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 Roknar wrote:
That would be a huge slap in the face for the other legions though. Why do only the TSons get new units. Seems pretty unfair for a supplement that is supposed to be for all nine legions. The rumour didn't say anything about new units mind you.

I've been thinking that, too. Except one thing doesn't sit quite right. The Primarchs. The primarchs that are still alive surely must be in this book, even though they have no miniatures released yet. Which means that it includes new units that have no miniatures. Either that or it doesn't include the other Primarchs in which case I guess 1k Sons is now the new Codex: Chaos Space Marines and GW is just playing their same old game.

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
Does anyone have a page count on the supplement? Could we be seeing a bunch of new kits to flesh out all Traitor Legions? Even an update of the much beloved Khorne Berzerkers kit?

In a perfect world World Eaters, Emperor's Children and Death Guard would get 1KSons style releases:

Big Single Character (WE already have this with the new Kharn/Lucius the Eternally Useless/Typhus)
3-Pack Unit of Something (eg. Berzerkers on Juggers)
10-man Infantry Squad (new Berzerkers/Noise Marines/Plague Marines)
5-man Terminator Squad ('Zerker Termies/Noise Terminators (can you imagine?)/Plague Terminators)
[Equivalent 10-Man Something Else] (maybe a 5-man 'Zerker Jump Pack Squad/10-man Plague Zombie unit with 5 sculpts x2/etc.)

The remaining traitor legions could easily stay a 'paint job' as long as they got Relics/Warlord/Army Special Rules (ala Chapter Tactics) + a few formations to give them the stuff that makes sense. Wouldn't necessarily need models for them.

Sadly, a little bit of Sisters Player's Doom'n'Gloom™ is sinking in and I'm thinking we'll loads of cool new 1KSons stuff and then some formations for WE/EC/DG, plus the others, and nothing new.

Why? My cynical view on GW's own Chapterhouse-borne cynicism: No model, no rules. Unless they're about to show off the next 6 months worth of cult releases in this Legion book, the only new things will be the 1KSons stuff, meaning that nothing new for anyone 'cept rules that use existing models.

That's part of why I made thread in general.I don't understand how Wrath of Magnus and Traitor l´Legions will interact, if at all.
Assuming there are no units in Traitor legions, I would expect to see any new units to come as part of a campaign book like Wrath of Magnus. So no need to add them in the supplement right away. It makes more sense to me than having a separate Tsons faction in parallel (and likewise for future legion releases), however I don't understand how the box art fits into that or how they could be somehow both csm and not csm.

 Roknar wrote:
Why do only the TSons get new units.

As I said above: No model, no rules. This is the reality we live in. We wanted a world where GW released models for all the rules they wrote. We got the opposite. A GW that removes rules where there were no models. Combine that with their unwillingness to show any products ahead of time (something that is slowly changing) and it unlikely that this book will contain a single solitary new model for anything outside of the 1KSons.

 Roknar wrote:
Seems pretty unfair for a supplement that is supposed to be for all nine legions.

Blame the Chapterhouse case. GW are so petrified of 3rd parties making parts for their models that they won't dare release something that doesn't have a model yet, even if that model is coming. It's either out when the book is out, or it doesn't exist.

Now I'm happy to be proven wrong - in fact, I'd love to be proven wrong and have the new Legion book show up showing off new EC/WE/DG units (and even plastic conversion kits for the other legions - 10 pads, a few heads/torsos, maybe a weapon or two/icons) - but I don't think I'm wrong about this, especially with 8th Edition so close around the corner.

yeah really hope that the other legions affiliated to a god get the same treatment as 1k sons. Would be a shame if they get stuck with finecast minis or horribly outdated plastic mini, while 1k sons got all this love. But I'm not too hopefull, since GW works in mysterious/incoherent ways, Hell, how can you explain that they still haven't released some plastic aspect warriors or greater daemons (bar avengers and the bt), yet find the way to release minis that have a very limited sale potential (logan, some of these AOS special characters) ?

I dunno, I doubt it. We know there will be more Primarchs. As far as we know they won't be coming anytime soon though. That makes it unlikely for them to include the units in the traitor legion supplement imho. Assuming they are indeed units for C:CSM in the first place of course. We still don't know how these new TSons unit relate to C:CSM.

 TheLumberJack wrote:

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
Does anyone have a page count on the supplement? Could we be seeing a bunch of new kits to flesh out all Traitor Legions? Even an update of the much beloved Khorne Berzerkers kit?

I think they'll slowly start releasing kits to match units in the supplement, at least I hope

GW stopped doing that after the whole no models no rules policy they took after the CH debaukal.

When ever GW updates a kit they add new weapons and equipment or make it a duel kit with a new unit to make it "worth it" so prole who already own the unit will but for the new weapon options.

Sm Evisorators and gravguns are a example of this, or fire warrior/breaches for the tau.

Wait and see, wait and see. There was a time, not that long ago, when the idea of Magnus appearing in official model form would have gotten a poster roundly scorned. When people might have grudgingly admitted to the possibility of plastic Rubricae (but called it unlikely) but the rest of these releases would have been dismissed as crazy talk.

