Why are Salamanders now Ebony?

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**Orkeosaurus**

It's a matter of radiation, not heat.

**DarkHound**

Well, heat is thermal radiation, but I was refering to the suns UV rays and what not.

**Delephont**

I always wondered how the average human on the Nocturn would look? After all, the Space Marines survive the radiation etc because of their genetics, but a normal human wouldn't just turn black, they'd fry to a crisp and die......that would lead to a serious recruitment problem.....

I have to agree that its a strange decision that GW has taken with the Salamander fluff, but equally, a Legion of African decendants doesn't quite seem balanced either!

At the end of the day, its you the collector who paints your army, so GW percieved "racism" has to be partly owned by the gamers who also paint their own armies......

**SagesStone**

Weren't they originally like this, then they become African in appearence after a long period of time off their planet?

**Samus666**

Hmm... old fluff as a justification doesn't quite work. So, squats and sensei can be retconned out, but an obscure mention of salamanders being pitch black with red eyes can't? Fluff can be changed for the sake of game atmosphere but not for the sake of good taste? Plus, according to fluff, all Space Marines should be black at least some of the time.
Fluff says most Marines should be african black and Salamanders should be pitch black. But instead, in GW artwork and photos, most marines are white, salamanders are pitch black, and african black skin is nowhere to be seen.
I think we mostly agree that the charcoal black looks terrible, so aesthetics is an unlikely motivation.
Im white, but I still find it offensive.

**Velour_Fog**

Samus666 wrote: Fluff says most Marines should be african black

Marine's skin adjusts according to the environment they are exposed to. They would probably stay their "natural"complexion unless an atmosphere was particularly hostile.

**Lowinor**

Er guys, come on now, it's not racist.

Salamanders were always supposed to be jet black, and African heritage had nothing to do with it.

There was a running theme in the original legions to base them off of mythological creatures.

Space Wolves are werewolves.

Blood Angels are vampires.

And so, Salamanders are fire giants.

Attached is an illustration of the original fire giant of Norse mythology, the one D&D fire giants are based off of. He has black skin not because he's based on anything African, but because it matches the color of soot.

It's exactly as stupid as Space Wolves having Wulfen as troops. The SM fluff borrows liberally from world mythology.

**SlaveToDorkness**

Gw is RACIST!! They've been calling things "Spear Chukkas" for YEARS!!!

LOL

**TaintedSoul**

LoL GW trying to throw a little more diversity eh?

**Orangecoke**

I'm actually doing up some Salamanders, and giving EVERYONE helmets because the ebony skin looks so stupid.

**Velour_Fog**

Also having helmets is safer.

**Railguns**

They probably did it to avoid accusations of racism by associating love of fire, slow reaction times, and inability to pilot landspeeders with black people. People can and will find racism in any flipping thing they want these days. Not having african characters is in no way racist in itself. That's like saying BET is racist because one of it's shows doesn't have white characters(That doesn't mean that it wouldn't be racist for plenty of other reasons though). It's just a reflection of what the people making the product experience in their everyday lives, not some sort of passive-aggressive dig against non-whites.

**Nurglitch**

I love the way people are wailing and carrying on in this thread, bemoaning the fact that GW's previously "African" or "African-American" (hint: if they're not American, they're not hyphenated Americans) without any hint of reflection that the genestock of Nocturne (an entire planet mind you) might have included a variety of races and skin-colours, and that people of the 'black' variety might have been descended from Australian Aboriginals, Native Americans, Dalits, or even Swedes. After ten thousand years of galactic migration we have Ogryns and Ratlings. A preference for melanin in a population is a small thing by comparison, and that's leaving out the fact of the Marine Melachroma organ.

