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I was once told that Canadians were supposed to be 'polite'.

From some of the posts of the Canuckistani flagged members, I'd never have guessed it.

If thine fluff offends thee, then pluck it out.

Use what you like, discard the rest. This is how it is. The codices are ALL written as propaganda (although it's BAD propaganda).
EVERYTHING YOU HAVE BEEN TOLD IS A LIE kinda stuff.

I've had the models for over 10 years.
Now, I get a codex that can hold its own against the bleeding marines and the flea-bitten marines and suddenly the sky is falling?

As for 40k having depth?

You do realise how much of the 'foundation' of 40k was homaged on the bones of the classics, right?
Clambering over the DUNEs of pulp fiction, the DEATHWORLDs (Good job copyrighting that, GW - Harry Harrison has that one sewn up).

Infinity is a young game, yes, but it has the last three decades of cyberpunk and posthumanism to draw from and find its own uses for things.
Every meal is a banquet.

withershadow wrote:
Although his fluff can be Goto-esque, his crunch is filled with cheesy goodness. His books are filled with fun and viable options. I hope he gets to write the Chaos codex, as his over-the-top crunch (and

No he won't be doing it, JustDave is writing it on behalf of GW

Check it out

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/340878.page

It's awesome!

Meh, not a big fan of homebrews. That one actually has some great rules, but is nowhere near broken enough to hang with Ward's offerings.

Delephont wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:From what I have seen, no other Sci-fi universe is NEARLY as in-depth as 40k, not even close. Ever try to explain the specifics of 40k to someone who knows nothing about it? I'm pretty sure there are better ways to spend your WEEKEND. Plus you're talking to people who have spent hundreds/thousands on wh40k material, and HUGE portions of their time. PROUD GEEKS UNITE!!!

Sorry!?!....I nearly swallowed my tongue when I read your "report" on modern Sci Fi.....are you for real?

Ok, first of all, WH40K has been going for what 30+ years....ok, now Infinity has been running for around 6 years now, and it has more depth and background then WH40K. See, you mustn't confuse quantity with quality....no Sci Fi setting, except maybe Mech-Warrior can compete with GW in terms of published fluff, but quality, quality and quality is the key.

You want to explain WH40K to a stranger in one sentence....its Lord of the Rings in Space, with a sprinkling of Terminator, Aliens and the Bible.....done!

If you feel WH40K is the most "in-depth" Sci Fi out there, then you need to get out more and look around, you'll be in for a surprise....and you know what, I kept my examples above to Sci Fi wargames, in respect to your actual comment about "Sci Fi universe" then here is a list of more in depth settings:

Star Gate
Star Wars
Dune
Mass Effect
Halo

I'm sure there are more!!

Mech-warrior...arguable but plausible enough,

but all of these:
Star Gate
Star Wars
Dune
Mass Effect
Halo

Are less in-depth.

The only one I'm willing to accept fully and unarguably is Star Trek...They have their own language written for it...that some people actually speak...

I assumed you were actually joking with Dune, Mass-effect and Halo...

im2randomghgh wrote:Mech-warrior...arguable but plausible enough,

but all of these:
Star Gate
Star Wars
Dune
Mass Effect
Halo

Are less in-depth.

The only one I'm willing to accept fully and unarguably is Star Trek...They have their own language written for it...that some people actually speak...

I assumed you were actually joking with Dune, Mass-effect and Halo...

There are times when someone says something so stupid that there really is nothing more to be said.

If you really believe that WH40K has more depth than Dune....then there really is nothing more to be said to you on this subject.....I mean, forget everything else on the list, if you stumble at Dune then theres no hope for you.

My parting point before dirtying myself further by discussing this with you.....DUNE has been classed as the Lord of the Rings of the Sci Fi world.

You sir deserve WH40K and WH40K deserves you.

Delephont wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:Mech-warrior...arguable but plausible enough,

but all of these:
Star Gate
Star Wars
Dune
Mass Effect
Halo

Are less in-depth.

The only one I'm willing to accept fully and unarguably is Star Trek...They have their own language written for it...that some people actually speak...

I assumed you were actually joking with Dune, Mass-effect and Halo...

