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Since it was discussed/debated a lot in my other thread about Inquisition rumors, I'm making a thread exclusively for WH fluff, for anyone with questions or general points about the faction.

What were the sticking points of the debate?

It was mainly arguments about the Inquisition and their structure and methods, along with something I'm unfamiliar with called Convocation of Nephlim. It got pretty interesting, but hard to keep up with at times. The thread got put back on track before I got to put add input though.

I thought it was mainly between those who desperately wish the Sisters of Battle had nothing to do with the Ordo Hereticus, and those who have accepted their role as the Hereticus Chamber Militant.

And me in the sidelines pointing out how futile it is because there is no consistent canon in 40K and what is now could change next week at the whims of whatever new Codex is about to come out.

That Convocation is an agreement to do with the Sororitas being at Hereticus's beck and call since the Age of Apostasy. I think it's talked about in the WH dex.

You probably have a better sense of it than me, I had a whole school day and band concert in the time I wasn't on the forum. I mainly wanted to add the knowledge I got from Faith and Fire to show how Sisters could be more than soldiers that did everything with blind faith. Whatever their function and future in the game, I just wanna play the army. I'm fine with them being in the Inquisition as long as they have at least the amount of models they do now.


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Manchu wrote:That Convocation is an agreement to do with the Sororitas being at Hereticus's beck and call since the Age of Apostasy. I think it's talked about in the WH dex.

Oh ok, thanks. I bet I read it but just forgot.

To answer HBMC's call-out more directly, as I have pretty strong feelings on the issue, give me a pure Sisters army. If somebody playing Sororitas wants an Inquisitor, why not just have them ally like you were playing Guard? I still think DH and WH were put together in the early 2000s (along with the Inquisitor skirmish game and Abnett's books) to make the GrimDark a little more grim and dark. It was pure Sisters before and there's really no reason it couldn't be again. I'm really not even up for the usual suggested compromise, i.e. an Ecclesiarchy dex. The only freaks I want from WH are the Repentia--a.k.a., the only Sisters in that book that don't give faith points (for no good fluff reason). Keep the assassins, arco-flagellants, and tank-sized-toilet-mounted Inquisitors. All I want are girls in power armor . . . and maybe a few in less than that.

Lol. I got the original Sisters Codex for $6 on Monday and really liked it. I want it to return to that too, because pure Soritas is predominately what I'm interested in in 40k and think they deserve their own codex again, but on the other side I disagree when people are talking of selling their Sisters if they get another combined codex. My main point is that I'd never ditch my army in progress, no matter how they are in the current edition.

I personally like the Sisters alongside my GKs, and I hope they stay that way. I think fluff-wise it's pretty much decided as of the WH codex that the Sisters, while ostensibly the chamber militant of the Ecclesiarchy, are always at the disposal of the Ordo Hereticus.

Even though everyone else in the Imperium are nominally at the Inquisitor's call, the Sisters are specifically bound to the Witch Hunters and are always obliged to operate alongside an Inquisitor from that Ordo.

I can't see why they wouldn't be included as Witch Hunters, seeing as it is what they do. It only makes sense to team them up with a faction of almost identical goals.

Allies are being removed.

It's amusing to see people think the paranoid whisperings of politicians amount to fact. The Sisters have no requirement to serve the Inquisition, indeed, the Inquisition has to ASK the Sisters for assistance (from Andy Hoare in Dark Heresy: Ascension), not demand it. The Sisters serve the Emperor in the end, and noone else.

Manchu wrote:To answer HBMC's call-out more directly, as I have pretty strong feelings on the issue, give me a pure Sisters army. If somebody playing Sororitas wants an Inquisitor, why not just have them ally like you were playing Guard? I still think DH and WH were put together in the early 2000s (along with the Inquisitor skirmish game and Abnett's books) to make the GrimDark a little more grim and dark. It was pure Sisters before and there's really no reason it couldn't be again. I'm really not even up for the usual suggested compromise, i.e. an Ecclesiarchy dex. The only freaks I want from WH are the Repentia--a.k.a., the only Sisters in that book that don't give faith points (for no good fluff reason). Keep the assassins, arco-flagellants, and tank-sized-toilet-mounted Inquisitors. All I want are girls in power armor . . . and maybe a few in less than that.

