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JohnHwangDD wrote:
I do hope that future Stelek is less of an ass to people who don't play what he says they have to, given that it's clear he's not as good as he wishes he was.

That's the fun about hope, it doesn't have to be reasonable or probable in the least... Stelek has made his name doing what he does (see above), he's not going to change because someone who plays an army that "sucks" barely lost (drew) to him.

Stelek's not infallible/Human? Whodathunkit? (though he himself was prolly surprised)

He lost a game while remaining on top of the heap. Like MVBrandt essentaially said, another GOOD player beat him.

So what?

Haters gonna hate.

Sidstyler wrote:Haters gonna hate.

Drinkers gonna drink.

Breathers gonna breath.

Bloggers gonna lose!

OOOoooooooooooo!


(just had to...not that it means anything...I lost out worse by not being able to go. Makes me the bigger loser!)

Snikkyd wrote:
Wasn't that the center of the entire debate, though? The weakness of the list? Or was it the Ork codex in general? And I think the discussion is beginning to take away some credibility from Stelek. After all, he did win. Why is everyone so focused on what -would- have happened rather than what did happen? I dunno. Maybe it's because Stelek is frowned upon here and this is Dash's "turf". But "If it had been x tournament" or "if Dash had taken x" or "if he had done this or that or the other" is all well and good, but it wasn't Tournament X, Dash didn't take X and Stelek eeked out a win. Grats to him, imo, rather than trying to figure out how many ways it could be considered that he didn't win.

It was the Ork codex in general. My disagreement with Stelek is over the quality of the Ork Codex. I think it's at least tier 2 and competitive (I think it's probably behind wolves, blood angels and guard). He thinks it sucks. Maybe he changed his mind since this weekend. The outcome of who outplayed who wasn't relevant to me. I don't even care who won. I just wanted to see orks compete with a top tier list and they did in that matchup.

I don't know why it matters. Saying "Orks suck" isn't the same as saying "Everyone that plays Orks sucks". A good player can take a sub-par codex and do pretty good with it, which Dash demonstrated at Nova.

Indeed, if you're a good player and do pretty good with Orks then why do you give a gak what "tier" some guy on the internet ranks them at?

Love the way people bash stelek when he cant reply.
dont get me wrong, ive had tons of arguments with him and still dislike him, but you would think people had enough decensy to leave out the snide remarks and comment on the topic.


Speaking of which, seemed like a decent batrep, just a shame it was missing pics.
Also, could have, would have, should have.
No one knows what roll a dice will play at, so no point guessing.

Frazzled wrote:Breathers gonna breath.

I don't know why this particular line cracked me up, but it did

۞ Jack ۞ wrote:Love the way people bash stelek when he cant reply.
dont get me wrong, ive had tons of arguments with him and still dislike him, but you would think people had enough decensy to leave out the snide remarks and comment on the topic.


Speaking of which, seemed like a decent batrep, just a shame it was missing pics.
Also, could have, would have, should have.
No one knows what roll a dice will play at, so no point guessing.

No offense, but the fact that he's incapable of responding on here is entirely his own fault. Especially when you consider the level of rudeness that's demonstrated and tolerated by many of the posters who do still post here regularly. Some of those users in this very thread.

Sidstyler wrote:I don't know why it matters. Saying "Orks suck" isn't the same as saying "Everyone that plays Orks sucks". A good player can take a sub-par codex and do pretty good with it, which Dash demonstrated at Nova.

Indeed, if you're a good player and do pretty good with Orks then why do you give a gak what "tier" some guy on the internet ranks them at?

I agree, and thats why he should say "Orks aren't competitive" if thats what he thinks, instead of "Orks suck" because thats what he come across as saying, that everything about them is bad.

Also Nash, I don't think Stelek changed his opinion on Orks, but he did seem to think they can still do well. Sometimes I don't really understand him, he annoys people by saying that their army sucks, then says that any army can win with a good player. No need to questin his motives I guess, just believe what you want to believe.

And i am included in those few on this thread.
Ive had many an argument with him in which warnings were handed out and threads locked, but i dont try and get in a childish cheapshot to make myself feel better.

