GenRifDrake wrote: Again.. check the image I linked, it too says Power of Hysh...
Yes, and I removed that bit because I'm not going to go through translating every little bit of the datasheet to make sure it's exactly the same for both.
That is fair enough, but it seems plausible to me that there is just one Power of Hysh, else it's gonna be very confusing going "i'm doing Power of Hysh! No not that Power of Hysh, that's the Warden Power of Hysh, this is the Sentinels Power of Hysh, it does To Wounds instead of To Hits" etc. So I think it's fair to assume there is just the one, and extrapolating from that, they will be on To Hit rolls and not To Wound rolls.
Earth127 wrote: this feels like it's half of the lumineth they have planned but they're saving up scultping the rest untill a later date. Looking at you Tyrion.
How many kits did the Ossiarch start with?
There is a lot of mentions in a number of articles we’ve had about Tyrion and Tyrion’s military skill and martial might. But then no Tyrion! I’d love to see him with more models linked to other aspects. I’d also love to see a new imagined Malhandir to perhaps as some sort of AoS Pegasus type unit that the cavalry unit venerates.
However I will be getting this range as soon as I can and will get other stuff when it’s out
Earth127 wrote: this feels like it's half of the lumineth they have planned but they're saving up scultping the rest untill a later date. Looking at you Tyrion.
How many kits did the Ossiarch start with?
There is a lot of mentions in a number of articles we’ve had about Tyrion and Tyrion’s military skill and martial might. But then no Tyrion! I’d love to see him with more models linked to other aspects. I’d also love to see a new imagined Malhandir to perhaps as some sort of AoS Pegasus type unit that the cavalry unit venerates.
However I will be getting this range as soon as I can and will get other stuff when it’s out
There is evidence imo that this is only half of the Lumineth people, with a focus on Teclis. It is stated there are 8 Lumineth nations and while they all revere Tyrion and Telcis, there is bias towards one of the two in each nation. Syar, Iliatha, Ymetrica and Zaitrec are stated as the Teclian nations, and low and behold, they are the 4 sub factions in the book. I am REALLY hoping, one or two years from now, will get a 2nd Lumineth launch/wave, that will have Tyrion and bring with it units from the other Spirit Temples to Wind, Zenith and River, with Oultrai, Aurathrai, Helon and Alumnia as it's 4 sub factions being the other 4 nations of the Lumineth.
-Start of combat, unit champion does D3 MW to enemy unit within 3" on a 2+
-6s to hit do a MW instead
-If you attack something that's charged this turn, you get +1 wound and +1 rend
-Spell: MWs on 5+ instead of 6
Alarith Spirit of the Mountain (340)
- At the start of the combat phase, if this model didn't charge, gain +1 Attack until your next movement phase
-At the end of your hero phase, choose a LUMINETH hero within 3". If that hero is within 3" at the beginning of your next hero phase, it can use a command ability without spending a CP -At the start of the enemy shooting phase, and any melee phase, pick 1 enemy unit with range of this ability. That unit is -1 to hit until the end of that phase. Doesn't stack.
-If this model is within 12" of a friendly STONEMAGE, you can treat this model has having suffered 0 wounds when you reference its damage table
-Command Ability:Start of combat phase, +1 Attack to a ALARITH-AELF unit wholly within 18", doesn't stack and doesn't stack with Avalenor's CA.
Alarith Stonemage (130)
-At the start of the combat phase, you can say this model takes the Stonemage Stance. If you do, this model and ALARITH STONEGUARD units within 12" cannot pile in and gain +1 Rend.
-Gravitational Diversion: Casts on 5. Caster can fly until next hero phase. 1 enemy unit within 18" takes 1 MW, can't fly, and has halved movement until next hero phase.
Scinari Cathallar (140)
-Start of the battleshock phase, pick 1 LUMINETH unit wholly within 18" and roll a die. 2+, you don't make a BS test for that unit. If at least one model from the chosen unit was slain this turn, you can pick 1 enemy unit within 18" which has to do a BS test, adding the number of models from the friendly unit to that roll.
-Darkness of the Soul: Casts on 7. Pick 1 enemy within 18" and visible to the caster, roll 2d6 each time that unit attempts a normal move, charge, or pile-in. If the result is higher than that unit's Bravery, that unit can't complete that action.
Light of Eltharion (220)
-Pick 1 enemy Hero within 3" of this model at the start of the combat phase. Add 1 to the Damage of the Celennari-Klinge for attacks against that hero
-+1 to wound with Krallenschwert des Eltharion if he charged. Also unmodified 6s to hit deal 1 MW in addition.
- In the shooting phase, choose an enemy unit within 18" and roll a dice. 1, nothing happens; 2-4, deal D3 MWs; 5+ deal D6 MWs
-Ignore save modifiers and half damage from ranged and melee attacks.
-Ignore negative hit modifiers. Unmodified hits of 6 deal two hits.
-Command Ability: Friendly units wholly within 24" of this model have bravery 10.
Teclis (660)
-Can cast 1, 2, or 3/4 spells. If 1, its auto cast and cant be unbound. If 2, it's auto cast at 12 but can be unbound. If 3 or 4, it's auto cast at 10 and can be unbound.
-Celennars Aura: +1 to cast, dispel, and unbind
-Can auto dispel 1 endless spell in your hero phase and auto unbind 1 enemy spell in their hero phase
-Friendly units in Celennar's aura ignore spells on a 4+ and an enemy within 18" takes D3 MW.
-Spell 1: 10 to cast. 5+ FNP within 18", can't be cast same turn as Hysh Protection.
-Spell 2: 10 to cast. Roll a dice for each enemy unit within 18" and visible. 1, nothing happens; 2-4 D3 MW, 5+ D6MW
Avalenor (360)
-If this model doesn't charge, +1 Attack
-6s to hit with hammer do 1 MW in addition
-At the end of your hero phase, pick a Hero within 6". If that Hero is still within 6" at the start of your next hero phase, it can use a command ability without costing a CP - -1 to hit for enemies within Hysh Watcher aura
-Treat this model as having suffered 0 wounds if within 12" of a Stonemage
-CA: Choose D3 Alarith-Aelf units wholly within 24". +1 Attack, can't benefit from this and Faith of the Mountains in the same phase.
Alarith Stoneguard (100 for 5, max 15)
-Standard Bearer: RRBS tests
-Unmodified 6 to hit with regular weapons deal 1 extra Damage
-Unmodified 6 to hit deal 1 MW instead
-RR hits with Stratumhammer
Vanari Sentinels (10 for 140, max 20)
-Can pick an enemy unit within 30" of the unit champion that isn't visibble, can attack as if they were visible with the long range profile.
-Two attack profiles
-Unmodified 6+ to hit does 1 MW instead, 5+ with spell
-Wizard if they have the unit champion and 5+ models
Dawnriders (130 for 5, max 20)
-Standard bearer lets you RR Battleshock tests
-Start of combat, can choose to either +1 Attack but only attack non-mounted units with 1 or 2 wounds, or add 2 but can only target unmounted units with a wound value of 1.
-+1 wound and +1 rend on charge
BATTALIONS
Alarith-Temple (120)
-1xAvalenor or Alarith Spirit of the Mountain, 1xAlarith Stonemage, 1-3xAlarith Stoneguard
-STONEGUARD units wholly within 12" of a hero from the same ability can reroll saves but can only move (pile in?) 1"
Auralan-Legion (120)
-1xScinari Cathalar, 2-4xVanari Auralan Sentinels with an equal amount of Vanari Auralan Wardens
-Units within 3" of another unit in this battallion can RR saves of 1
Dawnrider-Lance (120)
-2-3xVanari Dawnriders
-RR 1s to hit on the charge
ALLEGIANCE ABILITIES
Aetherquartz Abilities
-+1 Save when chosen as an attack target
-+1 to hit when chosen to fight
-+1 or reroll cast
-Cast an extra spell
Absorb Despair
-Once per phase, a Cathallar wholly within 18" of a unit who uses an Aetherquartz can absorb it. If they do, don't reduce that units Bravery by 1 and instead choose an enemy unit within 18" of the Cathallar and reduce it's Bravery by 1 for the rest of the battle. An enemy unit can't be affected by this more than once per battle.
Superior Reactions
-When you pick a unit to fight, you can pick two and resolve them in any order (only works during the combat phase, not at start or end of combat phase)
LORE OF HYSH
Speed of Hysh: Casts on 5 Double the movement of a friendly unit within 18" of the caster.
Solar Flare: Casts on 8. Pick a point on the battlefield within 10" of the caster. If there is an endless spell there, dispel it. If there is a unit there, roll # of models dice, Each +6 does 1 MW and until next hero phase -2 to enemy wizards cast, unbinds, and dispels.
Sparkling Light: Casts on 5. Pick an enemy unit within 18", you can reroll missile weapon attacks against that unit until your next hero phase.
Heavenly Blessing: Casts on 6. Give Ethereal to a friendly unit within 18"
Total Darkness: Casts on 8. Until next hero phase, your opponent has to spend 2 CP instead of 1 when using command abilities
Protection of Hysh: Casts on 8. Give a friendly unit wholly within 9" 5+ FNP. Doesn't stack with Teclis'.
LORE OF THE MOUNTAINS
Relentless Calm: Casts on 4. Unit wholly within 18' doesn't have to take BS tests.
Paralyzing Dizziness: Casts on 6. Pick an an enemy unit within 18" of the caster. Until your next hero phase, roll 2d6 each time the unit tries to make a normal move, pile in, or charge (?) move. If the roll is higher than the unit's bravery, it cannot make that move.
Voice of the Mountains: Casts on 6. -2 Bravery to all enemy units until end of turn, and then -1 until your next hero phase.
Living Divide: Casts on 6. Draw a 1mm line to a point 9" from the caster, on a 2+ deal D3 MWs to a unit that lines passes over
Bury: Casts on 7. Pick an enemy model within 18" and visible to the caster. Roll a dice, if the result is higher than the model's Wound characteristic, it is slain. If you roll a 6 and it is not enough to kill, deal D6MW instead.
Stone Attack: Casts on 8. CHoose an enemy unit wholly within 24" and visible to the caster. Roll a number of dice equal to the casting roll. For each result greater than the enemy unit's save value, they take 1 MW. Rolls of 1 or 2 never deal a mortal wound and Saves of "-" count as 6 for this rule.
GRAND NATIONS
ZAITREC
-First cast, unbind, or dispel each hero phase gets +1 and each wizard knows an additional spell
-Command Trait: Can dispel 1 additional spel and can use the first dispell roll for the second
-Artefact: 6+ shrug for MWs, +2 if Teclis is on the battlefield
-Overwhelming Heat: Casts on 7. Enemy unit within 24" has halved movement, and if you roll a die and its equal to or higher than their save, they take D3
ILIATHA
-Connected Souls: +2 Bravery
-Acting with Courage: After a unit uses a command ability, you can choose a friendly unit within 3" of that one. If you do, that unit can also use that command ability without spending a CP. once per phase.
-Command Ability: Used in shooting or comat ph ase. Pick a friendly unit with at least 2 models, they can RR 1s to hit.
-Artefact: When the bearer dies, roll a dice. on a 4+ heal them back to full.
(No mandatory command trait)
SYAR
-Units start with 2 Aetherquartz instead of 1
-Command Ability: Friendly unit wholly within 18" of a hero can use 1 of its Aetherquartz
-Command Trait: Choose 1 enemy hero within 6" of this hero. That enemy hero must attack your general, and your general gets +1 to hit for attacks against that enemy hero
-Artefact: Unmodified 3+ hits always hits, Unmodified 3+ wounds always wound, and unmodified 3s to save always fail.
YMETRICA
-Ignore up to -2 Rend for units in Mountain Stance, instead of -1
-Command Ability: End of combat phase, can use Tectonic Force again against another enemy unit within 1"
-Command Trait: When you pick this guy to fight, instead of fighting you can pick an enemy unti within 1" and deal D3 MW on a 2+.
