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Oh.. well thats kinda poop...

Many thanks but that's a bit too much leak wise.

Thanks for the thought and effort though

Reds8n

 GoonBandito wrote:

Veterans can take Rhino, Razorback (no Las/Plas or Heavy Flamer options curiously), Corvus Blackstar or Drop Pods as DT.

Presumably GW finally figured out that the Las/Plas Razorback is the optimal choice, verging on overpowered, in 5th Edition 40K.

GoonBandito, I was wondering if you could explain how the Tactical/Maelstrom Objectives work (and what they are) for the Deathwatch since they have 18 unique ones?

 GoonBandito wrote:

Vets are 5man, up to 10. Same price as a Sternguard, but come with CCW's instead of Bolt Pistols.... Any Vet can swap their Boltgun for Melee Weapons, Ranged Weapons or Special Weapons at the usual prices. Hand Flamers and Inferno Pistols are in as Ranged Weapons though, and Deathwatch Shotguns and Stalker Patter Boltguns are in as Special Weapons. Any vet can swap either Boltgun or CCW for a Storm Shield, or replace all weapons for a Heavy Thunder Hammer. Sergeant can swap CCW for Xenophase. One Vet can upgrade into a Black Shield, gaining WS5 and a rule that doubles their attacks when in combat with an Independent Char, Monstrous Creature, Vehicle or when outnumbered in combat.

Watch Masters' only upgrades are from Special Issue Wargear or Relics. No Jump Pack, Storm Shield or Terminator Armour though they do come with Artificer and the Guardian Spear (Boltgun and S+1 AP2 melee weapon) by default (imo probably due to the fixed Watch Master sculpt). The only thing the Watch Captains can't take on the other hand are Special Weapons and Bikes.

Edit: forgot to mention, 4 Heavy Weapons in a Veteran Squad - Heavy Bolters (optional Hellfire Shells), Heavy Flamers, Missile Launchers (optional Flak), Infernus Heavy Bolter (optional Hellfire Shells), Frag Cannon

Looking at this

"Any Vet can swap their Boltgun for Melee Weapons, Ranged Weapons or Special Weapons at the usual prices"

Do Special Weapons include the usual flamer, melta, plasma? Or only the ones listed?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ah I see it now. So wait, all models can take special weapons right? So you can take combi flamer for 10 pts, or a flamer for 5?

Who even thought that worked?

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
GoonBandito, I was wondering if you could explain how the Tactical/Maelstrom Objectives work (and what they are) for the Deathwatch since they have 18 unique ones?

Oh yeah, there are 3 'sets' and you choose which set you want to use before the mission starts. The Primus set is more aimed at killing HQElites/Characters, Secundus Set more aimed at kill Troops/mass models, and the Tertius is aimed at killing Heavy Support/LoW/Fast Attack/Vehicles. Fits in with the Mission Tactics rule and the Kill Team Formations which are geared toward picking a Force Org Slot to focus on.

Edit: also, haven't talked about the sprues yet! Veterans are in Mk VIII armour with CCW/Ammo Pouches part of the rear torso bit, rear torso cloak for the Black Shield. 2x Heavy Thunder Hammer, 2x the sexy as hell Storm Shields, 2x Power Mauls, 6x Power Swords, 1x Xenophase Sword, 1x Combi-Melta/Plas, 1 Stalker Boltgun, 2x Deathwatch Shotgun, 1x Infernus Heavy Bolter, 1x Frag Cannon. The 'Vanguard Sprues' are a bit boring in comparison, with 4prs Lighting Claws, 4 normal Storm Shields, 4 normal Thunder Hammers, a Power Axe and a Relic Blade. Dreadnaught Sprues have Twin-linked Lascannon, Plasma Cannon and Assault Cannon arms, plus either Storm Bolter or Heavy Flamer options for the Power Fist arm.

