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With the CSM rumours I thought, finally were getting a bit closer to the pack again, but this is just sad. As CSM we have the worst powers ever (Tzeentch is horrible), but now at least loyalist Space Marines, famous for their psychic power, get 28 new powers to reflect that their the "bestest at magicks".

With the likely unavoidable nerf to Tzeentch daemons relic for the 2++ rerolable I dont get how this happens. Really? Marines get the superinvul now? Over the god who can let his minions see the future? I thought we were getting over that part of the game.

The area I play in already over the top on power level, and at this rate I will have to get a titan to stay in it with CSM+FW traitor guard.

 Disciple of Fate wrote:
With the CSM rumours I thought, finally were getting a bit closer to the pack again, but this is just sad. As CSM we have the worst powers ever (Tzeentch is horrible), but now at least loyalist Space Marines, famous for their psychic power, get 28 new powers to reflect that their the "bestest at magicks".

With the likely unavoidable nerf to Tzeentch daemons relic for the 2++ rerolable I dont get how this happens. Really? Marines get the superinvul now? Over the god who can let his minions see the future? I thought we were getting over that part of the game.

The area I play in already over the top on power level, and at this rate I will have to get a titan to stay in it with CSM+FW traitor guard.

Don't worry, those Loyalist players will likely now hand wave away everything by simply pointing out that CSM's just got re-printings of our two supplements, which include nothing new beyond a handful of useless formations and a single Psychic power that requires at least 400pts of Sorcerers just to access it.

Within a couple of weeks, I'm sure we'll be hearing the cries of "OMG! Chaos is soooooooo ****ing OP!!!11!1!!!1", because this one time, a squad of Gravcents turned around and shot a bike squad off the table.

Experiment 626 wrote:

 Disciple of Fate wrote:
With the CSM rumours I thought, finally were getting a bit closer to the pack again, but this is just sad. As CSM we have the worst powers ever (Tzeentch is horrible), but now at least loyalist Space Marines, famous for their psychic power, get 28 new powers to reflect that their the "bestest at magicks".

With the likely unavoidable nerf to Tzeentch daemons relic for the 2++ rerolable I dont get how this happens. Really? Marines get the superinvul now? Over the god who can let his minions see the future? I thought we were getting over that part of the game.

The area I play in already over the top on power level, and at this rate I will have to get a titan to stay in it with CSM+FW traitor guard.

Don't worry, those Loyalist players will likely now hand wave away everything by simply pointing out that CSM's just got re-printings of our two supplements, which include nothing new beyond a handful of useless formations and a single Psychic power that requires at least 400pts of Sorcerers just to access it.

Within a couple of weeks, I'm sure we'll be hearing the cries of "OMG! Chaos is soooooooo ****ing OP!!!11!1!!!1", because this one time, a squad of Gravcents turned around and shot a bike squad off the table.

I would never complain like that, reasins...
1.CSM have been left in the dust the longest, its time they got something cool
2.I dont own Grav Cents
3.I dont own Bikes

Experiment 626 wrote:

 Disciple of Fate wrote:
With the CSM rumours I thought, finally were getting a bit closer to the pack again, but this is just sad. As CSM we have the worst powers ever (Tzeentch is horrible), but now at least loyalist Space Marines, famous for their psychic power, get 28 new powers to reflect that their the "bestest at magicks".

With the likely unavoidable nerf to Tzeentch daemons relic for the 2++ rerolable I dont get how this happens. Really? Marines get the superinvul now? Over the god who can let his minions see the future? I thought we were getting over that part of the game.

The area I play in already over the top on power level, and at this rate I will have to get a titan to stay in it with CSM+FW traitor guard.

Don't worry, those Loyalist players will likely now hand wave away everything by simply pointing out that CSM's just got re-printings of our two supplements, which include nothing new beyond a handful of useless formations and a single Psychic power that requires at least 400pts of Sorcerers just to access it.

Within a couple of weeks, I'm sure we'll be hearing the cries of "OMG! Chaos is soooooooo ****ing OP!!!11!1!!!1", because this one time, a squad of Gravcents turned around and shot a bike squad off the table.

Where is the Chaos whine thread when you need it!

But seriously, I'm more waiting for the Eldar tears about their D weapons being turned against them. :p

 Thairne wrote:
Could this make Terminators worthwhile again?

Deathwing Knights with a Librarian in TDA 2+/3++ rerollable?

Can... I can haz playable Deathwing? O_o

God I hope so!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Btw I know these are marine only powers, but after I take a look at them all, it's quite likely at my club we will be allowing all armies access, so long as it's not very clearly marine centric like "target a unit with atsknf"

 Formosa wrote:

 Thairne wrote:
Could this make Terminators worthwhile again?

Deathwing Knights with a Librarian in TDA 2+/3++ rerollable?

Can... I can haz playable Deathwing? O_o

God I hope so!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Btw I know these are marine only powers, but after I take a look at them all, it's quite likely at my club we will be allowing all armies access, so long as it's not very clearly marine centric like "target a unit with atsknf"

Does your club let everyone access the two Eldar Psychic tables, or the Chaos psychic tables?

