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 NinthMusketeer wrote:
I would like a mix of both. To me Warhammer just isn't Warhammer without absurd headwear on the fantasy side.

I figure it'll be both - there's no way they'll avoid doing "Wow, just amazing, look at those giant hats, Eddie! Just like Classic Warhammer(tm)!" but I hope they do it in such a way that you can point to them and go 'haha giant hat meme' but feel a good bit more grounded and in keeping with a more Azgorth-esq aesthetic. I expected Kruelboys to be a range of lolsowhacky nonsense and they turned out very gritty and surprisingly pleasing to my tastes, so I'll be a bit optimistic.

Give the heroes and elite units hats of various elaborate sizes, and keep the battleline units with the LoA style full plate, that would be perfect. And stick to the massive Bull Centaurs like Legions had, as they were amazing!

 Overread wrote:

 Uriels_Flame wrote:
Better to have lobsters on your piano, than crabs on your organ...

Here's to 3 editions in 6 years!

AoS 1st edition doesn't count.....

of course it doesn't, because god forbid the community would hold GW accountable...

warl0rdb0b wrote:
Give the heroes and elite units hats of various elaborate sizes, and keep the battleline units with the LoA style full plate, that would be perfect. And stick to the massive Bull Centaurs like Legions had, as they were amazing!

Actually I think "medium" basic infantry with medium sized hats, with the more Azhorg heavy plate and helmets for heavy infantry. Hats for the wizards and heroes, and FW style Bull Centaurs and remaking the Executioner in Plastic, and it could be a perfect mix of both aesthetics.

Aren't they referring to it as Age of Sigmar 3rd Edition themselves?

First released in 2015, definitely makes it 3 editions in 6 years. Pretty impressive! D&D has been on one edition since 2014.

 Da Boss wrote:
Yeah, missing out on the savings. I buy things based on value, if it's cheaper and I like it I'm more likely to buy it than if it's overpriced and I like it, I think that's pretty normal.

That's what they're trying to play on, the mentality of missing out on a bargain. It's a pretty commonly used, and effective, method of marketing.

I think it's also a bit scummy, but it's not illegal or anything so they can work away.

Ok. Cancel all box sets. Just do individual releases.

For the longest time I felt like GW would take the worst units from each faction and put them in a start collecting box set to get them out there. Generally I stay away from the box sets unless it has good chaff units from an army I need.

 Jjohnso11 wrote:

Spoiler:

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 Da Boss wrote:
Yeah, missing out on the savings. I buy things based on value, if it's cheaper and I like it I'm more likely to buy it than if it's overpriced and I like it, I think that's pretty normal.

That's what they're trying to play on, the mentality of missing out on a bargain. It's a pretty commonly used, and effective, method of marketing.

I think it's also a bit scummy, but it's not illegal or anything so they can work away.

Ok. Cancel all box sets. Just do individual releases.

For the longest time I felt like GW would take the worst units from each faction and put them in a start collecting box set to get them out there. Generally I stay away from the box sets unless it has good chaff units from an army I need.

And then there's AdMech, for which both version of the Start Collecting boxes were very good.

 Overread wrote:

 Uriels_Flame wrote:
Better to have lobsters on your piano, than crabs on your organ...

Here's to 3 editions in 6 years!

AoS 1st edition doesn't count.....

That's hardly a fair thing to say. Much of current 40k and AoS is defined by GW's attitude in the creation of 1st ed and the mad scramble to fix it when it failed.

There's no guarantee that they'd be raking in the profits like they do now if it hadn't been for that enlightening experience that their customers don't actually go along with everything they do coupled with the equally enlightening experience of how little it actually takes to satisfy people.

 Arbitrator wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
I would like a mix of both. To me Warhammer just isn't Warhammer without absurd headwear on the fantasy side.

I figure it'll be both - there's no way they'll avoid doing "Wow, just amazing, look at those giant hats, Eddie! Just like Classic Warhammer(tm)!" but I hope they do it in such a way that you can point to them and go 'haha giant hat meme' but feel a good bit more grounded and in keeping with a more Azgorth-esq aesthetic. I expected Kruelboys to be a range of lolsowhacky nonsense and they turned out very gritty and surprisingly pleasing to my tastes, so I'll be a bit optimistic.