-Artefact: +1 Attack to chosen weapon, 6+ Shrug, and 5+ Spell ignore
I suppose it had been clear for a while, but I am disappointed there are so few units and the only non wizard characters are special characters or monsters. This looks like the AdMech release again. Seems pretty clear there will be additional units in a year or so unless this tanks
Hm, I can see a number of potential balance concerns that dial back my hopes for the quality of this battletome. That said, quite a lot of the rules design remains great and there is nothing I see which changes that.
May be we'll see another round of Hedonites next year with mortals then
Tyrion's Lumineths to help kick them out (again) from the 10 paradises of Hysh...
Could be an interesting narrative for a book like they did with Archaon Vs Ossiarchs.
Just my opinion/wishes of course, nothing facted...
And they can't even ally with... whatever it is the High Elves are called now?
There is 2 Mono build infantry, Wardens and Sentinels are two different kits, one being archers, one being spearmen and beyond that 3 blister characters yea. As i've said else where, I am pretty sure the Lumineth are going to get a second wave launch, it probably won't be for a year or two, but there is evidence in the lore from what we know of them that this is one side of their coin. It kinda sucks that we're probably knowing GW release cycles gonna have to wait a year or two to get second half, but i'm rather convinced such is coming.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Hm, I can see a number of potential balance concerns that dial back my hopes for the quality of this battletome. That said, quite a lot of the rules design remains great and there is nothing I see which changes that.
These guys seem like they pack a huge punch, but they are fragile with no summoning.
I only have three issues that jump out at me upon just an initial skim
1. Teclis. He pretty much shuts down the magic phase if you are not Nagash or Tzeentch. He also has some busted abilities. That being said, he's only 16W with a base 4+ save. There are plenty of armies that can remove him turn 1 without breaking a sweat, or bracket him very low. Those that rely on magic to do that may have a hard time.
2. The Hammer dudes with the subfaction that makes them battleline looks like it may make them immune to up to rend -2 looks to be pretty good.,
3. The archers I'm not sure on yet. the 5+ to hit mortal wound if the spell goes off seems really good, and may end up being the boogeyman.
Other than that, they don't have a horde discount or summoning, and their aetherquartz boosts are limited. I think their core mechanics seem balanced enough that if there are any issues that a points tweak will fix it.
First up, some good news for everyone. No model in the Lumineth Realm-lords set is exclusive, timed or otherwise – you’ll be able to get the same excellent kits from the box when they’re released in full later in the year, more on that below! This means that if you miss out on the Army Set, you won’t be losing out on any miniatures. Meanwhile, if you’re lucky enough to secure a box, you’ll find reinforcing your army simple.
First up, some good news for everyone. No model in the Lumineth Realm-lords set is exclusive, timed or otherwise – you’ll be able to get the same excellent kits from the box when they’re released in full later in the year, more on that below! This means that if you miss out on the Army Set, you won’t be losing out on any miniatures. Meanwhile, if you’re lucky enough to secure a box, you’ll find reinforcing your army simple.
This is what I figured when they released the box set this late.
I'm guessing this means we are likely (Hopefully!) looking at Pariah for preview this week.
We know when this stuff was supposed to happen, Sasori. White Dwarf 454 was supposed to have been out by now as it contains the WarCry rules for Lumineth which contains all of the units. We're going to only get 10 issues of WD in 2020 instead of the usual 12, so it's not too difficult to work out that this would have been the 'big thing' for April/May. "Engine War" was the last week of March/first week of April.
New40k, sadly, is the only thing they probably can't futz with as a release schedule and is why we're being told "later in the year" for the Lumineth stuff.
Aye GW has too much stock and product invested into 40K 9th to move it along; its much easier to move smaller releases around in the schedule. They are also likely playing it by ear a lot of the time and balancing production capacity against demand.
Eg right now they are likely casting up loads of marines and necrons for the launch since they are the poster armies.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Hm, I can see a number of potential balance concerns that dial back my hopes for the quality of this battletome. That said, quite a lot of the rules design remains great and there is nothing I see which changes that.
These guys seem like they pack a huge punch, but they are fragile with no summoning.
I only have three issues that jump out at me upon just an initial skim
1. Teclis. He pretty much shuts down the magic phase if you are not Nagash or Tzeentch. He also has some busted abilities. That being said, he's only 16W with a base 4+ save. There are plenty of armies that can remove him turn 1 without breaking a sweat, or bracket him very low. Those that rely on magic to do that may have a hard time.
2. The Hammer dudes with the subfaction that makes them battleline looks like it may make them immune to up to rend -2 looks to be pretty good.,
3. The archers I'm not sure on yet. the 5+ to hit mortal wound if the spell goes off seems really good, and may end up being the boogeyman.
Other than that, they don't have a horde discount or summoning, and their aetherquartz boosts are limited. I think their core mechanics seem balanced enough that if there are any issues that a points tweak will fix it.
Many of my concerns could be dealt with by points adjustment and are thus relatively minor. However there is potential for a matchup misbalance where low bravery armies have a tremendous disadvantage while bravery-10 armies are practically immune to many of the Lumineth's debuffs. The archers doing character-sniping should they get their spell off and being able to fire off an average of 6.6 MWs at 30" with no LoS also seems like something difficult to account for with just points. I could go on but this is just estimation, my concerns could prove unfounded and I do not intend to make any definite statements as of now.
Not worried about the Sentinels. They lose Wizard status if the unit champion is slain and he also grants the no LOS shooting attack.
Anywho, the big thing about Lumineth is they seem to lack Battleline units. There's a weird caveat in effect for the way Wardens interact with Dawnriders and Sentinels but that is probably going to be mindbogglingly obvious once it's not in German.
Most armies don't even have an ability to pick certain models out of the unit, fewer still that can do it outside of very close range. I must be missing something because that argument does not make sense to me.
Then the other armies will just have to kill the 1W 5+ save unit that loses its Wizard status when the unit leader is slain or drops below 4 models+unit Champion?
I get that it seems crazy to start with, but it really doesn't seem to be from just the cursory view.
Kanluwen wrote: Not worried about the Sentinels. They lose Wizard status if the unit champion is slain and he also grants the no LOS shooting attack.
Anywho, the big thing about Lumineth is they seem to lack Battleline units. There's a weird caveat in effect for the way Wardens interact with Dawnriders and Sentinels but that is probably going to be mindbogglingly obvious once it's not in German.
It's been translated to meaning Wardens are Batteline units, but for every Warden unit you take, you can take 1 unit of Sentinels OR 1 unit of Dawnriders as Battleline too.
Ghaz wrote: I have a feeling that Teclis is going to be following Sigmar's example...
Spoiler:
Yep me too, it seems too intentional that Tyrion with a second wave of Lumineth is going to be coming at some point. I really want to see what the temple warriors of the other spirits might look like, i'd love to see some badass swordsmen unit revolving around flowing like the river or the wind etc.
Yeah typically your unit leader and banner etc... are the last models in a unit to die unless you've very specific sniper units or you can contrive a situation to kill just them.
Personally I think that's fine because most of the time those buffs are made to be core parts of how those units work as a group; so allowing them to be selectively taken out too easily would defeat the point of them.
Kanluwen wrote: Not worried about the Sentinels. They lose Wizard status if the unit champion is slain and he also grants the no LOS shooting attack.
Anywho, the big thing about Lumineth is they seem to lack Battleline units. There's a weird caveat in effect for the way Wardens interact with Dawnriders and Sentinels but that is probably going to be mindbogglingly obvious once it's not in German.
It's been translated to meaning Wardens are Batteline units, but for every Warden unit you take, you can take 1 unit of Sentinels OR 1 unit of Dawnriders as Battleline too.
That's assuming, as all the leaked photos I've seen cut off a quarter of the text.
Kanluwen wrote: Not worried about the Sentinels. They lose Wizard status if the unit champion is slain and he also grants the no LOS shooting attack.
Anywho, the big thing about Lumineth is they seem to lack Battleline units. There's a weird caveat in effect for the way Wardens interact with Dawnriders and Sentinels but that is probably going to be mindbogglingly obvious once it's not in German.
It's been translated to meaning Wardens are Batteline units, but for every Warden unit you take, you can take 1 unit of Sentinels OR 1 unit of Dawnriders as Battleline too.
That's assuming, as all the leaked photos I've seen cut off a quarter of the text.
I'm in the FB group with the guy who got the box early and posted all the pics, that was apparently the translation they said.
That's cool and all, but until it's 100% posted or I can see it in English I'm simply saying that it is probably going to be mindboggingly obvious once it's not in German.
Lumineth are quite cheap with how many mortal wounds they can make. I mean, the archers can be rerolling all hits with guiding light and doing mortal wounds on 5+ to hit. 30 archers doing that at 30" without LOS are gonna delete many units.
Galas wrote: Lumineth are quite cheap with how many mortal wounds they can make. I mean, the archers can be rerolling all hits with guiding light and doing mortal wounds on 5+ to hit. 30 archers doing that at 30" without LOS are gonna delete many units.
They are max unit of 20 sadly but they still have potential. Wardens are scarey too imo at 30 max unit size, 3" reach, and 2 attacks each... Get the Power of Hysh off and buffs to re-roll some misses and that's a huge amount of attacks doing MW on 5+ to hit.
Kanluwen wrote: Then the other armies will just have to kill the 1W 5+ save unit that loses its Wizard status when the unit leader is slain or drops below 4 models+unit Champion?
I get that it seems crazy to start with, but it really doesn't seem to be from just the cursory view.
So wait, the reason you said before is invalid but now it is a different reason, why didn't you say it in the first place? And how many armies are killing models at 30" range with no line of sight required? I'm not saying they will or won't be an issue (in fact I am specifically saying I do not know yet) but your reasoning makes no sense to my reading.
Galas wrote: Lumineth are quite cheap with how many mortal wounds they can make. I mean, the archers can be rerolling all hits with guiding light and doing mortal wounds on 5+ to hit. 30 archers doing that at 30" without LOS are gonna delete many units.
They are max unit of 20 sadly but they still have potential. Wardens are scarey too imo at 30 max unit size, 3" reach, and 2 attacks each... Get the Power of Hysh off and buffs to re-roll some misses and that's a huge amount of attacks doing MW on 5+ to hit.
MW spam is my biggest concern. I am hoping for some mitigating elements we have yet to see or put together.
Only Idoneth as allies is a bit hard to understand:
First Teclis wanted to destroy them considering them as a failure of his,
and other factions like Sylvaneth, Cities of Sigmar, or even Stormcast should be able
to ally them because, well fluffwise this is how they work.
Since Morathi and Teclis are depicted listenning at least to each other,
even the Sisters of Kaine could be a candidate.
These new Elves are almost enough to make me wanted to get into AoS. I always liked the aesthetic of the Hive Elves, and the cavalry, spearmen and archers here are all very nice.
Not so keen on the Wraithcow, or Teclis and his Kingdom Death reject monster though...
H.B.M.C. wrote: These new Elves are almost enough to make me wanted to get into AoS. I always liked the aesthetic of the Hive Elves, and the cavalry, spearmen and archers here are all very nice.
Not so keen on the Wraithcow, or Teclis and his Kingdom Death reject monster though...
Fear not, as I am sure the AU prices will quash that desire in full.
The best part is that SCE can take LRL as allies as they can ally with any order faction. I'm sure it's getting addressed in the next GHB, still, I think they've overplayed the isolated nation(s) card as it doesn't serve any real purpose (apart from *buy our new product*).
Since Morathi and Teclis are depicted listenning at least to each other, even the Sisters of Kaine could be a candidate
The nations seem more independent and engaged in their affairs. Teclis has priests/emissaries but those figures likely don't speak for the Lumineth nations, however it is rather odd that the Deepkin have more diverse pallet of allies to choose from. I had imagined CoS, Sylvaneth and Deepkin are going to make the cut, perhaps even Fyreslayers as they're wandering mercenaries.
