I got mine last night, put together nethyrmaul, cthulhu, wyrmgear, the demons, all 4 fire giants, the elementals, spider demons, red dragon, and tried to put together the jabberwocky (that one definitely needs glue), then unpacked and sorted one of my vampire boxes. Then came kaladrax, and the size of that model just blew me away, even havi ng seen all the pictures. The head's a little rubbery but not too bad. After all that though, I kinda felt like I had enough. Looked at my second, unsorted vampire box, and I've begun contemplating ebay. I'm not totally convinced though. There are a few things in it I think I'd still like.
Didn't see it posted here yet, but a couple locals who got their Bones figures had a nasty surprise priming the figures. Dupli Color Automotive primer melts the plastic. They primed the models because they didn't have 100% faith in the "No priming necessary" claim.
Fortunately the figs primed weren't majors ones and were test models. They seem to take GW/Vallejo paints fine. Fiddled with a painted fig and didn't see any rubbing or cracking.
Also played with the Dracolich skull and agree it felt like a play toy. Too flexible for my tastes.
I am going to try priming some random Vamp models today if the basement is sufficiently dry. I will let you know how Krylon or whatever I have laying around works. I think I have some Army Painter down there...
silent25 wrote: Didn't see it posted here yet, but a couple locals who got their Bones figures had a nasty surprise priming the figures. Dupli Color Automotive primer melts the plastic. They primed the models because they didn't have 100% faith in the "No priming necessary" claim.
I don't suppose you have pictures of this do you? Bones are PVC if I remember correctly, and I find it incredible that they were melted by spray primer.
I used Krylon Paint+Primer series black on 4 of my figures. 3 were perfectly normal, but 1 had a "sticky" feel to it after priming. Not sure what to read into it, but the model it's self didn't seem to be damaged.
BlueDagger wrote: I used Krylon Paint+Primer series black on 4 of my figures. 3 were perfectly normal, but 1 had a "sticky" feel to it after priming. Not sure what to read into it, but the model it's self didn't seem to be damaged.
ive primed 7 bones models from my vampire box and each has the "sticky" issue to it. At first I thought I just didnt wait long enough to let the primer dry but days later still sticky. I employed general forgeworld style resin washing of the models and still got the sticky issue. Would love to know how/if others are overcoming the sticky problems
Reaper stresses the importance of not using primer on Bones. Maybe this is why.
They suggest washing the models and then applying an undiluted coat of paint and giving it 24 hours to dry. Then any and all traditional painting methods should work after that, except maybe varnishing or sealing them.
If you prime Bones, it is important to choose the primer carefully.
Acetone makes PVC sticky. Krylon Primer is upto 30% acetone. When the paint in the primer locks the acetone vapors under it, it slowly outgasses and can remain sticky for a month or so.
I dont have the list in front of me, but several primers will work with PVC (Bones or otherwise). You can find a list on various garage kit sites. One nice thing about PVC though is that you dont generally need primer to paint it. The molecule is rather rough compared to other plastics like polystyrene or polyurethane, and holds paint quite well on its own.
A good primer on working with them can be found here
It doesnt have the list of primers that are safe to use, but it does have a lot of good information for people who are new to vinyl.
For myself, I normally airbrush on a regular acrylic paint that is whatever my primary color will be on the model. I have used Rustoleum Primer in the past (need to check to see if it still is Acetone free though) and Duplicolor, which is designed to be vinyl safe due to things like PVC mirror housings and bumpers.
silent25 wrote: Didn't see it posted here yet, but a couple locals who got their Bones figures had a nasty surprise priming the figures. Dupli Color Automotive primer melts the plastic. They primed the models because they didn't have 100% faith in the "No priming necessary" claim.
I don't suppose you have pictures of this do you? Bones are PVC if I remember correctly, and I find it incredible that they were melted by spray primer.
~Eric
Unfortunately no, going off the word of the painter. However, several threads on other forums have found different brands of primer cause different reactions. Some have no effect, while others cause stickiness. I mentioned the brand because this was the first I had heard of melting. Dupli Color is a fairly inexpensive spray so probably has some fun chemical in it that the Bones material doesn't like.
silent25 wrote: Didn't see it posted here yet, but a couple locals who got their Bones figures had a nasty surprise priming the figures. Dupli Color Automotive primer melts the plastic. They primed the models because they didn't have 100% faith in the "No priming necessary" claim.
I don't suppose you have pictures of this do you? Bones are PVC if I remember correctly, and I find it incredible that they were melted by spray primer.
~Eric
Unfortunately no, going off the word of the painter. However, several threads on other forums have found different brands of primer cause different reactions. Some have no effect, while others cause stickiness. I mentioned the brand because this was the first I had heard of melting. Dupli Color is a fairly inexpensive spray so probably has some fun chemical in it that the Bones material doesn't like.
That's cool.
Yeah, I've heard about the stickiness in a few places, but this is the first I had heard of melting. Was interested to see it is all.
Sean_OBrien wrote: If you prime Bones, it is important to choose the primer carefully.
Acetone makes PVC sticky. Krylon Primer is upto 30% acetone. When the paint in the primer locks the acetone vapors under it, it slowly outgasses and can remain sticky for a month or so.
I dont have the list in front of me, but several primers will work with PVC (Bones or otherwise). You can find a list on various garage kit sites. One nice thing about PVC though is that you dont generally need primer to paint it. The molecule is rather rough compared to other plastics like polystyrene or polyurethane, and holds paint quite well on its own.
A good primer on working with them can be found here
It doesnt have the list of primers that are safe to use, but it does have a lot of good information for people who are new to vinyl.
For myself, I normally airbrush on a regular acrylic paint that is whatever my primary color will be on the model. I have used Rustoleum Primer in the past (need to check to see if it still is Acetone free though) and Duplicolor, which is designed to be vinyl safe due to things like PVC mirror housings and bumpers.
I used Rustoleum and can confirm it contains acetone
Welp, they apparently finished all US orders. Canadian orders are also all packed, and tomorrow they start on International ones - still held up by a lack of the mythical "USPS truck". Which at this stage is clearly a load of bs. (aka - they wanted to get all the US orders done and out of the way first). Looks like August is going to be accurate after all.
silent25 wrote: Didn't see it posted here yet, but a couple locals who got their Bones figures had a nasty surprise priming the figures. Dupli Color Automotive primer melts the plastic. They primed the models because they didn't have 100% faith in the "No priming necessary" claim.
Fortunately the figs primed weren't majors ones and were test models. They seem to take GW/Vallejo paints fine. Fiddled with a painted fig and didn't see any rubbing or cracking.
Also played with the Dracolich skull and agree it felt like a play toy. Too flexible for my tastes.
Umm... I use Dupli Color for priming Bones - I have since the line first came out. Including the teeny tiny kobold miniatures.
I have never had it melt any figures, including any of my Bones miniatures.
I have used Dupli Color Black, Grey, and White sandable primers to no ill effect as well as the colored primers from The Army Painter.
The Auld Grump
*EDIT* Dupli Color and The Army Painter are the only primers that I have tried - I have no idea about Krylon or Rustoleum.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Azazelx wrote: Welp, they apparently finished all US orders. Canadian orders are also all packed, and tomorrow they start on International ones - still held up by a lack of the mythical "USPS truck". Which at this stage is clearly a load of bs. (aka - they wanted to get all the US orders done and out of the way first). Looks like August is going to be accurate after all.
Umm... no - they are not the only company having the USPS act like **** in regards to large numbers of international shipments right now.
The blame rests pretty cleanly on the USPS and the wonders of sequestration. No need to malign Reaper for this - though if you want to complain about their underestimating processing time then go right ahead....
Unfortunately their complete lack of official communication (and the various half-truths that have been told) are eroding the goodwill and ability to trust the elements of the story that escape through non-official channels. So I'm rapidly becoming more cynical.
Azazelx wrote: Unfortunately their complete lack of official communication (and the various half-truths that have been told) are eroding the goodwill and ability to trust the elements of the story that escape through non-official channels. So I'm rapidly becoming more cynical.
What half truths?
So far the only half truths that I have seen have been folks making things up to fill in the lack of communication.
The lack of communication I will grant - the person that normally does their talkin' is one of the ones packin'.
But as an example, chosen not at random of a half truth... is yours. Look up what is going on with the USPS right now - see how long it takes to find other examples.
You are not being cynical - you are being crabby, and a bit paranoid. There is a difference.
Now, me, I'm grumpy - Pessimistic rather than paranoid. I take the view that things never go as planned, and the more things that are out of the primary's direct control the more likely things are to go wrong
to go wrong
to go wrong
*Smack!*
The more likely things are to have unforeseen complications.
Reaper has no direct control over the manufacture - there is one area that things could go wrong, and did.
Reaper has no direct control over shipping from over seas - there is another area where things could go wrong, and did.
Reaper has no control over U.S. Customs - there is another area where things could have gone wrong, but Reaper was lucky on that one.
Reaper has no control over UPS in Canada - and apparently neither did UPS.... (Call the ombudsman! To arms!) Since 9/11 things have gotten... sticky between the U.S. and Canada in regards to red tape - now double sided....
Reaper has no control over the USPS for shipping over seas - and again, things that could go wrong did.
Now... add to this the fact that the folks normally holding down desks in the office are packing boxes in the warehouse.... The folks that might handle the red tape are dealing with packing tape....
I have been on the inside of problems like this... it is not fun, and folks get... crabby. And there is little that can be done about it.
The Auld Grump, in my case it was while working for a nonprofit organization, and waiting on data and funds from the United Way.... We had to run each through twice because deadlines passed when we had one of the required items, but not the other....
The latest from the BryanTracker I linked is that they're anticipating Canada's truck Tomorrow or Friday. So it's not that huge a bubble bursting, hopefully.
Azazelx wrote: Unfortunately their complete lack of official communication (and the various half-truths that have been told) are eroding the goodwill and ability to trust the elements of the story that escape through non-official channels. So I'm rapidly becoming more cynical.
What half truths?
So far the only half truths that I have seen have been folks making things up to fill in the lack of communication.
The lack of communication I will grant - the person that normally does their talkin' is one of the ones packin'.
But as an example, chosen not at random of a half truth... is yours. Look up what is going on with the USPS right now - see how long it takes to find other examples.
You are not being cynical - you are being crabby, and a bit paranoid. There is a difference.
Wow. One post on how I'm getting tired of the way Reaper's dealing with this and I'm getting called crabby and paranoid.
You know, I don't even care enough to reply to this in detail with examples. Feel free to browse this thread on the Reaper Forums. Of course, they must all be a bunch of paranoid whiny feths as well, since they don't share your opinion.
Since you've decided to play apologist, even with Bryan working his arse off (and full credit to him) there's still no excuse for not having a flash 15-min meeting (he mentioned that KS updates are by committee) to give out information on the shipping situation for CA/ROW backers at this point. I will point out that that they said that they were going to alternate between US/CA/ROW packing, and nothing in official channels has changed that. I had to go looking for information in at least three different places to find out what the feth is going on due to the lack of bothering to inform people several days after the "we're shipping! yay! Here's a tracker!" update to find that it actually meant "we're shipping to the US only now."
And hey, now that US orders are cleared and Canadian orders are ready, the Canadian UPS Truck is magically due tomorrow/Friday and they'll be packing the ROW orders tomorrow now that the Canadian ones are finished ROW truck is magically due right after that on Monday/Tuesday - how coincidental! I don't particularly blame them for wanting to clear out one, then the other, then the other - but the situation I've just described is just too perfectly timed to be believed easily. I'd have preferred an honest statement via the KS update system of "Hey, Canada and ROW, we apologise for the delay, but we're checking your Kalidraxes to save on tears, hassle and international reshipping, and we don't have space to pack all three destinations right now, so we've changed the order to US>CA>ROW - sorry guys!" Then I'd have at least known where we stand and I while might be a bit annoyed, (more likely sighing again, but I wouldn't be getting called PARANOID.
I think the problem wasn't that complaint about lack of communication, but the comment about "half truths."