If GW wanted to make fans of old and new Chaos Dwarfs happy they could just have both hat varieties on the sprue and let people pick their favorite.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 Da Boss wrote:
Yeah, missing out on the savings. I buy things based on value, if it's cheaper and I like it I'm more likely to buy it than if it's overpriced and I like it, I think that's pretty normal.

That's what they're trying to play on, the mentality of missing out on a bargain. It's a pretty commonly used, and effective, method of marketing.

I think it's also a bit scummy, but it's not illegal or anything so they can work away.

Ok. Cancel all box sets. Just do individual releases.

You're right, there can be no middle ground between cancelling all boxed sets and artificial scarcity. It's a good thing people only ever argue in good faith on Dakkadakka.

 Da Boss wrote:

You're right, there can be no middle ground between cancelling all boxed sets and artificial scarcity. It's a good thing people only ever argue in good faith on Dakkadakka.

In that same vein, can it really be called "artificial scarcity" at this point?

We've known for years at this point that the GW webstore for the region has its own stock allocation.
We know that the allocation to GW stores is separate from that webstore allocation. We know that when people order directly via the in-store terminals, it gets pulled from the webstore's allocation rather than the store's allocation.

We also know that independent shops get their order info, then have to place an order for the number of sets they expect to sell...and they seemingly don't do it based upon actually gauging their customers.

We know, additionally, that this results in stuff like "OMG the webstore sold out in .3 seconds!!11!!" and also "Three months later, I can still get X/Y/Z at my LGS! they've got bunches of them!".

So which is it?

 Da Boss wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 Da Boss wrote:
Yeah, missing out on the savings. I buy things based on value, if it's cheaper and I like it I'm more likely to buy it than if it's overpriced and I like it, I think that's pretty normal.

That's what they're trying to play on, the mentality of missing out on a bargain. It's a pretty commonly used, and effective, method of marketing.

I think it's also a bit scummy, but it's not illegal or anything so they can work away.

Ok. Cancel all box sets. Just do individual releases.

You're right, there can be no middle ground between cancelling all boxed sets and artificial scarcity. It's a good thing people only ever argue in good faith on Dakkadakka.

Cannot. Exalt. Enough. Times.

To be honest, the Indomitus / Dominion box is not anything different than the army bundles you get only on december.

They're both bundles limited to as long as stock is available. And it's always a bargain, indeed. That's the point. Frustrating as well when I miss it because I don't have the money for everything I'd like to take at that time of the year.

Are they artificial ? Well, yes. Like all sales in the world at very specific times.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Da Boss wrote:

You're right, there can be no middle ground between cancelling all boxed sets and artificial scarcity. It's a good thing people only ever argue in good faith on Dakkadakka.

In that same vein, can it really be called "artificial scarcity" at this point?

...yes?

GW doesn't have a lack of resources. GW's factory isn't controlled by another entity. GW controls the production amounts, the number of units, AND the duration they keep these sets in production. They could, in fact, keep making more and keep stocking them until demand runs out. Its a deliberate choice on their part. They're deliberating using under-production to push sales (either to customers or so the inventory is in indie shops and not with them). It is 100% artificial scarcity, because any random day between now and X years in the future when these molds are worn out, they can put the same box set together and ship it out to anyone who wants to buy it.

Now maybe it'll be in a white or brown unmarked box than a fancy red one, and have a standard cover on the rulebook rather than their current limited edition 'fancy' covers (ie, exactly the same but with less text and logos), but GW can sell these boxes at any time. They don't need to sell the contents of Indomitus (or Dominion, since they'll obviously do the same) at $500 separately (upwards $600 if you buy the individual boxes for skorpekhs, warriors, and various marines rather than starter sets). Its a deliberate choice on their part. The scarcity depends on nothing BUT their choice. So yeah, artificial.

 Da Boss wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 Da Boss wrote:
Yeah, missing out on the savings. I buy things based on value, if it's cheaper and I like it I'm more likely to buy it than if it's overpriced and I like it, I think that's pretty normal.

That's what they're trying to play on, the mentality of missing out on a bargain. It's a pretty commonly used, and effective, method of marketing.