New Lumineth set already “no longer available online” on the NZ site! And costs $365 NZ dollars for anyone who can work out what that will be elsewhere
No wolves on Fenris wrote: New Lumineth set already “no longer available online” on the NZ site! And costs $365 NZ dollars for anyone who can work out what that will be elsewhere
Now on UK site for £110
£88 if you get it from Element or 3rd parties. Not bad if you're after the limited book and such.
No wolves on Fenris wrote: New Lumineth set already “no longer available online” on the NZ site! And costs $365 NZ dollars for anyone who can work out what that will be elsewhere
Now on UK site for £110
£88 if you get it from Element or 3rd parties. Not bad if you're after the limited book and such.
$185 here in the states with a final price at a discount retailer of about $170 (discount + taxes).
As someone that just wants the models and tome (fancy tome would be nice but not a must have), I might wait on the Start Collecting box and Tome to come out separately. That should run about $125 all said and done.
So a difference of $45 (£36) if I wait for the individual releases. It's not much spread out over the months between here and when they actually become available but 40k's new edition is out next month so I'm sure the Lumineth would just sit on my shelf for months anyway.
That's assuming the SC box is: a) Coming this year(highly doubtful). b) Contains the same items as this set. c) Not going to be $100 or so.
We know exactly what is "limited to this box". Dice($25 for 20 when they release usually), counters and ability cards(ranges from $20 to $30), the combat gauge(first time we've gotten an army themed one that I can think of--these are overpriced normally), and the book's specialness.
Realtalk: If people want the items in this set? You're probably going to want to grab it. I'm not a fan of the army book but I can(and will) trade/sell that off if I like the cover of the general release better.
You're looking at $35 to $40 for Eltharion(50mm based character), $50 to $60 for the Wardens, $50 to $60 for the Dawnriders.
That's anywhere from $135 to $160 individually. The Start Collecting will probably be a Scinari Cathaller or Alarith Stonemage(guessing conservatively, $35 a pop on them--possibly $30 if lucky), a pack of Wardens, and a unit of Dawnriders or one of the Spirits of Alarith(the goat construct). The army is fairly limited as to what there is and they likely want to do a 'sampler' with the SC versus the Army Pack that's up right now which leans heavily towards the Vanari side of things.
Getting Started sets can take some time - Daughters of Khaine didn't get one for more than a year after release and they were one of the poster-child factions for the start of AoS 2.0
It doesn’t look like a great value. Maybe they realized that they can get away with that for the limited release boxes because they sell out so quickly.
Kanluwen wrote: That's assuming the SC box is:
a) Coming this year(highly doubtful).
b) Contains the same items as this set.
c) Not going to be $100 or so.
We know exactly what is "limited to this box". Dice($25 for 20 when they release usually), counters and ability cards(ranges from $20 to $30), the combat gauge(first time we've gotten an army themed one that I can think of--these are overpriced normally), and the book's specialness.
Realtalk:
If people want the items in this set? You're probably going to want to grab it. I'm not a fan of the army book but I can(and will) trade/sell that off if I like the cover of the general release better.
You're looking at $35 to $40 for Eltharion(50mm based character), $50 to $60 for the Wardens, $50 to $60 for the Dawnriders.
That's anywhere from $135 to $160 individually. The Start Collecting will probably be a Scinari Cathaller or Alarith Stonemage(guessing conservatively, $35 a pop on them--possibly $30 if lucky), a pack of Wardens, and a unit of Dawnriders or one of the Spirits of Alarith(the goat construct). The army is fairly limited as to what there is and they likely want to do a 'sampler' with the SC versus the Army Pack that's up right now which leans heavily towards the Vanari side of things.
The newest AoS Start Collecting, Slaves to Darkness, is $95 for: 1 Lord, 5 Knights, 10 Warriors. 16 models total.
Same as the Lumineth contents: 1 Eltharion, 5 Dawnriders, 10 Wardens.
Seems like a good match to be re-packed as the Lumineth Start Collecting box. Not guaranteed, but very likely in my opinion.
Assuming they keep the same price point, and there's nothing to suggest they wouldn't, that's $95 for the start collecting.
$95 Start Collecting Lumineth
$40 Battletome (Not the fancy tome, but the tome nonetheless)
That's $135 MSRP. Which translates to ~$125 after applying discount and taxes.
Again, that's just for the (potential) Start Collecting box and tome which are all I care for in the new box. The accessories are only a detriment to the price in my eyes.
Don't mind waiting as the new 40k boxed set is coming out very soon and the Lumineth would only gather dust for months before I paid them any mind.
Could buy it, sit on it, and sell it when full Lumineth release hits, then just pick up the SC and tome at a deeper discount thanks to the profits. As this special box would probably only appreciate, same as the Sisters of Battle one has.
It all depends on how much you value those dice and tokens.
Egyptian Space Zombie wrote: It doesn’t look like a great value. Maybe they realized that they can get away with that for the limited release boxes because they sell out so quickly.
In a way I am OK with it, as it makes things less appealing to scalpers.
Inquisitor Gideon wrote: Side question; is this the first time a limited ed battle tome/codex has been sold through 3rd parties?
Nope the Sisters of Battle was, far as I recall, also sold through 3rd parties and also had a limited edition inside. I think its how GW wants to sell them now. It doesn't surprise me as the price for limited editions on their own always turned me away from them; giving them away with discount over a regular codex along with a box of great models all at the start is a very neat way to get sales of them. Certainly the SoB and Luminoth boxed sets are things I would have bought if I were starting either army and had the money at launch.
The newest AoS Start Collecting, Slaves to Darkness, is $95 for: 1 Lord, 5 Knights, 10 Warriors. 16 models total.
Same as the Lumineth contents: 1 Eltharion, 5 Dawnriders, 10 Wardens.
Seems like a good match to be re-packed as the Lumineth Start Collecting box. Not guaranteed, but very likely in my opinion.
Assuming they keep the same price point, and there's nothing to suggest they wouldn't, that's $95 for the start collecting.
You know that Slaves to Darkness are Easy to Build/simplified builds right? The Lumineth stuff is full kits. You can go and look at the sprues right now if you want to. The Slaves to Darkness stuff is all shared frames.
$95 Start Collecting Lumineth $40 Battletome (Not the fancy tome, but the tome nonetheless)
That's $135 MSRP. Which translates to ~$125 after applying discount and taxes.
Again, that's just for the (potential) Start Collecting box and tome which are all I care for in the new box. The accessories are only a detriment to the price in my eyes.
Don't mind waiting as the new 40k boxed set is coming out very soon and the Lumineth would only gather dust for months before I paid them any mind.
Could buy it, sit on it, and sell it when full Lumineth release hits, then just pick up the SC and tome at a deeper discount thanks to the profits. As this special box would probably only appreciate, same as the Sisters of Battle one has.
It all depends on how much you value those dice and tokens.
That's cool and all, but Indomitus is also not full kits but rather simplified kits.
The newest AoS Start Collecting, Slaves to Darkness, is $95 for: 1 Lord, 5 Knights, 10 Warriors. 16 models total.
Same as the Lumineth contents: 1 Eltharion, 5 Dawnriders, 10 Wardens.
Seems like a good match to be re-packed as the Lumineth Start Collecting box. Not guaranteed, but very likely in my opinion.
Assuming they keep the same price point, and there's nothing to suggest they wouldn't, that's $95 for the start collecting.
You know that Slaves to Darkness are Easy to Build/simplified builds right? The Lumineth stuff is full kits. You can go and look at the sprues right now if you want to. The Slaves to Darkness stuff is all shared frames.
A bit beside the point so long as the units remain (relatively) the same.
In any case, I don't see why they would have full kits in this box and not the more dynamic push-fit stuff if it were available. The Sisters box had the dynamic push-fit models for their special box with special codex and later released the full kits.
Don't think they're sitting on Lumineth push-fit sprues just for the eventual SC.
Kanluwen wrote: That's cool and all, but Indomitus is also not full kits but rather simplified kits.
That's irrelevant. My point is that it's coming out soon which decreases the immediacy of my "need" to get the Lumineth stuff.
And my point is that Slaves to Darkness is an exception rather than the rule. It's currently one of three Start Collecting sets using easier to build mechanics that weren't in Starter Sets.
The other two are Start Collecting Vanguard Space Marines and Start Collecting Chaos Space Marines--both of which got brought in via Shadowspear(a battle box rather than starter).
And no, it isn't "a bit beside the point". Read the article posted yesterday. These are the kits that will be available at retail. The Sisters stuff will likely end up as a Start Collecting later this year, but we have yet to see any signs of AoS moving to have slews of SC sets in an easy build format.
Kanluwen wrote: And my point is that Slaves to Darkness is an exception rather than the rule. It's currently one of three Start Collecting sets using easier to build mechanics that weren't in Starter Sets.
The other two are Start Collecting Vanguard Space Marines and Start Collecting Chaos Space Marines--both of which got brought in via Shadowspear(a battle box rather than starter).
And no, it isn't "a bit beside the point". Read the article posted yesterday. These are the kits that will be available at retail. The Sisters stuff will likely end up as a Start Collecting later this year, but we have yet to see any signs of AoS moving to have slews of SC sets in an easy build format.
The Age of Sigmar was the first starter set that got moved to Start Collecting status, so we technically had 5 easy to build SC, with four of them being made from pre existing boxsets, minus a few units. As far as I am aware, the chaos space marine side is identical to Shadowspear, but the Librarian is missing from the primaris SC. And they shrunk down the number of blood reavers you get from the Khorne SC. I think we've also got the Dark Imperium ending up as SC sets, which I imagine will also shrink the number of poxwalkers per set from 20 to 10.
Kanluwen wrote: And my point is that Slaves to Darkness is an exception rather than the rule. It's currently one of three Start Collecting sets using easier to build mechanics that weren't in Starter Sets.
The other two are Start Collecting Vanguard Space Marines and Start Collecting Chaos Space Marines--both of which got brought in via Shadowspear(a battle box rather than starter).
And no, it isn't "a bit beside the point". Read the article posted yesterday. These are the kits that will be available at retail. The Sisters stuff will likely end up as a Start Collecting later this year, but we have yet to see any signs of AoS moving to have slews of SC sets in an easy build format.
Didn't dispute that the Lumineth Army Set has full kits. That's fact.
The contention is you believe the Start Collecting Lumineth box will have push-fit models and I'm saying I think it's likely they'll just use the full kits but that ultimately I don't care so long as it's the same units (or equivalently cool units).
All this to argue that I don't feel the Army Set is a good purchase for me at this time since I'd be paying for stuff I don't want and could pick up the stuff I care about (or a reasonable equivalent) for less money down the line when I'm not bolter deep in the new 40k set.
If anyone else feels like buy it, that's great. My reasons not to don't disparage your choice.
It's not a set I'd pick up, but I guess can sort of justify the price by looking at it like:
*The models are basically a start collecting (albeit a very poor one) or half the contents of one of those limited run boxsets. If you consider it a Start Collecting, that alone is $85.
*The Limited Edition Battletome. I'm not sure what price they do LE tomes, but when I picked up the old Dwarf rulebook, it cost $100.
*36 Reference cards. Those usually retail at $12-15, right? The cheapest cards I've seen GW sell are warcry ones for $10, while some go up to $27 (yikes), but we'll just say they'd cost $12.
*20 Army dice. Unlike the Miracle Dice from the sisters of battle army box, these actually are themed to the army. So $15.
*I'm not going to bother pricing the rest of the stuff. A 16 rulebook pamphlet, combat guage, 9 inch rule, and objective tokens don't really hold any value.
So, technically the set would have a value of $212ish dollars, give or take. And retails at $185.
I guess its not terrible. It's not really over priced, and once the units are released separately, I imagine those three units will retail for more than $85. Eltharion alone is probably $30, and even small units tend to be pretty costly now. I guess its good if you like the look of the army and wanted a limited edition battletome. I don't know how many people care about the cards or mediocre themed dice, but I guess those are just bonus
Kanluwen wrote: And my point is that Slaves to Darkness is an exception rather than the rule. It's currently one of three Start Collecting sets using easier to build mechanics that weren't in Starter Sets.
