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Me and my local gaming group started playing BFG a while while back in store and most of us sunk some money into building up some fleets,
however our manager has been informed by his regional that we're not allowed to play specialist games in store, so we've all had to stop.
I can understand GW not letting other games systems like PP or dust be played, but their own products?
Opinions?

Well there can only be opinions if it is GW wide, or if it is your manager being an ass. If this is GW wide, then bummer, but if thats the case then my local GW is an anomaly, because you can still play BFG, Inquisitor, Blood Bowl, all that jazz in there, they are more than happy for you to. So reflecting on that, I doubt its GW wide. Or it may be just limited to your country, in which case it seems like a bit of a dick move, but then again it doesn't affect me, so I can't be too mad.

So my opinion? Do you only have one table or something? I could understand him asking you to refrain if there is only one or two tables, so that the games they currently support are able to be played, that makes sense. But if its a battle bunker (I think thats the name) where there are oodles of tables, then no, he just sounds like a bit of an ass.

Explain that they are Games Workshop models that are currently available for sale at the Games Workshop website, that they have been put together with Games Workshop glue and painted with Games Workshop Paints, and then brought to a Games Workshop store to be used.

Then if the manager (or the one above him) can sufficiently explain why such a thing is disallowed, then you should let it go.

I have no idea if this is policy is GW wide, or on a store by store basis, but I'm pretty sure that Specialist games can be played in the York store.

This is from a conversation I had with one of the blue shirts when he asked me what I was working on, so I don't know if it's a specific night, or if I misunderstood what he said, but it's certainly the impression I got.

This already happened me a couple of time, exactly playing BFG! Me and some friends were running a BFG campaign, and the store manager was upset because kids went in the shop and were amazed by BFG, and asked how to start and such...the store manager was so upset because we "shifted the new customers attention from the great blockbusters, like WH40k and WHFB", that he told us that we would have been disallowed to play the game at the "store floor", but only at the "basement floor". We left the store, and started playing at a club. I currently play 40k, LotrSBG, but I don't like GW shop as game centers!

Well, I personally don't know about BFG, but the store in Cincinnati has been trying to start Mordheim and Necromunda for a while now, the manager/lone employee even went as far as to complain on their facebook page about how no one was communicating with him about planning the games.

No one really likes him, to be honest.

I don't think there is a company wide directive that says yes or no to Specialist Games in store - it appears to be entirely at the discretion of your particular local manager. Some people have reported being allowed to play, some haven't. Clearly there are other factors involved; the busyness of the store being one. If the store is busy and there is pressure for tables then it is unlikely you will be allowed to use a precious table to play Epic or something like that. Conversely, you may have more luck when the store is quiet and a manager might be inclined to relent.

It's often forgotten but bear in mind that GW allow people to game instore for the express purposes of providing a free aid to sell stuff; they don't let you do it because they are good guys or because they want to grow the hobby or whatever, it is all about selling product. Having a bunch of kids playing a game and enjoying themselves is a good advert to someone walking in off the street. And best of all, they pay nothing for this advertising. If you are taking up a table playing a Specialist Game then you are not able to assist in selling anything.

That being said, I would like to think most GW managers and rational, humans and most would be quite happy to let you play when it isn't too busy providing you have a word with them beforehand. Of course, if you really want an answer, then the ultimate solution is to game at a FLGS instead or in your own game room/venue and then you won't have any restrictions at all.

filbert wrote:That being said, I would like to think most GW managers are rational, humans

They may start out that way, but GW doesn't let them stay like that for long. You don't upsell a dozen products per second the customer is in the store while still owning a soul.

Da GeneruL wrote:Me and my local gaming group started playing BFG a while while back in store and most of us sunk some money into building up some fleets,
however our manager has been informed by his regional that we're not allowed to play specialist games in store, so we've all had to stop.
I can understand GW not letting other games systems like PP or dust be played, but their own products?
Opinions?

When were you playing?

In my experience, the GW I used to go to allowed specialist games on the 'games night' (thursday evenings) but didn't allow them during the day (unless the store was really quiet) simply due to having only 4 tables, which obviously were used for 40k/fantasy (the big sellers). So maybe it's a 'dedicate resources to market the stuff that sells most' rather than being genuinely mean...

I feel for the small stores, as it really would detract from sales. For larger stores, surely they can allow people to buy stuff online from the store (even my small store has the TERRIBLE computer system on the wall.

As for not playing, I would ask exactly what HBMC asked... even point to it on their own site in the store!