I think it's also a bit scummy, but it's not illegal or anything so they can work away.

Ok. Cancel all box sets. Just do individual releases.

You're right, there can be no middle ground between cancelling all boxed sets and artificial scarcity. It's a good thing people only ever argue in good faith on Dakkadakka.

Right, so we just pretend it is economically viable for GW to produce enough box sets that everyone gets one, but that there also isn't a massive glut and make it so that individual boxes sell terribly afterwards.

We ARE at the middle ground.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

Voss wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Da Boss wrote:

You're right, there can be no middle ground between cancelling all boxed sets and artificial scarcity. It's a good thing people only ever argue in good faith on Dakkadakka.

In that same vein, can it really be called "artificial scarcity" at this point?

...yes?

GW doesn't have a lack of resources. GW's factory isn't controlled by another entity. GW controls the production amounts, the number of units, AND the duration they keep these sets in production. They could, in fact, keep making more and keep stocking them until demand runs out. Its a deliberate choice on their part. They're deliberating using under-production to push sales (either to customers or so the inventory is in indie shops and not with them). It is 100% artificial scarcity, because any random day between now and X years in the future when these molds are worn out, they can put the same box set together and ship it out to anyone who wants to buy it.

Now maybe it'll be in a white or brown unmarked box than a fancy red one, and have a standard cover on the rulebook rather than their current limited edition 'fancy' covers (ie, exactly the same but with less text and logos), but GW can sell these boxes at any time. They don't need to sell the contents of Indomitus (or Dominion, since they'll obviously do the same) at $500 separately (upwards $600 if you buy the individual boxes for skorpekhs, warriors, and various marines rather than starter sets). Its a deliberate choice on their part. The scarcity depends on nothing BUT their choice. So yeah, artificial.

No - they're deliberately under producing so that they don't make hundreds or thousands more than they need to that end up rotting on a shelf in some obscure corner.

"Just print on demand" - they have other releases to get to and I will guarantee those machines are full up.

Togusa wrote:

 ik0ner wrote:
Less lotr orcs, I assume people mean the orcs from the movies and subsequent GW game - which all looked interesting, more like 80s GW orcs, which is a good thing. Best orcs GW has produced in a very long time. Definitively going to pre-order this even though its a shame about the game.

Shame about the game? What do you mean?

I mean that the box would have higher value for me if I found the ruleset included in it to be fun.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 Da Boss wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 Da Boss wrote:
Yeah, missing out on the savings. I buy things based on value, if it's cheaper and I like it I'm more likely to buy it than if it's overpriced and I like it, I think that's pretty normal.

That's what they're trying to play on, the mentality of missing out on a bargain. It's a pretty commonly used, and effective, method of marketing.

I think it's also a bit scummy, but it's not illegal or anything so they can work away.

Ok. Cancel all box sets. Just do individual releases.

You're right, there can be no middle ground between cancelling all boxed sets and artificial scarcity. It's a good thing people only ever argue in good faith on Dakkadakka.

Right, so we just pretend it is economically viable for GW to produce enough box sets that everyone gets one, but that there also isn't a massive glut and make it so that individual boxes sell terribly afterwards.

We ARE at the middle ground.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

Voss wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Da Boss wrote:

You're right, there can be no middle ground between cancelling all boxed sets and artificial scarcity. It's a good thing people only ever argue in good faith on Dakkadakka.

In that same vein, can it really be called "artificial scarcity" at this point?

...yes?

GW doesn't have a lack of resources. GW's factory isn't controlled by another entity. GW controls the production amounts, the number of units, AND the duration they keep these sets in production. They could, in fact, keep making more and keep stocking them until demand runs out. Its a deliberate choice on their part. They're deliberating using under-production to push sales (either to customers or so the inventory is in indie shops and not with them). It is 100% artificial scarcity, because any random day between now and X years in the future when these molds are worn out, they can put the same box set together and ship it out to anyone who wants to buy it.

