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Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





 Kanluwen wrote:


Kommando Grot
Spoiler:




I enjoy how the grot can crit for 4. An otherwise totally ignorable git can be dangerous with some luck and good use of his movement shenanigans.

   
Made in gb
Wise Ethereal with Bodyguard







So half of grot hits will do 1 damage, and the other half with do 4, and be much harder to stop. Thats quite a discontinuity

Please excuse any spelling errors. I use a tablet frequently and software keyboards are a pain!

Terranwing - w3;d1;l1
51st Dunedinw2;d0;l0
Cadre Coronal Afterglow w1;d0;l0 
   
Made in us
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Right behind you.

Considering the little goon is called "Distraction Grot" in the new Kommando unit for the codex?

100% okay.
   
Made in au
Longtime Dakkanaut




They need a grit now that puts out smoke, I love my bellows crew

I am keen to see what they are like as a team, if they can be a team. Don’t let me down GW I am kinda keen!
   
Made in us
Pragmatic Collabirator



Dayton, OH

 Flinty wrote:
So half of grot hits will do 1 damage, and the other half with do 4, and be much harder to stop. Thats quite a discontinuity

Nah, sounds exactly like how a grot should backstab people with extreme cowardice.
   
Made in de
Dakka Veteran




I bet we will see a Point Systen with the next yearly Killteam "Index" Book.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/07/27 17:07:05


 
   
Made in gb
Last Remaining Whole C'Tan






Kaffis wrote:
 Flinty wrote:
So half of grot hits will do 1 damage, and the other half with do 4, and be much harder to stop. Thats quite a discontinuity

Nah, sounds exactly like how a grot should backstab people with extreme cowardice.


Stab ‘em in da ‘urty bits!


Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?

Pfizer vaccine administered 13:40pm 18 Feb 21. Still no second head. Second jab 13:35pm 6 May 2021. At the Masonic Hall. 
   
Made in us
Boosting Black Templar Biker






 Arachnofiend wrote:

Rubrics don't have higher-than-normal toughness, that's only Death Guard so we should expect Plague Marines to have more wounds than normal.

Ah shucks, my mistake I was thinking they were T5 on account of not having any bodies. Great point that All is Dust isn't as strong as the 40k version, I'm curious as to why since it didn't seem that powerful for a Skirmish game.
   
Made in fi
Purposeful Hammerhead Pilot






RazorEdge wrote:
I bet we will see a Point Systen with the next yearly Killteam "Index" Book.


I hope so. That would get me back into KT2
   
Made in gb
Enginseer with a Wrench




Bath

 The Red Hobbit wrote:
 Arachnofiend wrote:

Rubrics don't have higher-than-normal toughness, that's only Death Guard so we should expect Plague Marines to have more wounds than normal.

Ah shucks, my mistake I was thinking they were T5 on account of not having any bodies. Great point that All is Dust isn't as strong as the 40k version, I'm curious as to why since it didn't seem that powerful for a Skirmish game.


maybe they will go a different route with KT? once you start playing with the fundamental gameplay like they have, they might as well use different mechanics to represent the same in-lore ability. Maybe some form of damage reduction, or ignores criticals, or even a penalty to shooting them (to represent the difficulty of getting a meaningful hit on a target that can ignore most fire?), or maybe they dont suffer form stat degradation (which i understand is going to be a thing in KT 2), to show their indifference to damage right up until it kills them?

thier a few ways they can play this, we will have to wait and see.

Then it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an` Tommy, 'ow's yer soul? "
But it's " Thin red line of 'eroes " when the drums begin to roll
The drums begin to roll, my boys, the drums begin to roll,
O it's " Thin red line of 'eroes, " when the drums begin to roll.
"Tommy", Rudyard Kipling
Exporitor force kappa-Tercia 500pts Coven of XVth 1000pts
Western Host 1000 pts
 
   
Made in au
Longtime Dakkanaut




xerxeskingofking wrote:
 The Red Hobbit wrote:
 Arachnofiend wrote:

Rubrics don't have higher-than-normal toughness, that's only Death Guard so we should expect Plague Marines to have more wounds than normal.

