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2012/06/19 12:55:34
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
DarbNilbirts wrote:Add in the rumor that any strength can wound any toughness on a 6 and mass lasguns bringing down wraithlords and other monstrous creatures, IG just got a few more tools in their toolkit.
STR 3 can already wound T6. The only thing it means is they can hurt the Talos Pain Engine and Wraithlords. Given how often you see those on the table, its not that much of a buff.
Now, the extra shots --- that's something that can be pretty cool.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Marzillius wrote:This, along with all toughness being wounded on a 6 probably spells the death of the Eldar Codex. Footdar is no longer viable, Wraith units are no longer viable. With transports probably being nerfed, Mechdar won't be as scary either.
I have a feeling 6th edition won't be that fun :(
Thats funny. I am willing to bet that Mechdar get a boost. While you will be able to shake/stun the serpents to death, I read rumors that fast moving skimmers are going to be much more difficult to hit in assault (and possibly shooting)
Today when playing my Mech'dar army, I lose a decent number of my vehicles from assault - be it in the form of scarabs, wraiths, or things killing me when I disembark the suicide dragons. If that changes, then it will be a big difference to my playstyle.
Also, remember that GW is releasing flyers for what appears to be all the armies now. When Eldar get another flyer, it has a good chance of being a nice boost to the codex. If they put the flyer into the fast attack slot, you would have 3 flyers, 3 prisms/nightspinners, and 4-5 serpents.
Finally, I would expect a new eldar codex to be released in the next year or so. I would not sell your army on ebay just yet.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/06/19 13:01:09
2012/06/19 13:47:50
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
I think an important distinction will be if it's 2 shots at max range / 1 at max or 2 at 12", OR if it'll be 2 at 24" / 1 at 24" or 2 at 12". If it's max range, that's all good - if it's a 24" cap, it means my fire warriors can still only double tap at 24" (same for krootguns and any other rapid fire weapon with a range over 24") Ideally, I'd like it to be max / half range rather than a set 24" / 12".
ZebioLizard2 wrote:
Captain Avatar wrote:Crisis suits armed with plasma rifles. 6 s6 ap2 shots at 24" and 9 at 12"(or 18" if the pancake rumour is makes it in). Makes the plas upgrade on broadsides a bit of a no-brainer.
The problem with the crisis suits is if it counts the assault pack movement for 2 shots, you really don't want to keep those things out in the open.
Broadsides are a bit iffy, as smart missles are still pretty good, and can avoid the cover issues too.
Crisis Suits are all relentless anyway, so it's a little irrelevant.
DarbNilbirts wrote:Add in the rumor that any strength can wound any toughness on a 6 and mass lasguns bringing down wraithlords and other monstrous creatures, IG just got a few more tools in their toolkit.
STR 3 can already wound T6. The only thing it means is they can hurt the Talos Pain Engine and Wraithlords. Given how often you see those on the table, its not that much of a buff.
Now, the extra shots --- that's something that can be pretty cool.
Giving things that are Str 1/2 the ability to drop T10 is utterly slowed. It's a huge buff to Str 1-3, a reasonable one to Str4 and a minor one to Str 5+. Everything able to wound on a 6+ technically makes rending worse, is a fairly major nerf to T7+ units, infact it takes Monstrous and Gargantuan Creatures and shifts them from 'struggling in comparison to vehicles' to 'crap everything will make it fall over.
I use Talos, I know lots of people that use Talos, and giving guard the ability to flashlight it to death, or guard / pathfinders / firewarriors the ability to punch it to death is VERY dissapointing.
Personally I hope this doesn't happen.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/06/19 13:48:32
Ovion wrote:Giving things that are Str 1/2 the ability to drop T10 is utterly slowed. It's a huge buff to Str 1-3, a reasonable one to Str4 and a minor one to Str 5+. Everything able to wound on a 6+ technically makes rending worse, is a fairly major nerf to T7+ units, infact it takes Monstrous and Gargantuan Creatures and shifts them from 'struggling in comparison to vehicles' to 'crap everything will make it fall over.
In non-apoc games, list the number of units that have a Toughness of 7 or higher.