I backed both reaper bones and Mantic KoW. Both had problems (reaper with timing, KoW with quality). Both had haters and defenders. Pretty much everybody on both sides had great points.
What gets to me, and I presume other posters is well, is when the commentary crosses from "here's what sucks about this" to "Reaper/Mantic is screwing with us and trying to defraud."
Presuming intent is something that's very hard to do, and most people aren't very good.
On a related note, massive kickstarters are something that everybody is new it. They are, it turns out, a lot more complex than people realized. We're seeing companies change their approach, because they realize that when you treble the scope of your project, people still hold you to the original deadline. And while there is more money, you can't always buy speed. Or, as mantic showed, there's a reason some sculptors and artists are readily available.
Yeah - you want issues, go look at the Dredd Kickstarter. Its a mess. Mongoose has been outright incompetent and lied multiple times about what has shipped (especially to US backers), and when they are going to deliver information. Literally for two months Matthew has said, "we're going to tell you what should have by now" - and hasn't. And every update or post repeats that.
Reaper, on the other hand, has been much more reliable in their communications, and have (mostly) taken it on the chin when they've erred or things haven't gone to plan. If they say they've been having USPS issues, I'd generally believe that, especially given the state of the US govt agencies these days.
Someone end me a PM in about 6 hours and I'll check for it. I didn't download it at the time because I didn't have my computer set up... I do have that set up now.
If you want the Swords and Wizardry book and the novel by Matt Forbeck, just go to reapermini.com/ks , put in your email address from your KS account, click the link in your email, and they'll be at the bottom of the page.
Got my Bones today. Out of curiosity, I played around to determine the extent of WSF.
Since Wehrkind did a fantastic job illustrating the issue on the smaller models, I didn't bother. Instead I went straight to Cthulhu and Kaladrax.
First of all, both models are individually boxed with custom artwork showing the model on the packaging. Really nice.
I dry fit built Cthulhu. I love him.
I was worried about the belly seam, but it is actually really minor and doesn't look out of place. As for WSF, I can confirm there is a definite texture/bendiness difference between the tentacles and the wings, which seem to be the same thickness. The head tentacles are very, VERY bendy. The wings are much more rigid. Regardless, my dry fitted Cthulhu is absolutely amazing.
As for Kaladrax. His box is also customized, but is significantly larger than any other boxed mini. There is a clear scale change. When I look at Kaladrax, he just doesn't fit with the scale of everything else Bones. I know there was some scale issues on manufacture, and it shows. He doesn't look right.
All that said, Kaladrax is still an awesome mini. All pieces are very rigid, except the head and tail tip. They have the flexibility issue. Which is very out of place considering the solidity and rigidity of the rest of the mini. The 2 hip bones are in between in rubbery-ness between the head and everything else.
For both Kaladrax and Cthulhu, the contrast in rigidity between the head and everything else feels odd. It feels out of place. But it doesn't appear to affect the functionality, or critically for me, the paintability of the models.
edit - My Kaladrax has 2 left arms, no right arms, and the right leg is hanging off in space... will be contacting Reaper over that. Also, I didn't receive any extras, but my packing list does have a note stating, in essence, don't contact us if you got extras... its a bonus.
I think the right rear leg hanging out into space is a feature, not a bug. I was really confused at first too, then finally found a pic showing his right side, and that had the right rear leg off in space too.
I am thinking when I finally put it together for realz, that is getting the hot water treatment.
Polonius wrote: I think the problem wasn't that complaint about lack of communication, but the comment about "half truths."
I backed both reaper bones and Mantic KoW. Both had problems (reaper with timing, KoW with quality). Both had haters and defenders. Pretty much everybody on both sides had great points.
What gets to me, and I presume other posters is well, is when the commentary crosses from "here's what sucks about this" to "Reaper/Mantic is screwing with us and trying to defraud."
Presuming intent is something that's very hard to do, and most people aren't very good.
Exactly - and that is also why I still stand by calling out the term PARANOID! about somebody that seems to have taken the view of 'I do not know what is going on so I will call everything that I am told lies.' Which is a fine demonstration of paranoia....
There has been a lack of communication - I will agree with that entirely. There is a reason for it, but there is a lack of communication that could have been dealt with by, well, communicating.
But as far as I have seen the 'Half truths' have been the fabrications of disgruntled and impatient peoples. In short - the 'half truths' are themselves the only 'half truths'.
The claim that the USPS not sending the truck must be 'BS' - not just a 'half truth', but itself complete BS. Fantabulation to fill an information void. The information void is real, but the manner in which that void is filled is beyond suspect.
The Auld Grump
*EDIT* For that matter I was also part of the Mantic Kickstarter... while the miniatures are not perfect, I have no real problem with them.
Like Bones they are miniatures for use, not for display -I use a different gauge for what I want in a display piece and a play piece. Though I will admit that it is nice when the same piece can be used for both. (A display piece does not need to withstand the stresses of in game use, so things like delicate joins means a good deal less than it does for a piece that is likely to see use by a sweaty twelve year old.)
silent25 wrote: Didn't see it posted here yet, but a couple locals who got their Bones figures had a nasty surprise priming the figures. Dupli Color Automotive primer melts the plastic. They primed the models because they didn't have 100% faith in the "No priming necessary" claim.
Fortunately the figs primed weren't majors ones and were test models. They seem to take GW/Vallejo paints fine. Fiddled with a painted fig and didn't see any rubbing or cracking.
Also played with the Dracolich skull and agree it felt like a play toy. Too flexible for my tastes.
Umm... I use Dupli Color for priming Bones - I have since the line first came out. Including the teeny tiny kobold miniatures.
I have never had it melt any figures, including any of my Bones miniatures.
I have used Dupli Color Black, Grey, and White sandable primers to no ill effect as well as the colored primers from The Army Painter.
The Auld Grump
Strange. Not sure what to make of it then. Will double check with the painter who told me that and confirm it was Dupli Color. One other possible cause might be tied to chemical composition in the figures varying. Was reading on another forum where the flexibility varies highly between identical figs. One person had one fig which was completely floppy, but a friend had the same one, but was almost rigid. Sounds like the Chinese company that produced these was inconsistent in the casting material or had poor quality control. That could also account for some people having varying accounts with priming/painting the figs. This should hopefully become a moot point as Reaper is moving everything in house and will have better control of the product.
It may well depend on how heavy handed you are with the spray.
A light coat of paint will allow the solvent that is melting the Bones PVC to evaporate fast before it get's a chance to really cause trouble
Drown the mini in paint and you'll trap a solvent under a layer of 'setting' paint, giving it plenty of time to start melting the mini and causing trouble
So, my Bones arrived today. Holy gak is that a lot more than I thought it would be. And the size of some of them! Seriously happy with the purchase.
As promised, here is Kaladrax's head with Vallejo Acrylic-Polyurethane Surface Primer on it:
I used Black, and German Dark Yellow. White seemed pointless, and I cannot find my dark grey anywhere.
I tried each of them first without cleaning, and both beaded up a bit but still covered. I then washed the head with warm soapy water and re-applied. Both went on silky smooth. What you see in the pictures is one coat, undiluted. It is adhering very well. I cannot scrape it off with a fingernail...
I will bust out my airbrush and spray some on later next week, but I cannot imagine the results changing very much.
After spending nearly 2 hours ripping into little plastic bags and shoving minis into a carry case, I have to say that I'm glad these miniatures are as flexible as they are. They all feel solid, except for in the places that you want some flex if you're tossing them in a case or box. I'm used to GW miniatures and so the PVC was concerning until I had it in hand. I've got a lot of heat treating to do on swords, arms and in some cases base-to-leg angle correction, but that's a much better problem o have than cleaning/filling/slammingheadtowall with fine cast or even FW stuff. I got all the dragons and all the giants and their size and detail is fantastic. You could knock someone out with a well aimed fire giant fast ball... And honestly it probably wouldn't do squat to the fire giant.
The size of my painting queue is literally years long, so I have no idea when I'll get around to some of these, but I'm looking forward to seeing some more paint examples and some best practices with bones painting.
Also, I think I'm missing 1 group of IMEF Marines from my package. Is there a Bones KS hotline/email address that's best to contact them about errors/missing stuff?
On your packing list is all the information to report a problem (including your order number), use this page to check product numbers and match figures: www.reapermini.com/kickstarter
Wehrkind wrote: I think the right rear leg hanging out into space is a feature, not a bug. I was really confused at first too, then finally found a pic showing his right side, and that had the right rear leg off in space too.
I am thinking when I finally put it together for realz, that is getting the hot water treatment.
Now that you say that, I remember that weird cocked out leg thing being mentioned before, too, but can't for the life of me remember where I saw it.
How could that be a feature unless... He's marking his territory! That's it!
Not sure if I'll bend it back, or add a tree or something for him to rest that foot on. Maybe add a giant fire hydrant looking rock... gotta get his proper arm first.
A light coat of paint will allow the solvent that is melting the Bones PVC to evaporate fast before it get's a chance to really cause trouble
Drown the mini in paint and you'll trap a solvent under a layer of 'setting' paint, giving it plenty of time to start melting the mini and causing trouble
That seems reasonable -with the white primer I went for a light dusting - enough to give purchase.
For the black and grey I went for solid colors, but held the mini between a foot and a half and two feet away from the nozzle.
If the model is too close... maybe the solvent is not having a chance to disperse before affecting the model?
Wehrkind wrote: I think the right rear leg hanging out into space is a feature, not a bug. I was really confused at first too, then finally found a pic showing his right side, and that had the right rear leg off in space too.
I am thinking when I finally put it together for realz, that is getting the hot water treatment.
Now that you say that, I remember that weird cocked out leg thing being mentioned before, too, but can't for the life of me remember where I saw it.
How could that be a feature unless... He's marking his territory! That's it!
Not sure if I'll bend it back, or add a tree or something for him to rest that foot on. Maybe add a giant fire hydrant looking rock... gotta get his proper arm first.
Great... now I have this image of using an ArmorCast 'Cinematic Effect' for Kallie marking his territory....
Having messed with Wehrkind's models a bit today, the spongy factor on the Kalandrax's head didn't seem too bad to me (and I also wonder if it was intentional for that one part... which would be odd). Didn't get to see the arm that he had showed being spongy in the video, though.
Also, I agree that while spongy sounds cooler, I think it's important to note it is not porous or sponge-like in that manner... just a little soft. It was more interesting than problematic, from what I saw. In general, though, the detail level on Bones figures and the bendiness of weapons and the like make me think most people will use these as "fodder" type models for RPGs, rather than main additions to their armies. That's probably the intended use anyway, though!
I think that the softer material allows undercuts - the mold does not have any flex, but since the material does then you can still have some minor undercuts.
Paint sticks to the more rubbery version just fine, so I am okay with it...
In fact, it makes me want to sing a little song....
Rubber dragon, you're the one.
You make game time so much fun!
Rubber dragon I am awfully fond of you!
Bobobodeo....
As promised, here is Kaladrax's head with Vallejo Acrylic-Polyurethane Surface Primer on it:
I will bust out my airbrush and spray some on later next week, but I cannot imagine the results changing very much.
Thanks for that! I was a bit concerned about the Vallejo primer on the "spongey" pieces.
AntomanElven wrote: Has anyone from Australia received their bones as of yet?
I have multiple Vampire levels as well as $300 of extras, all of the huge bones.
No email yet though, which is sad
They'll hopefully be sent in the next few days. It depends on whether the truck they've been "waiting for" for 3 weeks magically/suddenly arrives now that the other region's orders are out of the way.
From there, allow 2-3 weeks if sent via Airmail, or more likely 4-8 weeks in the probable case that they are instead sent surface mail (there's a lot of stuff, and their postage savings will be significant, especially after the USPS price rises at the start of the year). So expect your models at the end of August to sometime in September.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Just because you're choosing to accept everything you're told at face value doesn't mean you're magically correct. You are of course welcome to believe anything you like, but the only truth here is that neither of us knows for sure what's really going on, so for you to suppose that you know any more than I do is arrogant and disingenious.
