Chairman Aeon wrote: But seriously these might actually be models for this game and also useable in 40K. I know it's strange to the young' but sometimes stuff is actually designed for the game they are bundled with. I think there is probably more money in these boxed games than as a minis release for 40K, just a function of board games being a bigger market and this being of interest to people who wouldn't buy the minis if they were some 40K Imperial add-ons.
All the current Quest characters have rules and are available separately. Do you think that these won't be? Even the two big adversaries got separate releases.
You preach about "strange to the young", but you're showing how naive you just may be here.
Chairman Aeon wrote: I get that you are not impressed by all this H.B.M.C., but this is going to reach far outside 40K even in ways that Kill Team couldn't. And if its any consolation all the new characters for 40K are monopose now, so why would boardgames minis be any different...
I'm not impressed with kits with few and fewer options. The Primaris Marines have zero options (they only have 5 poses per box). The AoS releases have fewer options. We just got 6 different Ork buggies, all of which have zero options on the sprue. This issue isn't new, it's spreading fast to all aspects of the HHHobby.
Yodhrin wrote: Very promising, but it's the enemies that will sell me on this box - if we get Primaris-sized Chaos Marines and a selection of new & interesting gribblies then sold.
Thargrim wrote: I'm kinda excited about this but also hesitant. GW has a bad history of supporting this kind of game.
What kind of support would you want for a game like this? It's a board game, complete in itself.
For them to keep it and its accessories available and support it in store. The hero cards for silver tower got dropped from the US webstore before I could get them. And that was a long time ago. Or at the least it feels like a while ago.
They would continue to support it if people were buying it. The cards got dropped because they stopped selling. If you didn't get around to buying them for the year they were out that's kinda on you. Seems a lot of people have these "I'll buy that one day" items that they never actually buy then get upset when GW discontinues them because they aren't selling.
No business can afford to keep dead stock either on their shelf or warehouse. I can promise you GW has a team analyzing what is selling and what isn't and they don't stop carrying something just because.
I know this is an alien concept to some people, but a few of us have to operate on this thing called a "budget" which is, shockingly, not infinite and requires we prioritise spending. Finding out about a GW product and thinking "I can treat myself to that at next Christmas/[insert alternative festive event here]", then being disappointed when it randomly vanishes a few months later is hardly unreasonable.
Besides which - forget all the back & forth about whether or not GW was justified in removing items like this from sale entirely, or what the real point of Direct Only is if it doesn't actually result in GW keeping niche stuff up for sale: why does keeping this stuff available have to mean selling the physical objects? They're cards, so have The Office Intern spend an afternoon bodging the source files together into a print-ready PDF and give us that instead - no stock to keep on hand, no logistics to care about, and barely any effort whatsoever. I mean hell, GW used to do that with whole rulebooks and give them away for free, these days they could probably get away with selling people the cards and yet they just dump them.
There are always ways GW could keep supporting these systems, they just don't want to, and that's what folk object to.
I completely understand that people have budgets. That said, the example given was a card pack that was roughly $20 and available for a year. That isn't about budgeting for it, it is an item they wanted, never bought, and only lamented not buying it after they no longer had the option.
Both Warhammer Quest sets are still available from GW. Sure, it'd be great of GW gave stuff away for free. Most companies don't give things away for free though.
GW supports things that sell well. Even when they do that they get accused of money-grubbing. Look at Kill Team. Look at people in this thread complaining about these releases not porting into 40k proper as an Uber competitive unit. Nothing is ever enough.
The real issue here is people want every release to fulfill every need they have for their preferred gaming niche. Some things are just one-off releases to explore a concept within the universe. They are fun side games or shallower board games to cater to that market. Or they are more narrative driven expansions that focus on a theme and aren't meant to offer unlimited customization.
GW exists to sell things. They sell different experiences to get customers with a wide variety of interests. Not everything they do needs to be a super deep, continually supported products. Don't get me wong, there are some that I wish were because that's what interests me, but it doesn't interest everyone, and so it's only going to sell as much as people are interested and GW is going to respond accordingly.
Sometimes they'll be overwhelmed with a response, like SWA, and they'll work very quickly (relatively) to come back and offer a product like Kill Team. And then they get backlash for selling expansions and not offering a complete experience in the core box, and why to I have to buy more stuff to keep up, and why do these optional expansions exist, and why is GW forcing this down our throat and etc., etc. and then we're back to square one when the next release comes round.
fresus wrote: I'm quite puzzled by the timing. Normally we get next week's pre-order list on Sunday, then daily articles the following week.
On top of that, we get the occasional tease at a long term release. That's what the first Blackstone Fortress video was, and what we got yesterday with the couple lines basically saying "it's coming in the next couple months".
But here we have an article that looks exactly like the ones we have in the week leading to the pre-order. Since there isn't much to tease about this Saturday's pre-orders (just terrain packs), can we assume this article is a filler, and we'll get teases about Blackstone Fortress over the next two weeks, for a Nov 10 pre-order?
