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I'm looking forward to see how many more power armoured spikey boots I can put on the ground with the reduction in some of the costs.

the_scotsman wrote:
I'm just sad because for the longest time i've been saying "Man, thousand sons look cool, I'll wait for the new dex to balance them out so I can play a small detachment"

and then this made me sad. I think I'm abandoning the idea entirely.

Sorry, man.
How about Emperor's Children? I've heard that Noise Marines with sonic blasters/blastmasters got a bit cheaper. Will they be viable?

 wuestenfux wrote:
Some positive thoughts, please (other than Fabius Bile got finally a place in a CSM army or an ally detachment)!

The Warpsmith seems pretty good, and Maulerfiends seem like a steal with Tendrils.

ZebioLizard2 wrote:And again, Slaanesh armies got kicked again

Ah, what? How on earth did Slaanesh get kicked? Noise Marines are one of the better two cult troops now, the icon now grants FNP, Lucius got better; no I'm not seeing how Slaanesh got kicked again.

Just played a test game with my bro, my death guard list against his thousand sons. Pretty impressed by the book, didn't even feel like we were playing the same codex.. Forgefiend and maulerfriend performed pretty well. Oh and Typhus kicked a tzeentch DP's ass

Noise Marines are back in a big, big way. Between using swarms of Slaanesh marked BP/CCW CSM and Raptors as assault troops and Noise Marine weapons all ignoring cover, they are going to murder light infantry like it's cool. Losing Lash sucks a little bit, but the Slaanesh powers are pretty decent.

No marks for Terminators seems like an odd decision.

More importantly, how are the Legions addressed, if at all?

And even more importantly, how are the Alpha Legion addressed, if at all?

Does anyone have any thoughts on the Khorne Berzerkers?

Well, Chaos is the first to get flakk rockets. That's been overlooked pretty often and I'd say that it's an important point.

They suffer from not having split fire though...you don't want to fire your heavy bolters or sth. at a flyer.

I don't know where this "No marks for terminators" bit came from. There is a clearly spelled out cost for marking terminators.

the_scotsman wrote:
I'm just sad because for the longest time i've been saying "Man, thousand sons look cool, I'll wait for the new dex to balance them out so I can play a small detachment"

and then this made me sad. I think I'm abandoning the idea entirely.

I'm with you there...

I'm sort of disappointed in the options for a daemon prince... The only way I can see to give him instant death ability is giving him the murder sword, and even then its only against 1 enemy character.

What is the actual wording on upgrading Termies? Are we 100% sure you can only upgrade either the combi-weapon OR the CCW???

At worst, maybe it's a bad oversight that'll be address in the first FAQ within a month or so?!

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

ZebioLizard2 wrote:And again, Slaanesh armies got kicked again

Ah, what? How on earth did Slaanesh get kicked? Noise Marines are one of the better two cult troops now, the icon now grants FNP, Lucius got better; no I'm not seeing how Slaanesh got kicked again.

Should've been more specific.

Slaanesh HQ's and Lucius got awesome (HQ's in general are now all viable in some manner, even Huron)

Sonic blasters still suck and are still to expensive, blastmasters are now one per ten as well, just disappointed that I'm going to need to place bolters back on the models again as I was hoping for sonics to be a bit more decent.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

ZebioLizard2 wrote:And again, Slaanesh armies got kicked again

Ah, what? How on earth did Slaanesh get kicked? Noise Marines are one of the better two cult troops now, the icon now grants FNP, Lucius got better; no I'm not seeing how Slaanesh got kicked again.

Should've been more specific.

Slaanesh HQ's and Lucius got awesome (HQ's in general are now all viable in some manner, even Huron)

Sonic blasters still suck and are still to expensive, blastmasters are now one per ten as well, just disappointed that I'm going to need to place bolters back on the models again as I was hoping for sonics to be a bit more decent.

Really?!!
Ignoring cover with ap5 weapons that can get 3 shots per dude is crap?! Feth, all those poor b ard IG players who've been cowaring behind Aegis Lines and going to ground and then using their Orders to still shoot... Yep, they're totally not whining already about our ability to just laugh at their cover and wipe out whole Platoons in one go!
And while sure, the Blastmaster needs 10+ to take one, it's still an ap3 blast marker that ignores cover!

I fail to see how this is 'bad' in any way. (if you can't understand why you need 10+ to field blastmasters, then just do us a favour and go play Newcrons or GK's since you're looking for a 'win button')

I dread to think what 'decent' Sonic Blasters would be to you.

So... no Legion specific rules then?

Or, failing that, ways to build Legion specific forces?

Well.. apart from taking apropriate marks, cult troops and special characters not really.. Though there's plenty of options to make themed lists for most of the legions. Alpha legion not so much though.. Most I can think of is the warlord trait that let's you infiltrate d3 infantry units

Nothing I've seen lends itself towards an alpha legion army in particular, Alpharius. There's a random warlord trait for infilitrating, but chosen no longer have it. I guess cultists are a decent thing for alpha legion though?

Word Bearers looks doable to me. Dark Apostle, Cultists and Chosen/possessed, Daemon Allies. Done.

Da Boss wrote:
Nothing I've seen lends itself towards an alpha legion army in particular, Alpharius. There's a random warlord trait for infilitrating, but chosen no longer have it. I guess cultists are a decent thing for alpha legion though?

