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I'm hopeful the lack of communication means that there's a lot of non-glamorous logistical kinda stuff going on behind the scenes and all of our boxes are on some boat crossing the pacific right now, or maybe even on a train crossing the US. They have till the end of November till you can consider it late, so that's still like 5 or 6 more weeks... an eternity in Galactic Standard Interweb Time.

I doubt that anything has actually left the warehouse yet. I also wonder if they have anything set up with their distributer to handle shipping out the kickstarter stuff at the same time as the stuff that's shipping to retail outlets. I don't remember anything in the kickstarter saying we'd get our stuff earlier than the general public so I don't expect to see anything prior to that.

But a word or two from them on their own forums would still be nice.

Do not get me wrong, I cannot wait to get all of my items but I feel like maybe I could have spent less with each day that passes!

As for not posting news and pictures of the sculpts because one drew some flack - that's not the case at all. I pulled that thread because it was just going round in circles - and I just don't want that sort of aggressive back and forth on these forums.

*Snort*

It's always nice when a business owner feels so comfortable he can be completely honest with the people that paid him months in advance... Not to make butter out of his peanuts, but c'mon.

It's probably a bit closer to what their chief moderator/site administrator surmised,

Lugburz wrote:This goes above my pay-grade (which is to say £0, so I speak for no one but myself), but the backlash regarding the last sculpt preview had a definite impact on future updates and how they will be displayed. This isn't to say that miniatures won't be previewed before general release, but you may end up seeing them painted before you see the green-stuff / master molds.

What happened seems pretty typical of what has been seen from this first "generation" of kickstarter successes. They end up making way, way more money and attracting more interest then they initially expected or budgeted for, and find themselves overwhelmed.

The McVeys got near-about a million in advanced cash, thousands of pre-buys, and then... they moved to the Shire (or wherever it was that didn't have internet) and were essentially incommunicado for a month?

During that time, the only staff of any kind available on their forums were unpaid, volunteer moderators. Whatever you think of SM's ability to design minis/games/etc, that's some not-ready-for-prime-time stuff from a business perspective.

That's been happening all over the place: the communication in terms of when stuff would be shipping, along with making decisions for shirts and posters, for Tentacle Bento has been pretty atrocious (which really gives one good feelings about their much, much bigger Relic Knights KS...).

Reaper, who have been otherwise quite good, ended up with so many orders for paint that they ended up getting moved back 6 months to ship, all because they couldn't source enough bottles! (We should all have such problems, hehe!)

The lack of communication does rather annoy me. What would be wrong with posting a couple of pics of the actual sets? After all, we haven't even seen what most of the stuff looks like in plastic! Also, pretty sure they promised painted pics of said plastics in a few days, last month. Where are they?

Ah well, I can live with it provided I get all my stuff this year, just wanted to voice my opinion!

I think many of the posters have summarized the reasons why Kickstarter isn't as great as it may seem at first glance.

The McVeys were not ready for this it seems, but they should have been better prepared. With a million dollars coming in, maybe they could have hired a community manager to keep their customers happy, instead of unpaid volunteers who can't offer much.


Oh well. Once I get my models, I will make final judgement on the KS.

Keep in mind that not everything is shipping in November. Look at your kickstarter and you'll see that a bunch of stuff is scheduled for 2013. I only remind people of this because I don't want to read all the posts about how people are butt-hurt by McVey because they didn't get everything they wanted in the first shipment.

Just wait for 2013 to roll around and still have no communication lol

It is a shame that they went into shutdown mode after the Jada Lily debacle.

Still, they should have hired someone to manage the project.

It is a rather disturbing trend now though - the bigger, more successful Kickstarters not having a good line of communication or plan to deal with the success...

 Alpharius wrote:
It is a shame that they went into shutdown mode after the Jada Lily debacle.

Still, they should have hired someone to manage the project.

It is a rather disturbing trend now though - the bigger, more successful Kickstarters not having a good line of communication or plan to deal with the success...

Reaper is still communicating and they blew SW away. I think it's poor form on the part of the McVeys at this point. I defended them quite a bit but they have left us all in the dark and it has generated the feeling of discontent many have.

