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Wargamescon Recap

So here is the list I ended up bringing. After much thought, I decided not to make Celestine my warlord. I deliberately traded tactical reliability for some strategic flexibility. I'd rely on the solo laud hailer and LD8 for the dominions leadership tests for Acts of Faith and hope to get army wide buffs via the warlord trait.




Game 1: I played a TWC deathstar supported by a DA librarian conclave led by Ezekial in Emperor's Will. For my warlord trait I rolled "Conqueror of Cities." The move through cover ruins was awesome for this table as there was a big center ruin and several smaller ones my vehicles could now rumble through without penalty. My opponent rolled up two invisibilities, so I choose to go first to try and cripple his death star before he could get them buffed. I scouted the dominions and CCS forward and then did a ton of shooting. I used the transports flatout move to block off most of the direct assault lines to my now disembarked infantry. I actually thought my shooting phase was underwhelming. I only managed to kill off the cyber wolves and sprinkle some wounds around the TWC (I might have killed one as well). The TWC assault my transports but didn't manage to kill one. Ezekial being in the deathstar cost them fleet and prevented them from hitting my infantry in the disrupted charge (he rolled a 5). My surviving infantry hopped back into transports and then fled into all four directions. My goal was to have his deathstar either chase one to stay buffed or break apart so I could pick on individual units. This work pretty good as he broke the TWC apart to chase units and between surviving special weapons and the ranged exorcists, I managed to pick everything off over two turns. Ended up winning 7-4. My opponent won the maelstrom mission because I kept rolling objectives he could easily deny.

Game 2: Played a Necron Decurion in Kill Points. I rolled "Master of Ambush" for my trait and gave infiltrate to both BSS squads, the CCS, and the IG veterans. I then outflanked those four plus all my dominions. The plan was to try to spread the board so I could win Maelstorm and the secondary points to squeeze out a win. I actually had most of my army alive at the end of the game, but was still behind on KP by 3 or 4 points. I rolled poorly for my Maelstorm and my opponent rolled fairly well (lots of hold home objective or kill a unit points) and I ended up losing 10-2.

Game 3: Played the new marine battle company. Poor deployment by my opponent resulted in me tabling him on the bottom of turn 1. 11-0 win.

Game 4: Played a Knight list with a baronial court supported by an Inquisition detachment of a single big DCA retinue in a landraider. Mission was scouring with hammer and anvil deployment. Rolled conqueror of cities for the warlord trait. I outflanked the CCS and the dominions, deployed the wyverns and exorcists in the ruins in my deployment zone and put everyone else in regular reserves. The stealth ruins paid off big this game because the exorcists were sitting in 3+ cover against his knights shooting and I knew I'd take virtually no damage early on. He ended up crowding his knights on the left flank and my rolls allowed all three dominion squads to pop up on that flank in unison on turn two. As a result, I stripped 16 hull points of the three knights in a single shooting phase, killing two and leaving the third crippled. The game turned into a mop up mission from there. I ended up winning 11-1.

Game 5: Played new marines using a White Scars CAD supported by SW champions of Fenris. I used the servo skulls to deny all scout moves and my opponent decided to deploy only his command squad with 3 SW characters, chaptermaster, and Khan attached. My alpha strike knocked 3 wounds off the chaptermaster, 1 wound off Khan, killed all three SW characters, and 2 of the 5 bikers. He killed off some of my infantry in the return assault, but his reserves made a virtual no-show on turn two (he only got a single drop pod with 5 marines and none of his bikes) and that let me concentrate my fire too much for him to handle. Won 11-1.

I finished the tournament at 4-1, with 42 out of 55 possible battle points and 6th overall. Taking the strategic warlord trait paid off huge in 3 of my 5 games and it gave me deployment options in the other two (I rolled +1 to seize, reroll reserves but ended up deploying everything because of the situation). Being able to throw Celestine around with worrying about giving up warlord was fantastic and I don't think I'll change how I use her in the near future. She's much more valuable as a disruption unit to me than as a force multiplier.