Ovion wrote:I use Talos, I know lots of people that use Talos, and giving guard the ability to flashlight it to death, or guard / pathfinders / firewarriors the ability to punch it to death is VERY dissapointing.
I guess there are different meta's my friend. I've never seen a Talos pain engine in play in the US northwest area when I lived there or in the new england area where I live now. DA players here use ravagers or razorwings for their heavy support (mostly ravagers).
The whole point of most Gargantuan Creatures, Tomb Stalkers, Talos', and Wraithlords is that they can just blithely ignore most infantry. Take that away and they're utter crap. No one will take biotitans anymore when a few guard blobs that used to be unable to do much of anything before can now shoot one to death with ease.
Midnightdeathblade wrote: Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.
2012/06/19 14:03:22
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
Kain wrote:The whole point of most Gargantuan Creatures, Tomb Stalkers, Talos', and Wraithlords is that they can just blithely ignore most infantry. Take that away and they're utter crap. No one will take biotitans anymore when a few guard blobs that used to be unable to do much of anything before can now shoot one to death with ease.
So because forge world or apoc models would be hurt by lasguns, then you won't see bio-titans taken any more.
Or.......the 'nid player will use the extremely large blast template to shoot the guard squad at range. Don't you think that using apoc/forge world models to argue your point is a bit off base?
Right now wraithlords can ignore STR 4 and below. You can throw one wraithlord into a C:SM squad without a PF and the wraithlord will kill every last one of them if they don't fall back. Given this, why don't you see more wraithlords in competitive events?
2012/06/19 14:07:42
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
Kain wrote:The whole point of most Gargantuan Creatures, Tomb Stalkers, Talos', and Wraithlords is that they can just blithely ignore most infantry. Take that away and they're utter crap. No one will take biotitans anymore when a few guard blobs that used to be unable to do much of anything before can now shoot one to death with ease.
So because forge world or apoc models would be hurt by lasguns, then you won't see bio-titans taken any more.
Or.......the 'nid player will use the extremely large blast template to shoot the guard squad at range. Don't you think that using apoc/forge world models to argue your point is a bit off base?
Right now wraithlords can ignore STR 4 and below. You can throw one wraithlord into a C:SM squad without a PF and the wraithlord will kill every last one of them if they don't fall back. Given this, why don't you see more wraithlords in competitive events?
Nids don't have any of the huge blast templates that other Apoc factions get. The biggest we get is a hellstorm template that can only be used by three screamer killers working in concert. Even the Heiro freaking Phant does not get any blasts bigger than 5', if any at all. I do not like the thought of lasguns being able to hurt a Heirophant at all. It'd be like trying to kill a blue whale by throwing thumbtacks at it.
Midnightdeathblade wrote: Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.
2012/06/19 14:18:35
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
labmouse42 wrote:Or.......the 'nid player will use the extremely large blast template to shoot the guard squad at range. Don't you think that using apoc/forge world models to argue your point is a bit off base?
The apoc blast template? The one nids don't have access to? Oh.
Also - Phants are for shooting Titans and other superheavys. Wasting shots on a guard platoon isn't what they're designed for.
Right now wraithlords can ignore STR 4 and below. You can throw one wraithlord into a C:SM squad without a PF and the wraithlord will kill every last one of them if they don't fall back. Given this, why don't you see more wraithlords in competitive events?
Because people who take C:SM squads almost always have a PF in them?
And even then - wraithlords have other downsides - the high toughness just partially makes up for it.
My beautiful wife wrote:Trucks = Carnifex snack, Tanks = meals.
2012/06/19 14:20:03
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
If they can be hurt by guardsmen, then they can no longer blithely ignore them as they get to the superheavies, which would suck.
Midnightdeathblade wrote: Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.
2012/06/19 14:36:31
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
Ovion wrote:Giving things that are Str 1/2 the ability to drop T10 is utterly slowed. It's a huge buff to Str 1-3, a reasonable one to Str4 and a minor one to Str 5+. Everything able to wound on a 6+ technically makes rending worse, is a fairly major nerf to T7+ units, infact it takes Monstrous and Gargantuan Creatures and shifts them from 'struggling in comparison to vehicles' to 'crap everything will make it fall over.
