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 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Ok, so, M9 to kinda sorta make up for those of us with units with full wings modelled.

I believe that the studio probably only has 1 set of these painted up, but I suspect that each Possessed mini will have a whopping two configurations of tentacles/spikes/heads. Certainly nothing like the current kit, or even something like the endlessly adaptable Spawn kit.

Of course now we have a division of rules for the same units between Codices. I doubt Death Guard will get an update. They get "old and busted" Possessed whilst CSM get the "new hotness" Possessed.

And yes, I did just make a Men in Black reference from 25 years ago.

Voss wrote:
No there isn't. The 'wait and see' crowd will keep saying 'wait and see' no matter how much information is available. Even when the book is out the FAQ becomes the next 'wait and see' point.

Exactly. We've (waited and) seen the 'Wait an See' crowd say 'Wait and See' at every step of a journey up to and even after release. They appear to be terrified of committing to any sort of concrete opinion.

Most of the time I see 'wait and see' in regards to FAQs that invariably end up coming. Remember Leviathan and Crusher Stampede? 'Wait and see' crowd was like "yeah wait to see what GW does with that, but I bet you they're going to disallow it" and sure enough, that's what happened. How about that.

Yes, the more we see, the more it confirms what's been leaked. As ever, the last thing we'll discover will be points values, and that usually is where various units will succeed or die.

But hey, gnash your teeth all you want, doesn't change my plan. I'll be buying the new possessed and enjoying the heck out of painting those wild dudes. Whether or not they are broken or balanced or useless matters a lot less to me, and I'll have saved myself a lot of high-blood-pressure-evenings worrying about what might be instead of what is.

I didn't say anything about them being broken. I don't really care if they're powerful or not.

I'm usually in the "wait and see" crowd until we have the full codex available because until then we're not looking at the actual full picture and we've been mislead by incomplete information before.

I am also in the "wait and See" crowd. This does not mean i do not have an opinion about some of the spoilerd rules ( don't like them at all) or models (nice!) .
But untill i have held them in my hands i will try to stand away from absolute and final judgement.
Because i have seem to many "broken" Rules/units that never made it and enough "ugly" models that i had to own once i had seen them live.

drbored wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Ok, so, M9 to kinda sorta make up for those of us with units with full wings modelled.

I believe that the studio probably only has 1 set of these painted up, but I suspect that each Possessed mini will have a whopping two configurations of tentacles/spikes/heads. Certainly nothing like the current kit, or even something like the endlessly adaptable Spawn kit.

Of course now we have a division of rules for the same units between Codices. I doubt Death Guard will get an update. They get "old and busted" Possessed whilst CSM get the "new hotness" Possessed.

And yes, I did just make a Men in Black reference from 25 years ago.

Voss wrote:
No there isn't. The 'wait and see' crowd will keep saying 'wait and see' no matter how much information is available. Even when the book is out the FAQ becomes the next 'wait and see' point.

Exactly. We've (waited and) seen the 'Wait an See' crowd say 'Wait and See' at every step of a journey up to and even after release. They appear to be terrified of committing to any sort of concrete opinion.

Most of the time I see 'wait and see' in regards to FAQs that invariably end up coming. Remember Leviathan and Crusher Stampede? 'Wait and see' crowd was like "yeah wait to see what GW does with that, but I bet you they're going to disallow it" and sure enough, that's what happened. How about that.

Yes, the more we see, the more it confirms what's been leaked. As ever, the last thing we'll discover will be points values, and that usually is where various units will succeed or die.

But hey, gnash your teeth all you want, doesn't change my plan. I'll be buying the new possessed and enjoying the heck out of painting those wild dudes. Whether or not they are broken or balanced or useless matters a lot less to me, and I'll have saved myself a lot of high-blood-pressure-evenings worrying about what might be instead of what is.

Great. But 'your plan' wasn't the issue. It was the self-righteous 'wait and see, so stop discussing rumors, you aren't really living' proclamation that you started with. Whenever the 'wait and see' card is pulled at this point, its less about a theoretical 'people are overreacting' (because generally its the W & S folks over-reacting to hearing things they don't like) and more about shutting down discussion.

I'm glad Possessed got a huge upgrade but does anyone feel that 5 attacks each is a bit.....overkill?

1 more than assault intercessor on 1st round of combat. Not reallm.

There's;

"Wait and see (we only have shreds of information and so any conclusion drawn at this point is speculative at most)."