Ah shucks, my mistake I was thinking they were T5 on account of not having any bodies. Great point that All is Dust isn't as strong as the 40k version, I'm curious as to why since it didn't seem that powerful for a Skirmish game.


maybe they will go a different route with KT? once you start playing with the fundamental gameplay like they have, they might as well use different mechanics to represent the same in-lore ability. Maybe some form of damage reduction, or ignores criticals, or even a penalty to shooting them (to represent the difficulty of getting a meaningful hit on a target that can ignore most fire?), or maybe they dont suffer form stat degradation (which i understand is going to be a thing in KT 2), to show their indifference to damage right up until it kills them?

thier a few ways they can play this, we will have to wait and see.


They may also have faction ability’s to choose as well. I think it’s likely as GW likes that as a design.
   
Made in gb
Ship's Officer





Bristol (UK)

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/07/28/select-objectives-and-operatives-on-the-fly-to-outwit-your-opponent-in-kill-teams-new-matched-play-missions/

This reveal honestly leaves nothing but a bad taste in my mouth.

Firstly, ridiculous 'branded' language for basic gameplay concepts. Feth off with "Turning Point", it just obfuscates a basic principle of games.

Secondly, secondary objectives. I hate these. They're just an annoying faff.
   
Made in us
Pragmatic Collabirator



Dayton, OH

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/07/28/select-objectives-and-operatives-on-the-fly-to-outwit-your-opponent-in-kill-teams-new-matched-play-missions/

Objectives article. Unsurprisingly, we see objectives that require actions, giving further info on "what am I supposed to do with 3 APL?" Win.

Interestingly, the Consecrate Ground action grants an extra APL for the turn, so refunds the action used to take it, while offering points and a buff to help hold the objective point. Alright, cool.

The secondaries are a bit more interesting, in that they let us see some of the narrative stuff the game is trying to convey with its objectives. We've got 2 points for issuing a duel and winning, 2 points for stealing intel off a downed soldier and surviving to report it, and 2 points for using the battle as a distraction to send a unit off to make mischief in the backlines while nobody's looking. I like that the latter two require you to perform them while away from the action; this gives some counter-play if you opponent can guess what you're up to, and puts some restrictions on when you can do it in the chaos of the fight.

The fact that some of them can be partially completed, but require further support over the game to get the second point is nice, too.

We don't see enough, yet, to determine whether there's a good enough internal balance to make interesting choices based on opponent matchup, or whether there are less interestingly Secondary auto-takes based on your own faction, but the spread in variety means that I can definitely see that some are bad matchups for some factions and more appealing for others -- you're hardly likely to want to send one of your Custodes off on an Interloping mission, for instance, but an Imperial Guard team or a crew with Poxwalkers can more readily spare a model.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




 kirotheavenger wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/07/28/select-objectives-and-operatives-on-the-fly-to-outwit-your-opponent-in-kill-teams-new-matched-play-missions/

This reveal honestly leaves nothing but a bad taste in my mouth.

Firstly, ridiculous 'branded' language for basic gameplay concepts. Feth off with "Turning Point", it just obfuscates a basic principle of games.


Absolutely agree. Not only is it replacing a perfectly serviceable and well-understood term, it also looks really clunky in text.

I love how little info they're now giving us with each new reveal. Reminds me of the endless previews for 9th edition, which ran out of decent content after about a week.
   
Made in us
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Right behind you.

Bloodletter profile card
Spoiler:
   
Made in gb
Enginseer with a Wrench




Bath

i've complained about this before in another thread on this forum, but the way they are using the shapes rather than the actaul distances is frankly annoying. I get it, they've eliminated long range measuring and brought everything down to something you can fit on their new measuring tool, which if fine, it might well be easier to use than a tape measure (i'm giving them benefit of the the doubt, and withholding judgement on that until i've actually tried playing with it), but i wish for god-emperors sake, they'd put the real world distances next to those symbols, because i am reading those tactical objectives and i'm having to stop, load up the page where they explain the conversation chart to actaully understand those orders. I mean, how hard is it, really, to go "within SQUARE(2") of enemy"?