Now maybe it'll be in a white or brown unmarked box than a fancy red one, and have a standard cover on the rulebook rather than their current limited edition 'fancy' covers (ie, exactly the same but with less text and logos), but GW can sell these boxes at any time. They don't need to sell the contents of Indomitus (or Dominion, since they'll obviously do the same) at $500 separately (upwards $600 if you buy the individual boxes for skorpekhs, warriors, and various marines rather than starter sets). Its a deliberate choice on their part. The scarcity depends on nothing BUT their choice. So yeah, artificial.

No - they're deliberately under producing so that they don't make hundreds or thousands more than they need to that end up rotting on a shelf in some obscure corner.

"Just print on demand" - they have other releases to get to and I will guarantee those machines are full up.

So i suppose it's more viable to make hundreds or thousands less than they need? Even if plastic models are laughably cheap to make once they get the molds?

 Daedalus81 wrote:

Voss wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Da Boss wrote:

You're right, there can be no middle ground between cancelling all boxed sets and artificial scarcity. It's a good thing people only ever argue in good faith on Dakkadakka.

In that same vein, can it really be called "artificial scarcity" at this point?

...yes?

GW doesn't have a lack of resources. GW's factory isn't controlled by another entity. GW controls the production amounts, the number of units, AND the duration they keep these sets in production. They could, in fact, keep making more and keep stocking them until demand runs out. Its a deliberate choice on their part. They're deliberating using under-production to push sales (either to customers or so the inventory is in indie shops and not with them). It is 100% artificial scarcity, because any random day between now and X years in the future when these molds are worn out, they can put the same box set together and ship it out to anyone who wants to buy it.

Now maybe it'll be in a white or brown unmarked box than a fancy red one, and have a standard cover on the rulebook rather than their current limited edition 'fancy' covers (ie, exactly the same but with less text and logos), but GW can sell these boxes at any time. They don't need to sell the contents of Indomitus (or Dominion, since they'll obviously do the same) at $500 separately (upwards $600 if you buy the individual boxes for skorpekhs, warriors, and various marines rather than starter sets). Its a deliberate choice on their part. The scarcity depends on nothing BUT their choice. So yeah, artificial.

No - they're deliberately under producing so that they don't make hundreds or thousands more than they need to that end up rotting on a shelf in some obscure corner.

"Just print on demand" - they have other releases to get to and I will guarantee those machines are full up.

Again with the hyperbole. They don't have to make 'thousands' more than they need.

Companies, including GW, deal with stock issues all the time. If stuff sells out, you make a smaller second wave. And then maybe a smaller third wave after that if it also sells, adjusting up/down to the specifics of sales demand. This is basic business, not some mythical and impossible to divine mystery. Alternately, you keep things in lowkey production if its a continual demand.

Which -gasp- is what they will be doing anyway as these sprues will be part of the starter sets. And like indomitus, they'll bring the character/specialty unit sprues out at a massive price jump and keep around as a long-term fixture. These kits will already be PART of what keeps their machines 'full up.' As I said, they could very easily recreate the indomitus boxes tomorrow if they felt like it. But 250% to 300% profit for the _exact same sprues_ sounds better to them, so they don't.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
So i suppose it's more viable to make hundreds or thousands less than they need? Even if plastic models are laughably cheap to make once they get the molds?

That ignores so much of what it takes to run a business.

Should we just be landfilling plastic so people don't get upset that they didn't get a discount?

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
So i suppose it's more viable to make hundreds or thousands less than they need? Even if plastic models are laughably cheap to make once they get the molds?

That ignores so much of what it takes to run a business.

Should we just be landfilling plastic so people don't get upset that they didn't get a discount?

How about just keep it like it always was, run it with... no dramas. But nooooo. You want to buy a traditional starter you need to do this go there at certain time in the universe do a backflip refresh 1000times and...

smile and be happy how privileged you are to be able to buy our things.

Its ok they are biased towards the man dollies they produce...but clients?

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
So i suppose it's more viable to make hundreds or thousands less than they need? Even if plastic models are laughably cheap to make once they get the molds?

That ignores so much of what it takes to run a business.

Should we just be landfilling plastic so people don't get upset that they didn't get a discount?

So GW could keep this kind of boxes in productions for all of AoS second edition and 8th with Souls Wars and Dark Imperium but NOW they cannot?

Stop defending the indefensible, dude.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
So i suppose it's more viable to make hundreds or thousands less than they need? Even if plastic models are laughably cheap to make once they get the molds?

