Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Silly question, but do we have a price for this thing yet?

I love tau and want to expand them, but since I play casual games I rather take this than a supremacy as its hardly friendly.

May even get me playing tau again.

 Jackal wrote:
Silly question, but do we have a price for this thing yet?

I love tau and want to expand them, but since I play casual games I rather take this than a supremacy as its hardly friendly.

May even get me playing tau again.

It looks to be 360 base

*edit since no once reads older pages* Also, unrelated to my reply

Sorry, I meant £££ wise.

Its meant to be £90

I know.

£90 is fine.
Price per points I guess its not too bad in terms of some things lol.

Thanks

 Vaktathi wrote:
Is it Wraithknight good? No, it's not quite that absurdly cheap.

But it's certainly not a bad investment of 360pts at all.

Huh? A stripped down Wraithknight is 295 pts, 335 with dual Starcannon. The Tau supersuit is barely 10% more expensive than the fully-upgunned Wraithknight. If the Wraithknight is "absurdly cheap", then so is the Tau supersuit.

And just how is this suit inferior to a Wraithknight? It's got a D gun and lots of firepower. No loss of Stomp in Assaults. Extra missiles. More wounds against high S AP3 weapons. I see them as generally comparable, with a different target focus.

 Jimsolo wrote:
With a Ld of 8, I'm excited to face this with a Freakshow list. A Shadowseer would only need an additional -1 to one shot the thing with Mirror of Minds, and a Psychic Shriek or two (what with the negatives and all) should put paid to it and how.

The price seems reasonable for the armament. Even with another army I don't think I'd cry to hard about it.

I think GC are immune to psychic effects.

For people saying its rubbish, have a quick think.

If this were to be for the nids, how often would you see this accompanying flyrants on the field?

Both tau and Eldar have a thing because they have some pretty damn good units currently.
So when something new is released, its instantly compared to a very high end choice.

However, given to another army, I would see something like this as a no brainer in my nids.

 Jackal wrote:
For people saying its rubbish, have a quick think.

If this were to be for the nids, how often would you see this accompanying flyrants on the field?

Both tau and Eldar have a thing because they have some pretty damn good units currently.
So when something new is released, its instantly compared to a very high end choice.

However, given to another army, I would see something like this as a no brainer in my nids.

Difference is that NIds need lots of shooting and pie plates with low AP to make up for the most of the army being useless and overcosted. Tau don't. The main thing the tau lacked was long range anti tank and I had assumed the thing with the massive gun would do the job; not just do what other tau units already do.

The main problem with this suit of armor is that the Tuna super suit came out beforehand which pretty much overshadows it. Though manages to look just as stupid.

You need to understand though that GW never seem to fill gaps in armies.
No idea why, but each army should have a form of filling every role to some degree.

Let's forget nids then and say crons, chaos or daemons.
For any army except tau or Eldar this thing would have a place in a competitive army.

 Totalwar1402 wrote:

 Jackal wrote:
For people saying its rubbish, have a quick think.

If this were to be for the nids, how often would you see this accompanying flyrants on the field?

Both tau and Eldar have a thing because they have some pretty damn good units currently.
So when something new is released, its instantly compared to a very high end choice.

However, given to another army, I would see something like this as a no brainer in my nids.

Difference is that NIds need lots of shooting and pie plates with low AP to make up for the most of the army being useless and over costed. Tau don't. The main thing the tau lacked was long range anti tank and I had assumed the thing with the massive gun would do the job; not just do what other tau units already do.

I know right. I had to buy a FW Y'vahrah for my anti tank. Never looked back. I'm getting the Ta'unar now as well thanks to this things mediocre stats. I don't need 5/5 shooting. I have too much 5/5 shooting. Too much litteraly. I have nothgin to shoot at sometimes with all my 5/5 guns bolted everywhere. So what do they go and give me? A fething 5/5 main battery of cluster missiles. What the hell. And 4 one use missiles that are a tad better than use impaired seeker missiles? What are they smoking. Then they give the STR D a range of 10. Thank a lot you donkey-caves.

