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lcmiracle wrote: What kind of biased media is actually saying this is one of the "best year for video games"? All the big titles dying or DOA, with only a few exceptions who have always been outsider studios.
Tears of the Kingdom, Street Fighter 6, Final Fantasy 16, Armored Core 6, Sea of Stars, Alan Wake 2, Spiderman 2, Vampire Survivors, Super Mario Wonder. That's just the stuff I like and not including things like Baldur's Gate 3 which aren't my thing but undeniably great.
It might be a terrible year for live service garbage, but there hasn't been a year this good for games that aren't just constantly asking for more money in years.
lcmiracle wrote: What kind of biased media is actually saying this is one of the "best year for video games"? All the big titles dying or DOA, with only a few exceptions who have always been outsider studios.
Tears of the Kingdom, Street Fighter 6, Final Fantasy 16, Armored Core 6, Sea of Stars, Alan Wake 2, Spiderman 2, Vampire Survivors, Super Mario Wonder. That's just the stuff I like and not including things like Baldur's Gate 3 which aren't my thing but undeniably great.
It might be a terrible year for live service garbage, but there hasn't been a year this good for games that aren't just constantly asking for more money in years.
Compared to the previous year -- this is the year in which AAA titles actually suffers. Baldur's Gate put shame upon AAA developers so much they wanted blood; and Armored Core has always been excellent, as is Fromsoft's want.
Spiderman 2 is skub with fans, don't delute yourself. FF16 sales dropped off much faster than FF15, shipping 3 millions copies in the first month when FF15 sold 5 million on the first day and FF7 remake 3.5 millions on the first day, on top of that it's another skub with the fans. And don't even lie about Alan Wake 2, with the fans no even getting to play as Alan Wake? This year is either filled with garbage or near-garbage, no mistake. If it were for Fromsoft and Larian Studios this would be year without a single worthwhile new game.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/11/14 19:58:55
Have you played this stuff or do you just quote sales numbers as the ultimate barometer of quality? Is your opinion formed by the click bait echo chamber? Maybe we just like completely different kinds of games? You're going so far out of your way to be hostile about this I don't really have a baseline from where you're coming from.
Like, lets be clear. I never really latched on to things like Call of Duty and the Assassin's Creed franchise along with most UbiSoft offerings became a competitive grind I fell out of love with a decade ago. Bethesda's style never really clicked with me either so if that kind of stuff is what you're into, I can see being less enthused than I've been. Just trying to get an idea where you're coming from.
I wonder how much D+ is actually killing Disney, and they really should have left Streaming to Netflix and licensed it out to them instead?
Are we going to see the "death" of streaming as all the studios are losing buckets of cash on it? Will it reconsolidate back to Netflix now? Or will the studios keep dumping $$$ in for market share and add Adverts to it all?
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If CEOs could admit their mistakes, we’d probably be back to the Netflix/Tubi model.
But my guess is we’ll see more Balkanized paid-subscription services to go full ham with advertisements. Worse customer experiences for steeper prices.
Well, with D+ jumping 3 bucks a month for me I’ll be dropping it. How many streaming services am I supposed to have, and how much are these companies expecting the average person to spend a month?
With Prime, D+ and Netflix, it’s over $40 a month. And with the number of shows and movies on each, who has time to watch that much TV??
Add in Paramount, HULU, and god knows how many others and one can easily be running over $100 a month for streaming.
As for the Marvels though? I don’t even care what Marvel Studios puts out at this point anymore. And I’m a huge Marvel comics fan and was a fan of the MCU. They’ve killed my interest in the franchise simply by over saturating us with too much. And it’s not even the good stuff! They literally have 70 years of stories and characters along with the sales data of which stories/characters sold and all they’re making is stuff with unpopular characters, and modern storylines that aren’t selling comics.
Which is why I’ve about completely given up on Marvel Studios.
As for the Marvels though? I don’t even care what Marvel Studios puts out at this point anymore. And I’m a huge Marvel comics fan and was a fan of the MCU. They’ve killed my interest in the franchise simply by over saturating us with too much. And it’s not even the good stuff! They literally have 70 years of stories and characters along with the sales data of which stories/characters sold and all they’re making is stuff with unpopular characters, and modern storylines that aren’t selling comics.
