Ork Codex Leaked

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**yakface**

Posted By Toreador on 11/04/2007 9:02 PM
Cool, so I may have a unit of nobz on foot with some on bikes then, also I may only take a few stikkbomz on a few guys in a unit.

The one thing that actually has me worried, and I have been looking through the book, is that trukkboyz can get royally nailed as they speed across the board now. Any pen hit makes them disembark, and they get no better save now from what I can find, and actually any disembarking from the trukk when you are going over 12" wounds 50% of the mounted orks, and can pretty much make the unit ineffective. Anyone else see anything that effects them, because in a sense that makes them a heck of a lot worse than they used to be.

How can you possibly conclude they are a heck of a lot worse then they used to be? The mere fact that they aren't automatically entangled when the Trukk is destroyed makes them inifinitely more useful.

You are right though. . .a penetrating hit that doesn't destroy the vehicle would follow the normal vehicle rules and all the models would suffer a wound on a 4+ (and have to disembark). This is obviously strange since a Trukk that is actually destroyed does less damage than this (because of the 'Ramshackle' rule).

I guess "luckily" any penetrating roll of a 3+ (because of the open-topped rule) destroys the Trukk so you won't face the situation too often.

**Phryxis**

Any pen hit makes them disembark

Any Pen hit makes passengers disembark. That's in the BGB, p68.

I think you're (badly) misreading these rules. They replace the normal rules for when the Trukk is Destroyed or Explodes (but, bizzarely, not when other results occur) and they're much more favorable in many ways.

The "Kaboom" result is the worst thing that can happen, and it's already better than a Destroyed or Explodes result. Normally everyone is wounded on a 4+. In a Kaboom result, for T4 Orks, they're wounded on a 5+. Normally the unit is automatically entangled. The Orks will only have to take a pinning test.

"Kareen" is mostly the same thing, but with a movement beforehand, which the Ork player may end up controlling anyway.

"Kerrunch" is great, it basically makes it totally safe to be in an exploding Trukk.

To put that all in context, if you've got 12 Boyz in a Trukk and it gets Kaboomed, you're going to lose some Orks. You're not going to lose the Nob, since he's got 2W. The rest of the Boyz (11 of them) will suffer 3.67 wounds, and about 3 of them will die. Then the pinning test is taken with 9 Orks in the Mob, Ld9, which is a 5/6 chance to pass.

So, bottom line, killing a Trukk has a 1 in 6 chance of stopping the Orks inside. Killing a transport normally has a 100% chance to stop the models inside.

The oddness here is that in many ways the Orks would rather the Trukk just blew up than it got stunned. When it's stunned with a Pen hit, they take wounds on a 4+, lose more Orks, and have a worse chance of getting pinned as a result.

**Toreador**

That is why I concluded it Yak. Last night one of my two trukks took a penetrating hit that didn't destroy it. I would have been fine if we had the old trukkboy rules as I wouldn't have lost many of my unit. Couldn't find anything in the book last night that made it any better.

Trukks on the most part will always be moving over 12" a round. As you said, any penetrating hit causes a disembarkation. If you read the trukk entry it uses the same language. All of the entries from Kaboom to Kerrunch also cause a disembarkation. Thus causing a wound on any models on a 4+. If the Kaboom effect is also rolled you will also take a Str 3 hit on all passengers before disembarking. This all hinges on the disembarkation rule. It oddly overlaps. In the main rulebook it never calls emergency disembarkation that except for the table. All other rules just state the unit disembarks, and then you use the table to see the effect. I don't see anything saying you never use the table, just that you apply the results instead of the usual effects. It still causes a disembarkation at speed. It somewhat contradicts itself. The one thing that stands is that any penetrating non destroying hit can cause you to loose over half your boys. The rest is up to interpretation. I don't believe it should, but in the short time we had last night we had people on both sides of it.