Give it time, see what churns out of the rumor mill over the next few months and what comes from GW in the next year, we may all be surprised and highly gratified.

While some people may see it as unfair, it is a simple limitation of production capacity. Even a company as big as GW can't release 20-30 kits in a span of a few months to support all of the branches of Chaos.

They move the story and selected the "current" big baddie for the next year or 18 months etc. It's safe to assume the plastic kits being released for the Thousand Sons will be around for 5-10 years depending on the company's direction.

For anyone to complain is a little silly considering you have some armies which are still using 2nd ed. sculpts, finecast, etc. Personally I think it's refreshing to see something other than Khorne or Plague-X models. Good for them.

How new is the Space Wolf line? Should those players be expecting a fancy batch of releases within the next six months for this Warzone nonsense? Or are all of their kits pretty new-ish (i.e. 3-4 years).

This has been the fastest turnaround from "this is awesome" to "man, I only got a new bike, not a PONY!" I've ever seen.

Now that were pretty sure some loyalist primarchs will be making a return

what is everyone's bet the first one will be?

LightKing wrote:
Now that were pretty sure some loyalist primarchs will be making a return

what is everyone's bet the first one will be?

Russ.

LightKing wrote:
Now that were pretty sure some loyalist primarchs will be making a return

what is everyone's bet the first one will be?

Given the Dark Angels involvement in this plot, probably the Lion, but I'd much rather Dorn, Corax, or Khan.

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
It's about 10 pages longer than Angels of Death, so I'd actually suspect that it does have the new TSons units in it.

I doubt it. Unless the Wrath of Magnus has a bunch more stuff in it (SW, DA, GK, etc.), having everything in the Traitor Legions book would invalidate WoM.

LightKing wrote:
Now that were pretty sure some loyalist primarchs will be making a return

what is everyone's bet the first one will be?

Rowboat. Hopefully not suddenly but gradually, at first popping up in the background and trying to guide the Imperium until he regains strength to fight.

Zerosoul wrote:
This has been the fastest turnaround from "this is awesome" to "man, I only got a new bike, not a PONY!" I've ever seen.

True, but that's about how long it takes for the realization to set in that everyone else got a pony a long time ago and just now is chaos even getting a ing bike.

Liking the new Thousand sons marines, not a fan of the the Tzaangors, they make me think of Tzeenchian Bloodletters

Have we ever been given a reason why GW codicies don't include forge world stuff?

 Quarterdime wrote:

Zerosoul wrote:
This has been the fastest turnaround from "this is awesome" to "man, I only got a new bike, not a PONY!" I've ever seen.

True, but that's about how long it takes for the realization to set in that everyone else got a pony a long time ago and just now is chaos even getting a ing bike.

Orks. They had too much fun on the bike they had, so got beaten up and lunch money stolen by their new codex.

LightKing wrote:
Now that were pretty sure some loyalist primarchs will be making a return

what is everyone's bet the first one will be?

Sad Panda (who has basically 100% hit rate with rumours) has said the first loyalist Primarch isn't Russ. I think Dorn was mentioned but I can't remember who by.

I havent read the whole thread so i dont know if anyone mentioned it, but do you remeber the guy who claimed that he saw the new codex chaos space marines about a year ago? He mentioned legion tactics for every legion, maybe it wasnt all cr@p after all. Time will tell

From back then...