In non-apoc games, list the number of units that have a Toughness of 7 or higher.
Ovion wrote:I use Talos, I know lots of people that use Talos, and giving guard the ability to flashlight it to death, or guard / pathfinders / firewarriors the ability to punch it to death is VERY dissapointing.
I guess there are different meta's my friend. I've never seen a Talos pain engine in play in the US northwest area when I lived there or in the new england area where I live now. DA players here use ravagers or razorwings for their heavy support (mostly ravagers).
So my question is, where do you play that Talos' are so common?
I didn't say they were used a lot in my local meta (I think it's just me and 2 other guys that use them here), but I know several people across the country who have and use Talos, and several more on the forums / around the world, that use them.
However, Just because the 'standard netlist' mentality hawks that only use ravagers, or even just that only say 1 in 5, or even 1 in 10 DE players use it, doesn't make invalidating the unit a good thing.
It also doesn't make making Monstrous Creatures worse any less slowed, nor does it make a Str1 attack being able to wound a T10 creature any less ridiculous.
With the HUGE bias to Armour, Monstrous and Gargantuan Creatures tend to struggle to compete as it is (AV10 is immune to Str3, AV11 to Str4, yet a lot of things with these value are half the price of the MCs that have them.) it will practically invalidate High Toughness MCs, that pay the premium ofr their Str/T and simply eing an MC.
In order to viably field a Wraithlord, you now must have Eldrad/a Farseer babysit him with Fortune the entire game, or he will drop on the first turn. 60 Guardsmen shooting will more probably than not take him down.
Alaitoc Eldar: 5000p
Vampire Counts: 3000p
Death Korps of Krieg: 7000p
World Eaters: 2000p
2012/06/19 14:46:54
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
Ovion wrote:[However, Just because the 'standard netlist' mentality hawks that only use ravagers, or even just that only say 1 in 5, or even 1 in 10 DE players use it, doesn't make invalidating the unit a good thing.
How does having IG lasguns wound the Talos on a 6 invalidate the unit? I mean really.
* How many IG players do you face compared to other armies
* How many of those squads don't have enough melta/PG to fry the talos anyway.
To be honest, if this rule were changed, I would be more worried about the 4 PGs in the power blob shooting your talos with 8 STR 7 AP2 shots before I worry about the lasguns.
Ovion wrote:With the HUGE bias to Armour, Monstrous and Gargantuan Creatures tend to struggle to compete as it is (AV10 is immune to Str3, AV11 to Str4, yet a lot of things with these value are half the price of the MCs that have them.) it will practically invalidate High Toughness MCs, that pay the premium ofr their Str/T and simply eing an MC.
As I've said many times already -- your taking this rule and putting it into 5th edition ruleset. You don't know what else might happen in 6th. In 5th edition mechanized is king. You don't know what 6th is yet. MCs may be boosted in excellent ways that were not aware of yet.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
rigeld2 wrote:The apoc blast template? The one nids don't have access to? Oh.
Also - Phants are for shooting Titans and other superheavys. Wasting shots on a guard platoon isn't what they're designed for.
I don't know about you, but I can count on one hand the times there were enough 'nid models to play them as one side in an apoc game. Most apoc games I've seen were games where everyone brought their models and threw em down on the table.
Sure, I'll grant that in those apoc games where one side only has 'nids and the other side has IG, its possible that if you wander within 24" of the guardsmen, they can start plinking you with their lasguns. If that's enough of a problem to make you nerd rage -- more power to you.
For all other instances of 40k, your not talking about that big of an impact one the game.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
rigeld2 wrote:Because people who take C:SM squads almost always have a PF in them?.
This statement is not true.
If you want to see some great flame debates, go look in the Tactics forum on PF in TAC squads. You will see a variety of different passionate answers.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2012/06/19 14:56:07
2012/06/19 15:52:10
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
Marzillius wrote:In order to viably field a Wraithlord, you now must have Eldrad/a Farseer babysit him with Fortune the entire game, or he will drop on the first turn. 60 Guardsmen shooting will more probably than not take him down.