It's really pretty nasty. Noticed this last night in my game against a nid list. The lower init really made a difference too. I was always taking hits first when I charged in. It really helps that orks have as many attacks as they do, and I won out in the end through sheer brute force. Hormagaunts made a real mess of boyz, but it came out even because of the points cost. Ard boyz in this fight were very useful as they took a lot fewer wounds in CC, thus causing a lot more hits. The trukk thing really worries me though. Its very easy to shoot trukks and put the fragile cargo out of the fight. The small mob size of the orks and the ld combine to be very very harsh. In the past blowing me out of my trukk made little difference as I was only hit on a 6. I still had a viable cargo, now I don't.

**Pariah Press**

Posted By Deadshane1 on 11/04/2007 6:46 PM
....thats a portion of the reason for posting in a forum, debate. So yes, I'll continue to enjoy debating it.

I didn't realize that repeating the same thing over and over again constituted a debate. I learn something new every day.

What do you guys think about Battle Wagon mounted boyz? I'm kinda leaning toward mounting half my troops in Battlewagons, and half of 'em in Trukks. The trukks and my fast attack boyz hit the enemy lines first, tie up the enemy's guns, then the bigger mobz in the battlewagons come in the second wave.

**yakface**

Posted By Toreador on 11/04/2007 10:42 PM
That is why I concluded it Yak. Last night one of my two trukks took a penetrating hit that didn't destroy it. I would have been fine if we had the old trukkboy rules as I wouldn't have lost many of my unit. Couldn't find anything in the book last night that made it any better.

Trukks on the most part will always be moving over 12" a round. As you said, any penetrating hit causes a disembarkation. If you read the trukk entry it uses the same language. All of the entries from Kaboom to Kerrunch also cause a disembarkation. Thus causing a wound on any models on a 4+. If the Kaboom effect is also rolled you will also take a Str 3 hit on all passengers before disembarking. This all hinges on the disembarkation rule. It oddly overlaps. In the main rulebook it never calls emergency disembarkation that except for the table. All other rules just state the unit disembarks, and then you use the table to see the effect. I don't see anything saying you never use the table, just that you apply the results instead of the usual effects. It still causes a disembarkation at speed. It somewhat contradicts itself. The one thing that stands is that any penetrating non destroying hit can cause you to loose over half your boys. The rest is up to interpretation. I don't believe it should, but in the short time we had last night we had people on both sides of it.

It's really pretty nasty. Noticed this last night in my game against a nid list. The lower init really made a difference too. I was always taking hits first when I charged in. It really helps that orks have as many attacks as they do, and I won out in the end through sheer brute force. Hormagaunts made a real mess of boyz, but it came out even because of the points cost. Ard boyz in this fight were very useful as they took a lot fewer wounds in CC, thus causing a lot more hits. The trukk thing really worries me though. Its very easy to shoot trukks and put the fragile cargo out of the fight. The small mob size of the orks and the ld combine to be very very harsh. In the past blowing me out of my trukk made little difference as I was only hit on a 6. I still had a viable cargo, now I don't.

Well, the Ramshackle rule says you "apply the result instead of the usual effects." That is obviously a very broad term but taken at its face value means that when a Trukk suffers a Destroyed or Explodes result you use the Ramshackle result instead of all effects normally associated with a Trukk being destroyed or exploding.

One of those effects is clearly forcing an emergency disembarkation of the passengers and as such it is ignored in favor of the Ramshackle rule.

And it didn't matter if how many Trukk boyz survived with the old Ork codex as your opponent had another turn to wipe them or just move away.

**Dosadi**

In the poster for the Ork Spearhead the Ork boy unit are shootas...and their nob has a PK and slugga.

http://warseer.com/forums/2062005-post263.html

Now this may mean nothing, as GW frequently assembles their studio models anyway they please...But I'm choosing to see this as RAI and hopefully and end to this stupid arguement.

Dosadi

**Toreador**

On a pen forced disembarkation it's the same new as old, except you only took hits on 6's instead of 4's. So in a way getting a non destroying pen hit is better (worse for the ork player) than destroying it, lol.

