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come on, guys. give us a spoiler alert.

DakkaDakka wrote:

Lynata wrote:I guess the problem will be that a reborn Emperor would have a hard time convincing people of who he really is. Sure, once a powerbase is established it might get a bit easier - see Sebastian Thor - but at first he'd just be seen like a heretical madman.

Some guy in beggar's clothes: "Hey, I'm the reborn Emperor."
Random Arbites Enforcer: *facepunch*

He wouldn't even get noticed by the higher-ups at first, let alone recognized.

Also ... I wonder how he would be reborn. Like a completely new child that doesn't even have a clue of its potential at first?

It would presumably be like the manifestation of Living Saints, only radically more so.

Nicholas wrote:
Civil war might be good for them though. They will lose territory, but they will have their almighty Emperor to take it back after and will return to his ideals, which wold be much better.

Well, zero of the High Lords of Terra would likely maintain their strangleholds on power, since 100% of them are doing things the defiantly in ways the Emperor did not want. They'd lose a lot more than territory; their lives for example, possibly their souls.

There's really nothing in it for them personally to let the Emperor fully die.

If the emperor was reborn wouldn't he have to start over as a child? Also wouldn't he have to survive long enough to start to do anything?

Depends on how he is reborn, where, and if he gets noticed. The planet he gets reborn on would make a few gak tons of difference but minor in comparison to what would happen if he got noticed. If the wrong High Lord managed to catch wind of it he might do something he would regret. Such as send an adminisortum assassin after the newly reborn God Emperor.

Maybeh e gets reborn to an Imperial Guard family and spends his first 18 years fighting as a soldier, leading his own squad, and eventually organizing a rebellion against the Imperium in order to restore it to its glory; maybe he gets born to an Astartes Homeworld and quickly gets into position to rally legions loyal to the original Imperium as an idea; a faint dream in the mind of the dreadnoughts from the days of Horus; and he forces the high lords to recognize him for what he is and the imperium takes a massive upturn. Mans not an idiot so i assume he wouldn't sow his hand before he had the right opportunity.

Would make for some good books, maybe a damn good model, possibly a BA outcome(unless status quo must remain unchanged).

If the Emporer choses where he is reborn, he will most likely choose macragge or a BA recruitng world. he is the most powerful human psyker there would be no denying his power. personally i think he will be born in Cadia, thats where the fight is so he can prove himself and gain the loyalty of the eye's defenders

sorry about the lack of spoilers

Another possible issue for the emperor is whether he would even know who he is. Just because his soul is the same doesn't mean his mind is also reborn. He could come back but have no idea he is the emperor reborn. As far as I know the emperor didn't know he was made up of thousands of shamans. If he is reborn without the same mind he is going to find it much more difficult as all his knowledge is lost.

4M2A wrote:Another possible issue for the emperor is whether he would even know who he is. Just because his soul is the same doesn't mean his mind is also reborn. He could come back but have no idea he is the emperor reborn. As far as I know the emperor didn't know he was made up of thousands of shamans. If he is reborn without the same mind he is going to find it much more difficult as all his knowledge is lost.

a fair point but if his soul is the same, then things will just click, i would suspect that his soul will carry some of the knowlage or at least visions of his greatness

Lynata wrote:I guess the problem will be that a reborn Emperor would have a hard time convincing people of who he really is. Sure, once a powerbase is established it might get a bit easier - see Sebastian Thor - but at first he'd just be seen like a heretical madman.

Some guy in beggar's clothes: "Hey, I'm the reborn Emperor."
Random Arbites Enforcer: *facepunch*

He wouldn't even get noticed by the higher-ups at first, let alone recognized.

Also ... I wonder how he would be reborn. Like a completely new child that doesn't even have a clue of its potential at first?

Try attempted facepunch then Arbites explodes from Big E's psychic facepunch . He wouldn't just come out and say "Hey, I'm the reborn Emperor" until he knew it was the right time, he is probably the smartest human ever. Whatever he does will be so well thought out he might as well be reborn in the throne room. Unlike any normal rebel like Thor he would have the means to prove he is the Emperor. Let's be honest if a normal man like Thor could take down the the Eccleisiarchy when it basically controlled the Imperium than Big E could do much more.

Nicholas wrote:Try attempted facepunch then Arbites explodes from Big E's psychic facepunch . He wouldn't just come out and say "Hey, I'm the reborn Emperor" until he knew it was the right time, he is probably the smartest human ever. Whatever he does will be so well thought out he might as well be reborn in the throne room. Unlike any normal rebel like Thor he would have the means to prove he is the Emperor. Let's be honest if a normal man like Thor could take down the the Eccleisiarchy when it basically controlled the Imperium than Big E could do much more.