And now, since I've not interacted with you in the past, haven't found your posts in other threads especially interesting and and have not enjoyed conversing with you here, I'm throwing you on ignore. Please feel free to do the same to me and ne'er the twain shall meet again. Cheerio!
No one on this forum can say with any knowledge whether RoW shipment was on hold until they completed US shipments or on hold until they got the truck. With my experience with Reaper in the past, I'd like to think it's the latter, but I certainly can't say with any certainty or conviction. Arguing about it is pointless. Both sides have had their say, let's move on.
My Reaper bones are now packed away, as is 1/2 of my gaming stuff. I won't get to play with it until well after my move, unfortunately.
Anyone in Australia or other countries get their stuff yet?
Well I guess i've waited until now I can wait another few months.
Although next time I would probably buy a lot more of the really huge sculpts, that Kaladrax sculpt and the $10 Cthulhu were an absolute steal, Nethyrmaul looks great too but his neck is a bit too thick for his body...
Azazelx wrote: My opinion differs from yours. Deal with it.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Just because you're choosing to accept everything you're told at face value doesn't mean you're magically correct. You are of course welcome to believe anything you like, but the only truth here is that neither of us knows for sure what's really going on, so for you to suppose that you know any more than I do is arrogant and disingenious.
And now, since I've not interacted with you in the past, haven't found your posts in other threads especially interesting and and have not enjoyed conversing with you here, I'm throwing you on ignore. Please feel free to do the same to me and ne'er the twain shall meet again. Cheerio!
Your opinion has no supporting evidence.
You are being paranoid. And reacting in a paranoid fashion 'Oh no! somebody disagrees with my unsupported allegations on the interwebs! I will rage quit talking to him!'
Which is of course your right - but do not expect me to take your scenario seriously just because you quit the conversation.
Evidence against includes the fact that Reaper not having their warehouse space is bloody inconvenient. The faster they get their floor space back the faster they can go back to SOP.
They cannot start selling Bones outside of the Kickstarter until after shipping. Which is costing them MONEY.
They have postponed OTHER manufacture to deal with the Bones. This costs them MONEY.
They needed to rent a second unit, which costs them MONEY, and they have had to keep the unit for at least one full month beyond initial term.
So, of course they will lie about USPS doing the same thing to them that the USPS is currently doing to other people.
There is no benefit for Reaper to lie. When they have changed their shipping decisions on Bones so far they have announced the change - most recently, to my memory, in regards to having folks work overnight. Seemed like a good idea, didn't work, so they decided to just have more folks on during the day.
Lying would not help them, and being caught in a lie wold hurt their reputation. There is no gain, but potential loss. If they decided to postpone RoW then the safest thing for them to do would be to say 'We are postponing RoW shipments so we can clear the rest of the stock out of the way to deal with it'.
There would be grumbling, but that would be pretty much it.
You also have no benefit from lying, but then you do not suffer from being caught out, either.
The odds are heavily in favor of you talking through your hat. Deal with it.
It is not a matter of opinion, it is a matter of supporting evidence. If you had some supporting evidence then it would be one thing, since you do not... maybe you can go find some?
I am fairly certain that there are Dakka folks that live up Reaper way, ask them - nicely - to take a look.
Heck - if anyone on this thread does live out in Texas, close enough by Reaper to take a look could you let us know what's up? I'm interested in seeing how it looks right now.
***
As to shipping right now... no, the RoW trucks did not show up for them yet, at least by the most recent postings.... shipments have slowed to a crawl. three postings in the last thirty minutes, all to France. Most recently Vaires sur marne.
The Auld Grump
Automatically Appended Next Post: A bit of amusement - I have started work on the two undead dragons for a commission*.
Though smaller Nethyrmaul is a lot more work.... Definitely going to need some green stuff for that one.
Kaladrax is going to be a Colossal Red Ravener for Pathfnder. Nethyrmaul a Gargantuan Bronze lich.
I realized when working on them that I had not done any proper vinyl modeling since before there was any CA glues.... Super glue makes it so much easier than I remember it being....
The Auld Grump
* Really should work on these before anything else - I was paid ahead of time, which allowed me to buy more Bones....
I did see a few days ago that the last item shipped to was a AU location. So Im guessing the order will be shipped sometime soon (not liking that yesterday only 32 orders were shipped when previously they were doing over 800 a day :/)
Still nothing here. No E-mail that it's shipped either.
[Edit: Please keep it on topic and friendly, folks. No need for anyone else to dogpile on when two fellow Dakkanauts are having a spot of unpleasantness. -Mannahnin
Edit: Please keep it on topic and friendly, folks. No need for anyone else to dogpile on when two fellow Dakkanauts are having a spot of unpleasantness. -Mannahnin
---
PacRim folks, I hope you get your Bones orders, soon! I am very pleased with mine, they matched all of my expectations. I followed the instructions to report any issues with my order (one dragon had two right wings) and I got a response back in under 24 hours. So that portion of their system appears to be working. FYI, they're handling replacement/missing parts after they finish kicking out all the full orders.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Still nothing here. No E-mail that it's shipped either.
Edit: Please keep it on topic and friendly, folks. No need for anyone else to dogpile on when two fellow Dakkanauts are having a spot of unpleasantness. -Mannahnin.
Edited by Mannahnin
Bunch of problems with the contents of my Vampire box - looks like one of the six bags was mislabeled, so I got two of the contents of one bag and another bag was missing entirely.
Some of the missing figures do not matter that much - I also got two sets of the Fire it Up pledge. But missing the giant stripper?
Still happy with the box, but have sent off a query.
When they get ready to ship the replacements I will place an order with them so they can combine it with an existing order. I can use a Blond triad, and maybe a Red Hair triad. (Not buying many figures for a while... I have a bunch of commissions to paint, then about five hundred figures for myself....)
Quite the opposite. Not angry or tough-guy stuff. Simply no desire to argue or even engage with that particular poster any further. Argument over, problem solved, moved on.
kronk wrote: No one on this forum can say with any knowledge whether RoW shipment was on hold until they completed US shipments or on hold until they got the truck. With my experience with Reaper in the past, I'd like to think it's the latter, but I certainly can't say with any certainty or conviction. Arguing about it is pointless. Both sides have had their say, let's move on.
Anyone in Australia or other countries get their stuff yet?
Exactly right on the former, Kronk. On the latter, RoW packing has been happening, but not shipping yet, so it seems no-one outside the US/CA has their stuff yet. The latest word from Bryan:
ReaperBryan wrote:
@Sam Gerrod - because of various postal regulations for different countries, we are currently processing countries with similar regulations together, rather than by line. This kind of bulk shipping is different than we normally do so our reps keep telling us to change our methods. We are as frustrated as you, but if changing methods makes it easier for you and for us, then that's what we are going to do. We are making good progress though and finished all of South America and Central America, France and Germany, an got a good start on the Pacific Isles. We know that waiting is hard and do appreciate everybody's patience. We will continue to do everything we can to make this work. Meantime, I'm heading home now and will report in again tomorrow.
Jul. 16, 2013 on Reaper Miniatures Bones: An Evolution Of Gaming Miniatures.
ROW first truck confirmed for tomorrow. Postage being applied post dated for tomorrow. I am 99% sure emails won't go out until tomorrow.
Jul. 16, 2013 on Reaper Miniatures Bones: An Evolution Of Gaming Miniatures.
Looks like the first batch goes out tomorrow - right on time now that US/CA are taken care of. While it's disappointing that it looks like Australia is being bumped to the end of the RoW queue, at least shipping to RoW backers is beginning. Judging by the ticker and Bryan's post, it could be finished by the end of this week, or at worst, early next week. It depends on how many RoW truck pickups they require as well.
If by 'right on time' you mean 'three days lost while fixing things with the USPS', then yes....
The method that the USPS first recommended, piling all the RoW stuff on one truck and sending it off for the Post Office to deal with, ended up being something that the USPS would not actually do. (Which means that both the UPS and the USPS have no idea of how to handle something like this. So, I am guessing that this was as new to both of them as anyone else.)
***
Painted three of the Bones dragons for commissions over yesterday and today. The material was remarkably easy to work with, the light weight made it easier to paint, simply because holding the pieces was easier, even when I had to hold the models at weird angles. I did not expect the light weight to make that much of a difference.
I kind of needed to get those done right away - I had already been paid, and had used the money to buy more Bones during the Kickstarter. Three more dragons, two of them undead, and then done.
Cutting the mold lines away works much better than scraping or filing.
The primer stuck very well to the models - I used Armory Gray for Deathsleet and Duplicolor Black Sandable primer for Ebonwrath - no sign of tackiness after drying over Saturday and Sunday. Mind you, the temperature was around 90 F, and I do not know if that had any effect on how completely the primer dried.
Netyrmaul has been primed in Army Painter Leather Brown and Duplicolor Black - the brown had no problems either.
However, a friend did mention that one batch of Duplicolor White that he got a few months ago on sale at Walmart has been tacky on his metal and resin models... so folks having trouble with Duplicolor on Bones may want to test the primer on metal as well - there is a bad batch out there, maybe.
Heh, I am terrible about taking pictures - already sent the figures off in standard USPS boxes. (How bad am I about taking pictures? I bought a digital camera because I was going to Gen Con... and only took three or five photos....)
These were not display pieces though, definitely play pieces - the color of light through the membranes and the veins painted on the wings being the only special features. Those were some techniques that I wanted to try. (And since I could make the experiment on somebody else's miniatures.... )
Nethyrmaul is next, and I expect that he will take about as long as all three of the regular dragons put together.
One thing I may want to mention - on some of the joins the Zap a Gap holds... too well. I wanted to break one part on Kaladrax free and the plastic started giving way before the glue.
I was... impressed. It was easier just to cut the part off and glue it back in place when I finished modifying it. (The hip bones - I wanted to bend the long skinny bits away from the model, to broaden the appearance a little.
Afterwords I realized that popping the model in the freezer might have made the glue more fragile, and might have helped. I realized this after using boiling water to reshape the bits... and popping it in ice and water to set the change.... Doh!
The Bones minis are going to be awesome to play with - low price, low weight, and freakin' sturdy! - I won't feel worried about how the kids will treat me models!
Depends on the shipping method. They haven't to my knowledge stated whether they will be using air or surface mail. While I'd hope for air mail, I won't be surprised if they ship via surface, especially considering the USPS postage price bump at the beginning of the year and the amount of bones they need to deliver. Weight of add-on things like cases and paints will also be significant. Unfortunately, surface mail from the US to this region can take quite a long time (measured in months - so AU/NZ backers could feasibly get our order in September-October.). It'd be nice to have some official communication or information from them aside from what Bryan (can) tell us during his lunch break.
As for updated information, not much from Bryan today (just a comment about value declarations) and despatch emails don't appear to have gone out to any RoW people - so we don't know if anything actually went out or not.
Well after sitting here for over 3 weeks, I opened my box of bones! I saw at least one model that needs fixing (the model is bent parallel to the bad). I haven't opened any bags though because I am packing up the car and moving it to my new apartment across the country.
Tracker is now gone. No new updates from Bryan that I've been able to spot. Can any ROW people who got a shipping notice see if it states what kind of shipping method is being used? (Air, Surface?)
Azazelx wrote:Tracker is now gone. No new updates from Bryan that I've been able to spot. Can any ROW people who got a shipping notice see if it states what kind of shipping method is being used? (Air, Surface?)
Slinky wrote:ROW shipping notice received (UK)!
Vampire + 5 add-ons.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Extra info - shipping method is USPS "Priority Mail International Parcels"
That should answer your question. According to the USPS site, shipping time is 6-10 days, depending on major markets (like if it is going to the UK vs some random small island somewhere)
Thanks for that, Sparkywtf.
Interesting. I expected them to use surface mail. Priority is pretty good. Usually 14-16 days to Australia, though it can be anywhere from 10-28 in extremes).
Azazelx wrote: Thanks for that, Sparkywtf.
Interesting. I expected them to use surface mail. Priority is pretty good. Usually 14-16 days to Australia, though it can be anywhere from 10-28 in extremes).
That's good news, kudos on them still using airmail, it is much more expensive (but worth it considering the delay it would entail).
