Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.
Question: has anyone tried playing 9th using 2 wound CSMs? If so, any thoughts?
Friend of mine from Texas said this is a thing, he's been to a few stores where that's the house rule.
We found it to be somewhat "meh". We didn't bother with adjusting the points, so we just took them at the current points level and gave them 2 wounds. Helped a bit against things like the bomb dropping Archeopter as it was no longer wiping out half a unit on good rolls, but I still think they're going to end up almost worse for it (due to the price increase) unless they also get easy access to some kind of damage mitigation tool (like a chaos version of Transhuman, or a -1 to a min. of 1 type of deal).
I would almost rather they have kept the 1w and gone to T5. IDK what the math says, but that at least feels better. Most of the time, the 2 wounds didn't really keep them around that much longer, so much as it made it so that there was less "overkill" when they were eventually wiped.
The exception was my Iron Warriors list that has 4 squads of 5 marines each backing a ton of aggressive monsters (Leviathan dread, mauler fiends, Disco Lords, Venom Crawler, etc). There's a lot of big stuff moving forward that eats shots while the marines skulk in behind them to get objectives. They performed slightly better in this list. Also helps that I ended up using the IW 6+ FnP strat almost every turn of every game. There, the 2w made a difference. In armies without this though? Meh ...
Edit: I just googled ablutions and apparently it does not including dropping a duece. I should have looked it up early sorry for any confusion. - Baldsmug
Psiensis on the "good old days":
"Kids these days...
... I invented the 6th Ed meta back in 3rd ed.
Wait, what were we talking about again? Did I ever tell you about the time I gave you five bees for a quarter? That's what you'd say in those days, "give me five bees for a quarter", is what you'd say in those days. And you'd go down to the D&D shop, with an onion in your belt, 'cause that was the style of the time. So there I was in the D&D shop..."
There’s a rules FAQ that’s confirmed that if you teleport onto the roof of a 10” tall building, and there’s an enemy on the ground floor, you only need to make a 5” charge in order to get within engagement range
Question: has anyone tried playing 9th using 2 wound CSMs? If so, any thoughts?
Friend of mine from Texas said this is a thing, he's been to a few stores where that's the house rule.
We found it to be somewhat "meh". We didn't bother with adjusting the points, so we just took them at the current points level and gave them 2 wounds. Helped a bit against things like the bomb dropping Archeopter as it was no longer wiping out half a unit on good rolls, but I still think they're going to end up almost worse for it (due to the price increase) unless they also get easy access to some kind of damage mitigation tool (like a chaos version of Transhuman, or a -1 to a min. of 1 type of deal).
I would almost rather they have kept the 1w and gone to T5. IDK what the math says, but that at least feels better. Most of the time, the 2 wounds didn't really keep them around that much longer, so much as it made it so that there was less "overkill" when they were eventually wiped.
The exception was my Iron Warriors list that has 4 squads of 5 marines each backing a ton of aggressive monsters (Leviathan dread, mauler fiends, Disco Lords, Venom Crawler, etc). There's a lot of big stuff moving forward that eats shots while the marines skulk in behind them to get objectives. They performed slightly better in this list. Also helps that I ended up using the IW 6+ FnP strat almost every turn of every game. There, the 2w made a difference. In armies without this though? Meh ...
Thanks for the heads up. That's about the same as I've heard from others, let's see if anyone else chimes in.
Based on what we've seen so far in the 9th edition codices, is it likely that elites like berzerkers and Plague Marines will get the Core keyword? I'm building a CSM that is going to be heavy on PM.
Blood Angels have Death Company as Core. So maybe. I don't know. I left 8th from Loyalist Fandex favouritism so our book not being laughably gak next to theirs is what I'm waiting for before any idea of buying back in.
BlaxicanX wrote: A young business man named Tom Kirby, who was a pupil of mine until he turned greedy, helped the capitalists hunt down and destroy the wargamers. He betrayed and murdered Games Workshop.
Eldenfirefly wrote: I am very hopeful for CSM codex after seeing what GW did with Deathguard!
Yeaaahh partially.
The equipment option culling imo is unaceptable, it never was and the artificially implemented 1:1 ratio for specific units is artifically implemented and shows that GW capitulated to actually understand as to why the core rules influence heavy and light infantry .
Other than that, yeah it seems like a solid book with great options, but watch the new CSM dex beeing BL and renegades once again..
I do hope though that we will see a custom trait table ..
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
So with the new points out, what's the best loadout for CSM Terminators?
