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Hey guys,

So I've been goofing around with elite-style list build with orks, and came upon this unit build:
HQ
Mad Dok

Elites
10x Kommandoz
Snikrot
2x Burnaz
Cybork bodies

At 415pts (If I remember what Burnaz cost) It ain't cheap, but let's look at what you get:

An ambush unit that is fearless with 5++ and FNP. On the charge it does 6x S6 attacks (reroll misses) 6x S4 power weapon attacks, 28x S4 attacks and 5x S9 power klaw attacks and that sweet -1 LD that snikrot causes in cc.

Only really viable in 1500 pts+ (I wouldn't bother under 1750 personally). But used in conjunction with the right build and the right tactics it can work quite well.

Grotsnick's personal brand of Rage is problematic but being able to bring him on from any table edge and using the Waaaagh! will compensate for this.

Using him in conjunction with a big foot-slogging army is ideal. You place your main force in the center of the board and move up towards the enemy as fast as possible. In most cases (especially if you get first deployment first turn) your opponent will deploy as a pincer formation or all on one side as a denied flank.

This puts your cyber-Kommandoz in perfect striking distance of a big, meaty, or tanky target.

C&C welcome!

If your not doing it i'm doing it first.


Tonight!

Nice build. Can't beleive I never thought it up myself.

I laughed a little bit.

415 points...phew. I can get a 10 man nob squad with three powerklaws for that. =p Sounds fun though! Go for it!

Rage is way too easy for an opponent to exploit, especially against a unit with no armor. Meq players can feed the unit an empty rhino and then gun down the commandos after they run into the open to charge a rhino.

schadenfreude wrote:Rage is way too easy for an opponent to exploit, especially against a unit with no armor. Meq players can feed the unit an empty rhino and then gun down the commandos after they run into the open to charge a rhino.

Rage never forces you to charge anything, and so long as a single model moves as fast as possible towards the nearest target, you've fulfilled Rage. The rest of the squad can go wherever they want, and charge whatever they want.

More frightening than their offensive power is the fact that these buggers have at 66% save. They simply won't get worn down from close combat, which means your opponent has to devote relatively large quantities of shooting to purge them.

I was about to say that the biggest weakness I can think of for this unit is morale. You'll (hopefully) destroy whatever unit you charge on the turn Snikrot comes in... and then afterwards likely get shot to hell and probably flee.

Then I remembered that the Mad Dok is Fearless and this didn't seem so bad!

Grotsnik's Rage ability probably won't hurt you that much in this scenario, thanks to Snikrot, and you getting to choose where he comes on. You can even play Wound-Allocation shenanigans between Grotsnik, Snikrot, and the Kommandos to a point.

That being said, this isn't a Deathstar unit, and probably won't kill its point value worth of models unless you assault a high point IC... which you should be able to destroy with a combination of Grotsnik and Snikrot.

HOWEVER... it's fun and an awesome idea.

I think it'd be awesome seeing what Kommandos look like when modeled with Cybork Bodies.

DarkHound wrote:

schadenfreude wrote:Rage is way too easy for an opponent to exploit, especially against a unit with no armor. Meq players can feed the unit an empty rhino and then gun down the commandos after they run into the open to charge a rhino.

Rage never forces you to charge anything, and so long as a single model moves as fast as possible towards the nearest target, you've fulfilled Rage. The rest of the squad can go wherever they want, and charge whatever they want.

More frightening than their offensive power is the fact that these buggers have at 66% save. They simply won't get worn down from close combat, which means your opponent has to devote relatively large quantities of shooting to purge them.

They don't have to charge the rhino, but if a rhino moves close to the squad pulling 1 squad member 6" in the opposit direction that they want to go is bad.

What is worse is using a bait unit to pull the mob in assault range of something really nasty.

I just don't think 10 commandos are a tough enough of a unit to survive the downside of rage

It's a nice way of getting a PK in with Snikrot's Kommandos that doesn't involve putting Ghaz or a PK Warboss with them.


If you are taking the Mad Dok so you can get alot of Cybok bodies in your army it seems like a decent trick.

I can see the application in games where the unit rolls off from the table edge, and suddenly the opponent has to deal with an IC and one IC-like model now assailing his rear quarters.

Definately viable for an outflanking- Kommando army in general!

I like just a normal warboss, 7 kommandoes, and 2 burnas. Cheaper, better at anti-armour, and mostly just as effective where it really matters.

I ran Snikrot and Grotsnik together in a league list for a while (without maxing it out or adding cybork bodies). You can see the list here http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/344181.page
My decission was that while they did produce some good results and once or twice game winning results, it was not consistent and in most games could not earn their points back.
Problems that I encountered were that they can't contest a point reliably as they are lead away by Grotsnik and after they hit the first target they are then either useless or lead away from where they should be.

Hope this helps!

Coming from an ex marine player, wouldnt that unit die to bolter spam? Sure it would beat some serious ass when it got there, but it wouldnt make its points back before it died in a fire?

Jaon wrote:Coming from an ex marine player, wouldnt that unit die to bolter spam? Sure it would beat some serious ass when it got there, but it wouldnt make its points back before it died in a fire?

Depends.

Since Grotsnik is going to run after the closest unit, you could place a unit about 18.5" away from the table edge and the unit would never reach you. Of course, intentionally sacrificing an enticing board hugging unit does the same thing; it will make the Snikrot unit vulnerable the next turn to utter destruction.

Jaon wrote:Coming from an ex marine player, wouldnt that unit die to bolter spam? Sure it would beat some serious ass when it got there, but it wouldnt make its points back before it died in a fire?

With a 5++ and FnP, they save 66% of the time. Each bolter round has a tenth of a chance to bring one down. So no, they shouldn't die in bolter fire.

Some things lots of people seem to be missing:

1) Grotsniks also brings Feel no Pain to the Unit, in addition to cybork bodies. It would indeed take quite some shots to take the unit down.
2) Snikrot will bring Grotsnik onto the table anywhere on any table edge. In order to lead him around or feed him sacrificial units, you'd have to have lots of those. Also any valueable units they could kill have to be further away from any table edge than another unit to be save.

But 415 points is a hefty pricetag for this. Maybe one could try to allocate all wounds to Grotznik? That way you'd still have some boyz and snikrot to do some killing after the initial targets are dead.

Thanks for the feedback guys! I ran the numbers, this unit is actually 425 pts (Burnaz are very expensive).

That being said, I still haven't had a chance to field this unit.

They come in around the pts of a unit of 6x Nob Bikers with a decent loadout (which again, I haven't had a chance to field yet).

Anyways, it's more of a fun unit than anything else, based largely around the look on my opponent's face, but then again that's the whole reason that I started playing Orks in the first place