Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Thank you.

I did read a few pages but the conversation trailed off so I asked the question directly instead of trolling through 27 pages for a specific post.

So it seems that despite the claim on the official website under the product description that there are 'new army list entries' for several armies, there are in fact none. Can't say i'm surprised considering the state of most GW gaming literature.

Oh well, at least now I know that I don't have to buy the damn thing and can spend my money on more models instead!

@enceladus Going from the digital codex the storm talon has had rules and points changes and the storm raven has been added.

I'm pretty sure I read on a different thread ( there's like 3 or 4 of them). That someone stated that there are points and rules changes if your using orks, codex space marines or BT.

Don't know if this has been posted before http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m3050214a_Death_From_the_Skies_v1.0%E2%80%93FEBRUARY13.pdf

They are already FAQ'ing it seems

It's come up once or twice, but thank you for the effort and thought

Enceladus wrote:
Thank you.

I did read a few pages but the conversation trailed off so I asked the question directly instead of trolling through 27 pages for a specific post.

So it seems that despite the claim on the official website under the product description that there are 'new army list entries' for several armies, there are in fact none. Can't say i'm surprised considering the state of most GW gaming literature.

Oh well, at least now I know that I don't have to buy the damn thing and can spend my money on more models instead!

Not sure if serious....

Codex Space Marines now has access to the Storm Raven. That'd be a new army list entry.
edit: Also Black Templar. So that'd be two.

 Kroothawk wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Sigh, looks like i need this before i can play mt stormtalon again.

Just make sure if you want to play at GW stores (compulsory there, but most forbid playing) or an independent store (most promote playing, but some banned this book for several reasons http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/508055.page ).

GW now has a new strategy of selling books: Just change one point cost or rule, say it's official, and the book will sell out in no time regardless of the content. Wonder how long this will work.

*Sigh* if they do that, that would be the final straw for me. I hope this doesnt become a new thing. I really reallly hope

Some people are claiming to have received an email that the 2nd printing won't be available until Late March or Early April.

 kronk wrote:
Some people are claiming to have received an email that the 2nd printing won't be available until Late March or Early April.

Sounds like they need to clear printing space to make this happen as they are probably already in gear for the next two months of book releases.

Best thing to do is just work together as a community and make sure people get the rules they need, in my case I've got the digital marine codex and will be taking screenshots for anyone in my gaming group who needs those rules. Sharing of info is definately a way everyone can work together on this while the rules are still restricted.

rigeld2 wrote:

Enceladus wrote:
Thank you.

I did read a few pages but the conversation trailed off so I asked the question directly instead of trolling through 27 pages for a specific post.

So it seems that despite the claim on the official website under the product description that there are 'new army list entries' for several armies, there are in fact none. Can't say i'm surprised considering the state of most GW gaming literature.

Oh well, at least now I know that I don't have to buy the damn thing and can spend my money on more models instead!

Not sure if serious....

Codex Space Marines now has access to the Storm Raven. That'd be a new army list entry.
edit: Also Black Templar. So that'd be two.

Sorry for the misunderstanding, I said this with context to my previous question regarding GK's. The description on the official site for the product reads to suggest there are new army entries for all of the armies mentioned thereafter, including the likes of Blood Angels and Grey Knights, yet there are no new entries for either army which is misleading.

If I wasn't a member of an online community such as Dakka, I perhaps wouldn't have access to the info in this thread, and as a result I may be mislead into believing my army had access to new units for use on the tabletop when in fact it has none, completely wasting my money.

Enceladus wrote:
Sorry for the misunderstanding, I said this with context to my previous question regarding GK's. The description on the official site for the product reads to suggest there are new army entries for all of the armies mentioned thereafter, including the likes of Blood Angels and Grey Knights, yet there are no new entries for either army which is misleading.

If I wasn't a member of an online community such as Dakka, I perhaps wouldn't have access to the info in this thread, and as a result I may be mislead into believing my army had access to new units for use on the tabletop when in fact it has none, completely wasting my money.

Well I don't have the book (obviously) but what they may have done is publish a generic Storm Raven (ie with Stormstrike missiles) and have the upgrade options per Codex (ie Psybolt ammo, Mandatory swap from Stormstrike to Mindstrike missiles for GK).

That would be a new Army List entry, even if it has the same effect as the one in your Codex. Also, the price of upgrades/the base model may have changed. We don't know yet.

So after reading across multiple threads and spotty accounts of what is in the book (as no one seems to be ork focused)

The result for Ork players is:
*DftS has the exact same content as the Digital Chapter Approved: Ork Bomma download, so no changes in points or rules.
*DftS is the same as the WD article with the previous 6th edition FAQ fix applied.