I keep seeing single claw/C. Bolter but I just want to be sure before gluing on things (Magnetising the guns though).
Black Templars: WIP
Night Lords (30/40k): WIP
Red Corsairs: WIP
Iron Warriors: WIP
Orks: 6000pts
Batman Miniatures Game: Mr.Freeze, Joker
Ever wanted a better 5th ed. 40k? Take a look at 5th ed. Reforged! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/794253.page
Why would you ever use a single claw ? Its S4. The champ gets a power fist, and a combi gun (plasma or melta), one model (in a 5 model unit) gets another combi plasma or melta, and power axes/combi bolter for the rest. In a ten model unit two more models will get combi melta or plasma.
p5freak wrote: Why would you ever use a single claw ? Its S4. The champ gets a power fist, and a combi gun (plasma or melta), one model (in a 5 model unit) gets another combi plasma or melta, and power axes/combi bolter for the rest. In a ten model unit two more models will get combi melta or plasma.
Single claws are a fine choice, +1 attack per claw now so they generally outperform the other power weapons except in real niche situations, and you get the most attacks per turn per model from shooting the bolter and fighting with a single claw (also at the lowest price per model).
Single claws also work well in chosen when rocking special weapons, or as a back up on a chaos lord with a daemon weapon (expecially a red butcher world eater termy lord).
So just a quick weird question. Has anyone ever fielded or played against Noise marines who were not all (maybe except champ) equipped with sonic blasters and/or a blastmaster? The original all metal models could only take noise weapons. The mix plastic/metal box changed it and then the codex allowed for them to be equipped as basically CSM marines. But why pay a premium to field what is basically a CSM marine? Why not just make the sonic blaster default? Anyway random thought.
xeen wrote: So just a quick weird question. Has anyone ever fielded or played against Noise marines who were not all (maybe except champ) equipped with sonic blasters and/or a blastmaster? The original all metal models could only take noise weapons. The mix plastic/metal box changed it and then the codex allowed for them to be equipped as basically CSM marines. But why pay a premium to field what is basically a CSM marine? Why not just make the sonic blaster default? Anyway random thought.
This seems to change every edition or so. 4th Ed they could take a sonic blaster, chainsword, and bolter, and always struck first in melee due to their initiative. Then 6th Ed made Sonic Blasters were absolute trash, and forced an either all sonic of melee loadout. So you played them with either Blastmasters and bolters or melee with a Doom Siren on the champ. Most chaos players outside of Emperor Children didn't take either. Then the 8th Ed hit and suddenly Sonic Blasters were good again, and the melee loadout only has +1 attack and Music of the Apocalypse over a regular CSM. They were much more viable in melee when they were actually guaranteed to always fight first whether charging or not; basically up to the 8th. They were also decent without sonics after Traitor Legions came out and gave them FNP, and an attack if the were somehow killed by something with higher initiative.
Your right though outside of those past instances there is no good reason to run Noise Marines without sonics weapons, and its a real shame.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/02/06 23:13:24
Iron warriors player here (although I've not played a game yet due to lockdown) I've got 2 forgefiends/mauler fiends. What build would people suggest? I'm considering magnetising but game wise I'm thinking of using them as my beatstick with a disco lord and venom crawler all going forward to contest the middle of the board.
The Warp Forge wrote: So with the new points out, what's the best loadout for CSM Terminators?
After seeing what happened to Blightlords in the DG codex, I personally will not be building any more Terminator models until the codex is out. It's entirely possible any loadout that isn't specifically illustrated in the assembly instructions might be made illegal.
A little bit of righteous anger now and then is good, actually. Don't trust a person who never gets angry.
The Warp Forge wrote: So with the new points out, what's the best loadout for CSM Terminators?
After seeing what happened to Blightlords in the DG codex, I personally will not be building any more Terminator models until the codex is out. It's entirely possible any loadout that isn't specifically illustrated in the assembly instructions might be made illegal.
I feel as if in the wrong movie.
Like i don't think we should be afraid to customize our units, nor to build them definitively and yet here we are....
