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It's power armor. 3+ save.
Unless you want to change the fluff that's been around since 2nd ed.

Why not? It's not like Sisters are some sort of cash cow that needs to be protected. It's not like a minor stat change or two would cause any measurable drop in GW profits or revenue.

Chaos sacred numbers are older than that, and they got changed just because. Power weapons got a major overhaul not that long ago. Lots of stuff changes. That's the nature of the game.

Heck, GW could write tomorrow that the Grey Knights ritually sacrifice all of the remaining Sisters for their blood, and that'd be that.

Well, the major factions are all done now, except Necrons, which pretty much everyone expects early 2015. And, there were a lot of the supplements, plus 2014 was good to campaign types.

So I don't see why there wouldn't be some Sisters love next year

It would certainly be an easier way to get some cash out of players than to say, start up 8th edition

... history tells us that GW conveniently forgets the faction exists. Sometimes for a decade at a time.

Huh? 7th had to have been a strong cash grab for GW. If GW is really hot for people's wallets, we'll see 8th edition in 2016.

Same thing with the push for high dollar "must have" kits like Knights.

Still, if Sisters are on the plate for next year, with new plastics, that'd be great. And it's not like GW can't do it...

Heck, they could charge $60 for 10, and it'd be better.

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
No, not really. Holding on to the straw of Sisters deserving a 3+ save is [...] an archaic relic that makes no sense in game.

False. It's body-encompassing, hermetically sealed, military-grade power armor. Ergo, it makes perfect sense for it to have a 3+ save.

Your bizarre retcons are what lacks sense, you're kind of making stuff up that doesn't fit either the lore OR the game in order to justify the proposed nerf you want.

Fair enough, then. I look forward to Eldar Guardians having a similar 3+ save.

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
Fair enough, then. I look forward to Eldar Guardians having a similar 3+ save.

Your analogy failed. Eldar technology is vastly different from Imperial technology.

Psienesis wrote:Space Marine PA is "inches thick"... but hollow.

Well, "up to an inch", at least last time a Marine codex described it in that level of detail.

/nitpick

Aside from the space occupied by internal subsystems as you mentioned, I noticed a lot of people forgetting just how big Space Marines actually are. As if there'd be some normal dude in the suit, and the rest was all armour. People need to make up their minds.

Psienesis wrote:(alternately, it's a leather corset placed over the actual ceramite breastplate, I've seen it modeled that way, too.)

Yeah, if you look closely at the Repentia Mistress, she actually has the PA without the "corset" dust cover, so you can see the exposed lamellar below - quite similar to that one piece of artwork in the 3E codex. And then there's the Canoness who wears a metal plackart above the lamellar instead.

In fairness, it always looked more like power-lingerie with a corset. But divorce the issue from the fluff for a minute - necron warriors used to have 3+ and got bumped down to 4+, so it could happen. Whatever fluff contradicts this possibility can be easily retconned.

All I wish for Sisters in 2015 is new stuff. No more status quo books that are put out to remove things from a shrinking model line or a lack of new stuff.

I'm not asking for it to be the best thing ever or even for it to hold all the old lore true. At this point if they needed to retcon the army and revamp them visually to make the kits work better I can live with that.

What I can't stand though is them just in this slowly decaying orbit around the drain. Either pull the plug or put something out already GW.

Hell you just did a bunch of Nid releases, you could easily do the same for Sisters with some new options (like maybe a Rhino with an uparmored front so it has AV12, TL Avenger Mega Bolter and the Fast rule and call it the the Purifier or something).

At least that. At least some small options trickled in to give that army some new toys would be something you could already be doing.

Just no more waiting already.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Torga_DW wrote:
In fairness, it always looked more like power-lingerie with a corset. But divorce the issue from the fluff for a minute - necron warriors used to have 3+ and got bumped down to 4+, so it could happen. Whatever fluff contradicts this possibility can be easily retconned.

Necron Immortals still have a 3+ though. It just balanced the Warriors out better and justified making them cheaper points wise.

 ClockworkZion wrote:
At least that. At least some small options trickled in to give that army some new toys would be something you could already be doing.

Just no more waiting already.