1. There are times when someone says something so stupid that there really is nothing more to be said.

2. If you really believe that WH40K has more depth than Dune....then there really is nothing more to be said to you on this subject.....I mean, forget everything else on the list, if you stumble at Dune then theres no hope for you.

3. My parting point before dirtying myself further by discussing this with you.....DUNE has been classed as the Lord of the Rings of the Sci Fi world.

4. You sir deserve WH40K and WH40K deserves you.

1. don't be so harsh on yourself

2. Dune isn't even vaguely comparable to the depth of wh40k. The shallowness and dryness of Dune completely summarizes why sci-fi enthusiasts are often mocked.

3. Point being? Every article ever written ever has one of two things: Bias to one degree or other, or an author who managed to avoid bias by completely not caring and as a result did a rather poor job of writing.

4. Thanks for the complement

If you dislike 40k so much don't post in the 40k area!

As much as I hate Star Wars currently, I am going to have to say that it is way more in depth then 40K.

Well thats a give in. But Halo is most definitley not more in depth. They may have a Halo "Bible" at Bungie, but they don't have 20+ years of fluff. And this just means better quality, not quantity as opposed to Halo.

Lord Scythican wrote:As much as I hate Star Wars currently, I am going to have to say that it is way more in depth then 40K.

Not even close.

There are more Star Wars books, but at the same time, not as much fluff, since a lot of it is repetitive or series based.

All 40k books are different planets, different forces, different names etc.

The scale of 40k is so much bigger comparing them would be foolish to the tenth degree.

Star Wars was just a bunch of pretty movies.

im2randomghgh wrote:
2. Dune isn't even vaguely comparable to the depth of wh40k. The shallowness and dryness of Dune completely summarizes why sci-fi enthusiasts are often mocked.

Haha, is this the nerd totem pole? "Fans of DUNE are way less kewl than 40k fans!" I assure you, the legions of fat sweaty nerds with a pompous attitude and an undeserved sense of accomplishment over their choice of hobby provide just as much fodder for mockery.

40k has more quantity of crap going on than DUNE, but the central themes and struggles of the character make 40K look like a Saturday morning cartoon... which it is, and which is why we like it.

"dryness of Dune"

I c wut you did thar

Maybe if we gave all the Jokaero a typewriter they might eventually write a better GK codex. It has to work better than the current method GW is using.

im2randomghgh wrote:

The scale of 40k is so much bigger comparing them would be foolish to the tenth degree.

Star Wars was just a bunch of pretty movies.

Not even close.

Just saying it is a bunch of pretty movies shows you have no clue as to the scope of it all.

For example, Warhammer has 9 specifically named "A planets". Star Wars has 274 specifically named "A Planets". My fluff is bigger than yours!

Actually, that depends on if you accept the Expanded Universe as canon.

Lord Scythican wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:

The scale of 40k is so much bigger comparing them would be foolish to the tenth degree.

Star Wars was just a bunch of pretty movies.

Not even close.

Just saying it is a bunch of pretty movies shows you have no clue as to the scope of it all.

For example, Warhammer has 9 specifically named "A planets". Star Wars has 274 specifically named "A Planets". My fluff is bigger than yours!

Warhammer 40k has given names to thousands of planets. 274 is like a warm-up.

im2randomghgh wrote:

Lord Scythican wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:

The scale of 40k is so much bigger comparing them would be foolish to the tenth degree.

Star Wars was just a bunch of pretty movies.

Not even close.

Just saying it is a bunch of pretty movies shows you have no clue as to the scope of it all.

For example, Warhammer has 9 specifically named "A planets". Star Wars has 274 specifically named "A Planets". My fluff is bigger than yours!

Warhammer 40k has given names to thousands of planets. 274 is like a warm-up.

Seriously? Did you even read that post? 9 planets that start with the letter A versus 274 planets that start with the letter A. Do I really need to compare the rest of the Alphabet?

Oh I get it. You think Star Wars is 6 movies and a crappy TV show.

@Lord Scythican
"a planet" sorry for misinterpreting that...

*sarcasm*


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Lord Scythican wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:

Lord Scythican wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:

The scale of 40k is so much bigger comparing them would be foolish to the tenth degree.

