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caelim wrote:
Are the new Exalted Sorcerors required to generate one of their powers on the Discipline of Tzeentch table?

It seems strange to me that new War Coven formation would give you a boost to a BRB psychic discipline, but prevent you from rolling on it unless you're ML2+ (and even then, an ML3 Tzeentch sorceror is a worse Biomancer than a ML2 Librarian!)

But hey, it's Chaos, our worst enemy is ourselves :(

It's probably worth figuring out what has new potential rather than immediately complaining.

Siphon Magic has massive potential. Any WC1 power is essentially "free" and 2x Siphon will actually generate Warp Charge.

Conclave might be better Biomancers, so why not look outside Biomancy? I mean, you can always ally in an unmarked Cabal anyway.

OK I am totally making an army modeled after the seven samurai idea of a hand full of desperadoes. Ahriman and 9 Exalted sorcerors would be hillarious to field as an army. if you kept a few of them cheap, disc only and paired them with a mate I could see some serious psychic phases lol. Thats 32-37 warp charges a turn manifesting on 3+ Imagine ahriman spamming witch fires lol, 3 shrieks a turn, if you really wanted to win you could obviously just summon 10 units of horrors turn 1. My god, the more I think about it the more I think that formation might be broken. If they are all on discs and one guy casts shrouding they suddenly have a 2+ rerollable cover save..... So many insane combos.

 Cephalobeard wrote:
Luchiban, what does Magnus' wargear cost?

I would imagine that, like most named characters, his wargear is built into his cost, which is 130 Meltabombs. Unless I missed where he has optional wargear.

Yoyoyo wrote:

It's probably worth figuring out what has new potential rather than immediately complaining.

Siphon Magic has massive potential. Any WC1 power is essentially "free" and 2x Siphon will actually generate Warp Charge.

Conclave might be better Biomancers, so why not look outside Biomancy? I mean, you can always ally in an unmarked Cabal anyway.

Sorry, I was just using Biomancy as an example. There are some great powers in most of the other disciplines we have access to.

But there are a lot of duds, and there's a HUGE difference between a psyker rolling 2 vs 3 powers, in terms of reliability. (with 3 psykers, you go from a 66% chance of getting a particular power, to 87.5%).

Paying 15 points to get a better Invulnerable save is nice. Being charged 15 points to be less reliable at your job in my army is... sad.

My point wasn't to complain already, it was to hope that Tzeench Sorcerors might actually be better than others, rather than "cool but restrictive"

 BrokenRecord wrote:

 Cephalobeard wrote:
Luchiban, what does Magnus' wargear cost?

I would imagine that, like most named characters, his wargear is built into his cost, which is 130 Meltabombs. Unless I missed where he has optional wargear.

I would simply rather not assume.

 BrokenRecord wrote:

 Cephalobeard wrote:
Luchiban, what does Magnus' wargear cost?

I would imagine that, like most named characters, his wargear is built into his cost, which is 130 Meltabombs. Unless I missed where he has optional wargear.

You don't need to count in melta bombs on Dakka


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 Cephalobeard wrote:

 BrokenRecord wrote:

 Cephalobeard wrote:
Luchiban, what does Magnus' wargear cost?

I would imagine that, like most named characters, his wargear is built into his cost, which is 130 Meltabombs. Unless I missed where he has optional wargear.

I would simply rather not assume.

Are there any named characters in the game whose wargear isn't included in their points cost? That would be extremely strange.

Thanks very much for the info Luchiban

It looks like positive stuff for my existing Thousand Sons and Ahriman by the look of it, bit of a kidney-blow for my existing terminators though (kitted out with power mauls / axes, fists and chainfists)


Does Ahriman happen to have any modification to spell casting? In particular, does he receive a spell familiar or similar to help mitigate perils (or is he still as prone to self destruction?)

 Mymearan wrote:

 BrokenRecord wrote:

 Cephalobeard wrote:
Luchiban, what does Magnus' wargear cost?

I would imagine that, like most named characters, his wargear is built into his cost, which is 130 Meltabombs. Unless I missed where he has optional wargear.

You don't need to count in melta bombs on Dakka


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Cephalobeard wrote:

 BrokenRecord wrote:

 Cephalobeard wrote:
Luchiban, what does Magnus' wargear cost?

I would imagine that, like most named characters, his wargear is built into his cost, which is 130 Meltabombs. Unless I missed where he has optional wargear.

I would simply rather not assume.

Are there any named characters in the game whose wargear isn't included in their points cost? That would be extremely strange.

The only one I can think of is Samael, and we KNOW Magnus isn't getting a Landspeeder option

What sucks about exalted sorcerers, Ahriman, and CSM DPs is that they have to waste one of their psychic choices on a tzeentch power. Unless the new supplement changes that??