The other two are Start Collecting Vanguard Space Marines and Start Collecting Chaos Space Marines--both of which got brought in via Shadowspear(a battle box rather than starter).
And no, it isn't "a bit beside the point". Read the article posted yesterday. These are the kits that will be available at retail. The Sisters stuff will likely end up as a Start Collecting later this year, but we have yet to see any signs of AoS moving to have slews of SC sets in an easy build format.
Didn't dispute that the Lumineth Army Set has full kits. That's fact.
The contention is you believe the Start Collecting Lumineth box will have push-fit models and I'm saying I think it's likely they'll just use the full kits but that ultimately I don't care so long as it's the same units (or equivalently cool units).
All this to argue that I don't feel the Army Set is a good purchase for me at this time since I'd be paying for stuff I don't want and could pick up the stuff I care about (or a reasonable equivalent) for less money down the line when I'm not bolter deep in the new 40k set.
If anyone else feels like buy it, that's great. My reasons not to don't disparage your choice.
Okay, so basically you decided to put words in my mouth or misunderstood what I said and have been arguing against that. Cool, now I get what's going on.
Spoiler:
Kanluwen wrote:
That's assuming the SC box is:
a) Coming this year(highly doubtful).
b) Contains the same items as this set.
c) Not going to be $100 or so.
We know exactly what is "limited to this box". Dice($25 for 20 when they release usually), counters and ability cards(ranges from $20 to $30), the combat gauge(first time we've gotten an army themed one that I can think of--these are overpriced normally), and the book's specialness.
Realtalk:
If people want the items in this set? You're probably going to want to grab it. I'm not a fan of the army book but I can(and will) trade/sell that off if I like the cover of the general release better.
You're looking at $35 to $40 for Eltharion(50mm based character), $50 to $60 for the Wardens, $50 to $60 for the Dawnriders.
That's anywhere from $135 to $160 individually. The Start Collecting will probably be a Scinari Cathaller or Alarith Stonemage(guessing conservatively, $35 a pop on them--possibly $30 if lucky), a pack of Wardens, and a unit of Dawnriders or one of the Spirits of Alarith(the goat construct). The army is fairly limited as to what there is and they likely want to do a 'sampler' with the SC versus the Army Pack that's up right now which leans heavily towards the Vanari side of things.
I never said anything about pushfits. The numbers I called out are for full kits.
When I stated a 'sampler', it refers to the fact that Lumineth have effectively two 'factions' in them: Alarith(Stonemage, Spirit of the Mountain/named battlegoat, and Stonewardens) and Vanari(Wardens, Sentinels, Dawnriders) with the remaining three characters(Teclis, Light of Eltharion, Scinari Cathallers) playing an 'inbetween' role for both.
I never referred to anything Lumineth as pushfits. I ballparked some prices for the kits in this big box.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
GaroRobe wrote: It's not a set I'd pick up, but I guess can sort of justify the price by looking at it like:
*The models are basically a start collecting (albeit a very poor one) or half the contents of one of those limited run boxsets. If you consider it a Start Collecting, that alone is $85.
Start Collectings aren't a static price anymore. $85 is for the Khorne & SC out of the starter set for Realmgate Wars and the non-Primaris Space Wolves set. $90 is where we're starting at now for most stuff, $110 is the most expensive if I remember right.
*The Limited Edition Battletome. I'm not sure what price they do LE tomes, but when I picked up the old Dwarf rulebook, it cost $100.
$80 now.
*36 Reference cards. Those usually retail at $12-15, right? The cheapest cards I've seen GW sell are warcry ones for $10, while some go up to $27 (yikes), but we'll just say they'd cost $12.
So here's where things get weird. "Reference Cards" aren't a thing we usually see. These ones are a different format it seems from what we normally get(which are Warscroll Cards detailing the units from the army not the wargear and the like) and would be included with the Objective Tokens in all likelihood.
It's possible that this book is going to be like Codex: Genestealer Cult and include the Objective Sheet with the Battletome.
*20 Army dice. Unlike the Miracle Dice from the sisters of battle army box, these actually are themed to the army. So $15.
Army dice are $20 to $25 a pop usually.
*I'm not going to bother pricing the rest of the stuff. A 16 rulebook pamphlet, combat guage, 9 inch rule, and objective tokens don't really hold any value.
So, technically the set would have a value of $212ish dollars, give or take. And retails at $185.
I guess its not terrible. It's not really over priced, and once the units are released separately, I imagine those three units will retail for more than $85. Eltharion alone is probably $30, and even small units tend to be pretty costly now. I guess its good if you like the look of the army and wanted a limited edition battletome. I don't know how many people care about the cards or mediocre themed dice, but I guess those are just bonus
Combat Gauge is the only thing which would actually have a price. They were something stupid like $30 for a metal thing.
Inquisitor Gideon wrote: Side question; is this the first time a limited ed battle tome/codex has been sold through 3rd parties?
Nope the Sisters of Battle was, far as I recall, also sold through 3rd parties and also had a limited edition inside. I think its how GW wants to sell them now. It doesn't surprise me as the price for limited editions on their own always turned me away from them; giving them away with discount over a regular codex along with a box of great models all at the start is a very neat way to get sales of them. Certainly the SoB and Luminoth boxed sets are things I would have bought if I were starting either army and had the money at launch.
Well, the Sisters got a second limited edition codex anyway; sold seperately from the box.
As for appearing better value, due to having the easy to build figures with basically no options, the SoB box was cheaper than the basic codex and even just a fraction of the included figures if bought as full kits (which are obviously not worth the same anyway, but assuming you also buy at least some of the full kits later for some extra bits, they're not much worse). While these Lumineth are the full kits, the set only appears to be discounted if putting a high value on the limited edition nature of the codex, which many people don't (especially since it's just a special cover, none of the fancy stuff they used to have in the past). In fact, I absolutely love the SoB codex from the box set, but if available seperately I wouldn't have paid more than a fiver extra to have it instead of the ordinary version.
torgoch wrote: Do we know the cost of the Light of Eltharion individually?
I imagine as a solo he would be priced pretty close to Abaddon and wouldn't form part of a start collecting set.
We don't know yet. Given the size he's probably going to be the new named character price of 32,50€. Bile rather than Abaddon.
Unless he's released so late that GW raises the price again in the meantime.
Ah, i was expecting him to be more than Bile. He's a substantial model on large scenic base. Still, we will see.
Bile is two guys now. And a Chaos Lord at that; hardly insubstantial. But really the main thing is the number of sprues and I don’t think we have that for Eltharion 3.0
Actually, does anyone else want the actual Eltharion to turn up one day and be all “rumours of my death have been greatly exaggerated” just for the look on Teclis’s (and everyone else’s) face? Not least because then they have to figure out who/what has really been piloting the suit this whole time…
NinthMusketeer wrote: The model is also hollow with a textured interior, I don't know if that makes the molds more expensive to produce but I wouldn't be surprised.
I can't imagine that the sprue design would need to be any different, he'll still be assembled from moldable forms.
The idea being that for any given piece both sides must have a fully sculpted texture, as opposed to one side being smooth and featureless since it will be on the interior of an enclosed model. But again, I have no idea if that is a real factor or not.
The number of undercuts, type and number of the nozzles, cost of the material, pins, the hour cost of CNC and other technological operations are rough factors used. The number of undercuts, material cost, and CNC hours are the factors that add the most to the cost of the tool.
It's quite likely GW uses some other formulas to determine its cost, but I'd be surprised, if that'd be the cause of this particular product selling at the higher price. I am not an expert in moulding but it could also be a possibility that they've used this project just to see how much they can push it from a technological view.
Order Draconis, Swifthawk Agents, and any High Elf stuff that wasn't Shadow Warriors(now in Shadowblades) or Sisters of Avelorn(now Sisters of the Watch in the Wanderers) are gone over to Legends...so is it really that surprising the Lumineth can't ally with them?
Kanluwen wrote: Order Draconis, Swifthawk Agents, and any High Elf stuff that wasn't Shadow Warriors(now in Shadowblades) or Sisters of Avelorn(now Sisters of the Watch in the Wanderers) are gone over to Legends...so is it really that surprising the Lumineth can't ally with them?
Kanluwen wrote: Order Draconis, Swifthawk Agents, and any High Elf stuff that wasn't Shadow Warriors(now in Shadowblades) or Sisters of Avelorn(now Sisters of the Watch in the Wanderers) are gone over to Legends...so is it really that surprising the Lumineth can't ally with them?
Kanluwen wrote: Order Draconis, Swifthawk Agents, and any High Elf stuff that wasn't Shadow Warriors(now in Shadowblades) or Sisters of Avelorn(now Sisters of the Watch in the Wanderers) are gone over to Legends...so is it really that surprising the Lumineth can't ally with them?
Who can they ally with?
Only Idoneth Deepkin.
Would not have been my first guess. Thought Teclis burned that bridge. I'm more curious than ever to read their lore now. That's a surprisingly limited list of allies.
Kanluwen wrote: Order Draconis, Swifthawk Agents, and any High Elf stuff that wasn't Shadow Warriors(now in Shadowblades) or Sisters of Avelorn(now Sisters of the Watch in the Wanderers) are gone over to Legends...so is it really that surprising the Lumineth can't ally with them?
Who can they ally with?
Only Idoneth Deepkin.
Would not have been my first guess. Thought Teclis burned that bridge. I'm more curious than ever to read their lore now. That's a surprisingly limited list of allies.
Yeah I’m surprised too. From the snippets of lore they’ve shown so far, they seem to be very prideful and vein (usual high elf kind of affair) so I assume that’ll be a reason for why they don’t ally with most. But allying with Idoneth is odd, of all the ones they could’ve picked, so maybe they rekindle some form of alliance or friendship.
I'm only surprised they didn't sneak the Son's tome and model out as well considering its just one kit ( as far as we are ware at this stage).
Of course a lower model count week makes sense production wise; chances are GW is gearing up and trying their best to keep 40K stuff in stock as much as they can for the new edition launch.
I'm not really complaining about it. It just seems like there's usually more build-up to the GHB release. I probably won't be picking it up for a while, though. I'm going to be focusing my efforts of 40k during Lockdown 2: SARS-Cov Boogaloo.
So apparently the new GHB doesn’t have the new correct points and we’re getting a separate pdf with those instead. The new GHB Has points, they’re just the old ones.
AduroT wrote: So apparently the new GHB doesn’t have the new correct points and we’re getting a separate pdf with those instead. The new GHB Has points, they’re just the old ones.
The GHB has the correct points for most armies, its just for the newer books that the points will be in the PDF, becuase the GHB has been made months ago. Samething happend last year
AduroT wrote: So apparently the new GHB doesn’t have the new correct points and we’re getting a separate pdf with those instead. The new GHB Has points, they’re just the old ones.
It has correct points until cities of sigmar. The book was already finalised then, so any books that came out after will get an update in a pdf file.
people also fast forget (or with AoS weren't around before) just how fast GW was pushing out battletomes. One a month at least on average was a blazing speed for a company that used to leave months between each book. So yep you either have no GHB or you have a bunch of points online only - its not a huge issue esp when most changes are fairly minor; a simple slip of paper in your battletome or using the free warscroll builder and you've got your update points.
Overread wrote: people also fast forget (or with AoS weren't around before) just how fast GW was pushing out battletomes. One a month at least on average was a blazing speed for a company that used to leave months between each book. So yep you either have no GHB or you have a bunch of points online only - its not a huge issue esp when most changes are fairly minor; a simple slip of paper in your battletome or using the free warscroll builder and you've got your update points.
There are a host of ways of avoiding this mess with just a modicum of competency.
"The full Lumineth Realm-lords range will be hitting shelves soon!" In the meantime, Rainbow Dash Always Dresses in Style!