So if you own a digi update You are good, if you have the WD article, you just need a copy of the previous Errata to tape in your WD.

Can anyone provide hard evidence of this? Someone who has the book and is aware of the ork rules?

one part of me is happy that i can use a storm raven and that the storm talon has had it's point cost drop a bit. but finding the new rules is going to be a bit of a pain. if the book had been priced at 25 i would have bought one. i don't mind the 40 or so for a codex. but a 70 page 35 dollar book that only has 2-3 pages i care about is a bit much. with any luck someone i know will buy it.

rigeld2 wrote:

Enceladus wrote:
Sorry for the misunderstanding, I said this with context to my previous question regarding GK's. The description on the official site for the product reads to suggest there are new army entries for all of the armies mentioned thereafter, including the likes of Blood Angels and Grey Knights, yet there are no new entries for either army which is misleading.

If I wasn't a member of an online community such as Dakka, I perhaps wouldn't have access to the info in this thread, and as a result I may be mislead into believing my army had access to new units for use on the tabletop when in fact it has none, completely wasting my money.

Well I don't have the book (obviously) but what they may have done is publish a generic Storm Raven (ie with Stormstrike missiles) and have the upgrade options per Codex (ie Psybolt ammo, Mandatory swap from Stormstrike to Mindstrike missiles for GK).

That would be a new Army List entry, even if it has the same effect as the one in your Codex. Also, the price of upgrades/the base model may have changed. We don't know yet.

All they've done is added a few sections which basically say "GK Stormraven - No changes. Nothing to see here. Refer to the codex." This allows them to name drop the codex in the description to mislead the customer into thinking they get new units and/or rules when in fact they get nothing of the sort.

I won't be buying it because it's useless to me so it's not a personal complaint, I just feel sorry for those that don't play any of the 3 affected armies and are disappointed upon receipt that all they've got are a re-print of the dogfighting rules, new rules for Ork Flyers and a couple of pages that give two armies use of the Stormraven.

I see lots of complaints and refunds in the near future!

So, what I'm getting from all the griping here is that the digital SM codex on my iPad just payed for itself with the rules updates. Now if only my Dark Angels and Necron digital codexes would do the same...

Anyone know if they updated the rules/points cost for the extremely overpriced and essentially ueseless flyers in the DA codex?

Being Dark Angels book is brand new, and this has nothing to do with it at all..... no, no it doesn't
'sides - from what I've heard the Dark Angels flyers aren't that bad, just not especially brilliant.

 Ovion wrote:
Being Dark Angels book is brand new, and this has nothing to do with it at all..... no, no it doesn't
'sides - from what I've heard the Dark Angels flyers aren't that bad, just not especially brilliant.

Nah, they're pretty useless. The bomber is terrible and the fighter is only semi-ways decent with a lascannon, but even then it's totally outclassed by every other flyer in the game.

 Andilus Greatsword wrote:

 Ovion wrote:
Being Dark Angels book is brand new, and this has nothing to do with it at all..... no, no it doesn't
'sides - from what I've heard the Dark Angels flyers aren't that bad, just not especially brilliant.

Nah, they're pretty useless. The bomber is terrible and the fighter is only semi-ways decent with a lascannon, but even then it's totally outclassed by every other flyer in the game.

Better than some.
180pts for AV11 all round, missiles that fire at BS5, a twinlinked heavy bolter and a twinlinked lascannon isn't terrible.
A Voidraven bomber, with what's basically 2 lascannons, and 4 missiles (that would be Str6, ap5, or Str7, ap-) would be 185, for AV11/11/10.
So the Dark Eldar equivalent would cost roughly 215 for the same thing - and you're complaining about this one.

Oh - and according to rumours, the Storm Talon, which was already better armed and armoured than my flyers while being cheaper, just had a points reduction.

Anyone thought oh how this will affect the ETC? If there really are point changes, and with SM and Templars getting new units, then English-speaking teams will be showing up with army lists everyone else will see as illegal. I know it's kind of a small problem and something that they will make their own ruling on, but just something that came to mind.

 MandalorynOranj wrote:
Anyone thought oh how this will affect the ETC? If there really are point changes, and with SM and Templars getting new units, then English-speaking teams will be showing up with army lists everyone else will see as illegal. I know it's kind of a small problem and something that they will make their own ruling on, but just something that came to mind.

bullocks.

Everyone who goes to ETC is at minimum competent enough to keep up to date with latest rules developments online. Using english rulesets is the norm for tournament play in the german language area - so there will be no problem of the likes you describe.