 IdentifyZero wrote:
I think many of the posters have summarized the reasons why Kickstarter isn't as great as it may seem at first glance.

x1000

KS is still a pretty new concept, and I think given the delivery dates of a lot of the projects have yet to come around, we've only seen the results of a few failures - indeed, I've only read about one in depth, but I'm sure there has been others.

I think the "stretch" part of "stretch goal" is perhaps a little too apt in projects like this. It's great to keep throwing money down to get all these bonus extras that come about, but in hindsight are you going to wish that they'd just concentrated on the original content with perhaps half as many stretch goals if it enables them to release a higher quality product in a timely manner, with more money devoted to managing the entire post-KS process?

 IdentifyZero wrote:

 Alpharius wrote:
It is a shame that they went into shutdown mode after the Jada Lily debacle.

Still, they should have hired someone to manage the project.

It is a rather disturbing trend now though - the bigger, more successful Kickstarters not having a good line of communication or plan to deal with the success...

Reaper is still communicating and they blew SW away. I think it's poor form on the part of the McVeys at this point. I defended them quite a bit but they have left us all in the dark and it has generated the feeling of discontent many have.

This.

Also, great post above by Buzzsaw. I also enjoyed the pun. (I see what you did there).

I don't think McVeys are going to rip me off, but I expect that it will (all?) be late. Ultimately the way that they (and CMON) handle the post "give us money" phase will be what impacts how willing I am to go in for any future KS either company has anything to do with. I'm far from angry or in "give me my stuff" or "you ripped us off" mode, but neither am I impressed with the lack of communication either. Going from daily updates to a deafening silence once the money is in isn't quite awesome, if you see what I mean...

I ask "Is there any new news?" and somehow we're at "I don't think the McVey's are going to rip me off!".

Sheesh... Kickstarters are bad for this website. Everyone acts like it's life or death...

At this point, unless DUST feels the need for some crazy Kickstarter for no reason, I am done with the whole thing.

I got a great amount of Sedition Wars miniatures at an amazing price I suppose, I believe they will deliver us a quality product but as Scipio.au said, it's likely going to be late, I have no doubts. :( I do however, feel that a great deal of this post-KS silence falls to CMON.

The McVeys are small time people mostly, CMON did not seem to guide them through the post-KS process or even attempt to. I'm not ranting or raving for my cash back, nor will I when I get my models (I hope), but I do think that many of us get sucked in by the 'deal' of the KS without considering the time we may be waiting.

The Reaper Kickstarter is an example I will use again of one that probably brought many of us in, solely because of that $100 deal, the amount of miniatures you get is astounding.

I just feel, perhaps, that the KS is not as great of a deal, situation or tool if you want to get product or a deal; since the real purpose is to support those people with their goal, they are not even obligated to supply to you after if all falls through for some reason, based upon what I have read.

We all probably got an extra $50-$100 value in our box sets through KS, just at the cost of waiting. One way to look at it is, if we did not use KS we would still be waiting. Given how many of us who paid into the KS probably ordered from Studio McVey? The deal becomes more extraordinary when you consider that a squad of 10 Vanguard was over $100 USD! That blows the cost of GW or any other company out of the water really.

Sorry if this got a bit long, long story short, they messed up but in the end, we will get our product from these guys. It just might take a bit longer than expected.

I think it's about time periods and expectations.

I am still perfectly happy with this as I trust them as much now and don't expect communication unless problems occur.

6 months to a year is kind of the point of a kickstarter. Heck, I just signed up for one that delivers in May 2014.

There is always a chance it could fall over, just the people involved (and the stacks of boxes in the pictures) make that unlikely.

Late... probably... but as soon as they hit $200k I thought late was a certainty

 IdentifyZero wrote:

The McVeys are small time people mostly, CMON did not seem to guide them through the post-KS process or even attempt to. I'm not ranting or raving for my cash back, nor will I when I get my models (I hope), but I do think that many of us get sucked in by the 'deal' of the KS without considering the time we may be waiting.

