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Stoffer wrote:

But again, from what I gather, the Thousand Sons force Ahriman commanded was basically wiped out. Doesn't it make sense to move on to an emergent character from another chapter? The people central to the fiction when the Chaos dex comes out might not be the same characters that were central when the last one came out.

Ahriman's warband works like all Chaos renegades. He's a big, powerful guy promising more power, thus Chaos guys flock to him, get wiped out and he gets new ones. And he's been an on-and-off ally of Abaddon, so supplies of new recruits shouldn't be an issue really.


And I think people still have a wrong picture of "renegades". Renegades are in no small part (former) Legions. Many of those with at least some official fluff have some ties. Such as the Sanctified, who are (at the top at least) Word Bearers who have given themselves fully to Khorne or the Warriors of Aggannor, which is an alliance of Night Lord and Word Bearer splinter groups. Renegades are not, if ever, exclusively "recent" traitors. Renegades ARE what the Legions have become 99% of the time. Even if they are led by a powerful "new" champion from a more recent Chapter such as Huron or Zhufor, they also quickly build a following with warbands from the Legions.

catharsix wrote:Hey now, the Cron second wave was rumoured to be coming up even sooner than this, so don't blame the ancient-undead-space-mummy-robots!

Oh this is personal

Btw the dark angel spine image is supposed to be over at bols, I cant view it but might be helpful to someone? Indicator for release?

Rumours really are hectic now aren't they? So many conflicting rumours

Edit: nevermind

Your tag is broken.

Here:

The backpack looks wierd, I thought it looked quite chaotic, but maybe I have been playing to much chaos

You sure thats this picture, http://www.lounge.belloflostsouls.net/showthread.php?t=21401 sorry i cant see the pic, one guy says it seems to be complete in 6 months, if the pic is legit, could it be an indicator for releases, e.g. it would mean da in 6 months, so what would this mean for chaos

Iirc I read a story where Karne leads a warband of world eaters against some followers of Slaneesh, showing that he does have followers...especialy when he is tempted to join a slaneesh daemon and "convince" his warriors that it is the correct path...

LazzurusMan wrote:Iirc I read a story where Karne leads a warband of world eaters against some followers of Slaneesh, showing that he does have followers...especialy when he is tempted to join a slaneesh daemon and "convince" his warriors that it is the correct path...

Yeah...

That is when he got the title "The Betrayer".
The fighting would die down when the snows started, and Kharn grabbed a flamethrower and started burning everyone friend and foe alike.

kronk wrote:Your tag is broken.

Here:

Looks like a DA with a plasma gun (with an underslung plasma pistol), robes, and a chaos backpack... hmm. Really going to keep us guessing until next month when we see the face!

Kanluwen wrote:

LazzurusMan wrote:Iirc I read a story where Karne leads a warband of world eaters against some followers of Slaneesh, showing that he does have followers...especialy when he is tempted to join a slaneesh daemon and "convince" his warriors that it is the correct path...

Yeah...

That is when he got the title "The Betrayer".
The fighting would die down when the snows started, and Kharn grabbed a flamethrower and started burning everyone friend and foe alike.

Pretty sure the story LazzurusMan is talking about is separate from when he got the "Betrayer" title. It was from a short story from back in the day of Inferno Magazine. It was called "Wrath of Kharne" by William King, and it even references how he had the "Betrayer" name before this particular story. It was a good short story from what I remember. Kharn even had a "kill count" HUD thing that was gifted to him from Horus. Kharn seems somewhat thoughtful and jovial (in a savage sense) in this story and is not the mindless bezerker that his is portrayed to be in the small amount of fiction we have for him today.

Its also in the 25 for 25 compilation.

Well, obviously the robes, ornate plasma gun and colour scheme suggests Dark Angels. But the chest plate and backpack suggest Chaos.
This suggests to me it's either a very grim-dark Dark Angel - going more ornate and gothic would suit the Dark Angels/any new models, and they already have a model with a skull-power-pack. Or it's a Fallen Angel/Chaos Space Marine with a cocked up colour scheme.