Hopefully Vampire + 10-20 Add-ons will be coming soon!
Azazelx wrote: Thanks for that, Sparkywtf.
Interesting. I expected them to use surface mail. Priority is pretty good. Usually 14-16 days to Australia, though it can be anywhere from 10-28 in extremes).
Agreed... especially with the postal rate increase, which went into effect well after the end of the KS, which (to me) has felt like it almost doubled the cost of international Priority Mail shipping to some countries (like the UK, for instance). I don't know if it's truly doubled... but it went up by a Lot!
Somebody on the KS comments has reported getting a response from Brian about their shipping
apparently part way through getting the AUS stuff on board the USPS truck filled up, so ROW stuff is piling up at Reaper HQ waiting for another one (or more?)
USPS won't say when they plan to come back (sigh!) despite Reaper asking/begging them for info
so if you've not had an email from Reaper it's not packed yet (latest update says they should be done by the end of the week which probably means Sunday, although emails don't tend to go out over the weekend)
if you've had your Reaper email but your USPS tracking number only says 'Electronic Shipping Info Received' (like me) it means your stuff is packed and waiting for the truck to come back
If you're a retail undertaker level backer they're now in the process of blister packing your stuff, and they'll start boxing and shipping next week
SilverMK2 wrote: My package is marked "shipment received" so I guess mine in on it's way? Though it has said that since the 17th...
I'm guessing that is 'electronic shipping info received', which means it's waiting at Reaper for the truck to arrive (as mine has been since the 17th)...
but a few minutes ago mine has had two new entries
'arrived sort facility: Chicago' & 'processed through sort facility: Chicago'
so I guess Reaper has had another USPS truck in and my are Bones are on the way!
Hopefully your's will be on the move too
(note that despite filling in the bit on the USPS site that promises to email you when your shipment status changes I didn't get an email (and it's not in spam either) so you probably need to check manually
SilverMK2 wrote: My package is marked "shipment received" so I guess mine in on it's way? Though it has said that since the 17th...
I'm guessing that is 'electronic shipping info received', which means it's waiting at Reaper for the truck to arrive (as mine has been since the 17th)...
but a few minutes ago mine has had two new entries
'arrived sort facility: Chicago' & 'processed through sort facility: Chicago'
so I guess Reaper has had another USPS truck in and my are Bones are on the way!
Hopefully your's will be on the move too
(note that despite filling in the bit on the USPS site that promises to email you when your shipment status changes I didn't get an email (and it's not in spam either) so you probably need to check manually
Ditto!
I've just received another parcel via the same method - A handy hint for Brits - once it's in this country, use the same reference number on the Parcelforce tracking page, you get more details.
We wanted to take a moment to give everyone a quick update.
International customers: we're still working through our international shipments. USPS's international shipment policies caused our shipping counter to fall out of sync, so we took it down. Please don't be alarmed.
When we get to your order, our system will send you a shipping confirmation.
Undertakers: your rewards are being processed and we will begin shipping next week.
When we get to your order, our system will send you a shipping confirmation.
As always, if you have any questions regarding your shipments, contact questions@reapermini.com. Our front office is flooded with emails and phone calls, so please be patient. We will get back with you as soon as we can. And make sure you include your Kickstarter email address and/or your order number in all correspondence.
As always, thank you!
So... still chewing their way through, but no view of how far to go.
I don't suppose you would be able to do a close up of some of the "clear" elementals and spirits would you? I've not seen many pictures of them and was wondering what they were like.
Edit: I've also got the bones KS open in a tab and every so often I have to just have a look at all the stuff I am getting
I don't suppose you would be able to do a close up of some of the "clear" elementals and spirits would you? I've not seen many pictures of them and was wondering what they were like.
Edit: I've also got the bones KS open in a tab and every so often I have to just have a look at all the stuff I am getting
I don't suppose you would be able to do a close up of some of the "clear" elementals and spirits would you? I've not seen many pictures of them and was wondering what they were like.
Edit: I've also got the bones KS open in a tab and every so often I have to just have a look at all the stuff I am getting
My camera (my iPad, right now) is not great at close-ups. But here are some links:
TheAuldGrump wrote: However, a friend did mention that one batch of Duplicolor White that he got a few months ago on sale at Walmart has been tacky on his metal and resin models... so folks having trouble with Duplicolor on Bones may want to test the primer on metal as well - there is a bad batch out there, maybe.
The Auld Grump
Correction to this - I saw his primed minis yesterday - he put on gobs of the stuff.
Odds are good that it was not the primer in this case, just a heavy hand with a spray can.....
The thing was shiny because of how much primer he had on it.
I am going to show him how to prime before he kills any more minis....
TheAuldGrump wrote: However, a friend did mention that one batch of Duplicolor White that he got a few months ago on sale at Walmart has been tacky on his metal and resin models... so folks having trouble with Duplicolor on Bones may want to test the primer on metal as well - there is a bad batch out there, maybe.
The Auld Grump
Correction to this - I saw his primed minis yesterday - he put on gobs of the stuff.
Odds are good that it was not the primer in this case, just a heavy hand with a spray can.....
The thing was shiny because of how much primer he had on it.
I am going to show him how to prime before he kills any more minis....
Finally got back to the country and unboxed my rewards. Woot!
I have some massive bones envy right now...
Oh well, I'll pick up a few when they hit retail. Up until now the only bones figure I had was a unicorn that my four year old daughter decided she wanted to paint...so, I have no bones figures of my own still.
Finally got back to the country and unboxed my rewards. Woot!
I have some massive bones envy right now...
Oh well, I'll pick up a few when they hit retail. Up until now the only bones figure I had was a unicorn that my four year old daughter decided she wanted to paint...so, I have no bones figures of my own still.
Dude... comments of having envy over massive bones... you gotta be careful about straight lines like that.
Finally got back to the country and unboxed my rewards. Woot!
I have some massive bones envy right now...
Oh well, I'll pick up a few when they hit retail. Up until now the only bones figure I had was a unicorn that my four year old daughter decided she wanted to paint...so, I have no bones figures of my own still.
Dude... comments of having envy over massive bones... you gotta be careful about straight lines like that.
Just got my box today and everything looks in order except Im missing the cases that I ordered.
Did I miss a posting that said that they were being delivered later?
BobtheInquisitor wrote: I believe he is $40, but will probably be around $32-35 after discount from The War Store.
Looks like the Sponginess thread on the Reaper forums got locked. I may have played a part in that. Sorry, guys.
Huh!
Somehow, I don't think you are!
What was the conclusion - that we're all just...imagining it?
Did you read the thread? I'm betting that he did.
There is no official conclusion yet. Unofficial consensus seems to be that the parts are softer on purpose, but not miscast. Whether the softness is any kind of real issue or not remains to be seen.
Personally, I don't see a real issue. We'll see how it all shakes out though, to be sure.
Colfax wrote: Just got my box today and everything looks in order except Im missing the cases that I ordered.
Did I miss a posting that said that they were being delivered later?
No idea about a post saying so but my case was in the same box as the rest of the Bones.
So far Reaper hasnt made an official comment on that trait, though they have said that the material is formulated differently for different applications (clockwork dragon is very rigid for example to better hold edges and support its weight). Most likely they are designed to be more bendy in order to deal with undercuts and what not, the question is whether or not it is beyond where they want it to be. Most who have painted bendy items report it holds paint as well as more rigid PVC material. The process of heating to reshape also works to drive out the plasticizer and make them more rigid.
My own experience with painting a 'spongy' Kaladrax head was... that it really was not much of an issue.
Yes - the plastic was very flexible. Had I not read beforehand that the material was so soft then it might have seemed like an issue - it was not like painting a more rigid material.
If anything I was kind of disappointed that it had so little effect on the primer, see below.
I did not boil the head - so it was soft and squooshy throughout the painting.
I did wash the model with soap, water, and a old toothbrush - so there was no mold release or oil on the model.
I primed the head with The Army Painter Skeleton Bone primer - which also took care of much of the painting.
The primer stuck to the material well, and though the horns and jaw were flexed a fair amount it did not flake off.
I did play with it a while to test that - maybe five minutes of going 'wub, wub, wub!' while moving the horns and jaw around.
Ditto with a sepia wash over the primer - I was kind of expecting some crazing, kind of hoping for it, actually, but the ink did not crack. If I want that effect then I may need to add some crackling medium to the paint. (I wanted to see if I could create a crackling dry skin effect, but not with just the primer, the sepia ink, and some wub.)
I did not test the effect with the highlighting paints on over the ink and primer - while crackled skin might have looked cool, peeling paint? Not so much. Plus, at that point I wanted to get it out the door and in the post.
I am kind of worried about how the model will handle shipping - I glued together sub assembles, but the client will need to glue on the tail and wings when he gets the model. (The model is freakin' 'UGE! - I am tempted to wear one as a hat....)
The Auld Grump
*EDIT* Higgins' Sepia Tone ink, for the record, and for folks that want to give it a try.
*EDIT 2* Oh, and any comments that you may see on how long the tail is? It's longer.... I am tempted to shorten the tail by one segment on one of my own two Kaladraxes. Kaladraxii?
*EDIT 3* On the other hand the wings on the clockwork dragon seem to be made of a completely different material - closer to a high impact plastic. Which means that it will be harder to make the 'canvas' wings than I had planned on painting.
*EDIT 3* On the other hand the wings on the clockwork dragon seem to be made of a completely different material - closer to a high impact plastic. Which means that it will be harder to make the 'canvas' wings than I had planned on painting.
You might be able to remove the current webbing and add new out of curved styrene or thin metal plate. However to me that sounds like a recipe for drain bammage, which is bad sense I'm suggesting it.
Two large boxes from Reaper arrived at my mailing address today. I'll be able to pick them up tomorrow night, and hopefully open them on the weekend...
For reference, I tossed a model I had been slapping paint on to test out the 'paint without primer!' claim into a jar of Simple Green yesterday. After ~15 minutes I got pretty much all the paint off with a toothbrush. Threw it in for another 5-10, and got pretty much the rest off. There was a little staining it looks like from the paint, but nothing that appears to have dimension. The model itself didn't get damaged at all that I could see; the thin little swords retained their shape and didn't become more or less soft, and the surfaces of the cloak etc. didn't pock or mar.
Going to toss some Army Painter primer on it tomorrow, weather willing, and see what happens. Might try my preferred Rustoleum stuff on a different model too and see what happens.
That so weird that it goes through the same customs in the same box from the same manufacturer, and one guy gets hit with customs charges and one doesn't.
Wehrkind wrote: For reference, I tossed a model I had been slapping paint on to test out the 'paint without primer!' claim into a jar of Simple Green yesterday. After ~15 minutes I got pretty much all the paint off with a toothbrush. Threw it in for another 5-10, and got pretty much the rest off. There was a little staining it looks like from the paint, but nothing that appears to have dimension. The model itself didn't get damaged at all that I could see; the thin little swords retained their shape and didn't become more or less soft, and the surfaces of the cloak etc. didn't pock or mar.
Going to toss some Army Painter primer on it tomorrow, weather willing, and see what happens. Might try my preferred Rustoleum stuff on a different model too and see what happens.
rustoleum doesnt get along with bones, it contains aceton and any primer with that stuff in it will make the model "sticky" I primed some bones a few weeks back with some rustoleum and they are still sticky
I wonder how much of the problems people have had with sponginess and primer tackiness have to do with how hot the minis are. I know mine sat in an airconditioned office for a week before I opened them, and when I did open them I noticed no sponginess at all, even with Kaladrax and Cthulhu. I've also had no issue with paint or primer on any of the Bones I've tried them on.
Checked my paid extras - most are good. I'm missing a couple of Murlocs and one of my Cthulhus has two right arms and no left arm.
Went through one of the Vampire sets, and again, mostly good. One of my townsfolk has a miscast/missing head. Two more to sort through, but not today.
I've now seen the "spongey" figures in person. I'd call it "rubbery" instead, and some are indeed very bad (and I've been buying bones since shortly after the line launched). We'll see if anything firms them up.