**Orock**

Posted By Toreador on 11/05/2007 6:55 AM
On a pen forced disembarkation it's the same new as old, except you only took hits on 6's instead of 4's. So in a way getting a non destroying pen hit is better (worse for the ork player) than destroying it, lol.

Yup its amusing, which is half the fun of an ork army. There is some real potential in this codex to build a luck based army that could either win big through sheer luck and comedy, or do the same losing. Either way cant think of a more amusing casual army to play.

**Orock**

http://bp2.blogger.com/_JsKZ1YCU6Z4/Ry3PY5Q8JcI/AAAAAAAAAYw/9ClrJWbo5oc/s1600-h/ork_1.JPG

Oh lawd, is that sum orkses with shootas that have a nob NOT armed with a shoota? And on the back picture of the official codex no less? Can that arguement DIE a horrible death now?

**Toreador**

Yes, but again it makes no sense. Why would the orks just getting out because they are afraid the trukk is going to blow take more damage than when the trukk explodes? Enemies will be hoping for a non destroying pen result, instead of destroyed. Like the no PK shoota thing, it just doesn't make much sense.

**ancientsociety**

My thought on seeing the new dex was simply "Wow." After the disaster that was the new CSM dex, I was very worried that the book would be thin, boring, and superficial. I have to say I was surprised.

Pros:
-LOTS of great fluff - stuff not seen since 2nd ed., Gorka, etc! Concise and well-organized. Why didn't they do this for CSM, Eldar, or SMs?
-Great new artwork (interspersed w/ the normal cut-and-paste previous artwork but...). I'm nuts about the Rokkit Squig on p28, definitely going to add one to my stormboyz unit for decorative purposes.
-The return of the Shokk gun, Weirdboyz, etc.
-Deth Koptas!
-Independent Nob mobz as Elites PLUS the ability to mount them on bikes!
-Lootas' "Deffgunz", even w/ BS2 15+ shots/turn average will HAVE to hit something.
-An entirely Burna-armed unit of Burna Boyz!
-Different abilities for Wartrukks, Trakks, and Skorchas (good idea, this will certainly sell more models, GW)
-Killa Kanz new "Grotzooka" weapon (I can see this being useful against horde armies)
-Few new special characters and the return of some old ones
-Nearly every unit has access to either a Trukk or Battlewagon
-The new Battlewagon rocks (SO glad I did not get rid of my converted KV2 Gigant!)

Cons:
-The "new and (un)improved format of separate unit lists/special rules and army lists. It's incredibly annoying to have to flip back and forth 20+ pages to make sure your army list is working right or to try and find something during a game. ARGH!
-Tankbustas kind of stink now, esp. w/ the "Glory Hogz" rule
-Kommandos still kind of stink (but I'll still take them!)
-Not necessarily a bad thing, but Bikes seem a bit less useful...
-Gretchin lose the meat shield rule (again, not really a bad thing, just not as fun)
-Attack Squigs for the Warboss cost WAY TOO MUCH

I can honestly say this is the first codex since IG that i'm really anxious to spend my money on. As an Ork player and a recent convert to Gorkamorka, I feel like this is the first of the new dexs to really cater to the long-standing fans of 40K. I also feel like this is the first of the new dexs to cater to the uber-power players and the beer-and-pretzels crowd in equal proportion.

Excellent work GW!

**Toreador**

Tankbustas are really really useful, as there are few things that are sure to take out specific targets like a tankbusta can. I fired turn after turn with a 6 man loota squad at a Carnifex that I really needed to get rid of, but the only thing that could take him down was the tankbustas and PK orks. I ended up wasting a couple of turns of Lootas that could have been at a better target, because they just couldn't take him down... (damn saves)

I actually liked the dex layout once I got use to it. I knew about where everything was, and when I couldn't immediatly flip to it, there were page number references everywhere. I had to reference the old ork dex a few times, and remember how bad it actually was. I was completely lost finding things in it, then ran into the worse thing... the weapons with NO stats listed in that book as they were in the main one... gah!

