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the_scotsman wrote: "Steve that Havoc sprue sure does look great! Love it! I just had one note from the focus group here....uh...
'it seems like people tend to get annoyed when we include only a single copy of each weapon on the sprue, especially when the loyalist equivalent to this unit actually gets two copies of each'
What do you make of that Steve?"
"Oh, those whiners! Look, if I included TWO copies of any of the heavy weapons, I wouldn't have space on here for a melta gun, flamer, power maul, chainsword, bolter, mandatory basing rock, plasma gun or bespoke loincloth for the havoc sergeant!
EEEEEEVERYONE knows you give that guy as many upgrades as you can cram on him! Why, if my havocs ever left home without their Power Maul/Melta Gun sergeant how would they ever get anything done?"
There’s either a doubled sprue or another sprue as there’s only 3 bodies there.
The havoc sprue confuses me. I guess maybe you get two of it in the box? Because otherwise there'd need to be a sprue of 2 more guys and some more guns - not sure which.
I guess that might be it. The SM one doesn't have doubles of each gun, only some of them, so maybe the extra sprue will have 2 guys and a second one of some or other guns.
Of course, there'll also be things like the autocannon guys from Shadowspear and whatever's in the "tactical" squad box as well. So in the end I think building a havoc squad will be a lot like building a devastator squad.
the_scotsman wrote: "Steve that Havoc sprue sure does look great! Love it! I just had one note from the focus group here....uh...
'it seems like people tend to get annoyed when we include only a single copy of each weapon on the sprue, especially when the loyalist equivalent to this unit actually gets two copies of each'
What do you make of that Steve?"
"Oh, those whiners! Look, if I included TWO copies of any of the heavy weapons, I wouldn't have space on here for a melta gun, flamer, power maul, chainsword, bolter, mandatory basing rock, plasma gun or bespoke loincloth for the havoc sergeant!
EEEEEEVERYONE knows you give that guy as many upgrades as you can cram on him! Why, if my havocs ever left home without their Power Maul/Melta Gun sergeant how would they ever get anything done?"
Dude, we only see one of probably 2 sprues for the HAvoc box, because ATM there are only 3 completely assembleable dudes in that sprue, min is 5 however, so maybee we get doubles?
Exactly. There MUST either be a 3rd sprue we haven't seen that has the other 2 dudes, or both of the sprue we've seen are included twice in each box
the_scotsman wrote: "Steve that Havoc sprue sure does look great! Love it! I just had one note from the focus group here....uh...
'it seems like people tend to get annoyed when we include only a single copy of each weapon on the sprue, especially when the loyalist equivalent to this unit actually gets two copies of each'
What do you make of that Steve?"
"Oh, those whiners! Look, if I included TWO copies of any of the heavy weapons, I wouldn't have space on here for a melta gun, flamer, power maul, chainsword, bolter, mandatory basing rock, plasma gun or bespoke loincloth for the havoc sergeant!
EEEEEEVERYONE knows you give that guy as many upgrades as you can cram on him! Why, if my havocs ever left home without their Power Maul/Melta Gun sergeant how would they ever get anything done?"
Dude, we only see one of probably 2 sprues for the HAvoc box, because ATM there are only 3 completely assembleable dudes in that sprue, min is 5 however, so maybee we get doubles?
Exactly. There MUST either be a 3rd sprue we haven't seen that has the other 2 dudes, or both of the sprue we've seen are included twice in each box
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I wouldn't mind A 6 man Havoc box, altough i am unsure as to why the havoc champion has a PG in the hand, even though he can't have one.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/03/22 16:09:15
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
the_scotsman wrote: "Steve that Havoc sprue sure does look great! Love it! I just had one note from the focus group here....uh...
'it seems like people tend to get annoyed when we include only a single copy of each weapon on the sprue, especially when the loyalist equivalent to this unit actually gets two copies of each'
What do you make of that Steve?"
"Oh, those whiners! Look, if I included TWO copies of any of the heavy weapons, I wouldn't have space on here for a melta gun, flamer, power maul, chainsword, bolter, mandatory basing rock, plasma gun or bespoke loincloth for the havoc sergeant!
EEEEEEVERYONE knows you give that guy as many upgrades as you can cram on him! Why, if my havocs ever left home without their Power Maul/Melta Gun sergeant how would they ever get anything done?"
Dude, we only see one of probably 2 sprues for the HAvoc box, because ATM there are only 3 completely assembleable dudes in that sprue, min is 5 however, so maybee we get doubles?
That'd be awesome, I'm just amused by the fact that they put flamers/meltas/power weapons in there. It's a very GW thing to do.
"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"
"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"
"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"
"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!"
