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Hey all,

I've followed 40k and have been modeling for a long time, but I'm still very new to the game itself. I recently started to put together a real army... and it's Imperial Knights. I know that they've been getting a lot of flak, but the models are just too cool, and I bought some pre-owned but unbuilt FW Knight variants, so my army should be at least a LITTLE more varied than the standard Knight/Paladin squad.

However, while I'm mostly building these for the modeling potential, I do still want to enjoy the game, and I've heard that pure Knights become rather monotonous to both play and play against. In the interest of keeping the game fun and interesting, I was looking at some of the allies I could take to fill out my ranks as well as give me some more tools. I was almost set on Scions when I remembered that I absolutely loved the Sisters and their models. My question is: Would sisters mesh reasonably with a Knight Lance if taken in small numbers? Are there specific Sisters units that would be a 'must-have' if I was running them with Knights? Anything that I absolutely should not take?

At the end of the day, I'm not trying to build a tournament list, I'm building this to have an army that's fun to build and play, but I would like to have a list that doesn't just get stomped because of my rookie choices.

If it helps, my tentative knight list uses the Knightly ranks rule, a Cerastus Acheron as my Lance Commander and Seneschal, a Knight Errant using Gerantius' special rules, and a Knight Paladin/other knight/whatever one I build first.

Knights are not Fun ... To Play against

Thank you for that wonderful contribution. That really sheds some light on how I can pair up Sisters with all the Knights I already bought, painted, and are going to continue to buy because they're fun to build and paint. I already mentioned that I've heard they're not fun to play against, but I appreciate that you restated it, since I had forgotten already.

If you enjoyed building and painting them then you shouldn't have any problem just putting them on display and not ruining the game for your opponents..

But seriously you're bringing 3 knights, it doesn't matter what else you bring. If you win or lose its not going to be because of the SoB you have.

So a couple things you could do:

-Battle Conclaves (That's the Death Cult Assassin/Crusader ones). These don't take up any force org slot, but are limited to no more than one per priest. One of these or more could keep an enemy assault unit away from your knights or counter assault them. Knights are tough, but they don't fare all that well against enemy power armor or better. (The chainsword excels at cutting through low model count, high cost units, not so much some tacticals with melta bombs, and stomps are AP4.)

-20 BSS squad with Uriah Jacobus. If you make Uriah your warlord, they all get a 5++ save, and the blob is fearless. Useful for preventing the enemy for drop podding in melta too close to your knights, and Uriah makes them all Fearless and potentially gives rerolls to saves or wound in melee.

-Exorcists: Cheap long range fire power. Let's face it knights aren't actually good at popping large numbers of vehicles. Take the melta template for example: It's got an OK chance to pop a landraider. Fire it at a Rhino and it has only slightly more of a chance. Faced with a heavily mechanized enemy, the knights would be hard pressed to pop enemy transports fast enough to get at the squads inside.

There's a few other things you can take, but honestly it's a bit of a question of what kind of opposition you face.

@CrownAxe: Look, if you don't want to take a game with me, then don't take a game with me. It's ridiculous to think that I should put mounds of effort into building and painting some completely legitimate game pieces and then be expected to shelf them because I'm going to ruin the game for everyone I play with. And whether I'm taking 1 knight or 5 knights, I'd like at least a modicum of insight because I'm very, very green.

@Mavnas: Thank you, this is exactly what I was looking for! I like the idea of having some battle conclaves - having a couple of those for dealing with tarpits/splitting off to take objectives would be excellent in conjunction with the knights. Would I also take repressors for said Conclaves? One of my concerns with doing a knight-heavy army is that I will be outmaneuvered too easily - and having more squads of troops just footslogging seems like it would be problematic.

Throwing in an exorcist or two would be a solid idea as well. I'm thinking that with the big "shoot me!" sign that knights come with as free wargear, exorcists would probably be able to do some good damage without worrying about getting focused down too easily.

I'm not really concerned with tailoring a list for a specific opponent, more just to mix the game up a bit, make it more enjoyable, as well as fill out some of the weaknesses that running a knight-heavy army comes with. I do really, really like the idea of Battle Conclaves. Crusaders are excellent models, and Rebel minis makes some "Earth Force Valkyries" That would look killer as Crusader counts-as.

