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Considering Axe's are 5pts, a Solarite gauntlet is only worth 7-8pts.

+2 str, +1 AP, 2flat dmg over the axe.

Granted axe's need a buff, but if they go to 3flat damage the gauntlet is only worth +2 points max.

I'm not saying it's wouldn't be the most 9th edition thing ever to give Custodes S10 3 damage Power fists on top of 2+3++(+1 to save rolls) 5+++, for less than our terminators cost, but common, do we really want that level of broken?

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I'm not saying it's wouldn't be the most 9th edition thing ever to give Custodes S10 3 damage Power fists on top of 2+3++(+1 to save rolls) 5+++, for less than our terminators cost, but common, do we really want that level of broken?

LOL, yes? If this was a limited bodyguard option I'd actually see no real problem with it.

 cuda1179 wrote:

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I'm not saying it's wouldn't be the most 9th edition thing ever to give Custodes S10 3 damage Power fists on top of 2+3++(+1 to save rolls) 5+++, for less than our terminators cost, but common, do we really want that level of broken?

LOL, yes? If this was a limited bodyguard option I'd actually see no real problem with it.

Limited don't mean squat in our faction when we only have the points to take maybe two of a given unit anyway.

IMO what Custodes really need is existing units and weapons to be improved and diversified so there are more effective and meaningful options, not new units or new weapon loadouts. Right now everything blurs together too much, and it makes selections boring and predictable.

If they made our basic troops basically the equivalent of Heavy Deathwing Terminators, I think that would have a negative effect on our game style and I would have to break the arms of all my guardians to put on powerfists now.

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
If they made our basic troops basically the equivalent of Heavy Deathwing Terminators, I think that would have a negative effect on our game style and I would have to break the arms of all my guardians to put on powerfists now.

Our troops won't be able to use powerfists. The hetaeron guard is a very specific unit and if it ever were to be released, which I wouldn't hold my breath for to actually happen, they will definitely not be a troops choice.

I'm sorry, I thought someone said our "Shield guys" should be able to use powerfists. The only models we have that use shields are HQs and Troops. If you made a third unit that could, that would be an entirely new unit, which isn't what they were talking about. Hence my confusion.

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I'm sorry, I thought someone said our "Shield guys" should be able to use powerfists. The only models we have that use shields are HQs and Troops. If you made a third unit that could, that would be an entirely new unit, which isn't what they were talking about. Hence my confusion.

No need to apologize. Just to maybe clear up any confusion: the hetaeron guard have existed in our lore for some time. In 30k these are the guys who are personally with the emperor at all times, as of course not everyone of the ten thousand is permanently in the same room with the emperor. So these have to be the very best of our guys. In 40k the hetaeron guard are roughly equivalent with the 300 companions, who are stationed within the throne room at all times. So much for the lore.

The hetaeron guard actually have rules in 30k, which is where they can be equipped with storm shields and power fists. There was never a dedicated kit for them released however. Since Forgeworld massively expanded the custodes model range based on their 30k iteration, there was some hope they might release a dedicated hetaeron guard kit at some point, which in turn would mean that we would quite likely get rules for them in 40k, since every custodes unit from forgeworld (except constantin valdor for obvious reasons) also got 40k rules.

Tiberias wrote:

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
I'm sorry, I thought someone said our "Shield guys" should be able to use powerfists. The only models we have that use shields are HQs and Troops. If you made a third unit that could, that would be an entirely new unit, which isn't what they were talking about. Hence my confusion.

No need to apologize. Just to maybe clear up any confusion: the hetaeron guard have existed in our lore for some time. In 30k these are the guys who are personally with the emperor at all times, as of course not everyone of the ten thousand is permanently in the same room with the emperor. So these have to be the very best of our guys. In 40k the hetaeron guard are roughly equivalent with the 300 companions, who are stationed within the throne room at all times. So much for the lore.

The hetaeron guard actually have rules in 30k, which is where they can be equipped with storm shields and power fists. There was never a dedicated kit for them released however. Since Forgeworld massively expanded the custodes model range based on their 30k iteration, there was some hope they might release a dedicated hetaeron guard kit at some point, which in turn would mean that we would quite likely get rules for them in 40k, since every custodes unit from forgeworld (except constantin valdor for obvious reasons) also got 40k rules.

Sadly, pretty sure this falls squarely in Chapterhouse. If GW releases rules without a model, third parties can make a model for it. So unlikely to see these without a model release.

They could just do an arms upgrade sprue for wardens - not that I'd want them to, though. The army doesn't need another even more elite elites choice, it's overflowing with those already.

yukishiro1 wrote:
They could just do an arms upgrade sprue for wardens - not that I'd want them to, though. The army doesn't need another even more elite elites choice, it's overflowing with those already.

I'd not put it past GW to do something that dumb considering the cadian infantry upgrade sprue nonsense, but I hope to see at least one new kit with our codex release. It's likely going to be some sort of character (either sisters or custodes), since that is the easiest way for GW to make money. Just design a new monopose character, charge premium price for it....profit.

Not that I don't want to see new stuff for our faction, but when you factor in forgeworld and consider what units custodes have in the lore, our faction is pretty fleshed out. Now the problem with that is the fact that FW premium prices and working with resin keeps some hobbyists from getting access to basically half our factions units, which isn't optimal.
Considering that custodes are quite popular, maybe GW releases a plastic equivalent of a popular FW unit at some point, a dreadnought or transport/tank for example. But considering how well the FW custodes stuff has been selling over the past months, I don't think GW even has enough incentive to create a plastic transport or something similar.