My thoughts on the matter anyway.

Its the same artist that drew the current codex's art, as with the Blood angels to my knowledge. I think that it may just be a gothic styling, and if it were a fallen wouldn't his armour be black? 0.o

Just Dave wrote:Well, obviously the robes, ornate plasma gun and colour scheme suggests Dark Angels. But the chest plate and backpack suggest Chaos.
This suggests to me it's either a very grim-dark Dark Angel - going more ornate and gothic would suit the Dark Angels/any new models, and they already have a model with a skull-power-pack. Or it's a Fallen Angel/Chaos Space Marine with a cocked up colour scheme.

My thoughts on the matter anyway.

The chest plate? Can't see it correctly, behind that handle of a CCW...

Its hard to tell what it could be. I think its either

1. A Dark Angel (robes and colour of the armour)

2. A Fallen angel (backpack skull looks demony and thetres that arrow on his chest which says chaos)

3. Cypher (but i am pushing it there on a very flimsy rumour that he might be coming back)

We wont know till the end of the month and get some more

It's been discussed to death in the Dark Angels thread.

The "Chaos" elements/spiky bits?
Aren't.

The backpack's "spiked skull" matches the one that Azrael wears on his backpack. For awhile someone was insisting that the area over the skulls was a section of "mutated bone", but it is a stylized angel wielding a blade.

The "spike" on the chestplate isn't. It's the hilt of a dagger on his belt, and the dagger is actually on the Dark Angels Chapter Upgrade Frame.

Whoever this Marine is:
He is wearing a robe signifying that he has been initiated into the Deathwing(the bone colored robes signify such), he has a weird combi-plasma which links to a power feed from his backpack, and he has his hood down.

If i remeber correctly when deamons of chaos army book came out, thus making hordes of chaos (i think that's what it was called back then?) was invalided and received a WD make do army list until a few months later the current warriors of choas came out. really with the gak of the sister codex out there i'm pretty sure they would just do this for renegades, thus making a reason for people to buy WD
It'll be a little crapy but it'll do and then they'll get new codex with new characters? just speculation on my part BTW .

mortetvie wrote:

Slayer le boucher wrote:

mortetvie wrote:

Jayden63 wrote:I've lost track as to what people are talking about. But clearly people are mixing 3.5 and 4th edition.

1) There were only three troop choices. Chaos space marines, deamon packs, and nurglings. Specific only to the chaos space marine, if you gave them a mark of a choas god they became and elite choice (chaos marines with marks could then take wargear from the approparte gifts section). But thats it. Havoks/raptors/chosen/bikers/possessed etc. all stayed in their own sections. It was not possible to have 6 units of havoks in 3.5. That is a 4.0 thing. The only things that could jump around is the Chaos Space marine turned into a cult choice.

2) Terminators - Terminators came from chosen. You upgraded them for +19 points. You could then spend another 10 points to make as many or as few as you liked into aspiring champions (basically just giving them another attack). Chosen could also take a mark of a god. Thus giving them the weargear options in the approperate god section. So you could have slannesh/nurgle/khorne/tzeench terminators with the bonuses that go with them.

Yes but Thousand Son cult troops (i.e., rubric marines with 2 wounds) could be upgraded to be rubric terminators. No other cult troop could be upgraded to be the equivalent terminator. It was either marked Chosen or Thousand Son rubric terminators.

Well this way of doing was because their where no Chosen squads for Tzeentch, so if you wanted to have Termies, you then upgraded a Rubric unit into it, but they became Elite.

So nothing "unique" or wunderbarr here.

And rubric Termies was more fun in the 3rd Ed dex, only S5 weapons could hurt them, the old "All is but Dust" rule.