Okay, I have now looked at the book, and have a little worry. It worried me last night in a quick glance, it worries me now with a little more research. I am not pushing this because I think it is one way or the other. What I like is discussion on the subject giving all sides. It really helps to have all forms of the argument.

Okay Ramshackle lets you ignore the usual effects of the vehicle damage tables. If you read those effects it says they must disembark. If you read those rules in the main book, you can't disembark if the vehicle goes over 12". That is covered under emergency disembarkation, which then gives you the entangled and 4+ wound result.

So do we ignore all the effects from both the vehicle damage table, and the emergency disembarkation table? Or is it vague enough that people could argue it only replaces the vehicle damage part, and that disembarkation is an entirely other set of rules?

We have already established that a non destroying penetrating hit follows the normal rules, and is bad for boyz, but I want to make sure I am clear on the rest of it. Sadly that rule is vague enough to make me question things also.

**Clang**

Has anyone else noticed that looted wagons (the new rhino eqivalents) don't come as a squadron (the way the old looted vehicles did so long as you kept their points <=50? That will hurt players who used 3 looted rhinos, as they're unlikely to want to use up all 3 Heavy slots merely for slightly tougher trukk equivalents. I guess they'll have to start ripping the roofs off (or at least the top and side hatches) to make them into 'count as' trukks...

**yakface**

Posted By Toreador on 11/05/2007 10:22 AM

Okay, I have now looked at the book, and have a little worry. It worried me last night in a quick glance, it worries me now with a little more research. I am not pushing this because I think it is one way or the other. What I like is discussion on the subject giving all sides. It really helps to have all forms of the argument.

Okay Ramshackle lets you ignore the usual effects of the vehicle damage tables. If you read those effects it says they must disembark. If you read those rules in the main book, you can't disembark if the vehicle goes over 12". That is covered under emergency disembarkation, which then gives you the entangled and 4+ wound result.

So do we ignore all the effects from both the vehicle damage table, and the emergency disembarkation table? Or is it vague enough that people could argue it only replaces the vehicle damage part, and that disembarkation is an entirely other set of rules?

We have already established that a non destroying penetrating hit follows the normal rules, and is bad for boyz, but I want to make sure I am clear on the rest of it. Sadly that rule is vague enough to make me question things also.

Read my last post again. Ramshackle ignores the normal effects of a Trukk being destroyed, this includes the rules for emergency disembarking. There simply isn't any other way to interpret it.

The only way you could argue otherwise would be to say that units in a vehicle that suffer a penetrating hit disembark before the damage roll is even made, in which case you'd also be playing that all passengers take double wounds: once for emergency disembarking ( with a re-roll if the vehicle was moving over 6" ) and then another set of wounds from the vehicle if it explodes.

Nobody I've met plays the game this way, so I think you can safely rest assured that everyone will read the Ramshackle rule the same way: it replaces all effects of a vehicle being destroyed with its own set of rules. That means no emergency disembarking, no entanglement, and no double set of damage.

**sugarwookie**

I got a good read of the new Codex like most of you and I'm excited about some things, but also disappointed.

I still don't understand why a hulking mass of muscles is only a S3. It just doesn't make sense that an Ork has the same strength of a Grunt Guardsman. They've added the Furious Charge rule, but can someone explain to me how this will benefit and Ork against other HtH armies? Take Marines, at I4 we're going to go last now instead of simo, which usually meant we'd win the first round of combat, I'm not really seeing how this is going to factor into anything but worse, maybe I'm not seeing the big picture?

Also, I didn't see anywhere that stated a Warboss could take a retinue. Maybe I overlooked it? It doesn't make any sense to me. It seems to me you're Warboss is now a little less effective? Again, I guess I might be overlooking something.