The biggest change I need to make is adding repressors. I'll have to drop the inquisitor for most tournaments so finding the points won't be hard. AV12/13 is super tough again now that most shooting needs 6 to damage them. I'm going to keep the 4x plasma CCS for now too. They worked better as a support unit than the Master of Ordnance/Lascannon version with the extra chimera.

Any questions, feel free to ask.

"Game 3: Played the new marine battle company. Poor deployment by my opponent resulted in me tabling him on the bottom of turn 1. 11-0 win. "

Holy crap. What'd he do?

 pretre wrote:
"Game 3: Played the new marine battle company. Poor deployment by my opponent resulted in me tabling him on the bottom of turn 1. 11-0 win. "

Holy crap. What'd he do?

He deployed only three centurions supported by two librarians inside ruins well within scouting melta/plasma range and had only one drop pod come in with a 5 melta command squad. The drop pod landed deep inside my zone to try and kill the wyverns but this meant the marines were surrounded by both BSS squads, Celestine, the AM veterans and all three exorcists. The dominions and CCS killed the centurions and librarians handily with all the ignore cover and AP1/2. The mass flamers killed the command squad in shooting before Celestine even had to charge and the drop pod died to exorcist fire.

My opponent left a second drop pod with 10 tac marines, two 10 man squads with Rhinos, and the flyer formation in reserve. The stormraven had his last librarian and assault centurions embarked on it.

The French names seems a bit… off to me.
A few change I would make would be :
« Le dissipe démon » → « Le dissipe-démon »
« Force de la Pureté Albigenses » → « Force purificatrice Albigeoise » or « Forces de purification des Albigeois » (I had to Wikipedia the reference here).
Should those not be huntresses rather than hunters too?

Ouch.

Great job and thanks for the write up

I'm still giggling over that marine player How embarrassing

Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:The French names seems a bit… off to me.
A few change I would make would be :
« Le dissipe démon » → « Le dissipe-démon »
« Force de la Pureté Albigenses » → « Force purificatrice Albigeoise » or « Forces de purification des Albigeois » (I had to Wikipedia the reference here).
Should those not be huntresses rather than hunters too?

Thanks. I was trying that off high school French from 13 years ago. Definitely making those changes.

MrFlutterPie wrote:Great job and thanks for the write up

I'm still giggling over that marine player How embarrassing

Yeah. It was late in the day and I think he just underestimated how much damage I'd be able to put out.

Great batrep. Poor Marine player. It makes me think of Panzer Leader and the Marine staring awkwardly at each other for a moment before one of them suggests playing another game just to fill the rest of the time slot.

"And, uh, I'll stick with the same deployment to save time, but why don't you, um..."
"Yeah, I'll do this a little differently."

PanzerLeader wrote:
Game 1:I used the transports flatout move to block off most of the direct assault lines to my now disembarked infantry.

Random Note while still reading this:

Are these the Transports from the disembarked Units? Depending on when you disembarked, Flat out is not permitted.

(BrB:If the vehicle had already moved before the unit disembarked, the vehicle cannot move further that turn (including pivoting on the spot, moving Flat Out, Running or charging) )


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Read through, great reports ! I'd just like details on this one:

PanzerLeader wrote:
Game 5: My alpha strike knocked 3 wounds off the chaptermaster, 1 wound off Khan, killed all three SW characters, and 2 of the 5 bikers.

Scouting all 3 Dominion Squads+CCs with Liber forwards, jumping out and melta, plasma + Exorcist fire? Or just a few of those, etc?

PanzerLeader wrote:
Thanks. I was trying that off high school French from 13 years ago.

Nice work then. French is pretty hard ^^. If you have any question, please ask.
By reading again the name of the Exorcists, I think you meant that they were killing ghosts and purging aliens? Here it sounds like the first one is a ghost who is also a killer, and the second one is a foreigner ^^.
I would suggest naming them « Le tueur de fantômes » (possibly « Le tue-fantôme » to keep the same structure as with the other two) and « Le purge-alien » or « Le purge-xénos » (or « Le purge-extraterrestre », but that is a bit long and unwieldy).
The end result would be the French equivalent of « The ghost-killer, the alien-purger and the daemon-dispeller ».