So far, Army Painter Skeleton Bone worked very nicely for a primer. I will pick a few models I don't care about to test the Rustoleum Rusty Metal Autoprimer on later, when it isn't raining again.
Boy oh Boy that's a lot of minis and took a good few hours to inventory.
All the big guys were present and correct, but missing the odd mini from the Vampire box, sadly ones I was specifically after otherwise I wouldn't bother asking for replacements.
I've had to pack them away for now but had to leave one Cthulhu out so he can guard my huge box of paints.
Very impressed with the absolute bargain (I'll mention Cthulhu again here) despite the delays
...So I take it we're going to have to inventory the entire vampire level, checking off models one by one, to make sure everything's there?
...Damn, usually I have to actually come up with an excuse to fondle new-gotten plastic crack for a few hours before resuming normal operations.
in other news, still no email whatsoever here so with customs delays and everything, I'm guessing no sooner than September...
Bolognesus wrote: ...So I take it we're going to have to inventory the entire vampire level, checking off models one by one, to make sure everything's there?
...Damn, usually I have to actually come up with an excuse to fondle new-gotten plastic crack for a few hours before resuming normal operations.
in other news, still no email whatsoever here so with customs delays and everything, I'm guessing no sooner than September...
Probably a good idea to inventory, yes.
I found that I had two of one bag, and was missing another, in my Vampire box.
***
On the 'rubbery' or 'spongy' miniatures - one of my players has found that his Deathsleet (white dragon) cannot stand on its own.
I painted one for a commission, and did not notice a problem, nor does my own Deathsleet have that problem, but I can now confirm that it happens.
I came up with a cheat for him*, so he will not be asking for a replacement, but... it would have been nice not to have the problem.
***
I have added The Army Painter Plate Armour and Barbarian Flesh to the primers that I have tried with Bones - still no problems.
The Auld Grump
* We added a rock outcropping, so the dragon is being held up by three points instead of two.
It came out good enough that I may do the same with my dragon, even though mine stands without the extra support. But then I like dragons coming around or dominating terrain - it makes them look bigger.
Azazelx wrote: Two large boxes from Reaper arrived at my mailing address today. I'll be able to pick them up tomorrow night, and hopefully open them on the weekend...
An Australian actually had the box arrive.
did you have only a few extras?
TheAuldGrump wrote: On the 'rubbery' or 'spongy' miniatures - one of my players has found that his Deathsleet (white dragon) cannot stand on its own.
I painted one for a commission, and did not notice a problem, nor does my own Deathsleet have that problem, but I can now confirm that it happens.
I came up with a cheat for him*, so he will not be asking for a replacement, but... it would have been nice not to have the problem.
"Good" to see confirmation of it, particularly with someone so involved with Bones. Hopefully, they'll address it at some point, or at least acknowledge the problem!
...so I guess we're saying Wehrkind's not crazy, eh? Who knew
Azazelx wrote: Two large boxes from Reaper arrived at my mailing address today. I'll be able to pick them up tomorrow night, and hopefully open them on the weekend...
An Australian actually had the box arrive.
did you have only a few extras?
Still waiting for mine to arrive sadly
Mine was 36 lines. 3x Vampire, 4x cases, hat, 2 shirts, all paint sets, all extras x2 except 4x Kalidrax, 3x Cyberdragon, 4x Cthulhu.
I figure it was packed with the real big stuff, due to all the large boxed models and figure cases.
TheAuldGrump wrote: On the 'rubbery' or 'spongy' miniatures - one of my players has found that his Deathsleet (white dragon) cannot stand on its own.
I painted one for a commission, and did not notice a problem, nor does my own Deathsleet have that problem, but I can now confirm that it happens.
I came up with a cheat for him*, so he will not be asking for a replacement, but... it would have been nice not to have the problem.
"Good" to see confirmation of it, particularly with someone so involved with Bones. Hopefully, they'll address it at some point, or at least acknowledge the problem!
...so I guess we're saying Wehrkind's not crazy, eh? Who knew
Heh - I have never said that Wehrkind is crazy.
Some other folk, but not Wehrkind....
Looking at the Jabberwock.... I am pretty sure that I will have the same problem with the soft plastic - but I already have a solution in hand, attaching one of his forelegs to a Woodland Scenics tree, so that he is wuffling through a tulgy wood.
I may give him a waistcoat and a pocket watch as well. Seems most folks leave them off....
On the 'rubbery' or 'spongy' miniatures - one of my players has found that his Deathsleet (white dragon) cannot stand on its own.
I painted one for a commission, and did not notice a problem, nor does my own Deathsleet have that problem, but I can now confirm that it happens.
I came up with a cheat for him*, so he will not be asking for a replacement, but... it would have been nice not to have the problem.
***
I have added The Army Painter Plate Armour and Barbarian Flesh to the primers that I have tried with Bones - still no problems.
The Auld Grump
* We added a rock outcropping, so the dragon is being held up by three points instead of two.
It came out good enough that I may do the same with my dragon, even though mine stands without the extra support. But then I like dragons coming around or dominating terrain - it makes them look bigger.
I had forgot to mention this, but mine has that same problem (it has been propped up with a toothpick so long I forgot the toothpick was there).
It does not actually seem to suffer from WSF, its material seems as solid as most. Once the wings are added, however, the weight proves too much for its ankles and it slowly sinks forwards to where it is touching the base.
TheAuldGrump wrote: On the 'rubbery' or 'spongy' miniatures - one of my players has found that his Deathsleet (white dragon) cannot stand on its own.
I painted one for a commission, and did not notice a problem, nor does my own Deathsleet have that problem, but I can now confirm that it happens.
I came up with a cheat for him*, so he will not be asking for a replacement, but... it would have been nice not to have the problem.
"Good" to see confirmation of it, particularly with someone so involved with Bones. Hopefully, they'll address it at some point, or at least acknowledge the problem!
...so I guess we're saying Wehrkind's not crazy, eh? Who knew
Wehrkind wrote: Be fair, I am just correct about soft models. No one is saying there is actually an alien invader growing in the belly of my wife, for instance.
Insanity, still on the table!
It's only an alien invader if you're an alien invader... Also, congrats on the upcoming kid? (if that is indeed what you're referencing?)
Is there a checklist of what was suppossed to be in the vampire box somewhere ?
I have two Vampires to go through, and I've noticed at least 1 double in the first box. Made me worrry that something might be missing, but I really don't want to scoll through the images on the KS page playing match up with 200+ miniatures a whack.
Azazelx wrote: Two large boxes from Reaper arrived at my mailing address today. I'll be able to pick them up tomorrow night, and hopefully open them on the weekend...
An Australian actually had the box arrive.
did you have only a few extras?
Still waiting for mine to arrive sadly
Mine was 36 lines. 3x Vampire, 4x cases, hat, 2 shirts, all paint sets, all extras x2 except 4x Kalidrax, 3x Cyberdragon, 4x Cthulhu.
I figure it was packed with the real big stuff, due to all the large boxed models and figure cases.
Ok, darn... Mine was around $200 worth... not anywhere near what you ordered. I have contacted them about it... NOT HAPPY
sparkywtf wrote: I think they said in their last update that ROW is going from largest to smallest, probably to get a large amount of floor space to open up.
Ah! I must have missed that.
I just got a response saying that it is still processing, not long now!!! Well, maybe another 2 months
I was having a look at my Bones this morning before I came out to work and assembled the three dragons I have (red, Kal and Ny) and was quite impressed with the detail. Just need to bend some of the wing spines back into shape but otherwise they are quire cool.
Some of the models I have so far unpacked (1 of the vampire bags and the Ice Giants) are reasonably soft, especially on swords and spears and things. The wing spines on the dragons are quite soft too, as are some of their heads and limbs but not unacceptably so. As long as they can be re-set using hot and cold water into the correct position then I am not too bothered.
It seems that in a lovely bit of feth you Jack, I'm alright, the International shipping thread on the Reaper forums has been locked.
While I'm sure Reaper will ship everything, eventually, their communication has been worse than sub-par, particularly to international backers.
Very disappointing.
If it makes you feel any better I have started painting my bones models
But yes, their communication has been pretty pants, especially to those still waiting for their Bones and especially, from what I understand, to their Canadian backers.
Pretty stupid they are not putting out announcements left and right keeping people updated. It is a shame as I have always thought Reaper were reasonably good at this kind of thing, and they are now squandering good will in a lot of places.
I like the minis (especially the larger stuff which I thinks works better with the material)
but the communications at the tail end of the process have been horrible and REALLY need to be addressed
although playing devils advocate it's not impossible any domain sending about 20K identical emails as an official reaper update would need to do could indeed have ended up flagged as spam (idiot backer: I've got my stuff, why are they emailing me, flag message as spam),
thus labelling Reaper and or KS as a spam site with some ISPs requiring extensive chasing to get sorted out and Reaper may have been told to stop sending updates because of this
(but since they should have the email addresses of unfulfilled backers it should be possible to just email them alone)
ReaperBryan wrote:
Interestingly, there are several figures that we ourselves felt did not translate successfully. Those figures, while included in rewards as promised (including Undertaker/retail pledges), will not be released to distribution.
I don't have the list in front of me, but thought you all might be pleased to hear that we did a critical evaluation and are pre-canceling several items because they consistently do not meet our quality standards.
SilverMK2 wrote: If it makes you feel any better I have started painting my bones models But yes, their communication has been pretty pants, especially to those still waiting for their Bones and especially, from what I understand, to their Canadian backers.
Pretty stupid they are not putting out announcements left and right keeping people updated. It is a shame as I have always thought Reaper were reasonably good at this kind of thing, and they are now squandering good will in a lot of places.
Yeah, I have mine as well, but that's not the issue. It's everything else you posted, quite rightly.
RiTides - they're simply not communicating. That's a choice. Suggesting that they're so overwhelmed that a 15-minute has been a physical impossibility for the last month+ to trash out an official update, or to even post one on Facebook or their own official forums is ...disingenious. Bryan makes a post every week or two, saying "I know your'e frustrated - we're working on it." which is frankly barely better than CMON/McVey.
Orlando - it's through the KS messaging system, and as I pointed out above, they also have Facebook and their own official channels if they actually wanted to communicate with their backers...
ReaperBryan wrote:
Interestingly, there are several figures that we ourselves felt did not translate successfully. Those figures, while included in rewards as promised (including Undertaker/retail pledges), will not be released to distribution.
I don't have the list in front of me, but thought you all might be pleased to hear that we did a critical evaluation and are pre-canceling several items because they consistently do not meet our quality standards.
ReaperBryan wrote:
Interestingly, there are several figures that we ourselves felt did not translate successfully. Those figures, while included in rewards as promised (including Undertaker/retail pledges), will not be released to distribution.
I don't have the list in front of me, but thought you all might be pleased to hear that we did a critical evaluation and are pre-canceling several items because they consistently do not meet our quality standards.
So... which models are we stuck with that are gak
Juliette, Female Sorceress
Townsfolk: Mom & Kids
Drago Voss, Male Assassin
Ellen Stone
Dita,Steampunk Witch
My own Juliette and Mom & Kids were fine, as was Ellen Stone, but Drago... not so good, and Dita is missing altogether.
I'm guessing it will be one or two of the large minis with thing legs that may or may not support their weight
(depending on the exact plastic mix used, but they proably can't choose to make them stiffer or they risk tearing during mould release)
the Jaberwocky & Deathsleet seem to be the two with this
and 4-5 of the smaller minis seem to have a fairly high reporting rate for missing noses so I guess they may be for the chop too
although they might be able to fix these by a bit of mould re-cutting depending on whether that bit of the mould never fills or whether the nose is formed then tears off when the mould opens (and whether this surgery would leave the mini with an acceptable 'face')
My Juliette has a flipper arm.
Ellen Stone, and Berkeley have really soft facial detail. Mr Bill quality.
A couple of the Wizards with the devil horn hand gesture came out bad also.
But the other couple hundred minis I got seemed to be just as advertised,
if not better in the case of the Cthulu and Nethermaul.
The Frost Giants were impressive.
I only wish I could have got all the giants and dragons at the time.
