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Firewarriors score and are more durable, particularly against anti-tank weapons. You're correct on the armor, but you said 30 Firewarriors without leaders would be 360. Perhaps neither of us know the codex. Anyway, assuming they run 6 Las-plas like you suggested, he can remove 2 Broadsides with the Lascannons and still massacre your Suits with the MLs.

You'll notice one of the Firewarrior squads is an Honor Guard, so it only takes 5. The remaining 2 missiles can score another kill against 5+ cover. I think that negates your next paragraph.

I can't believe I'm explaining how spacing models works. Look, the second rank can afford to be over 3" away from the front for the first few turns. The models on the ends of the first row can be spaced slightly back, between the first and second row, to allow the second row to remain in coherency.

DarkHound wrote:Firewarriors score and are more durable, particularly against anti-tank weapons.

My list has 2 kroot squad and 1 squad of mandatory FWs for a total of 3 squads. So your point here is moot.

I agree with the anti tank part, so you scored a point. .
More durable against anything else? No.

DarkHound wrote:You're correct on the armor, but you said 30 Firewarriors without leaders would be 360.Perhaps neither of us know the codex.

LOL, wait. Don't know the codex? Who just assumed broadsides have 3+ armor? Noticed you go silent on every point that you realize you are wrong?

Nvm, skip the hyperbola. Fact is your point that Suits are much more expensive is a moot one now. In order to skip all the drama, I ll just total up what you have. 145+125+125 = 395. That's more expensive than 6 FireKnives :-).

DarkHound wrote:Anyway, assuming they run 6 Las-plas like you suggested, he can remove 2 Broadsides with the Lascannons and still massacre your Suits with the MLs.

You are right on this. SWs are never an easy matchup. But these beats having a bunch of useless firewarriors doing nothing. By saying that my units will die don't prove your point.

So between having a bunch of missiles and railguns that can threaten my opponent but which will dwindle every turn, v.s. having a bunch of useless fws intact, I gladly choose the former.

Also, Suits can JSJ, and stay out of LOS completely. Suits behind Devilfish are also completely blocked. But NVM. I am assuming they don't just to patronize you.

And since we are at this, i shall add this : - Against that SWs list, realize all your opponent need to do is kill your 8 pathfinders (which is a piece of cake), and your firepower is greater diminished. He doesn't even have to do anything else anymore and he auto wins

DarkHound wrote:You'll notice one of the Firewarrior squads is an Honor Guard, so it only takes 5. The remaining 2 missiles can score another kill against 5+ cover. I think that negates your next paragraph.

Your total is still wrong. I have 9 with me. (I can see you refuse to do the math, so i ve done it for you)

DarkHound wrote:I can't believe I'm explaining how spacing models works. Look, the second rank can afford to be over 3" away from the front for the first few turns. The models on the ends of the first row can be spaced slightly back, between the first and second row, to allow the second row to remain in coherency.

You are already talking about conga line here. Nvm Sir, I do not think you understand what is conga line. But you are stating the extreme on purpose. If you think i m accusing you, take a picture and tell me how what you have described is not a conga line.


Still not debating the rest of my points, or is it because you agree with them? :-)

I'm not actually debating you. This is an open forum. The point of the discussion is the enlighten readers, so I challenge the points I feel need to be challenged for their sake. For instance, I'll normally drop the matter of template weapons. What you call a conga line is in fact the only way to competently run horde armies. If you see that as "an extreme case", then you're woefully under experienced. I expect a player to whom tactics in countering blast templates mattered to already know. Anyone else doesn't care.

If you want a debate, you'll need to find a position and stick to it. My position is that an army without suits can still function. I brought up the fact that SW spam is a hard match-up for any Tau list to show just that. $70 bucks may be more than 50, but 50 bucks is still money.

An observant reader will notice you pay 124 for firepower, then 140 for scoring. Firewarriors do a little of both jobs pretty well, for less than either. Kroot's offensive power is negligible, though they are very useful for fieldcraft. They can be relied on to break from combat. I'd argue that an Ethereal gives Firewarriors the same utility. For the price of 40 Kroot and 6 Suits you can get 60 Firewarriors and an Ethereal. They each have their advantages, but useful reading explains things the reader alone wouldn't have considered.

