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Made in us
Snivelling Workbot





Welcome to our great hobby, asugradinwa.

A lot of us have been collecting and reading WD for what seems like millenia now. My collection of WD starts consecutively at 136 through the current one, with a sizeable pile before the 136.

WD can be good and many of us look at the issues published from 2003 thru late 2005 to be some real dandies, but as of late they've been real disappointers. They just don't have the strong content as they used to and when it comes to making decisions on what to purchase, WD isn't on top anymore compared to picking up some paints or other needed items.

My reading enjoyment of WD last less than 30 minutes these days, when in the old days, it would take days to digest all the info and cool stuff presented.

It disappoints me to see the price go up. I was on the edge of a decision to renew and the bump in price is enough for me not to renew.

Not enough quality content to retain this Uber-Veteran Hobbyist. I am writing on a letter to send to GW management regarding where WD has come from and gone to and who its left behind.



   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran






Fabricator General wrote:A lot of us have been collecting and reading WD for what seems like millenia now. My collection of WD starts consecutively at 136 through the current one, with a sizeable pile before the 136.


Somewhat the same, at about 148, but I ended up buying a pile of back issues over bartertown, many of which I read more now that newer issues.

Fabricator General wrote:WD can be good and many of us look at the issues published from 2003 thru late 2005 to be some real dandies, but as of late they've been real disappointers. They just don't have the strong content as they used to and when it comes to making decisions on what to purchase, WD isn't on top anymore compared to picking up some paints or other needed items.


They've cut back woefully of late, around the time the mag had no editor, and produced just a few bare-bones issues. The Battle for Black Reach issue was particularly dire, focusing solely on the new box set. Understandable from a business point of view, but none of the content came close to the depth of the material produced when the big 40K2 box set was released or the 40K3 release in WD 228.

Fabricator General wrote:My reading enjoyment of WD last less than 30 minutes these days, when in the old days, it would take days to digest all the info and cool stuff presented.


Agreed. Once they stopped paying for fan-submitted content, that was the beginning of the end. Everything else was staff-only, which was mostly one-shot stuff. If they doubled down on painting articles and army showcases I wouldn't care that much but they haven't, and the drop in quality shows.

Fabricator General wrote:It disappoints me to see the price go up. I was on the edge of a decision to renew and the bump in price is enough for me not to renew.


Quoted for truth. White Dwarf is the only GW product I buy regularly, and this looks like this is the end for me. I might see if I can take out a subscription at the old price, but I doubt it. Too bad it was one of the few things I bought at my local store.

Fabricator General wrote:Not enough quality content to retain this Uber-Veteran Hobbyist. I am writing on a letter to send to GW management regarding where WD has come from and gone to and who its left behind.


Color me cynical, but I'm somewhat amazed you've been in the hobby this long, and still think they'll care...

--Chris
www.chrisvalera.com

Looking for the Empire spearmen from the Warhammer sixth edition box set (empire vs orcs) Must be unpainted and in good condition. Also looking for MIB Empire State Troops boxes.

Looking for Battle for Macragge and Black Reach Tactical squads, unpainted and unassembled. 
   
Made in us
Nurgle Veteran Marine with the Flu






Wauwatosa, WI

I've been reading since #95 but lost interest in WD around #300 or so. It became a glorified catalog to me. Was hopefull for the new changes hinted at by Jervis and others, but just don't feel like paying for those changes.

DS:60SG++M++B+I+Pw40k87/f-D++++A++/sWD87R+++T(S)DM+++ 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Longtime Dakkanaut






In da Mekshop

The only reason I've found to crack open a WD lately was the pics of the new ork Battlewagon - but even then that was shown somewhere on the net and my need to see the pic was satisfied.

There are so many other great scale modeling magazines and so many talented folks out there willing to share their techniques that my reasons to buy a WD has really plummeted. I bought the last one with the free minis in it to enter a painting contest and because a free mini is a free mini, but the magazine itself wasn;t anything compared to the dozens of old issues I keep around for inspiration and painting technique.

8 bucks seems just too high. I can skip a couple issues and get a nicely sculpted figure like Pedro Kantor? Yeah, I think I'd rather do that.

