8th Edition Rulebook Roundup

Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:

No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.

If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

**Ragnar4**

Minsc wrote:
Buttlerthepug wrote:
I think its more or less that horde armies will be 10 wide (more models attacking) and getting horde rule (which is another attacking rank? more attacks?) 3 10wide ranks is pretty ridiculous.. I could be wrong, I havent read through rumors in a while.
Horde is stupidly easy to counter, however, so long as the "must remain in base or catty-corner" remains. At least, for 25mm or above armies (Orcs & Beastmen). 20mm is where the cheese for Horde will be at.

At 25mm: Six wide front with a 20mm unit, or a five wide front with 25mm. First cuts twelve attacking models out of the picture, second cuts nine out of the picture. Or, pretty much, most of that third rank (or all of it, in 20mm case). It's the 20mm's that can abuse the rule most readily, especially stuff like Black Guard and Phoenix Guard.

30 Pheonix guard is 450 points. No way that the Helves will be trying to abuse that rule competitively. Spearmen might try to abuse the rule at 9 points per, but they will be getting the extra attacks anyway up to 5 rumored ranks.

Off the top of my head, I honestly don't think that it, as a rule, will do much for horde armies. It's one of those things that looks neat on paper, but once it's all said and done, people are going to value persistant ranks and stubborn over 10 extra craptastic attacks. Horde versus horde may attempt to use this rule. But Horde vs Elite won't. Tournaments present an interesting problem because you can't guarantee that horde vs horde will occur, and bringing units THAT big would be a huge detriment. Instead people will balance their armies in a tournament setting to deal with all comers.

**Buttlerthepug**

Minsc wrote:
Buttlerthepug wrote:
I think its more or less that horde armies will be 10 wide (more models attacking) and getting horde rule (which is another attacking rank? more attacks?) 3 10wide ranks is pretty ridiculous.. I could be wrong, I havent read through rumors in a while.
Horde is stupidly easy to counter, however, so long as the "must remain in base or catty-corner" remains. At least, for 25mm or above armies (Orcs & Beastmen). 20mm is where the cheese for Horde will be at.

At 25mm: Six wide front with a 20mm unit, or a five wide front with 25mm. First cuts twelve attacking models out of the picture, second cuts nine out of the picture. Or, pretty much, most of that third rank (or all of it, in 20mm case). It's the 20mm's that can abuse the rule most readily, especially stuff like Black Guard and Phoenix Guard.

Very true, regardless though, compare to now...
With corners, that's still 3 ransk of 7 guys... still rather ridiculous.

**ShivanAngel**

Skaven will end up liking the horde rule more then anyone imo.

Yeah they are only WS2, but you can get a 10x5 block for only 100 points... That block will have Ld 10 if within general range until you kill 15 models... Now imagine them with death frenzy which gives every model an additional 2 attacks... /drool

**Alpharius**

Don't do that - I already hate Skaven enough as it is!

**ShivanAngel**

Alpharius wrote:Don't do that - I already hate Skaven enough as it is!

Yes thats ummm...

hmmmmm

125 attacks.....

You wunna just say the unit is dead... Or are you gunna make me roll all that?!

**Kirasu**

Yeah, it will also help empire imo.. Most of the empire state troops are 100% garbage, however 50 of them is scary when 30 get to attack.. Might make halberds useful

if the stubborn rule works as it sounds.. yeah skaven slaves are gonna be a bit over the top, but we'll see.. they already were way too good. Hopefully the missions will balance out things just like they do in 40k

**ShivanAngel**

Kirasu wrote:Yeah, it will also help empire imo.. Most of the empire state troops are 100% garbage, however 50 of them is scary when 30 get to attack.. Might make halberds useful

if the stubborn rule works as it sounds.. yeah skaven slaves are gonna be a bit over the top, but we'll see.. they already were way too good. Hopefully the missions will balance out things just like they do in 40k

Yeah was hillarious when a star dragon charged a block of 25 slaves, held on a 6 then i was able to double flank charge his dragon, win by pure SCR, then overrun it...

YAY 120 points killing 400!

**Minsc**

Death Frenzy wouldn't help second ranks, to my knowledge: Only one attack barring special rules specifically giving extra.

It also, if I'm not mistaken, causes Frenzy, meaning you'll only get those attacks on the charge.

Also, remember that they'll only be Leadership 7 stubborn in the general's range: FAQ says you don't get the "Strength in numbers" bonus for stubborn.

**Kirasu**

LD7 stubborn is still a really good chance with 7 being the most commonly rolled number.. Add a BSB nearby and possibly even more special rules revolving around the general and you got 100 pts of super awesomeness

Yeah you could flank them or something but thats A LOT of work to kill a 100 pt unit.. Should see the book soon

**ShivanAngel**

I must have misread that the horde rule gave them all their attacks....

still its a lot of attacks.