I think you're cute, so I'll break down the math, but just for you. 5 Lights for 3 Warrior squads brings them all to BS5, bringing 60 shots indiscriminately hits 50 times, wounds 33, and 5.61 get through armor and FnP. The Monats hit 75%, wound 83%, and go through Shield 66% of the time. Multiply the resulting .41 wounds by 4 suits and you get 1.64. The Devilfish score 3.76 hits, 2.48 wounds, .42 of which make it through. There are 3 Fish, making that 1.26, plus the Pathfinder's adds another Burstcannon resulting .16 wounds. 2 Skyrays firing 2 Burstcannons each scores 4 hits, 2.64 wounds, .45 make it through. Then two missiles hit and wound .83, and breach the 5+ Shield, resulting in .45 wounds each (for a total of .9). So let's add them up: 5.6 for the Warriors, 1.64 for the suits, 1.42 for the Fish, .45 for the Skyrays, and an additional .9 for the missiles. I seem to have lost half a Marine somewhere; it's late, I probably forgot something. Anyway, that total is still 10.11 dead Mariners.

DarkHound wrote:I'm not actually debating you. This is an open forum. The point of the discussion is the enlighten readers, so I challenge the points I feel need to be challenged for their sake. For instance, I'll normally drop the matter of template weapons. What you call a conga line is in fact the only way to competently run horde armies. If you see that as "an extreme case", then you're woefully under experienced. I expect a player to whom tactics in countering blast templates mattered to already know. Anyone else doesn't care.

Notice how you use the words "if he spaces them even remotely properly.", but when asked to explain, you resort to the most extreme example - conga line. It's just funny. But nvm, no point dragging the drama around this, since this wasnt even the center of our discussion.

DarkHound wrote:If you want a debate, you'll need to find a position and stick to it. My position is that an army without suits can still function. I brought up the fact that SW spam is a hard match-up for any Tau list to show just that. $70 bucks may be more than 50, but 50 bucks is still money.

And I ve just told you how your army is not functional at all, just that you chose to ignore what i have put forth. There is absolutely NO WAY you can win that SW list barring a total noob playing that list. 3 seeker missiles a turn (and then deepstriking 3 suits for kamikaze) against 15 missiles 4-6 lasc is a joke to me.

DarkHound wrote:An observant reader will notice you pay 124 for firepower, then 140 for scoring. Firewarriors do a little of both jobs pretty well, for less than either. Kroot's offensive power is negligible, though they are very useful for fieldcraft. They can be relied on to break from combat. I'd argue that an Ethereal gives Firewarriors the same utility. For the price of 40 Kroot and 6 Suits you can get 60 Firewarriors and an Ethereal. They each have their advantages, but useful reading explains things the reader alone wouldn't have considered.

Then here you are talking about kroots v.s. Fws, not suits v.s. FireWarriors. If that's your intention, then i suggest you bring it somewhere else, because it brings no meaning to our discussion.

If you are arguing that FireWarriors can score and can provide that little firepower v.s. Crisis Suits with their raw firepower but non-scoring, I am not going to contest that. But when you can't even threaten your opponent's forces the whole game, what's the point talking about scoring.

Also, the main point is that given the same 1500 points, my list has 3 - the same number of scoring units as yours, but MUCH better firepower. Of course, your intention is not to build a list that is on par with a conventional suit list (just functional), but it is far from being functional with that lack of firepower and range.

DarkHound wrote:5 Lights for 3 Warrior squads brings them all to BS5, bringing 60 shots indiscriminately hits 50 times, wounds 33, and 5.61 get through armor and FnP. The Monats hit 75%, wound 83%, and go through Shield 66% of the time. Multiply the resulting .41 wounds by 4 suits and you get 1.64. The Devilfish score 3.76 hits, 2.48 wounds, .42 of which make it through. There are 3 Fish, making that 1.26, plus the Pathfinder's adds another Burstcannon resulting .16 wounds. 2 Skyrays firing 2 Burstcannons each scores 4 hits, 2.64 wounds, .45 make it through. Then two missiles hit and wound .83, and breach the 5+ Shield, resulting in .45 wounds each (for a total of .9). So let's add them up: 5.6 for the Warriors, 1.64 for the suits, 1.42 for the Fish, .45 for the Skyrays, and an additional .9 for the missiles. I seem to have lost half a Marine somewhere; it's late, I probably forgot something. Anyway, that total is still 10.11 dead Mariners.

A single devilfish scores 3.7 hits? Where do you get that from?