Did you guys know the Ta'unar is sold out and they have to make more? I'm not even joking sales are through the roof on that thing. 1. It looks awesome. 2. It actually puts out anti tank fire we need. Too much in fact. I was hoping this would be anti tank so I didn't have too go and buy an OP Ta'unar. Now when I bring my Ta'unar I'm going to give my opponents extra points and objectives to try even it all out. If anyone will even play me. I got a few people who will but not as much as I would like.

fething GW man.

 Totalwar1402 wrote:

 Jimsolo wrote:
With a Ld of 8, I'm excited to face this with a Freakshow list. A Shadowseer would only need an additional -1 to one shot the thing with Mirror of Minds, and a Psychic Shriek or two (what with the negatives and all) should put paid to it and how.

The price seems reasonable for the armament. Even with another army I don't think I'd cry to hard about it.

I think GC are immune to psychic effects.

Not if they are Witchfires.

 eskimo wrote:
Something not OP and everyone goes just as wild.

Its more they were hoping it was good. T6 and 3+ save is garbage. Ask any Nid player how long 2 hive tyrants on foot last.

If you can realistically threaten it and keep it moving around, the thing seems pretty fairly costed.

If it is free to anchor and double fire from turn 2 on, it will definitely be pulling weight and then some. One of the few situations where actively ignoring the big shiny toy makes it an even bigger problem.

I'd call it fair overall with the current tau book. We'll have to see how the new book looks with it. Might be different based on wargear changes and possible formation buffs.

 Ravenous D wrote:

 eskimo wrote:
Something not OP and everyone goes just as wild.

Its more they were hoping it was good. T6 and 3+ save is garbage. Ask any Nid player how long 2 hive tyrants on foot last.

With only a difference of 4 wounds and FNP...Not to mention that at best the Tyrants range abilities are 12 TL S6 shots, this thing can reach out and touch people from across the board with an almost ludicrous amount of high strength, low ap pie plates. Don't even try and compare this thing to a Tyrant. I would KILL to have my Tyrants be half as effective as this beast.

EDIT: Seriously, this thing is a bit "Squishy" based on the other stupid crap that GW has been releasing in the past year but it more than makes up for it in fire power. Look at this thing as a glass cannon if you are so deluded to think that it is glass at all. Any DE players, you know THE glass cannon army, want to pipe in about how they feel about Tau players complaining about this things toughness?

Listening to Tau and Eldar players complain that their new units aren't even more OP than their other OP units is annoying when some of the other armies would KILL to have something HALF as strong as this thing.

 niv-mizzet wrote:
If you can realistically threaten it and keep it moving around, the thing seems pretty fairly costed.

If it is free to anchor and double fire from turn 2 on, it will definitely be pulling weight and then some. One of the few situations where actively ignoring the big shiny toy makes it an even bigger problem.

I'd call it fair overall with the current tau book. We'll have to see how the new book looks with it. Might be different based on wargear changes and possible formation buffs.

Nah I ran the numbers. It kills 5 marines with normal guns and the big cannon will obviously drop some hurt. Not really worth the points and its highly doubtful it will ever anchor. The list of things that eat it alive is very very long, and all very very common.

Arbiter_Shade wrote:

 Ravenous D wrote:

 eskimo wrote:
Something not OP and everyone goes just as wild.

Its more they were hoping it was good. T6 and 3+ save is garbage. Ask any Nid player how long 2 hive tyrants on foot last.

With only a difference of 4 wounds and FNP...Not to mention that at best the Tyrants range abilities are 12 TL S6 shots, this thing can reach out and touch people from across the board with an almost ludicrous amount of high strength, low ap pie plates. Don't even try and compare this thing to a Tyrant. I would KILL to have my Tyrants be half as effective as this beast.

Just want to point out that killing is probably the easiest way you will get Tyrants half as good as this Tau thing... I am certain GW will crumble to your will if you start killing them.

Arbiter - you summed up my thoughts better than I could.

My heart bleeds for people who play tau or Eldar now.
How dare GW give them a new unbroken (but still amazing) model to use!

Do people honestly think units should keep on creeping up in power?