You can only get those specialist game models directly from GW. Thats pretty lame if they don't support their own products.

filbert wrote:I don't think there is a company wide directive that says yes or no to Specialist Games in store - it appears to be entirely at the discretion of your particular local manager. Some people have reported being allowed to play, some haven't. Clearly there are other factors involved; the busyness of the store being one. If the store is busy and there is pressure for tables then it is unlikely you will be allowed to use a precious table to play Epic or something like that. Conversely, you may have more luck when the store is quiet and a manager might be inclined to relent.

Yes I think this is the case. My local store banned specialist games some years ago when a new Manager came in, although fortunately a couple of other FLGS stores have since opened nearby.

It's remarkable, many years ago when I was a GW staff member we used to get quite a few guys playing the likes of Necromunda, Mordheim, BFG and Bloodbowl. It's not like these were sales stolen from other core games; the people purchasing the specialist games had stopped on the grounds of simply not being able to afford armies for those core systems. Paying £30-40 for something which cannot be used on its own (and will comprise perhaps only 25% of the total amount you need to spend) actually stops a lot of customers making a purchase at all, whereas having that amount as a total investment, be it for a Blood Bowl team or Necromunda gang, is a lot more of an attractive proposition at that time as it's an achievable target.

We used to run Necromunda and BFG campaigns, and Blood Bowl leagues on a seasonal basis, and generally run the core game stuff during the day. The games nights used to be absolutely packed, to the point where we were having to limit how many people were coming into the shop. Turnover was excellent, and every week the kids would be in with money to order perhaps a new blister pack of something, or to collect their last order.

Now that the specialist games have been banned that has all gone. Of course, you still get the parents in to make the £100 purchase of stuff, but for the most part those aren't the same type of kids and young adults who used to come to the games nights - the ones who can't afford or aren't willing to pay that amount to play the core games, and so presumably have just quit altogether or else found another club to play in. I suppose you could make arguments for and against the specialist games being allowed - and I can understand GW's attitude that 'you shouldn't be allowed to have fun for that little money', but having worked in a shop when the Specialist sales were ongoing, and seeing the difference afterwards, I think the company has probably taken a negative hit in several different areas because of it.

It appears to be on a store by store basis (in spite of what many managers would say). I fondly remember having to ring Warhammer World in advance just to check if we could play games of Epic up there, okay WHW does exist in a slight vacuum, but they were somewhat shocked to find out one cannot play Epic in a "normal" GW store. They even went as far as to get some 6mm terrain out for us.

All in all, a slightly bizarre, but very nice experience with the WHW staff.

@HBMC: In my experience if you question any aspect of store policy with the type of over-zealous "no specialist games" manager, then they'll simply wield the banhammer if you persist. A good example of this was I recently went into my local GW for the first time in about a year. Turns out talking about Dark Heresy is completely verboten and a bannable offence.
Now, a lot of people play DH at the local gaming club and meet up at the GW store before. Okay DH is not a GW product per se, but it uses their IP. Banning talking about it a they don't sell it in store (the same logic can be applied to Dawn of War. Go figure. ) just strikes me as daft and power trippy.

We were regularly playing WHQ at a GW store, and were then told we could only do it one weekend day a month.

Our GW store allows us to play any specialist game sold by GW. They even have a few custom made blood bowl boards for us to use.

My store runs Mordheim stuff from time to time.

When I worked for GW, specialist Games were generally not allowed to be played in stores for the reason that they are not stocked on the shelf.

It was explained to me that we should of course encourage people to buy and play specialist games, but not to allow it to be played in the store for the reason of new or beginning gamers. If someone walked into a shop, saw that we were playing with model starships, asked for a demo or an explanation and was interested, we wouldnt be able to sell that product to the person since it wasnt in stock. Of course one can reference someone to a website, but an off the street bystander should be entitled to instant gratification. We would not be able to fullfill that, and it would be a wasted opportunity when we could have been talking about a boxed set they could take home and play with right there and then.

Whilst I believe that perhaps an evening could be set aside for such games, and advertised as such amongst the community, it does make better business sense to not advertise and promote (even by proxy, i.e. people playing in the shop) a system not available to the common store walker.

I have heard different stories from different GW managers. Some blame it on higher ups, while others just say that it is at their own discretion. I suspect that it is at the store manger's discretion, and that they blame corporate so you don't view them as the bad guy.

If you are not happy with GW, tell them, and then go play other games. If you are into BFG check out Spartan Game's stuff.

I'm getting a markedly different impression here from UK posters compared to US ones.