Btw my list has a total of 14 - since apparently it seems you are trying to squeeze every juice you have (of course we are talking things in a vacuum because we assume no casualty on Tau's side, but I used the same assumptions whether it's yours or my list)

6 Railguns - 2.22 dead
Shas El + Fireknives - 8.1 dead
kroots - 1.6 dead
FWs - 0.66 dead
Pirahnas (fusions, drones) - 1.443 dead
1 Devilfish - 0.2777 dead

So whether it's 9 against 14, or 10 against 14, it's a world of difference especially when both of us are bubble wrapping to survive the onslaught over 3-4 turns. Also notice, with each layer of fws that you lose, you lose a significant amount of your firepower. For my case, it is only losing a layer of kroots - 0.8 less dead marines . I keep the bulk of my firepower intact - the Crisis Suits, who are contributing 8.1 kills a turn.



And to skip the drama even further, you ve given up commenting on how you can deal with IG AV12 spam firing you from a distance, and even AV14 Battlewagon spams. And we haven talk about Grey Knights, and BA razorspams.

And you used the words "extreme example." We should just drop the adjectives. The reality is a horde player will work to minimize blast templates, and the lowest number larges can get is 3. That is actually relevant here. Remember you said the Long Fangs could drop 15 blast templates on the Warriors instead? I'd welcome that, because they'd only hit 1 (maybe 2) model each. I really don't need to explain that one, do I?

Every combination of every unit in the codex is fair game here. The standard list uses suits for firepower, then makes up for scoring power with cheaper, less useful scoring units. The point of the thread is to find alternatives to the suits for firepower, which I posit the warriors can to a some degree. In doing so, you eliminate the need for cheap scoring, freeing up points for whatever you please. What part of that is irrelevant?

A Devilfish is equipped with a Burstcannon and 2 Gundrones, which carry TL-Carbines. At BS4, (2 * .88)+(3 * .667)=3.7. I don't know what about that is hard.

To your list of match ups, I've made my point. You've given your rebuttal. If I address that, you'll rebut again. It'll quickly devolve into 'no they can't' 'yes they can' 'nu-uh' 'yeh-huh' ad nauseum. I've done the dance too many times and I'm getting too old for it.

DarkHound wrote:And you used the words "extreme example." We should just drop the adjectives. The reality is a horde player will work to minimize blast templates, and the lowest number larges can get is 3. That is actually relevant here. Remember you said the Long Fangs could drop 15 blast templates on the Warriors instead? I'd welcome that, because they'd only hit 1 (maybe 2) model each. I really don't need to explain that one, do I?

LOL. Nvm forget about this. Since you insist on using conga line as the basis of your argument, I have nothing to contest for. What's MOST IMPORTANTLY, this has no barring on our discussion on the viability of a "no-suit" Tau list. I rather you spend more effort in trying to debate my other points instead of avoiding them :-)

DarkHound wrote:Every combination of every unit in the codex is fair game here. The standard list uses suits for firepower, then makes up for scoring power with cheaper, less useful scoring units. The point of the thread is to find alternatives to the suits for firepower, which I posit the warriors can to a some degree. In doing so, you eliminate the need for cheap scoring, freeing up points for whatever you please. What part of that is irrelevant?

It's irrelevant because looking at the list in it's entirety, i still have the same no. of scoring units as you do, and MUCH better firepower and range.
The fact that you created duality in your firewarrior is a moot point because it is pathetic in its role as a source of firepower, only marginally better than the kroots against infantry, and minimally effective against light vehs. It's like trying to make do with a cheap vacuum cleaner (saving on the suits for firepower in this case), but end up with the vacuum cleaner not keeping the house clean.

DarkHound wrote:A Devilfish is equipped with a Burstcannon and 2 Gundrones, which carry TL-Carbines. At BS4, (2 * .88)+(3 * .667)=3.7. I don't know what about that is hard.

Drones fire as passengers. They don't take the BS of the devilfish.

DarkHound wrote:To your list of match ups, I've made my point. You've given your rebuttal. If I address that, you'll rebut again. It'll quickly devolve into 'no they can't' 'yes they can' 'nu-uh' 'yeh-huh' ad nauseum. I've done the dance too many times and I'm getting too old for it.

Your rebuttal was :-

1) Let the wagons come to you, unload their passengers into your face and rape you. My list can movement block the wagons, delay their movement, fire s10 AP1 at the wagons from a distance, and delay/disembark/footslog the passengers so that I can fire into them for as long as possible. Your strategy is hardly a winning proposition.

2) Against the IG spam list, rely on your 3 S8 missiles a turn, against enemy's 9 TL S9 shots, and 2-6 (2 manticores) s10 barrages. You pray that the dice God is with you, so that you roll 6 every turn while your opponent roll ones.