I do love most of the changes and additions to the book mind you, but the boys in my store had dreams of a true "Waaagh" rolling over the hill in numbers and strength and it seems that you're not going to have that effectively.

Wookie

**yakface**

Posted By sugarwookie on 11/05/2007 2:11 PM
I got a good read of the new Codex like most of you and I'm excited about some things, but also disappointed.

I still don't understand why a hulking mass of muscles is only a S3. It just doesn't make sense that an Ork has the same strength of a Grunt Guardsman. They've added the Furious Charge rule, but can someone explain to me how this will benefit and Ork against other HtH armies? Take Marines, at I4 we're going to go last now instead of simo, which usually meant we'd win the first round of combat, I'm not really seeing how this is going to factor into anything but worse, maybe I'm not seeing the big picture?

Also, I didn't see anywhere that stated a Warboss could take a retinue. Maybe I overlooked it? It doesn't make any sense to me. It seems to me you're Warboss is now a little less effective? Again, I guess I might be overlooking something.

I do love most of the changes and additions to the book mind you, but the boys in my store had dreams of a true "Waaagh" rolling over the hill in numbers and strength and it seems that you're not going to have that effectively.

Wookie

Take a little time and do the math. For the points, the boyz do more damage now (without a Choppa) then they did with the Choppa (being more points per model).

Now, I agree with you on the fluff of having Orks be S3. . .I would have personally made them S4 WS3 (cause Orks shouldn't be "skilled" in cobmat, just strong IMO) but then you wouldn't have been able to make them as cheap in points (cause a S4 is MUCH more useful than a WS4 in close combat), so it is just the decision they decided to stick with in order to make the army work (and I think it does work now).

And Warbosses like all ICs since the Eldar codex cannot take a retinue. A retinue was clunky rules design that caused all sorts of issues (like the: is an IC with a retinue still an IC? rules debacle).

If you want a retinue you just have to take a separate unit and join it to the boss yourself.

**Toreador**

It is an oddity, and I agree it doesn't make sense. It just makes me very very uneasy.

Boyz really need the charge now, but even in that they are brutal. I had a 12 boy Stormboyz mob with PK nob charge 16 hormagaunts in a house. His mistake, he hid them so Lootas couldn't shoot them. We struck simultaneous and I let him roll first. He killed a few, but then I struck back with my 40 odd str 4 attacks. It's funny to see a nid player taken aback by the amount of attacks I get, and for the points. In two turns I was able to take the hormagaunts in close combat along with a zoanthrope, then onto finishing off a 1 wnd carnifex. The boyz are still very tough in CC, and at the new points cost, they can bring the numbers. I used two foot slogging units of 20, and put a major hurt on him with the numbers.

Great thing too is if you want to take a retinue, the most likely choice (nobz) become troops. It then frees up the elite slots for other things.

**sugarwookie**

I see where you're coming from Yak, but do wish they'd made them S4, maybe I'll understand more when I begin playtesting the new list.

One thing that amazes me is that, when taking a squad of Tank Bustas, or Burna Boyz is that they all come with standard Rocket Launchas, or Burnas respectively. Is this a typo? If not, a squad of 10-15 RL's will actually make Zilla Bugs and Falcon lovers wince a little.

I'm a little behind with the new codex being leaked, as I quit the game after spending hundreds of dollars on models for a Feral list and finding out before a GT it was banned. I figured I'd give the game a break and wait to see how our Boyz fared when the book was released. I'm happy to say I'll be playing once more and probably with a little more Ommph to my army.

What do you feel are the hands down best units now that we're all gettng a peak? I'd love to hear some ideas that are being kicked around, though maybe it's being discussed in another part of the forums? If so forgive me and point me in the right direction?

Cheers!

**Schepp himself**

Lootas...I always thought Dark Reapers were the kings in high rate of fire, long range fire support. Not anymore I guess...