-GrimTeef-
Proud mod of The-Waaagh forum and Vice-President of the Brian Nelson is a Sculpting God Club 
   
Made in us
Crazed Spirit of the Defiler





Two Rivers, WI

while I agree with a lot of you that the mag has really gone down in quality, I will continue to buy it. I love the painting and modeling side of things. However, I don't game, so I don't often get a chance to talk about the hobby(I'm sure my lovely wife has heard more about Chaos space marines then she ever wanted to) Thats way I always buy a WD at my local hobby store. It gives me a reason to stop in, shoot the breeze and maybe buy some new models. Sure the mag isn't what it used to be, but it helps to keep me connected with the hobby.

   
Made in us
[DCM]
.







GrimTeef wrote:The only reason I've found to crack open a WD lately was the pics of the new ork Battlewagon - but even then that was shown somewhere on the net and my need to see the pic was satisfied.



Pics of the new plastic Ork Battlewagon online?

Link?

Please?
   
Made in us
Foul Dwimmerlaik






Minneapolis, MN

JokerGod wrote:
Hellfury wrote:
whatwhat wrote:This could be some of the first effects of the economic crisis is having on gw, it is bound to happen at some point gw being in the recreation sector and therefore must likely to suffer during a recession. Other than that and budgeting issues i cant see another reason why they would do this. It could be just another 'exploit our huge share in the market' maneuver but I don't think gw are that stupid considering the current economic climate any price change at this time will need to be a necessity surely.


I beg to differ.
During times of recession or depression, forms of egress (escapism, don't delude yourself that hobbies aren't a form of escapism) do quite well in those climes. While it isn't burgeoning by any means during such times, they certainly aren't hit nearly as bad as say other forms of industry. Industries such as essentials which are forced to increase prices. Or industries such as cookware, furniture, etc which aren't considered a necessity until they HAVE to become replaced due to ruin when money can be better spent elsewhere.

Look at nickelodeons during the depression. The movie industry certainly wasn't in any bad shape during that time. It was a comparatively cheap way to pass rough times.

Price increases are warranted, but price increases for a substandard advertisement promoted as a "product" is laughable at best.


And that hole post mean jack gak. GW is a company based around a HOBBY, with the economy crashing the way it is less people buy more models, less people buying means they are not making money, if there not making money they have to increase there prices so they can still pay there employees.


I never said that people wouldn't be buying less models, Thats obvious and goes without saying. You seem to have reading comprehension issues.
Allow me to repeat myself. In times of economic recession, industries that revolve around egress tend to do better than industries that do not.

I pointed out that price increases are warranted, but in this case, increasing the price for a supposed 'product' are just as ridiculous as the posts you make.

Saying my post doesnt mean jack gak doesn't change that fact.

   
Made in gb
Deadshot Weapon Moderati





London.

They're just taking the piss. When it jumped up to £4 here in the UK people couldn't believe it, and god knows what it will cost now. I used to be a habit buyer but it can burn now. Maybe this will provoke some kind of backlash, but I'm not confident. Lets see what happens.

I really should be spending my time more constructively. 
   
Made in gb
Lord Commander in a Plush Chair





Beijing

Anti-Mag wrote:They're just taking the piss. When it jumped up to £4 here in the UK people couldn't believe it, and god knows what it will cost now. I used to be a habit buyer but it can burn now. Maybe this will provoke some kind of backlash, but I'm not confident. Lets see what happens.


The £4 was the wake up call for me. I used to buy every one, up to about #250, after that I began to wind down a bit and get every other issue up to around #280 when I really did only buy them on an occasional basis. But I always told myself if it went up to £4 I wouldn't buy, and that's pretty much been the case. The only issue I bought for £4 for #300 as it was extra large and had a few genuinely interesting things in it.
   
Made in gb
Monster-Slaying Daemonhunter







Hellfury wrote:
JokerGod wrote:
Hellfury wrote:
whatwhat wrote:This could be some of the first effects of the economic crisis is having on gw, it is bound to happen at some point gw being in the recreation sector and therefore must likely to suffer during a recession. Other than that and budgeting issues i cant see another reason why they would do this. It could be just another 'exploit our huge share in the market' maneuver but I don't think gw are that stupid considering the current economic climate any price change at this time will need to be a necessity surely.


I beg to differ.
During times of recession or depression, forms of egress (escapism, don't delude yourself that hobbies aren't a form of escapism) do quite well in those climes. While it isn't burgeoning by any means during such times, they certainly aren't hit nearly as bad as say other forms of industry. Industries such as essentials which are forced to increase prices. Or industries such as cookware, furniture, etc which aren't considered a necessity until they HAVE to become replaced due to ruin when money can be better spent elsewhere.