And soon according to AOSFB team is september which they specifically called out. Wonder if that was intended leak or unintended leak though still there. But one would expect reveal of release month would be with bit more fanfare.
"See how our teams have been painting their Lumineth ahead of their widespread release in September."
Overread wrote: people also fast forget (or with AoS weren't around before) just how fast GW was pushing out battletomes. One a month at least on average was a blazing speed for a company that used to leave months between each book. So yep you either have no GHB or you have a bunch of points online only - its not a huge issue esp when most changes are fairly minor; a simple slip of paper in your battletome or using the free warscroll builder and you've got your update points.
There are a host of ways of avoiding this mess with just a modicum of competency.
Well points online for free but GW+free=don't mess up. Freeze battletome releases for like 3/4 year(half a year lead time, 3 months to actually get points) before GHB but that would leave only about 3 months in which actually release battle tomes or simply don't do any point changes for books that were released after GHB points were set. Or current.
"The full Lumineth Realm-lords range will be hitting shelves soon!" In the meantime, Rainbow Dash Always Dresses in Style!
Spoiler:
Now there's a unique color scheme.
I like the orange color scheme a lot better than the showcase one the studio chose. I think I said it before, but GW should have picked that one over the boring official one. It has so much more character.
Gw official shemes tend to avoide more complex painting methods to achieve. In general they tend to go for schemes that are easily done to that new customers have a greater chance to emulate them.
There is now a great temptation to get a unit or two of those knights and paint them up for my daughter as MLP knights...that might also cure my hatred of painting horses...endless variations of red-brown, light-brown, black-brown and oh look...more brown.
I could get behind purples, blue and neon colored horses...
Sacredroach wrote: There is now a great temptation to get a unit or two of those knights and paint them up for my daughter as MLP knights...that might also cure my hatred of painting horses...endless variations of red-brown, light-brown, black-brown and oh look...more brown.
I could get behind purples, blue and neon colored horses...
Serious statement:
Look at the Gryph-Chargers for the Stormcast Vanguard range. They're not horses...but they've got a fun, fluffy reason for being all different kinds of colors. They're magical beasties that have a coloration based upon the magic of the Realm they're found in.
Serious statement:
Look at the Gryph-Chargers for the Stormcast Vanguard range. They're not horses...but they've got a fun, fluffy reason for being all different kinds of colors. They're magical beasties that have a coloration based upon the magic of the Realm they're found in.
Yes, for some reason I have no issues with most other mounts (except for big cats), and have six of the gryph-chargers in my Stormcast pile.
I think my issue with horses began when I used to do 15mm and painted up about 40 baggage train figures for a Napoleonics scenario...the 1990s were a strange time for wargaming...
Serious statement: Look at the Gryph-Chargers for the Stormcast Vanguard range. They're not horses...but they've got a fun, fluffy reason for being all different kinds of colors. They're magical beasties that have a coloration based upon the magic of the Realm they're found in.
Yes, for some reason I have no issues with most other mounts (except for big cats), and have six of the gryph-chargers in my Stormcast pile.
I think my issue with horses began when I used to do 15mm and painted up about 40 baggage train figures for a Napoleonics scenario...the 1990s were a strange time for wargaming...
I can get that.
The paint guide for the horses for Lumineth is kind of interesting. The 'box art' brown horses? They're sprayed Corax White, painted Kislev Flesh, then washed with Skeleton Horde Contrast in a 2:1 mix of SH and Contrast Medium. Then they do a bit of edge highlights with Screaming Skull.
There's also some guides for grey and dapple horses.
ungry to collect some aelves? The Lumineth Realm-lords will be arriving in September,
Sigh... Aelves...
AoS must be giving their spell checkers fits.
A new Rosetta-type stone was found near Nottingham recently by an employee of GW. It was buried a full 6” move distance in the sand of a kindergartn sandbox. That along with some cutting edge design action figures which they have adapted to be the next generation of Space Marines.
New army transports also coming with Hello Kitty-type faces on it, though not Hello Kitty but some sort of Dark Mechanicus cat.
Aelves is not the worst of the AoS names, not even among the worse, but one of the attractive bits of Fantasy and 40k was the use of easily recognizable tropes. To someone with even a passing knowledge of fantasy there's no need to explain what an Orc or Zombie or Lizardman is. GW's unique version of them needs filling in of course but once you hear the name you're pretty much ready to go.
The more nonsensical the names become the less accessible the game is. Dark Elves is easy to understand, Druhilli or whatever they're now called is not. And Seraphons and Fyre Slayers and Khapratic Overlords are right out.
Kid_Kyoto wrote: The more nonsensical the names become the less accessible the game is. Dark Elves is easy to understand...
Those were the bad guys in that not-so-good Thor movie, right? Sometimes you don't want to be associated with a generic name anymore...
Bah. The invasion of the palace was the most 40k scene in anything. Vortex grenades, idiots trying to swordfight in sci-fi, stormshields, flying transports to drop troops into assault range, etc
High/Dark/Wood Elves are all gone. Not simply rebranded but actually dead. Unlike armies like Lizardmen-->Seraphon or Orcs-->Orruks they were destroyed in the End Times and never made it to the AoS setting. The closest we have is Wanderers, which are analogous enough to Wood Elves, but still have significant differences to mark them as an entirely separate culture. Meanwhile the likes of Darkling Covens, Corsairs or DoK share models with the Dark Elves of old but are literally and figuratively different armies.
NinthMusketeer wrote: High/Dark/Wood Elves are all gone. Not simply rebranded but actually dead. Unlike armies like Lizardmen-->Seraphon or Orcs-->Orruks they were destroyed in the End Times and never made it to the AoS setting. The closest we have is Wanderers, which are analogous enough to Wood Elves, but still have significant differences to mark them as an entirely separate culture. Meanwhile the likes of Darkling Covens, Corsairs or DoK share models with the Dark Elves of old but are literally and figuratively different armies.
And I will still field a Cities of Sigmar army and call them Dark Elves. Or the Empire, for that matter.
I think we might be waiting a while for the New Stuff as 40K 9th takes the lead for a bit.
Aside from starter sets, it doesn't look like we're going to see much of anything else for 40k until October. We already know the Lumineth are coming in September, and I'd be willing to bet that Sons of Behemat will drop before October, as well - especially since it's really just a book and one box kit.
I think we might be waiting a while for the New Stuff as 40K 9th takes the lead for a bit.
Aside from starter sets, it doesn't look like we're going to see much of anything else for 40k until October. We already know the Lumineth are coming in September, and I'd be willing to bet that Sons of Behemat will drop before October, as well - especially since it's really just a book and one box kit.
Good candinate for august release. Lumineth in september, 40k codexes(2) in october with plenty of new kits. What comes in august? 40k starters but that's 1 week. Maybe some marine/necron models comes before codex. But SoB would fit well to august that's atm fairly empty looking.
Oh and august-september I expect LOTR releases previewed in spring to come finally as well.
I think we might be waiting a while for the New Stuff as 40K 9th takes the lead for a bit.
Aside from starter sets, it doesn't look like we're going to see much of anything else for 40k until October. We already know the Lumineth are coming in September, and I'd be willing to bet that Sons of Behemat will drop before October, as well - especially since it's really just a book and one box kit.
Good candinate for august release. Lumineth in september, 40k codexes(2) in october with plenty of new kits. What comes in august? 40k starters but that's 1 week. Maybe some marine/necron models comes before codex. But SoB would fit well to august that's atm fairly empty looking.
Oh and august-september I expect LOTR releases previewed in spring to come finally as well.
they've also announced a bunch of 40k characters which could be released in august-september
I think we might be waiting a while for the New Stuff as 40K 9th takes the lead for a bit.
Aside from starter sets, it doesn't look like we're going to see much of anything else for 40k until October. We already know the Lumineth are coming in September, and I'd be willing to bet that Sons of Behemat will drop before October, as well - especially since it's really just a book and one box kit.
Good candinate for august release. Lumineth in september, 40k codexes(2) in october with plenty of new kits. What comes in august? 40k starters but that's 1 week. Maybe some marine/necron models comes before codex. But SoB would fit well to august that's atm fairly empty looking.
Oh and august-september I expect LOTR releases previewed in spring to come finally as well.
they've also announced a bunch of 40k characters which could be released in august-september
They confirmed that Underworlds is getting stuff in August, as is Necromunda, and there’s Warcry stuff that’s been teased but not properly announced yet.
I think we might be waiting a while for the New Stuff as 40K 9th takes the lead for a bit.
Aside from starter sets, it doesn't look like we're going to see much of anything else for 40k until October. We already know the Lumineth are coming in September, and I'd be willing to bet that Sons of Behemat will drop before October, as well - especially since it's really just a book and one box kit.
Good candinate for august release. Lumineth in september, 40k codexes(2) in october with plenty of new kits. What comes in august? 40k starters but that's 1 week. Maybe some marine/necron models comes before codex. But SoB would fit well to august that's atm fairly empty looking.
Oh and august-september I expect LOTR releases previewed in spring to come finally as well.
they've also announced a bunch of 40k characters which could be released in august-september
They confirmed that Underworlds is getting stuff in August, as is Necromunda, and there’s Warcry stuff that’s been teased but not properly announced yet.
And also Warcry stuff that has been announced (Scions of the Flame).
Seen worse. Granted, I'd hate to see someone try to use these, but they've got nothing on an actual 'd3,' a d100 (basically a golf ball with numbered divots) and a percentile die that is one d10 inside a larger, clear d10.
Warhammer Age of Sigmar wrote:The full range will be released over the next two weeks!
Good to know, thanks.
Giants before the end of the month, I hope. A few other odds and ends, hopefully we can 'catch up' on delayed releases and get back on track by November.
All I can think is you must have not seen many dice then. These aren't even the worst faction dice GW has put out if you are concerned about function. Let alone all the strange permutations of dice that exist.
I am planning on getting a set. They won't be used in dice pools certainly, but I could see rolling for Initiative, spell casting or important rolls only needed 1-2 dice for my Lumineth army. Also they make a good deterrent to an opponent annoying me with helmet and battle-cattle comments during a game as I can add a die each time to my pool.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I don't mind the breaking Lumineth into two pre-order periods. I am planning to get a pretty sizable amount to the point I doubt I will even have the first week models finished being built let alone primed before I get the second part. I also wasn't looking forward to paying for everything all at once, so it's kinda nice to have it broken up into chunks.
No models for me till Xmas and then January as it’s my bday and that’s when I can buy a load of models. (3 kids and one on the way puts paid to luxuries like plastic crack) but the battletome will be ordered next week
Sasori wrote: Will be nice to finally get my hands on the battletome.
Where the hell were you people wanting a battletome when I had money and could have bought more of the launch boxes?!
There's a mistake in the article though, saying the Sentinels were in the launch boxes. It was the Dawnriders.
Hopefully it's not mistake as in "sorry you get dawnriders, not sentinels".
I can do useful 2k list with releases in article. Cavalry rather than archers? Gimps list hard. (plus i loathe painting any cavalry)
It appears as though Dawnriders and Sentinels are.coming based on the video. I am fine with either or both, since the way my list is shaping up, I am going to need two more squads of Wardens and a squad of Dawnriders and a squad of Sentinels. They can keep their Cows. I want traditional High Elves.
Using the battle report from last month as a guide I reckon if you took that army as it was then doubled up on the units (so another 1x sentinels, wardens, dawn riders, Stoneguard and the non named moontain) it would put at around 3000 points or there abouts
I'll be getting cow elves eventually and especially the big cow but it's the sentinels I need. If I can get them then I can get decent 2k army from what will be available next week and what I have even without cavalry(I have 2x5 anyway). Teclis, calthallar(for which I have count as model already), 20+10 warden, 20+10 sentinel, 5 dawnrider, spellportal(feels bit cheesy with teclis though....that's basically MW's to entire enemy army), twinstones and prismadic palisade. Plus battalion.
1990, haven't thought about relics. Syar. Need 30 sentinels, 10 wardens, teclis and endless spells. Maybe get the card set as well.
