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The number of preview page followers on Gamefound has almost reached the total backer count from D&L3 already so looks like the move isn't hurting their exposure at all.

I think people in the tabetop community are use to Gamefound now as they started making a big push about 2 years ago to get as many of the big names on it. I think only Mythic, Monolith and CMoN aren't there. Wonder if Kickstarter is having to give better terms to keep tabletop stuff there as I would be shocked if Gamefound wasn't doing that to get big campaigns on their site.

Yeah, I know most tabletop stuff is going over there, but I think you surely miss out on the casual traffic that KS gets. Maybe I'm wrong, but Gamefound seems like a place you go intentionally if you are really into things specifically, KS just has a much larger base of visitors? Whether that actually matters, I dunno.

Also, turned out my DL3 stuff hadn't arrived, my wife was just trolling me after a tiny tiny parcel arrived for me. Divorce papers are being ordered as we a speak

I think the amount of followers on gamefound has more to do with the visibility of the previous campaigns as most "customers" will likely be regulars from the previous kickstarters.

The fees on Kickstarter might not be worth the additional exposure for a company that essentially has a large amount of regular people funding their campaigns or buying it afterwards throught gamefound. Since most regulars will have the gamefound account because of the pledge manager/late pledges, it doesn't add more work to customers.

For smaller companies with no major brand recognition in the marker Kickstarter is likely a better platform, but once you are already established it shouldn't make much difference to customers which platform you use, unless there is a heavy amount of additional stuff to do.

Best for last great set

Hehe, this one is the least interesting to me as it's a common theme and very easy to print. I'll probably get 2+ each of the other two, 1x minis and none of this.

Very true printing is of no interest to me so priorities will differ. I'm thinking 2 Woods, 2 Ruins, 1 Swamps and 1 Creatures. Swamps losses out as I still have 2 sets of the old citadel trees and the next Warcry set will have a similar theme - pity that won't be seen in the next 3 weeks.

How well would Giants fit on a Kingdom Death board? Theme seems suitable, but dunno if the terrain is the right size?

 ced1106 wrote:
How well would Giants fit on a Kingdom Death board? Theme seems suitable, but dunno if the terrain is the right size?

I was thinking the same thing...I suspect that they will fit nicely.

Elven Woods and Swamps of Doom game mats are €20 each (very low mark up per AMA)
Warcry/Killteam sized mats go for €30 to €40 so that's not a bad price but I'm glad they are separate now.

10th June AMA

- They plan to do a separate presentation on tooling and manufacturing costs at some point.
- D&L3 approx 130 pledges with trim packs missing 1 sprue per pack (should be 2 - it's a packing error) missing parts will be sent on soon.
- No dragons planned for Encounters only the Wyvern
- 2 large models planned but can change depending on funding
- 1x2, 1x4 etc. tiles - not planned for now
- D&L 5 being concepted now - planning to go back to D&L 1 and 2 themes
- D&L 4 shipping costs - they will factor in some leeway to cover extra costs if fuel prices go up but if shipping prices go down they'll add more minis to compensate.
- D&L 3 dodged a bullet with shipping costs - contract had been signed and they had factored in €1 or €2 extra in the shipping charges just in case.
- UK shipping Brexit still causing problems - paperwork/regulations seem to change by batches shipped. No consistency. 4 to 5 times more work to ship to a UK backer.
- No elevated platforms (in trees for example) for flying creatures - custom bases instead
- No AoE templates. Spell effects yes but in future
- Rivers - translucent blue sprues exact colour TBD. No 45 degree bend only 90 not enough space on tool and sticking with grid system and normal tile sizes. Might be a SG to connect sewer to rivers but not in the river set.
- No ponds or lakes
- Legacy base pack will be an add on for D&L 4.
- New Encounters base pack planned.
- D&L 3 Townfolk set straight to retail within 2 months so no add on for them in D&L 4 (Dragons seem to be the same as they are already at retail).
- No separate wolves, spiders, wasps etc. they are tooled in a way that they can't be split.
- Some D&L 4 stuff already tooled and will be Rapid Delivery (looks like Elven Woods is nearly done)
- Jarek really doesn't like PVC and won't use it for anything other than boardgames due to costs.
- They reckon they are 3 years off reaching GW levels with HIPS.
- Swap Tarrasque - no and no option for pledge without it - they see it as a gift to backers. 5 sprues planned might be more they keep varying the size. 1 per backer only.
- 2 Land of Giant sets will make a full circle
- Pledge redesign - €65 retail costs per set they have to sell wholesale for €20/€25 (and make a profit) - so larger sets basically at wholesale cost per set.
- SG 18 to 20 sprues similar to D&L 3 mainly terrain. 20 sprues is about the limit they can add (but not a hard limit)
- Entrances might be a SG as well as add on
- The surveys are the best way to give them feedback and what they give the greatest attention to.
- Planning to make minis with less parts going forward some external sculpts required more splits in the past but bringing it mostly in house now.
- 3 themes only no further themes, original plan was only 2. Need to make SG fit with all themes which gets harder the more themes they add.
- More 1 per backer minis planned.

