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With my experience with Crusaders, (which is quite little), I can get a max of 12 shots at rapid fire range.

That is if you are looking straight at the target, with both sides in line of sight and in range.

Tri wrote:Rapid Fire weapons do no such thing they fire 1 or 2 shots. If the model is within 12" its 2 shots; if the model stands still he can fire 1 shot at maximum range. Are you using a non-English rule book?

Not sure where the hostility came from. Let me ask you this: what is the difference in rules between "one Rapid Fire 3 weapon" and "three Rapid Fire weapons that fire together" other than the amount of words used?

SJ

jeffersonian000 wrote:

Tri wrote:Rapid Fire weapons do no such thing they fire 1 or 2 shots. If the model is within 12" its 2 shots; if the model stands still he can fire 1 shot at maximum range. Are you using a non-English rule book?

Not sure where the hostility came from. Let me ask you this: what is the difference in rules between "one Rapid Fire 3 weapon" and "three Rapid Fire weapons that fire together" other than the amount of words used?

SJ

There's no such thing as a RapidFire3 weapon. It simply doesn't work.

jeffersonian000 wrote:

Tri wrote:Rapid Fire weapons do no such thing they fire 1 or 2 shots. If the model is within 12" its 2 shots; if the model stands still he can fire 1 shot at maximum range. Are you using a non-English rule book?

Not sure where the hostility came from. Let me ask you this: what is the difference in rules between "one Rapid Fire 3 weapon" and "three Rapid Fire weapons that fire together" other than the amount of words used?

SJ

No hostility intended but was was trying to under stand why you though Rapid-fire could have an X number of shots.

I'm trying to understand why a Rapid Fire weapon could not have an X number of shots.

SJ

jeffersonian000 wrote:I'm trying to understand why a Rapid Fire weapon could not have an X number of shots.

SJ

simples. Rapid fire weapons fire 1 shot at max range and 2 shots at 12". There is no option for multiple shots or it would read Rapid fire weapons can fire the number of shots on there profile to max range if they stand still or double that number if within 12"

A weapon profile with no number noted after the weapon type fires 1 shot, while the weapon profile with a number after the weapon type fires that many shots. A Rapid Fire weapon fires twice as many shots at 12" as it does over 12". Just because there is currently no written example of a Rapid Fire X weapon does not mean there will never be a Rapid Fire X weapon. The pattern has been set, and the profile I posted is both clear and accurate.

To turn the tables, show me one example of a non-titan/non-missile weapon that has two profiles to express a difference in the number of shots the weapon can fire.

SJ

jeffersonian000 wrote:
To turn the tables, show me one example of a non-titan/non-missile weapon that has two profiles to express a difference in the number of shots the weapon can fire.
SJ

...There's not that many I may struggle ...

Disintegrator
(Max)
Range 36" Str7 AP2 Heavy 1, Blast
(Sustained)
Range 24" Str4 AP3 Heavy 3

Blastmaster
(Varied Frequency)
Range 36" Str5 AP4 Assault2, pinning
(Single Frequency)
Range 48" Str8 AP3 Heavy 1, Blast, pinning

...only 2 but then there's lots of weapons that use multiple profiles to change things ...

Prism Cannon
(Focussed)
Range 60" Str9 AP 2 Heavy 1, Blast
(Dispersersed)
Range 60" Str5 AP 4 Heavy 1,Large Blast

Conversion Beamer
Range up to 18" Str6 AP- Heavy 1, Blast
Range 18" - 42" Str8 AP4 Heavy 1, Blast
Range 42" - 72" Str10 AP1 Heavy 1, Blast

Thunderfire Cannon
(Surface)
Range 60" Str6 AP5 Heavy4, Blast
(AirBurst)
Range 60" Str5 AP6 Heavy4, Blast, Ignores Cover
(Subterranean)
Range 60" Str6 AP5 Heavy4, Blast, Tremor

Whirlwind multiple missile launcher
(Vengeance)
Range 12"-48" Str5 AP4 Ord. 1, Barrage
(Incendiary Castellan)
Range 12"-48" Str4 AP5 Ord. 1, Barrage, Ignores Cover

Astartes Grenade Launcher
(Frag)
Range 24" Str3 AP6 Rapid Fire, Blast
(Krak)
Range 24" Str6 AP4 Rapid Fire

Axillary Grenade Launcher
(Frag)
Range 24" Str3 AP6 Assault 1, Blast
(Krak)
Range 24" Str6 AP4 Assault 1

Grenade Launcher
(Frag)
Range 24" Str3 AP6 Assault 1, Blast
(Krak)
Range 24" Str6 AP4 Assault 1

Psycannons
Range 18" Str6 AP4 Assault 3, ignores inv. saves
Range 36" Str6 AP4 Heavy 3, ignores inv. saves

Warp Blast
Range 24" Str5 AP3 Assault 1 Blast
Range 18" Str10 AP2 Assault 1

Mawcannon
(Vomit)
Range Template Str6 AP4 Assault 1
(Tongue)
Range 24" Str10 AP1 Assault 1
(Phlegm)
Range 36" Str8 AP3 Assault 1, Large Blast

RailGun
(solid shot)
Range 72" Str10 AP1 Heavy 1
(sub-munition)
Range 72" Str6 AP4 Heavy 1, Large blast, Hammer head only

Is that not enough?

Should also be noted the only reason you can fire X shots with assault and heavy weapons is you are told to fire the indicated X number of shots. Rapid fire just shoot how rapid fire shoots, 1 shot at range 2 within 12"

...and vehicles have "relentless" meaning they always count as stationary. Firing at the same target you can easily have one sponson firing at >12" and one firing at <12"

Well that was a fun read.