Which is why I’ve about completely given up on Marvel Studios.
I think I'm about the complete opposite. My Marvel exposure as a kid was primarily Spiderman, and then X-Men as a teenager. As much as I enjoyed the Spiderman and (most of) the X-Men movies, I've quite enjoyed the fact that the MCU has given me a bunch of movies about characters I was either only vaguely familiar with or didn't know anything about at all.
I also wonder if it's the storylines that aren't selling comics, or just the fact that print media is dying generally.
As for the Marvels though? I don’t even care what Marvel Studios puts out at this point anymore. And I’m a huge Marvel comics fan and was a fan of the MCU. They’ve killed my interest in the franchise simply by over saturating us with too much. And it’s not even the good stuff! They literally have 70 years of stories and characters along with the sales data of which stories/characters sold and all they’re making is stuff with unpopular characters, and modern storylines that aren’t selling comics.
Which is why I’ve about completely given up on Marvel Studios.
I think I'm about the complete opposite. My Marvel exposure as a kid was primarily Spiderman, and then X-Men as a teenager. As much as I enjoyed the Spiderman and (most of) the X-Men movies, I've quite enjoyed the fact that the MCU has given me a bunch of movies about characters I was either only vaguely familiar with or didn't know anything about at all.
I also wonder if it's the storylines that aren't selling comics, or just the fact that print media is dying generally.
Yeah, same here. Before watching the original Avengers back in 2012, I couldn't tell you a damn thing about Thor, Iron Man, Black Widow - any of'em. Phase 1 is what made me fall in love with those characters, and I highly doubt I ever would have been exposed to them otherwise. I have no problem with them introducing new heroes to general audiences, so long as the stories are written well.
I think I'm about the complete opposite. My Marvel exposure as a kid was primarily Spiderman, and then X-Men as a teenager. As much as I enjoyed the Spiderman and (most of) the X-Men movies, I've quite enjoyed the fact that the MCU has given me a bunch of movies about characters I was either only vaguely familiar with or didn't know anything about at all.
I also wonder if it's the storylines that aren't selling comics, or just the fact that print media is dying generally.
Spiderman and zoids. And Transformers. Was that marvel?
I tell you, if they did a good Zoids series in the style of the British comic I would be hooked and paying a subscription...
Ex-Mantic Rules Committees: Kings of War, Warpath
"The Emperor is obviously not a dictator, he's a couch." Starbuck: "Why can't we use the starboard launch bays?"
Engineer: "Because it's a gift shop!"
As for the Marvels though? I don’t even care what Marvel Studios puts out at this point anymore. And I’m a huge Marvel comics fan and was a fan of the MCU. They’ve killed my interest in the franchise simply by over saturating us with too much. And it’s not even the good stuff! They literally have 70 years of stories and characters along with the sales data of which stories/characters sold and all they’re making is stuff with unpopular characters, and modern storylines that aren’t selling comics.
Which is why I’ve about completely given up on Marvel Studios.
I think I'm about the complete opposite. My Marvel exposure as a kid was primarily Spiderman, and then X-Men as a teenager. As much as I enjoyed the Spiderman and (most of) the X-Men movies, I've quite enjoyed the fact that the MCU has given me a bunch of movies about characters I was either only vaguely familiar with or didn't know anything about at all.
I also wonder if it's the storylines that aren't selling comics, or just the fact that print media is dying generally.
Yeah, same here. Before watching the original Avengers back in 2012, I couldn't tell you a damn thing about Thor, Iron Man, Black Widow - any of'em. Phase 1 is what made me fall in love with those characters, and I highly doubt I ever would have been exposed to them otherwise. I have no problem with them introducing new heroes to general audiences, so long as the stories are written well.
The problem is, they aren’t written very well.
There are literally decades of amazing stories they could use and adapt.
And they aren’t using any of them.