And what are the odds you wont be testing on a 10 with the gens ld, if you lose the combat by that much... epic failz!

**Kirasu**

Eh the problem is the stubborn rule Shivan.. I think thats the "other shoe" people are waiting for to drop

If it allows large units to be stubborn (say slaves) then it doesnt matter how much they lose by.. So you'll be taking 3 turns to get 100 points

Stubborn in a game revolving around LD tests is bad to give to every unit.. We'll have to wait and see how broadly they apply the stubborn brush

**ShivanAngel**

Wouldnt you get to pick the leadership to test on tho.

Say they are a stubborn 7, or a normal 10. You lose combat by one so you could test on the 9.

You lose by 5 so you test on the 7. Thats how it is now at least.

**Buttlerthepug**

Yeah I agree that the stubborn rule will be a bit ridiculous... Although the sound of 200 Orcs... Some Black Orc Big Bossess... Gorbad... 4 catapults...drool...

**Flashman**

ShivanAngel wrote:Skaven will end up liking the horde rule more then anyone imo.

Yeah they are only WS2...

Ahem, WS3 if you please

(Slaves are WS2)

**ShivanAngel**

Flashman wrote:
ShivanAngel wrote:Skaven will end up liking the horde rule more then anyone imo.

Yeah they are only WS2...

Ahem, WS3 if you please (Slaves are WS2)

read the rest of the post where i say a block of 50 costs 100 points, clearly talking about slaves.

**mikhaila**

Steadfast rule will give a unit the stubborn ability if it has more ranks than it's opponent, in HTH combat. The counter to a block of 10 wide slaves is a unit that's 5 wide and 6 deep.)

A stubborn unit may use it's leadership, or the leadership of the general, if he is within 12", or 18" if mounted on a large target, such as a screaming bell.

I think skaven will be really tough, but all armies will be getting this rule, and can choose troops to take advantage of it.

**Kirasu**

Also one thing to consider.. these 50 man units are going to be dying A LOT quicker if they get into combat due to multiple ranks attacking

Did you get the book mikhaila? If you did Legions should have also I know when to go down and look

**Flashman**

ShivanAngel wrote:
Flashman wrote:
ShivanAngel wrote:Skaven will end up liking the horde rule more then anyone imo.

Yeah they are only WS2...

Ahem, WS3 if you please (Slaves are WS2)

read the rest of the post where i say a block of 50 costs 100 points, clearly talking about slaves.

Apologies

**Platuan4th**

The one problem though, Shivan, is that without a change to the Stubborn rules(particularly that part where it says they use the LD on their Profile), Skaven actually benefit LESS with the Horde rule than other Hordes.

**rlsquared2**

I'm not a very experience player so most of the rumors i'm not sure how they will affect the meta game except for the obvious combat/movement changes. used my WoC, warriors, as a tarpit with 2+sv kickass now.. 3+sv with str4 attacks with a 6+ward save.. only for the first 5 guys.. With the change of parry im curious if we will see changes on how people will arm their warriors. Im thinking greatswords..attack in 2 ranks.. 4+ armor sv str 5.. might be better than that 3+sv/str4 attack..

on another note.. im more curious to how they will FAQ the codicies for 8th. How long does a FAQ take after the release of a rulebook?

**mikhaila**

Kirasu wrote:Also one thing to consider.. these 50 man units are going to be dying A LOT quicker if they get into combat due to multiple ranks attacking

Did you get the book mikhaila? If you did Legions should have also I know when to go down and look

We have books coming in on the 15th of June, which is the big unveiling day. I don't have a book yet. I'd bet Legions should have there's on the 15th as well.

**Grimstonefire**

@Shivan

10x5 skaven with spears = 40 models that can attack.

Death frenzy would give +2 attacks to the front rank only, so if they are all in base contact that goes to 60 attacks (presuming they have the models).

The skaven errata is the full 6 pages I believe.

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

GW Stores should be getting there's this week, to be shown off from the 15th only.

I may provide a Lol-O-Meter on the overall accuracy of the rumours if I get the time, 0 being 'bloody hell...spot on, all of it' with 10 being 'must be a paralell universe copy they read'

**reds8n**

From Warseer, as books start to arrive in the stores..

Hey guys I have actually read the rule book and held it. Here are some things I got out of it with the 15 minutes I could read it. The rules are very sparse and random because I was looking for rules that would help my Lizardmen army build. So here is what I have got. You guys can take this however you want it, I know these are official rules. Hope you guys enjoy.

Heavens magic is just awesome.

Heavens perk is any flyer hit by heavens magic is damaged and then takes an additional D6 strength 4 hit.

1st: Blizzard Spell cast on a 6

The spell acts like if weapons got wet in last edition. But anything with a BS and needs a roll to hit is -1 to hit. Anything with no BS needs a 4 plus to shoot. I believe there is more to the spell but that is the short and sweet description.