BlackTalos wrote:

PanzerLeader wrote:
Game 1:I used the transports flatout move to block off most of the direct assault lines to my now disembarked infantry.

Random Note while still reading this:

Are these the Transports from the disembarked Units? Depending on when you disembarked, Flat out is not permitted.

(BrB:If the vehicle had already moved before the unit disembarked, the vehicle cannot move further that turn (including pivoting on the spot, moving Flat Out, Running or charging) )


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Read through, great reports ! I'd just like details on this one:

PanzerLeader wrote:
Game 5: My alpha strike knocked 3 wounds off the chaptermaster, 1 wound off Khan, killed all three SW characters, and 2 of the 5 bikers.

Scouting all 3 Dominion Squads+CCs with Liber forwards, jumping out and melta, plasma + Exorcist fire? Or just a few of those, etc?

Whoops. I've been misplaying that for a long time then. Its not something that comes up frequently.

So all the damage was from my entire army in range: scouting dominions and CCS, three exorcists, two chimera multi-lasers and my wyverns. He rolled a little above average on his 3++ save for the chapter master but he also rolled a little below average across the board on FNP so I think it evened out.

Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

PanzerLeader wrote:
Thanks. I was trying that off high school French from 13 years ago.

Nice work then. French is pretty hard ^^. If you have any question, please ask.
By reading again the name of the Exorcists, I think you meant that they were killing ghosts and purging aliens? Here it sounds like the first one is a ghost who is also a killer, and the second one is a foreigner ^^.
I would suggest naming them « Le tueur de fantômes » (possibly « Le tue-fantôme » to keep the same structure as with the other two) and « Le purge-alien » or « Le purge-xénos » (or « Le purge-extraterrestre », but that is a bit long and unwieldy).
The end result would be the French equivalent of « The ghost-killer, the alien-purger and the daemon-dispeller ».

Merci! Changes are being made.

PanzerLeader wrote:

Scouting all 3 Dominion Squads+CCs with Liber forwards, jumping out and melta, plasma + Exorcist fire? Or just a few of those, etc?

Whoops. I've been misplaying that for a long time then. Its not something that comes up frequently.

I kind of know how you feel. 7th is the first time I've played 40k since 3rd Edition, so I keep wanting to assault after disembarking, only assault 6", treat rapid fire as "one shot within 12" if moved", assault after firing rapid fire... >.>

It's going to take a while to break those habits, but I'm getting better. They tend to creep up (other than the only 12" after moving with rapid fire) rather than be a constant thing

PanzerLeader wrote:
Whoops. I've been misplaying that for a long time then. Its not something that comes up frequently.

Yeah, you'd think the Flat-out move is not affected by anything but the shooting phase, however disembarking is one of them.

It gets even more confusing when you can disembark before moving the Transport, and then it can move + Flat out with no restrictions.... So:
Move - Disembark - Flat out. Denied (max move = 6")
Disembark - Move - Flat out. Allowed (max move can be 18" or more with Fast, skimmer...)

Yeah, the first time someone disembarked from a zooming flyer and kept zooming I was confused, but that's totally legal as long as you disembark before the move.

On the condition that said flier has Grav-Chute Insersion, Skies of Blood, or Invasion Beams at any rate. Otherwise it has to go to Hover to let anyone disembark.

Hey,

Can I make repressors out of the immolator kit?

ninepaces wrote:
Hey,

Can I make repressors out of the immolator kit?

They do if you convert them a bit. Follow pretre's advice for a quick simple conversion.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/652950.page

Recent thread on the topic.

PanzerLeader, nice job and great battle reports. Pretre, thanks for those links... I think Repressor conversions are pretty high on my list.