I like the dice. They’re clear and readable and sufficiently different that they could be used for wound counters or objective markers or a game round dial without getting accidentally picked up for a roll. Imma get a set, plus Eltharion.
In regards to dice, look at the squig dice if you want terrible.
They look like crap, they are lumpy (massive impact on rolling) and insanely expensive for what they are.
Doesn’t help that they can’t even print them correctly as the colours on the teeth don’t even line up, so look horrible.
Wouldn't surprise them coming in september as well. We know there's at least 1(unlikely to be 2) more waves of Lumineth september. That leaves 2 weeks. There's 2 40k codexes and tons of models in october so good luck fitting much else there. As sob are basically 1 kit plus book it's super easy to fit into 1 week anyway. So wouldn't surprise me: 5.9 lumineth wave 1, 12.9 lumineth wave 2, 19.9 something(warcry?), 26.9 sob and then october dedicated to 40k.
The audio bit on the weekly update confirms Lumineth as being a 2 week release. So next week we'll see previews of the rest - cavalry, a few more leaders and the rock/mountain elemental units - titan and warriors.
I can see them releasing Sons too - agreed its just one big kit that can be allied into any other army and also one Battletome. Simple easy and quick.
It also means that GW is moving forward and it would leave us only the Warcry release from early year previews getting out.
Well with GW they could put something between 2 waves of lumineth and not exactly break their word. GW has habit of saying something players take to mean X and in fact it's Y so I'm not 100% certain they will be 2 consecutive weeks.
But as even in worst case it's only 1 week between and I'll have plenty to paint from wave 1 won't be losing sleep either way. As it is they got enough in wave 1(assuming sentinels are indeed in wave 1 despite article spelling being bit odd) that I could wait for month or two lot easier than it was to wait SOB wave 3(which contained several key units for the army in competive sense...).
I think they'll do it over two weeks. Get it out the door and make a noise about it. Then it leaves the rest of the month for other things. I'd wager a shift to at least specialist games. We might get the Warcry Warband for DoK; or perhaps something for AT or AN. After that there's more 40K stuff, though October is going to be chock full of 40K between Marines and Necrons.
Overread wrote: I think they'll do it over two weeks. Get it out the door and make a noise about it. Then it leaves the rest of the month for other things. I'd wager a shift to at least specialist games. We might get the Warcry Warband for DoK; or perhaps something for AT or AN. After that there's more 40K stuff, though October is going to be chock full of 40K between Marines and Necrons.
The DoK Warcry warband is in the new Warcry starter. The multiplayer expansion for Underworlds is due for September too.
All I can think is you must have not seen many dice then. These aren't even the worst faction dice GW has put out if you are concerned about function. Let alone all the strange permutations of dice that exist.
I am planning on getting a set. They won't be used in dice pools certainly, but I could see rolling for Initiative, spell casting or important rolls only needed 1-2 dice for my Lumineth army. Also they make a good deterrent to an opponent annoying me with helmet and battle-cattle comments during a game as I can add a die each time to my pool.
Golly, what a compelling case for their worth. Buying an expensive pack of dice that roll like carrots only to use 1-2 per game. How foolish I am. Please, spend away
All I can think is you must have not seen many dice then. These aren't even the worst faction dice GW has put out if you are concerned about function. Let alone all the strange permutations of dice that exist.
I am planning on getting a set. They won't be used in dice pools certainly, but I could see rolling for Initiative, spell casting or important rolls only needed 1-2 dice for my Lumineth army. Also they make a good deterrent to an opponent annoying me with helmet and battle-cattle comments during a game as I can add a die each time to my pool.
Golly, what a compelling case for their worth. How foolish I am
tneva82 wrote: Teclis 130 euro, infantry 45, eltharion 33. Now i really don't care which week rest comes. Can't afford more before october anyway :lol:
Well infantry about what i expected. Teclis i wasn't so sure as not that familiar with big models and their prices
Source? That's Dominus Knight pricing. I know the new Teclis is big, but. . . wow. Feels like they are pricing this based on his in-game points more than the model (yes I know they do this anyway).
tneva82 wrote: Teclis 130 euro, infantry 45, eltharion 33. Now i really don't care which week rest comes. Can't afford more before october anyway :lol:
Well infantry about what i expected. Teclis i wasn't so sure as not that familiar with big models and their prices
Source? That's Dominus Knight pricing. I know the new Teclis is big, but. . . wow. Feels like they are pricing this based on his in-game points more than the model (yes I know they do this anyway).
Flgs order sheet. Stores get prices on mondays so usually somewhere prices get leaked. Spotted one on lumineth group.
And yes pricy. Of course if dominus would be released now it would be even more expeksive. Gw raises sku prices steadily as they get released. Eventually 10 inf model releae will be 50.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Kanluwen wrote: Eltharion is $40, Teclis $165, Sentinels and Wardens are $60.
Weird that no price for the Cathallar.
Not bothered too badly on the price for Teclis. He's a beefy model given the shots in the army book.
Teclis is... 650 points? Don't have the battletome on me atm. At any rate he is a third of the army and overpowered to boot. The reality is that in-game points does impact the 'purchasibility' of the miniature, and having him be such a big chunk of the army on his own will make that price tag easier to stomach. I still think it is more than a bit high.
$60 Wardens is a shame, I was hoping for 50. Not terrible though IMO; if an individual miniature of that design and quality was sold for $6 no one would have an issue. They are really nice figures.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Teclis is... 650 points? Don't have the battletome on me atm. At any rate he is a third of the army and overpowered to boot. The reality is that in-game points does impact the 'purchasibility' of the miniature, and having him be such a big chunk of the army on his own will make that price tag easier to stomach. I still think it is more than a bit high.
Yeah I'm definitely aware of GW's pricing taking into account the in-army value. They are pricing Lumineth as a low unit elite army, which to be fair they are. If they didn't jack the real world prices of these units up, people would be able to build whole armies of Lumineth for $300-$400, and we can't have that, now, can we?
According to the excel seen on reddit/4chin cathallar is around 22 euro. No idea how much it's in covidbucks.
Either way, Teclis is firmly in the "in your dreams" category, Infantry is up there with DoK Witch Elves. GIven how polarizing the other half of the army (cowheads) have been, its going to be a hard sell with this army.
I really like the look of those dice. I want to get them but I’m not sure how feasible it is to hold enough in your hand at once. Rolling should be fine though. Anyone got any sort of experience rolling a bunch of barrel dice at once?
Pleasantly surprised by the tactics article today--pretty much all of it is both correct and relevant. The exception is the first point; while some (very) niche situations may call for the single or dual cast, most games one should only ever use the quad cast option. The other point is more of a nitpick; while on his warscroll and not something one 'takes' per say, the Protection of Teclis spell IS one you want to be casting every turn bar the occasional context that doesn't call for it.
But everything else in the article is good advice and this will definitely be something I reccomend to people seeking advice on Teclis use.
Pre-Orders are up on the Kiwiland and Oz websites.
I like the Spearmen and the Archers. The spears are very long. I remain impressed with Eltharion as a model - creating a workable miniature that is an empty suit of armour couldn't've been easy.
Still can't get behind Teclis and his Kingdom Death reject mount.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Pre-Orders are up on the Kiwiland and Oz websites.
I like the Spearmen and the Archers. The spears are very long. I remain impressed with Eltharion as a model - creating a workable miniature that is an empty suit of armour couldn't've been easy.
Still can't get behind Teclis and his Kingdom Death reject mount.
Well seeing they are pikes(even says so in warscroll) makes sense they are long.
Told flgs to reserve teclis, 3 sentinels, endless spells and cards. With existing models enough to play 2k games
Those archers, the arrow would fell off if they put it on that side and tilt the bow like that.
Lance bucket and ballet research but still no basic archery knowledge, even the finger draw technique is the inferior one and usually associated with self taught archery.
Chopstick wrote: Those archers, the arrow would fell off if they put it on that side and tilt the bow like that.
Lance bucket and ballet research but still no basic archery knowledge, even the finger draw technique is the inferior one and usually associated with self taught archery.
Which draw technique? The figures appear to show two different types - some have one finger on the string either side of the arrow, another showing the arrow held between thumb and index finger with no fingers on the string itself.
Can't say I'm too worried about that or the endless debate over having the arrow rest on the thumb or a groove on the right side of the bow though, given the context of the impossible triple-stringed bow (well, impossible if the string isn't an elastic band). Was wondering if they'd look better once I got used to them, but.. turns out no. Spearelves look pretty ace though. Will look excellent as a dense formation (probably better on smaller bases than those supplied).
£36.50 for their basic infantry, so presumably it's going to be a rise across the board going forward for standard grunts. That's even more than Vulkites and pretty weird when 20 Motek Guard cost £1.50 less and I'm not sure we can blame static poses for it.
What in god's green earth are those sorry excuses for dice??!!! And they're 22 quid!! Insane.
Teclis at 105 is also absolutely ridiculous. He does not deserve to be more than ARCHAON. Granted he's really cool, but that pose is kind of janky. Hopefully we see some cool conversions asap.
They're really really inflating costs for these guys. 25 pounds is a lot yet they have to stretch the character to 26.50. and nearly 40 for a box of TEN GUYS?!
Coenus Scaldingus wrote: Which draw technique? The figures appear to show two different types - some have one finger on the string either side of the arrow, another showing the arrow held between thumb and index finger with no fingers on the string itself. Can't say I'm too worried about that or the endless debate over having the arrow rest on the thumb or a groove on the right side of the bow though, given the context of the impossible triple-stringed bow (well, impossible if the string isn't an elastic band). Was wondering if they'd look better once I got used to them, but.. turns out no. Spearelves look pretty ace though. Will look excellent as a dense formation (probably better on smaller bases than those supplied).
Look like a pinch draw, another self-taught technique, not to be confused with the mongolian thumb draw.
All they have to do is have the model lean and tilt the bow a bit to the left and the problem would be solved.
Also having multiple string added nothing, only 1 string will be the one sending energy to the arrow, while the other 2 to the bow limb, which will break the bow as it's the equivalent of dry firing. Let's just say it's proven Telic isn't the brightest of mind among the Aelves, but luckily he got some magic shenanigan to help this time.
All they have to do is have the model lean and tilt the bow a bit to the left and the problem would be solved.
What problem, they all seem to be posed decently? tilting the bow would look funny.
Anyway, big oof on the teclis, and still not happy about the infantry prices. Still going to collect maybe 1500pts of them, but over the course of a year. And teclis the prune is plain out of buying queue.
And how on earth are those warscroll cards so expensive, the army has ten units and 3 spells...
McMagnus Mindbullets wrote: They're really really inflating costs for these guys. 25 pounds is a lot yet they have to stretch the character to 26.50. and nearly 40 for a box of TEN GUYS?!
It is a case where the quality of miniature really comes into play. I agree it is a bit much, but divide the cost by 10 and realize people readily pay that for single miniatures of lower quality to use in RPGs.
As for the archers, I am assuming magic; the upper three strings are indeed elastic and their properties can be magically altered by the user when firing.
McMagnus Mindbullets wrote: They're really really inflating costs for these guys. 25 pounds is a lot yet they have to stretch the character to 26.50. and nearly 40 for a box of TEN GUYS?!
It is a case where the quality of miniature really comes into play. I agree it is a bit much, but divide the cost by 10 and realize people readily pay that for single miniatures of lower quality to use in RPGs.
As for the archers, I am assuming magic; the upper three strings are indeed elastic and their properties can be magically altered by the user when firing.
Theres no sane reason for the difference in miniature=€ for Morterk Guard and Lumineth Spearmen. Of course that will be fixed by GW , halving the miniatures in the Morterk Guard box.
Wardens have a good bit more surface to them than mortek guard, between the larger shield and larger weapon. Still think 20/box would be fair though, so I don't disagree with you
I don't think this is a very popular army. Pretty much every game store I've been to has multiple copies of the launch box gathering dust on the shelf.
