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Seriously, why oh why, did GW change Salamanders into something non-human. They're not dark skinned, they're not African, they have ebony skin and red eyes. I always thought Salamanders were kinda cool, but now they just seem too cartoonish even for 40k (which has Space Vikings and Space Nuns with Guns, etc.). The LSS in the new WD just doesn't look right with the scouts. Anyone else feel this was a huge fething mistake on GW's part?

I know, it's annoying. I'm calling racist shenanigans on Jervis.

I don't even know if it's racist. It's just DUMB.

On lexicanum it says that the black skin comes from the radiation of volcanos and such. But I agree with you. You know there are some people who think that GW made a mistake and they were sopposed to be african.They had marines who looked like Mike Tison.

Salamanders used to be black, as in the terran definition of race, not some weird drow things. I liked that about them, I further liked that once said, nothing further was made of their colour, it had no bearing on their outlook and they fell into no stereotyping hotspot.

They should still be brown skinned humans, not black skinned humans.

Yeah that would be cool. Having space marines that look like micheal jordan!

They're now traditional D&D fire giants -- black skin, red eyes. They'd have flaming red hair, too, except they're Space Marines, so they're just bald fire giants.

Al Sharpton is staging a news conference on the black Salamanders shortly. I believe Spike Lee referred to them as "handkerchief-headed, chicken-and-biscuit-eating Uncle Toms".

Down with GW racism! Power to the people!

I was annoyed by that change too. It's pretty damn stupid.

Rise up and paint your Salamanders as Africans!

GW isn't the boss of you.

Yeah, I wonder how it would go over at a GW tournament if you gave all your Space Marine scouts Brown Skin and equiped them with Bows and Arrows, along with Spears.

I always thought it was just stupid period, that the large majority of IG etc.. are nonethnic. Its all white.

Name a Human special character that is not White.



40k is racist.

Hollismason wrote:Yeah, I wonder how it would go over at a GW tournament if you gave all your Space Marine scouts Brown Skin and equiped them with Bows and Arrows, along with Spears.

I always thought it was just stupid period, that the large majority of IG etc.. are nonethnic. Its all white.

Name a Human special character that is not White.



40k is racist.

40k's target market is white men between 12 and 30, hence most of the humans being white men that appear to be youthfull yet adults.

I am not sure what fluffy resource set this notion in my head but I am pretty certain that all of the space marines have a genetic alteration that allows their skin pigmentation to rapidly change to adapt to differing environments. Why couldn't such an extreme result occur under high exposure to radiation? I like the fluff. :(

EBONYYY AND IVORYYY,
LIVE TOGETHER IN PERFECT HARMONYYYY.
ON MY PIANO KEYBOAAARD!

dietrich wrote:Seriously, why oh why, did GW change Salamanders into something non-human.

Sadly, racism is the only explanation I can think of. At the very, very least the change is spectacularly insensitive and politically incorrect.

Its also funny because Salamander is a lizard and a lizard is slang for mle member.

Hollismason wrote:
Its also funny because Salamander is a lizard and a lizard is slang for mle member.

Anything can become slang for the male member if you say it the right way.

Anyways, I dont see exactly why the skin change in Salamanders is such a big thing. Is it that no one likes the obsidian skin or no one likes the change in general cause its perceived to be racism on GW's part?
I would think a Chapter of highly irradiated Space Marines to be more reasonable in a science fiction setting than an entire Chapter of African-Americans. Too many "token black Chapter" jokes otherwise.

That being said, if I ever made a Salamanders army they would all be wearing their helmets. Safety first, people.

dietrich wrote:Seriously, why oh why, did GW change Salamanders into something non-human.

If Nick Kyme, the author of the "Salamander" novel is to be believed, then that's how they were originally supposed to look like.

http://www.nickkyme.com/?p=126
"[...] This actually came from the very top from some chats I’ve had with Rick Priestley about the Chapter. Truth is, they were always meant to have black skin but just got misrepresented, and red eyes too. Their homeworld is a volcanic, hellish planet so it sort of fits."

Anyone else feel this was a huge fething mistake on GW's part?