Under your definition, there has never been a 'Pure Sisters' codex.

2nd Edition: Ecclesiarchy models and Frateris Militia
3rd Edition: Redemptionists (I soooo miss my Cultists of the Red Redemption, they were WRONG)
3.5 Edition: Inquisition (OH) and Sisters Mix

I was more rejecting a future Ecclesiarchy (as a compromise with those who'd be sorry to see the Inq's out) book than being nostalgic. It's similar to not wanting Ultramar Defense Auxilla or Chapter Serfs in a Vanilla Marine book. Unlike something like Tau and Kroot, Sisters would make sense model-wise, rules-wise' and fluff-wise on their own.

Manchu wrote:I was more rejecting a future Ecclesiarchy (as a compromise with those who'd be sorry to see the Inq's out) book than being nostalgic. It's similar to not wanting Ultramar Defense Auxilla or Chapter Serfs in a Vanilla Marine book. Unlike something like Tau and Kroot, Sisters would make sense model-wise, rules-wise' and fluff-wise on their own.

I'm a fan of more choice in the codex, so we're going to have to duel for the fate of the Sisters Codex.

My prob with an all Sisters codex is that it will:
a) have little variety (Cannoness, Repentia, Celest, Sisters, Dominion, Seraph, Retributors, Immo, Exorcist). 9 units for a codex not counting ded trans.
b) Be Marineslite. Above list plus 'Sternsisters' 'VanSisters' 'Lightlyarmored scout sisters' 'Heavyarmored assault sisters'

Where as with Ecclesiarchy and Inq, they can expand the base a bit to include OH and Eccles models and get us some variety that isn't just ShortRangedFemMarines.

The problem I see with continuing to keep two codices as opposed to a collected one is that you end up with two armies that are only lightly played, as they are now.

Both the DH and the WH are one-off. The DH fight daemons, so it's hard to justify why they're fighting Eldar or Necrons. WH fight heretics and psykers. So why are they fighting with the Orks?

A combined codex alleviates the problem somewhat, allowing for the impression of a collective of forces. I do like the Sisters, can't see why they would need an individual codex.

pretre wrote:I'm a fan of more choice in the codex, so we're going to have to duel for the fate of the Sisters Codex.

My prob with an all Sisters codex is that it will:
a) have little variety (Cannoness, Repentia, Celest, Sisters, Dominion, Seraph, Retributors, Immo, Exorcist). 9 units for a codex not counting ded trans.
b) Be Marineslite. Above list plus 'Sternsisters' 'VanSisters' 'Lightlyarmored scout sisters' 'Heavyarmored assault sisters'

Where as with Ecclesiarchy and Inq, they can expand the base a bit to include OH and Eccles models and get us some variety that isn't just ShortRangedFemMarines.

I agree. My army will be Sororitas dominated, but there is limited diversity: Sister with bolter, Sister with heavy bolter, sister with flamer, sister with heavy flamer, sister with bolter and a bit more gold, sister with pistol, sister with pistol flying. The inquisition retinue is a highlight for every modeller as much as the Harlequins for Eldar. I don't want to lose the female Inquisitor, I don't want to lose Karamasov on throne, I don't want to lose the assassins.

Noone hinders you to only use a fraction of the options in the Codex, why hinder others to use other existing options? The WH Codex and its model range is so small, that we shouldn't discuss how to reduce the few options even more. Just adding more ecclesiarchy units (like redemptionists and a bishop) would be great for everybody, so that some players can have their pure Sororitas army and others add some Inquisition to it.

The Dark Heresy RPG clearly shows the diversity and fascination of the Inquisition. I would hate to lose the models for this game as well.

pretre wrote:I'm a fan of more choice in the codex

So am I, which means I want the Sisters expanded in choice. I don't give a ratling's arse about the Inquisition. I never use them because I don't like them as an army (quite possibly because they aren't an army to begin with) and because their units universally suck in comparison to Sisters units.