I am defiinitely keeping an eye out for stuff at my local now.
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote: I'm guessing it will be one or two of the large minis with thing legs that may or may not support their weight
(depending on the exact plastic mix used, but they proably can't choose to make them stiffer or they risk tearing during mould release)
the Jaberwocky & Deathsleet seem to be the two with this
and 4-5 of the smaller minis seem to have a fairly high reporting rate for missing noses so I guess they may be for the chop too
although they might be able to fix these by a bit of mould re-cutting depending on whether that bit of the mould never fills or whether the nose is formed then tears off when the mould opens (and whether this surgery would leave the mini with an acceptable 'face')
Sorry - I should have been more clear - the figures that I listed above are the ones to fail the test, no guessing involved. They listed the numbers on the Reaper site.
Deathsleet and the Jabberwock will more likely see a change in formula than a removal from the catalog - they need a firmer plastic, but the detail is coming out fine. They are not among the figures listed for removal.
The listed miniatures, on the other hand do suffer from Missing Face or Fingers Syndrome.
A change in the plastics formula is easier than redesigning the mold, and a lot less expensive.
skrulnik wrote: My Juliette has a flipper arm.
Ellen Stone, and Berkeley have really soft facial detail. Mr Bill quality.
A couple of the Wizards with the devil horn hand gesture came out bad also.
But the other couple hundred minis I got seemed to be just as advertised,
if not better in the case of the Cthulu and Nethermaul.
The Frost Giants were impressive.
I only wish I could have got all the giants and dragons at the time.
I am defiinitely keeping an eye out for stuff at my local now.
I almost started on mine last weekend, but I found it needs a bunch of heating to make the legs line up with the ground. So it got put to the side for now.
Azazelx wrote: I almost started on mine last weekend, but I found it needs a bunch of heating to make the legs line up with the ground. So it got put to the side for now.
Mine, too. And the legs keep reverting back even when dunking at rolling boil for 15-20 secs, then ice water while holding straight. I concluded he needs to be based.
I'm going to get a sheet of board from the hardware store and cut to size for the base-needed models.
A couple others are doing the same thing with memory, but not all. Some hold the new configuration after heating just fine, like Cthluhu's wing: perfect with a quick dunk in boiling water.
ReaperBryan wrote:
Interestingly, there are several figures that we ourselves felt did not translate successfully. Those figures, while included in rewards as promised (including Undertaker/retail pledges), will not be released to distribution.
I don't have the list in front of me, but thought you all might be pleased to hear that we did a critical evaluation and are pre-canceling several items because they consistently do not meet our quality standards.
So... which models are we stuck with that are gak
IMO anything with fine details thats on the small end of man size. Bones is great for big things (giants, dragons), and mooks you want a lot of, but I would never use it for a PC or special figure. I have both Ebonwrath and Deathsleet in metal, and dont notice any significant drop in quality, particularly compared to the friggin stupid savings in medium translation. But I do have some metal figs of the medium sized bones, and even a simple basecoat and wash reveals a significant difference. Its simply not worth the 2-3 bucks I'd save on a figure I use every session. But for just throw down dudes (orcs, goblins, undead, lizard men), its awesome. Hopefully Reaper realizes this, and we see more generic monsters in the next release and less PC minis. The villager with a pitchfork and torch, lizardman or gnoll are probably going to sell a crapton more minis than the blacksmith figure.
Incidentally, what paints have you guys had good/bad luck with? I've been priming with Vallejo primers with an airbrush and haven't had any of the stickiness issues some people have reported w other primers. Used P3 and reaper paints, no issue either. But GW metallics (leadbelcher, warplock and chainmail) have been sticky.
skrulnik wrote: My Juliette has a flipper arm.
Ellen Stone, and Berkeley have really soft facial detail. Mr Bill quality.
A couple of the Wizards with the devil horn hand gesture came out bad also.
But the other couple hundred minis I got seemed to be just as advertised,
if not better in the case of the Cthulu and Nethermaul.
The Frost Giants were impressive.
I only wish I could have got all the giants and dragons at the time.
I am defiinitely keeping an eye out for stuff at my local now.
I've been priming with automotive primer (unfortunately have to do a double layer due to wanting a white base coat, so I have to prime grey so I know the model is covered, then white over the top).
Had no issues with melting, stickiness or any other problem. I did have a bit of an issue with paint shrinkage but I think that is because I put too much on/did not wait long enough between coats rather than because of the material.
Will let you know if I get any damage from paint strippers when I get round to cleaning them off
I've had poor results when brushing on the Vallejo polyurethane primers as well as Vallejo GC "Extra Opaque" (ie Not-Foundation). Haven't tried every shade of either, but no luck with either so far.
After laying down the first coats with a layer or two of Foundation, all is good in the world. Also, super-thinned-down liquid green stuff works very well as well(!)
Actually, I'm going to recycle a post mate to a mate on another forum who got seriously frustrated with Bones in general and Ebonwrath specifically - which I will recycle again at some stage when I take some pics of finished Bones for my Blog...
I haven't looked closely at many of mine yet, bit I figure it's all in the attitude, brah. I knew that Bones would be good for cheap gaming figures and not something to do my best work on, so I'm using them to "play" with. I know I've been gak for photos recently (midwinter does that, since I tend to use natural light), but I've painted the Crypt-coffin and "iron" golem using a copper and verdigris wash technique a bit different to what I've done before. They look quite reasonable as finished figures - more than fine for Pathfinder-ing, and I got in some good practice on figures I just don't care all that much about. The Iron Golem had gak-awful details on the chain, pouch and bag on his butt, so I just knocked them up quickly and decided not to worry about them much. I have a couple finished models that are fine for gaming, and was good practice on that particular verdigris technique on two different kind of models (armour vs flat "scenery" surfaces). The pre-KS $3 Bones troll I painted turned out merely "okay" (and the Army Painter varnish fethed it up), but I got some good practice in blending human-ish skin tones into troll-green, which will do me well when I paint something like a new $20 GW troll down the line. The mushy details on both the Iron Golem and that Troll prevent them from ever being able to be showpiece models, but I got what I wanted out of both - decent RPG miniatures and practice on a specific technique/look. I know you did the same with the Bones Ogre you painted awhile back.
Now I'm painting the "clay golem" as a Carnage Demon (inspired here) because I'm wanting to play with reds on large organic areas and blending up and down. Deciding whether to to go orangey, or pinky. Going down to a dark cadmium red or even black in parts. (If I'd painted him a "normal" flesh tone it'd be all about practicing freehand tattoos). Next will be the stone golem because I want to play with sandstone looks, and chipped/weather-worn paint (on his skirt). Rather than concentrating on getting a great model, the price allows me to just use them as figures to play with and experiment on. - it doesn't mean I'm trying for a gak result, but "okay" and "decent" are good enough.
FWIW, For a bones figure that does paint up very well, I finished my two purple worms a few weeks ago. I'm surprised at how well they turned out.
My best advice would be to use them not as your top-flight display figures, but technique-practice models. You might luck out on some and be happy with them as both. I'm going to use them for a combo of that, stuff to use as I teach my wife to paint, and semi-speed-painted gaming models for Pathfinder. When something turns out to be a whole bunch of fun or finishes as an awesome model as well as one of the other criteria, that's a bonus.
Furry figures like the Owlbear? Practice painting fur, countershading, paint washes, ink washes, ink glazes, oil washes. The rats - practice snouts and the transition between the pinkish bits like the snout/ears/feet/tails and the black/grey/white parts of the fur. Use the skeletons to practice different shades of bone (yellowed vs whitened). Lots of practice canvases for different types of cloth and if you like, freehand on all those adventurers - I know you were talking about not enjoying painting white. Coat D'Arms has a shade called "unbleached wool", and P3 have their Menoth White shades. Use these as trial fodder.
Not to get all telling you what to do and gak, just suggestions based on what I plan to do with some of them.
And I've noticed that htis thread has now made it's way from Misc Miniature Games across to Dakka Discussions....
Azazelx wrote: I've had poor results when brushing on the Vallejo polyurethane primers as well as Vallejo GC "Extra Opaque" (ie Not-Foundation). Haven't tried every shade of either, but no luck with either so far.
I've found the brush on Vallejo primer went on perfectly and stuck really well. I did wash the figure in soap & water and let it thoroughly dry first though.
Liquitex acrylic gesso is going on great on bones as well.
Which one? I'm using the large 200ml bottles of Acrylic Polyurethane Surface Primer (which brushes onto normal plastic and metal models without a problem). I've tried Panzer Grey and possibly one or two others but I've forgotten which one(s).
I have the grey Acrylic Polyurethane Surface Primer. I've used it on about 10 bones miniatures so far, but the gesso works even better on the bones material.
The lighter grey (just called "Grey"), or the darker (Panzer) one? It's the latter that didn't work well for me, so far. Though I'd have expected them to all work equally well or badly, with just the pigments being different.
I haven't got any Gesso. I'll pick some up next time I do a Blick order. I need to replace my MIA Series 7 000 brush, and get some S7s for the wife as well. Maybe some brush soap as well.
The gesso I'm using is liquitex stuff that gets recommended whenever gesso is talked about as a primer. I've also tried cheaper store brands and discount brands and they ended up getting used up as terrain primer.
Still haven't gotten a postage notification - Perth, Western Australia, got Vampire + 1 each of most of the dragon addons + cthulu. Anyone else still waiting??
Good idea to check your order if you have not already checked it.
Mine was missing Nethermaul, Mr Bones and Kaladrax's wizard fig. Emailed about the missing pieces and they said they would deal with them after everything has shipped.
Bossk_Hogg wrote:[
Incidentally, what paints have you guys had good/bad luck with? I've been priming with Vallejo primers with an airbrush and haven't had any of the stickiness issues some people have reported w other primers. Used P3 and reaper paints, no issue either. But GW metallics (leadbelcher, warplock and chainmail) have been sticky.
I've not had any stickyness, and aside from your post, the only sticky paints I've seen reported were certain spray-can paints/primers. I've read nothing about any brushed or airbrushed acrylics being sticky on Bones. Did you clean the figure prior to painting? It's a good idea with any figure material, but seems to be particularly important for Bones.
I've been using Liquitex Gesso, and Craft paints (solids and metalics) from Folk Art and Delta Ceramcoat.
Still haven't gotten a postage notification - Perth, Western Australia, got Vampire + 1 each of most of the dragon addons + cthulu. Anyone else still waiting??
15 line items, one of which two cases, to the Netherlands. Also still waiting.
...And getting pretty pissed by now, incidentally.
Azazelx wrote:The lighter grey (just called "Grey"), or the darker (Panzer) one? It's the latter that didn't work well for me, so far. Though I'd have expected them to all work equally well or badly, with just the pigments being different.
I haven't got any Gesso. I'll pick some up next time I do a Blick order. I need to replace my MIA Series 7 000 brush, and get some S7s for the wife as well. Maybe some brush soap as well.
Figures that the Panzer Grey wouldn't work well. It and white were the two that I didn't try out...
Azazelx wrote:The lighter grey (just called "Grey"), or the darker (Panzer) one? It's the latter that didn't work well for me, so far. Though I'd have expected them to all work equally well or badly, with just the pigments being different.
I haven't got any Gesso. I'll pick some up next time I do a Blick order. I need to replace my MIA Series 7 000 brush, and get some S7s for the wife as well. Maybe some brush soap as well.
Figures that the Panzer Grey wouldn't work well. It and white were the two that I didn't try out...
Sorry to hear that man.
~Eric
Not a worry mate. I've got a few of the Vallejos, and Foundation worked just fine on the few things I've started anyway.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
timd wrote: Good idea to check your order if you have not already checked it.
Mine was missing Nethermaul, Mr Bones and Kaladrax's wizard fig. Emailed about the missing pieces and they said they would deal with them after everything has shipped.
T
Yeah, I'm missing a couple of the add-ons, and have the townsfolk mother missing her and her kid's heads. One of my Cthulhus has two left (or is it right?) arms. I haven't looked closely at the rest in Vampire #1 since they all got opened the day they arrived by a slightly over-enthusiastic friend, and I'm in no rush for opening Vamp #2 and #3 since they're taking their sweet-arse time shipping the Rest of Rest of World's stuff.