Phobos wrote: I don't think this is a very popular army. Pretty much every game store I've been to has multiple copies of the launch box gathering dust on the shelf.
Unless you're willing to actively part it out, there's not really much reason to buy duplicates.
Light of Eltharion is a unique model and $40.
Wardens are $60 for 10.
Dawnriders will probably be $50 for 5.
And then there's the extraneous stuff(the counters, dice, and LE army book) that you probably aren't going to need a lot of.
Idoneth is old release. GW keeps upping prices per SKU round. 35£ for 10 is the current price. It's just matter of time before new SKU comes with 40£ for 10 and then it's that for new released until it goes up.
You don't get Idoneth level prices for any new release anymore. Just hope Idoneth doesn't get SKU change(say with reboxing) least they get price upped as well.
Also don't forget Luminoth hit the shelves almost at the worst possible time because Corona shut GW and the world down. So instead of following up the starter box with a full release, Luminoth got stuck half out the door. What with Indomitus and other things then coming first they've had basically a half year period waiting for their full release. I suspect a lot of people were waiting for the "full" release before going for the boxed set or at least wanting to see 360 views and real world views of other models in the range.
So its no surprise that some of their stock was slow to shift.
That said we've seen this before, unless the army out the door is broken in balance (eg Daughters of Khaine) then the uptake of a brand new army can be somewhat slower. It takes time for people to want a new army when they've already got others and for new people to filter into the game. Also I think we have to shed the idea that if GW doesn't "sell out" then its been a bad release. Sometimes they are going to sell out and we complain that they didn't make enough stock; other times they aren't. Heck its arguable that GW didn't sell out of Indomitus as there's still stock around on the highstreet stores. Even now I still see it being posted on FB groups that a store has a stack of boxes still for sale.
The LRL box was horrible because it was a SC! box that sold for 2x the price because of a "fancy" (horrible in other words, the faux velvet cover is already stained as opposed to normal hardcover) battletome and literal useless doodahs. Compared it to the SoB box for the same price...
tneva82 wrote: Idoneth is old release. GW keeps upping prices per SKU round. 35£ for 10 is the current price. It's just matter of time before new SKU comes with 40£ for 10 and then it's that for new released until it goes up.
You don't get Idoneth level prices for any new release anymore. Just hope Idoneth doesn't get SKU change(say with reboxing) least they get price upped as well.
Vulkites are older than Idoneth and they were £35 for ten and their characters were £18. GW seemed to realise they outpriced their audience given how poorly they sold (although this was still AoS 1.0) and so most of the standard infantry released after that remained around the £30, including the Idoneth.
Lumineth are in a somewhat unique situation where they've directly sold as a spiritual successor to the High Elves, who next to Warriors of Chaos were WHFB's most popular army and it's no secret there's been a good amount of hype surrounding them. They probably figured they can take the mick and people would still buy them, especially when they've done so well out of Covid.
Phobos wrote: I don't think this is a very popular army. Pretty much every game store I've been to has multiple copies of the launch box gathering dust on the shelf.
The launch box was kind of crap unless you absolutely needed some models RIGHT NOW (which to be fair, is how a lot of GW fans are) or you were somebody who planned to buy the limited edition codex anyway. The big boxes only really do well when there's at least one limited edition model that will only be available in that set, otherwise people are generally happy to wait until a general release. Indomitus and the Sisters box probably wouldn't have sold out almost instantly if GW hadn't pushed the, "AND THERE'S NOWHERE ELSE YOU'LL BE ABLE TO GET THESE EXCLUSIVE SPECIAL LIMITED SCULPTS EVER AGAIN!"
tneva82 wrote: Idoneth is old release. GW keeps upping prices per SKU round. 35£ for 10 is the current price. It's just matter of time before new SKU comes with 40£ for 10 and then it's that for new released until it goes up.
You don't get Idoneth level prices for any new release anymore. Just hope Idoneth doesn't get SKU change(say with reboxing) least they get price upped as well.
Vulkites are older than Idoneth and they were £35 for ten and their characters were £18. GW seemed to realise they outpriced their audience given how poorly they sold (although this was still AoS 1.0) and so most of the standard infantry released after that remained around the £30, including the Idoneth.
Lumineth are in a somewhat unique situation where they've directly sold as a spiritual successor to the High Elves, who next to Warriors of Chaos were WHFB's most popular army and it's no secret there's been a good amount of hype surrounding them. They probably figured they can take the mick and people would still buy them, especially when they've done so well out of Covid.
Phobos wrote: I don't think this is a very popular army. Pretty much every game store I've been to has multiple copies of the launch box gathering dust on the shelf.
The launch box was kind of crap unless you absolutely needed some models RIGHT NOW (which to be fair, is how a lot of GW fans are) or you were somebody who planned to buy the limited edition codex anyway. The big boxes only really do well when there's at least one limited edition model that will only be available in that set, otherwise people are generally happy to wait until a general release. Indomitus and the Sisters box probably wouldn't have sold out almost instantly if GW hadn't pushed the, "AND THERE'S NOWHERE ELSE YOU'LL BE ABLE TO GET THESE EXCLUSIVE SPECIAL LIMITED SCULPTS EVER AGAIN!"
That's not a thing. That was never a thing that they said. Everyone knew that the indomitus models were essentially just mono-pose versions of kits that were going to come out later or new versions of characters people already have and don't need more of. Same with the Necrons. The box sold as well as it did because it was a decent whack of new(subjectively very cool) models for a fairly reasonable price (including the book). Literally not one person on the entire planet bought it thinking they'd never be able to get the sculpts ever again.
The sisters boxset was going to sell insanely well no matter what simply because it was what it was. Everyone who wanted to play sisters basically had to buy the box because it was the only place you could get models for months. It was also a slight discount when you included the codex, which was nice.
The fact that that box is the only place you can get those specific sculpts was largely irrelevant.
The Lumineth launch box was a good deal if you wanted to start the army right out of the gate. Dawnriders are likely to be $50, Wardens are $60, and Light of Eltharion is $40.
That's $150 right there.
Standard army book is $40
Realm Lord Army Pack was $185.
The only two items that you can't really do as repeats are the book and Light of Eltharion, so that's $80 that is effectively 'meh' to anyone who would be doing repeat buys.
John D Law wrote: You know people are gonna cry rigged when someone is getting hammered by a Realmlords army using these!
I've been using a set in this style for over 10 years and no one's ever complained yet.
Have you used them for Warhammer? If so, how is it to roll a bunch of them at once? I’m slightly concerned they’ll be awkward.
I have yeah. I mean, it's no different than standard dice. Just don't throw them overly hard so they don't knock into anything and you're fine. If anything, they roll more than standard cubes due to the cylindrical shape.
Cronch wrote: The LRL box was horrible because it was a SC! box that sold for 2x the price because of a "fancy" (horrible in other words, the faux velvet cover is already stained as opposed to normal hardcover) battletome and literal useless doodahs. Compared it to the SoB box for the same price...
Your subjective opinion =/= actual value of the product.
Kanluwen wrote: The Lumineth launch box was a good deal if you wanted to start the army right out of the gate. Dawnriders are likely to be $50, Wardens are $60, and Light of Eltharion is $40.
That's $150 right there.
Standard army book is $40
Realm Lord Army Pack was $185.
The only two items that you can't really do as repeats are the book and Light of Eltharion, so that's $80 that is effectively 'meh' to anyone who would be doing repeat buys.
Exactly. The value was there, for the first purchase. For repeat buys it is not, something done differently with the Lumineth box than GW's normal army/starter bundles. In addition to (and perhaps because of) that it did not attract the scalper market; a huge number of box sets from GW are still essentially unsold as they were bought by individuals for resale and not with intention to play; they still exist as wholes or in parts on ebay, etc.
I figure the broken up sets with discount on ebay will get cleaned up once battletomes are in people's hands and they start wanting more warriors for their forces and armies.
tneva82 wrote: Idoneth is old release. GW keeps upping prices per SKU round. 35£ for 10 is the current price. It's just matter of time before new SKU comes with 40£ for 10 and then it's that for new released until it goes up.
You don't get Idoneth level prices for any new release anymore. Just hope Idoneth doesn't get SKU change(say with reboxing) least they get price upped as well.
Vulkites are older than Idoneth and they were £35 for ten and their characters were £18. GW seemed to realise they outpriced their audience given how poorly they sold (although this was still AoS 1.0) and so most of the standard infantry released after that remained around the £30, including the Idoneth.
Lumineth are in a somewhat unique situation where they've directly sold as a spiritual successor to the High Elves, who next to Warriors of Chaos were WHFB's most popular army and it's no secret there's been a good amount of hype surrounding them. They probably figured they can take the mick and people would still buy them, especially when they've done so well out of Covid.
Phobos wrote: I don't think this is a very popular army. Pretty much every game store I've been to has multiple copies of the launch box gathering dust on the shelf.
The launch box was kind of crap unless you absolutely needed some models RIGHT NOW (which to be fair, is how a lot of GW fans are) or you were somebody who planned to buy the limited edition codex anyway. The big boxes only really do well when there's at least one limited edition model that will only be available in that set, otherwise people are generally happy to wait until a general release. Indomitus and the Sisters box probably wouldn't have sold out almost instantly if GW hadn't pushed the, "AND THERE'S NOWHERE ELSE YOU'LL BE ABLE TO GET THESE EXCLUSIVE SPECIAL LIMITED SCULPTS EVER AGAIN!"
That's not a thing. That was never a thing that they said. Everyone knew that the indomitus models were essentially just mono-pose versions of kits that were going to come out later or new versions of characters people already have and don't need more of. Same with the Necrons. The box sold as well as it did because it was a decent whack of new(subjectively very cool) models for a fairly reasonable price (including the book). Literally not one person on the entire planet bought it thinking they'd never be able to get the sculpts ever again.
The sisters boxset was going to sell insanely well no matter what simply because it was what it was. Everyone who wanted to play sisters basically had to buy the box because it was the only place you could get models for months. It was also a slight discount when you included the codex, which was nice.
The fact that that box is the only place you can get those specific sculpts was largely irrelevant.
Yeah no, you better believe that people absolutely buy SUPER LIMITED NEVER-AGAIN-MADE EXCLUSIVE SCULPT(!!!) models no matter how generic they may be. Look at how many people bought the last made-to-order Sister Superior model or the Librarian with the weird proportions. Why do you think ONE WEEKEND ONLY BUY-IT-NOW-OR-NEVER-AGAIN HOLY FRAK(!!!) models are put out for yearly when those moulds would cost in the tens of thousands for one-offs? There's a reason why most game companies these days put out exclusive sculpts with pre-orders/buying directly, most notably Infinity and Bolt Action, nevermind Kickstarters. Why would smaller companies who can't afford 'dud moulds' as well as GW do that if they didn't sell extremely well? Go back to the Indomitus pre-order threads and you can bet a good chunk of the disappointment was not getting the limited models.
I'll grant you that the Sister box (and Indomitus) was going to sell extremely well regardless, but I doubt it would've been quite the fanatical sellout/Ebay scalper banazna it was if they'd said the models would be releasd separately later.
They did say that the models from Indomitus would be released later...yet that didn't stop people from griping.
The Sister Superior and Librarian were most likely going to be event exclusive models. They wouldn't have even been available to most people who didn't have shoppers for them at events. This is the first year they've done the method they used for those.
Additionally, it's worth mentioning that a big part of the "scalper bonanza" is the discount e-shops. Back when Indomitus was getting ready to go on sale, there was some webstore that had a physical storefront in the middle of either Kentucky or Tennessee that claimed they had ordered $30k worth of Indomitus and GW promised they'd get allocated that much. When it didn't happen, they then stirred the pot and cancelled a bunch of 'preorders'(really just reservations to get onto a list of preorders). We had a whole thread about it here on Dakka...and no way is some shop in the middle of KY or TN moving $30k worth of Indomitus without something weird going on(like them selling outside of the US, something that last I read was disallowed) or the ever-popular "I made sure suchandsuch knew I was interested, but I wasn't gonna order through them" approach.