Sisters can be expanded quite a damn lot if you put your mind to it. Don't act like a pure Sisters codex couldn't have a huge amount of choice. I can PERSONALLY prove otherwise.

Shabutie wrote:The problem I see with continuing to keep two codices as opposed to a collected one is that you end up with two armies that are only lightly played, as they are now.

Both the DH and the WH are one-off. The DH fight daemons, so it's hard to justify why they're fighting Eldar or Necrons. WH fight heretics and psykers. So why are they fighting with the Orks?

A combined codex alleviates the problem somewhat, allowing for the impression of a collective of forces. I do like the Sisters, can't see why they would need an individual codex.

Really? You have a hard time justifying why they would fight Orks? They fight Ork constantly.
Here's an example off the top of my head. The Ork invade a shrine world.

Giving them their own codex makes sense just like in 2nd edition. Give them a few more Eccleisarchy, a few new sister units and a couple new tanks and their good to go.



Here is the problem with a combined codex, they never do the sisters justice. Ever single fandex I've seen of a combined Codex always results in the sisters getting nerfed and I've seen many fandexs. On top of that it adds nothing new to a pure sister army besides a few updated rules.

I can't believe how totally I agree with Kroot.

The main reason I'd like to see a combined codex is because the Sisters aren't very diverse unit-wise. The main difference is a squad gets more special weapons or more heavy weapons. This makes the army, in my opinion, a little bland and not as characterful as certain other forces.

I also love the Inquisition units. You can easily make (or at least, could) a killer HQ choice with an Inquisitor, a few gun servitors and a spare henchman or two. They were also great to paint and convert, making them an awesome standoff piece to an otherwise uniform army.

Shabutie wrote:I can't believe how totally I agree with Kroot.

The main reason I'd like to see a combined codex is because the Sisters aren't very diverse unit-wise. The main difference is a squad gets more special weapons or more heavy weapons. This makes the army, in my opinion, a little bland and not as characterful as certain other forces.

So we shouldn't give them any new units? We should just ignore them since they don't already have much units.
Why can't we expand them? Whats wrong with giving them their own full codex with lots of new units?
I'm pretty sure GW could easily expand them and make them unique from space marines easily.

Shabutie wrote:The main reason I'd like to see a combined codex is because the Sisters aren't very diverse unit-wise.

This post makes my brain hurt. Don't you... just...god... grhlgklk.... GYARRRR! And other similarly dramatic jibberish.

That's the entire goddamned point of having a codex dedicated to the Sisters.

TO GIVE THEM MORE OPTIONS. To expand them! To give them more fluff!

It's stupid circular argument to try and say that they shouldn't get their own codex because they don't get enough options!

Necrosis wrote:

Shabutie wrote:I can't believe how totally I agree with Kroot.

The main reason I'd like to see a combined codex is because the Sisters aren't very diverse unit-wise. The main difference is a squad gets more special weapons or more heavy weapons. This makes the army, in my opinion, a little bland and not as characterful as certain other forces.

So we shouldn't give them any new units? We should just ignore them since they don't already have much units.
Why can't we expand them? Whats wrong with giving them their own full codex with lots of new units?
I'm pretty sure GW could easily expand them and make them unique from space marines easily.

See my above post on Boring Sisters vs. FemMarines.

Inquisition/Ecclesiarchy is what makes Sisters Different. Otherwise they have 10 choices or become MarineLite.

pretre wrote:

Necrosis wrote:

Shabutie wrote:I can't believe how totally I agree with Kroot.

The main reason I'd like to see a combined codex is because the Sisters aren't very diverse unit-wise. The main difference is a squad gets more special weapons or more heavy weapons. This makes the army, in my opinion, a little bland and not as characterful as certain other forces.

So we shouldn't give them any new units? We should just ignore them since they don't already have much units.
Why can't we expand them? Whats wrong with giving them their own full codex with lots of new units?
I'm pretty sure GW could easily expand them and make them unique from space marines easily.

See my above post on Boring Sisters vs. FemMarines.

Inquisition/Ecclesiarchy is what makes Sisters Different. Otherwise they have 10 choices or become MarineLite.