[

 SweaterKittens wrote:
Hey all,


However, while I'm mostly building these for the modeling potential, I do still want to enjoy the game, and I've heard that pure Knights become rather monotonous to both play and play against. In the interest of keeping the game fun and interesting, I was looking at some of the allies I could take to fill out my ranks as well as give me some more tools. I was almost set on Scions when I remembered that I absolutely loved the Sisters and their models. My question is: Would sisters mesh reasonably with a Knight Lance if taken in small numbers? Are there specific Sisters units that would be a 'must-have' if I was running them with Knights? Anything that I absolutely should not take?

At the end of the day, I'm not trying to build a tournament list, I'm building this to have an army that's fun to build and play, but I would like to have a list that doesn't just get stomped because of my rookie choices

If it helps, my tentative knight list uses the Knightly ranks rule, a Cerastus Acheron as my Lance Commander and Seneschal, a Knight Errant using Gerantius' special rules, and a Knight Paladin/other knight/whatever one I build first.

A Fun List to Play is not standing any Chance against a List with an acheron, and 3 other knights.
So maybe its Fun for you but definitely not for your Opponent.
Bringing assasins with this choices makes it only worse.
What Kind of SOB Your Taking doesnt matter. This List will Never ever get stomped...
One thing to think about...
If i Would pick up a game against you and i Would Face those knights i Would definitely loosing.
In the next game i Would bring a marauder destroyer and 6 vendettas or 1 tigershark and 3 barracudas or spam other anti tank flyers...i also Would bring an aegis for better reserves, a voidraven shield Generator and a Landung Pad so 1 Flyer can Begin game turn 1.
SOB Lack anti air, so do knights.
Maybe think aboutthis

Don't listen to the whiners about the Knights, yes they are powerful but they're not impossible to take down. I've taken out a 5-Knight army with... "gasp" non-bike ultramarines, and no airplanes.

On that note, Knights need anti-air support big time. Now normally I'd say that sisters aren't the best for that specific purpose BUT since you like FW stuff get your hands on 2-3 Avenger Strike fighters to fill up your heavies, at 150 points they sport the very good avenger bolt cannon, 2 lascannons, front AV12 and strafing run USR.

Now since your Knights got the firepower section covered, I would also look into repressors to carry your sisters around, they don't have the TLMM of an immolator but come with a heavy flamer, transport of 10, 4 fire ports, and a front AV 13 which will go a long way to carry your sisters safely around the battlefield.

Your basic BSS with 2 meltaguns or flamer/heavy-flamer combo is the mainstay of the army.

I second Jacobus' choice, as well as other Priests as they are a very inexpensive way to make your squads fearless and give them a nice boost in CC.

Outflanking, ignore cover, 4 meltaguns, Dominion squads are popular too.

The rest of the units tend to be a bit lackluster, they have a lot of cool rules but tend to shoot themselves in the foot with awkward game mechanics or logistics (like no assault vehicles, no rapid deployment methods, etc...)

Hope this helps you in your choices.

Repressors with 4 melta doms would also be pretty solid, you could present an AV13 4++/ 6++ wall to the enemy. I'm not sure if you need anti-air, zooming flyers won't score and you can just wipe enemy ground forces and the play the objectives game. Unless the enemy is spamming flyers, they won't do much more than strip the odd hull point from a knight.

The other thing you could bring is 4 heavy flamer retributors. They will eat up one of your heavy supprt slots, but you get some anti-horde defense. Alternatively you could take a cannoness instead of Uriah and get 4 heavy flamers in a command squad along with the banner that would give all friendlies within 12" including the knights +1A. It's a thing I always want to bring, but never can quite fit into my lists because they're not that assault heavy.

I would advocate for Immie/Rhino spam with min squad Battle Sisters, max squad Dominions, and max Exorcists. Ignore flyers as shooting targets, while placing your units in the way of where the flyers can move to while zooming. Burn everything on the ground. Win.

SJ

You like to model more than play so I will go with that in mind for this post. Ie... Not super competitive, but awesome figs.

1. Penetint engines! These things are wonderful figures with the tragic flaw of horrible rules. Would go well with the knights and would be fun to play as well. Frankly they would even work better as your opponent would have bigger things to deal with.