 Crazyterran wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

 Thairne wrote:
Could this make Terminators worthwhile again?

Deathwing Knights with a Librarian in TDA 2+/3++ rerollable?

Can... I can haz playable Deathwing? O_o

God I hope so!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Btw I know these are marine only powers, but after I take a look at them all, it's quite likely at my club we will be allowing all armies access, so long as it's not very clearly marine centric like "target a unit with atsknf"

Does your club let everyone access the two Eldar Psychic tables, or the Chaos psychic tables?

Of course not, because they are clearly geared towards there respective factions, and.if this is, we will carry on normal, but if they are generic then we will just consider them as extra psy disciplines, more variety is a good thing to us, we will also open them up to Legion armies, tis our club, we can do what ever We think is fun :-D

I'll certainly be looking to get them accepted for my legion armies, and will probably suggest all but the Librarius (The really only marine-centric one by the sound of it) be available to at the VERY least CSM.

This power is nothing compared to S:1+D6 Ap- blast

 Formosa wrote:

 Crazyterran wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

 Thairne wrote:
Could this make Terminators worthwhile again?

Deathwing Knights with a Librarian in TDA 2+/3++ rerollable?

Can... I can haz playable Deathwing? O_o

God I hope so!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Btw I know these are marine only powers, but after I take a look at them all, it's quite likely at my club we will be allowing all armies access, so long as it's not very clearly marine centric like "target a unit with atsknf"

Does your club let everyone access the two Eldar Psychic tables, or the Chaos psychic tables?

Of course not, because they are clearly geared towards there respective factions, and.if this is, we will carry on normal, but if they are generic then we will just consider them as extra psy disciplines, more variety is a good thing to us, we will also open them up to Legion armies, tis our club, we can do what ever We think is fun :-D

Whats good for one group isn't good for another, hmm?

Of course, I just wanted to point out the hypocrisy.

Now that i think about it
Can Legiones Astartes use the new powers?

commander dante wrote:
Now that i think about it
Can Legiones Astartes use the new powers?

A very good question, one of which I will excitedly wait for Forgeworld's answer on. Personally, I'm going to assume that they can use all 4, but I suggest waiting to see before using them outside of friendly games

 Crazyterran wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

 Crazyterran wrote:

 Formosa wrote:

 Thairne wrote:
Could this make Terminators worthwhile again?

Deathwing Knights with a Librarian in TDA 2+/3++ rerollable?

Can... I can haz playable Deathwing? O_o

God I hope so!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Btw I know these are marine only powers, but after I take a look at them all, it's quite likely at my club we will be allowing all armies access, so long as it's not very clearly marine centric like "target a unit with atsknf"

Does your club let everyone access the two Eldar Psychic tables, or the Chaos psychic tables?

Of course not, because they are clearly geared towards there respective factions, and.if this is, we will carry on normal, but if they are generic then we will just consider them as extra psy disciplines, more variety is a good thing to us, we will also open them up to Legion armies, tis our club, we can do what ever We think is fun :-D

Whats good for one group isn't good for another, hmm?

Of course, I just wanted to point out the hypocrisy.

What hypocrisy? There is none, chaos powers are clearly chaos, Eldar are clearly eldar, deamons etc.

These ones from what we have seen so far are very generic, so explain to me, what is so marine about casting thunder bolts? There are plenty of examples of Chaos, orks and Eldar doing it, and why can't eldar use earth based psy powers, or shall I just bow down to the marine elitism?

Nope I think not, I see no good reason these powers can't be used by others books, and yes, we do allow normal marines to use chaos powers, to represent renegade chapters, we like to play casually for the fluff, not treat the rulebook as a cast iron tome, which I see as a lot of people's problems in 40k, this is after all, the house rule edition.

commander dante wrote:
Now that i think about it
Can Legiones Astartes use the new powers?

They shouldn't. Pre-Heresy they would have been products of Magnus' librarius project, and I don't recall the Thousand Sons having a Magister Templi of Geokinesis, do you?

Well I think me and my buddy are going to houserule this power as not existing. He hates me using Orikanstar in under 5k games so this is just out of the question.

MonumentOfRibs wrote:
Well I think me and my buddy are going to houserule this power as not existing. He hates me using Orikanstar in under 5k games so this is just out of the question.

Same. I have people saying that its not that powerful just because the eldar one exists

 cosmicsoybean wrote:

MonumentOfRibs wrote:
Well I think me and my buddy are going to houserule this power as not existing. He hates me using Orikanstar in under 5k games so this is just out of the question.

Same. I have people saying that its not that powerful just because the eldar one exists

Which just shows their stupidity and ignorance. Eldar don't have easy access or spamable 2+/3++ FNP where as imperials have dozens. Really the only thing that fortune was a problem on was back when you could take the Baron and the jetstar but that's been dead since 6th. Plus eldar don't have the libby conclave casting on 2+. Really the only saving grace of Veil is that its one cast per unit and the power only works on the libby and his unit.