This may be premature but…. I am beginning to think the Emperor's Children will be rolled into the new Chaos Marine book instead of getting their own book like the Deathguard/Thousand Sons. GW just does not know what to do with Slaanesh. It's really sad because my first chaos army for 40K Rogue Trader was a Slaanesh Warband from the old Realm of Chaos book. That is how long I have been waiting for GW to do something cool with Slaanesh. They need to get rid of the mouth-speaker Noise Marines, which look totally dumb, and go with an esthetic like Forge World did with Eidolan. Heavy metal rockers with head shaved on one side and long hair on the other, attractive and strange at the same time, not bug-eyed mouth-speakers. A proper set of plastic noise marines with guns that actually look like guitars! And a few new characters/followers(groupies) to round them out. I know the lore says they don't function as a legion any more, but neither did Thousand Sons until they ret-conned them. And if they make a Fulgrim model I think they would put the band back together for another tour!
Yeah, I wish EC and WE Codices would hurry up an drop with their Primarchs. It grates my OCD that all 4 god-aligned Legions don't have equal representation in the rules.
But it's pretty much par for the course with GW. I remember when Khorne Deamonkin came out and everyone thought other Daemonkin books would follow. It almost looked like Tzeentch was going to get a 40K equivalent after it's big AoS release and Tsons came out. But then 8E dropped and KDK disappeared as a faction.
I have my doubts that EC or WE will get a full Codex. And even if they do, who knows if Fulgrim or Angron will get rules/models to go with them.
Albino Squirrel wrote: The painted unit has 5 different bodies. So must be another sprue.
While I agree there is probably a 3rd sprue, I actually don't think the painted imagine is 100% proof of 5 unique bodies. The grieves/chain loincloths appear to be separate bits, so the ML/LC model could be the same "pose" just with alternate details. Same with the Rotocannon/HB models There is still a possibility that the 2 sprue we have seen are it, but they are doubled in the kit
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This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2019/03/22 16:37:24
Hopefully the missing havoc sprue will have alternate left arms for the lascannon guy. Like maybe 4 god-specific offensive hand gestures plus one for Chaos Undivided. Don't let me down gdubs.
I really need the GW marketing team to stop shooting themselves in the foot. You can not leave space for speculation on the future of the product your trying to sell in the tabletop environment.
Either people will speculate and then be disappointed when it doesn't come true or people will speculate negatively and be pushed away because of the uncertainty.
If your going to show the havoc sprue, then show all of it. Showing some of it was a terrible idea. Now people are worried if there is only one of each weapon or if you can even only take one of each weapon, etc erc.
Galef wrote: Yeah, I wish EC and WE Codices would hurry up an drop with their Primarchs. It grates my OCD that all 4 god-aligned Legions don't have equal representation in the rules.
But it's pretty much par for the course with GW. I remember when Khorne Deamonkin came out and everyone thought other Daemonkin books would follow. It almost looked like Tzeentch was going to get a 40K equivalent after it's big AoS release and Tsons came out.
But then 8E dropped and KDK disappeared as a faction.
I have my doubts that EC or WE will get a full Codex. And even if they do, who knows if Fulgrim or Angron will get rules/models to go with them.
I can sort of remember back in 5th edition times, where people were "certain" we'd see individual Legion books. And eventually, it seems we did get a couple. And that was it. There really no logic behind any of it, except, "we felt like doing something." I don't think GW has many ideas for a EC book, or a WE one. Or a WB one for that matter. Even though, to me, it would have made sense to have what seems now to be Daemonkin be Word Bearers. Let other Legions be the "Cultist" ones and have WB be the "deamon summoning ones."
But with Abaddon being redone, everything had to be Black Legion focused, of course. It honestly just is all a mess and one I think GW sees as not worth trying to untangle. So they just lob whatever out there into the mess, because, whatever, it's already a mess.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/03/22 16:56:44
"Wir sehen hiermit wieder die Sprache als das Dasein des Geistes." - The Phenomenology of Spirit
BrotherGecko wrote: I really need the GW marketing team to stop shooting themselves in the foot. You can not leave space for speculation on the future of the product your trying to sell in the tabletop environment.
Either people will speculate and then be disappointed when it doesn't come true or people will speculate negatively and be pushed away because of the uncertainty.
If your going to show the havoc sprue, then show all of it. Showing some of it was a terrible idea. Now people are worried if there is only one of each weapon or if you can even only take one of each weapon, etc erc.
They haven’t shown the sprue yet, it was datamined I’m pretty sure. The words with it might explain more.
2019/03/22 16:56:45
Subject: Re:Shadow Spear / New Chaos Space Marines
Ooph, looks like only 1 of each heavy weapon. Not all the heavy weapons or bodies on that sprue so I assume there's a second one with 1 of each of the rest. That'll hurt. Still a cool looking kit though.