Actually, Tzeench could take chosen squads, each chosen became a sorcerer. So Tzeench had the option of like a full huge Chosen unit with thrall wizards shooting 2X bolt of change a turn which was pretty crazy. They then had the option for pure cult/rubric termiantors. Other legions only had the chosen option to get terminators and noting unique about those chosen to their god specific legion.

Having Termies who could Run up to 12", charge at S and I 5 with 4 attacks each, was pretty damn good for my World Eaters if you ask me.

Aside from the 2 W, the Sorc and S&P, Rubric Termies wasn't that great, they couldn't take any weapon option, they where stuck with their base wargear.

They where great for Objectifs holding with their 2W each, but that was in a time where any unit could score.

oldone wrote:If i remeber correctly when deamons of chaos army book came out, thus making hordes of chaos (i think that's what it was called back then?) was invalided and received a WD make do army list until a few months later the current warriors of choas came out. really with the gak of the sister codex out there i'm pretty sure they would just do this for renegades, thus making a reason for people to buy WD
It'll be a little crapy but it'll do and then they'll get new codex with new characters? just speculation on my part BTW .

Mph. They need to add in characters for the other legions before they start invalidating the ones we already have. It's not like it'd even be the codex with the most characters.

Din't occur to anyone that maybe when the new book comes out, they will Faq the current one in the WD.

Thus maybe putting a line with" For Arhiman,Kharne,Abbadon,Lucius and Thypus, please refer to the Chaos Legion codex".

And don't tell me that they won't do this because then poeple will have to buy the new dex to play the previous one, every chaos player will buy the nex book anyway, even if it is only to see the new stuff.

Maybe if in the new Dex those SC's gets additional "Legion" specific rules, they will ass a line that says" because they arn't used in a Legion army, the "Legion Specific Rules" arn't used".

Simple and that would be it.

How are people still debating this? It's insanely obvious that that is a Dark Angel Marine.

Arm.chair.general wrote:The backpack looks wierd, I thought it looked quite chaotic, but maybe I have been playing to much chaos

No, the backpack is just like the one on Azrael, with the spiked skulls.

unmercifulconker wrote:You sure thats this picture, http://www.lounge.belloflostsouls.net/showthread.php?t=21401 sorry i cant see the pic, one guy says it seems to be complete in 6 months, if the pic is legit, could it be an indicator for releases, e.g. it would mean da in 6 months, so what would this mean for chaos

The "completed" image is a fake. It made the rounds here about a month ago.

Alpharius wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:
Of the original Legions, very few are still "intact" to the point where they operate in warbands solely formed of their own brothers. Those are the Night Lords, Iron Warriors, Black Legion, and MAYBE the Alpha Legion.

I see what you did there.

And I will NOT be happy if GW decides to go down the Mustache Twirling Psychotic Billion Slaughtering Chaos Worshiping Only route with the Alpha Legion...

'Takes out my crystal ball and looks into it' " I see in your future A LOT of hurt,pain and disappointment" If you think Chaos is going to be anything but a 'MTPBSCW' vehicle to sell more models then prepare now for the hurt that will come.

I would personally love to see a return to 'the old ways' of chaos, but like LoTD and Slaves to Darkness those days are long gone and never coming back sadly.

I would love to see the AL & Night Lords get some neat fluff, especially if it was written by ADB


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Kanluwen wrote:

LazzurusMan wrote:Iirc I read a story where Karne leads a warband of world eaters against some followers of Slaneesh, showing that he does have followers...especialy when he is tempted to join a slaneesh daemon and "convince" his warriors that it is the correct path...

Yeah...

That is when he got the title "The Betrayer".
The fighting would die down when the snows started, and Kharn grabbed a flamethrower and started burning everyone friend and foe alike.

No actually that is the story "The Wrath of Kharn" by Bill King. He's already known as 'The Betrayer' so it must take place after Skatharax or now ever it is spelled. Great little story I love his kill counter. Bill King knew how to write 40k stories. =o]

Brother SRM wrote:How are people still debating this? It's insanely obvious that that is a Dark Angel Marine.