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
Its a pain in the backside to somehow mark models to show what weapon they actually have, when GW decides they can only have one combi weapon each, and one melee weapon from each kind, when you built them with all chainaxes and combibolters. I like WYSIWYG, its not a rule, it makes the game easier when you models are modelled with the weapons they really have. I have magnetized my termis, but i only have twenty chainaxes, ten combiplasma and ten combimelta. If GW now says a squad can only have one combi melta, one combi plasma, one combi flamer, one chain axe, one power axe, one power sword, etc. i am screwed.
p5freak wrote: Its a pain in the backside to somehow mark models to show what weapon they actually have, when GW decides they can only have one combi weapon each, and one melee weapon from each kind, when you built them with all chainaxes and combibolters. I like WYSIWYG, its not a rule, it makes the game easier when you models are modelled with the weapons they really have. I have magnetized my termis, but i only have twenty chainaxes, ten combiplasma and ten combimelta. If GW now says a squad can only have one combi melta, one combi plasma, one combi flamer, one chain axe, one power axe, one power sword, etc. i am screwed.
not to mention that this change doesn't make it easier for the newbies aswell, considering the litany of law text paragraph f.e. PM have turned into..
So basically, beyond an attempt at screwing over 3rd parties, gw has done everyone a disservice...
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
Battle Size [12CP]: 3. Strike Force (101-200 Total PL / 1001-2000 Points)
Chaos Allegiance: Chaos Undivided
Detachment Command Cost
+ Stratagems +
Rewards of Chaos (1 Relic) [-1CP]
+ HQ +
Bloodthirster of Insensate Rage [13 PL, 250pts, -1CP]: Armour of Scorn
. Exalted Bloodthirster: 1. Hellfire-wrought Armour
Lord of Change [14 PL, 270pts, -1CP]: Gaze of Fate, Incorporeal Form, Infernal Gateway, The Impossible Robe, Treason of Tzeentch, Warlord
. Exalted Lord of Change: 6. Architect of Deception
The idea here, is to send the nurglings to the objectives/table corners and shove the rest of the units to my opponent's face.
There seems to be a decent synergy between the disco-lord and the Brass Scorpion/Blood Slaughterer... as so long as the disco-lord is within 6" of the Scorpion, it hits on 2+ in both assault and shooting (not that it'd need it). Also, with Blood Slaughterer hitting on 2s instead of 3s.
The Exalted Thrister and Exalted LoC are configured for durability to add to the army's overall threat.
With one SuperHeavy and 3 HQs, so I don't think I'm bleeding VPs to my opponent in this list....other than any vehicle victory conditions...
Thoughts?
EDIT: I'll crosspost this in Army List as it's probably more appropriate there.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/02/04 16:22:10
Just a quick question guys. The wife and I are finally delving into 9th after a short hiatus from 40k, and I was curious what Chaos was doing as a faction. If we're updating our armies for slightly more competitive play what Chaos stuff improved over 8th edition, what got worse, etc...
Also, are any supplements like Psychic Awakening still valid? I bought, but never tried the book + Fabius Bile.
in CSM, obliterators are good. Especially Iron Warrior Obliterators. Berserkers are still good too. You need to get them into charge range though, and they are very fragile. Abaddon is still really good too. Possessed are good too, but you need to build a list around them to get the best out of them, and soup it with Slanaash chaos daemons so that they can advance and charge.
And Chaos daemons are really strong right now because Slanaash daemons are strong.
Eldenfirefly wrote: And Chaos daemons are really strong right now because Slanaash daemons are strong.
Slaanesh Daemons are fantastic.
Chaos undivided detachments comprised of Nurgle and Tzeentch are good.
Pure Nurgle or pure Tzeentch are meh.
Khorne is the red-headed step child that got left at the park.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/02/08 00:14:44
whembly wrote: Hey guys, just wanting to do a little theoryhammering about this list I'm going to bring to a 2k point tournament at the end of the month.
I've yet to play a game under the new CA, but I understand that there's a premium to secure objectives and mobility.
Please critique and correct me if I get any rules/strategies incorrect.
Battle Size [12CP]: 3. Strike Force (101-200 Total PL / 1001-2000 Points)
Chaos Allegiance: Chaos Undivided
Detachment Command Cost
+ Stratagems +
Rewards of Chaos (1 Relic) [-1CP]
+ HQ +
Bloodthirster of Insensate Rage [13 PL, 250pts, -1CP]: Armour of Scorn
. Exalted Bloodthirster: 1. Hellfire-wrought Armour
Lord of Change [14 PL, 270pts, -1CP]: Gaze of Fate, Incorporeal Form, Infernal Gateway, The Impossible Robe, Treason of Tzeentch, Warlord
. Exalted Lord of Change: 6. Architect of Deception
The idea here, is to send the nurglings to the objectives/table corners and shove the rest of the units to my opponent's face.
