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the_scotsman wrote:
aaaaaaand you can very clearly see a reference to a Grey Knights psychic power that says "if the target is a Daemon..."

In a game mode.

That doesn't have any daemons.

Games workshop not givin a flying flip.

I think you’re guaranteed to see Daemons show up with the Rogue Trader expansion. A couple of the Nurgle forces shown for that expansion look very Daemonic to me. Might see rules for others as well with the same expansion.

What I took away from todays article: Chaos Space Marines (troops) areso ugly.

 Sherrypie wrote:

Blastaar wrote:

 Boss Salvage wrote:


So Eldar = Guardian (+ Champ?), Storm Guardian (+ Champ?), Ranger, Dire Avenger (+ Exarch)

What the feth? What is the point in playing Eldar at all without access to Scorpions, Banshees, Hawks, Reapers and Spiders? Or Warlocks!? Did the Mighty Shadespire Team TM Masters of Balance TM and Deep Gameplay TM look at the Guardian weapon platform and decide that was enough?

...same as any other? Taking a group of mostly normal, non-superninja troops and playing with that Dirty Dozen of your own?

Once again, this isn't going to be a game of "anything goes" from the start but a pretty low-key commando skirmish without all the crazy that 40k normally is with its walking god-engines, endless zealot hordes and space elf Avengers.

That is precisely what turned me off of every previous version of Kill Team. What's so fun about taking a handful of identical, basic troops? That isn't a different game, it's playing at low points.

Keep in mind that for Eldar, Aspect Warriors are the commandos. Guardians are milita for crying out loud. And what are the odds that a Craftworld would send a team out on a clandestine mission without a seer?

Blastaar wrote:

 Sherrypie wrote:

Blastaar wrote:

 Boss Salvage wrote:


So Eldar = Guardian (+ Champ?), Storm Guardian (+ Champ?), Ranger, Dire Avenger (+ Exarch)

What the feth? What is the point in playing Eldar at all without access to Scorpions, Banshees, Hawks, Reapers and Spiders? Or Warlocks!? Did the Mighty Shadespire Team TM Masters of Balance TM and Deep Gameplay TM look at the Guardian weapon platform and decide that was enough?

...same as any other? Taking a group of mostly normal, non-superninja troops and playing with that Dirty Dozen of your own?

Once again, this isn't going to be a game of "anything goes" from the start but a pretty low-key commando skirmish without all the crazy that 40k normally is with its walking god-engines, endless zealot hordes and space elf Avengers.

That is precisely what turned me off of every previous version of Kill Team. What's so fun about taking a handful of identical, basic troops? That isn't a different game, it's playing at low points.

Keep in mind that for Eldar, Aspect Warriors are the commandos. Guardians are milita for crying out loud. And what are the odds that a Craftworld would send a team out on a clandestine mission without a seer?

Agreed - its very poor.

Blastaar wrote:

 Sherrypie wrote:

Blastaar wrote:

 Boss Salvage wrote:


So Eldar = Guardian (+ Champ?), Storm Guardian (+ Champ?), Ranger, Dire Avenger (+ Exarch)

What the feth? What is the point in playing Eldar at all without access to Scorpions, Banshees, Hawks, Reapers and Spiders? Or Warlocks!? Did the Mighty Shadespire Team TM Masters of Balance TM and Deep Gameplay TM look at the Guardian weapon platform and decide that was enough?

...same as any other? Taking a group of mostly normal, non-superninja troops and playing with that Dirty Dozen of your own?

Once again, this isn't going to be a game of "anything goes" from the start but a pretty low-key commando skirmish without all the crazy that 40k normally is with its walking god-engines, endless zealot hordes and space elf Avengers.

That is precisely what turned me off of every previous version of Kill Team. What's so fun about taking a handful of identical, basic troops? That isn't a different game, it's playing at low points.

Keep in mind that for Eldar, Aspect Warriors are the commandos. Guardians are milita for crying out loud. And what are the odds that a Craftworld would send a team out on a clandestine mission without a seer?

I'm not too sold on the identical, though. If you have maybe a dozen miniatures on the board, there is plenty to distinguish them from each other if one has a gun, one is geared for close combat, one is a demolition expert, one is a sniper and so forth. Games that have nothing but humans can manage, as can other forms of media too. Basic is underrated and yes, it is a different game and not just 40k at low points.