Anyway, long story short. I wouldn't get my hopes up for a proper model release for us in 9th.

Don't they already do that? I mean it's not possible (I think) to buy several in codex Guard units (Astropath, Platoon Leader, Plasma Russ, Regular Commissar, and Veteran squads, if I am remembering correctly. They went away in 8th, and you can't find them anymore, but they still have current rules.

As for Custodes, it wouldn't be that hard for GW to release a simple "upgrade" spru, the SW Wolfpack unit that is literally just a weird bunch of reavers with an upgrade spru, is literally that. Same goes for DW primaris. Just make an upgrade spru for Custodian guard that enables them to replace their sword with a powerfist, done.

Looks like new Admech are going to be a brutal matchup for us based on how easily they dismantle death guard.
Vehicles seem like they are just waiting to die. And d3+3 lascannons make bikes and terminators risky.

Not only that, but the 20 man ranger blob is a death sentence to anything.

I know this is optimal, but 80 S5 Ap-2 D1 BS2 shots at 15" kill 4 Terminators or one squad of shield guard.
Considering their/our Infoslave skill is 12" without hit modifiers, that is a no-DS zone for literally anything.
Alt least the 20 vanguard blob with autowound on a hit of 4+ will pling of the 2+, but still hurt a bit.
Not special, since that setup is just a fusilade of fire that nothing can stand against...

If the new 1kSons/GK codex combo is just around the corner we are screwed. 2-3 wound Rubrics and Scarab Terminators? For the same costs?

Please correct me on that, but Auspex tactics dropped a vid on it and there was no changes on their points. So I guess their extra wound is free?

Those two armies have always been non favorable matchups for us. We probably don't survive the smite spam regardless of whether they have an extra wound or not. I would hold my horses though and wait to see what they actually get, maybe it won't be too oppressive, but even if it won't be, GK and tsons will in all probability remain a tough match up for us.

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
If the new 1kSons/GK codex combo is just around the corner we are screwed. 2-3 wound Rubrics and Scarab Terminators? For the same costs?

Please correct me on that, but Auspex tactics dropped a vid on it and there was no changes on their points. So I guess their extra wound is free?

Not quite.

The points in the Munitorum book are for the Codices, which have the wound update, other changes and are not released yet. We don't know what those points are.

The .pdf points GW released are temporary points only to be used until the Codices are released. Then you switch to the Munitorum points.

The .pdf points are the same as the points are now except in two places (one of them being Landraiders).

So what GW is saying is that despite the Munitorum releasing, their points stay the same till their Codices drop. Then they get point changes.

Telemon +20
Caladius -20

Thats it with MFM for us.

 Thairne wrote:
Telemon +20
Caladius -20

Thats it with MFM for us.

Keep in mind there's good odds that fakes are what are circling now.

That said, I can see this being real. We're in a decent spot and GW probably just wants us to wait for our Codex (because then they get more money).

Yeah but those were actual book photographs, not some weird digital thing.
And the book is on preorder tomorrow, so...

Was only the FW part tho, so things might still happen, but unlikely.

Tiberias wrote:Those two armies have always been non favorable matchups for us. We probably don't survive the smite spam regardless of whether they have an extra wound or not. I would hold my horses though and wait to see what they actually get, maybe it won't be too oppressive, but even if it won't be, GK and tsons will in all probability remain a tough match up for us.

I've always found Tzeentch-Thousand Sons to be very swingy: I played against a Thousand Sons - Tzeentch Daemons player twice about a month or 2 ago and I rolled over him both times because he didn't get his important powers off either because of failed to cast or deny's. He was unlucky but the games were super one sided and I wonder whether him getting his powers off would have made the games even or one sided in his favour. It just kind of felt like his shooting and combat phases didn't pick up any of the slack left by the poor psychic phases.

Thairne wrote:Telemon +20
Caladius -20

Thats it with MFM for us.

So basically nothing then, sweet.

Caladius is actually somewhat interesting at 100 points less than a Telemon.

yukishiro1 wrote:
Caladius is actually somewhat interesting at 100 points less than a Telemon.

Interesting and I will give them a go but a single Telemon still has the survivability of 2 and a half Calidus tanks vs something like a dark lance. Suppose you'll have to ask yourself if what your spending that extra 75pts on is worth losing out on our unkillable dread.

It's a 90 or 105 point difference for the loadouts people actually take. I'd still lean towards sticking with the Telemon, but it at least gives you something to think about, whereas right now it's just a bad joke.

Do you think its a bad idea to dive down the rabbit hole of "GW is holding back major point changes because codex soon"? Apparently the TS/GK codexes were supposed to be out last month originally?

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Do you think its a bad idea to dive down the rabbit hole of "GW is holding back major point changes because codex soon"? Apparently the TS/GK codexes were supposed to be out last month originally?

I don't think we'll see a codex for another year.

You know what would fix this whole BS problem? Digital editions.

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
You know what would fix this whole BS problem? Digital editions.

honestly? im hoping they do that with this planned warhammer+ thing, make it part of the service (maybe verify it with the same warhammer app codes they are already using, so they dont miss out on those sweet dead tree sales).

xerxeskingofking wrote:

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
You know what would fix this whole BS problem? Digital editions.

honestly? im hoping they do that with this planned warhammer+ thing, make it part of the service (maybe verify it with the same warhammer app codes they are already using, so they dont miss out on those sweet dead tree sales).

Dead tree sales is why it'll never happen. If we could just pay some amount per-month to be subscribed to all the rules, they wouldn't get their current bonus of having us pay for the app and then pay for books to use in the app.