If you are using Codex: Blood Angels then you cannot field a LRC, by the way.

(Note: unless it is mentioned in the FAQ, I guess I haven't checked there).

Fearspect wrote:(Note: unless it is mentioned in the FAQ, I guess I haven't checked there).

Came here to post the same thing, but checked the codex on the site - they do get LRC's, because they obviously don't get enough special units already

Hurricane Bolters are described in the Dark Angels codex.

Tri wrote:

jeffersonian000 wrote:

Tri wrote:Can't agree with that profile since rapid fire weapons only fire up to 2 shots at 12" or 1 shot at maximum range. Only way to get all the shots is duel profiles.

The profile I posted is correct as rapid fire weapons double their attacks at 12", vehicles count as stationary when firing, and each sponson is counted as a separate weapon. This means that in an instance where one sponson is at 12" or less while the other is at greater than 12", you would only get 9 shots (3 from the far one, 6 from the close one).

SJ

Rapid Fire weapons do no such thing they fire 1 or 2 shots. If the model is within 12" its 2 shots; if the model stands still he can fire 1 shot at maximum range. Are you using a non-English rule book?

He said if the -sponsons- are a different ranges... if Left Sponson is at 12" or less, it can rapid-fire and if Right Sponson isn't, it must single-fire. And he's correct, since you measure from the gun and not the hull. Though this shouldn't happen too often. o_O

Tri wrote:Yep you've got to fire at the same target ... sucks I know. Look unless your in love with death company, pick up a copy of codex SM and use that to build your army. Simply put they get the best toys and aren't sharing them with any other chapters.

This however I agree with.

Tri, every example you posted other than the Psycannon have different strengths in each mode which requires a different profile depending on mode. The Psycannon has the same strength in each profile, yet has a different range and weapon type listed in each mode while retaining the same number of shots.

None of your examples disprove my use a Rapid Fire X as a weapon type to describe a Hurricane pattern bolter in a single line entry. Good try, though.

SJ

Not that it matters though.

InquisitorBob wrote:

jeffersonian000 wrote:
The profile I posted is correct as rapid fire weapons double their attacks at 12", vehicles count as stationary when firing, and each sponson is counted as a separate weapon. This means that in an instance where one sponson is at 12" or less while the other is at greater than 12", you would only get 9 shots (3 from the far one, 6 from the close one).

SJ

He said if the -sponsons- are a different ranges... if Left Sponson is at 12" or less, it can rapid-fire and if Right Sponson isn't, it must single-fire. And he's correct, since you measure from the gun and not the hull. Though this shouldn't happen too often. o_O

If you've read most of the tread you have notice i was replying to just the part in bold.

jeffersonian000 wrote:Tri, every example you posted other than the Psycannon have different strengths in each mode which requires a different profile depending on mode. The Psycannon has the same strength in each profile, yet has a different range and weapon type listed in each mode while retaining the same number of shots.

None of your examples disprove my use a Rapid Fire X as a weapon type to describe a Hurricane pattern bolter in a single line entry. Good try, though.

SJ

Well you have to ask for some thing that specific and i would have agreed it didn't exist. All you asked for was a gun that fired more shots in different modes which i found.

Now back to why you can't stick rapid fire X in as a rule. If you read through the rules for rapid fire there is no mention what to do with X number add to the end. Assault and Heavy weapons have the line "Assault weapons shoot the number of times indicated whether you move or not and regardless of range." and "When shooting, heavy weapons always fire the number of times indicated regardless of range."

Now if GW (or you) want to make up a new rule or change the Rapid fire rules then that would be different but as it stands the max a rapid fire weapon can shoot is 2 shots within 12" and 1 shots up to maximum range (if they stay still) even if you made them Rapid Fire 9000

DarkHound wrote:Not that it matters though.

No its doesn't matter GW has no reason to do anything but call it a Hurricane bolter and state its 3 TL-Bolters but if they did then they couldn't get away with rapid fire 3.

Why go to all the trouble of inventing a profile for Hurricane Bolters and then getting into a discussion about the wording for the imaginary statline......when the answer is; "It is three twinlinked boltguns"?

Steelmage99 wrote:Why go to all the trouble of inventing a profile for Hurricane Bolters and then getting into a discussion about the wording for the imaginary statline......when the answer is; "It is three twinlinked boltguns"?

You need a reason?

Steelmage99 wrote:Why go to all the trouble of inventing a profile for Hurricane Bolters and then getting into a discussion about the wording for the imaginary statline......when the answer is; "It is three twinlinked boltguns"?

It's a forum.

SJ

LunaHound wrote:

Elector wrote:Sorry =P, this is my first vehicle and I've only actually been playing the game for a week now. (before that was just learning how to do anything) So forgive my nooby-nees

Nono its fine , what i meant was negativity towards GW ( why they cant just respecify a few paragraphs onto the codex , so we dont have to flip through 3 books )

of course they did it so we have to buy more stuff -_-

Actually Luna, you're just incorrect - the Blood Angels codex is supposed to be complete.

 LunaHound wrote:

Thats why the sub codex always says
"you need the main Rule Book and Space Marine Codex"
to be able to use this supplement.

The stats for it are on the Space Marine Codex.

actually the profile isn't even in the regular space marines codex

Epic Necro, 5.5 years.

Really? A thread almost 6 years old? We've had two new editions of the game since then!

Durablesilver wrote:

 LunaHound wrote:

Thats why the sub codex always says
"you need the main Rule Book and Space Marine Codex"
to be able to use this supplement.

The stats for it are on the Space Marine Codex.

actually the profile isn't even in the regular space marines codex

They were almost a half decade ago when this thread was last active.

Thread is being locked due to thread necromancy.