Hmm, good point about the psychic powers. Though I'm still somewhat sceptical as to how much he would even remember/realize. Visions were mentioned, which I think sounds like a pretty solid concept (provided he gets reborn like a normal toddler and doesn't just pop up with a beam of light) - yet, depending on what the respective Ecclesiarchy officials think, such visions can also interpreted as the works of Chaos, and youngsters with the psyker-gene usually end up being shoved onto Black Ships or burnt on a pyre. And Sebastian Thor had the benefit of just about anyone realizing how mad Vandire truly was - the current Imperium is slightly more stable and less tyrannic (yes, I know, sounds weird!), whilst the Ecclesiarchy has more public support than it had back then.

Have to admit I like the alternatives, though. Both, actually. Regardless of whether the Emperor grows up like a "normal" child from some commoner's family and just ends up committing miracles amidst the poor until he gets recognized, or if he pops up like a Living Saint amidst his most loyal Space Marines to claim his rightful rule ... both paths would make for an epic story.

Well, say the Chaos gods feth with him the way they did with the primarchs. Say he tries to come back on Cadia, but then they send him to some backwater feral world. Sure the whole population would worship him as a god, but how often do Imperial officials visit? And then, Emperor forbid, there's a warp storm and everything on the planet goes Chaotic.

4M2A wrote:Another possible issue for the emperor is whether he would even know who he is. Just because his soul is the same doesn't mean his mind is also reborn. He could come back but have no idea he is the emperor reborn. As far as I know the emperor didn't know he was made up of thousands of shamans. If he is reborn without the same mind he is going to find it much more difficult as all his knowledge is lost.

Actually, I doubt that would be an issue at all.

Magnus the Red, an immensely naturally powerful psyker, to be sure, was conscious the moment his "soul" came into existence, he can perfectly recall the bonding and formation of his body on a molecular level, apparently.

The Emperor is uniquely the most powerful psyker in the setting, so, he could possibly do the same were he to be reincarnated, in that his soul would retain the memories of his mind, since they seem to be connected.

Even if he shows signs of being the reincarnation of the Emperor(such as that champion of Sigmar fellow from FB) no guarantee leadership would be obliged to abdicate him to the throne. Odds are GW would kill him again to maintain the status quo.

I imagine he would be able to either overcome or avoid local authorities, but his birth would probably at least alert (and possibly cause head-'splosions) of every psyker in the sector. The Inquisition would be all over it, to be sure. So it becomes a question of how puritanical the local Inquisitors would be.

In the Far Future of the 42nd Millennium, ... the Emperor ends up on a Black Ship.

I dunno, the Emperor is powerful enough that I doubt anything short of an absurd number of Titans in one place, if that, could not arrest him.

Coincidentally, an absurd number of titans in one place would reinvigorate GW popularity, so maybe they should go for it?

While the emperor is an extremely powerful psyker the IoM has enough pariahss to shut him down. They had to move them off terra to stop them blocking the astronomicon.

And that brings up another issue. If the Emperor went down, everything would go to hell in a hand-basket before the custodes even noticed. At one point, the Astronomicon just flickered and thousands of ships were lost. So imagine what would happen if it went down for only 15 minutes? The whole Imperium would likely come grinding to a halt. As long as the Emperor isn't on the golden throne, there is no space travel. He would have to haul ass back to Terra and finish that webway gate really fast. And by that time, hundreds of worlds would have been lost.

Not that I doubt the Emperor could fix that in a jiffy.

Chaos will always win in the end for they are truly inmortal :(
well thats what they all say just befor they get killed

Well, as long as the Imperium is around, so will Chaos. In fact, Chaos will likely outlive the Imperium. But that doesn't mean the Imperium has to fail! I for one, will stand by the IoM until the end.

hellspawn22 wrote:And that brings up another issue. If the Emperor went down, everything would go to hell in a hand-basket before the custodes even noticed. At one point, the Astronomicon just flickered and thousands of ships were lost. So imagine what would happen if it went down for only 15 minutes? The whole Imperium would likely come grinding to a halt. As long as the Emperor isn't on the golden throne, there is no space travel. He would have to haul ass back to Terra and finish that webway gate really fast. And by that time, hundreds of worlds would have been lost.

Not that I doubt the Emperor could fix that in a jiffy.