"Wait and see (I see that your concerns are valid based on the evidence we have but there is a chance things will be different when we have the whole picture so we shouldn't pass judgement yet)."

"Wait and see (sometimes things end up being different than they initially appear so I am dismissing your concerns without acknowledging them)."


Automatically Appended Next Post:

EviscerationPlague wrote:
I'm glad Possessed got a huge upgrade but does anyone feel that 5 attacks each is a bit.....overkill?

Four limbs and a bite, makes sense.

Its kind of the reality of the game, but you need to know all the buff architecture to judge a unit these days.

Call it 40~ points and its probably okay. Much lower and its getting obnoxious by obvious comparisons. Much higher and they are turning into a bad unit.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
There's;

"Wait and see (we only have shreds of information and so any conclusion drawn at this point is speculative at most)."

"Wait and see (I see that your concerns are valid based on the evidence we have but there is a chance things will be different when we have the whole picture so we shouldn't pass judgement yet)."

"Wait and see (sometimes things end up being different than they initially appear so I am dismissing your concerns without acknowledging them)."


Automatically Appended Next Post:

EviscerationPlague wrote:
I'm glad Possessed got a huge upgrade but does anyone feel that 5 attacks each is a bit.....overkill?

Four limbs and a bite, makes sense.

I'm usually on the first two.

And with CSM being Primaris +1 on the attack profile I see nothing off about Possesses being 5 attacks.

So what are we supposed to do with our greater possessed models? I'd be willing to bet that most people who own them have an even number of them and it's fewer than 5.

I'm hoping that there is an entry for greater possessed but keeps them as characters rather than units.

BTW how long have the greater possessed models been available? I don't think it's been that long so I don't see GW getting rid of them that quickly.

Do we know the minimum unit size for possessed? It could be 2 to allow for the greater possessed models to be used.

Leo_the_Rat wrote:
So what are we supposed to do with our greater possessed models? I'd be willing to bet that most people who own them have an even number of them and it's fewer than 5.

I'm hoping that there is an entry for greater possessed but keeps them as characters rather than units.

BTW how long have the greater possessed models been available? I don't think it's been that long so I don't see GW getting rid of them that quickly.

You buy a box of possessed and run 7 I guess? You're right, most people will have 2, so making them an easy add on to possessed boxes is a winner.

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Do we know the minimum unit size for possessed? It could be 2 to allow for the greater possessed models to be used.

Didn’t the article say 5 to 10? With the new combat patrol, the start collecting may be discontinued and only a few of the models in it repackaged for individual or group sale

Edit: nm about the minimum unit size

Voss wrote:

drbored wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Ok, so, M9 to kinda sorta make up for those of us with units with full wings modelled.

I believe that the studio probably only has 1 set of these painted up, but I suspect that each Possessed mini will have a whopping two configurations of tentacles/spikes/heads. Certainly nothing like the current kit, or even something like the endlessly adaptable Spawn kit.

Of course now we have a division of rules for the same units between Codices. I doubt Death Guard will get an update. They get "old and busted" Possessed whilst CSM get the "new hotness" Possessed.

And yes, I did just make a Men in Black reference from 25 years ago.

Voss wrote:
No there isn't. The 'wait and see' crowd will keep saying 'wait and see' no matter how much information is available. Even when the book is out the FAQ becomes the next 'wait and see' point.

Exactly. We've (waited and) seen the 'Wait an See' crowd say 'Wait and See' at every step of a journey up to and even after release. They appear to be terrified of committing to any sort of concrete opinion.

Most of the time I see 'wait and see' in regards to FAQs that invariably end up coming. Remember Leviathan and Crusher Stampede? 'Wait and see' crowd was like "yeah wait to see what GW does with that, but I bet you they're going to disallow it" and sure enough, that's what happened. How about that.

Yes, the more we see, the more it confirms what's been leaked. As ever, the last thing we'll discover will be points values, and that usually is where various units will succeed or die.

But hey, gnash your teeth all you want, doesn't change my plan. I'll be buying the new possessed and enjoying the heck out of painting those wild dudes. Whether or not they are broken or balanced or useless matters a lot less to me, and I'll have saved myself a lot of high-blood-pressure-evenings worrying about what might be instead of what is.