That ignores so much of what it takes to run a business.

Should we just be landfilling plastic so people don't get upset that they didn't get a discount?

Y'know, you don't have to try to defend everything Daddy Gw does...

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
So i suppose it's more viable to make hundreds or thousands less than they need? Even if plastic models are laughably cheap to make once they get the molds?

That ignores so much of what it takes to run a business.

Should we just be landfilling plastic so people don't get upset that they didn't get a discount?

Well they SOMEHOW kept Soul Wars in production for a good three years... and i don't see how Soul Wars is any diffrent from this box.

 Galas wrote:

So GW could keep this kind of boxes in productions for all of AoS second edition and 8th with Souls Wars and Dark Imperium but NOW they cannot?

Stop defending the indefensible, dude.

There is literally no way to tell if they "kept making them" or "made more than they could sell". They built a whole other factory, because they couldn't make stuff fast enough. How many specialist games are floating around now as opposed to then?

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 Galas wrote:

So GW could keep this kind of boxes in productions for all of AoS second edition and 8th with Souls Wars and Dark Imperium but NOW they cannot?

Stop defending the indefensible, dude.

There is literally no way to tell if they "kept making them" or "made more than they could sell". They built a whole other factory, because they couldn't make stuff fast enough. How many specialist games are floating around now as opposed to then?

Ah yes, because three resin guns for Titanicus every other months is clearly pushing GW' supply lines to the brink of collapse.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
Ah yes, because three resin guns for Titanicus every other months is clearly pushing GW' supply lines to the brink of collapse.

Bloodbowl
AI
Underworlds
Warcry
Necromunda
LOTR
Warhammer Quest

And *I'm* the one that gets painted as arguing in bad faith.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 Galas wrote:

So GW could keep this kind of boxes in productions for all of AoS second edition and 8th with Souls Wars and Dark Imperium but NOW they cannot?

Stop defending the indefensible, dude.

There is literally no way to tell if they "kept making them" or "made more than they could sell". They built a whole other factory, because they couldn't make stuff fast enough. How many specialist games are floating around now as opposed to then?

Remember the indomitus set that they "couldn't keep in production"? Most of it is now available at massive markup as two "direct only" sets. So they ARE producing it, just charging you extra for it.

Cronch wrote:

 Daedalus81 wrote:

 Galas wrote:

So GW could keep this kind of boxes in productions for all of AoS second edition and 8th with Souls Wars and Dark Imperium but NOW they cannot?

Stop defending the indefensible, dude.

There is literally no way to tell if they "kept making them" or "made more than they could sell". They built a whole other factory, because they couldn't make stuff fast enough. How many specialist games are floating around now as opposed to then?

Remember the indomitus set that they "couldn't keep in production"? Most of it is now available at massive markup as two "direct only" sets. So they ARE producing it, just charging you extra for it.

No no. It's all perfectly simple, see: GW produced so many Indomitus sprues that they completely filled their warehouse, meaning that they had to build a new one. And now they're using Imperium as a way of shifting those extra sprues via Hachette rather than dumping them all in landfill.
Really, GW are heroes here, and we should all praise them.

Cronch wrote:
Remember the indomitus set that they "couldn't keep in production"? Most of it is now available at massive markup as two "direct only" sets. So they ARE producing it, just charging you extra for it.

How much extra exactly? The one that costs $5 more than a box of warriors and comes with a Warden, Captain, and Assault Intercessors? The ones designed for bringing new people into the hobby?

To that point there are plenty of opportunities to get discounted sets and if you miss this there will certainly by a SC that will come along soon. Likely this Christmas.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

Cronch wrote:
Remember the indomitus set that they "couldn't keep in production"? Most of it is now available at massive markup as two "direct only" sets. So they ARE producing it, just charging you extra for it.

How much extra exactly? The one that costs $5 more than a box of warriors and comes with a Warden, Captain, and Assault Intercessors? The ones designed for bringing new people into the hobby?

To that point there are plenty of opportunities to get discounted sets and if you miss this there will certainly by a SC that will come along soon. Likely this Christmas.

The Royal Court and the Honoured of the Chapter. Both of which have absolutely insane prices.
.