Its sad there is legit prejudice against Eldar armies and players. Why learn to play and adapt when you can just blame your problems on something else?

Well, half of the armies can't win against even an unoptimized Eldar, Tau, GSF, daemons, ect force, but yes the prejudice against the players as a group is a bit ridiculous.

Edited by Moderator

Again, was talking about those codeses (Orks, solo DE, Solo BA, IG, ect.) who CANNOT do those four thing effectively, but sure.

There's also the ever so minor detail that not everyone enjoys, or even wants to always be forced to play 'balls to the walls' "Tournament"hammer...

I have no problems with Eldar players who have the courtesy to adapt their list and come down a good bit to the level that Chaos is forced to play at. (especially CSM's)
I have serious problems with those who outright refuse to ever play anything except for the most highly optimised, cheddar-laced list possible, even when they're going up against a crippled bottom feeding codex like CSM's, and instead insist that the player with no options just has to "man-up" and "L2P/Git Gud".

 Swampmist wrote:
Again, was talking about those codeses (Orks, solo DE, Solo BA, IG, ect.) who CANNOT do those four thing effectively, but sure.

well to be fair, orks have the ability rapidly capture objectives, we just have very little staying power once we get there. as for the other 3 things? yeah basically zero ranged firepower ignores cover saves. I would have to shoot my entire army at a wraithknight and then assault it with several nobz with Powerklaws to even have a chance of killing one in a turn. And as far as countering/containing invisibility....can't counter it, and the only way to contain it is to throw units at it until it runs out of steam, not really a good tactical move :p

Ravenous D, Instead of taking up this L2P tone that pretty much everybody else agrees is a symptom of TFG, you could always shelf your SM and your eldar and try running with the have nots (mono Orks, DE, BA or AM) for a few months. That way you might come to the conclusion that it's not that simple and folks like Martel aren't just blowing hot air OR if you don't want to jeopardize your win /loss ratio you could always slap him on the ignore list.

Dantes_Baals wrote:
D, Instead of taking up this L2P tone that pretty much everybody else agrees is a symptom of TFG, you could always shelf your SM and your eldar and try running with the have nots (mono Orks, DE, BA or AM) for a few months. That way you might come to the conclusion that it's not that simple and folks like Martel aren't just blowing hot air OR if you don't want to jeopardize your w/lords ratio you could always slap him on the ignore list.

first things first, I love your name

secondly, I have a good friend who plays eldar. He is in a similar circumstance as me, meaning he can't afford to go buy a completely new army because his is OP cheese. On the other hand I know for a fact he didn't pick Eldar to be cheese, everything we do he is always the stupid elves so I don't fault him for going for Space Elves. With that said, his favorite models were seriously OP, he loves scat bikes, wraithknigths and those stupid transports for his Guardians which are his other love. So a lot of cheese. In order for him to understand what it felt like to have to play against that we switched armies for a few weeks. After handful of games where I utterly steam rolled him in the first 2-3 turns he realized he wasn't the best general in the world it was his army doing most of the heavy lifting. Since then he has limited himself to only using small numbers of scat bikes, at most 1 wraithknight a game (usually none) and since then our games have become a lot more intense and fun for both of us.

So in conclusion, switching to a have not army is a really good way to learn how the other side feels

SemperMortis, Thx for the kudos.

Yea that's definitely what I meant. I seriously doubt many folks have several hundred to drop on temporary minis to experiment with. I was suggesting an army swap with one of the poor four(tm) assuming one of the folks at his local gaming establishment runs them and is cool with it.

"Yeah right. You've spent the last year jumping into every eldar thread to piss and moan how you cant win with your blood angels and when a bunch of people tried to tell you how to change your list you gave us nothing your own personally restrictions as your sorry excuse for an argument. You blame everyone else for YOUR problems.

So maybe instead of reporting people that criticize you, maybe you should play the game and stop putting yourself into a restrictive box of self imposed delusional problems and projecting your issues and prejudice on your betters. "

Translation: you can't win with them either. You're the kinda guy that kicks around bronze players with a Void Ray build and then is mystified when you start losing to people that actually scout your base.

I'm not giving GW money, and I shouldn't have to. It would be like Blizzard releasing DLC units that were OP compared to the original ones.

Keep posting. It amuses me.

Welp. I'm out. See you guys in 30k where the rules work.

Edited by Moderator

Not that I normally defend people or anything, because I'd rather them do it themselves, but just to report...

... refusing to use allies or drop pods is fine. It isn't mental illness or delusion - it's how one wants to build one's army. You know, creative freedom. Like, for example, my Mechanicum, who don't field Tech-Thralls because, unlike most Forge Worlds, they lack an inexhaustible supply of manpower.

And auspexes are, if not useless, kind of stupid. They would be better if they worked on units not within 12" - if a unit is within, say, 8", I'll probably charge it and kill it in assault, and if it's outside of 12", an auspex is useless anyways.

Meltaguns are useless, depending on your meta. They work on vehicles very well, but they're comparatively useless against MCs and things with high and on-demand coversaves... that is to say, they're useless against the modern meta.

No need to defend. His posts are awesome.