If i want to pick at a post of his, i mail him and do so.
I actually got warned for having a shot at stelek a day after he got perm-banned (didnt know until afterwards), simply for talking about him while he cant respond.
He may not be here, but rule #1 is.

۞ Jack ۞ wrote:He may not be here, but rule #1 is.

True story.

Anyway...

Am I the only one who's ready to get his broom out and declare shenanigans? They didn't even roll for turn 6? Booooooooo! Weak sauce!

It doesn't take CREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEED! to see where things would have gone, and I don't even really know who the feth Stelek is.

I still need to write my battle report for this (I'm not home yet - been on the road for 11 hours and change, and still an hour away from getting back to the home front.

Pregame, while discussing terrain, Stelek and I agreed that the middle piece of terrain (a bastion) was impassable and BLOS. Also that the top left and bottom right solid "fuel tank / dumpster" type objects were impassable. Some point during deployment (I don't remember) someone said, "I thought there was no impassable terrain?" Personally, I didn't read the Nova FAQ. :( I called Mike over, who clarified that it was not impassable, just BLOS.

To my understanding, there are two kinds of buildings in 40k: The kind with armor values that you get into and have to wreck in order to get through, and ruins - the kind that you drive through. Since the bastion in the middle was declared to be non-impassable but still BLOS, I presumed it was a solid-walled ruin; I've never seen a non AV building that you couldn't drive through / move through.

I lined up directly behind it; whichever side Stelek was going to put his long fangs on, I was going to move around one way or the other to deny his lascannons / missile launchers good vantage points. When Mike made the call, I decided instead that I was just going to drive straight ahead through it.

His scouts that infiltrated 12-13" away behind the building still got to fire their melta at me (6" range)nd caused a weapon destroyed result on Ghazghkull's wagon. He wanted to shoot them at the KFF wagon (which to my understanding was invisible). I offered him the opportunity to switch the weapon destroyed result to the KFF wagon, but he declined.

It *was* a close game. It was my first Ork game in a while; I'm a Dark Eldar player, and have been for 6 months, only breaking out Orks for 'Ard Boyz because DE don't scale to 2500 points.

It *was* also a friendly game. Some of the stuff on Friday night I wouldn't allow during a tournament game where more than pride is at stake. For example: Turn4, Stelek got his scouts into my rear. Then he forgot about them. He did all his shooting, assaults, we started my turn, I was in the middle of my movement phase and he says, "Oh, forgot my scouts, we need to do those." In a tournament game I say "Uh, its my turn. I'm in the middle of it. Sorry....." In this game, I said, "Alright Stelek, but know that you won't get to rewind turns tomorrow."

Probably cost me the game. =p His scouts would have eaten shooting from gretchin and two Loota units with no armor and no cover saves from the Lootas he was about to assault. Instead, he assaulted the gretchin, killed them, consolidated into cover, and subsequently passed like 7 4+ cover saves without a single failure; it was spectacularly good rolling.

But that was the point - it was a friendly game. Should I have denied him that kind of stuff? The tournament gamer in me says yes. The sporting guy who likes to drink and laugh during games says no.

My pride will recover.

and I don't even really know who the feth Stelek

Google-fu helps
google "yes the truth hurts"

quick summary: Stelek makes some pretty nasty lists that work very well, its a shame though that he isnt the most polite of people, and is somewhat stubborn once his mind is made up.

۞ Jack ۞ wrote:

and I don't even really know who the feth Stelek

Google-fu helps
google "yes the truth hurts"

quick summary: Stelek makes some pretty nasty lists that work very well, its a shame though that he isnt the most polite of people, and is somewhat stubborn once his mind is made up.

Oh, since I started frequenting Dakka I have a cursory knowledge of YTTH, but I wouldn't call myself a subscriber. Forgive my hyperbole.

No probs
I check it now and then to see what stelek has to say.
Quite alot of it is worth reading now and then.

۞ Jack ۞ wrote:He may not be here, but rule #1 is.

Thanks, and on that note, I'm out of the thread.