3) Against DOA or Nob biker list, you kill 9-10 marines a turn (against my 14 a turn) and pray that your walls of firewarriors will outlive the marines.

So in 3 cases illustrated above, you are waiting for miracles, am i right? That's hardly "FUNCTIONAL" :-)

You keep using the word moot, but I don't think you know what it means. The entire thread is moot since there isn't a single true outcome, proven by this discussion we're having. So this thread is moot, but that's irrelevant.

Firewarriors have almost the same damage (0.1 wound less) output against Marines as your Fireknives. You're saying the Fireknives have pathetic damage against infantry too?

Because getting within 36" is all Battlewagon spam needs to do to win, right guys? The list I posted does everything you said, except with S8 against AV12.

The list can deploy 7 or 8 Seeker Missiles against the Valks per turn. 4 from the Pathfinders, 3 more from the Skyrays. Those aren't bad odds, especially when I can send my troops to deal with the midfield.

Any other Tau list doesn't perform much better against DoA or Nob Bikers. 4 Spessmarheens isn't much difference. You can't employ the old Fish of Fury technique that would force him to chew through Devilfish first. You'll note that Devilfish are more durable than Kroot.

Now your response is going to be "nu-uh," And I'll follow it up with "ye-huh."

DarkHound wrote:Firewarriors have almost the same damage (0.1 wound less) output against Marines as your Fireknives. You're saying the Fireknives have pathetic damage against infantry too?

8.1 - 5.55 = 2.55. Math is useful in all aspect of life . But if you use ork boys as the basis for comparison, the answer is obvious. But killing horde is NOT the main role of fireknives, although they don't suck in doing that. And if i NEED to kill horde, there is always the 24 SMS. The conventional list HAS answers to all things. That is the main point of contention.

DarkHound wrote:Because getting within 36" is all Battlewagon spam needs to do to win, right guys? The list I posted does everything you said, except with S8 against AV12.

Only one Skyray can get AV12. Because if you put both on the left or both on the right, i ll face all wagons in that direction. The rest of your army has no solution to av12, sadly.

I have 6 S10 AP1, 3 s8 ap1 from the pirahnas, and 14 S7 (side armor only), as opposed to your 6-7 s8 seekers (you expend all counters for your seekers, and roll 2+ to hit) a turn. How is that not a world of difference?

Your army can't movement block. I asked if you use devilfish to movement block, you refuse to answer me, and insist we are going in circles :-). If you bother to answer me, I would have countered you point by point.

DarkHound wrote:The list can deploy 7 or 8 Seeker Missiles against the Valks per turn. 4 from the Pathfinders, 3 more from the Skyrays. Those aren't bad odds, especially when I can send my troops to deal with the midfield.

Pathfinders only hav 36 inches range. vendetta 48", manticore unlimited. So you only have 3-4 seekers going off a turn if i deploy 2nd and away from you, or i deploy first (you choose to deploy close to me - EVEN that, it's assuming it's not spearhead or DOW deployment ), shoot first, and almost decimate your pathfinders on turn 1.

DarkHound wrote:Any other Tau list doesn't perform much better against DoA or Nob Bikers. 4 Spessmarheens isn't much difference. You can't employ the old Fish of Fury technique that would force him to chew through Devilfish first. You'll note that Devilfish are more durable than Kroot.

you have 4 skimmers in your list, i have 4. So whatever you can do to bubble wrap, i can, and i only do it cheaper. Also, i shall pre-empt you, in case you argue that pirahnas are smaller than devilfish. 3 pirahnas and 1 fish spread out 2inches apart, covers wider footprint than 10 fws/kroots. So whatever the infantry can wrap, the piranhas can.

I dun understand what mean by "doesnt perform much better". Ok maybe you are still insisting 9/10 against 14 is not a significant difference, like how you would argue that the sky is gold color.

DarkHound wrote:Now your response is going to be "nu-uh," And I'll follow it up with "ye-huh."

And i presume "nu-uh represents solid argument, while ye huh means sweeping statements?

Excuse me, it was late and I was tremendously unspecific in this singular instance. Your list lacks the infrastructure to provide Markerlights to every suit team, while even my Firewarriors can boost each other to BS4. At range, you'll see the Fireknives inflict 1.51 casualties to Marines in cover, compared to the Firewarrior's 1.4. Now that I've said that, you'll accuse me of being too specific though. Or for making sweeping statements. Who knows with your strawman attacks.