My Review of the Book


At £20, the book is 72 pages long. Softcover, reminiscent of the old Campaign book covers (EG Black Crusade)

The back cover is just a load of pictures of the flyers for sale.

Page 5 - 20: "The Battle of Cadrim" - This looks like a slightly extended version of the section in White Dwarf when the storm talon came out. It includes the same pictures of the White Scars armies etc.

Page 23 - 29: Air War Missions.

Mission 1: Deadly Bridgehead: Space Marines with Necron allies, against Orks.
Mission 2: Scramble; Space Marines V Orks
Mission 3: Aerial Assault: Necrons V orks with Space Marine allies
Mission 4: Death from the Skies: Necrons V Marines

Page 32 - 40: Burning Skies - Looks like a reprint of the Crusade of Fire rules

Page 40 - 55: Gallery pictures

Now we're coming to the important bit

Page 56: StormRaven Beastiary: It includes the FAQ updates. EG, a Dreadnaught taking s10 hits if the flyer explodes and is zooming. The important note is Blood Angels and Grey Knights armies use the rules printed here though their storm ravens have additional wargear options and rules - see the army list for details. Also, new piece of artwork. An ultrasmurf storm raven.

Page 57: Storm Talon: Still 2 HP. It now has the Strafing Run rules. Type (Flyer, Hover). Escort craft rules looks to be clarified to avoid anything BS-ey. Can't escort anything using Outflank / Deepstriking. Plus other stuff. NO supersonic rules

Page 58: Valkyrie/Vendetta: Exactly the same as the IG codex, but with HP's added in - Same as rulebook. Also the Grav Chute Insertion rules have been updated with the FAQ rules

Page 59: VoidRaven/Razorwing: I'm assuming these are the same? Razorwing Armour 10, VoidRaven Armour 11. Night Vision/Supersonic rules

Page 60: DoomScythe: Looks the same as before
Page 61: NightScythe: Broadly the same as before. They clarify the embarked unit doesn't take damage when destroyed. Also they enter through normal reserves? No mention of rembarking on a night scythe... However. "If a night scythe has moved more than 24", the disembarking unit may only fire snap shots."

Page 62: Dakkajet: No Hover. However, Strafing run, supersonic. Fighta Ace upgrade has been renamed to 'flyboss' - it basically gives him Strafing Run against things you don't get strafing run against.... Aside from that, same as before.

Page 63: Burna Bomber, Blitza Bomber: Seems the same as before, with obvious changes. No hover. Supersonic, waaagh plane! Points costs and upgrades are identical to White Dwarf.

Page 64: Wargear. A burna bomb is a bomb... Death Ray looks like it has rules changes... It hurts friendly models too. It can't hurt zooming flyers or flying monstrous creatures.

Page 65: Wargear. Everything looks the same.

Page 66: StormStrike Missiles: I dunno what to say, they actually seem to kick rear end... S8, AP2, concussive...

Page 68: Army List:
Storm Raven: Heavy Support: Yup, marines and templars get storm raven. Nothing for space puppies. Grey Knights and Blood Angels don't get stormstrike missiles. The rest looks broadly similar
Storm Talon: Marines/Black Templars only (typical). Fast Attack. A lot cheaper in points. The most expensive version is 10 points cheaper than before.

Page 69: Army List:
Valkyrie And Vendetta: Identical to earlier rules

Page 70:
Razorwing, Voidraven, Doom Scythe, Night Scythe:
I think these are identical to their normal rules

Page 71: The Ork Flyers: In all honesty, they seem the same as the white dwarf. I think someone with more of an ork brain will need to pick out the diffferences.

Page 72: Summary Page.

------------------

So, there you go. That's what your getting for your £20, and that's what the FLGS' are losing out on.

Edit: So, in summary, it seems only Black Templars and Codex Marines players really need to buy it.

Copying the above post before it might be deleted o/

It shouldn't be... I've not revealed points costs, it's only selected quotes as part of the review process. Just about the only controversial thing I've got is mentioning the stormstrike special rules and the 'ultrasmurf' quip.

I'm pretty sure Legoburner allows people to review products...

I agree with you, but dakka's been really...careful with stuff like that in the past, so I'm just making sure I get to keep the info

So the Storm Talon didn't change point costs?

Wut?

It did, read the last couple of pages, it's there somewhere

So, I ordered and am one of those who got delayed, but I just got an email (4 actually) apologizing and giving me a $25 virtual gift voucher to spend in apology with assurances my book will ship/arrive around March 4th!

GW did good with that I think.

@Compel: Thank you very much!