Great. But 'your plan' wasn't the issue. It was the self-righteous 'wait and see, so stop discussing rumors, you aren't really living' proclamation that you started with. Whenever the 'wait and see' card is pulled at this point, its less about a theoretical 'people are overreacting' (because generally its the W & S folks over-reacting to hearing things they don't like) and more about shutting down discussion.

So, yeah, if someone is saying 'wait and see, so quit discussing rumors' that's pretty lame, but I don't see that.

What I see happening instead is something like... Person A will be yammering on and on, inconsolable about some thing that is happening but they don't know for 100% certainty that it's happening.

Person B, C, D, and E come in and they really have nothing else to add to that conversation. Person A went on and covered all the points in their massive tirade, and it's clear that every other interaction with Person A has simply devolved into inane pedantery, but Person B, C, D, and E want to sort of... make their presence known?

In other words, I see 'wait and see', especially used in this topic, as a "Well, yeah, sucks, what else can you do?" or "I guess we'll see" or "yeah..................." Basically a non-answer to Person A's ongoing rambling.

If you think that my posts were self-righteous, then yes, they absolutely were, because at the end of the day I'm not fuming over what someone said on Dakkadakka to the point that I have to call out their self-righteousness

Obviously, this is the internet, any attempt at shutting down discussion is pointless. I can no more stop you from posting your personal attacks on me as I can stop the sun from shining, but what I *can* and often *do* do is step away and go build some plastic models or watch some YouTube or pet my cat or literally anything else, because it's generally more enjoyable.

My usual wait and see is more a "I see people getting spun up on X but we don't know Y or Z and assuming those points could mean this *seems* worse than it is".

Like, for example from earlier in the thread, we know they're taking certain melee options off the datasheets proper. What we don't know is what is on the melee weapons wargear list or who gets access to said list.

That said, I still respect that people are concerned about the worst case scenario I just try to not let myself ride the hyper train or the doom train too soon. I just don't have the mental energy to be that mad or excited all the time. Working retail is enough of a tax so I'd rather join in trying to unwravel things as we go and see what's coming while trying to keep my own knee jerk reactions under control.

Speaking of keeping things under control, listening to Primogenitor has me looking at those Traitor Guard and going "those would make nice Gland Hounds" so maybe what I really need to do is stop listening to 40k fiction.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/06/04/saturday-pre-orders-the-horus-heresy-is-here-with-a-huge-haul-of-miniatures-books-and-more/

Just FYI in case anyone missed it. At the bottom of the heresy per-order is this months white dwarf cover clearly shows it includes index world eater. So probably codex preorder by middle of month?

 xeen wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/06/04/saturday-pre-orders-the-horus-heresy-is-here-with-a-huge-haul-of-miniatures-books-and-more/

Just FYI in case anyone missed it. At the bottom of the heresy per-order is this months white dwarf cover clearly shows it includes index world eater. So probably codex preorder by middle of month?

There is a bunch of rumors floating around about the new CA coming out too. We also have the AoS books. I think it's a tossup in whatever order they come out, but it sure seems like they would push out the CSM dex with the WD coming out.

Um, are there rumours about the traitor guard? I would love to know how the corrupted comissar is going to be added to the codex

 Sasori wrote:

 xeen wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/06/04/saturday-pre-orders-the-horus-heresy-is-here-with-a-huge-haul-of-miniatures-books-and-more/

Just FYI in case anyone missed it. At the bottom of the heresy per-order is this months white dwarf cover clearly shows it includes index world eater. So probably codex preorder by middle of month?

There is a bunch of rumors floating around about the new CA coming out too. We also have the AoS books. I think it's a tossup in whatever order they come out, but it sure seems like they would push out the CSM dex with the WD coming out.

Based on previous behaviour I'd expect:

Today's preview to be a made-to-order filler week, thanks to the two-week HH preorder

Next week is AOS Battletomes that have already started with slow preview articles, with preorder on the 18th

CSM rules & kit previews gradually ramp up during June, with preorders on June 25th or 2nd July.

They may slot in something like new Necromunda stuff in between

Based on the WD cover I'd say that WE are only gettng a Mini-Codex. I think that the way it's phrased means the Codex is in that issue.

Caveat- I don't speak British English so I may be wrong.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
There's;

"Wait and see (we only have shreds of information and so any conclusion drawn at this point is speculative at most)."

"Wait and see (I see that your concerns are valid based on the evidence we have but there is a chance things will be different when we have the whole picture so we shouldn't pass judgement yet)."