Greets
Schepp himself

**Jayden63**

Its the basic I2 that really rubs salt in my wounds. FC is ok, except when your limited on numbers. I.E. trukkers. As it is, no trukk boy mob has a chance of winning against any other assaultish squad in the game. Against 10 man assault marines we loose 5 orks before getting to swing even if we charged. 24 attacks, 12 hits, 6 wounds 2 dead. How the hell is the PK nob supposed to get another 3 kills just to tie, and possibly 4 so that we might win. Now we are taking an LD check on a 6 with a reroll. Fail that and we are most likely wiped out on the massacure check.

I'm really worried about this. I'm not sure it will be possible to bring enough of the boys. Softening up with shooting is a possibilty except that trukkers are supposed to work in enemy territory. Its not likely your going to get much shooting support save what they bring with them.

Now I know that trukkers with trukk are 170ish points and assault marines tend to be in the 250 range. But what good is killing 100 points of marines then loosing 130 points of boys (on the turn you charged). Something just doesn't seem right here. If we could attack simo (like in the old dex) at least we had an easier chance of bring the combat to a draw.

**Tau-Cent**

First of all 12 trukk boyz and a nob come to about 100+ pts (not including the cost of the trukk). Perhaps you could consider the consequence of charging a 100 pt of boyz into 250 pts of SM?

Attack the assault marine squad with 2 squads of boyz and see what 200+ pts of boyz does to 250 pts of marines.

Take shoota boy trukkers and fire 23 str 4 shots into the marines first, each squad of 12 boyz shot drop 1.25 marines before you even assault.

Ork Boyz are simply awesome.

**Tau-Cent**

First of all 12 trukk boyz and a nob come to about 100+ pts (not including the cost of the trukk). Perhaps you could consider the consequence of charging a 100 pt of boyz into 250 pts of SM?

Attack the assault marine squad with 2 squads of boyz and see what 200+ pts of boyz does to 250 pts of marines.

Take shoota boy trukkers and fire 23 str 4 shots into the marines first, each squad of 12 boyz shot drop 1.25 marines before you even assault.

Ork Boyz are simply awesome.

**sugarwookie**

Is it definite on what models are going to be put out with the new Codex? I know of the truck, bikes, burnas along with the Big Mek. Anything else you've heard are going to be produced to support the new line?

**Pariah Press**

Boyz and Lootas will also be in the first wave of releases, and a big mek with a shokk attack gun.

**puree**

Posted By Jayden63 on 11/05/2007 3:53 PM
Its the basic I2 that really rubs salt in my wounds. FC is ok, except when your limited on numbers. I.E. trukkers. As it is, no trukk boy mob has a chance of winning against any other assaultish squad in the game. Against 10 man assault marines we loose 5 orks before getting to swing even if we charged. 24 attacks, 12 hits, 6 wounds 2 dead. How the hell is the PK nob supposed to get another 3 kills just to tie, and possibly 4 so that we might win. Now we are taking an LD check on a 6 with a reroll. Fail that and we are most likely wiped out on the massacure check.

Actually that fight is a lot more even than you credit (if you charge).

10 assault marines vs 12 slugga boyz + pknob

sluggas shoot - 50% chance 1 casualty

charge

10 assault marines most likely casualties = 4 (40% chance of 5+, 38% of 3-)
9 assault marines most likely casualties = 4 (31% chance of 5+, 47% of 3-)

if 4 casualties:
7 choppa boyz most likely casualties = 2 (40% of 3)
1 pk nob most lilely casualties = 2 (35% of 3)

Following the most likely result provides a tie. with modest chances of gaining the win, either from the marines only killing 3, or you killing more. Thats not bad given the points difference.

**yakface**

Posted By Jayden63 on 11/05/2007 3:53 PM
Its the basic I2 that really rubs salt in my wounds. FC is ok, except when your limited on numbers. I.E. trukkers. As it is, no trukk boy mob has a chance of winning against any other assaultish squad in the game. Against 10 man assault marines we loose 5 orks before getting to swing even if we charged. 24 attacks, 12 hits, 6 wounds 2 dead. How the hell is the PK nob supposed to get another 3 kills just to tie, and possibly 4 so that we might win. Now we are taking an LD check on a 6 with a reroll. Fail that and we are most likely wiped out on the massacure check.