There seems to be a decent synergy between the disco-lord and the Brass Scorpion/Blood Slaughterer... as so long as the disco-lord is within 6" of the Scorpion, it hits on 2+ in both assault and shooting (not that it'd need it). Also, with Blood Slaughterer hitting on 2s instead of 3s.
The Exalted Thrister and Exalted LoC are configured for durability to add to the army's overall threat.
With one SuperHeavy and 3 HQs, so I don't think I'm bleeding VPs to my opponent in this list....other than any vehicle victory conditions...
Thoughts?
EDIT: I'll crosspost this in Army List as it's probably more appropriate there.
I think in a competitive setting, there are going to be shooty lists that literally kill your Greater Brass Scorpian on turn 1. Just something to think about.
whembly wrote: Hey guys, just wanting to do a little theoryhammering about this list I'm going to bring to a 2k point tournament at the end of the month.
I've yet to play a game under the new CA, but I understand that there's a premium to secure objectives and mobility.
Please critique and correct me if I get any rules/strategies incorrect.
Battle Size [12CP]: 3. Strike Force (101-200 Total PL / 1001-2000 Points)
Chaos Allegiance: Chaos Undivided
Detachment Command Cost
+ Stratagems +
Rewards of Chaos (1 Relic) [-1CP]
+ HQ +
Bloodthirster of Insensate Rage [13 PL, 250pts, -1CP]: Armour of Scorn
. Exalted Bloodthirster: 1. Hellfire-wrought Armour
Lord of Change [14 PL, 270pts, -1CP]: Gaze of Fate, Incorporeal Form, Infernal Gateway, The Impossible Robe, Treason of Tzeentch, Warlord
. Exalted Lord of Change: 6. Architect of Deception
The idea here, is to send the nurglings to the objectives/table corners and shove the rest of the units to my opponent's face.
There seems to be a decent synergy between the disco-lord and the Brass Scorpion/Blood Slaughterer... as so long as the disco-lord is within 6" of the Scorpion, it hits on 2+ in both assault and shooting (not that it'd need it). Also, with Blood Slaughterer hitting on 2s instead of 3s.
The Exalted Thrister and Exalted LoC are configured for durability to add to the army's overall threat.
With one SuperHeavy and 3 HQs, so I don't think I'm bleeding VPs to my opponent in this list....other than any vehicle victory conditions...
Thoughts?
EDIT: I'll crosspost this in Army List as it's probably more appropriate there.
I think in a competitive setting, there are going to be shooty lists that literally kill your Greater Brass Scorpian on turn 1. Just something to think about.
Yeah, Brass Scorpion isn't all that much different than the Knights, just a wee bit faster. So, any list that can shoot/weather Knights would do just fine.
I ran into blade guard units with this list, and the amount of 4++ with the apothecary and captain auras, those units tanked the Scorpion easily.
I'm probably going to drop the scorpion (probably in favor of Mortarion), because my meta is mostly marines, and it'll be worst when the new Dark Angels codex.
The transhuman strat is a game changer and the only decent counter I can think of, is weight of fire against marines.
I will say that nurglings for obj scoring are stellar, especially using that strat to get a base back on a 5+ for each model destroyed in a phase. I only had 3 bases per unit, and now I'm thinking 4 nurgling base is the sweet spot (you have to do 16 wounds to destroy the unit in one go).
I will say that 9th is a vastly different game than any edition with all the Primary/Secondary scoring... I'm realizing that I need to build my list to maximize the scoring, rather than building a TAC/Counter to the meta.
NewTruthNeomaxim wrote: May I ask which Slaanesh Daemons are good? We own stupid amounts of Nurgle, Tzeentch, and Khorne, but I never really amassed much Slaanesh.
they play great the mission, fast, take early obj and have big swing in melee, and most of times you need melee to win, you must move on objectives. Often they are paired with nurgle/tzeentch, nurglings keep backfield obj, keepers/Loc keep pressure. A nice list play EC patrol with 20 sl termies.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/02/08 22:48:14
3rd place league tournament
03-18-2018
2nd place league tournament
06-12-2018
3rd place league
tournament
12-09-2018
3rd place league tournament
01-13-2019
1st place league tournament
01-27-2019
1st place league
tournament
02-25-2019
Black Templars: WIP
Night Lords (30/40k): WIP
Iron Warriors: WIP
Orks: 6000pts
4980pts Total (4980pts painted)
3730 Total (210pts painted) 