"Black Legion: [Abaddon the Despoiler is Black Legion]
*** Veterans of the Long War: +1 Leadership and Hatred (Imperials).
*** Vengeful Strength: Characters gain +2 Strength in close combat.
Renegade Warband: [Huron Blackheart and Fabius Bile are Renegades]
*** Selfish Pride: Furious Charge. Can reroll failed Morale, Fear and Pinning checks.
*** Merciless Corsairs: Characters can choose to double their Attacks characteristic once per game.
World Eaters: (Mark of Khorne only, Khorne Berzerkers and Blood Brethren are always World Eaters)
[Kharn the Betrayer is World Eaters]
*** Insane Bloodlust: Add +D3” to max charge range. Automatically pass Pinning checks.
*** Fury of Khorne: Characters gain the Rampage special rule.
Emperor’s Children: (Mark of Slaanesh only, Noise Marines and Blissriders are always Emperor’s Children) [Lucius the Eternal is Emperor’s Children]
*** Martial Grace: Hit and Run. Fleet.
*** Vicious Excess: Characters gain the Rending special rule.
Death Guard: (Mark of Nurgle only, Plague Marines and Plague Wardens are always Death Guard)
[Typhus is Death Guard]
*** Diseased Bulk: Immune to the Poisoned special rule. Automatically pass Fear checks.
*** Plague Arsenal: Flamers, Heavy Flamers, Frag Missiles and Grenades have Poisoned and Rending.
*** Aura of Decay: Characters cause enemy models in base contact to suffer -1 Attack (to min of 1).
Thousand Sons: (Mark of Tzeentch only, Rubric Marines and Corvidaes Covens are always Thousand Sons)
[Ahriman is Thousand Sons]
*** Favoured of the Deciever: You may reroll Invulnerable save results of 1.
*** Infernal Armory: Heavy Bolters, Reaper Autocannons and Autocannons have Inferno Bolts.
*** Sorcerous Premonitions: Characters can reroll a single to hit, to wound, saving throw or manifesting die once per game turn.
Alpha Legion:
*** Coils of the Hydra: Infiltrate. Alpha Legion characters may always join units of Cultists prior to deployment.
*** Headhunters: Characters have Acute Senses and can bestow the Sniper rule upon a friendly Alpha Legion unit’s Bolters/Combi-Bolters if they are within 6” during the Shooting phase, provided that friendly unit hasn’t moved.
Iron Warriors:
*** Siegemasters: Tank Hunters.
*** Shredder Bolts: Heavy Bolters, Frag Grenades and Frag Missiles have the Shred special rule.
*** Iron within Iron Without: Characters gain the Feel No Pain rule. Warpsmiths have +1 to repair rolls on friendly vehicles.
Night Lords:
*** Murderous Talents: Reroll 1s to Wound in Close Combat. Lightning Claws have the Rending rule.
*** Lords of Terror: Stealth and Fear.
*** Gutter Fighters: Characters cause Instant Death on a wound roll of 6 in Close Combat.
Word Bearers:
*** Blessed by the Gods: Units get to roll on the Boon Table whenever they kill an enemy unit in close combat, with all models benefiting from the result (reroll Spawndom and Dark Apotheosis). In addition, psykers count as Daemons for the purposes of using Malefic Daemonology powers.
*** Fanatical Devotion: Characters gain the Zealot special rule, and if they are a Dark Apostle they grant their unit +1 Attack. "

^That would be awesome

Tha same guy also said the following
"" Formations are, unsurprisingly, organized into a greater detachment that includes a collection of smaller ones.
Black Crusade Detachment: (1+ Core, 1-10 Auxiliary, 0-3 Exalted Champions)
*** Lord of the Black Crusade: Your Warlord can roll for a second warlord trait, rerolling any duplicates.
*** Dark Ascension: Characters in this detachment make a free roll on the Boon table at the start of the game, rerolling any results of Spawndom or Dark Apotheosis. The result of this roll applies for the rest of the game""

Which appeared in traitors hate 6 months later.

just saying...

I love this hole release! The fact that they done Tartaros armor for a traitor is impressive to me. Oh... and Magnus, he's cool too

 SargentWhiskey wrote:
I love this hole release! The fact that they done Tartaros armor for a traitor is impressive to me. Oh... and Magnus, he's cool too

I think it's hilarious that the first 40k army to gain access to Tartaros, in a main GW book, is a "traitor" legion, rather than the regular SM chapters. We all know that there'll be a 40k rules release, probably in a few months, giving SM armies access to Tartaros, when the sprues from BoP are released separately, but Thousand Sons beat all those Imperium Astartes to that particular punch.

What do you think the effect of legions comming back to 40k will have on 30k? A lot of 30k players are playing it because they couldn't play their favourite legion in 40k. I for one have started to paint my chaos marines as best as I can in order to sell them and buy 30k word bearers, but this news is making me rethink this depending on the quality of the book. Do you think there will be a drop in price on 30k models if a significant number of chaos legion loving players decide to play the much less expensive 40k?

Feth me, i can't understate the state of excitement that i'm in right now. All these years of waiting, ever since - well, basically since the 3.5 went the way of most childhood dreams. Having legion-specific rules was basically the main thing that drew me towards the HoR Killteam. I had basically resigned and given up all hope for ever having a special snowflake edition of the chaos codex, not when all the attention for CSM was drawn towards such original chapters as the Crimson Slaughter.

Now this, this is really getting me hyped. Not only do all the new Units look brilliant (Magnus himself aside, not much of fan of giant-scale models, but who knows...), but the promise of rules, gear, items and artifacts sounds almost to good to be true. My wife probably won't like it, but it looks like i will finally spend some money on a fresh, first hand GW release, for the first time in about 5 or 6 years.

 Grot 6 wrote:
Only thing missing is the electric guitars and psionic weapons.

Not a fan of spending a half hour setting up only to bring this guy out and have to pick up everything again. Good looking statue, though.

Said everybody ever when Imp Knights first came out. Now look at them.

 nintura wrote:

 Grot 6 wrote:
Only thing missing is the electric guitars and psionic weapons.

Not a fan of spending a half hour setting up only to bring this guy out and have to pick up everything again. Good looking statue, though.

Said everybody ever when Imp Knights first came out. Now look at them.

I'm out of the game so don't understand what your point it. Do you mean no one ever uses them now, or do you mean they're easily defeated?

More pics here

https://war-of-sigmar.herokuapp.com/bloggings/1384

https://war-of-sigmar.herokuapp.com/bloggings/1385