2. Priests. With the knights on the field I would go to town with priests. Zealots with knights, what's not to love!

3. Repentia. If you do go the priests route then repentia would go well.

As for other stuff, the exorcists and avenger strike fighter both are crazy rare relics that I could see a knight family having. Could work and both are good figs and quite effective on the field

Wow thanks for all the tips guys! This definitely gives me enough to work with for a while!

@War: I have always loved the style and models of the Penitent Engine and the Repentia, and that's a great idea to partner up with my knights. I will probably end up doing Battle Conclaves so priests are a good possibility.

@Jeffersonian: I didn't think about completely ignoring fliers, and instead just mopping up everything on the ground. I'll have to play with both tactics and see which one suits me, depending on whatever the meta over here turns out to be.

@Mavnas: My only concern with bringing Repressors/Immolators and Melta doms is that I've got plenty of long-range anti-vehicular firepower from my knights (or at least I think I do) and I'm worried that if I bring too many more dedicated anti-tank units, I'll just get bogged down by tarpits and copious infantry. I'm hoping to have the Acheron's board-sweeping flamethrower do most of the clean-up for hordes, though.

I like the idea of Heavy Flamer Retributors. I'm not too concerned with filling up slots, since the knights are going to be my main force, and whatever I bring of Sisters will just be a small contingent.

@Phoenix Darkus: Thanks man, I appreciate it. Despite having not yet played, I love watching battle reports, and I consistently see knights getting stomped. I mean, they're not bad units by any stretch, but they're certainly beatable.

That is a solid observation, I do indeed love FW stuff. I also got a guy who sells pre-owned FW stuff at a fraction, so 2-3 of those bad boys shouldn't be too hard on my wallet. Avengers are a damn cool model, too


I really appreciate all the tips and advice, this gives me a lot to work with. I think I'll play around with builds, and probably get most of the models suggested just because they're so damn cool! I've got this guy picked out for my Jacobus/priest counts-as :http://www.ragingheroes.com/collections/si-fi/products/tarja-yaga-soul-weaver-kst?variant=1045413052. And these ladies for priests/crusaders/repentia counts-as: http://ep.yimg.com/ca/I/yhst-51356505839231_2272_78091999. I'll definitely be posting pics when they're done. Thanks again!

Wouldn't the Grey Knights just kill the Sisters of Battle and coat their armor with their blood?

Nah, everyone knows that grey knights are uncorruptible and therefore any that would engage in such a practice would be immediately purged by the chapter.

Sorry to come in a bit late to this thread but I definitely have a few cents to throw in. First, don't listen to people telling you not to play knights. Play the army you want to play and enjoy the game the way you want to enjoy it. I run a knight list with Elysian allies and my friends and I still have a great time.

From my experience with knights, and especially with the list you are running, you don't have as much ranged anti-vehicle as you think you do. It's not a huge deal because you can usually run them down and destroy them with your sword and stomp. However, those three large blasts don't always get the job done. I have more luck with my swords than I do with the cannons. Basically, in a four knight list that I run, trying to pop vehicles slows me down a lot more than I'd like. Sisters can help a lot with the exorcist. Man, I love that thing.

Your other issue is anti-air. Knights are super vulnerable to it because your knights will have virtually no answer to it. The only real answer we have is the Castigator and that is way too much to spend just to shoot down some flyers. Once again, Sisters to the rescue. Avengers ASSEMBLE!!! (couldn't resist) Seriously, so much resin, but not a bad model, actually. The Elysians can have the Avenger as well so I run one in my list and I love it. I run it with autocannon upgrades. That's something like 4 str7 shots, 2 str 9 shots, and whatever that crazy gatlin gun puts out as well. I can never remember its stats. 7 str 6 shots or something like that. Either way, you're killing whatever flyer you come in on AND you get to start popping light armor for your knights to get at the gooey innards. Once the vehicles are gone, that guy is still great against infantry as well. It's just a good flyer.

As far as your troops are concerned... I'm out. I run the minimum of troops and hq just to get the flyers so I don't really have any advice or ideas there.

Good luck with your army. Sisters and Knights seem like such a cool thing to see on the table and I'd love to see some pictures once you get it together.

war wrote:
Nah, everyone knows that grey knights are uncorruptible and therefore any that would engage in such a practice would be immediately purged by the chapter.