I'm glad that the FLGS is beginning to make a bit of a comeback in the UK in any case, I firmly believe that if there had been more around 5-10 years ago then a lot more people would be playing the specialist games now.

I'm guessing whether or not the store is a 'Battle Bunker' is also an important issue, so that you can be safely tucked away playing away from the eyes of impressionable kids..

as much as this leaves a bad taste in my mouth - GW should really revisit some of the Specialist Games. Bad taste in mouth comes from the idea in my head that they will do to BFG what they did to 40k and Fantasy, however, if doing that allows me to play in their store I would have no problem. Also, it might bring out new models for BFG which would be cool...




I shuddered thinking about "finecast" BFG ships hahahah

Every Sunday there are at least 2 or 3 games of BFG played at my local GW.

We are also working on setting up a mordheim campaign.

In short, your local manager sucks.

My Local Gw runs both a Mordheim and Necromunda leagues on and off. As well as some BFG events and Dreadfleet even. Although it appears to be the best gw in the local area sadly.

I think for the UK it's became a nono for specialist games to be played at all even on games nights at GW's. Found this one out by looking around for Blood Bowl players and popped into a GW to find some. The blank stares I got from so many people who hadn't even thought to look at a specialist game :(.
But then the start up cost of even these games is offputting to some I think, especially as those few models generally won't be used elsewhere.

Nearly everyone who says that they can play instore appears to be from the US.

You don't have to play in a GW, there are gaming clubs everywhere. Gaming clubs also have the advantage of letting you play what ever you like with what ever miniatures you like.

fidel wrote:as much as this leaves a bad taste in my mouth - GW should really revisit some of the Specialist Games. Bad taste in mouth comes from the idea in my head that they will do to BFG what they did to 40k and Fantasy, however, if doing that allows me to play in their store I would have no problem. Also, it might bring out new models for BFG which would be cool...




I shuddered thinking about "finecast" BFG ships hahahah

Before LoTR was released, wasn't Epic the other big game system?

I am looking right now at the event calendar for my GW near me on facebook.

https://www.facebook.com/GWBowie#!/photo.php?fbid=313095245443541&set=a.179330538820013.45795.114192078667193&type=1&theater

WEDNESDAY NIGHT SPECIALIST GAMES.

And they have a Mordheim Campaign.

I declare shenanigans. Not only do they still allow it to be played, they will totally help people sit down at a kiosk, buy any specialist game they want and have it shipped to store for you.

How would they react to playing a specialist game that they used to make and have since stopped producing? I got the 3rd edition of Talisman not too long ago, completely a GW product, filled with tons of GW minis and the White Dwarf article sheets. Would that be disallowed? I think a smart manager could use that game to say "this is Warhammer Fantasy on a board game system that is no longer in production, but if you like the models can we interest you in [insert army here]?"

Call and write to GW corporate. Specialist games are still GW games. You play GW games at GW stores. If GW doesn't agree you should probably game and buy elsewhere...let an indie retailer get your profit rather than a GW storefront.

DoctorZombie wrote:

fidel wrote:as much as this leaves a bad taste in my mouth - GW should really revisit some of the Specialist Games. Bad taste in mouth comes from the idea in my head that they will do to BFG what they did to 40k and Fantasy, however, if doing that allows me to play in their store I would have no problem. Also, it might bring out new models for BFG which would be cool...




I shuddered thinking about "finecast" BFG ships hahahah

Before LoTR was released, wasn't Epic the other big game system?

Yes, it was the 3rd 'core' system a few years before. But, they tended to get alternated - so for a while it was Necromunda, BB, Mordheim etc depending on which one had been released more recently. But yes, they were available to buy from the store for a time. Some of my best GW childhood memories were massive 'epic' Epic games stretching on a 12ft table, and Blood Bowl tournaments.

I think the decline in popularity of Epic is one of the greatest losses to the younger miniature wargamers coming into the hobby these days. It's funny that really GW have tried to replace it with 'Apocalypse' and having similar scale battles at 28mm, but nothing can really compare to half a dozen titans on the table and entire tank companies. The ironic thing is also that despite it being lambasted for its smaller scale, Epic offers a far more tactical and rewarding experience than it's bigger 28mm cousin. Yes, 40k is fun, but then to me it's like having only watched a black and white TV when you have also seen flat screens and HD. Once you have seen the latter it is very difficult to go back to the other one, but if you have only ever seen the black and white then you don't (and will not) know any different.

Absolutely ridiculous. I would pursue an explanation from "regional" myself.