Does anyone get any use out of the formations in the Codex? In particular I'm looking at the Angelic Host. That's the only one I have the models for, but it seems like it might be advantageous in bigger games to have 3x Dominions and 2x Seraphim. Any experience? If so, how do you equip the second squad? I converted Inferno pistols years ago, but I also have enough hand flamers to go that way, and I have some Veteran Superior models to choose from.

Thanks!

Considering those formations are Apoc Only? I've never used them in a normal game.

Given how powerful normal codex formations are today they should just update the edex to say that they can be used in normal 40k.

Would take them 30 seconds to do, build some good rep and might even sell a few models. Win win.

Too bad it will never happen

I hadn't realized there was a distinction. So those Sisters formations are considered too powerful for regular play, but the Space Marine drop pod monstrosity that has whole threads devoted to it is just the direction the game has taken these days? That seems a little lopsided.

No, they aren't considered too powerful for normal play; they are just classified as apocalypse so aren't legal in normal play.

The only one that's really any good is the Retributor one. The others are pretty meh.

They're apoc only because our codex came out before they started doing the formation thing in general play.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The Angelic Host is pretty nice though I would attach some non-sisters ICs maybe? Or have something to reduce scatter.

The ability to reroll Celestine's invuln and also her ability to show up whenever. I wonder if this applies to other ICs attached to these units because RAW they can show up Turn 1 with no roll.

For 475, the angellic host lets you deep strike turn one, and gives celestine a rerollable 4++. it's 21 models and they all get a free automatic act of faith. I'd certainly try it a few times. But.. then i really like the seraphim models.

So I was looking at maybe bringing some DA allies to fill the role of scary bullet sponge distraction unit, but I just realized Celestine would murder Sammael in a challenge. (Which calls into question their utility as a counter-assault unit).

Mavnas wrote:
So I was looking at maybe bringing some DA allies to fill the role of scary bullet sponge distraction unit, but I just realized Celestine would murder Sammael in a challenge. (Which calls into question their utility as a counter-assault unit).

Bring a Ravenwing Strike Force. 1 HQ plus two units of Black Knights = WINNING at the Tiger Blood level. You get rapid fire, twin-linked plasma talons and rending close combat weapons on MEQ bikes with 2 attacks base each that, as a bonus, have scout, skilled rider, and reroll failed jinx saves. A squad of three is 120 points base so you could get two squads of three for 240 points + the HQ. Great support for dominions and very versatile.

PanzerLeader wrote:

Mavnas wrote:
So I was looking at maybe bringing some DA allies to fill the role of scary bullet sponge distraction unit, but I just realized Celestine would murder Sammael in a challenge. (Which calls into question their utility as a counter-assault unit).

Bring a Ravenwing Strike Force. 1 HQ plus two units of Black Knights = WINNING at the Tiger Blood level. You get rapid fire, twin-linked plasma talons and rending close combat weapons on MEQ bikes with 2 attacks base each that, as a bonus, have scout, skilled rider, and reroll failed jinx saves. A squad of three is 120 points base so you could get two squads of three for 240 points + the HQ. Great support for dominions and very versatile.

Sammael is a 200 point tax I'm not willing to pay (Because he's not sturdy enough to alleviate my need for a melee monster who can distract my enemies while Celestine mirders their troops.) And the black knights will also crumble in melee against anything dedicated to the role. The rerollable jink is nice but makes the talons a waste. For the same price I could get double the rending attacks out of TWC.

Mavnas wrote:

PanzerLeader wrote:

Mavnas wrote:
So I was looking at maybe bringing some DA allies to fill the role of scary bullet sponge distraction unit, but I just realized Celestine would murder Sammael in a challenge. (Which calls into question their utility as a counter-assault unit).

Bring a Ravenwing Strike Force. 1 HQ plus two units of Black Knights = WINNING at the Tiger Blood level. You get rapid fire, twin-linked plasma talons and rending close combat weapons on MEQ bikes with 2 attacks base each that, as a bonus, have scout, skilled rider, and reroll failed jinx saves. A squad of three is 120 points base so you could get two squads of three for 240 points + the HQ. Great support for dominions and very versatile.