While I understand the ire and think something like Scorpions would fit in very well, the rest feel a bit silly. Reapers and Spiders for an example don't feel right here, where it's about the few Wild Geese duking it out against the odds. And the bit about the seers is silly, of course they send out those missions all the time. The seers direct their movements, they don't micromanage everything by being on every single commando raid.

Low-key. Mud and dust. Gritty, silent lull of war before the suddenly exploding dam bursts. Less ghostfaced screaming murderelves and more lying in the mud and I'm content with this launch. Perhaps we'll see the aspects later on, or you can pretty easily port them in yourself, since the statline is pretty much the same as in 40k.

CRAFTWORLDERS
10 Dire Avenger?
11 *Exarch?
7 Guardian?
8 *Gunner/Champ?
11 Ranger
6 Storm Guardian?
7 *Gunner/Champ?

0 Chainsword?
0 Aeldari Blade?
2 Diresword?
1 Power glaive?

2 Shuriken Cannon
3 Starcannon
0 Shuriken Catapult
0 Avenger Shuriken Catapult
3 Fusion Gun
4 Bright Lance
3 Flamer
5 Aeldari Missle Launcher
0 Ranger Long Rifle
0 Shuriken Pistol
0 Plasma Grenade
2 Scatter Laser

4 Mirror Shield

With some guesses on the gun points + ccw names.

CSM
4 Cultist
4+ *Gunner
4+ *Champ
13 Chaos Space Marine
13 *Gunner
13+ *Champ

3 Mark of Khorne?
1 Mark of Tzeentch?
5? Mark of Nurgle?
3 Mark of Slaanesh?
1 Mark of Vengeance?
^ This might be the icon bearer only, in which case I'm not sure if other CSM share the mark or only the bearer gets it?

0 Bolter
5 Heavy Bolter
3? Meltagun?
5 Plasma gun
0 Shotgun?
0 Autogun?
0 Frag Grenade
0 Krak Grenade
1 Flamer
5 Stubber?
1 Plasma Pistol
0 Bolt Pistol
0 Autopistol?

0 Brutal Assault Weapons
1 Power Sword
0 Chainsword
4 Power Fist

Pretty muddy screenshots for these ones, and I'm guessing that the marks are in that order and cost points at all (not sure what other special table Chaos would get, plus the overleaf with the mark rules).

DEATH GUARD
14 Plague Marine
15 *Gunner
15 *Fighter
15 *Champ
3 Poxwalker

0 Poxwalker ccw?
0 Plague Knife?
0 Plaguesword?
4 Flail of Corruption?
4 Power Fist?
4 Great Plague Cleaver?
2 Balesword?
3 Mace of Contagion?

0 Bolter
3 Meltagun
3? Plasma Gun
4 Plaguespewer?
0 Blight Grenades
0 Krak Grenade
3 Blight Launcher?
1 Plasma Pistol
0 Bolt Pistol
3 Plaguebelcher?

3 Icon of Despair

Man that was a lot of cross referencing to wade through the French ...

- Salvage

 Sherrypie wrote:

Blastaar wrote:

 Sherrypie wrote:

Blastaar wrote:

 Boss Salvage wrote:


So Eldar = Guardian (+ Champ?), Storm Guardian (+ Champ?), Ranger, Dire Avenger (+ Exarch)

What the feth? What is the point in playing Eldar at all without access to Scorpions, Banshees, Hawks, Reapers and Spiders? Or Warlocks!? Did the Mighty Shadespire Team TM Masters of Balance TM and Deep Gameplay TM look at the Guardian weapon platform and decide that was enough?

...same as any other? Taking a group of mostly normal, non-superninja troops and playing with that Dirty Dozen of your own?

Once again, this isn't going to be a game of "anything goes" from the start but a pretty low-key commando skirmish without all the crazy that 40k normally is with its walking god-engines, endless zealot hordes and space elf Avengers.

That is precisely what turned me off of every previous version of Kill Team. What's so fun about taking a handful of identical, basic troops? That isn't a different game, it's playing at low points.

Keep in mind that for Eldar, Aspect Warriors are the commandos. Guardians are milita for crying out loud. And what are the odds that a Craftworld would send a team out on a clandestine mission without a seer?