There's lots of Deathwatch Shoulder pads, plus a Shoulder pad for each of the First Founding chapters plus Black Templars, Silver Skulls, Howling Griffons, Brazen Claws, Minotaurs, Flesh Tearers and Novamarines and a Black Shield pad.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

 GoonBandito wrote:

Vets are 5man, up to 10. Same price as a Sternguard, but come with CCW's instead of Bolt Pistols.... Any Vet can swap their Boltgun for Melee Weapons, Ranged Weapons or Special Weapons at the usual prices. Hand Flamers and Inferno Pistols are in as Ranged Weapons though, and Deathwatch Shotguns and Stalker Patter Boltguns are in as Special Weapons. Any vet can swap either Boltgun or CCW for a Storm Shield, or replace all weapons for a Heavy Thunder Hammer. Sergeant can swap CCW for Xenophase. One Vet can upgrade into a Black Shield, gaining WS5 and a rule that doubles their attacks when in combat with an Independent Char, Monstrous Creature, Vehicle or when outnumbered in combat.

Watch Masters' only upgrades are from Special Issue Wargear or Relics. No Jump Pack, Storm Shield or Terminator Armour though they do come with Artificer and the Guardian Spear (Boltgun and S+1 AP2 melee weapon) by default (imo probably due to the fixed Watch Master sculpt). The only thing the Watch Captains can't take on the other hand are Special Weapons and Bikes.

Edit: forgot to mention, 4 Heavy Weapons in a Veteran Squad - Heavy Bolters (optional Hellfire Shells), Heavy Flamers, Missile Launchers (optional Flak), Infernus Heavy Bolter (optional Hellfire Shells), Frag Cannon

Looking at this

"Any Vet can swap their Boltgun for Melee Weapons, Ranged Weapons or Special Weapons at the usual prices"

Do Special Weapons include the usual flamer, melta, plasma? Or only the ones listed?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ah I see it now. So wait, all models can take special weapons right? So you can take combi flamer for 10 pts, or a flamer for 5?

Who even thought that worked?

Combi-Flamer lets you keep the Specialist Ammunition for the Boltgun I guess? That's something I suppose. Also, the HQ units can't take from the Special Weapons, only the Ranged Weapons.

Special issue ammo and the flexibility of using it all the time you can't use your flamer. Makes sense to me!

Meowstalker wrote:
um... something new?

Seriously disappointed. That captain model really needs a new sculpt. And those vehicles only seem to have the tiny =][= symbols.

That stasis bomb is literally the greatest thing ever.

So the power swords are 15 points and there's no default way to assemble the bolter dudes without them? And they have no pistols? What?

The stasis bomb is the greatest thing ever if you are playing an Ork army. I am not so sure it makes sense for one of the greatest heroes of the Imperium to be carrying a weapon that has a one in three chance of killing him if he ever uses it. Especially if, as one presumes, it is a fairly rare weapon. If it's "dangerous to use at close range", why doesn't he throw it?

 Crimson wrote:
So the power swords are 15 points and there's no default way to assemble the bolter dudes without them? And they have no pistols? What?

Yeah, what is this? Do we miss a special rule where they can one-handle boltguns and assault after shooting them?

Edit: Also, I couldn't find the rule for including bikers/Terminators/etc. in Veteran squads?

 Ian Sturrock wrote:
The stasis bomb is the greatest thing ever if you are playing an Ork army. I am not so sure it makes sense for one of the greatest heroes of the Imperium to be carrying a weapon that has a one in three chance of killing him if he ever uses it. Especially if, as one presumes, it is a fairly rare weapon. If it's "dangerous to use at close range", why doesn't he throw it?

More like 9%. 1/9 chance of missing(you obviously won't use it against somebody you don't have rerolls unless situation is dire) and even D isn't auto kill.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Hanskrampf wrote:
Edit: Also, I couldn't find the rule for including bikers/Terminators/etc. in Veteran squads?

Umm you take formation and they form combined squad. What more rules you are looking for?

tneva82 wrote:

 Ian Sturrock wrote:
The stasis bomb is the greatest thing ever if you are playing an Ork army. I am not so sure it makes sense for one of the greatest heroes of the Imperium to be carrying a weapon that has a one in three chance of killing him if he ever uses it. Especially if, as one presumes, it is a fairly rare weapon. If it's "dangerous to use at close range", why doesn't he throw it?