Look at nickelodeons during the depression. The movie industry certainly wasn't in any bad shape during that time. It was a comparatively cheap way to pass rough times.

Price increases are warranted, but price increases for a substandard advertisement promoted as a "product" is laughable at best.


And that hole post mean jack gak. GW is a company based around a HOBBY, with the economy crashing the way it is less people buy more models, less people buying means they are not making money, if there not making money they have to increase there prices so they can still pay there employees.


I never said that people wouldn't be buying less models, Thats obvious and goes without saying. You seem to have reading comprehension issues.
Allow me to repeat myself. In times of economic recession, industries that revolve around egress tend to do better than industries that do not.

I pointed out that price increases are warranted, but in this case, increasing the price for a supposed 'product' are just as ridiculous as the posts you make.

Saying my post doesnt mean jack gak doesn't change that fact.


Dont confuse the media industry with the recreation sector, totally different issues.

If GW aren't considering the effects of the financial crisis, they're fools.

   
Made in us
Homicidal Veteran Blood Angel Assault Marine





Los Angeles

I used to have a subscription back in the day (Before 4th edition), didn't see a need to renew it then. The mag became something that I wasn't looking forward to reading when it showed up. I don't see a need to setup a subscription now, nor buy it at the store. The only White Dwarf's I've bought in probably the last 2-3 years were the two Blood Angel codex issues. If they release other armies codexes through WD, I'll buy them too. Other than that I have no need. Painting technique advice I can get from people at the store or the lovely people here on Dakka. Same thing with modelling/conversion advice. Was there ever a WD article on how to magnetize a turret or how to install LED's into a Rhino? New release announcements I find here well before they are mentioned in WD. There used to be monthly FAQ's for rules in WD. There used to be army showcases of people's armies that weren't employees. There used to be scenarios and custom missions and all kinds of useful gaming product in it. Where'd that all go GW?

I'm not paying the current price for your glorified catalog. I'm not paying the raised price for it either.

What would be interesting to see is the costs/revenue report for JUST the WD side of the business...


I play

I will magnetize (now doing LED as well) your models for you, send me a DM!

My gallery images show some of my work
 
   
Made in jp
[MOD]
Anti-piracy Officer






Somewhere in south-central England.

Someone's buying WD. I see it all over the place in newsagents.

BTW home recreation hobbies tend to do well in recessions, because they are cheaper than going out. It's like instead of going to the cinema and a meal out, you rent a DVD and have a pizza delivered.

I'm writing a load of fiction. My latest story starts here... This is the index of all the stories...

We're not very big on official rules. Rules lead to people looking for loopholes. What's here is about it. 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut






London UK

yeah,
£5 (or whatever they decide to charge) a month oh noes! I can't afford this hobby mag anymore. your in the wrong hobby.

Well you can all call me a fanboi, I love reading WD.
If you don't want to buy it? don't... but do you have to cry like little girls about your nots buyings somethings you don't wants?

Yeah the old ones seemed better... that's nostalgia!
I now gets to tell you all My favourite interwebs quote "nostalgia isn't as god as it used to be!"... get over it

If you think you can make a better magazine with more content, make your own fanzine I'd love to read it.
But what do you want?
more reader armies? you can see all the armies you want online? they can't compete with the internet on this front.
more fiction and short stories, they don't do that any more because now you can go buy a BL novel.

What is it you think they should actualy be doing? that they are not?

Glorified catalgue? if they weren't showing you their products what would they show you? rackhams? your just stupid.
Personnelly i like the focus they have, showing me what's coming and what's out, what their selling next month or the month after... I want to Know...
Confirming all the rumors, telling you how it is from inside the company. the direction things are going.

Grow up!

PaniC...

   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka






Sheffield, UK

I've not bought a White Dwarf since 303. This changes nothing.

Panic wrote:your just stupid.


Spain in Flames: Flames of War (Spanish Civil War 1936-39) Flames of War: Czechs and Slovaks (WWI & WWII) Sheffield & Rotherham Wargames Club

"I'm cancelling you, I'm cancelling you out of shame like my subscription to White Dwarf." - Mark Corrigan: Peep Show
 
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Yea'rly!)