It is a very good, power creeped as feth unit. Honestly it is going to put Tau players back on a watch list just as they were getting off it; it doesn't bear good signs of what will come with their codex.

As for the lack of Invul. Just toss the fething thing on a skyshield w/ a nice Fireblade Cadre; just shored up all of the weaknesses now didn't I?

EDIT: I wonder if I'm going to revert back to my "feth Taudar" mentality.... it is close to happening.

The issue is not its effectiveness, it's the role. We already kill off armies that its designed to kill.

We needed good anti-tank roles. Not more anti swarm.

You already have the R'vharna, Melta suits, Skyray, EMP grenades. You don't need anything.

 Gamgee wrote:
The issue is not its effectiveness, it's the role. We already kill off armies that its designed to kill.

We needed good anti-tank roles. Not more anti swarm.

Well if we follow the line of tactical genius in this thread just charge the things and get in D range because its a viable tactic.

Rule 1 is important. You can make your point without the second part of this post., motyak

 Ravenous D wrote:

 Gamgee wrote:
The issue is not its effectiveness, it's the role. We already kill off armies that its designed to kill.

We needed good anti-tank roles. Not more anti swarm.

Well if we follow the line of tactical genius in this thread just charge the things and get in D range because its a viable tactic.

Y'all mother fethers need to get your daddy issues with eldar checked.

you the real MVP

Farsight Enclaves has the swarms of suits man not regular Tau Empire.

Yv'ahrah is incredibly good anti tank true, but it is frail and will die. It also has to get super close to bring down anything and that means it can get tangled up in melee. It's good but has its weaknesses.

EMP grenades? Where? Tell me. My firewarriors? yeah right not an option when knights are walking around the field.

This thing has very little going for it considering the existing armaments of the Tau.

All our rail weapons currently suck so bad. We literally use XV8's with the occasionally a Y'vahrah and thats all we have for anti-tank that doesn't just die.

Even then the suits can't be taken in enough numbers to matter anymore for regular TE and FSE is a whole other beast.

Meanwhile we have Smart Missiles, Fire Warriors, Sky Rays, Drones, Kroot, Sniper Drone Teams, Pathfinders, A 5/5 Large Blast gak tier flier, Riptide's, Rv'arnah, the Supremacy Armor, and Missile Broad Sides to take out the targets this thing is designed to take out.

But yeah sure we really need MORE anti-infantry/swarm.

Skyray can't to gak against heavy armour, the r'vharna isn't part of the base codex (we really shouldn't have to use FW to have decent anti-armour), and EMP grenades are really not what you want against heavy armour. Try taking down a knight with those, and if you do somehow succeed on that suicide mission, your opponents will be sure not to allow that again (which isn't to hard considering FWs are pretty squishy. We are gak against heavy armour. Melta-cide is really the only decent option, and it really shouldn't have to be. And they get chewed up by knights in any case.

Saying you shouldn't have to use FW is like any of the players of a IoM faction saying "we shouldn't need to use allies", oh wait we get shouted down when we say that.

 Co'tor Shas wrote:
Skyray can't to gak against heavy armour, the r'vharna isn't part of the base codex (we really shouldn't have to use FW to have decent anti-armour), and EMP grenades are really not what you want against heavy armour. Try taking down a knight with those, and if you do somehow succeed on that suicide mission, your opponents will be sure not to allow that again (which isn't to hard considering FWs are pretty squishy. We are gak against heavy armour. Melta-cide is really the only decent option, and it really shouldn't have to be. And they get chewed up by knights in any case.

Quickjager is adamantly against Tau in general so bear that in mind, all Tau are overpowered all the time in his eyes it seems. And I agree we really do need more/better counters for long range anti-tank. The vast majority of our stuff is only effective at close ranges which makes us vulnerable and we usually only have a single turn to inflict as much damage as possible. Also this is assuming that we will still have access to EMP grenades but on that same note who knows what they may change/buff for the Tau Codex we will have to see.