It actually doesn't matter how many Skyrays can get AV12. If even one can, I get to launch all my missiles from it. By the time your Pirhanas can fire (if the Lootas haven't vaporized them), my Monats will be on the scene. If killing the Battlewagon comes down to your S7 shots, something's gone awfully awry. I didn't think addressing movement blocking was necessary, but yes, Devilfish can block Battlewagon movement. I've got at least 2 empty ones to spare, given that a FW team is on an objective and the Pathfinders are deployed.

The board isn't an unlimited range, and Pathfinders have a Scout move. If a Vendetta spamming player were to go first against your list, he'd alpha strike your Broadsides (1 per Vendetta) and leave you crippled. You'd actually be crippled much more easily, given that his Vendettas can't really damage the Skyrays.

I've got 6 skimmers. I can cordon off half a deployment zone with that. But really, 4 Marines is not a significant difference. He's got 11-16 on the board. That'll kill both squads of Kroot at least, while his second wave arrives. You finish the first wave, he finishes off your army. You'd perform better if you came closer to winning.

DarkHound wrote:Excuse me, it was late and I was tremendously unspecific in this singular instance. Your list lacks the infrastructure to provide Markerlights to every suit team, while even my Firewarriors can boost each other to BS4.

EXPLAIN yourself. In case you don't know the codex again, different units can expend the counters on the same target

DarkHound wrote:At range, you'll see the Fireknives inflict 1.51 casualties to Marines in cover, compared to the Firewarrior's 1.4. Now that I've said that, you'll accuse me of being too specific though. Or for making sweeping statements. Who knows with your strawman attacks.

With cover taken into consideration, at range, and without markerlight support, obviously the benefits diminishes with each factor taken into consideration. You are painting a perfect picture in favor for your argument. I find it funny. But fortunately, everyone knows the sole purpose of fireknives is not against horde. They do well in killing TEQs, MEQs, MCs, light vehs, and are still better than FWs when it comes to killing horde.

DarkHound wrote:It actually doesn't matter how many Skyrays can get AV12. If even one can, I get to launch all my missiles from it.

Ok, and then what? 6 S8 missiles as opposed to 6 s10 AP1 railguns, 14 S7 missiles?

DarkHound wrote:By the time your Pirhanas can fire (if the Lootas haven't vaporized them), my Monats will be on the scene.

On the scene? I assume you mean deepstriking, which sadly happens on a 4+, from turn 2 onwards. By the time your Monats arrive, the wagons have already moved 12-26 inches.

DarkHound wrote:If killing the Battlewagon comes down to your S7 shots, something's gone awfully awry.

Not quite. Law of averages. S10 ap1 railguns against av14 (or av12 if i split into 2 sides left and right), plus kff saves means damage from the broadsides are not guaranteed. So the 14 S7 always helps :-).

DarkHound wrote:I didn't think addressing movement blocking was necessary, but yes, Devilfish can block Battlewagon movement. I've got at least 2 empty ones to spare, given that a FW team is on an objective and the Pathfinders are deployed.

(1) Devilfish move 12inches, pirahnas 24. So even if you go first, the wagons have already moved a full 13".
(2) I sacrifice a 75 pts pirahna for movement blocking, you sacrifice a 100 point devilfish to do the same job. AWESOME. .

DarkHound wrote:The board isn't an unlimited range, and Pathfinders have a Scout move.

Be it Pitched battle, spearhead, or dow, I can stay 48" or 50+ inches away from you if i reacted to your deployment. I didn't know Pathfinders can move more than 12"in their scout move?

DarkHound wrote:If a Vendetta spamming player were to go first against your list, he'd alpha strike your Broadsides (1 per Vendetta) and leave you crippled. You'd actually be crippled much more easily, given that his Vendettas can't really damage the Skyrays.

9 TL Lasc, 6.75 hits, 2.8125 dead after cover. I still have 3 other broadsides fighting (assuming i pass Ld of course). Then the broadsides have a 2+ save against s10 manticore barrages.

Your case: You lose 3 from lascs, and another 3-5 pathfinders after 4+ cover from manticore. Apart from the 2 skyrays, you have nothing else to threaten the opponent, sadly.

DarkHound wrote:I've got 6 skimmers. I can cordon off half a deployment zone with that. But really, 4 Marines is not a significant difference. He's got 11-16 on the board. That'll kill both squads of Kroot at least,

Wait. Explain how he kill off 2 squads of Kroot in A TURN. I m waiting patiently for your answers with my popcorns

DarkHound wrote:while his second wave arrives. You finish the first wave, he finishes off your army. You'd perform better if you came closer to winning.