I disagree, acts of faith, living saints and their specalization in flame and melta weapons make them different, not the Inquisition. I have no problem with the Ecclesiarchy being part of the codex but I don't want the Inquisition in it.

pretre wrote:Inquisition/Ecclesiarchy is what makes Sisters Different. Otherwise they have 10 choices or become MarineLite.

I don't have that problem . I have an imagination and a spark of creativity.

Necrosis wrote:

pretre wrote:

Necrosis wrote:

Shabutie wrote:I can't believe how totally I agree with Kroot.

The main reason I'd like to see a combined codex is because the Sisters aren't very diverse unit-wise. The main difference is a squad gets more special weapons or more heavy weapons. This makes the army, in my opinion, a little bland and not as characterful as certain other forces.

So we shouldn't give them any new units? We should just ignore them since they don't already have much units.
Why can't we expand them? Whats wrong with giving them their own full codex with lots of new units?
I'm pretty sure GW could easily expand them and make them unique from space marines easily.

See my above post on Boring Sisters vs. FemMarines.

Inquisition/Ecclesiarchy is what makes Sisters Different. Otherwise they have 10 choices or become MarineLite.

I disagree, acts of faith, living saints and their specalization in flame and melta weapons make them different, not the Inquisition. I have no problem with the Ecclesiarchy being part of the codex but I don't want the Inquisition in it.

Okay, so how do we make a codex using just sisters without Marines Lite or only 10 entries?


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Melissia wrote:

pretre wrote:Inquisition/Ecclesiarchy is what makes Sisters Different. Otherwise they have 10 choices or become MarineLite.

I don't have that problem . I have an imagination and a spark of creativity.

So use that creativity, what direction could they go?

Also, do you have to be snarky? ;0

pretre wrote:So use that creativity, what direction could they go?

Also, do you have to be snarky? ;0

1: I've already done it.
2: Yes. I'm very passionate about this subject, and that comes out in the form of snark . I apologize ahead of time if it gets out of hand,

http://download200.mediafire.com/acd...sis%282%29.pdf
Here is a codex that makes them different and unique to marines and adds new units.

If your not creative enough to think of new units doesn't mean GW isn't.

Necrosis wrote:http://download200.mediafire.com/acd...sis%282%29.pdf
Here is a codex that makes them different and unique to marines and adds new units.

If your not creative enough to think of new units doesn't mean GW isn't.

Can't get to that site at work, so I'll assume it is something new. In which case, I would withdraw my crit.

I agree. But this is a thread based on the WH fluff where people are asking for a pure sisters dex. Personally, based on what has been said so far, I don't see a way to do that without Eccles/Inq or Boring.

Once again listen to what we are saying. We don't mind if we have Eccles units. We just don't want Inquisition.

My fandex isn't pure Sisters, which is irrelevant. The Marines codex isn't pure Marines, either (Scouts aren't yet Marines, after all), and Guard has Commissars and Primaris Psykers, neither of whom report to the Guard chain of command directly.

I don't consider that an issue, why would you? I have said, time and time again, that the Sisters are and have always been the militant arm of the Ecclesiarchy. And so I gave the Ecclesiarchy one HQ choice, one troops choice, and one fast attack choice, and kept an elites choice and heavy support choice from the previous codex (arco-flagellants and penitent engines).

Melissia wrote:
1: I've already done it.
2: Yes. I'm very passionate about this subject, and that comes out in the form of snark . I apologize ahead of time if it gets out of hand,

I maintain my earlier comments that Fandex is not a 'Pure Sisters' list, but a mix of Eccles and Sisters. No Inq though, so that's a plus for the anti-Inq crowd. Also has significant quantities of new types of girls, which is positive.


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Manchu wrote:I was more rejecting a future Ecclesiarchy (as a compromise with those who'd be sorry to see the Inq's out) book than being nostalgic. It's similar to not wanting Ultramar Defense Auxilla or Chapter Serfs in a Vanilla Marine book. Unlike something like Tau and Kroot, Sisters would make sense model-wise, rules-wise' and fluff-wise on their own.

You guys are getting all upset, but I was responding to this.

Please go back and see that yes... Some people are demanding a pure sisters codex.