The Great State of Texas

Panic wrote:yeah,
Glorified catalgue? if they weren't showing you their products what would they show you? rackhams? your just stupid.
Personnelly i like the focus they have, showing me what's coming and what's out, what their selling next month or the month after... I want to Know...
Confirming all the rumors, telling you how it is from inside the company. the direction things are going.

Grow up!

PaniC...

The difference is not nostalgia, its lack of content. If everything is about selling the next mini, that’s not a magazine, that’s a catalog. I have no problem with catalogs. I get gobs of catalogs, but I would never pay for them. That’s why I quit procuring WD years ago, its just a catalog at this point. To be worthwhile they have to actually have content. Where’s the old content?

*Variant lists
*Fluff for established or new races.
*New missions for play
*FAQ’s or clarifications
*New hobby pieces and master level events.
*Tacticals-real tacticals not “buy our new stuff” dreck.
*Discussions from Specialist Games lines.




As an aside, I find it particularly interesting when you're throwing insults about, yet spelling and punctuation seem to elude you.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut






London UK

Frazzled wrote:
The difference is not nostalgia, its lack of content. If everything is about selling the next mini, that’s not a magazine, that’s a catalog. I have no problem with catalogs. I get gobs of catalogs, but I would never pay for them. That’s why I quit procuring WD years ago, its just a catalog at this point. To be worthwhile they have to actually have content. Where’s the old content?
...
As an aside, I find it particularly interesting when you're throwing insults about, yet spelling and punctuation seem to elude you.


  • *Variant lists this always creates more trouble than it's worth, when it's no longer supported. like the harliquins lists.

  • *Fluff for established or new races. buy a BL novel

  • *New missions for play Yes this would be good.

  • *FAQ’s or clarifications Yes this would be good.

  • *New hobby pieces and master level events. ? sorry i'm not sure what you mean?

  • *Tacticals-real tacticals not “buy our new stuff” dreck. Any Tactics is going to involve their models (buy our stuff?) and I'd rather read tactics involving the new stuff, so i can get a feel for how it works? rather than how to use a rhino?

  • *Discussions from Specialist Games lines. People already moan when theres coverage of LOTRs (I'm guessing because it doesn't have warhammer in it's Box name/title) etc...so how will diluting their 40ks even more help make WD better in their eyes? But I agree with you I'd love to see bloodbowl, spacehulk, necromunda return... I'd make them mainstream WD... Two Space hulk missions a year would deffinently make me smile. but all the moaning crew will only see it as another reason not to buy WD- "I don't play space hulk I'm not buying this GW catalogue"


  • My spellings bad and i can't be bothered to copy and paste in and out of dakka to use a spell checker... you'll have to learn to deal with that.

    Panic...

    This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2008/10/17 13:02:27


       
    Made in us
    Growlin' Guntrukk Driver with Killacannon




    No. VA USA

    Panic wrote:
    My spellings bad and i can't be bothered to copy and paste in and out of dakka to use a spell checker... you'll have to learn to deal with that.

    Panic...


    Yeah, I think the saying here is don't throw rocks in glass houses..

    A woman will argue with a mirror.....  
       
    Made in gb
    Longtime Dakkanaut






    London UK

    yeah,
    How do you work that out?
    I'm challenging peoples stupid crying about something they don't buy?
    How does that compare to my lack of spelling/grammer skills?

    Panic...

    Edit:
    Are you guys implying that only those with perfect spelling/grammer can throw insults? again don't be stupid.

    This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2008/10/17 13:31:12


       
    Made in gb
    Deadshot Weapon Moderati





    London.

    You don't work for WD do you?

    There's nothing wrong with criticism of a publication that has obviously been going downhill for sometime. Games Workshop is an expensive hobby, and a labour of love. There's simply no excuse for its current lack of content. If they produce a good magazine years ago, they can do it now.

    I really should be spending my time more constructively. 
       
    Made in us
    Rogue Daemonhunter fueled by Chaos






    Toledo, OH

    @Panic:

    First, poor spelling and grammar is generally a way of showing that you, while posting, put very little time/thought/effort into expressing your ideas, and thus it's not hard to come to the conclusion that since even you don't think they're worth much, why should we.

    Second, while most people would have to deal with your attitude by ignoring it, the learned Frazzled is a Mod, and as such can "deal with it" far more pro actively.