IKR? Only a sexist donkey-cave would write something like that. Almost as crazy as a Grey Knight running around in the warp killing daemons left and right.

We like to call it a "Hexigramic Ward".

SJ

Sisters + Knights = awesome. Exalted!

That's not a substantive comment, just me fanboying out. When you get 'em painted up, post pics!

PS: I homebrewed a Sororitas Knight in my fandex. It can Deep Strike. On top of things.

I was just involved in a game with Sisters + Imperial Knight (+ Space Marines).

This was the list that was used:



1850 Sisters of Battle + Space Marines Allies

St. Celestine

5x Battle Sisters - 2x Meltas, Rhino w/Dozers
5x Battle Sisters - 2x Meltas, Rhino
5x Battle Sisters - 2x Meltas, Rhino
5x Battle Sisters - 2x Meltas, Rhino

5x Dominions - 2x Meltas, Rhino

Knight Cerastus Castigator

Space Marine Allies:

Sevrin Loth

10x Tactical Marines - Veteran Sergeant, Combi-melta, Melta, Multi-melta, Meltabombs, Drop Pod
10x Tactical Marines - Veteran Sergeant, Combi-melta, Melta, Multi-melta, Meltabombs, Drop Pod

5x Assault Marines - Veteran Sergeant, 2x Flamers, Meltabombs, Drop Pod


You can check out my battle report here for some insight into some tactics (report not completed yet but will be in a couple of days).

1850 Competitive - AV13 Necrons vs Sisters of Battle w/Space Marine Allies

 jy2 wrote:
I was just involved in a game with Sisters + Imperial Knight (+ Space Marines).

This was the list that was used:

Dat paint

 jeffersonian000 wrote:
I would advocate for Immie/Rhino spam with min squad Battle Sisters, max squad Dominions, and max Exorcists. Ignore flyers as shooting targets, while placing your units in the way of where the flyers can move to while zooming. Burn everything on the ground. Win.

SJ

Looks like my contribution is already covered.

My opinion, I don't remembed what they're called but I love SoB's so I encourage running them with knights no problems!..

Like I said.. dont remember what they're called, but I'd run as many jump pack sisters as possible to grab objectives while Knights eliminate the threats.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
On an outside note, I always love seeing Pretre comments

The sisters of Battle you sold me are doing some fun things on the board from time to time.

Holy wow, thanks for all the responses! I figured this thread had gone the way of the Dodo, but I'm glad to hear more input (and support )

@Lanternricky: Thank you for the support! And I always like to hear about people having played similar lists and still having a good time. The more I hear about Exorcists, the more I'm thinking I'll incorporate a few into my list. I've always been hesitant to take 'artillery' type units like that seem to just be asking to be shot at - but with knights, they definitely won't be the biggest target. As I mentioned before, I'm really loving the Avenger model, so I think I'll incorporate at LEAST one into whatever list I end up with. With so few units, increasing my unit count can only alleviate pressure on my knights.

@SisterSydney: Thanks! And that Knight Angelus. I just... I might... I might have to incorporate that. And convert a Cerastus for that. It's too awesome. You had me at death from above <3

@Jy2: Ooooo, a Castigator, I haven't seen a batrep with one of those yet. Thank you for posting this! I'll definitely be taking a look at the report

@Pyeatt: No one has suggested Seraphim yet, that's a great idea too. Goes along with a similar idea to having battle conclaves - that is, something to deal with tarpits and snag objectives while the knights open a holy/unholy can of whoop-ass on the rest of their team.

I can't tell you how helpful this all is. It has definitely narrowed my options down and given me some great ideas.

Considering your codex has like 5 units in it, these days...

I've used Seraphim as 12" moving "screen" for my Knight, armed with Hand Flamers to suppress Pods. They work fine. However, Dominions work better for popping Wave Serpents and killing other units abusing cover saves with their massed Melta + Act of Faith.

SJ

 jeffersonian000 wrote:
I've used Seraphim as 12" moving "screen" for my Knight, armed with Hand Flamers to suppress Pods. They work fine. However, Dominions work better for popping Wave Serpents and killing other units abusing cover saves with their massed Melta + Act of Faith.

SJ

Yeah, I would go with target overload (which is generally how I run sisters). Too many targets and too many threats for your opponent to concentrate on one.