The possibility of that happening is incredibly stupid and akin to sacrliedge. Lasguns can't touch dreadnoughts, why should they be able to touch a no less durable Wraithlord, much less a godzilla sized Heirophant? This change would make high toughness even more of a waste. Honestly I'd go the opposite route and make high toughness even better by bumping up the "immunity threshold" to 3 points and above, as that would make infinitely more sense than a pissant ratling being able to hit a heirophant with a club and kill it.
Midnightdeathblade wrote: Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.
2012/06/19 16:03:22
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
Marzillius wrote:In order to viably field a Wraithlord, you now must have Eldrad/a Farseer babysit him with Fortune the entire game, or he will drop on the first turn. 60 Guardsmen shooting will more probably than not take him down.
The possibility of that happening is incredibly stupid and akin to sacrliedge. Lasguns can't touch dreadnoughts, why should they be able to touch a no less durable Wraithlord, much less a godzilla sized Heirophant? This change would make high toughness even more of a waste. Honestly I'd go the opposite route and make high toughness even better by bumping up the "immunity threshold" to 3 points and above, as that would make infinitely more sense than a pissant ratling being able to hit a heirophant with a club and kill it.
there are some very strong guardsman out there who could easily club a heirophant to death
but i dont know, i like everything at least being able to have a chance to wound something, but i am kind of biased in that as I have nothing that is high T really, but i could see the comparison where I would be mad is S4 could always glance my AV12 or 14. Then everyone would have gauss rules
Frigian 582nd "the regulars" with thousand sons detachment 5th Edition
W : L : D
23 : 20 : 7
6th Edition
W : L : D
Don't Know...alot of each
Bretonnians
W : L : D
4 : 2 : 0
"Those are Regulars! By God!" -Major General Phineas Riall
2012/06/19 17:16:35
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
Kain wrote:The possibility of that happening is incredibly stupid and akin to sacrliedge. Lasguns can't touch dreadnoughts, why should they be able to touch a no less durable Wraithlord
One melta-gun shot will destroy the dreadnought and only piss off the wraithlord. The wraithlord will never suffer a "Shaken", "Stunned", "Weapon Destroyed", or "Immobolized" result. Having a high toughness value instead of an armor value are very different mechanics.
A bolter will have a 1/27 chance of wounding the wraithlord. Thats not really that bad of a nurf to the wraithlord. We also don't know what benifits being a MC will give. Without a rulebook there is no way of knowing.
Alas, it looks like no real discussion is happening here. Were just saying the same points over and over. Both of us probably feel like this....
2012/06/19 17:23:13
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
Marzillius wrote:In order to viably field a Wraithlord, you now must have Eldrad/a Farseer babysit him with Fortune the entire game, or he will drop on the first turn. 60 Guardsmen shooting will more probably than not take him down.
The possibility of that happening is incredibly stupid and akin to sacrliedge. Lasguns can't touch dreadnoughts, why should they be able to touch a no less durable Wraithlord, much less a godzilla sized Heirophant? This change would make high toughness even more of a waste. Honestly I'd go the opposite route and make high toughness even better by bumping up the "immunity threshold" to 3 points and above, as that would make infinitely more sense than a pissant ratling being able to hit a heirophant with a club and kill it.
there are some very strong guardsman out there who could easily club a heirophant to death
but i dont know, i like everything at least being able to have a chance to wound something, but i am kind of biased in that as I have nothing that is high T really, but i could see the comparison where I would be mad is S4 could always glance my AV12 or 14. Then everyone would have gauss rules
It's stupid and unrealistic. A human could never kill a large dinosaur by clubbing it with a rifle butt. He should not be able to hurt a much bigger and better armoured biotitan at all, a guardsmen would realistically break his bayonet, his rifle, his feet, and his fists and still not even *slightly* damage a heirophant. It would not even register his presence because his attacks would be so damned inconsequential. It'd be like a jawless ant trying to kill you by punching you in the foot.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2012/06/19 17:25:01
Midnightdeathblade wrote: Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.