Still haven't gotten a postage notification - Perth, Western Australia, got Vampire + 1 each of most of the dragon addons + cthulu. Anyone else still waiting??
15 line items, one of which two cases, to the Netherlands. Also still waiting.
...And getting pretty pissed by now, incidentally.
I don't blame you. It's seriously fethed up at this point.
Still haven't gotten a postage notification - Perth, Western Australia, got Vampire + 1 each of most of the dragon addons + cthulu. Anyone else still waiting??
I'm in Sydney (with a similar number of items) and still waiting.
Emailed them about a week (or 2) ago and they said I hadn't been processed yet.
Still haven't gotten a postage notification - Perth, Western Australia, got Vampire + 1 each of most of the dragon addons + cthulu. Anyone else still waiting??
Brisbane, 2 vamps, 4 cases, a few add-ons, Kaladrax, Wyrmgear and Cthulu.
I'm wondering if there's a specific part they had to wait to be reshipped or something, and that's why the last bunch of pledges just haven't gone out. I did hear they had troubles with the Kaladrax legs (A whole bunch of them were missing one leg and had doubles of another), so I wonder if that meant they had to wait for a batch of new Kaladrax legs (or just Kaladraxes) to come from China to complete the final orders. Just a theory, could well be wrong, but they were pumping out far far more orders than this, and even if they stopped having the special kickstarter crew working on it, it still should have been out the door by now.
So yeah, I think we're waiting for another shipment from China for our orders.
So yeah, I think we're waiting for another shipment from China for our orders.
Things are still shipping, just at a very, very slow rate. US was getting about 500 a day, RoW seems to be about 50 a day.
Given the difference between US and everyone else, my personal take is that they're simply going out via their normal postal pickups. They didn't organise a specific shipping contract with anyone, expected the USPS to just pick up 3k packages at x hundred per day and had no backup plan when they wouldn't do that.
Add in bloody terrible communication, incorrect claims about Kickstarter, repeated missed dates and expectations and it's gone from one of the best run kickstarters to a bloody awful one. Not the worst because they're getting stuff out, but they've certainly screwed up their PR and reputation internationally.
Their shipping system is a mess. Apparently they're just randomly picking stacks out of the warehouse to ship now instead of any particular order. And they still won't let people know how many pledges are left
I really don't know if i will be supporting them this time around, this campaign just hasn't been an enjoyable experience for me. I might consider it though if Reaper can guarantee upfront that their communication will be drastically improved, and that the ROW shipping won't be an absolute disorganized clusterfeth.
It must be a total piss off to still be waiting for stuff as a rest-of-world project backer. The idea of putting a bunch of money forward and not getting your stuff is pretty much the worst thing to happen in any financial transaction. It sucks. Reaper must know things aren't working out right on the international shipping front.
Reaper's main market is North America and they probably view their execution of rest-of-world delivery as a problematic side issue representing a fraction of their market. As for miscasts and missing parts, that's going to happen and as long as they're willing to get all the problems fixed in a timely manner once their shipping is done.
In the next KS, they probably should be more aggressive in their charging of shipping fees and talked to a customs expert so they could send everything out via courier with all customs fees paid on their end.
If they can get a general estimate of how much shipping + brokerage + customs would be to the countries they sent the products to in the first KS, then they can charge appropriately, use a courier's express customs services and get things to people in a timely manner. Will it be cheap? No. Will it turn people off who are buying from other countries? Yes, as it will be expensive.
Still waiting on mine as well, in perth western australia and haven't even recieved a delivery email which means it's at least 1-2 months away still.... :(
As with all KS projects I'll look at what Bones II has to offer and then decide whether to back
I have got my shipment from Bones I, but it certainly wasn't fast, but then I never expected it would be
part of the problem is clearly people seeing lots of other folk getting their packages and starting to get worried/angry/ disgruntled
it's a lot more obvious in a project with round 20,000 orders that it is with other 'big' project which have tended to run to under 5000. I had hoped shipping would take 4x as long as these, but clearly it has (or worse)
The issue is really that they stopped communicating with RoW backers, and the "shipped per day" has dropped from 700+ to... well, they won't tell us, but it's clearly under 100 or they'd be done a couple of weeks ago. Evilref probably has it spot on the money.
Moderately interested in Bones 2, but not all that much now that I have way more middling quality models than I will ever paint. I suppose there are parts of their line that would get me pretty excited, but right now, I am feeling alright where I am.
I feel about the same. It really depends on what they'll want to kick start again. I have most of the models I'll need for awhile, so they have to do something really special to draw me back in.
Yup info came out at Gencon: Bones 2 due fall 2013
(photo of flyer taken from Darsc Zakal on the Reaper Forum)
Hopefully KS1 fulfilment and replacement of missing/faulty parts will be finished before it starts (or the comments will not be a nice place to hang out this time)
Maybe with most (all?) of the production being in the USA it won't be as much of a...factor?
Reaper need to get a local UK distributor so we don't have to pay customs charges and the Royal Mail Rip Off Charge
I would be interested to hear what would be in Bones II - I would hope for lots more monsters of different types we have not seen from them yet as well as some more scenery (really impressed with what we got in I) as I think I will never need another PC model again thanks to Bones I
Maybe with most (all?) of the production being in the USA it won't be as much of a...factor?
There's no chance of much if any of the production for KS 2 being in the USA
KS1 demanded 12+ (I think, it may have been more) machines in China run by an experienced factory for many months (and was still late on delivery)
Reaper has a single machine and no (little by the time of KS 2) experience with it, so they'll go to China to supply the new, volume production
what their machine will be very good for is topping up production of stuff that's in short supply while waiting for a Chinese shipment, and testing out new moulds plastic recipeis etc
as they get more machines & staff they'll be able to do more in house, but not yet
If I were a betting man, I'd wager that Reaper makes this kickstarter less of a value, and probably increases the ROW shipping.
I really feel for both sides of this. As an international supporter, I would want clear communicaiton, shipping as quick as possible, etc. But as a shipper, holy cow, is shipping internationally a PITA.
I know I feel like a tool when I'm selling stuff on eBay and have to cancel bids from international bidders. It's not that I don't want the money, it's just not worth the hassle.
If they bring out lots of monsters, townsfolk and scenery I think I might spring for it.
This. I've got enough generic PC guys to last a lifetime (plus bones are too mediocre to really use as PC's).. Gimme horde monsters and giants. Small scenery is also a good idea. Do some tables and chairs, barrels, chests,etc. I wonder how cheap they could do somjething like a 3" x3" cottage?
Ehh, I think bones is fine for PC quality miniatures.
But more scenery would be nice. Also, I think that if they work on getting models that are more designed to be made via bones material, they might hold the detail better.
Polonius wrote: If I were a betting man, I'd wager that Reaper makes this kickstarter less of a value, and probably increases the ROW shipping.
I really feel for both sides of this. As an international supporter, I would want clear communication, shipping as quick as possible, etc. But as a shipper, holy cow, is shipping internationally a PITA.
I know I feel like a tool when I'm selling stuff on eBay and have to cancel bids from international bidders. It's not that I don't want the money, it's just not worth the hassle.
Much as I would love to disagree with you.... Yeah, shipping has become a heck of a lot harder over the last decade or so. :(
It used to be so easy, and not all that expensive. Then, suddenly, *BAM!* rates skyrocketed and the paperwork doubled.
A software glitch had the new bones up for sale on the Reaper site very briefly yesterday..
As soon as they realised they were pulled, but in explaining it was not deliberate they let slip they were meant to go live on 26th August...... Maybe the date the (internally at least) hope to have the last package out of the door
Polonius wrote: If I were a betting man, I'd wager that Reaper makes this kickstarter less of a value, and probably increases the ROW shipping.
I really feel for both sides of this. As an international supporter, I would want clear communicaiton, shipping as quick as possible, etc. But as a shipper, holy cow, is shipping internationally a PITA.
I know I feel like a tool when I'm selling stuff on eBay and have to cancel bids from international bidders. It's not that I don't want the money, it's just not worth the hassle.
Yeah shipping is insane, misterjustin (Secret Weapon) and Adam Poots (Kingdom Death: Monster) were talking to Cyporiean about plastics and kickstarters during GenCon... Poots spent 400 grand on shipping. He spent more on shipping than misterjustin and On the Lamb made in their kickstarters.
It would suck that the ROW gets shafted on the shipping, but man it's a rough one.
Also when and why did this get moved out of Misc Minis?
Alfndrate wrote: Yeah shipping is insane, misterjustin (Secret Weapon) and Adam Poots (Kingdom Death: Monster) were talking to Cyporiean about plastics and kickstarters during GenCon... Poots spent 400 grand on shipping. He spent more on shipping than misterjustin and On the Lamb made in their kickstarters.
It would suck that the ROW gets shafted on the shipping, but man it's a rough one.
Also when and why did this get moved out of Misc Minis?
Maybe people will start looking at a single large container to the EU/AUS/other larger ROW customer locations for distribution by a partner company at local postage rates, with the only international shipping being for people in ROW locations where it is cheaper to just post out their stuff than ship in bulk and break up for local distribution.
lord_blackfang wrote: So Bones are going retail before I get my Kickstarter stuff. Lovely.
Maybe
The won't be going retail until everything has shipped at the very least
It's possible they will hit retail (in the USA) while they are in transit to you
It's very unlikely they'll hit retail in a ROW country as stores/distributors from outside the USA will have exactly the same shipping time & customs issues to deal with as you do
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Maybe people will start looking at a single large container to the EU/AUS/other larger ROW customer locations for distribution by a partner company at local postage rates, with the only international shipping being for people in ROW locations where it is cheaper to just post out their stuff than ship in bulk and break up for local distribution.
It's certainly an attractive option if you get the numbers of backers in a territory to make it work
But choosing to do so means you need to keep your campaign simple, lots of companies are delighted to 'drop ship' a simple box with a barcode on to whatever addresses you choose, and it's not terribly expensive to arrange (eg Amazon fulfilment)
but the moment you start needing packers to choose between box A, B and C (or combinations of them) costs go up a lot, and something as complex as Bones would probably just be offered a price that would make financial sense (and single items in plastic bags are probably a no go area, everything would need a barcode)
I got my e-mail today, which means I'll have a big, big box in about two weeks. Between then and now I will have to get rid of a lot of stuff to make space. I sense a lot of old old metal going to the recycling center...
sparkywtf wrote: Ehh, I think bones is fine for PC quality miniatures.
But more scenery would be nice. Also, I think that if they work on getting models that are more designed to be made via bones material, they might hold the detail better.
Regarding PC quality miniatures - completely without snark, it depends on your, well, we'll call them "standards" and that of your group - though that sounds unintentionally elitist, and it's not meant to be. I know roleplayers who game with unpainted figures from Warhammer Quest. I know others who use D&D miniatures, unpainted models (maybe with a wash at best) and Reaper's pre-paint line. For the group that plays at my place, for the PCs, it's metal GW and Reaper figures. Customised kitbashed GW plastics, etc etc. Updated with new models when people get significant gear changes/upgrades All (well) painted by me. But that's because I'm a miniatures guy, so my personal "standards" of miniature requirements are naturally different to others who aren't miniatures people quite so much.
Compete agreement on more scenery (but hopefully less warpage on the straight lines!) and that minis designed for Bones will hopefully work out better.
The sculpt, detail, and quality are on a par with GW and other manufacturers. The mini looks, I think, really good.
A friend who went in on the Bones Kickstarter got that model in the Bones plastic/resin. I had a look at the two side by side and the quality looks just as good. So, I'd say any perceived lower quality of Bones is probably dependent on the sculpt in question, rather than only the material itself--the above is one example which I think looked equally good in both materials. Definitely a 'good' quality mini suitable for use as a PC, IMO. Like Azazelx, I paint/convert miniatures to represent my PCs in RPGs, rather than using prepainted ones.
sparkywtf wrote: Ehh, I think bones is fine for PC quality miniatures.