"Wait and see (sometimes things end up being different than they initially appear so I am dismissing your concerns without acknowledging them)."


Automatically Appended Next Post:

EviscerationPlague wrote:
I'm glad Possessed got a huge upgrade but does anyone feel that 5 attacks each is a bit.....overkill?

Four limbs and a bite, makes sense.

Do Genestealers also have five attacks (four limbs and a bite)?

Garrac wrote:
Um, are there rumours about the traitor guard? I would love to know how the corrupted comissar is going to be added to the codex

None yet. It seems that they were missing from the playtest doc from which most of the current leaks originate, possibly similar to how the Beastsnagga units were missing from the rules given to playtestors for Orks.

Leo_the_Rat wrote:
Based on the WD cover I'd say that WE are only gettng a Mini-Codex. I think that the way it's phrased means the Codex is in that issue.

Caveat- I don't speak British English so I may be wrong.

Yes, WD mini-Dex until their full Codex releases. GW stated that a while ago.

Leo_the_Rat wrote:
Based on the WD cover I'd say that WE are only gettng a Mini-Codex. I think that the way it's phrased means the Codex is in that issue.

Caveat- I don't speak British English so I may be wrong.

Yeah, that's what they told us was happening.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Strg Alt wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
There's;

"Wait and see (we only have shreds of information and so any conclusion drawn at this point is speculative at most)."

"Wait and see (I see that your concerns are valid based on the evidence we have but there is a chance things will be different when we have the whole picture so we shouldn't pass judgement yet)."

"Wait and see (sometimes things end up being different than they initially appear so I am dismissing your concerns without acknowledging them)."


Automatically Appended Next Post:

EviscerationPlague wrote:
I'm glad Possessed got a huge upgrade but does anyone feel that 5 attacks each is a bit.....overkill?

Four limbs and a bite, makes sense.

Do Genestealers also have five attacks (four limbs and a bite)?

They have 4, but they also cost a whole 13 points.

Fresh from the Reddit Rumour Mill:

Ok_Entrepreneur3004
You can make a daemon force 25% of your force and it won't make you lose your legion rules

When asked if Death Guard and 1000 Sons were counted for this as well:

Any chaos faction

Also a pretty specific note to "wait for the Chaos Daemons book". The posts regarding Daemons seems to be implying heavily that Daemons are going to be a "Knights" style faction.

 Kanluwen wrote:
Fresh from the Reddit Rumour Mill:

Ok_Entrepreneur3004
You can make a daemon force 25% of your force and it won't make you lose your legion rules

When asked if Death Guard and 1000 Sons were counted for this as well:

Any chaos faction

Yeah, I think this leaked a little while back and it's in the Daemons codex as a rule.

 Kanluwen wrote:
Fresh from the Reddit Rumour Mill:

Ok_Entrepreneur3004
You can make a daemon force 25% of your force and it won't make you lose your legion rules

When asked if Death Guard and 1000 Sons were counted for this as well:

Any chaos faction

Also a pretty specific note to "wait for the Chaos Daemons book". The posts regarding Daemons seems to be implying heavily that Daemons are going to be a "Knights" style faction.

Ooh. So, Thousand Sons PLUS Daemons PLUS a Knight. Sounds... fun.

 Strg Alt wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
There's;

"Wait and see (we only have shreds of information and so any conclusion drawn at this point is speculative at most)."

"Wait and see (I see that your concerns are valid based on the evidence we have but there is a chance things will be different when we have the whole picture so we shouldn't pass judgement yet)."

"Wait and see (sometimes things end up being different than they initially appear so I am dismissing your concerns without acknowledging them)."


Automatically Appended Next Post:

EviscerationPlague wrote:
I'm glad Possessed got a huge upgrade but does anyone feel that 5 attacks each is a bit.....overkill?

Four limbs and a bite, makes sense.

Do Genestealers also have five attacks (four limbs and a bite)?

Six limbs and a bite makes seven, but only one mind per body means it gets halved to 3.5, rounded up to 4. Possessed have two beings per body so don't have to half. The logic is very consistent.

EviscerationPlague wrote:
I'm glad Possessed got a huge upgrade but does anyone feel that 5 attacks each is a bit.....overkill?

Not if their costed correctly. But its a new kit and they need them to move so they'll be under costed for at least a few months.
That said possessed are going to be crazy with the Malefic discipline, Legion Trait, Marks, Icons, and Stratagems.