When the Emperor dies the warp will flow through the webway and they will have to stop it or the entire Imperium will be engulfed by another eye of terror. They either need to evolve until the entire race is psykers or expand beyond it's reach.

Having the entire species as psykers won't stop chaos it will help it. When the emperor dies all but the most powerful psykers will be possesed and become gateways for daemons.

You're really depressing, you know that?

Nicholas wrote:

hellspawn22 wrote:And that brings up another issue. If the Emperor went down, everything would go to hell in a hand-basket before the custodes even noticed. At one point, the Astronomicon just flickered and thousands of ships were lost. So imagine what would happen if it went down for only 15 minutes? The whole Imperium would likely come grinding to a halt. As long as the Emperor isn't on the golden throne, there is no space travel. He would have to haul ass back to Terra and finish that webway gate really fast. And by that time, hundreds of worlds would have been lost.

Not that I doubt the Emperor could fix that in a jiffy.

When the Emperor dies the warp will flow through the webway and they will have to stop it or the entire Imperium will be engulfed by another eye of terror. They either need to evolve until the entire race is psykers or expand beyond it's reach.

I never got that one. Who took a sledge hammer to the support beams and set that u[p to happen?

DarknessEternal wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:
No, if the emperor died, he would have simply died. This way he became a deity, something he never was in life. They lost, hard. Their legions were depleted, they were confined to one (okay, two with the maelstrom) regions of space, and their single greatest enemy is more powerful now then he could ever have been.

Nope. If the Emperor dies, he can bring himself back to life. Conversely, he could have become a Warp God as well. Right now, he's fully neither, as he's still a little from column A and a little from column B.

Also, you're still confusing Chaos with the Traitor legions. They aren't remotely equivalent.

No, if the Emperor had died during the Heresy, he would have simply been a dead human. Now, with all of mankind praying for him, he is becoming enormously powerful, building his power in the warp, becoming a deity. He is orders of magnitude more powerful than he ever was in life.

And without their greatest servants the Legionnes Astartes of Chaos, and the black crusades associated with them, chaos would be a much, much smaller threat.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Varrick wrote:

Nicholas wrote:

hellspawn22 wrote:And that brings up another issue. If the Emperor went down, everything would go to hell in a hand-basket before the custodes even noticed. At one point, the Astronomicon just flickered and thousands of ships were lost. So imagine what would happen if it went down for only 15 minutes? The whole Imperium would likely come grinding to a halt. As long as the Emperor isn't on the golden throne, there is no space travel. He would have to haul ass back to Terra and finish that webway gate really fast. And by that time, hundreds of worlds would have been lost.

Not that I doubt the Emperor could fix that in a jiffy.

When the Emperor dies the warp will flow through the webway and they will have to stop it or the entire Imperium will be engulfed by another eye of terror. They either need to evolve until the entire race is psykers or expand beyond it's reach.

I never got that one. Who took a sledge hammer to the support beams and set that u[p to happen?

Magnus.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

hellspawn22 wrote:Well, as long as the Imperium is around, so will Chaos. In fact, Chaos will likely outlive the Imperium. But that doesn't mean the Imperium has to fail! I for one, will stand by the IoM until the end.

Not really, since other than the Eldar, who are dying, no other major faction would feed them enough power to subsist. the orks don't, the nids don't, the necrons certainly don't...

No, if the Emperor had died during the Heresy, he would have simply been a dead human. Now, with all of mankind praying for him, he is becoming enormously powerful, building his power in the warp, becoming a deity. He is orders of magnitude more powerful than he ever was in life.

No.
Worship does not make something a god- Its emotions that create warp gods. The emperor doesn't stand for an emotion and all human emotions fall under one area of chaos. As the fluff currently stands the emperor cannot be turned into a god.

4M2A wrote:

No, if the Emperor had died during the Heresy, he would have simply been a dead human. Now, with all of mankind praying for him, he is becoming enormously powerful, building his power in the warp, becoming a deity. He is orders of magnitude more powerful than he ever was in life.

No.
Worship does not make something a god- Its emotions that create warp gods. The emperor doesn't stand for an emotion and all human emotions fall under one area of chaos. As the fluff currently stands the emperor cannot be turned into a god.

Their faith most definately does manifest in the warp, and it DOES fuel the emperor. This is power that he is pooling so that when/if he dies he can become a god in the most literal sense.

I'm going to side with 4M2A, the Emperor isn't fueled by human emotions or worship. If he was, I don't think he would go around telling everyone that religion is bad and they shouldn't worship him.