    Third, I think you have a fundamental misunderstanding of our complaints about White Dwarf. You seem to think that we've decided not to buy it, and are piling on complaints in an attempt to simply complain. In fact, I think if you ran a poll asking Dakkites if they would pay $10 an issue for a WD full of experimental army lists, apocalypse datasheets, campaign rules, scenarios, in depth fluff, army profiles, competitive battle reports, conversion masterclasses and increased specialist games content, I think most people would gladly pay it. Nobody here is afraid to spend money on GW product, we just expect to get our money's worth. Even without readding in chapter approved, there is so much WD could include that would entice people back it's sad. People genuinely want a flagship hobby magazine: we're far more disappointed in White Dwarf than we are angry.
       
    Made in jp
    [MOD]
    Anti-piracy Officer






    Somewhere in south-central England.

    Panic wrote:yeah,
    How do you work that out?
    I'm challenging peoples stupid crying about something they don't buy?
    How does that compare to my lack of spelling/grammer skills?

    Panic...

    Edit:
    Are you guys implying that only those with perfect spelling/grammer can throw insults? again don't be stupid.


    When you challenge people's stupidity, rong speling an stuf makes you look stupid and weakens the intellectual force of your argument.

    DakkaDakka has built-in spellchecking.

    I'm writing a load of fiction. My latest story starts here... This is the index of all the stories...

    We're not very big on official rules. Rules lead to people looking for loopholes. What's here is about it. 
       
    Made in gb
    Longtime Dakkanaut






    London UK

    yeah
    I don't work for WD. I wish I did.
    I enjoy WD and I'll defend it, Sure it can be better, so It's a easy target for the haters.

    I also feel sorry for those who use it for toilet paper... it's really rough and hard and not very absorbive... your poor bums...

    And If you think I have a attitude because I tell people their stupid points of view are stupid... fair enought, so be it, ignore me, I don't care.

    Panic...

       
    Made in gb
    Boosting Space Marine Biker






    Bolton, Gtr Manchester/Lancs

    So that'll be more hours standing in WH Smiths reading it at the stands. Though I bought the last one for the one off return of the Painting guy.

    He isn't the Omnissiah, he's just a very haughty boy. 
       
    Made in gb
    Legendary Dogfighter





    Birmingham - GB

    recession, new flat yet I'll still buy the models and play. However I would not pay more than £4 for it. There are other military model mags that cost more but have better content (although it's not warhammer, but the techniques still apl). I'll still get it as I don't pay at the moment anyway, but for the money what you get these days is pretty poor. They got rid of the citadel journal and said more would be added to WD, but instead of adding more hobby stuff they've taken what there was away. Like you've said it's all staff stuff now, I'm not staff, I'm a normal player. That's why I ended up on Dakka in the first place, becuase I no longer found the hobby stuff I wanted in WD so I looked elsewhere. As for price increases, well they should stop monopolising and look into allowing othre firms to advertise in their pages. Not competition as such, but look into other aspect of the hobby - wood supplies, foamboard, quality painting airsprays rather than they're 'toy' flamer, scenary options they don't produce themselves (which is getting harder these days). If they're that worried about a bit of competition then they're technically acknowledging that they have weaknesses and don't fully exploit their strengths. Model rail magazines (even those owed by hornby) advertise other firms and gadets etc. in their pages.

    I'm coming to get you

    My Silver Deamon winning GD entry http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/302651.page

    check out my P&M for more projects!

    part of other hobby - dark age jewellery www.darkagejewellery.com 
       
    Made in us
    Ork Boy Hangin' off a Trukk



    UAS~PA

    Panic wrote:yeah
    I don't work for WD. I wish I did.
    I enjoy WD and I'll defend it, Sure it can be better, so It's a easy target for the haters.

    I also feel sorry for those who use it for toilet paper... it's really rough and hard and not very absorbive... your poor bums...

    And If you think I have a attitude because I tell people their stupid points of view are stupid... fair enought, so be it, ignore me, I don't care.

    Panic...


    you are completely missing what there saying Panic... They have no real argument because they are in fact just crying because its not going there way like when they cry about everything els, They just use your spelling because they can't come up with a real argument.