Pictures to follow

The hand staircase was the most Kingdom Death piece out of the bunch.

Or Elden Ring. Both have a propensity for fingers and hands everywhere.

Stream was fascinating, recommended to everyone to go watch from start to finish.

Bossman said he was very proud of how well the team are learning to cut the models, and I agree, I was clipping my strethc goals as I listened and man they are close to Underworlds level of intricacy. The "sewer mermaid" is only 3 parts!

I really wish they hadn't gone with the sculpted gack all over the hills/rocks.

It just doesn't look good, is very limiting in terms of theme, and static grass or tufts will always look better.

I'm probably going to sit this one out and just wait for the trees to hit retail.

I'm still pretty unhappy about the tiny true 28mm miniature scale they went with.

A shame about the UK paperwork issues (wierd that some companies seem to be having far more than others, but i guess that may be partly practice, and partly who they have to deal with on the UK side as)

and glad i sneaked another order of townsfolk in before the deadline

mats seem decent value (shame they're gridded but I can see why as they're aiming the sets at the RPG market)

and if they can do a good giant ant? yes please, the PVC toys look rubbish and never stand up)

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
A shame about the UK paperwork issues (wierd that some companies seem to be having far more than others, but i guess that may be partly practice, and partly who they have to deal with on the UK side as)

Well they use FedEx within the EU. If they also use them for the UK that would be the cause, as FedEx are imbeciles.

The do and that certainly won't help (and i'd add greedy too and wouldn't put it past them to make it difficult in order to sell a service to help),

but ive seen other places not using them having issues too

Another scale pic from D&L3.

Gergely Szabolcsi : "They are on the smaller side, but I think they look good. Yeah next to the modern GW figures it looks small, but those are really oversized.
GW Aragorn (older sculpt), GW vampire hunter (it has a sculpted base), blacklist miniatures mage, D&L guard, nolzur elf, GW lotr ranger, GW(?) skeleton

https://www.facebook.com/groups/2418164861823205/posts/2958026054503747/

Ugh, they look like 80% the size of Nolzur's, which are already pretty puny.

I find them pretty well sized, a bit big perhaps even. But then again, lately I've been working more with historicals. They're definitely smaller than modern GW though

They look small even compared to GWs LOTR line.

Hoping to get my money back from selling D&L 3 miniatures.

 Dolnikan wrote:
I find them pretty well sized, a bit big perhaps even. But then again, lately I've been working more with historicals. They're definitely smaller than modern GW though

Historicals also tend to be uselessly small for modern minis. I dont know what geriatric gamer is driving them to make stuff compatible with their crappy old Ral Partha lead figures, but they need to cut it out lol. The industry standard shifted ages ago.

At least he posted something slightly more useful than the giant and space moth scale shot.

 Bossk_Hogg wrote:

 Dolnikan wrote:
I find them pretty well sized, a bit big perhaps even. But then again, lately I've been working more with historicals. They're definitely smaller than modern GW though

Historicals also tend to be uselessly small for modern minis. I dont know what geriatric gamer is driving them to make stuff compatible with their crappy old Ral Partha lead figures, but they need to cut it out lol. The industry standard shifted ages ago.

At least he posted something slightly more useful than the giant and space moth scale shot.

Presumably, it's all the people interested in historicals. Which seems to be a lot, given the amount of historical minis around.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

 Bossk_Hogg wrote:

 Dolnikan wrote:
I find them pretty well sized, a bit big perhaps even. But then again, lately I've been working more with historicals. They're definitely smaller than modern GW though

Historicals also tend to be uselessly small for modern minis. I dont know what geriatric gamer is driving them to make stuff compatible with their crappy old Ral Partha lead figures, but they need to cut it out lol. The industry standard shifted ages ago.

At least he posted something slightly more useful than the giant and space moth scale shot.

Presumably, it's all the people interested in historicals. Which seems to be a lot, given the amount of historical minis around.

Are they the target audience for this sort of thing? Do they need a lot of ruined statues for their 20mm Alamo battle? How about spiders, wolves and goblins? So why are we in grandpa's scale for fantasy minis?

 Bossk_Hogg wrote:

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

 Bossk_Hogg wrote:

 Dolnikan wrote:
I find them pretty well sized, a bit big perhaps even. But then again, lately I've been working more with historicals. They're definitely smaller than modern GW though

Historicals also tend to be uselessly small for modern minis. I dont know what geriatric gamer is driving them to make stuff compatible with their crappy old Ral Partha lead figures, but they need to cut it out lol. The industry standard shifted ages ago.