it doesnt help the shapes chosen dont (in my mind) bear any resemblance to the distances. why triangle for 1", circle for 3"? i'd have put those the other way around, circle for 1", a triangle for 3", and swapped the square/2" with a large X (ie two lines) and the pentagon/6" with a hexagon (six sides). That to, me makes more sense, and creates a "sides = distance" relationship that works better for tying the two together.



anyway, rant over, onto the actual rules:

I havn't played many games with secret objectives like this, so it will be intresting to see how easy (or not) this is to implement. the existence of at least one objective that requires the enemy to get behind you might incentivise players to care more about flanks and trying to prevent breakthoughs, which i suppose is more "realistic" in that troops should be worried about being flanked. that said, it sounds like it might punish more elite factions slightly if they can't get enough bodies on the field to block all lines of approach. I can pretty much guarantee that custodes are going to be putting at most 3 bodies on the feild, for example, so sneaking around them in a suitable crowded battlefield is going to be easy 2VP for a more numerous enemy. I suppose the question then becomes if thier are secondary objectives that play to the strenghts of a elite army, like "hold this postion" or something. We might well see some objectives becoming auto-includes on some factions (a very fast army might love the interloper objective, etc)

Then it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an` Tommy, 'ow's yer soul? "
But it's " Thin red line of 'eroes " when the drums begin to roll
The drums begin to roll, my boys, the drums begin to roll,
O it's " Thin red line of 'eroes, " when the drums begin to roll.
"Tommy", Rudyard Kipling
Exporitor force kappa-Tercia 500pts Coven of XVth 1000pts
Western Host 1000 pts
 
   
Made in us
Pragmatic Collabirator



Dayton, OH

Slipspace wrote:
 kirotheavenger wrote:

Firstly, ridiculous 'branded' language for basic gameplay concepts. Feth off with "Turning Point", it just obfuscates a basic principle of games.


Absolutely agree. Not only is it replacing a perfectly serviceable and well-understood term, it also looks really clunky in text.

As a counter-point, adding in a distinct game term that is explicitly defined helps resolve confusion among people learning the rules second- and third-hand about the difference between "turns" and "rounds" in a game that centers around alternating activations.
   
Made in gb
Ship's Officer





Bristol (UK)

I agree, every time I get to one of those shapes when reading my brain has to pause, switch from "english" to "abstract concepts", understand that circle is a distance, then switch back to continue reading.
It's really annoying. I hope I'll get used to it but I somewhat doubt it.


   
Made in au
Longtime Dakkanaut




The shapes are one thing, but with the language used. It’s just unpleasant to read.

One or the other would have been great.
They have done nothing with the shapes at all, but need the reference as well.

Otherwise it’s standard stuff with nothing unexpected, looks like will need work to get a good game out of it I am thinking.

On the blood letter, is fighter a new typing ? Will have to go back. Will be interesting to see if demons get some effort put in will be what gets me in or out on that I am thinking.
   
Made in us
Pragmatic Collabirator



Dayton, OH

On the Bloodletter front, they have a 6+ Sv, but a 5+ Invuln. Does this imply that terrain or some other rules will offer beneficial modifiers to Sv values?
   
Made in gb
Enginseer with a Wrench




Bath

Kaffis wrote:
On the Bloodletter front, they have a 6+ Sv, but a 5+ Invuln. Does this imply that terrain or some other rules will offer beneficial modifiers to Sv values?


yes i think they do, i seem to recall the terran piece mentioning taking cover as being at thing, so i'd assume that cover still grants save bonuses. Plus, having a bigger invulnerable save than normal save is sometimes a thing in regular 40K as well. I know a few factions have it, normally on things like deamons or other units mainly protected by powers rather than armour.

Then it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an` Tommy, 'ow's yer soul? "
But it's " Thin red line of 'eroes " when the drums begin to roll
The drums begin to roll, my boys, the drums begin to roll,
O it's " Thin red line of 'eroes, " when the drums begin to roll.
"Tommy", Rudyard Kipling
Exporitor force kappa-Tercia 500pts Coven of XVth 1000pts
Western Host 1000 pts
 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





 kirotheavenger wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/07/28/select-objectives-and-operatives-on-the-fly-to-outwit-your-opponent-in-kill-teams-new-matched-play-missions/

This reveal honestly leaves nothing but a bad taste in my mouth.