Don't forget Imdomitus had the new rule book in it which was basically free.This created an artificially high amount of sales compared to marine/necron fans alone. So some of that stock vanished from retailers, only to appear secondhand at reasonable rates on ebay and fb and forums. So some people who wanted an army and book or both armies got annoyed when it all vanished.
Of course the market had enough duel buys and spare stuff that by now most have what they want - heck UK ebay still has loads of half kits up for sale. £50 can get you a necron half with free postage.
Kanluwen wrote: They did say that the models from Indomitus would be released later...yet that didn't stop people from griping.
I'm pretty sure they said the sculpts would be unique to Indomitus, but the actual units/characters would be released later - multi-option units, different sculpts for the characters.
The Sister Superior and Librarian were most likely going to be event exclusive models. They wouldn't have even been available to most people who didn't have shoppers for them at events. This is the first year they've done the method they used for those.
And it sold like hotcakes regardless of what it was originally intended for. My point was, people love their SUPER LIMITED NEVER GET-THEM-AGAIN OHMYGOODDDDD BUY IT NOW(!!!) models.
Taking out the books, Indomitus gave you about £400 worth of models for £100. Did I buy a Necron half for £50? You bet I did. It seems crazy not to. (I could potentially buy a second, because it will still be cheaper than 20 more warriors - but so many monopose duplicate characters feels a bit lame.)
By contrast the Realm Lords box is giving you about £90-95~ worth of models for... about £85? I guess a bit cheaper if you really value the cards and dice.
Surely its not really surprising people aren't falling over themselves to get hold of it.
I get that he is very fancy with his floaty stuff, but $40 for the stonemage is just lame. I was prepared to cringe at battle cattle pricing but $110 is lower than I expected.
Cue the Lumineth army packs suddenly going out of stock
40+60+65=$165.
Box was $185...so $20 difference. Not actually too bad.
Especially when you add in the tome and dice for free.
Also, moo mountain is a lot cheaper than I had anticipated. I was definitely thinking greater daemon price, but $180AUD is weirdly okay, which makes me feel like it’s wrong when compared to everything else haha. Stoneguard are pretty painful, and Dawnriders oof...
Those are very pricey- the Hammer dudes are £36.50 for 5? Thats horrendous .. the cavalry are lovely models but £40..I'd have to really love a faction to try paying those prices, its harsh even with online discounts..
Are there indications the mage has any options? The prices are largely in line with what I would have expected after the Sisters of Battle (i.e. "the current price for 10 infantry" etc.), but that mage is even more expensive than the Canoness, and at least she was kind of worth it for consisting of two sprues including a lot of options. If the mage is just expensive because of the big base of which I'd instantly remove at least half (balance on pillar or float on rocks, not both)... oof indeed.
Coenus Scaldingus wrote: Are there indications the mage has any options? The prices are largely in line with what I would have expected after the Sisters of Battle (i.e. "the current price for 10 infantry" etc.), but that mage is even more expensive than the Canoness, and at least she was kind of worth it for consisting of two sprues including a lot of options. If the mage is just expensive because of the big base of which I'd instantly remove at least half (balance on pillar or float on rocks, not both)... oof indeed.
She doesn’t have any options, no. So yeah she’s just pricey because of the tall base I’d assume.
cow is cheaper than expected, everything else is either disappointingly what I expected (stoneguard) or somehow crazy expensive (cav, the astonishing rock balancer).
I really want to collect more of the army, but at those prices, is not likely to happen. Can't justify 45 euro for 5 models.
GaroRobe wrote: You know, I felt the same way. But then I realized gargants has been a term in 40k for awhile, so it's not as bad a change as troggoth imo
And is also derived from the name Gargantua, a legendary giant. Same as the word gargantuan.
Now, of course this hobby of ours is a creative and time-consuming one. For those customers who spent time, money, and creative resources building and painting the forces we presented in Tome Celestial articles, not making them ‘legal’ in an ongoing fashion was clearly a disappointing decision – if not an outright upsetting one!
So we sat down and had a good, hard think and realised that a ready-made solution was right in front of us, at least in terms of White Dwarf. Digital back issues of White Dwarf containing Tome Celestial content are available to purchase, and so we have updated the General’s Handbook 2020 designer’s commentary to provide a comprehensive list of which publications can be used in Pitched Battles (2020) without your opponent’s permission
'Here's the actually game-legal stuff out of the slew of stuff we've published.'
Now, of course this hobby of ours is a creative and time-consuming one. For those customers who spent time, money, and creative resources building and painting the forces we presented in Tome Celestial articles, not making them ‘legal’ in an ongoing fashion was clearly a disappointing decision – if not an outright upsetting one!
So we sat down and had a good, hard think and realised that a ready-made solution was right in front of us, at least in terms of White Dwarf. Digital back issues of White Dwarf containing Tome Celestial content are available to purchase, and so we have updated the General’s Handbook 2020 designer’s commentary to provide a comprehensive list of which publications can be used in Pitched Battles (2020) without your opponent’s permission
Cool, glad to see them go back and reverse this decision. The vast majority of those battalions are not particularly good anyways; they were really for people who put the narrative first.
Now, of course this hobby of ours is a creative and time-consuming one. For those customers who spent time, money, and creative resources building and painting the forces we presented in Tome Celestial articles, not making them ‘legal’ in an ongoing fashion was clearly a disappointing decision – if not an outright upsetting one!
So we sat down and had a good, hard think and realised that a ready-made solution was right in front of us, at least in terms of White Dwarf. Digital back issues of White Dwarf containing Tome Celestial content are available to purchase, and so we have updated the General’s Handbook 2020 designer’s commentary to provide a comprehensive list of which publications can be used in Pitched Battles (2020) without your opponent’s permission
Cool, glad to see them go back and reverse this decision. The vast majority of those battalions are not particularly good anyways; they were really for people who put the narrative first.
It finally lets me field my Squig herds and let them come back via the Loonshrine. Time to drown my enemies in endless waves of slobbering cave horrors!
LiftForSwift wrote: ''Gargants'' is just so dumb. I'll never get over it, just the same with Ogres and Imperial Guard. They're giants! GIANTS!
And dwarves. Fyreslayers are dwarves.
You mean Fire slayers? Also the name is silly, they are on fire, they don't slay fires. That's a fire-fighter, and they can't be dwarfs.
Why can't firefighters be dwarves? Are you suggesting that when a mine gets a fire they have to hire in humans to do the firefighting for them?!
Also they aren't fire-slayers they are fyreslayers. Totally different, its just phonetically that they are similar. It's closer to think of them as dwarves with an inner fire which shows through on their bodies with the runes that are beaten into them and which blaze during combat.
Shouldn't they be fyre-caretakers then? They harbor the inner fire, not slay it.
Also everyone knows that firefighter have height requiement, no dwarf can reach it.
Of course AoS names aren't that bad. warhammer fantasy was even worse, it'd have "lizardmen" which spawned from pools, making them amphibians, or "high" elves that were in fact the same height as any other elf, or "dark" elves with even paler skin that the "high" elves...don't even get me started on orcs, they don't even live in the oceans!
"
Cronch wrote: Shouldn't they be fyre-caretakers then? They harbor the inner fire, not slay it.
Also everyone knows that firefighter have height requiement, no dwarf can reach it.
Of course AoS names aren't that bad. warhammer fantasy was even worse, it'd have "lizardmen" which spawned from pools, making them amphibians, or "high" elves that were in fact the same height as any other elf, or "dark" elves with even paler skin that the "high" elves...don't even get me started on orcs, they don't even live in the oceans!
"
This is the post we needed. This is the post we deserved.
Although one has to admit that their models would make for quite nice normal-Slayers alongside more standard Dwarfs. Like playing Mordheim with modern-availability models, and the like.
Undead_Love-Machine wrote: Does anybody know where I can find the leaked pic of the forthcoming Slaanesh vs (?) army box, the one with the new Slaaneshi champion in it?
I've gone back through a large chunk of the thread but I can't find it, I just wanted to be reminded of what is in the box!
It's looking like Sons of Behemat will be revealed on Sunday for preorder on the 3rd and release on the 10th.
Well that didn't age well. The 10th is a 40K week (the price list is doing the rounds) so a little longer to wait.
I remember seeing something about a Novel being up for pre order on the 10th? Maybe that will be the Behemet pre order date. All the recent novel tie ins have gone up with their preorders.
not sure, seeing how marines and necrons have more models announced than that there are in the pre-order this coming saturday, which mostly means a second week follows
terry wrote: not sure, seeing how marines and necrons have more models announced than that there are in the pre-order this coming saturday, which mostly means a second week follows
It wouldn’t be unlike GW to weirdly split up a release, and there’s a Sons of Behemat audiobook going up for preorder on the 10th (edit: oops this was the whole discussion anyway) which is probably to tie in with the army release. I wouldn’t be particularly surprised if they aren’t up for preorder on the 10th, but I am expecting them to be.
terry wrote: not sure, seeing how marines and necrons have more models announced than that there are in the pre-order this coming saturday, which mostly means a second week follows
It wouldn’t be unlike GW to weirdly split up a release, and there’s a Sons of Behemat audiobook going up for preorder on the 10th (edit: oops this was the whole discussion anyway) which is probably to tie in with the army release. I wouldn’t be particularly surprised if they aren’t up for preorder on the 10th, but I am expecting them to be.
Yeah, its just a weird situation right now, both are equaly possible based on the past
If they do 9 books like Psychic Awakening starting before Christmas and doing 1 a month that would certainly bring us up to the summer. I think Broken Realms will be less than 9 books there are 23 armies SoB will be 24 so 3 or 4 in each book would be 6 to 8 books. 2 per book would take too long unless some armies get left out.
Nice as it'd be, they'd show that off along with the hero. We're probably looking at the same release pattern as Psychic Awakening, so 2 heroes per book and maybe a new/refreshed unit.
Cronch wrote: Nice as it'd be, they'd show that off along with the hero. We're probably looking at the same release pattern as Psychic Awakening, so 2 heroes per book and maybe a new/refreshed unit.
Psychic Awakening had no real 'pattern' unfortunately. Some saw a single new hero, some saw multiples, some only saw new units, some only saw rules tweaks.
Phoenix, Pariah, and Saga of the Beast saw multiples.
Engine War had multiple new units(Pteraxii, Serberys, Archaeopter) plus the first book format rules for the previously released Techpriest Manipulus and Skorpius tanks.
Greater Good, Ritual of the Damned, Blood of Baal, War of the Spider all saw one new/revamped hero.
Faith and Fury only saw rules, plus maybe some generic blisters released if I remember right?
Thing is almost every AoS army barring a small handful, has need of updates. Either replacing older metal/finecast/really really old first gen plastics - with modern plastics; or adding to a very small force.
Skaven have 1st gen plastics (eg rat ogres); metals and finecast. So whilst they've a huge and diverse arm they have a lot of need for updating. Same for Seraphon (old Lizardmen).
Meanwhile armies like Flesheaters, Daughers of Khaine, Fyreslayers etc... have tiny armies which work well, but which have very few real options and diveristy. Many of their builds are often "spam x unit". Heck Dok has the fewest number of actual kits on sale of any AoS army - it just so happens one builds 3 or more leaders and most of the others are duel kits; but in general they've very limited options.
So you can pick almost any army and justify a big update in a book or expansion being needed. Stormcast, Nighhaunt and Gloomspite Gitz are perhaps the only armies (off the top of my head) that don't need a big revamp, but have already had it as part of AoS already (Khorne likely should be added to that list as they've had a lot of releases too).
I think its because they were going to do Stormcast just like Marines and then someone realised that that isn't a good idea and scrapped it and sort of pushed two or more separate stormcast armies into one - resulting in a bit of a mess.
So they wound up with a bloat of models that trip over each other; but which can certainly be fixed given an updated book.
I'm sure it's getting addressed in the next 
but some sort of Dark Mechanicus cat.