I'm not too sold on the identical, though. If you have maybe a dozen miniatures on the board, there is plenty to distinguish them from each other if one has a gun, one is geared for close combat, one is a demolition expert, one is a sniper and so forth. Games that have nothing but humans can manage, as can other forms of media too. Basic is underrated and yes, it is a different game and not just 40k at low points.

While I understand the ire and think something like Scorpions would fit in very well, the rest feel a bit silly. Reapers and Spiders for an example don't feel right here, where it's about the few Wild Geese duking it out against the odds. And the bit about the seers is silly, of course they send out those missions all the time. The seers direct their movements, they don't micromanage everything by being on every single commando raid.

Low-key. Mud and dust. Gritty, silent lull of war before the suddenly exploding dam bursts. Less ghostfaced screaming murderelves and more lying in the mud and I'm content with this launch. Perhaps we'll see the aspects later on, or you can pretty easily port them in yourself, since the statline is pretty much the same as in 40k.

Given that - why would you send Guardians when you have a elite warriors whose only job is to carry out these missions and if they can't do it then the rangers would - if you were allowed to actually equip them with a variety of Eldar weapons Equipment and not straightjacketedby copy pasting unit blocks.

The unit selections we have seen have nothing to do with balance or fluff - its just easier for them.

daemons might feature in some of the missions esp narative ones. Think there was mention of a horde 'see how long you can survive' game type mentioned on WHC

I'm already painting up poxwalkers, priorities be damned..!

 Latro_ wrote:
daemons might feature in some of the missions esp narative ones. Think there was mention of a horde 'see how long you can survive' game type mentioned on WHC

There was - it was against Poxwalkers, which are already in the game.

the_scotsman wrote:
Interesting that the frenchified version of the rulebook still has all the names in English. It's not a "marine du spess en chaosisme" or an "un du flayment". But all the weapons have been french'd.

It was not the case before, but since a few editions of WH40k, it's a trend. I suspect that it's for the copyrights and not having errors with different translations.
I'm still calling my warlock "archonte", my wraitguard "guarde fantôme" or my stormbolter "fulgurant". Maybe one day my "moëlle spectrale" will become wraithbone...

To everyone freaking out about this, or that.
Chill. Be patient.

During the first few expansions for Shadespire, lots of cards looked useless. Once the whole block was released, these cards had proper combos.

There is such a thing as future-proofing with rules.

One thing people don't seem to be talking about much is the RIDICULOUSLY low prices for wargear here. 2 points for a scatter laser?3 points for exchanging your shuricat for a fusion? I guess with all the - to hit flying gear would have to be cheap but flamers are also 3pts and we know they still autohit.

They are actually releasing quite a few different units and options all at once.

Compare to shadespire, which had 8 sides (which were all fixed), only 12 activations a game and a few hundred cards in total.

They've said they are supporting it in future, yes unit x and y might be missing now but it's day 1 and there are years to go.

Something strange in the Heretic Astartes Focus. The Beseech the God's tactic costs 2 command points and is used in the first battle round. Yet in the Kill Team article on the 5th of July it says you only get one command point per turn. On the first round you would only have one command point?

Either it's a mistake or there are ways of purchasing extra command points like in Aos.

Major differences between Shadespire and this.

Shadespire is a different rules system. This is 40k with a few Necormunda rules bolted on

Almost every model in Shadespire is unique complete with a unique profile - this is just copy pasting stat blocks with a few extra rules and pts changes.

Shadespire had new models - this is just reboxing which is the element thats choosing the including units - not fluff, rules or balance.

Shadespire does not allow customisation becuase the models are unique and balanced for that - this pretends to have some choice but has a massively restricted equipment and weapons again just based on copy/pasted stat blocks.

 Mr Morden wrote:
Major differences between Shadespire and this.

Shadespire is a different rules system. This is 40k with a few Necormunda rules bolted on

Almost every model in Shadespire is unique complete with a unique profile - this is just copy pasting stat blocks with a few extra rules and pts changes.

Shadespire had new models - this is just reboxing which is the element thats choosing the including units - not fluff, rules or balance.

Shadespire does not allow customisation becuase the models are unique and balanced for that - this pretends to have some choice but has a massively restricted equipment and weapons again just based on copy/pasted stat blocks.