    Any one that thinks GW will is not being hit by the falling economy is a fool, if people don't have the money to spend any more there not going to go out and spend 100-200$ on new models, there going to save it, this is not the movies, and the only reason they still did well in the last depression is because people could trade iron pots and pans to get in to the movie.

    As the economy falls, prices for materials gos up, and with that GW has to increase there prices to still make a profit, any one that thinks its just them "price gouging" needs to go back to school.

    4K Dark Eldar.
    2K Gray Knights.

    20 Menoth.
    200 Skorn
     
       
    Made in us
    Rogue Daemonhunter fueled by Chaos






    Toledo, OH

    JokerGod wrote:

    As the economy falls, prices for materials gos up, and with that GW has to increase there prices to still make a profit, any one that thinks its just them "price gouging" needs to go back to school.


    Easy there killer, that straw man can't fight back, you know!

    Look, you seem, from your posts, that you're just a loudmouth who delights in telling us all how stupid we are, but on the off chance that you're not a complete troll I should point this out.

    1) nobody is calling it gouging, or at least not most of us. We simply are making an economic decision based on how valuable something is and how much it costs
    2) I wouldn't be such a big man about claiming we don't have an argument. Spelling is important as a method of communication, but I've noticed that there is little response from you two to reasoned arguments either.
    3) There's an argument to be made that GW is making a mistake in raising the price. If WD is an effective method of advertising for GW, then making it less likely to get in the hands of it's target audience reduces how much market penetration it has for it's new products. I don't have the figures, so I'm guessing they've kept that in mind, but WD makes a good "loss leader" to create more buzz.

    Also, in a time of economic problems there is usually also a more general deflationary effect. If nothing else, labor costs can go down, while oil has plummetted from this summer's high. Prices go up when demand goes up, not up when demand lessens.
       
    Made in us
    [DCM]
    Longtime Dakkanaut






    In da Mekshop

    Alpharius: http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k222/mrscorrie/BATTLE20WAGON202.jpg


    -GrimTeef-
    Proud mod of The-Waaagh forum and Vice-President of the Brian Nelson is a Sculpting God Club 
       
    Made in us
    Ork Boy Hangin' off a Trukk



    UAS~PA

    Polonius wrote:
    JokerGod wrote:

    As the economy falls, prices for materials gos up, and with that GW has to increase there prices to still make a profit, any one that thinks its just them "price gouging" needs to go back to school.


    Easy there killer, that straw man can't fight back, you know!

    Look, you seem, from your posts, that you're just a loudmouth who delights in telling us all how stupid we are, but on the off chance that you're not a complete troll I should point this out.

    1) nobody is calling it gouging, or at least not most of us. We simply are making an economic decision based on how valuable something is and how much it costs
    2) I wouldn't be such a big man about claiming we don't have an argument. Spelling is important as a method of communication, but I've noticed that there is little response from you two to reasoned arguments either.
    3) There's an argument to be made that GW is making a mistake in raising the price. If WD is an effective method of advertising for GW, then making it less likely to get in the hands of it's target audience reduces how much market penetration it has for it's new products. I don't have the figures, so I'm guessing they've kept that in mind, but WD makes a good "loss leader" to create more buzz.

    Also, in a time of economic problems there is usually also a more general deflationary effect. If nothing else, labor costs can go down, while oil has plummetted from this summer's high. Prices go up when demand goes up, not up when demand lessens.


    1) Sevral people have claimed that GW is just raising prices because there greedy, if that's not you fine with me. My last post was directed at a hole group, not just one or two people.

    2) Spelling is not everything, we don't have to be perfect for you to understand what we are saying, by bringing it up you are showing that you have no argument on the subject so instead your going to try to take a personal attack on someone to make them look like the lesser man. And I don't get involved with a lot of arguments period, and the ones I do are minor, and if there reasonable why would I try to argue it? Its the blatant spewing of junk that I dislike, if some one can come up with a good argument about why the price went up thats not just junk spewed from there arse then we can have a real conversation.

    3) I'm not saying its a good idea, I am saying they have to increase there prices or they will take a loss in WD and wont have one at all. Clearly only one or two of you here even buy WD so they are not making as much money on it then the models, because of that you could argue that they had to cut back on content because they could not support the same amount of employees as before with the loss of money. Also, with rising prices for materials they must raise prices to keep the same profit they are making now.


    As stated before, if you don't like the current WD make your own and distribute it, then you can see for your self how much time and money has to go in to it, then you might stop complaining about what GW has to do to keep it published.