But more scenery would be nice. Also, I think that if they work on getting models that are more designed to be made via bones material, they might hold the detail better.
Regarding PC quality miniatures - completely without snark, it depends on your, well, we'll call them "standards" and that of your group - though that sounds unintentionally elitist, and it's not meant to be. I know roleplayers who game with unpainted figures from Warhammer Quest. I know others who use D&D miniatures, unpainted models (maybe with a wash at best) and Reaper's pre-paint line. For the group that plays at my place, for the PCs, it's metal GW and Reaper figures. Customised kitbashed GW plastics, etc etc. Updated with new models when people get significant gear changes/upgrades All (well) painted by me. But that's because I'm a miniatures guy, so my personal "standards" of miniature requirements are naturally different to others who aren't miniatures people quite so much.
Compete agreement on more scenery (but hopefully less warpage on the straight lines!) and that minis designed for Bones will hopefully work out better.
I completely understand where you are coming from and it makes sense! I guess part of it is biased because every group I end up playing in falls apart a few months in, so its hard to justify the time spent for a high quality paint job.
I wouldn't be surprised if bones 2.0 had some great quality models that are more designed for the bones material.
I actually do think that, on the average, the Reaper Bones do have a slightly lower quality.
But that is more than offset by the price.
The minis are definitely better than the days when that was the normal price for a human sized figure, so I am not comparing a $2 Bones figure to a $7 resin figure from 2013, I am comparing it to a $2 lead figure from 1990....
I am more than happy with the Bones for the retail price, and ecstatic about the KS price.
More importantly, Bones are inexpensive enough to be an impulse buy!(Not that spending $300+ on the Kickstarter was an impulse buy... but I have plenty of pre-KS Bones that were.)
I ended up getting some duplicates of some metal miniatures I had already in my bones. I painted one up and I can't really tell the difference other than by picking them up. I imagine if someone was a truly great painter, the difference would be more pronounced, but I base coat, shade and highlight twice and I can't tell the difference between the metal and bones.
EDIT: Mould line removal was more annoying though. Traditional methods work, but then you have to go back over the other direction to remove any fuzzies.
frozenwastes wrote: I ended up getting some duplicates of some metal miniatures I had already in my bones. I painted one up and I can't really tell the difference other than by picking them up. I imagine if someone was a truly great painter, the difference would be more pronounced, but I base coat, shade and highlight twice and I can't tell the difference between the metal and bones.
EDIT: Mould line removal was more annoying though. Traditional methods work, but then you have to go back over the other direction to remove any fuzzies.
As many others have said, some Bones are better than others. I've raved about the purple worm (pre-KS) model a few times, and the praise is very well deserved. OTOH, the Iron Golem (KS) and Troll (pre-KS) are both nice for the price, but just not as good as metals. I can well believe that some of the "PC"-type figures are just as good in the Bones material, but it's basically luck of the draw, and then another roll of the dice to see if the figure fits any of your party. As Magos said (or insinuated) the Bones models also make very good conversion fodder for RPGPCs, since it's pretty simple to lop off an arm/head/etc to swap out or use to replace the part on a different model. I'll probably keep quite a few aside for that very purpose.
Yeah, I ordered Tre Manor's "bugbear" model in metal... 2 copies of it, and I'm really happy with it. Saw it in Bones material and don't think it's quite as good...
Mostly, I'm looking for one-off models from the range, so metal works fine for me. If they would make more massed units, the bones material would be a bigger draw for me... but for so many character-type and monster-type sculpts, I'm willing to pay more for higher quality.
That said, I'm extremely interested that they're doing another kickstarter... will likely just watch it again, but man it was entertaining the first time around and will likely be so again.
That's totally fair, and is similar to things like Kingdom Death offering resin and plastic versions of their models. In that case, the resin is too expensive for me... but metal is a nice middle ground price-to-quality-wise.
Albiet, one that is likely to disappear sooner rather than later, given the way things are going!
frozenwastes wrote: EDIT: Mould line removal was more annoying though. Traditional methods work, but then you have to go back over the other direction to remove any fuzzies.
I have had good luck with slicing the mould lines off instead of trying to scrape or file them off - I end up with thin strings instead of fuzzies.
Wee, I got my huge box! Lots of small boxes with paint, a huge box with my miniatures, two large dragons and a separate Mr Bones. But ... no Sophie Urban Legend :( . I already sent them an e-mail - I hope they still have Urban Legend versions. Considering us ROW were treated like plebs ... it's well possible they ran out by now.
Red_avatar wrote: Wee, I got my huge box! Lots of small boxes with paint, a huge box with my miniatures, two large dragons and a separate Mr Bones. But ... no Sophie Urban Legend :( . I already sent them an e-mail - I hope they still have Urban Legend versions. Considering us ROW were treated like plebs ... it's well possible they ran out by now.
I was sent my Sophies REALLY early, like a few weeks after the KS finished. You should have had them last year by that model... :(
I just bought a bones model on ebay to use in a conversion... will let you know if I encounter anything unusual, but I'm hoping it will lend itself to converting quite readily
Red_avatar wrote: Wee, I got my huge box! Lots of small boxes with paint, a huge box with my miniatures, two large dragons and a separate Mr Bones. But ... no Sophie Urban Legend :( . I already sent them an e-mail - I hope they still have Urban Legend versions. Considering us ROW were treated like plebs ... it's well possible they ran out by now.
Reaper normally only destroys the mold if they no longer are licensed to own it, they keep molds for limited edition items for lost and damaged parts...so they ought to be able to help you out there without much difficulty.
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dreamakuma wrote: I'm thinking of getting the bugbear to convert int a warboss. Anybody added plastic bits? does this work?
Works fine. I have added styrene, pewter, resin and brass to various PVC kits in the past, including the bones formulation (currently modifying the clockwork dragon with brass and plasticard). The only problems tend to be weight/balance if you choose to use something like metal bits. Those are not too hard to deal with though. Superglue is the adhesive of choice, though you can also use a specialty plastic cement that will bond the styrene and PVC together (Plastruct sells one, and I think Squadron might as well). Regular plastic cement isnt quite agressive enough to work on the PVC though.
Automatically Appended Next Post: One thing that I always liked about Reaper...
Posted Today, 12:08 PMDan Goodchild, on 26 Aug 2013 - 12:53 PM, said:Is $324.99 a new price for the Vampire box? I thought it was going to be $399.99.Could just be me mis-remembering though.
New price. It's always our goal to bring things down as low as possible, price-wise. So we had a chance to look at our pricing calculations, and found that some of the variables we default in to pricing models didn't apply, and made adjustments.
So, if you decide you want to buy in on a Vampire box set now, they are available...and after crunching the numbers, they dropped the price by $75 from what they originally anticipated they would be. Always nice to see prices go down as opposed to up.
I finally noticeds that a bunch of the new bones are up on Reaper's site. I'm going to check if my local store is just stocking the whole line or if I'm going to have to make a special order for a bunch.
It was always pretty painless. My local store clears their own US shipments for customs so they don't have to pay the courier's charges, but now I guess that's even one less hassle as the shipments won't stop at the border waiting for the paperwork to be processed.
Makes ordering direct easier too for the times between the local store's orders.
I'm really looking forward to the IMEF bones:
I can get 10 of these guys for less than a Space Marine tactical squad cost me in the 90s.
International postage rates skyrocketed after the KS, unfortunately... I always have to use first class when shipping abroad now, when I used to use priority.
frozenwastes wrote: It was always pretty painless. My local store clears their own US shipments for customs so they don't have to pay the courier's charges, but now I guess that's even one less hassle as the shipments won't stop at the border waiting for the paperwork to be processed.
Makes ordering direct easier too for the times between the local store's orders.
I'm really looking forward to the IMEF bones:
I can get 10 of these guys for less than a Space Marine tactical squad cost me in the 90s.
It will be interesting to see where things like that show up on their top selling lists in the next few months. Most of those are already in the top 50 for Chronoscope, I would guess they will become some of the more popular Bones figurss for just that reason. Bones 2.0 may see another squad of those and some more of the Nova Corps guys as well.
BobtheInquisitor wrote:I really want to see an IMEF Marine actually shooting his rifle for a change.
That's a good point. I never even noticed. I like soldiers with helmets so I might remove all the IMEF guy's heads and replace them. When i do, I'll be sure to make the Jazz Jenkins guy looking down his rifle. Then I'll put his left foot up a rock or something to raise his rifle ever so slightly. Not an optimal shooting pose, but it'll work.
As for bases, i was thinking of checking eBay for laser cut MDF circles. Litko would be a good source as well.
Sean_OBrien wrote:
It will be interesting to see where things like that show up on their top selling lists in the next few months. Most of those are already in the top 50 for Chronoscope, I would guess they will become some of the more popular Bones figurss for just that reason. Bones 2.0 may see another squad of those and some more of the Nova Corps guys as well.
I really like the Nova Corps as well. I have them in metal and will probably add more. I think the first 30 bones that were out already are going to stay as consistent top sellers as they are slightly cheaper than the ones generated by the Kickstarter and so it's easier to add one or two to an existing order to check the material out. I think once people are more familiar with it the orders for the rest of the line will eclipse things like the cave troll.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Orcs turned out great in Bones:
I'm actually glad I didn't end up going in on the Kickstarter because I would be totally overwhelmed at what to paint next. While I'll pay triple per figure buying them at full retail, I think getting them piecemeal will be good for my psyche compared to the supply dump of 200+ miniatures my friends got.
RiTides wrote: International postage rates skyrocketed after the KS, unfortunately... I always have to use first class when shipping abroad now, when I used to use priority.
Yep, I'm well aware of that. Though the initial delivery date for the Sophie sets was September 2012, and the price hike came on Jan 27th 2013, so even allowing for delays in getting cash from Amazon, etc. So with the information at hand, it seems they screwed themselves on that one by trying to save money by changing the dates after everyone had paid (eventually 11 months later for most international backers), and they can't blame the USPS for it, either.
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BobtheInquisitor wrote: I really want to see an IMEF Marine actually shooting his rifle for a change.
Well, two of the six are in braced/firing poses. Just not the riflemen.
BTW, I am not sure how much room for influence there is left with it...but ReaperBryan seems to be testing the waters regarding what people would like to see for Bones 2.0 (in that round about way that shrinks ask what you see in the ink blots).
It seems that it will be coming sooner rather than later based off the squishy timeline he had mentioned over in their forums.
I have the first planning meeting (wherein we will settle on the models for the initial offering and stretch goals, and theme, level names, and art style) on my calendar. I know I then have a few days to make art for approval so we can begin the project approval process. I'd anticipate several weeks, but refuse to pin down a date, in case something happens to alter the intended schedule.
As they get more expierence with the material, they will find what works well and what doesnt. This time around, I wouldnt be surprised if more are purpose built as opposed to metal to bones conversione...granted much of that will be dependent on the schedules of their sculptors, though I am sure they have been in contact with them to get work penciled in.
Not looking for any more future models. In fact, if anyone in the UK wants to swap for some of the future bones figures, I would be happy to accept cash, fantasy models or scenery
Enough IMEF Troopers/heavies/officers to build legit squads
More medium/large monsters
Rank and file style troopers of various races: orcs, humans, dwarves, etc.
My very first painted miniature (as in, first miniature I EVER painted - not counting Hero Quest figurines when I was 12):
Done with Vallejo Game Paints for the brown & bronze, Reaper HD paints for the teeth and blood (note: I found that Vallejo paint covered much better - Reaper's blood red refused to adhere even after serious cleaning of the figurine before hand).
I'm quite happy considering it's a first try - any feedback anyone? I took the pics after I did a wash so it will be a lot dryer tomorrow . I plan on adding some highlights to the teeth and also clean up the red stains on them a bit. It looks worse on the pics than in RL though - but it still bugs me.
The only thing I might suggest is going with a matte finish rather than gloss. It's totally your call, but it's easier to see the details of the model when it's less shiney.
Umm... I use Dupli Color for priming Bones - I have since the line first came out. Including the teeny tiny kobold miniatures.