I ll answer you on this after you answer my question above.


You given up on razorspam? 15 missiles + 4-6 lasc against your 3 seekers a turn (pathfinders not in range, unless you can scout more than 12"), how do you win that.

Field your own army. Don't do what everyone tells you becuase i don't think anyone has ever in the history of 40k has ever made a Tau army without spamming battlesuits. Every unit has a function. They wouldn't just make a unit and be like "ok cool, no one is ever going to use this" Obvoulsly every unit has potential to win.

King Crow wrote:Field your own army. Don't do what everyone tells you becuase i don't think anyone has ever in the history of 40k has ever made a Tau army without spamming battlesuits.

Or maybe no one has ever been competitive with a Tau list without spamming battlesuits.

King Crow wrote:Every unit has a function. They wouldn't just make a unit and be like "ok cool, no one is ever going to use this" Obvoulsly every unit has potential to win.

Off the top of my head, Vespids fall under this category.

Thank you very much for the wise posts Darkhound, especially for staying on topic for none suit strategies.

Im about to order these from FW, can they pass as broadsides?

Isseyfaran wrote:

King Crow wrote:Field your own army. Don't do what everyone tells you becuase i don't think anyone has ever in the history of 40k has ever made a Tau army without spamming battlesuits.

Or maybe no one has ever been competitive with a Tau list without spamming battlesuits.

King Crow wrote:Every unit has a function. They wouldn't just make a unit and be like "ok cool, no one is ever going to use this" Obvoulsly every unit has potential to win.

Off the top of my head, Vespids fall under this category.

At the time the codex released, when cover wasn't as dominant as it is today, they were a lot more functional.

Isseyfaran wrote:

King Crow wrote:Field your own army. Don't do what everyone tells you becuase i don't think anyone has ever in the history of 40k has ever made a Tau army without spamming battlesuits.

Or maybe no one has ever been competitive with a Tau list without spamming battlesuits.

King Crow wrote:Every unit has a function. They wouldn't just make a unit and be like "ok cool, no one is ever going to use this" Obvoulsly every unit has potential to win.

Off the top of my head, Vespids fall under this category.

Or maybe it's overdone and getting really lame to see nothing but battlesuit armies because everyone just tells you to make them.

Maybe if people took the time to actually figure how Tau are supposed to be played they woulden't field just battlesuits

The main questions was can you field a Tau army without suits.... The answer obviously is YES. You can field whatever you like..... The common argument though is that a Tau army list without Suits is only handicapping oneself and Tau are not an army that can afford any handicaps at all....

The natural progression in Tau warfare is the FW then the suit.... So those are two main componenets of Tau warfare....

It would be like playing a SM Chapter and taking no vehicles or drop pods and walking across the battlefield.... Can it be done? Sure... Will it be fun? Maybe... Will you lose? Most likely.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
And any Forgeworld model is ok to use as long as the opponent agrees to its use before hand.... Most likely any idiot can see that it would proxy well for a XV88.... With that said you might get a tard say NO.

Milisim wrote:The main questions was can you field a Tau army without suits.... The answer obviously is YES. You can field whatever you like..... The common argument though is that a Tau army list without Suits is only handicapping oneself and Tau are not an army that can afford any handicaps at all....

The natural progression in Tau warfare is the FW then the suit.... So those are two main componenets of Tau warfare....

It would be like playing a SM Chapter and taking no vehicles or drop pods and walking across the battlefield.... Can it be done? Sure... Will it be fun? Maybe... Will you lose? Most likely.

[url]
http://hulksmash-homeplace.blogspot.com/2012/02/dark-star-results.html [/url]

SM chapter, no vehicles or drop pods. Really, most codexes are considerably more flexible the net lister make them out to be, people are driven by pre conceived notions about what works for them, and a vocal minority often drives the interwebs discourse.


Not sure why the URL is parsing that way...but you get the picture.

Using GK isnt exactly what I had in mind when I said that..

50 Vanilla marines will not get that kind of str weaponry on the move.... at at any decent range....

King Crow wrote:Or maybe it's overdone and getting really lame to see nothing but battlesuit armies because everyone just tells you to make them.

Maybe if people took the time to actually figure how Tau are supposed to be played they woulden't field just battlesuits

Less likely that people didnt take the time to figure how Tau can be played otherwise, but more likely because it doesnt work otherwise.

Anyway, it seems that the OP is looking more for fun than a competitive/semi-competitive list, so I guess there is no problem now. Also, if he is mostly playing against amatuer players, I guess he should do fine.