Hey Iuchiban, thanks for sharing! I understand that at this point most people are mainly interested in the rules, but could you confirm whether the fluff summary found in this thread was accurate?

caelim wrote:

Yoyoyo wrote:

It's probably worth figuring out what has new potential rather than immediately complaining.

Siphon Magic has massive potential. Any WC1 power is essentially "free" and 2x Siphon will actually generate Warp Charge.

Conclave might be better Biomancers, so why not look outside Biomancy? I mean, you can always ally in an unmarked Cabal anyway.

Sorry, I was just using Biomancy as an example. There are some great powers in most of the other disciplines we have access to.

But there are a lot of duds, and there's a HUGE difference between a psyker rolling 2 vs 3 powers, in terms of reliability. (with 3 psykers, you go from a 66% chance of getting a particular power, to 87.5%).

Paying 15 points to get a better Invulnerable save is nice. Being charged 15 points to be less reliable at your job in my army is... sad.

My point wasn't to complain already, it was to hope that Tzeench Sorcerors might actually be better than others, rather than "cool but restrictive"

I really think the best Discipline for TS is Divination Ignores Cover and Twin Linked plus other good things.

What about the tzeentch warp storm table?

Also do you really need to take 9 units in every formation to get a reroll of 1's?

Guyver 3 wrote:
What about the tzeentch warp storm table?

Also do you really need to take 9 units in every formation to get a reroll of 1's?

From what has been said, it's not that you need to take "9 units" in every formation, but rather you have to take the maximum allotment of units that a formation can take.

So if a formation gives you the option of taking 1-3 Superduperguys, you need to take 3 Superduperguys in order to get the reroll of 1's for saving throws.

Guyver 3 wrote:
What about the tzeentch warp storm table?

Also do you really need to take 9 units in every formation to get a reroll of 1's?

Yeah, each formation will tell you a range for number of units so if it says, for example, Sekhmet conclave core formation, 3-9 units of SOTermies if you have 9 you get that sweet re-roll. but War Cabal (other core) is less demanding so you'd need 3 exalted or regular sorcerers, 3 rubrics and 3 SOT instead of 1-2 for each. Looking at these as I build my army honestly reflect to what I would build anyway. I can't plop down cash for 9 boxes of SOT anytime soon but a goal to reach one day, War Cabal needs to be first for me in this case, and it makes sense. There's so much AP3 and psyker bad-assery in this army not worried one bit.

While on the topic of terminators, can they be taken instead of normal termies so we could use them with traitor's hate?

Man, I really like the looks of that War Cabal, but whoof, that's expensive, both in cash and points. Whoof. My store basically only plays 1850, so I guess I better get used to not being able to field anything else if I want that sweet formation bonus...

Edit: NM

What is the point of the formation bonus.

Those units will very rarely be fielded in that abundance.

Its a bit of a slap in the testicles, to be frank.

any info on the daemon formations? And tzeentch warpstorm table?

Guyver 3 wrote:
any info on the daemon formations? And tzeentch warpstorm table?

To add to this, does anyone know about Tzaangors? Are they just like tzeentch specific cultists like plague zombies are?

 Galef wrote:

The current codex entry for Pink Horrors does not say they have access to Daemonology, and yet it is accepted that they can use it even without an FAQ, so why would an updated entry's lack of Daemonology be any different?
The BRB gives specific access to all psykers with few exceptions (no Malefic for GKs or Sanctic for Daemons, or at all for Nids).

Unless the new entries SPECIFICALLY say the Horrors (of any type) cannot access Malefic daemonology, they can use it. PERIOD
Or if it says they can ONLY access the Change Discipline, which we now know neither the Blue or Brimstone horrors entries are listed as such, so why would the Pinks entry be different?

Another possibility is if the Pink Horrors entry has access to Daemonology and Change (we haven't seen their entry yet, only the Blues & Brimstones)
That would make sense as otherwise, why ever buy Pinkies over Blues?

I'm going to guess RAI is they don't have access, but RAW they do, at least until 8th edition drops.

Anyone has a clue what are the "floating auxillary" of the war coven?

I mean, the units you can just take 1 of as an auxillary.

And if there a way to get both ahriman and a prince, while staying remotely sane in costs? seems like the only way to get princes in the war cover (hugely expensive if you want the reroll), and if you do then you gotta take the exiles for ahriman, and that thing clocks what? 700ish points? at minimum size before upgrades?


It seems 1ksons suffers the same issue as the cadian and ork detachments. they simply were not designed for the same scale most of us play.
In huge games (say, 3000 points) they become amazing, but in 1500-1850 range, they are very hard to pull off.