Do not count on it. Find something else to be excited for. Find something else to wait for. Then, if some sisters get release, nice surprise. If not, and that is very, very, very likely, you will not get disappointed.
I got myself into waiting for Horde trollbloods with guns. I got an awesome character warbeast that is special issue with my warcaster and fit the theme of “Trolls with guns, military cap, cigars and an attitude” just perfectly. If I had stayed with Sisters, I would have had… some fluff references and new illustrations in Shield of Baal?

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
There is a very small number of people who very much love Sisters. The problem is that their supporters are very, very few, and they don't buy much stuff.

I'd buy more Sisters stuff, but there's really very little... well, almost nothing left that I would use but don't already have.

I have a Command Squad, two Canonesses, a Battle Conclave, a Preacher, a Confessor, two Penitent Engines, two Exorcists, three Rhino chassis capable of being either Rhinos or Immolators, a big squad of Repentia (from when they could come in squads of 20), 10 Seraphim, and enough Superiors, special and heavy weapons to outfit 4 10-woman squads with a variety of loadouts and enough left over to make a Retributor Squad. I don't use Flyers in my games, so adding some air support from Forge World is out.

For a few years, I was expanding my Sisters army rather quickly. Then I got my first Exorcist, built it, and came up empty when trying to think of what to get next. Since then, the only additions to my Sisters have been a custom-made Banner Bearer (not that Simulacrum that GW relabeled as a Banner Bearer), a second Exorcist, and a customized Jacobus stand-in. Because really, there's nothing left to get that wouldn't just be "because I felt like spending money."


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Psienesis wrote:
... history tells us that GW conveniently forgets the faction exists. Sometimes for a decade at a time.

That can't be true. Someone has to make the decision to take down the miniatures from the webstore a few at a time.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
It's OK. It's not like GW reads this and takes business direction from the scions and luminaries on Dakka, such as ourselves.

BTW, looking waay back, I seem to recall Charlies Angels on TV, and Foxy Brown in the theatres. "kickass girls with guns", indeed.

No, no, they definitely have people reading this forum.

A couple of years ago, I got a WD in the mail a few days early. Took some photos once I realized I had early info I could share with people, uploaded the photos to Photobucket, posted them here and nowhere else.

Then after an hour or two of trying to get better photos with a craptastic camera in the dark of night (lamps only go so far) and slowly getting the message pounded into me by fellow forumgoers that even though I know for an absolute fact that something is true because I hold it in my hands, it's still considered a "rumor" on the Internet and should be "taken with a mountain of salt", I went to bed.

Woke up the next morning and found a tasty treat in my e-mail - GW's lawyer team had sent a Cease and Desist order to get those photos taken off of Photobucket and had gotten it through within 3 hours of my posting those photos here.

So yes, they read these forums.

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:
At least that. At least some small options trickled in to give that army some new toys would be something you could already be doing.

Just no more waiting already.

Do not count on it. Find something else to be excited for. Find something else to wait for. Then, if some sisters get release, nice surprise. If not, and that is very, very, very likely, you will not get disappointed.
I got myself into waiting for Horde trollbloods with guns. I got an awesome character warbeast that is special issue with my warcaster and fit the theme of “Trolls with guns, military cap, cigars and an attitude” just perfectly. If I had stayed with Sisters, I would have had… some fluff references and new illustrations in Shield of Baal?

I'm not counting on anything, I'm wishlisting on Sisters.

And right now I'm working on a Nid army in my free time. Hivefleet Kraken with a Space Hulk basing theme.

 Pouncey wrote:

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
There is a very small number of people who very much love Sisters. The problem is that their supporters are very, very few, and they don't buy much stuff.

I'd buy more Sisters stuff, but there's really very little... well, almost nothing left that I would use but don't already have.

 JohnHwangDD wrote:
It's OK. It's not like GW reads this and takes business direction from the scions and luminaries on Dakka, such as ourselves.

No, no, they definitely have people reading this forum.

Woke up the next morning and found a tasty treat in my e-mail - GW's lawyer team had sent a Cease and Desist order to get those photos taken off of Photobucket and had gotten it through within 3 hours of my posting those photos here.

So yes, they read these forums.

Same, I've got a full Sisters Allies contingent (HQ, Elite, 2 Troops, Fast & Heavy), with loads of swap-in Heavy / Special weapons models. While I could add more Transports, there's no real incentive for that.