Saw it yesterday and really liked it. Certainly one of the best recent Marvel movies imo. The jokes landed ('he's bilingual' was great), it didn't outstay its welcome and big-screen Ms Marvel was a delight.
As mentioned earlier? SAG strike meant it received little to no hype. That’s a factor here, given how much advertising is usually done for a Blockbuster. Now we kinda see why it was done.
Yet, audience scores remain high. Almost as if….its a genuinely decent movie. Which having seen it with my own eyes and brain? It is.
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Lack of hype, lack of advertising, lack of interviews in the run up all matter. Especially when an overwhelming percentage of those who have seen it enjoyed it.
And it’s another “did we even watch the same film, or were you too busy looking for things to nitpick you didn’t actually pay any attention” situation when it comes to reviewers.
No plot element goes unexplained by the end. Our main characters all have motivations which make sense. The performances are no worse than Fine.
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Yeah, the hate for this movie is really bizarre. People really want this to fail and the genuine delight in its box office woes is so weird. It's no Winter Soldier or Infinity War, but it comfortably sits with most other MCU movies in its quality IMO.
creeping-deth87 wrote: Yeah, the hate for this movie is really bizarre. People really want this to fail and the genuine delight in its box office woes is so weird. It's no Winter Soldier or Infinity War, but it comfortably sits with most other MCU movies in its quality IMO.
Similar things happened with this year's DC superhero films. Shazam 2 and Flash weren't masterpieces, but they got beat up a little more than they deserved.
No one showed up for Shazam 2, and that was even a sequel to a film that did decent BO, had very high audience and critical scores, and then did well in streaming. You would expect it to top the original's numbers or at least maybe match it. But audiences still seem to be cagey about watching films in theaters. They'll come out for certain experiences, but not others that they would have pre-COVID. And I think that superhero fatigue is fairly real at this point.
I'm really not sure that anyone is going to care much about James Gunn's new DCU. It's the right idea, 10 years too late.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/11/20 15:05:07
The Flash is another oddity, given the bizarre and illegal behaviour of its lead.
I for one have no wish to endorse such behaviour, and so won’t watch it. The same reason I don’t watch films starring Jared Leto, Rebel Wilson, James Corden, Tom Cruise and others.
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Anyway, I think this is kind of a bigger Solo effect, a movie that would have struggled to attract a huge audience to begin with following up on one or more punishing duds. The audience might like the film, but they won’t take the risk after the last couple times their hands were burned.
Add in the terrible economy, and you have a situation where people are saving their dollars for the few movie experiences that really stand out.
I'm really not sure that anyone is going to care much about James Gunn's new DCU. It's the right idea, 10 years too late.
I think the thing that's easily forgotten is that superhero films have been cultural milestones for decades, but not the same style of superhero movies. The genre has "died" at least half a dozen times, only to sprout up again. A lot of the failures of the DCEU really come down to it holding on to a grounded style that had been building since X-Men but really peaked with The Dark Knight. A lot of the MCU's success is a result of building on the style of the Rami Spider-Man films, which seemingly peaked with Endgame. Gunn's new DCU might be a flop, but it also might set the tone for what super hero films resonate with the next decade of audiences. Above all else though, what makes audiences see these films is making them good films. The MCU has always had some high grade mediocrity, but the greats carry audiences through the couple hour lulls here and there. I'd actually wager that Phase 3 films have a simliiar average quality, but its a lot harder to ignore weekly doses of 45 minute time sinks.
I think it's complicated. IMO, the grounded style itself didn't do in the DCEU when offerings like Daredevil through The Batman were very popular in that same time period. And while I wouldn't call WW a grounded film exactly, it certainly had a level of grit to it that the first Cap film kinda lacked.
So I think it's much more about the style's execution, application, and timing. Safe to say that Snyder had trouble with all three of those with BvS.
Anyway, yes, maybe Gunn's DCU reignites the genre. But it's really hard to just whip up a genre-changing 'great' film. And I'm not sure that theaters are a rational marketplace these days.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Very little. Certainly never displayed an ounce of talent or charisma.