Zerosoul wrote:
Iuchiban: Thank you for the info! A couple questions if I may.

1) How expensive is the cannon for the Rubrics? Same price as for the terminators?

2) What kind of options does the Exalted Sorcerer have? We know you can bump ML up to 3, but do they have weapon options? Can they wear Terminator Armor?

Sorry guys, but duty called ...

Going back to the book:

1) Cannon fo Rubrics is +25 points

2) Exalted sorcerers: 160 points, Lvl2, +25 Lvl3. Disc for +30 points. Once per game, in the shooting phase thay may unleash the power of the Silver Tower:Reach Unlimited S9, AP2, Heavy1, Lance Blast One use only. Note that this is NOT a power, just a shooting attack.

 BoomWolf wrote:
Anyone has a clue what are the "floating auxillary" of the war coven?

It was said on Frontlinegamings review of the book that a lone Heldrake was an auxiliary choice for the Thousand Sons detachment.

Let's go with some Tzeentch Daemon stuff:

There are three new loci (I think that's the name of the Daemon Heralds upgrades, and again translations may be not accurate)

- Lesser Loci of Metamorphosis (+15): Bearer and all the models in his unit have the IWND special rule

- Mayor Loci of Scam (+20): Roll a D6. All attacks that have the same result as in the rolled D6, are considered to be a 1.

- Glorious Loci of Creation (+35): Everytime a Pink of this unit horror dies, 4 Blue Horrors are created. Everytime a blue Horror of this unit dies, 2 Brimstone Horrors are created.


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XT-1984 wrote:

 BoomWolf wrote:
Anyone has a clue what are the "floating auxillary" of the war coven?

It was said on Frontlinegamings review of the book that a lone Heldrake was an auxiliary choice for the Thousand Sons detachment.

There are 2 Aux Formations (aparto from the already mentioned)

Daemon Engines: 1 Defiler, Forgefiend, Helbrute, Heldrake or Maulerfiend

Legion Armoury: 1 Chaos Land Raider, Predator or Vindicator

Any reason other than the power why the exalted sorcerer is more expensive than a basic csm sorcerer 160 for a level 2 is allot! Some special gear or power?

Guyver 3 wrote:
Any reason other than the power why the exalted sorcerer is more expensive than a basic csm sorcerer 160 for a level 2 is allot! Some special gear or power?

They have a Chaos Lord Profile (3 Wounds, 3 Attacks, etc ..), Mark of Tzeentch, 5++ (with the mark, 4++), Veterans of the Long War SR, ,,,,

Luchiban please, can you speak about the new warp table for daemon of tzeentch? (when use it) and something about daemon formations/decurion.

And has some horror access to daemonology?

Thanks a lot!

The increased profile helps a lot, but man, they're pricey, and can't even hop into Terminator Armor or grab a spell familiar. Painful. That's kind of a hard sell over a regular Sorcerer, to me. The extra wound is highly relevant, of course, but the extra attack...Blech. And the gun is completely useless unless you're planning on putting him on a Disc, which isn't a BAD plan, of course, but then you either have to find him a ride or do without everything that makes the disc cool.

Yeah, I think I'll either skip the Exalted Sorcerer for a regular Sorcerer or just find the extra points and go with a Daemon Prince.

Yoyoyo wrote:

caelim wrote:
Are the new Exalted Sorcerors required to generate one of their powers on the Discipline of Tzeentch table?

It seems strange to me that new War Coven formation would give you a boost to a BRB psychic discipline, but prevent you from rolling on it unless you're ML2+ (and even then, an ML3 Tzeentch sorceror is a worse Biomancer than a ML2 Librarian!)

But hey, it's Chaos, our worst enemy is ourselves :(

It's probably worth figuring out what has new potential rather than immediately complaining.

Siphon Magic has massive potential. Any WC1 power is essentially "free" and 2x Siphon will actually generate Warp Charge.

Conclave might be better Biomancers, so why not look outside Biomancy? I mean, you can always ally in an unmarked Cabal anyway.

It really hit me last night that the army really revolves around the power of the sorcerer so we need to utlize that and things like the power are a great example. I need to read up on it. Is it scale able? The higher the warpcharge the more siphoning? If so that could lead to some a lot of energy being thrown around.

With a sorcerer in just about all units and the ability to generate and extra spell makes them and ther units expensive though I love how this made up for with the Tzaangors. These guys are dirt cheap and plentiful with with decent stats for fodder and the ability to run and charge is huge!! I also play harlequins so the board control these guys are going to offer is great. Being able to fleet ans get a bonus if they charge 9 in or more is insane for 7 points a model if that is to be believed. sure you gotta take the beastmen formation to get that but what great fun!!


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Also it seems like the Helm is an auto include for me.