We know what's up for pre-order this weekend thanks to those who already have the new White Dwarf. No idea why GW hasn't mentioned it on Warhammer Community unless they want it to be a 'surprise'. From Lady Atia via War of Sigmar:
Spoiler:
The Scenery bundles they showed on Sunday are up for preorder next weekend, they said that in the article.
Is Silver Tower actually fun to play? I bought it for the minis. This one would have to be fun, though, with all the other minis wants me to get. Even CSM goons and hopefully some crazy =I= stuff could be bits bought (prpbably have to be quick, though) and outside of maybe Skaven-Hrud I'm not sure what I'm lacking in 40k right now.
PS: The fur/scale trophy. The tail of it is furry, so why would the rest be scales, especially painted like that?
Binabik15 wrote: Is Silver Tower actually fun to play? I bought it for the minis. This one would have to be fun, though, with all the other minis wants me to get. Even CSM goons and hopefully some crazy =I= stuff could be bits bought (prpbably have to be quick, though) and outside of maybe Skaven-Hrud I'm not sure what I'm lacking in 40k right now.
PS: The fur/scale trophy. The tail of it is furry, so why would the rest be scales, especially painted like that?
I think so. I thought it was a little easy for the players, but then I've seen other groups (including the Warhammer TV people) be abysmal at it, so maybe we were just lucky. I've never played Shadows of Hammerhal, but I'd like to.
Alternartively, Shadows of Hammerhal is the only Warhammer Quest game (currently) that does have a GM. I mean, there's only the two (the original '90s Warhammer Quest is only related by name).
Blackstone Fortress is following in Silver Tower's footsteps by having characters designed specifically for that game.
fresus wrote: I'm quite puzzled by the timing. Normally we get next week's pre-order list on Sunday, then daily articles the following week.
On top of that, we get the occasional tease at a long term release. That's what the first Blackstone Fortress video was, and what we got yesterday with the couple lines basically saying "it's coming in the next couple months".
But here we have an article that looks exactly like the ones we have in the week leading to the pre-order. Since there isn't much to tease about this Saturday's pre-orders (just terrain packs), can we assume this article is a filler, and we'll get teases about Blackstone Fortress over the next two weeks, for a Nov 10 pre-order?
We know what's up for pre-order this weekend thanks to those who already have the new White Dwarf. No idea why GW hasn't mentioned it on Warhammer Community unless they want it to be a 'surprise'. From Lady Atia via War of Sigmar:
Spoiler:
Are these the space marines that were released in Japan? The last of the non-primaris?
Yep. RIP Space Marines.
I love the Inquisitor model. I wonder if this game will have a dedicated DM role like in Shadows over Hammerhal.
Space marines for 6 euro?
Sounds like its just a holliday greetings card by the price
Binabik15 wrote: Is Silver Tower actually fun to play? I bought it for the minis. This one would have to be fun, though, with all the other minis wants me to get. Even CSM goons and hopefully some crazy =I= stuff could be bits bought (prpbably have to be quick, though) and outside of maybe Skaven-Hrud I'm not sure what I'm lacking in 40k right now.
PS: The fur/scale trophy. The tail of it is furry, so why would the rest be scales, especially painted like that?
I think so. I thought it was a little easy for the players, but then I've seen other groups (including the Warhammer TV people) be abysmal at it, so maybe we were just lucky. I've never played Shadows of Hammerhal, but I'd like to.
It depends on the characters, as there's a good span of difference in power there. I also played with friends who have been playing RPGs and strategy games for decades, making Silver Tower pretty easy. Then again, I also played a one-off game with less magnificent characters and beating the final room was very tough and required creative use of the means at hand.
I thought Silver Tower is a really neat, lighthearted game where you can have a lot of fun as long as you're not looking for a hardcore challenge or competition.
I'm kind of hoping Blackstone Fortress goes in the same direction, but maybe with a little more substance in the RPG/progression/character development department.
H.B.M.C. wrote: I'm not impressed with kits with few and fewer options. The Primaris Marines have zero options (they only have 5 poses per box).
You keep repeating this but it's still wrong. Five dynamic poses is still more than one, namely "I think I need a dump soon" squat tacticals have going on. Then you have arms, 10 different pairs doing different things, allowing you to make hundreds of unique combinations and ensuring with some thought none of your minis really look alike. The tacticals? Gee, one combination, again, clutching bolter across chest making every single one of them look downright identical (and stupid, that's not how you aim your gun, primaris poses next to that look like Delta force next to Bosnian conscript). Speaking of bolters, last time I checked three different variants is not only not zero, but more than again, one tacticals have. Really, the only thing the tacticals have over Primaris is the fact one guy in five has access to several guns instead of just grenade launcher, but if that is somehow the towering difference to you, then bravo.