Arm.chair.general wrote:The backpack looks wierd, I thought it looked quite chaotic, but maybe I have been playing to much chaos

No, the backpack is just like the one on Azrael, with the spiked skulls.

unmercifulconker wrote:You sure thats this picture, http://www.lounge.belloflostsouls.net/showthread.php?t=21401 sorry i cant see the pic, one guy says it seems to be complete in 6 months, if the pic is legit, could it be an indicator for releases, e.g. it would mean da in 6 months, so what would this mean for chaos

The "completed" image is a fake. It made the rounds here about a month ago.

Ah, that one, thanks for pointing out. It was starting to get my hopes up.

You know, the design studio has the ability to write and re-write fluff anyway they see fit in order to justify the inclusion of certain units or indeed an entire army structure. They have no qualms doing this, as the last several 5th edition codecies show. Be prepared for things to change.

Just heard that CSM might not be in the new Starter box (rumours say it's gonna be DA vs Eldar) and might not even get a new codex until 2013. So here's the only thing I get to tell to GW (disclaimer, I didn't draw this, just used the picture to got with my demotivator) :

Are there any rumors of an Eldar Codex, Eldar models, or anything else Eldar to go along with an inclusion in a starter set?

The whole Eldar vs Dark Angels has been called bunk by multiple rumor-posters who, unlike the good doctor, actually have a track record.

So there you go, CSM are still firmly first in line to be part of the starter box and the next codex release.

Not sure if I posted this before, but anyone who's read the chaos codex a couple times knows that no particular preference is given to the traitor legions, which would give a bit of sauce to the idea that GW never intended to use the CSM codex as a stand-alone codex to represent chaos factions. I'm starting to believe that more and more, and I can't really complain about the 4th edition dex too much if that's the case.

I play word bearers. Of course I'm not going to happy with a renegades codex, because that's almost like using the black templars to represent my force. It just doesn't fit. Getting a bit more excited now.

personally i doubt CSM will be in the starter box. from what i can recall its always been a loyalist marine army, fighting a xenos army

- black templars + DE
- ultramarines vrs ork
- ultramarines vrs nids


i would also point out that the xenos armys were at the time, underselling or "weak" armies. this also prevents converting one of the starter armies to work with the other. a DA/CSM starter box could allow for one to convert one of the armies and just make one big DA or CSM army. not to mention, GW wants you to have to buy other kits, not just the starter box. (wich is why they are all usually single or 2 piece snap together "simple" models)

therefore i would be VERY surprised if GW released such a box. Da vrs eldar would seem to fit more in with GW style and tendancys towards marketing. if CSM is due out sometime soon, then i would hazard they would either be one of the first 6th ed armies, (if 6th is even confirmed for this year...). i realize there is a big chaos fanboybase who desperatly want them to be starter box..... but history, trends and overall style indicates against it.

Samus_aran115 wrote:Not sure if I posted this before, but anyone who's read the chaos codex a couple times knows that no particular preference is given to the traitor legions, which would give a bit of sauce to the idea that GW never intended to use the CSM codex as a stand-alone codex to represent chaos factions. I'm starting to believe that more and more, and I can't really complain about the 4th edition dex too much if that's the case.

I play word bearers. Of course I'm not going to happy with a renegades codex, because that's almost like using the black templars to represent my force. It just doesn't fit. Getting a bit more excited now.

No particular preference is given to the legions? The book is roughly 95% on nothing but the Legions. Non-Legion coverage include Huron, the 2-page story on the Fenris ship he captured, a half-page of fluff on Constantinus, about 4 pages of colour-shemes in the hobby section. The rest is exclusively dedicated to Legion. Word Bearers here, Iron Warriors there. A huge extra-box for the Black Legion, yadda, yadda. If anything, there is need for a Codex to get more in-depth with renegades over the highly legion-specific one we have.

There will always be 1 army like.MEQ with good saves and very forgiving. Then.one not so much.

Seeing as Crons just came out I'll wager they're in it along with DA.