Firstly, ridiculous 'branded' language for basic gameplay concepts. Feth off with "Turning Point", it just obfuscates a basic principle of games.

Secondly, secondary objectives. I hate these. They're just an annoying faff.


Agree with the weird name. Hard disagree on secondaries. These are great.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
xerxeskingofking wrote:
i've complained about this before in another thread on this forum, but the way they are using the shapes rather than the actaul distances is frankly annoying. I get it, they've eliminated long range measuring and brought everything down to something you can fit on their new measuring tool, which if fine, it might well be easier to use than a tape measure (i'm giving them benefit of the the doubt, and withholding judgement on that until i've actually tried playing with it), but i wish for god-emperors sake, they'd put the real world distances next to those symbols, because i am reading those tactical objectives and i'm having to stop, load up the page where they explain the conversation chart to actaully understand those orders. I mean, how hard is it, really, to go "within SQUARE(2") of enemy"?

it doesnt help the shapes chosen dont (in my mind) bear any resemblance to the distances. why triangle for 1", circle for 3"? i'd have put those the other way around, circle for 1", a triangle for 3", and swapped the square/2" with a large X (ie two lines) and the pentagon/6" with a hexagon (six sides). That to, me makes more sense, and creates a "sides = distance" relationship that works better for tying the two together.



Yea I like it less and less. The rules will basically force use of the template for a while.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/07/28 14:01:01


   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Stonecold Gimster






They lost me at...

" ... using the finely balanced, points-free system."


I guess time, and reading some reviews after people have played it a few times, will tell.
I hope I'm wrong.

My Painting Blog: http://gimgamgoo.com/
Currently most played: Kill Team 18, Kings of War, Silent Death, Beyond the Gates of Antares, Dracula's America, Bolt Action (inc K47), DzC and X-Wing. Dabbling with 40k again and trying AoS3. 
   
Made in us
Hacking Shang Jí





Fayetteville

The more I read about this new version of Kill Team, the more I find myself browsing for Infinity miniatures. Like I have a strong urge to splurge on some Yu Jing for some reason.

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Made in us
Powerful Pegasus Knight





What's stopping someone from picking the commando grot as an interloper and getting a free 2 points? I mean it sounds like the grapple has infinite range.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/07/28 14:20:28


 
   
Made in au
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Sledgehammer wrote:
What's stopping someone from picking the commando grot as an interloper and getting a free 2 points? I mean it sounds like the grapple has infinite range.


It would need terrain in position to work, so it works once. And no one plays you where it works again.
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

xerxeskingofking wrote:
I mean, how hard is it, really, to go "within SQUARE(2") of enemy"?
It doesn't matter. This wheel is better than the old wheel. You'll see!

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
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Ship's Officer





Bristol (UK)

I think not having terrain in your deployment zone is a bit of a tall order for a skirmish game.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Apple fox wrote:
 Sledgehammer wrote:
What's stopping someone from picking the commando grot as an interloper and getting a free 2 points? I mean it sounds like the grapple has infinite range.


It would need terrain in position to work, so it works once. And no one plays you where it works again.


Also, overwatch. I really like the decisions you have to make to be able to stop something like that. You're going to be working hard to get an angle on that grot before he gets line of sight to a clear spot on your board edge.

   
Made in us
Powerful Pegasus Knight





 Daedalus81 wrote:
Apple fox wrote:
 Sledgehammer wrote:
What's stopping someone from picking the commando grot as an interloper and getting a free 2 points? I mean it sounds like the grapple has infinite range.


It would need terrain in position to work, so it works once. And no one plays you where it works again.


Also, overwatch. I really like the decisions you have to make to be able to stop something like that. You're going to be working hard to get an angle on that grot before he gets line of sight to a clear spot on your board edge.
Have they confirmed overwatch is in the game yet?
   
 
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