While GW scours fora for IP, my point was that they don't take business direction from Dakka (or anywhere else, for that matter). The lack of changes despite well over a decade of complaints shows this to be completely true. OTOH, stand up to them in court, and prove them wrong, and yeah, that gets their attention in a huge way.

With 2.5k of Sisters myself, I only find myself coming up short for Apoc games, so I stopped needing to buy more Sisters stuff.

I look forward to the day when that's not a problem anymore and I can actually expand my army and do new things with it, but for now I'll deal with what I've got.

Torga_DW wrote:In fairness, it always looked more like power-lingerie with a corset.

Are you referring to the models or the artworks? And if the latter, do you mean those by GW or others? As I noticed there can be quite a difference.

And sure, in theory you could retcon their fluff and make them less elite, but why would you want to mess with their image and turn the Sisters into Guardsmen+1? That niche is already occupied by Storm Troopers, methinks. Also, as much as GW seems to like to appear as if they have forgotten about this army's existence, in the past they have been pretty consistent as presenting them as "equals to their brother Space Marines", to quote the website. Of course it is not impossible that they re-think their stance on this subject, but at the same time, how likely is it, and what would it actually achieve?

Unless their goal would be to make them even more unpopular ... hm!

Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:Do not count on it. Find something else to be excited for. Find something else to wait for. Then, if some sisters get release, nice surprise. If not, and that is very, very, very likely, you will not get disappointed.

Wisdom.

 Lynata wrote:
Also, as much as GW seems to like to appear as if they have forgotten about this army's existence, in the past they have been pretty consistent as presenting them as "equals to their brother Space Marines", to quote the website.

“[…]Each of the Tyranid brood that scurried into the open was torn to pieces, shredded by more bolter fire than an entire company of Space Marines could hope to muster.[…]”
Shield of Baal: Leviathan.

Ha! I love it.

"Hey, Astartes! Maybe you'd hit more 'nids if you took your fething chainsword out of your arse and focused on your fething bolter!"

 Lynata wrote:

Torga_DW wrote:In fairness, it always looked more like power-lingerie with a corset.

Are you referring to the models or the artworks? And if the latter, do you mean those by GW or others? As I noticed there can be quite a difference.

The models. Mainly from models like this http://www.games-workshop.com/en-AU/Sisters-of-Battle-Superior-with-Power-Sword-and-Bolter and this http://www.games-workshop.com/en-AU/Sisters-of-Battle-Superior-with-Bolter where there's an obvious corset and lots of cloth, but it tends to breakup the power armour to the point that it looks a bit like uncomfortable and slightly-dangerous lingerie gone awry. Then you get the more basic trooper where the gun obscures the torso http://www.games-workshop.com/en-AU/Battle-Sisters and look at their hands: they're big leather gloves, not marine-style gauntlets. It just leads me to an impression that they're not suitably dressed for either the bedroom or the battlefield. Ymmv.

If you go back 20 years to when those models were first cast, you will notice that Space Marine gloves looked almost exactly the same.

http://store.wargamingtrader.com/system/files/imagecache/product_full/M2650%20-%20Mk.%202%20Space%20Marine%20Devastators%20x%204%20-%201992%20%20%20%20%2011-07-4.jpg seems to disagree. The closest i can find to 'gloves' are the plastic khornies & milk http://sigur.tabletopgeeks.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/18/gallery/chaos-space-marines/squad1.jpg only their gloves still look like power-armoured gloves and not leather gloves.

I'm not trying to diss on the sisters of battle, i'm just saying (in my personal opinion) that the amount of cloth they have on their models makes it look like they're not wearing full power armour and hints at only a few key pieces.

Which means nothing, since it's cloth laid over the armor for ceremonial reasons, much like their robes. Or do you think that Dark Angels don't have as good armor because of the cloth on theirs?

Dark angels look like they're wearing robes over power armour. Like i said the sisters look like they're wearing cloth instead of power armour. No need to take it personally, i went out of my way to say it was just my personal opinion.

 Torga_DW wrote:
Dark angels look like they're wearing robes over power armour.

Just like Sisters look like they're wearing robes and decorative cloth over power armor.