At least he posted something slightly more useful than the giant and space moth scale shot.

Presumably, it's all the people interested in historicals. Which seems to be a lot, given the amount of historical minis around.

Are they the target audience for this sort of thing? Do they need a lot of ruined statues for their 20mm Alamo battle? How about spiders, wolves and goblins? So why are we in grandpa's scale for fantasy minis?

Have you ever heard about politeness? I guess not based on the writing style.

Lots of fantasy minis also aren't enormous. It's just that some companies seem to have abandoned scale creep for a scale race, making downright huge figures that are annoying to play with. But that's a matter of taste I guess

Pre-launch survey: https://archon-studio.com/content/dungeons-lasers-encounters-pre-launch-survey

IMO, Mini's look fine for the gaming table. I've noticed with the PC party, miniatures from different manufacturers can also look a little off. I doubt anyone else at the gaming table would notice.

OTOH, For dioramas and picture-taking with other manufacturer's mini's, I'd agree the scale is noticeable. The KS is about terrain, of course, so hopefully there won't be many (or any) human-sized figures, other than corpses.

The survey does ask for many small bits vs. larger terrain elements, so mebbe the latter is better if you didn't like the 28mm scale Archon used?

 Bossk_Hogg wrote:

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

 Bossk_Hogg wrote:

 Dolnikan wrote:
I find them pretty well sized, a bit big perhaps even. But then again, lately I've been working more with historicals. They're definitely smaller than modern GW though

Historicals also tend to be uselessly small for modern minis. I dont know what geriatric gamer is driving them to make stuff compatible with their crappy old Ral Partha lead figures, but they need to cut it out lol. The industry standard shifted ages ago.

At least he posted something slightly more useful than the giant and space moth scale shot.

Presumably, it's all the people interested in historicals. Which seems to be a lot, given the amount of historical minis around.

Are they the target audience for this sort of thing? Do they need a lot of ruined statues for their 20mm Alamo battle? How about spiders, wolves and goblins? So why are we in grandpa's scale for fantasy minis?

This is a very uninformed post as there are a lot of truescale Fantasy Minis on the market recently. Oathmark with all its plastic sets, Wargames atlantic, Davale, Unreleased Miniatures, numerous Patreons, Lord of the rings no less. Grandpa's scale in Fantasy are actually GW's old World miniatures with their deformed "heroic" scale that's of course still around too but not more or less than true 28.

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
The pledge managers for both

Dungeons & Lasers 3 and Ramparts 3 are both closing on 10th June

so if anybody has delayed finalising it (or wants to order another pledge) get shopping

Wasn’t the Ramparts PM supposed to be open until December?

 Bossk_Hogg wrote:

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

 Bossk_Hogg wrote:

 Dolnikan wrote:
I find them pretty well sized, a bit big perhaps even. But then again, lately I've been working more with historicals. They're definitely smaller than modern GW though

Historicals also tend to be uselessly small for modern minis. I dont know what geriatric gamer is driving them to make stuff compatible with their crappy old Ral Partha lead figures, but they need to cut it out lol. The industry standard shifted ages ago.

At least he posted something slightly more useful than the giant and space moth scale shot.

Presumably, it's all the people interested in historicals. Which seems to be a lot, given the amount of historical minis around.

Are they the target audience for this sort of thing? Do they need a lot of ruined statues for their 20mm Alamo battle? How about spiders, wolves and goblins? So why are we in grandpa's scale for fantasy minis?

I'm on the younger side of the collecting hobby myself (I guess, lol) and I prefer the smaller sizes. I think GW has become obnoxiously large. I don't want to play and model 45mm figures, I want something 25-28mm tall as they make mass battles better, but can still have a lot more individual personality put into them then a 15 or 20mm figure can.

To my eyes the "industry standard' you're talking about basically GW, a few successful boutique studios, and a ton of failed ones. By far the most successful non GW mini makers are doing their stuff in 25/28mm.

Lots of interesting concept art. I really hope we see Frogfolk and giant ants as well as the wagon.

I am reserving judgement on the miniature size until our D&L 3 arrives. I am hoping it they scale well with WGA.

As regards to folks and their age or preference for miniature sizes it is disappointing to seeing such rudeness on here. Any chance folks could show a bit more respect for other gamers? Plenty of folks outside the hobby are quick enough to tear us all down without turning on each other.

The Encounters SG pack add on price is €40 which means it’s a little cheaper to pick one pledge level and add additional SG packs rather than getting multiples of a pledge level.

For example Hero + 2SG =€280
Starter x3 =€300
Starter + Adventurer+1SG =€290

In all cases above it’s 6 sets, 3 SG and 1 Tarrasque