۞ Jack ۞ wrote:Love the way people bash stelek when he cant reply.
dont get me wrong, ive had tons of arguments with him and still dislike him, but you would think people had enough decensy to leave out the snide remarks and comment on the topic.


Speaking of which, seemed like a decent batrep, just a shame it was missing pics.
Also, could have, would have, should have.
No one knows what roll a dice will play at, so no point guessing.

I have ridiculous numbers of pictures. Also part of why our game took a long time.

I just need to get HOME....get DINNER....relax....and get to the batrep. 45 minutes from home after 11.5 hours on the road.

1) Dash plays well. I have seen many of you play over the years and I don't say that about just anyone.

2) I setup a defense predicated on the huge middle building being impassable. This was changed AFTER my setup was complete. That effectively ruined my deployment, which is where you win or lose much of 40k.

3) I countered this 'oopsie' as best I could, by assuming I could 'see' the middle battlewagon. I planned to blow up the left and central battlewagons and entice Ghazghull and his Burna boy filled wagon to trundle forward into my revised trap, as did happen. AFTER I moved much of my mobile elements into position (exposing them to attack by Orks) Dash told me something astonishing. His central Battlewagon was inside the complete LOS blocking building not on it as everyone else I know plays. But this is a friendly game. Was starting to remind me of my fun game against Marc Parker. If its a friendly game you should have nothing to prove and you should play fairly. Dash was certainly not cheating or out to get me like Parker was, but Dash has a level of skill most do not. I felt pressure and I normally don't. I certainly never did against Parker, that's for sure. Nobody ever seemed to pick up on my utter disdain. Maybe the gak talkers there remember and that's why they avoided NOVA. Hard to say but three "crowds" were spectacularly absent. Yet the competition was fierce. Funny that. Anyway so back to my second problem--if Dashes central battlewagon is inside a building, as he needed it to be....how could I stop it? Answer is I couldn't. All of my melta was out of position, forced to fire at impossible targets. Which is what Work armies NEED. They got what they needed--but Dash needs more experience against high calibre players. With loss, comes retrospection. Never losing teaches you nothing. With a more balanced list Dash could have won--or with effective tactics learned from losses...if he had retreated after turn three he could have safely sat there and won. He instead attacked, and it cost him. Which brings me to the final point...




4) I have no idea who mentioned the math but I had more than +250 points over Dash. He lost the win on objectives by not knowing other Codices like he should, and he lost the VP battle when he pushed too far with too little.

In the end, this game has no real meaning and if not for the two 'oopsies' which blew not one but TWO of my game plans this game would not have taken the course it did. I might have done better OR worse. No way to know.

What does matter is Dash played well. Orks still need a new Codex. And I recovered from two major fethups of my game and still won.

And while it was incredibly frustrating to have my positions yanked out from under me AFTER I had already committed to them...

Remember this much: I blew that first battlewagon no problem. That second one had triple the amount of meltas aimed at it but survived due to the 'oopsie'. Of course it could have survived anyway, but how can anyone ever know?

So why am I not mad about it? Frustrated yes but mad, no. Because I made an assumption that Dash was as experienced and rules guru-ish as I. He is not. That's not a knock on him, I assumed and that's what I get for doing so.

Btw, Mike announced that rule info on riding on TOP OF TERRAIN at the start of the tournament so no one else would have to deal with it.


Copied and pasted from ytth

Dash, you dont need food, drink, sleep or R&R.
You need pics mate

Agreed on the pics.

Dashofpepper wrote:
It *was* also a friendly game. Some of the stuff on Friday night I wouldn't allow during a tournament game where more than pride is at stake. For example: Turn4, Stelek got his scouts into my rear. Then he forgot about them. He did all his shooting, assaults, we started my turn, I was in the middle of my movement phase and he says, "Oh, forgot my scouts, we need to do those." In a tournament game I say "Uh, its my turn. I'm in the middle of it. Sorry....." In this game, I said, "Alright Stelek, but know that you won't get to rewind turns tomorrow."

Probably cost me the game. =p His scouts would have eaten shooting from gretchin and two Loota units with no armor and no cover saves from the Lootas he was about to assault. Instead, he assaulted the gretchin, killed them, consolidated into cover, and subsequently passed like 7 4+ cover saves without a single failure; it was spectacularly good rolling.