Star Wars was just a bunch of pretty movies.

Not even close.

Just saying it is a bunch of pretty movies shows you have no clue as to the scope of it all.

For example, Warhammer has 9 specifically named "A planets". Star Wars has 274 specifically named "A Planets". My fluff is bigger than yours!

Warhammer 40k has given names to thousands of planets. 274 is like a warm-up.

Seriously? Did you even read that post? 9 planets that start with the letter A versus 274 planets that start with the letter A. Do I really need to compare the rest of the Alphabet?

Oh I get it. You think Star Wars is 6 movies and a crappy TV show.

I kno that it's more than those media, it's just that, aside from movies, crappy t.v. show and videogames, no one gives a feth about it.

P.S. There are actually 50 star wars planets that start with "A" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Star_Wars_planets_%28A%E2%80%93B%29

im2randomghgh wrote:
I kno that it's more than those media, it's just that, aside from movies, crappy t.v. show and videogames, no one gives a feth about it.

Well thats true. I can't argue there. I used to really like Star Wars but has really went downhill. However looking at your post, I think I may know what you are missing. The printed media. That have close to 400 novels, and probably twice that in comics. Now while a few hundred are less than great, the last 50 or so books have been really good. The comics are really good too.

In addition, the fluff that is written in the old WEG D6 RPG is on par with warhammers. So honestly, by looking at what you have probably been exposed too, I think your opinion is valid. However there is a lot more than that out there. There is way more in the novels, rpg, and comics than in any of the movies and games.

Also I see what happened with the a planets! Ha I guess you were thinking something was wrong with me...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh and I see your mistake with the number of planets. Again it is about what you have been exposed too. Wikipedia has next to no info on Star Wars and there is a reason for that. It is because of Wookiepedia...


http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_planets_A

Lord Scythican wrote:

im2randomghgh wrote:
I kno that it's more than those media, it's just that, aside from movies, crappy t.v. show and videogames, no one gives a feth about it.

Well thats true. I can't argue there. I used to really like Star Wars but has really went downhill. However looking at your post, I think I may know what you are missing. The printed media. That have close to 400 novels, and probably twice that in comics. Now while a few hundred are less than great, the last 50 or so books have been really good. The comics are really good too.

In addition, the fluff that is written in the old WEG D6 RPG is on par with warhammers. So honestly, by looking at what you have probably been exposed too, I think your opinion is valid. However there is a lot more than that out there. There is way more in the novels, rpg, and comics than in any of the movies and games.

Also I see what happened with the a planets! Ha I guess you were thinking something was wrong with me...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh and I see your mistake with the number of planets. Again it is about what you have been exposed too. Wikipedia has next to no info on Star Wars and there is a reason for that. It is because of Wookiepedia...


http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_planets_A

I am actually quite aware of the books, have read 25 or so SW books, I even mentioned them in one of my posts.

P.S, I think it is worth mentioning that the books I read were those little, ~150 pg books (Feris Olin thing)

P.P.S, completely unrelated, reading The Lost and it's awesome!

Lord Scythican wrote:

Oh I get it. You think Star Wars is 6 movies and a crappy TV show.

Yes, as it helps me avoid such literary abominations as Resident Sith...errrr... Death Troopers....

They wrote a book-a 300 page book- about the hunt for Darth Vader's glove.

Hey, at least Star Wars doesn't rewrite their core original fluff several times over in order to sell new stuff to the right target audience.

micahaphone wrote:They wrote a book-a 300 page book- about the hunt for Darth Vader's glove.

Was it his left one or right one?

micahaphone wrote:Hey, at least Star Wars doesn't rewrite their core original fluff several times over in order to sell new stuff to the right target audience.

This is the problem with the GW side of things, things that have been consistent for many moons suddenly change for no reason and make even less sense than they did originally or makes an already well thought out piece of background terrible.