Literally nobody has compared the systems. Please read fully what others say.
The only comparison being made was in the way shadespire initially looked bonkey and nonsensical, only to have later expansions make sense of everything.
The same team designed Kill Team.
So we should expect the same thing - especially when they're telling us to expect expansions for Kill Team.
The games aren't even at all similar.

A CSM is 13 points, but a Plague Marine is only 14? Something pretty drastic in the rules must have changed to validate that adjustment.

I also like how Necrons are cheaper in this system even though we got a massively better rule than we did in 40k.

Wow a starter for 130 before discounts seems too good to pass up. I initially was only in for terrain and the rules. But sheesh for that price I might as well get everything and sell the kill teams if i dont want them.

Neronoxx wrote:
To everyone freaking out about this, or that.
Chill. Be patient.

That's simply not possible. Forumhammer is the #1 sport and everyone is vying to be the Master Complainer.

This is not future-proofing. Future-proofing is writing the main rules in such a way that new units can be added to the game later without causing balance problems or requiring new mechanics to function properly because the core of the game was designed to support them to begin with. Limiting options so severely is withholding content, so that they can charge us again for the same product.

GW has been making games for 30+ years- the time "wait and see" how 8th, KT or whatever develops, or to "be patient" is long past. They should be able to get things right by now.

Latro_ wrote:no their function is they are chosen and are better... the kinda guys you'd send on a mission...

more attacks, better leadership + x other spec KT rule they could have to be different from normal marines

It's the same as Guard Veterans, or why there's no Sternguard.

You make your own Veterans/Chosen with the specialist trees.

I was first of the opinion that Chaos should be CSM/Cultists/Possessed/Chosen, but I see that Chosen wouldn't be needed (due to the aforementioned specialist trees). Possessed would be cool, but as the "Beseech the Gods" tactic shows, maybe you can get away with converting a single Possessed and always using the Beseech tactic to "make" them Possessed?

Some news on the Gellerpox Mutants (from the Rogue Trader expansion)

https://war-of-sigmar.herokuapp.com/bloggings/3143

So chaos incursion caused by gellar fields collapsing confirmed, nice.

“Glitchlings” - Awesome.

I've not read all 60 pages, apologies if I missed this...

(Assuming I already have bucket loads of figures from a variety of armies)

If I get the rule book, will that allow me to play a full game? Or, am I going to need to wait for Kill Team War book 1, book 2, WD articles etc?

So the content of "Kill Team : Rogue Trader" would be :

The "Elucidian Starstriders" Team :

- 1 Rogue Trader Elucia Vhane
- 1 Lectro-Maester Larsen Van Der Grauss
- 1 Rejuvenat Adept Sanistasia Minst
- 1 Executionner Knosso Prond
- 1 Voidmaster Nitsch
- 3 Voidguards (?)
- 1 Voidguard with Autocanon
- 1 Voidguard Imperial Dog

The "Gellerpox Mutants" Team :

- 1 Vulgrar Thrice-Cursed
- 3 Nightmare Hulks
- 3 Gellerpox Mutants
- 4 Glitchlings
- 10 Mutoid Vermin (4 Flies Swarm, 4 Mites, 2 Maggots)

Space ship tiles and small plastic objectives / scenery

 Gimgamgoo wrote:
I've not read all 60 pages, apologies if I missed this...

(Assuming I already have bucket loads of figures from a variety of armies)

If I get the rule book, will that allow me to play a full game? Or, am I going to need to wait for Kill Team War book 1, book 2, WD articles etc?

No.. you just need the rulebook. It contains the core rules and all the lists you need to field any of the listed units.

While we're at it!

Seeing as Rogue Trader has now thoroughly been confirmed as an expansion for Kill Team and KT itself being touted as a supported system, it's high time to merge threads and restructure the OP into something a bit more informative for future use!

So, if anyone has the images and trailer from Rogue Trader handy, please post them here along with any other proper rumours, I'll add them to the OP tomorrow.

Thanks in advance!

These previews were going so well, until this phrase appeared:



Mortal Wound.

*sigh*

the_scotsman wrote:
aaaaaaand you can very clearly see a reference to a Grey Knights psychic power that says "if the target is a Daemon..."

In a game mode.

That doesn't have any daemons.

Games workshop not givin a flying flip.

Yeah, 'cause you wouldn't want to future proof your core rules in any way...