Definitely agree, it's important to remember that McVey studios are quite small time (perhaps just he and his wife?) That they were shocked by the money this project received is a certainty.

To be honest I don't mind waiting a little while, and would rather wait a few extra months if it means the final product will be better (although Christmas time games of Sedition Wars would be perfect! ) but the issue here is with lack of communication and also a bit of management from CMoN. I mean they must be making an absolute packet out of the KS, surely it justifies a guy sitting down to write an email every 2-3 weeks with a project update? I think that would immediately put everyone's minds at ease, even if they were then informed that there had been some delay.

Same to with the poo-storm on the McVey forums regarding Jada - it just needed a small-time moderator to give a friendly reminder to the few people who were getting heated about it (and if you look, it was the same people posting the same thing repeatedly). And instead what we have now is the obvious implication that it has made them much more cautious about releasing anything, compounding the issues caused by the lack of communication from CMoN.

I don't think there is any reason to expect a delay. The original date which is stated on Kickstarter is November so they have more than a month. And given the picture of what seems to be the finished boxes seems they are probably getting ready for start shipping. Although I have to agree that if they would tell us this we all would be a lot happier.

 Bacms wrote:
I don't think there is any reason to expect a delay. The original date which is stated on Kickstarter is November so they have more than a month. And given the picture of what seems to be the finished boxes seems they are probably getting ready for start shipping. Although I have to agree that if they would tell us this we all would be a lot happier.

Exactly!

It isn't even late yet - and from all appearances, it isn't going to be!

 Bacms wrote:
I don't think there is any reason to expect a delay. The original date which is stated on Kickstarter is November so they have more than a month. And given the picture of what seems to be the finished boxes seems they are probably getting ready for start shipping. Although I have to agree that if they would tell us this we all would be a lot happier.

Assuming that that is not 4 pallets of empty boxes and they are not being store in Maelstroms phantom warehouse!

I agree though it is far too early for gnashing of teeth, last week of November maybe but not October.

 Pacific wrote:
the issue here is with lack of communication and also a bit of management from CMoN. I mean they must be making an absolute packet out of the KS, surely it justifies a guy sitting down to write an email every 2-3 weeks with a project update? I think that would immediately put everyone's minds at ease, even if they were then informed that there had been some delay.

Same to with the poo-storm on the McVey forums regarding Jada - it just needed a small-time moderator to give a friendly reminder to the few people who were getting heated about it (and if you look, it was the same people posting the same thing repeatedly). And instead what we have now is the obvious implication that it has made them much more cautious about releasing anything, compounding the issues caused by the lack of communication from CMoN.

This says it pretty well, though we were discussing similar points way back when we were waiting on the pledge manager. As for the palettes of boxes there wasn't any indication of where they were, so I'm assuming China, so there's no guarantee that they're even on a slow boat to San Fran yet (or whichever port they're using.) That's the thing with not being updated or given any information - it leads to all kinds of fun speculation!

I don't think any KS I've supported has been late - yet:

Red Box Games looks like people who ordered cavalry will be a week into November (everything else has been cast, from my understanding), and he's working on the last cavalry model (theoretically if there's a lot of overnight shipping, it could make October, but that's not necessary(). So that's about the only late one so far.

Kings of War - Mantic delivered the first army shipments _earlier_ than the dates on the KS. The second stuff is what, May 2013?

Judge Dredd - I've seen messages from people who have already received their pledges (of models that currently exist), and Mongoose just showed a ton of greens for CitiDef and Sovs and others. No worries there.

Low Life - they keep showing greens and a half dozen are about to be cast. (Feb/Jun 2013)

Fanticide - has just shipped, on time.

Sedition Wars - due November for the first shipment, so we've got 5 weeks.

so while I also understand and it kinda sucks about the lack of updates, should anyone really be complaining unless it's maybe a month from now and no one has Sedition Wars boxes in hand?

 judgedoug wrote:
Kings of War - Mantic delivered the first army shipments _earlier_ than the dates on the KS. The second stuff is what, May 2013?