More like 9%. 1/9 chance of missing(you obviously won't use it against somebody you don't have rerolls unless situation is dire) and even D isn't auto kill.

how you figure 9% firste you cant hit on better than 3+ in HTH, so you 16% change of rolling 2 with will hit your self 16% change of a 1 wich you then re-roll and have 33% change of hitting you self

so probely more like 25% change og hitting your self with it

Am I the only one who's uncomfortable with the amount of photos of the rules being posted? Models I'm ok with, the rest seems to violate copyright rules (IMHO).
So much has been posted, there's no need to buy the codex anymore.

 bubber wrote:
Am I the only one who's uncomfortable with the amount of photos of the rules being posted? Models I'm ok with, the rest seems to violate copyright rules (IMHO).
So much has been posted, there's no need to buy the codex anymore.

Don't worry, GW won't mind. They are a models company first and foremost, they do no market research and their costumers favourite hobby is to buy GW models.

tneva82 wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Hanskrampf wrote:
Edit: Also, I couldn't find the rule for including bikers/Terminators/etc. in Veteran squads?

Umm you take formation and they form combined squad. What more rules you are looking for?

Whoops, that's what I missed, did only flip through the pics. Thanks!

Am I missing something or is there no reason whatsoever to take any of the other Kill Teams beyond the Aquila Kill Team?

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
Am I missing something or is there no reason whatsoever to take any of the other Kill Teams beyond the Aquila Kill Team?

Kind of what I'm thinking too.

Spam Aquila's, maybe a Strategium for FnP, add a vehicle of your choice or just deep strike everywhere. Frag cannon and hammer time everything else.

Points add up mighty fast. At 1000pts, I can make a list with ~10 models and a vehicle. Pretty cheap army to collect when each frag cannon marine is around the 50pts mark.

So the Watch Captain cannot have a heavy thunder hammer and can have a relic blade only if he takes terminator armour in which case he cannot have a storm shield. Argh!

Yeah, the Watch Captain doesn't really get me excited. I'd kill for either the Heavy Thunderhammer or Guardian Spear option on him. Ah well.

Why the hell can't a Terminator HQ take a Storm Shield?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Why the hell can't a Terminator HQ take a Storm Shield?

'Cause there's no model? Seems the easiest explanation.


A certain bits site has sold a ton of upgrade sprues at 10 pounds a pop already (and has very crisp pics). I'd wager this release will be a hit for GW

They currently have -4 sprues in stock.

And yes, very nice pics:

Love that helmet with the crest!

 Ian Sturrock wrote:
The stasis bomb is the greatest thing ever if you are playing an Ork army. I am not so sure it makes sense for one of the greatest heroes of the Imperium to be carrying a weapon that has a one in three chance of killing him if he ever uses it. Especially if, as one presumes, it is a fairly rare weapon. If it's "dangerous to use at close range", why doesn't he throw it?

Math?
Artemis is ws6 and not including half the formations that include some form of rerolling or PE shenanigans or librarian abilities in deathwatch. You always have mission tactics which Artemis can change as a warlord trait to gain reroll to hit.
The only way you are missing with Artemis is if your assaulting an invis unit and miss but odds are if you are using a Intiative 5 str d ap1 single atk in melee it's probably something much worse then Artemis since He is already equipped with a power sword aT ap3 and 4-5 melee atks.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Why the hell can't a Terminator HQ take a Storm Shield?

Why aren't rule and list brain farts which the player base picks up on in seconds not spotted at GW?

Needs a FAQ/errata the second it's released.

What is stopping the watch captain with terminator armor take a storm shield? It doesn't replace a weapon, just adds.

 conker249 wrote:
What is stopping the watch captain with terminator armor take a storm shield? It doesn't replace a weapon, just adds.

Because it says he can't.