I'm really worried about this. I'm not sure it will be possible to bring enough of the boys. Softening up with shooting is a possibilty except that trukkers are supposed to work in enemy territory. Its not likely your going to get much shooting support save what they bring with them.

Now I know that trukkers with trukk are 170ish points and assault marines tend to be in the 250 range. But what good is killing 100 points of marines then loosing 130 points of boys (on the turn you charged). Something just doesn't seem right here. If we could attack simo (like in the old dex) at least we had an easier chance of bring the combat to a draw.

That is the whole point of balancing the Trukk boy unit. I thought it was going to be an impossible task to make a KOS (Trukk mounted) army on equal footing with a (predominately) footslogging army but on first glance GW seems to have accomplished that goal, which is an amazing feat IMO.

In 3rd edition, KOS was just simply broken. Their ability to jump out of vehicles (even if their vehicle was blown up) and assault made the army an absolute monster.

4th edition turned the KOS army completely into a hit-or-miss beast. Either you got the first turn and were able to move your Trukks into good position to strike next turn (hiding behind terrain close to the enemy) or your Trukks got blown up and all your Orks got entangled and then killed in the following turn. Games tended to be slaughters for one side or the other.

This new codex gives Orks the ability to charge again if their vehicle gets blown up but to balance that fact they've made individual boys weaker (but cheaper) and made small mob sizes more vulnerable to morale checks.

So you can't go into games expecting a Trukkload of boys to peform like they used to in 3rd edition or even 4th edition if they made it into combat unscathed. Instead, you have to totally swamp enemy flanks with several Trukkboy mobs at once (preferebly backed up by some Stormboyz). Only through combined mob support will you be able to achieve the same success in combat you're used to.

But since the Boyz are cheaper, you should be able to get more Trukks and more Trukkboyz into your army to help you with this goal. And, you can safely drive your mobs right in front of a couple of enemy units knowing that even if they destroy your Trukk there's still a really good chance that you'll be able to charge and swamp them next turn.

That's the best thing about the Trukk assault in the new codex (IMO), you can reliably count on your Trukk boyz to reach combat if you play well (i.e. don't put full Trukks out in front of enough enemy units that one enemy unit can blow up the Trukk and another unit can follow up with shots on the disembarked unit).

In other words, it actually takes some planning and strategy to get Trukk assaults to work but if you know what you're doing you should have pretty good success.

**sugarwookie**

So are the basic boys unit getting a resculpt? They looked the same to me, with the exception of a new weapon or two? That'd be cool to have them pretty much compatible with what I already own. Are there any pix of the new shokk attack gun around anywhere? I'd love to see it........

**malfred**

They're the same plastics but with more extras on the sprues and a different sprue layout or
something like that.

**sugarwookie**

Looking at the codex and trying to come up with a nice theme list, I think I'll work on two angles. One being Blood Axes, which are way easy to figure out and put something together for.
The other end of the spectrum would be Snake Bites, I like the idea of a couple of loony Weird Boys as the HQ's and aside the core boys I'm trying to figure out what other choices might fit with this style of army. I don't have the older codex with the fluff on this clan, so I'm wondering if any of the more experienced vets might have some advice, what would work fluffwise for them and not?

**yakface**

Posted By sugarwookie on 11/05/2007 8:34 PM
So are the basic boys unit getting a resculpt? They looked the same to me, with the exception of a new weapon or two? That'd be cool to have them pretty much compatible with what I already own. Are there any pix of the new shokk attack gun around anywhere? I'd love to see it........

A painted pic of the SAG is on this Warseer page:

warseer.com/forums/40k-news-rumour-discussion/104202-ukgd-2007-new-ork-stuff-10.html