**Railguns**

Nurglitch wrote:I love the way people are wailing and carrying on in this thread, bemoaning the fact that GW's previously "African" or "African-American" (hint: if they're not American, they're not hyphenated Americans) without any hint of reflection that the genestock of Nocturne (an entire planet mind you) might have included a variety of races and skin-colours, and that people of the 'black' variety might have been descended from Australian Aboriginals, Native Americans, Dalits, or even Swedes. After ten thousand years of galactic migration we have Ogryns and Ratlings. A preference for melanin in a population is a small thing by comparison, and that's leaving out the fact of the Marine Melachroma organ.

Thank you. One of the funniest arguments I've ever witnessed was between one of my med school friends from Africa arguing with a local "african-american" over which one of them was actually "african-american".

**Nofasse 'Eadhunta**

My Salamanders are black.

Now I have an excuse for outnumbering in CC and getting good Run rolls.

**Polonius**

Point of information: If Al Raheem is meant to be neo-arabic, then he's white.

Personally, I think the midnight black with red eyes looks really sweet against the dark green armor.

**Railguns**

But thats not the point!! The point is RACISM!!! RARR!!

(You're right, they do look pretty cool)

**SlaveToDorkness**

My favorite is a white person who immigrates from Africa to America....an African-american!

**Canonness Rory**

Half of my bare-headed models are african, if only because it's more fun to paint.

**Railguns**

I'm not racist! I have black friends, er models!! haha

**Orkeosaurus**

Black people love me.

**cadbren**

When they say they have red eyes, do they mean the coloured part of the eye or the entire eye? GW painters seem to have gone with the whole eye approach but how would they look if they just had red irises?
I agree that the red eyes looks plain wrong and I'd say that they'd look just as wrong no matter what colour their skin is.

What I've wondered about is why so many descriptions of marines have them as being tanned (at least their faces). When do marines have the time to get tanned, I thought they spent most of their lives either in fortresses or spaceships and normally wore helmets in battle, so where is all this exposure to sunlight? I think your average marine would look pretty pasty rather than tanned.

**CajunMan550**

I don't really care I painted my salies that I bought black and gave them Afros.

**Majesticgoat**

I would imagine it is just the iris'. But who knows?

How is it possible this can be considered racist?

Every Space Marine is whatever skin pigmentation they need to be to best survive in their environment. Being exposed to the Salamanders planet long enough would turn Marneus' skin darker.. Maybe it would take a decade to turn completely black but the point still stands.

It is really sort of an anti-racist take on human adaptation, isn't it?

**DarkHound**

It'd take several seconds given his enhancements.

**Grim.Badger**

If you think Sallies are racist, just read some of the Blod Angel fluff

They go into vats all haggared and tanned as humans and come out all white skinned and "Godlike". Sounds racist but it's really just the whole Vampire thing.

Personally I paint mine with a mediteranian complexion (or at least I try) as their imagined home base is on a continent with a very mediteranian climate, but as has been pointed out their enhancements would make them adapt so quickly you can paint them whatever colour you want; also who knows what would be the best skin colour under the light of a blue giant sun? or a red dwarf?

**Emperors Faithful**

Hey! BA are cool. Don't deny it. (also, the locals aren't tanned, thye're BURNT)

**KingCracker**

I think its pretty dumb too. When I first heard of them and the fluff (long time ago) I thought how cool it was that they had an all black chapter. It always bugged me on the fact they have NO dark skin toned.... wel anything really. That stuck out to me. But now they are.... BLACK!! not black. Just ten shades of lame I think. I agree, make them look african, not drows.

**Railguns**

The Salamanders are the way they are because unlike the other chapters, they actually intermingle with their "home" planet and live among them for most of their free time. The company captains are the leaders of the 7 largest settlements. An "african" skin tone would make sense considering melanin is a protective pigment to help the skin survive UV radiation and heat.

I think it probably has nothing to do with racism at all, but probably more to do with them seeing the Firegiants and thinking, "hey, these guys look pretty cool! Lets make the Salamanders look like this! They like fire too!"
Then they get confused when we all start screaming about racism.