2ortent of Far is back but it is called something different

It casts on a 6 any friendly unit within 24 can re roll all 1s to hit wound and armour save. Or the buffed one casts on a 12 and any unit within the 12 inch radius gets the benefit.

3:Is a Wind spell:

This spell casts on a 7

It pushes a enemy unit back D3+1 inch directly away from the wizard if the unit hits any terrain it takes D6 S 3 hits. If the unit hits another unit both units take D6 S 3 hits. The stronger version casts on a 14 but pushes units back D6+2 Inchs away.

4: This spell is like portent of far but is a curse.

Can be cast on a enemy unit within 24 the unit must re roll any 6's to hit, wound, or armour save. This spell can be beefed up to effect any enemy unit within 12 inch radius.

5: Urions Thunderbolt is still there it is D6 strength 6 hits.

6: Is Comet which casts on a 12

The comet hasnt changed much. Once cast it cannot be dispelled. The Range is 2D6" plus an additional inch for every counter on it. The Damage caused by it is 2D6 strength is 4 but is plus 1 stronger for every counter on it. It comes down on a 4+. If it does not come down place a marker.

The Stronger Version is cast on 24+ Same as before but it automatically starts with 2 markers on it. And everyturn it does not come down an additional 2 markers are put on it.

7: Chain Lightening

It casts on a 15+ does D6 strength 6 hits on a unit within 24 of the mage. After you determine the results roll a dice on a 3+ you may choose a unit within 12 of the previous unit hit and then that unit is hit by D6 strength 6 hits. This continues until you roll a 1 or 2.

Random Rules:

Skinks can move and shoot blow pipes without taking a penalty of -1 due to they have quick shot.

Stegadons are awesome now. They have the Chariot rule as well as Thunderous Stomp. So they get impact hits for being a chariot. Then the Stegadons attacks. Then Thunderous Stomp which is always strike last but automatically hitting D6 attacks at the monsters strength. This can only be done to infantry sized creatures.

Kroxigors can use the ability Stomp which is the same as Thunderous stomp but only 1 auto hit instead of D6.

Magic levels only determine how many spells you can use thats it. Everyone generates the same amount of dice no matter what level.

Javilines and blow pipes can always stand and shoot.

Parrying can only be used against other Infantry Type models.

You may not parry Impact Hits, Stomped, Thunderous Stomp.

Oh and there is no blow pipe entry in the book I really dont know why. They have every other weapon in the book but no blow pipes.

Skirmishers do not see 360 anymore but have to face the direction they want to shoot. The easiest way for this is to put a small arrow beside the unit portraying which way they are all looking. So you dont have to individually turn each model to face the proper direction.

Magic Items:

Bane Blade 5 Points

- Any monster or character that takes an unsaved wound from this weapon perminantly loses 1 attack to a minimum of 1

I cant remember the names

- 60 point sword gives you plus 3 attacks

- 70 point sword gives you plus 3 strength it does not count as a great weapon.

There are now paired magic items. I got a glance but nothing concrete. This allow you the benefit of two hand weapons but count as magical.

Everyone knows this magic item already.

It is a 100 point magical Enchanted item. WatchTower

It is a actual watch tower that must be constructed by the player using it. If the player does not have an adequate Tower or Building the item may not be used. After deploying terrain and armies. The Player may activate the magic item and may place the watch tower anywhere in his deployment zone. It counts as a Defended building.

And again you dont have to believe me I really dont care. But I have read and touch the book. My buddy does have it. He will not put it online because he does work for the company.

Thanks for reading it and I will sned you more as soon as I read more.

I like the magic tower artifact, reminds me of an old D & D magic item.

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

Guy is talking nonsense as far as I can tell.

Black Boxes shipped Monday...

**reds8n**

Hmm... certain managers have already got their copies of the book.

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

Still no covinced about the above though.

But as I said, believe nothing until the book is in your own hands. It could be accurate, I simply do not know. But will know tomorrow or Friday!

**reds8n**

I'm sure there's errors there, there generally are when people are excitedly skimming rulebooks for odds and sods.

But that tallies quite well with the gist of what we've been hearing for a while now. Especially the more impressive magic.

**Kirasu**

Yeah i dont understand the "believe nothing" attitude.. Rumors have been pretty accurate for years and years :p not totally accurate but mostly especially this close to a release

GW's iron curtain doesnt keep the west out completely

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

It's just me saying that though, and it's more to do with being wary of rumours being taken as fact. Lots of times you see people getting upset over a rumour which proves to have no substance, and rubbishing products on unbased suspicions.

That's all! Not setting out to call anyone anywhere a liar, just hoping to cool peoples heels a little bit. For all I know it's 100% accurate!