2012/06/19 18:35:11
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
Pretty sure they would make rules for super giant creatures that prevent them from being killed by lasguns. Something that big would obviously be immune to it and freaking out over it seems to be jumping to conclusions. However, Having a platoon of guardsmen coordinate their shots on a specific spot of a monstrous creature like a carnifex and taking it down is much less crazy fluff wise. It's been repeatedly stated that the only way lasguns kil thing like space marines and large creatures is by concentrated fire. Hence the whole "thats a whole lotta diddley" meme.
That said, if all you think you have to fear is lasguns, you must not play guard often. As others have said, it's the plasma guns and lascannons you should worry about. Lets say we have a 31 man blob with plasmaguns, lascannons, a commissar, and three regular sarges (we'll ignore the pw's these guys normally would have) Thats 3 lascannon shots, 6 plasma gun shots, and 36 lasguns at 24", if we go by this rumored "stand still and you get 2 shots up to 24inches". Those plasma guns alone are going to put down way more wounds alone than the lasguns would on a MC, and that's not throwing in the lascanons. Would it probably still let one or 2 lasgun wounds get through? Perhaps (I'm unfamiliar with mathammer sorry) but the main damage will be what it always comes from, the special weapons. However, this change would makeconscripts slightly useful at throwing wounds on big creatures you want to harass, but they would still be garbage
'I've played Guard for years, and the best piece of advice is to always utilize the Guard's best special rule: "we roll more dice than you" ' - stormleader
"Sector Imperialis: 25mm and 40mm Round Bases (40+20) 26€ (Including 32 skulls for basing) " GW design philosophy in a nutshell
2012/06/19 19:08:24
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
MrMoustaffa wrote: Lets say we have a 31 man blob with plasmaguns, lascannons, a commissar, and three regular sarges (we'll ignore the pw's these guys normally would have) Thats 3 lascannon shots, 6 plasma gun shots, and 36 lasguns at 24", if we go by this rumored "stand still and you get 2 shots up to 24inches". Those plasma guns alone are going to put down way more wounds alone than the lasguns would on a MC, and that's not throwing in the lascanons. Would it probably still let one or 2 lasgun wounds get through? Perhaps (I'm unfamiliar with mathammer sorry) but the main damage will be what it always comes from, the special weapons. However, this change would makeconscripts slightly useful at throwing wounds on big creatures you want to harass, but they would still be garbage
With no cover saves, you can expect the following results from your 31 man blob squad.
Plasma Guns 50% to hit, 66% to wound, no armor
50% * 66% * 6 shots = 1.98 wounds
LasCannons 50% to hit, 83.33% to wound, no armor
50% * 83.33% * 3 shots = 1.25 wounds
LasGuns 50% to hit, 16.66% to wound, 33.33% failed armor save
50% * 16.66% * 33.33% * 36 shots = 0.99 wounds
2012/06/19 19:26:09
Subject: Re:Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
Now Wraithlord for fun:
Plasma Guns 50% to hit, 33% to wound, no armor
50% * 33% * 6 shots = 0.99 wounds
LasCannons 50% to hit, 66% to wound, no armor
50% * 66% * 3 shots = 0.99 wounds
LasGuns - says the same
50% to hit, 16.66% to wound, 33.33% failed armor save
50% * 16.66% * 33.33% * 36 shots = 0.99 wounds
Tie
But I really think Gargantuan Creatures will get some kind of low S immunity.
IMHO this rule sucks but MCs probably will get something in return. FNP maybe?
There are numerous other rules that will (possibly, *IF* true; I can't stress that enough) bone Eldar and Tyranids much more. Let's leave other rules for other topics and focus on rapid fire weapons.
All flavour SM's (GK excluded), Tau, Necrons and IG will be really happy about this. IG gets my vote as the most pleased. Eldar, Orks and Tyranids won't. Shuriken weaponry will be in a really dark place in 6th.
Good things are good,.. so it's good
Keep our city clean.