This.
I thought this was pretty obvious from the sprue pics, actually. If you look at the Space Marine Devastator sprue, there are repeated "sections" though the sprues themselves are exactly replicated. As far as these ones go, if they're showing just the two of them, I wonder if the "third" sprue is simply a repeat of the one with two bodies on it.
That's still kinda problematic, however, as it means you still lack doubles of some of the heavy weapons.
If it IS more like the Devastator sprue, however, then there's a third sprue that potentially combines elements of both the shown sprues. I'm hoping this is the case.
BrotherGecko wrote: I really need the GW marketing team to stop shooting themselves in the foot. You can not leave space for speculation on the future of the product your trying to sell in the tabletop environment.
Either people will speculate and then be disappointed when it doesn't come true or people will speculate negatively and be pushed away because of the uncertainty.
If your going to show the havoc sprue, then show all of it. Showing some of it was a terrible idea. Now people are worried if there is only one of each weapon or if you can even only take one of each weapon, etc erc.
Playing devils advocate, it's making people spend a lot of time looking at those sprues, the pictures and discussing the models. There is plenty of press for these models because of it.
Ultimately they product details will come up by the time of pre-order and they will confirm one way or the other. You can't really commit to a purchase based on number of guns etc. without knowing whats in there, so the speculation ongoing is pointless until the product details go up and even then your reactions to the contents will be unaffected by this thread.
It seems that there must be a missing sprue because if you were to double the missile launcher sprue, you would have a total of 3 "arming arms". There is another "arming arm" on the 2nd spure and this seems like a really odd piece to give extras of. At least that is what I am getting out of this.
Oh, and I am betting that a "good guy" buys it on Vigilus due to the Echoes of War Mission: Demise of a Legend being the final mission in recreating the flow of battle for the planet. Maybe Calgar is about to have the shortest miniature shelf life ever.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/03/22 17:13:21
2019/03/22 17:35:00
Subject: Re:Shadow Spear / New Chaos Space Marines
stinkyjunk wrote: Oh, and I am betting that a "good guy" buys it on Vigilus due to the Echoes of War Mission: Demise of a Legend being the final mission in recreating the flow of battle for the planet. Maybe Calgar is about to have the shortest miniature shelf life ever.
Yeah, I'm guess that too, although I seriously doubt it's going to be Primarneus Calgar. More likely it'll be a non-Primaris character....that will probably get "reborn" as a Primaris later on
GW Facebook is also asking people not to spoil anything if they get Vigilis Ablaze early, so there is certainly something happening story-wise
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/03/22 17:35:31
Dakka does have White Knights and is also rather infamous for it's Black Knights. A new edition brings out the passionate and not all of them are good at expressing themselves in written form. There have been plenty of hysterical responses from both sides so far. So we descend into pointless bickering with neither side listening to each other. So posting here becomes more masturbation than conversation.
ERJAK wrote: Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.
Elbows wrote: The shoulder mounted heavy weapons are such a nice throw-back. Diggin' it. Now if only we returned to the heavy stabilized boots.
Their boots seem to have claws on them to grab onto the ground with. It's not my favourite feature of the models.
To be honest I'm pretty sure that nailing your feet to the ground would be detrimental to remaining balanced. It might be useful to be able to take a step back if you fire a gun with a huge recoil, rather than just fall over backwards. Or to move your feet to brace in different directions if you had to switch targets. But maybe things are different in power armour.
I'm now picturing havocs and devastators falling over backwards and then standing up again like weebles every time they fire. I'm fine with this image.
You know, one thing I don't like about this guy - if 8th edition likes to give armies lots of support characters, where the hell is loyalist version?
And by that, I don't mean a new model or anything, just actually using existing ones. SM actually have lots of 'Lord X' characters, why GW won't give them datasheets?
See this guy, for one, you could give him slight variation of the rules given to CSM model above, and triple the sales overnight, but apparently GW hates creativity/money...
2019/03/22 17:57:40
Subject: Re:Shadow Spear / New Chaos Space Marines
'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
You know, one thing I don't like about this guy - if 8th edition likes to give armies lots of support characters, where the hell is loyalist version?
And by that, I don't mean a new model or anything, just actually using existing ones. SM actually have lots of 'Lord X' characters, why GW won't give them datasheets?
See this guy, for one, you could give him slight variation of the rules given to CSM model above, and triple the sales overnight, but apparently GW hates creativity/money...
Now you're complaining that loyalists don't get analogues of every single non-primaris Chaos option too? Newsflash: GW aren't making new models for non-primaris loyalist SM. So that means CSM should never get a new power armor unit ever again?
That jump pack captain model is a legacy model. He's neither plastic nor primaris. They're not going to waste their time creating new rules for legacy models.