But that was the point - it was a friendly game. Should I have denied him that kind of stuff? The tournament gamer in me says yes. The sporting guy who likes to drink and laugh during games says no.

My pride will recover.

Well, that's rather striking. First, from what I had read it very likely did cost you the game. Second, it speaks volumes about your character that you allowed someone to rewind to their turn after you had started moving. I expect that from friends when we play weekends but would never expect anyone to be so generous at a tournament (Especially considering the....unfriendly banter you two had prior to the event).

Good on you dude!

AgeOfEgos wrote:

Dashofpepper wrote:
It *was* also a friendly game. Some of the stuff on Friday night I wouldn't allow during a tournament game where more than pride is at stake. For example: Turn4, Stelek got his scouts into my rear. Then he forgot about them. He did all his shooting, assaults, we started my turn, I was in the middle of my movement phase and he says, "Oh, forgot my scouts, we need to do those." In a tournament game I say "Uh, its my turn. I'm in the middle of it. Sorry....." In this game, I said, "Alright Stelek, but know that you won't get to rewind turns tomorrow."

Probably cost me the game. =p His scouts would have eaten shooting from gretchin and two Loota units with no armor and no cover saves from the Lootas he was about to assault. Instead, he assaulted the gretchin, killed them, consolidated into cover, and subsequently passed like 7 4+ cover saves without a single failure; it was spectacularly good rolling.

But that was the point - it was a friendly game. Should I have denied him that kind of stuff? The tournament gamer in me says yes. The sporting guy who likes to drink and laugh during games says no.

My pride will recover.

Well, that's rather striking. First, from what I had read it very likely did cost you the game. Second, it speaks volumes about your character that you allowed someone to rewind to their turn after you had started moving. I expect that from friends when we play weekends but would never expect anyone to be so generous at a tournament (Especially considering the....unfriendly banter you two had prior to the event).

Good on you dude!

Shhh....according to the internet, I'm a a mean, WAAC, condescending, rub-it-in-your-face jerkoff.

Waiting on Dash's batrep before commenting. I want to see both perspectives.

Not to de-rail the thread: Dash, is he as abrasive in person as on the net, or is that a net front he puts on?

Not trying to start an argument, just wondering in case I ever meet him(highly unlikely as Adepticon is the only national level event I attend and we all know his feelings on that).

Platuan4th wrote:Not to de-rail the thread: Dash, is he as abrasive in person as on the net, or is that a net front he puts on?

Not trying to start an argument, just wondering in case I ever meet him(highly unlikely as Adepticon is the only national level event I attend and we all know his feelings on that).

I don't think that my personal feelings would contribute to anything, but I will note that in his post game interview he said something along the lines of, "Well, I realize that I was kind of a jackass and here's why....<insert his frustration with terrain judgment>."

When he's not talking about 40k, he's quite pleasant to talk to. I think he posted in his blog that he was anticipating that I was going to be a veteran seasoned gamer like himself, and I'm not (and I'm not). He exhibited some frustration with my lack of knowledge of his codex; I make up for what I don't know with a *lot* of questions - there was a point where he said, "I'm not going to answer that, you should know that" about his codex. I tried keeping him friendly.

I think if he were to have a game that wasn't in spotlights that everyone on the internet was watching and rabbling about for one or the other of us to get beaten on, he'd have been much different.

when someone does not know your codex and you keep asking alot of questions it can be really bothersome and distracting to the game. He should have just given you his codex and said "look up what ever you need to, I'm tring to concentrate". This does not lend credibility to your status as one of the best 40k players.

I don't want to munch on you Dash, but to help people in general:

Know Your Foe, read up on their tactics, codexes, etc. to get better. It might be annoying to ask so many questions at first, but once you get a hold of the Codexes info for various armies, you can play that much better as you know what to expect.

So it was a tie, yeah?

I don't think winning by 5 or so victory points is really a win, closer to a draw than anything.

I just hope Stelek learned a bit more about Dash, and doesn't play Dash off as a jersey shore type of douche.