Imo they look very, very stupid now, so it's a change for the worse.

I quite liked it. Didn't think it was racist but would probably look better tanned rather than black. Mind you though you can paint marines however you want. ^_^

frankly, being a primarily British company, I highly doubt they have the same level of racial sensitivity regarding african-americans as The U.S. tends to be. This is starting to sound an awful lot like the "RE5 is racist because there are black people being killed by a white man" debacle.

There are no negative or positive connotations to their skin colour, nor does the fluff mention it beyond it being the case.

Aesthetically speaking, I agree; it doesn't look quite right. I've seen a 'black' as in african Salamander army before that looked perfect, and far preferable to GW's version. The GW versions just look too inhuman to be humans, but not alien enough to be distinct. Just looks like a paint palette experiment gone wrong.

Hollismason wrote:
Name a Human special character that is not White.

Captain Al'Rahem
Mogul Kamir
Vulkan
Ko'Sharro Khan
(I think thats it)

Also, there are people who are black, not really dark brown, but BLACK. There are people with red eyes, they are called albinos. And while it is possible to get partial albinism and only have it in your eyes, it is unlikely that an entire planet would have this. So yes the glowing red eyed darkness that is the new salamanders is genetically possible.

Now having said these things yes the new salamanders look slowed, because i expect them to start breathing fire from looking at them, and apparently in the grimdarkness of the 41st millenium there are three minorities...

Pitch black and red eyes, sounds more like a lame devil look army to me that an exercise in racism but YMMV.
Did you check if GW was selling a horn upgrade sprue for the salamanders?

M.

iamthecougar wrote:

Hollismason wrote:Name a Human special character that is not White.

Captain Al'Rahem
Mogul Kamir
Vulkan
Ko'Sharro Khan
(I think thats it)

Also, there are people who are black, not really dark brown, but BLACK. There are people with red eyes, they are called albinos. And while it is possible to get partial albinism and only have it in your eyes, it is unlikely that an entire planet would have this. So yes the glowing red eyed darkness that is the new salamanders is genetically possible.

Now having said these things yes the new salamanders look slowed, because i expect them to start breathing fire from looking at them, and apparently in the grimdarkness of the 41st millenium there are three minorities...

I WILL CRUSH YOU UNDER MY INQUISITORIAL BOOT!

Inquisitor Toth is the first one that comes to my mind.

EDIT: I think it is cooler that their skin is jet black. Human skin darkens to protect itself from radiation, both during a lifetime and over a long course of natural selection (Africa is HOT). Space Marine skin does this in a matter of seconds, and on top of that, I don't think skin that would let you survive in Africa is going to cut it on Nocturne.

Black skin looks terrible, because black is the color they're primed in. They look like they haven't been painted yet.

A dark gray looks better, although I thought the brown skin looked better than either.

Well, you have to highlight. Go go Base Coat Black. It makes them look sweaty, heh. Highlight up through grey or brown. I guess brown would humanize them, which is what you should be going for.

I think it just doesn't look right. red eyes are for orks.

These cries of racism are lame.. Take your PC-ness home and go live in a bubble.

Besides that, they aren't even really human. Red eyes are strange, there isn't really a point for that (unless radiation effects eye color in natural selection, but I'm just an artist). Ebony skin is natural given the world they live in.

Most Space Marines have a functioning "Melanochromic Organ", which is hemispherical and black. It monitors radiation levels and types bombarding the skin, and if necessary, sets off chemical reactions to darken the skin to protect it from ultraviolet exposure. It also provides limited protection from other forms of radiation. Much like how the Imperial Fists lack a Sus-An Membrane and Betcher's Gland, surely some cracker Chapter out there lacks a functioning Melanochrome.

Me, I think the pale Space Marines everyone always paints are weird considering the kinds of radiation Space Marines must get exposed to over their term of service. I figure Space Marines get blacker as they age. If they were recruited from the African America sector of the Galaxy, on the other hand, they might start off pretty dark too.

I figured the skin would go back to it's original color after it hadn't been exposed to radiation for a while.

And their original skin color is deep black, due to natural selection on a very hot planet.