This is my issues with the Grey Knight codex, it wasn't necessary to add what they did with the Bloodtide and Draigo. If Mr Ward had maybe thought a bit more in the wording he could've turned it into something that quite a proportion of us wouldn't nerdrage against. This might not have been his fault, as I guess GW do proof read their stuff. Say for example, the Sisters knowing that the end was near without sacrifice offered their lives to the Grey Knights, realising the consequences if they did not. An act like that wouldn't tarnish the Grey Knights and it would stand the Sisters as the utmost devout Emperor follower. We don't know if this wasn't the way it did go down, just the current phrasing used seems to suggest that the Grey Knights just killed the Sisters.

Reading Sacrifice by Ben Counter from the new Victories anthology this does tie in with the Codex. Now, I've never read a Grey Knights novel all the way through as I didn't enjoy them that much, but I don't think that anywhere this stuff has been mentioned before. I kinda feel that GW went to Mr Counter and said 'Mr Ward has gone and written something for the younger masses, can you do a short for the oldies to make it fit in with your fluff, we'll give you moneh!!' Sacrificing Psykers to make the wards on armour, Sacrificing a 'good person' to make a bullet, where has this come from suddenly?!

To me all this sullied the name of the Grey Knights, they are supposed to be the purist of the pure and not need blood ritual to make them so. They were the pinnacle of the Astartes because of their faith in the Emperor and it's this reason why they would never falter or fall to Chaos. Blood ritual is the Domain of Khorne.

I'm starting to accept that this is the new breed of 40k, that we're now going from 11 to 12 and the 40k I remember is fading away as everything gets bigger and more powerful, but not necessarily better. I am still going to game and read the fluff, but will keep nerdraging when something blatantly sucks and will keep the old stuff closest to my heart.

I'm just hoping that they do not make a mockery of the established fluff when they do the Chaos Codex.

micahaphone wrote:They wrote a book-a 300 page book- about the hunt for Darth Vader's glove.

You have to tell me where you got that huge paint brush of yours micahaphone. It must make painting so much easier when you can colour everything with the same brush!!!

My point of view:

^^

B30 wrote:My point of view:

^^

Oh man that's awesome, did you draw that yourself?

B30 wrote:My point of view:
http://images.dakkadakka.com/gallery/2011/4/14/209725_md-Grey%20Knights%2C%20Humor%2040k%2C%20Sisters%20Of%20Battle.jpg
^^

That's a thing of beauty. Many thanks for sharing it.

Sounds like the sisters stole the GK's cookies...

Ward=FAIL

im2randomghgh wrote:
I am actually quite aware of the books, have read 25 or so SW books, I even mentioned them in one of my posts.

P.S, I think it is worth mentioning that the books I read were those little, ~150 pg books (Feris Olin thing)

P.P.S, completely unrelated, reading The Lost and it's awesome!

See now you are just getting me back into Star Wars. I was completely happy with hating the Clone Wars and giving up on it, but now I have discovered that you have read those little 150 page books and are unaware of the the awesome ones.

First up you need to check out The New Jedi Order series. A lot of people don't like them, but they are a must if you are following the story of Jacen and Jaina Solo, the kids of Han and Leia. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/The_New_Jedi_Order

After that you get to the really good stuff:
The Legacy of the Force. I don't want to get too much into it because I don't want to spoil it, but these are some really good books.
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Legacy_of_the_Force

After that is the Fate of the Jedi series. I haven't finished them myself (due to my dislike of star wars in its current form) but these have remained the only thing good about Star Wars at the moment:
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Fate_of_the_jedi


These series are nothing like the Prequels or the crappy TV show.

Lord Harrab wrote:
Oh man that's awesome, did you draw that yourself?

AlexHolker wrote:
That's a thing of beauty. Many thanks for sharing it.

Thanks ^^ Yes, I made it myself. You can find more of my art on my site (see in my sig. There is an "Warhammer &40K" album in the column on the right.

On topic, Demon hunters were an army I started because I had SM minis I didn't use, and because they looked like perfect allies for my main army: Sisters of battle. Also I liked their "desesperately fighting the good fight" aspect.
Now that they're a Mary-sue uber-marines chapter that casualy sacrifice Sisters and use their blood to fight the blood god (wth?), I don't think I will play them again. ^^ Sure, the fluff of the new codex is based on pre-existing fluff, but that doesn't save it from bad writing
And by the way, I've read the codex and forged my own opinion, I'm not surfing the hate-wave ;-)