New skaven...

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**Dobie**

You wouldn't happen to have that PDF for the Doomwheel or a link to it?

I googled it with no luck.

**Thargrim**

Da Blak Gobbo wrote:Maybe it's just me but is anyone picking up similarities or just a look-a-like feel between the District 9 aliens and these skaven?

no Skaven are ratlike and the D9 Prawns are like big crickets, they are both hunched though..thats the only similarity I can think of.

**Jive Professor**

Oh my God, Skaven actually look... cool? Does not compute.

**JohnHwangDD**

If the Vermin Lord were a Giant-equivalent Special Monster that cannot be the Army General, that'd probably work just fine in terms of army balance and theme.

**Malecus**

Sooooo looking forward to this. Because Empire and VC weren't big enough horde armies for me to play...

**Railguns**

I read some chatter on on Something Awful to the effect that Skaven were losing the Warp-Lightning cannon for the Doomwheel. It doesn't sound very plausible, but it's another thing to worry about.

**The Crippler**

Most interestingly (to me) is that the new plastics appear smaller then the current range. This happened with the new skeletons as well. Smaller, more detailed plastics. I'm quite alright with that if it means fitting more on the sprue!

**Railguns**

And not looking like dogfaced chimps. That's important.

**The Crippler**

I prefer to think of the current clanrats as 'cartoony'. They're what? A full decade old or close to it. They were out before the current Skaven army book, which itself is 7+ years old.

**reds8n**

The Crippler wrote:Most interestingly (to me) is that the new plastics appear smaller then the current range. This happened with the new skeletons as well. Smaller, more detailed plastics. I'm quite alright with that if it means fitting more on the sprue!

They are smaller. One of the things that has concerned the design team for a few years was the scale creep for certain models/ranges. To get round this they made a series of master models or "dollies" as I believe they are called for most/all of the races showing the correct scale. All new models have to be in line with these new masters, so the skellies are small enough to actually fit inside a human, the goblins got smaller and these skaven and the other plastic stormvermin kit will be similarly scaled.

Big shout out to Mr. Harry from Warseer for the original scale explanation.

**JohnHwangDD**

reds8n wrote:
The Crippler wrote:Most interestingly (to me) is that the new plastics appear smaller then the current range. This happened with the new skeletons as well. Smaller, more detailed plastics. I'm quite alright with that if it means fitting more on the sprue!

They are smaller. One of the things that has concerned the design team for a few years was the scale creep for certain models/ranges. To get round this they made a series of master models or "dollies" as I believe they are called for most/all of the races showing the correct scale. All new models have to be in line with these new masters, so the skellies are small enough to actually fit inside a human, the goblins got smaller and these skaven and the other plastic stormvermin kit will be similarly scaled.

About time! The model sizes were just getting stupid. When *everything* is "heroic", *nothing* is "heroic".

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

All I have to say on the matter, is SQUEAK!

And what a time to be applying for a one day a week part time position! KERCHING!

**Vengis**

Damn, I'm going to have to buy more rats.

I guess the current monkeys can be used as slaves or something.

Also please let the Vermin Lord be in this book. I need a big centerpiece that's not as likely to kill my Grey Seer.

**Savnock**

Okay, I've been out of WHFB for a few years (since Cavatore murdered all light-infantry armies by nerfing skimishers grumble grumble), but...

...couldn't you just field DOW units and "counts as" them to be the Vermin Lord etc.? Like a Giant, or that Elf on Dragon, etc.? And is there a Steamtank DOW unit? That would certainly make a decent rules-base for a Doomwheel.

And thanks for the explanation on the scale-creep correction, s8n. Is that confined to the WHFB range? Haven't seen much evidence of such control in 40K- would've been nice to have more realistic Guardsmen.

**JohnHwangDD**

The Vermin Lord could "count as" a Giant, but not being winged or Flyijng, counting as an Elf Hero on Dragon is quite a bit of a stretch.

DoW don't have anything close to a Steamtank or Doomwheel at all, which is odd, considering the inspiration of Miragliano...

**reds8n**

Vengis wrote:

Also please let the Vermin Lord be in this book.

Hmm... it would seem you might be a happy bunny after all.

**smart_alex**

I hate those new models.