,,,planned for somewhere Q2 2013, originally. seems it'll be march/april now, I believe - they might squeeze it into Q1, actually

 scipio.au wrote:

 Pacific wrote:
the issue here is with lack of communication and also a bit of management from CMoN. I mean they must be making an absolute packet out of the KS, surely it justifies a guy sitting down to write an email every 2-3 weeks with a project update? I think that would immediately put everyone's minds at ease, even if they were then informed that there had been some delay.

Same to with the poo-storm on the McVey forums regarding Jada - it just needed a small-time moderator to give a friendly reminder to the few people who were getting heated about it (and if you look, it was the same people posting the same thing repeatedly). And instead what we have now is the obvious implication that it has made them much more cautious about releasing anything, compounding the issues caused by the lack of communication from CMoN.

This says it pretty well, though we were discussing similar points way back when we were waiting on the pledge manager. As for the palettes of boxes there wasn't any indication of where they were, so I'm assuming China, so there's no guarantee that they're even on a slow boat to San Fran yet (or whichever port they're using.) That's the thing with not being updated or given any information - it leads to all kinds of fun speculation!

These two hit it perfectly.

Its not that I'm worried about not receiving my stuff, or even that I care it will be late. It is the lack of communication that most of us find, at best, a little irritating. I love seeing sculpts for figures. I'm sure there are new ones to show. At the very least, it lets us know there is something going on with the stuff we pledged hundreds, and some of us thousands, of dollars for.

Communication is easy. And CMoN seem to be very poor at it, or just don't want to be bothered by it. Either way, its not good. It seems to not be just this project either. Relic Knights has been quiet from my understanding, and Zombicide has questions hanging out there waiting for answers as well.

~Eric

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/coolminiornot/sedition-wars-battle-for-alabaster/posts/335585?ref=email&show_token=0f8e2aadd1a50d85

Seems like they've been paying attention to Dakka and gave us an update.

Well well, speak of the Devil and he shall appear, WIPs!







Nice biohazard dude, and the techno-zombie is... definitly a techno-zombie.

Looking at it, I would guess that the dude is a Remy Tremblay sculpt. I could be wrong... although, it is odd that they seem to have stopped crediting the guys that do the work. *shrug*

In all honesty, while the zombie is very well done, I have to say that I really dislike the aesthetic they went with. Entirely personal, I realize it's almost certainly blowing the hair back on a lot of people.

 Buzzsaw wrote:
In all honesty, while the zombie is very well done, I have to say that I really dislike the aesthetic they went with. Entirely personal, I realize it's almost certainly blowing the hair back on a lot of people.

I'm with you 100%. While I didn't start playing it until after the Kickstarter was over, I think Dead Space's Necromorphs are a much better take on the body horror concept than these are. Too much of the original body is replaced to make them interesting models.

W00T!

Both are very much to my liking!

I think the strain is meant to be Ramirez?(spelling?)

 Buzzsaw wrote:
Well well, speak of the Devil and he shall appear
In all honesty, while the zombie is very well done, I have to say that I really dislike the aesthetic they went with. Entirely personal, I realize it's almost certainly blowing the hair back on a lot of people.

I have to say that I agree with you. I'm very happy with the look of the human trooper, and while the zombie is technically fine, I'm not in love with it. It'll be fine to use in the game though (and in 40k as a Plague Zombie as well, no doubt). Looks like a nice contender for an Army Painter dip bath over an uneven airbrushed coat of flesh tones, reds and pinks. So at least they'll paint up real fast.

Jeez.. Scipio, please change your avatar dude, that guy you've put there now is a you're going to immediately put the back up of anyone who reads your posts

Love the human trooper (going to love painting that in hazard suit colours!) and I guess the zombie is OK - bit of a special one though? I think it looks a bit odd because it is still wearing a head-band (this zombie accessorises! ) but that was a necessity to try and tie it to the other Ramirez model.

Would it be inappropriate now for me to go onto the official forum and make a post saying
WHY IS THE ZOMBI WITH A HEDBAND AND HAS NO LIPS WTF ALSO THE HEAD AND ALSO THE FACE IS 2 BIG WOLOLOL!!!1!!!
Or would that not be appropriate ?