Report your death to the Department of Expiration
2012/06/19 19:43:08
Subject: Re:Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
Macok wrote:All flavour SM's (GK excluded), Tau, Necrons and IG will be really happy about this. IG gets my vote as the most pleased. Eldar, Orks and Tyranids won't. Shuriken weaponry will be in a really dark place in 6th.
aaaaaah yeah, i would be super psyched, plus my storm troopers that I already use may get even better
2 AP3 shots at 18 inches and 3 each at 9? yes please
Frigian 582nd "the regulars" with thousand sons detachment 5th Edition
W : L : D
23 : 20 : 7
6th Edition
W : L : D
Don't Know...alot of each
Bretonnians
W : L : D
4 : 2 : 0
"Those are Regulars! By God!" -Major General Phineas Riall
2012/06/19 21:08:43
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
At the moment, 30 Str1-3 hits vs a Talos results in... nothing!
If it wounds on a 6, then these would do 1.7 wounds. I know it's not much, but the Strength 1 attack having a 1/6 chance of hurting a massive floating hulk of armour and death is patently slowed.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/06/19 21:17:57
Macok wrote:All flavour SM's (GK excluded), Tau, Necrons and IG will be really happy about this. IG gets my vote as the most pleased. Eldar, Orks and Tyranids won't. Shuriken weaponry will be in a really dark place in 6th.
aaaaaah yeah, i would be super psyched, plus my storm troopers that I already use may get even better
2 AP3 shots at 18 inches and 3 each at 9? yes please
They wouldn't get 3 each at 12" unless you used FRFSRF on them, and since they dont use normal lasguns they can't use that order. As it sits right now, we get 2 shots at full range if we stand still, 1 if we move(24" for regular lasguns, 18" for hotshots) at 12" we get 2 shots regardless of movement.
of course this is all speculation, we don't even know if this rumor is even remotely true, as well as any strength being able to wound a high toughness on a 6. Would I love for them to be true? Absolutely. Will they be true? We won't know till 6th
'I've played Guard for years, and the best piece of advice is to always utilize the Guard's best special rule: "we roll more dice than you" ' - stormleader
"Sector Imperialis: 25mm and 40mm Round Bases (40+20) 26€ (Including 32 skulls for basing) " GW design philosophy in a nutshell
2012/06/19 22:15:40
Subject: Re:Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
Maybe if they allow you to take multiple saves
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Hmm...Killing a TH/SS Termi in cover with an apothecary where they can take all their saves...
...Hope you have a Volcano cannon up your sleeve!
Midnightdeathblade wrote: Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.
2012/06/19 22:52:08
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
MrMoustaffa wrote:I though it just allowed you to make 1 shot at up to 24" if you moved. If this is true though, FRFSRF just became slightly redundant for IG. If we dont move, it lets us shoot 2 shots up to 24", so the order would only help within 12" for a 3rd shot. Unless they decided to faq the order, getting us 3 shots if we don't move up to 24", and 4 per lasgun within in 12" (or just stay at 3) Which would make the IG combined squad (aka blob) one of the scariest infantry units at range ever Although I'm sure we won't see that, that'd be rediculous.
On the other hand, watching a single platoon put out more lasgun shots than most armies have models would be pretty friggin hilarious to watch, even if it'd take half an hour to resolve al the hits
Yeah but now you can MOVE and get 2 shots at 24 inches. This is massively awesome for imperial guard. Makes me want to actually take lasguns instead of shotguns now...
2012/06/20 00:37:33
Subject: Who benefits the most from a change to Rapid Fire?
Umm... where are you seeing we can move and fire twice up to 24"? Because Frfsrf only lets you do that if you stand still. FRFSRF has no effect on models that have moved shooting at a target 24" away, for now at least. Now, it wouldn't surprise me if the order was tweaked in some way, like letting you fire a 3rd shot up to 24" if you stood still for example.
'I've played Guard for years, and the best piece of advice is to always utilize the Guard's best special rule: "we roll more dice than you" ' - stormleader
"Sector Imperialis: 25mm and 40mm Round Bases (40+20) 26€ (Including 32 skulls for basing) " GW design philosophy in a nutshell
Alaitoc Eldar: 5000p
Vampire Counts: 3000p
Death Korps of Krieg: 7000p
World Eaters: 2000p 
Frigian 582nd 