That being said I don't thing this thing is horrible but I do feel it is overcosted, especially for what weapons it has (im sorry all of you going on about how "it has a D weapon its just as good as other GMC's now" are completely wrong, it has a 10 INCH RANGE! At that point if our opponent is within 10 inches of it you have some other issues going on) and I do feel it should have been geared more for some long range heavy armor. Still looking on the bright side of things you can take a squadron of them and unload a good amount of S10 AP2 Blast templates downrange, once of course you spend a turn anchoring in, however that is an additional 25pts. per model and for its fire output 385pts for that is overcosted. I still plan on getting at least 2 however because it does look awesome to me

And Jager big difference between FW and Allies is that you can take Allies without any chance of argument where (personally I think its stupid if it occurs) but there are places that refuse FW so though it is slightly similar it is not the same.

Can I break my record for largest troll multiquote? Yes I can!

JohnHwangDD wrote:

 Vaktathi wrote:
Is it Wraithknight good? No, it's not quite that absurdly cheap.

But it's certainly not a bad investment of 360pts at all.

Huh? A stripped down Wraithknight is 295 pts, 335 with dual Starcannon. The Tau supersuit is barely 10% more expensive than the fully-upgunned Wraithknight. If the Wraithknight is "absurdly cheap", then so is the Tau supersuit.

And just how is this suit inferior to a Wraithknight? It's got a D gun and lots of firepower. No loss of Stomp in Assaults. Extra missiles. More wounds against high S AP3 weapons. I see them as generally comparable, with a different target focus.

Okay, let's take the dual Starcannon Wraithknight. For 25 less points and two less wounds, the Wrtaithknight has S10 T8 WS/BS4 I5 A4 and is Fearless. Furthermore, it can swap for a D-strength CCW or plasma blast weapon, both with a 5++ save, for free. Yeah, the Wraithknight isn't undercosted at all. Clearly its the new Tau GC that's the problem!

Quickjager wrote:It is a very good, power creeped as feth unit. Honestly it is going to put Tau players back on a watch list just as they were getting off it; it doesn't bear good signs of what will come with their codex.

As for the lack of Invul. Just toss the fething thing on a skyshield w/ a nice Fireblade Cadre; just shored up all of the weaknesses now didn't I?

EDIT: I wonder if I'm going to revert back to my "feth Taudar" mentality.... it is close to happening.

The storm of hate is coming, I can guarantee you. But if you want to avoid the likes of me and my unflinching snark and well-though-out arguments, you'll stay far away.

Seriously, I don't want Tau players to be in the same situation as Eldar players were back during their new codex's release cycle. That was not fun.

Jackal wrote:Arbiter - you summed up my thoughts better than I could.

My heart bleeds for people who play tau or Eldar now.
How dare GW give them a new unbroken (but still amazing) model to use!

Do people honestly think units should keep on creeping up in power?

The power creep has been the trend so far. No reason to think it won't stop now (though I hope that GW does).

Eldar have some seriously OP units, and Tau have a stereotype as being boring to play against and one-dimensional. But not all Eldar players use the OP units, and not all Tau players spam undercosted MCs and play as static gunline. I just hope the Tau codex turns out better in terms of balance than the latest Eldar book.

Ravenous D wrote:

 Gamgee wrote:
The issue is not its effectiveness, it's the role. We already kill off armies that its designed to kill.

We needed good anti-tank roles. Not more anti swarm.

Well if we follow the line of tactical genius in this thread just charge the things and get in D range because its a viable tactic.

Y'all mother fethers need to get your daddy issues with eldar checked.

If you're the tournament-caliber player you say you are, you should know that a single-shot D-wepaon isn't much of a threat. After all, no one takes the Wraithknight with dual Wraithcannons.

You need to have your attitude checked.

 Quickjager wrote:
Saying you shouldn't have to use FW is like any of the players of a IoM faction saying "we shouldn't need to use allies", oh wait we get shouted down when we say that.

But not me. IoM should not have to use allies any more than tau should have to use FW. What you are saying really isn't an argument.

All armies should be able to stand on there own, without needing allies/FW. And just because your army currently requires those, doesn't mean that others should. In fact, you should want other armies not to require them, as that means it's more likely yours won't next times it's updated.


Basically, just because your army gets something bad, doesn't mean everyone elses has to.