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    JokerGod wrote:

    1) Sevral people have claimed that GW is just raising prices because there greedy, if that's not you fine with me. My last post was directed at a hole group, not just one or two people.


    Wait, I'm confused. You're last post was directed at a "whole" group, not one or two people, but only several people have made the claim to which you are responding. If you send a blanket response to the statements of a few, the rest are going to object.

    2) Spelling is not everything, we don't have to be perfect for you to understand what we are saying, by bringing it up you are showing that you have no argument on the subject so instead your going to try to take a personal attack on someone to make them look like the lesser man. And I don't get involved with a lot of arguments period, and the ones I do are minor, and if there reasonable why would I try to argue it? Its the blatant spewing of junk that I dislike, if some one can come up with a good argument about why the price went up thats not just junk spewed from there arse then we can have a real conversation.


    First off, critizing spelling isn't a personal attack. Saying, "Jokergod is clearly too stupid to possibly spell correctly" is a personal attack. Spelling isn't everything, but it's a show of respect to your fellow readers, and not taking simple steps to correct it is by definition disrespectful. Pointing out that somebody is not following the rules and is being disrespectful is not a sign that we have no argument, it's simply pointing out that you're breaking rules and being disrespectful on top of being, if not wrong, at least loudly and obnoxious incorrect.

    I like that you point out that you couldn't argue with a reasonable point. It's oddly refreshing to hear that you simply like to argue, and that you like to argue minor points and ignore reasonable arguments. Oh, but if we agree, we can talk. How charming of you.

    3) I'm not saying its a good idea, I am saying they have to increase there prices or they will take a loss in WD and wont have one at all. Clearly only one or two of you here even buy WD so they are not making as much money on it then the models, because of that you could argue that they had to cut back on content because they could not support the same amount of employees as before with the loss of money. Also, with rising prices for materials they must raise prices to keep the same profit they are making now.


    So, you're saying that we shouldn't be at all upset that they've had to both cut staff and thus content, as well as raise prices? Your argument seems to boil down to "the price rise at WD is due to economic realities," which I think we'd all agree with. We're not saying there is no reason for a price increase. We're simply pointing out that raising the price of a product at what's often seen as the nadir of it's quality seems counterproductive. Why not use the next six months to roll out great content, and then raise the price when people are excited again?


    As stated before, if you don't like the current WD make your own and distribute it, then you can see for your self how much time and money has to go in to it, then you might stop complaining about what GW has to do to keep it published.


    Seriously, we need an "arguing on the internet" handbook for situations like this. Criticism is not founded on the principle of "I could do better," it's founded on the idea that we can judge the merits of an item based on it's value to us. Never mind that many fora are creating their own zines, and warhammer podcasts have exploded, while the article system here is gaining all kinds of ground, while WD has stopped accepting fan content and shut down black gobbo. I think the community is showing it can do a better job with some of these things, and with far less resources and arguably talent. Why is it so wrong to point out that GW could simply open up WD to army profile (which take almost no time), or competitive battle reports (which take only slightly more), etc, etc. To re-iterate a point of mine: we want a good WD! We are willing to pay for content! We want GW to make lots of money, and to make it off of us! Just give us what we want!
       
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    JokerGod wrote:3) I'm not saying its a good idea, I am saying they have to increase there prices or they will take a loss in WD and wont have one at all. Clearly only one or two of you here even buy WD so they are not making as much money on it then the models, because of that you could argue that they had to cut back on content because they could not support the same amount of employees as before with the loss of money. Also, with rising prices for materials they must raise prices to keep the same profit they are making now.


    So you're saying you know why they are raising prices? Where are you getting your info?

    As stated before, if you don't like the current WD make your own and distribute it, then you can see for your self how much time and money has to go in to it, then you might stop complaining about what GW has to do to keep it published.


    There already is a fanzine, it's distributed on Warseer. I forget the name, but it's free and there's actually CONTENT. Why should I reinvent the wheel? I'll speak with my wallet...download and enjoy a freely distributed fanzine, or pay for WD? Take a guess at what I'm going to do.

    GW really needs to embrace the digital age. "Living" codex's, an on-time updated Army Builder software, a email list to distribute FAQ's (or the ability to print them in-store)...lots of easy ways for them to promote and make their "hobby" better.

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