**RecByjam**

Never mind Doom Wheels, they need a revamp, Giant Spiky Hamsterballs anyone?

**Cheese Elemental**

JohnHwangDD wrote:The Vermin Lord could "count as" a Giant, but not being winged or Flyijng, counting as an Elf Hero on Dragon is quite a bit of a stretch.

DoW don't have anything close to a Steamtank or Doomwheel at all, which is odd, considering the inspiration of Miragliano...

Don't worry John, if you want a Steamtank or Doomwheel for your Dogs of War, you can always use 'counts-as'.

**Wehrkind**

I suppose we don't know whether the heads on these little guys are sepatate, huh? I would love to put some Pig Iron heads on these and use them as cultists.

I am really pleased to hear that GW is trying to reign in scale. The Primaris Psyker being SM size really irks me.

**reds8n**

To clarify AFAIK the scale alterations are, currently, restricted to the WFB line.

..not least, I'd imagine, as rendering the entire marine model range invalid would cause THE END OF THE INTERNET

..meanwhile...

From the GW site

If you're subscribed to our newsletter you'll know that the Skaven are coming this November.

The Skaven plot and scheme the demise of other races while dreaming of their own rise to power. Epitomising the theory that quantity is a quality all of its own; a Skaven army will generally outnumber its foe at least two-to-one. As a Skaven player you can command tens of regiments each 30 or 40 strong, and throw them against the foe with wanton abandon - while practising your maniacal laugh. Another hallmark of Skaven armies are their impressive war machines, which are a stark contrast to the numberless horde of ratmen, and make for striking centrepieces to an army. One of the best things about the new Skaven army book is that it allows you greater flexibility than ever before: allowing you to field an army based around any of the infamous Skaven clans

**MeanGreenStompa**

reds8n wrote: To clarify AFAIK the scale alterations are, currently, restricted to the WFB line.

Shame, the imp guard could do with this to halt them growing larger than the space marines. Than allow the size creep to continue for space marines until they reach truescale.

**Wehrkind**

Yea, that is a bummer. At least it is a step in the right direction though.
I was personally dearly hoping that the new Marine line would go to true-scale. Maybe for the next codex they will start releasing Marine squads in true scale, and let everyone update as they see fit.

**Alpharius**

MeanGreenStompa wrote:
reds8n wrote: To clarify AFAIK the scale alterations are, currently, restricted to the WFB line.

Shame, the imp guard could do with this to halt them growing larger than the space marines. Than allow the size creep to continue for space marines until they reach truescale.

Absolutely!

True-Scale Marines would be what we have now if they could have controlled that mess!

On Topic, any word on how Ratling Guns and Warplock Engineers will be reigned in?

I'm guessing having to determine how many dice are used FIRST (not as you go) and then for the Engineers... I have no idea.

**JohnHwangDD**

The easiest "fix" for the 40k scale problem would be to simply shrink IG back to the 2E metal Guardsman size (Praetorian / Mordian / Tallarn). It's the stupid Catachans (and Cadians, to a somewhat lesser extent). Then at least Marines and Orks will be "heroically" large compared to Guardsmen.

**Death By Monkeys**

As a Skaven player you can command tens of regiments each 30 or 40 strong...

(Emphasis is mine)

Tens of regiments? Okay, that implies that you'll be field at least ten regiments of 30-40 rats - we're talking a minimum of 300-400 model armies? Minimum? You're kidding right? And folks complain that foot-slogging orks in 40k take all day to play. I mean, I know in WHFB you can use movement trays, but geez, seriously?

**JohnHwangDD**

2000 pts at 3-4 pts /model = 500-600 models possible...

**whitedragon**

GW wins because they sell boatloads of models.

I win because I'm going to figure out a way to use those models in 40k for either a Hrud army or LaTD.

MOAR PICS PLEASE!

**Minsc**

JohnHwangDD wrote:2000 pts at 3-4 pts /model = 500-600 models possible...

If you took no heroes, and felt like losing every game.

I'm hoping that quote is for Mighty Empires or something similar.

**MeanGreenStompa**

Skaven armies have always been crazy sized, I certainly remember agreeing to waive the table edge borders for deployment for my old housemate back in 98 on an 8ft table with 3k a side.