Word Bearers looks doable to me. Dark Apostle, Cultists and Chosen/possessed, Daemon Allies. Done.

You can take a counts-as Huron Blackheart for Warlord; he always gets the infiltrate thingie.

Is it really true that Chaos Terminators only can switch either the Power weapon OR the twin-linked bolter to another weapon?
Is it really true that the Maulers and Obliterators are not Fearless any more?

Chaospling wrote:
Is it really true that Chaos Terminators only can switch either the Power weapon OR the twin-linked bolter to another weapon?

Yup

Is it really true that the Maulers and Obliterators are not Fearless any more?

Yup, and Ld8 to boot.



A lot of truly unnecessary changes in those units.

There's some nice changes in many units, but a lot of inexplicable ones that look like change for it's own sake, and not in the units that could actually use it.

 -Loki- wrote:
They won't, simply because the cultists come on 2 'common' sprues, which include a bolter Chosen, a Stormbolter Deathwing, 4 autogun cultists and 4 autopistol/ccw cultists.

To release them as a standalone box, they'd have to recut a whole mold. If they were planning to release them separately, they'd have done them on their own individual sprue to get around making a second expensive mold for them.

Hardly. The DV sprues are for DV and have nothing to do with future kit releases. Deffcoptas eventually got their own box, but were part of the combined sprues for AoBR. Plenty of more detailed marine and ork kits available despite the sprues in AoBR as well. The set up of the DV sprues is limited only for inclusion in the DV box. Nothing stops GW from offering a decent multiple part kit for cultists separately from the DV box. In fact I *expect* that such will be the case. They are definitely part of the second wave because right now they want to encourage the sale of the DV boxed set. After that, as a baseline troops unit in the codex they will get their own boxed set.

Skriker

Anyone else notice that the Dread's autocannon option is the shorter-ranged "Reaper" type as opposed to the straight TL autocannon of the other dreads?

:/

I love the codex. I'm crazy about a product I haven't even seen yet...

 Vaktathi wrote:


A lot of truly unnecessary changes in those units.

There's some nice changes in many units, but a lot of inexplicable ones that look like change for it's own sake, and not in the units that could actually use it.

Strange... I'm with the opinion that most people who make the choices are not stupid at all, even if it would appear so, we just don't know what reasons and goals they had, when they took the decisions they took. But in this case I'm extremely curious about what GW thought they would achieve of positive things which would outweigh the anger they inflict to Chaos players who have to do something with all their Chaos Terminators which can't be used, only giving Daemon Weapons to models with the mark of Khorne and making a kind of respected and awesome fluff-wise model, the Obliterator, as scared of battle as Guardsmen. GW really doesn't want my money. Or maybe I'm just too old for this.

Ok, here is a weird question.

An Independant Character with a Mark of Chaos may not join a unit with a different Mark of Chaos.

Abaddon has all four Marks of Chaos. Does this mean he can't join any unit that has a Mark? (Since he will always have a different one from them?)

I am not, by any means, a hyper competitive player, but I believe this dex is powerful and balanced, there are some really cool, fluffy armies, WHICH CAN STILL COMPETE. Nothing is super OP or OTT, it is all balanced and fair, everything will kick ass on the things it is supposed to. I am not a Chaos player, nor have I been outside of Vassal, but it is tempting because this dex is SO much better for fun, fluffy lists.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Myth wrote:
Ok, here is a weird question.

An Independant Character with a Mark of Chaos may not join a unit with a different Mark of Chaos.

Abaddon has all four Marks of Chaos. Does this mean he can't join any unit that has a Mark? (Since he will always have a different one from them?)

He also has the same one as well, so I think it would kinda cancel out..

 Vaktathi wrote:
Anyone else notice that the Dread's autocannon option is the shorter-ranged "Reaper" type as opposed to the straight TL autocannon of the other dreads?

:/

That's something that I assumed was the case with the old codex, but I was wrong. Interesting decision. It makes them feel more like a big, overgrown infantry unit than a vehicle to me, especially with them having a power fist instead of a dreadnought CCW. I know that's not the case, but that's the impression that I get from them now.

As a Thousand Sons player (if I can even be called a player when the army spends 10x more time on the shelf than on the table) I'm pretty disappointed. The army as a whole is still awful. The cult unit is awful. The additions to the book don't really feel Tzeentchy. The Magnus Scroll is awful even if you can, in theory, get the other schools from it. Demon Princes are awful. Defilers are awful. Havoks got the SW treatment (what a coincidence...).

That said, Ahriman is amazing now for the first time in a long time. Sorcerers with 2+/3++ and murder blades could be fun.

Ahriman, Sorc, 2 units of 9 thousand sons, 3 units of cultists, and some havoks/oblits will probably not be awful. But wouldn't really be fun either.

 Skriker wrote:

Hardly. The DV sprues are for DV and have nothing to do with future kit releases. Deffcoptas eventually got their own box, but were part of the combined sprues for AoBR.

Your argument would make a lot of sense if the Deffkoptas actually did get their own box, which they didn't.

The brute does only get a reaper autocannon, but it only costs 5 pts for it and comes with an extra attack, for the same price as a loyalist dread I think it's better