Sammael is a 200 point tax I'm not willing to pay (Because he's not sturdy enough to alleviate my need for a melee monster who can distract my enemies while Celestine mirders their troops.) And the black knights will also crumble in melee against anything dedicated to the role. The rerollable jink is nice but makes the talons a waste. For the same price I could get double the rending attacks out of TWC.

So you don't really want a counter assault force then. You want a true melee unit. Black knights are the epitome of a counter assault force because they are fast, shooty and between HoW and S5 rending decently choppy.

For a pure melee unit, I'd do either a DW strike force centered around death wing knights or a simple marine allied detachment with assault terminators. Both have the all important 3++ and can drop a ton of AP2/3 close combat attacks. The DW would let you bring Belial and his I5 flesh bane attacks and with the marines you could bring a chapter master.

PanzerLeader wrote:

Mavnas wrote:

PanzerLeader wrote:

Mavnas wrote:
So I was looking at maybe bringing some DA allies to fill the role of scary bullet sponge distraction unit, but I just realized Celestine would murder Sammael in a challenge. (Which calls into question their utility as a counter-assault unit).

Bring a Ravenwing Strike Force. 1 HQ plus two units of Black Knights = WINNING at the Tiger Blood level. You get rapid fire, twin-linked plasma talons and rending close combat weapons on MEQ bikes with 2 attacks base each that, as a bonus, have scout, skilled rider, and reroll failed jinx saves. A squad of three is 120 points base so you could get two squads of three for 240 points + the HQ. Great support for dominions and very versatile.

Sammael is a 200 point tax I'm not willing to pay (Because he's not sturdy enough to alleviate my need for a melee monster who can distract my enemies while Celestine mirders their troops.) And the black knights will also crumble in melee against anything dedicated to the role. The rerollable jink is nice but makes the talons a waste. For the same price I could get double the rending attacks out of TWC.

So you don't really want a counter assault force then. You want a true melee unit. Black knights are the epitome of a counter assault force because they are fast, shooty and between HoW and S5 rending decently choppy.

For a pure melee unit, I'd do either a DW strike force centered around death wing knights or a simple marine allied detachment with assault terminators. Both have the all important 3++ and can drop a ton of AP2/3 close combat attacks. The DW would let you bring Belial and his I5 flesh bane attacks and with the marines you could bring a chapter master.

Termis lack mobility.

What I use is a force that can charge the biggest, baddest enemy unit and live. Not necessarily kill it, but tie it up. On the way in should draw fire away from my doms and my BSS who then get to survive long enough to get into Melta range. With celestine there, I can hit and run to break off, split her off to cause havoc in the enemy back field while my melee unit ties theirs back up. It's worked decently well. At first I was impressed with rerollable jink from Ravenwing, but the more I think about it, the more I think it's a recipe for them getting meleed down while my sisters eat a lot of the enemy firepower. I need a unit that is vulnerable/scary enough that the enemy is willing to focus on it (even while there's 12 melta guns moving towards him in squishy metal boxes).

The SM CM with shield eternal isn't very killy. Or at least not with me rolling. (I've been known to inflict 1-2 wounds with 4 TH attacks), but he can tie up a lot of enemies usually.

That said, if I can up my painting rate, I could try a knight soonish, though I think it would actually be more vulnerable to enemy S10 attacks and easier to Tar Pit (since I can't attach Celestine).

What I really want to try is a Wolf Lord on a Thunderwolf with the Black Death. That should be 10 S7AP2 attacks on the charge as long as he's outnumbered, but he won't be an EW and will strike at I, and his unit needs to be smallish if I want him to get all his attacks. (If the enemy doesn't have too many uber melee guys, I could see him and Celestine by themselves putting out 16 attacks on the charge and making anyone without an AP2 weapon sad.)