You included her in a list of people who did/do crimes or were abusive to coworkers (and Tom Cruise). Did she not commit any crime or abuse?
I'm sure there's...something.
People can do whatever they want. Personally, I think if one boycotted every film that had a sh*tty person attached to it, you'd be left with a very small list of movies to watch. Hollywood's issues didn't begin and end with Harvey Weinstein and Ezra Miller, for chrissakes.
So PERSONALLY, I don't worry about that stuff. I can go see a film to support all the hundreds of non-sh*tty people who worked hard on it to feed their families.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/11/20 16:41:39
creeping-deth87 wrote: Yeah, the hate for this movie is really bizarre. People really want this to fail and the genuine delight in its box office woes is so weird. It's no Winter Soldier or Infinity War, but it comfortably sits with most other MCU movies in its quality IMO.
Similar things happened with this year's DC superhero films. Shazam 2 and Flash weren't masterpieces, but they got beat up a little more than they deserved.
No one showed up for Shazam 2, and that was even a sequel to a film that did decent BO, had very high audience and critical scores, and then did well in streaming. You would expect it to top the original's numbers or at least maybe match it. But audiences still seem to be cagey about watching films in theaters. They'll come out for certain experiences, but not others that they would have pre-COVID. And I think that superhero fatigue is fairly real at this point.
I think this is a big part but its broken into a few segments
1) People who are just sick of superhero films. IT might be they were never fans; or they are just wanting something a little fresh and perhaps original.
2) People who might be casual fans but are burned out on the constant cross-over films that require you to have seen multiple other TV shows/films to keep up; often with totally different characters/ensembles. I'm very much falling into this group. I like the idea, but they have networked so many different elements together that the films feel messy and perhaps I don't want to "Watch 16 hours of content to see one film". Even though I'm also accepting the argument put forth in point 3 - that all those hours of watching are only to keep up with a very basic story.
3) People who are serious fans but are getting lost/frustrated with how all the interconnected stories are often boiling down to insanely simple plots. Ergo for those who are keeping up and are engaging; there just isn't a deeper layer to most of the stories being presented. It's all super shallow standard comic/action flick film writing. Even the characters often lack the emotional elements within the films. Partly because being killed often just means you'll be reintroduced later; or because the film has another halfdozen to dozen character to focus on as well so your death kind of gets glossed over rather fast. There's no time to process sense when its onto the next action sequence.
DC/Marvel seem to have gone super super hard with the whole crossovers thing. Something that once was a one-off comic or few comics has become a core foundation and I think it creates very messy situations. TV series and comics can somewhat handle it better, but films just fall apart when you've 120mins to cram a halfdozen to a dozen lead characters into a film; each one of which comes with several prior films (and might even have reboots before that). I know I certainly find it very hard to keep up casually, plus when taken into live action a lot of the characters can start to appear quite bland/the same when they are out of costume and such. Esp if they have actor changes/art style changes/etc.. between films.
In the end I think if they want to stay on the superhero train I almost feel like what they need to do is take a step back from all the massive universe stories and end of the world as we know it every single time; and actually focus on core stories and development. Perhaps even risking some new heroes or character that haven't have the limelight as much. Certainly don't do ANOTHER spiderman origin story - for dear love of gods not another (that's what 5 or 6 now?)
Honestly it feels like the Super Hero films are burning out, but that we are stuck because nothing's really coming in (or getting a chance to come in) to replace them.
Addressing the critics on X/Twitter, horror author King wrote: “I don’t go to MCU movies, don’t care for them, but I find this barely masked gloating over the low box office for The Marvels very unpleasant.
“Why gloat over failure?” The Shining writer questioned, hypothesising that “some of the rejection of The Marvels may be adolescent fanboy hate”.
“You know, ‘Yuck! GIRLS!’” he said.
'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'
- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
I think obsessing over the box office figures is super weird in general. I've loved so many things that don't sell well that I have little correlation between the two. I know people like having it as evidence to feel like their opinion is justified, but I personally have zero stake in the financial success of things. I definitely don't need get attached to hating something to not see it.