Really, the only thing Primaris need right now is consolidation of all the various options they have in all SM books now into one datasheet (maybe in Primaris Codex?), release of 'Veteran' Primaris box (that will also provide some more bits you can use in regular Intercessors), and they will blow squatmarines out of the water in both rules and hobby aspects. Not bad for something that is only a year old compared to line that accrued bits and options across decades...
These new WHQ games suffer in my personal purchasing decisions from the fact that I ran a weekly, rotating cast game of the original, full Roleplay Book style, for about three straight years. All modern dungeon crawlers suffer from that, I think.
I'm sure they're nice games in their own right, but the brilliance of original Quest was that the random, AI-driven co-op mode was built into the default rules...then the full Roleplay Book (which focused on making it a GM-designed dungeon crawler board game with a campaign/character progression system, rather than an RPG-lite as so many people who never played it seem to assume) was layered on top of that. That meant the GM was utilizing the elements of the game that ran themselves, rather than co-op mode rules trying to fill in for an absent GM. Add to that the bestiary right there in the core box set that meant that any players with an evil WHFB at the time expanded your enemy sets by orders of magnitude and...yeah, I just can't get myself excited about these new ones.
Man, I wish someone could make a more modern dungeon crawler to scratch that particular set of itches.
H.B.M.C. wrote: I'm not impressed with kits with few and fewer options. The Primaris Marines have zero options (they only have 5 poses per box).
You keep repeating this but it's still wrong. Five dynamic poses is still more than one, namely "I think I need a dump soon" squat tacticals have going on. Then you have arms, 10 different pairs doing different things, allowing you to make hundreds of unique combinations and ensuring with some thought none of your minis really look alike. The tacticals? Gee, one combination, again, clutching bolter across chest making every single one of them look downright identical (and stupid, that's not how you aim your gun, primaris poses next to that look like Delta force next to Bosnian conscript). Speaking of bolters, last time I checked three different variants is not only not zero, but more than again, one tacticals have. Really, the only thing the tacticals have over Primaris is the fact one guy in five has access to several guns instead of just grenade launcher, but if that is somehow the towering difference to you, then bravo.
Really, the only thing Primaris need right now is consolidation of all the various options they have in all SM books now into one datasheet (maybe in Primaris Codex?), release of 'Veteran' Primaris box (that will also provide some more bits you can use in regular Intercessors), and they will blow squatmarines out of the water in both rules and hobby aspects. Not bad for something that is only a year old compared to line that accrued bits and options across decades...
That’s a truly impressive level of bias you have going there. Whilst you might not like the less human proportions and wide legged stance on tacticals, there’s simply zero question that a model with a posable waist and arms is more posable than one with only posable arms that comes with five fixed torso and legs as a unit builds.
I think we should keep a catalogue of all the posts that Ibris starts with some variation of "You are wrong!".
I wager it'd be a significant portion of them.
Plus regular Marines can have all sorts of variety, and can be kitbashed with almost every other Marine kit. Of course you knew that's what I was talking about. Your claims about "5 dynamic poses" don't mean anything. They have 5 poses (fewer in the boxes with only 3 minis), and almost no options compared to regular Marines. They are indicative of GW's current miniature design ethos, and somehow you seem to have missed the entire point of what I was saying to go on another "YOU ARE WRONG!" rant.
Whilst I agree that lack of variety and options is the biggest problem with the Primaris,the one-part bodies is not part of that. And I say this as a person who loves converting and customising models. Between Hellblaster and Intercessor kits you already have ten different base bodies. Making them one piece allows better details on the waist and stomach area, and those base bodies pretty much have the poses you would reasonably use already covered. And if you really need some tweaking for a very specific pose, knives exist. Primaris kits allow you to produce way better poses than more multipart tactical kits ever did.
I have to say that I was sceptical about the primaris kits as well, and I'm all about kitbashing and converting in general, but these kits are just leagues above tacticals.
It's not just the proportions, but despite the somewhat predefined poses, there is still a good amount of room to get great and diverse poses between the models.
Admittedly, there was a good amount of modelling putty, pinning and filing involved to achieve the exact poses I wanted.
well the new video has more info on the "good guys". Got the kroot fellow shown, plus the ranger. The other guys include some odd balls for sure. What kind of dude is the one with the wide hat/helmet? Looks like some kind of techno priest perhaps. Then you have the Iron Giant
Voodoo_Chile wrote: That giant suit of armour, Tech-Heretic or Squat Exo-Armour?
You're assuming it's "armour" and not someone who's given themselves over to the Machine God.
Ha that's why I covered myself with Tech-Heretic. Downloaded himself into this perfectly fashionable machine body.
It definitely has shades of a Kastelan Robot about it.
That wouldn't be a Tech-Heretic though...that would be a perfectly acceptable thing!
They weren't shown with the "Imperial loyalists" but alongside the "don't know where their loyalties lie", so tech heretic seems more likely than tech loyalist
For the love of Khaine, I was about to pass on this until I saw that.
If they are preparing to update the Kroot models, then I might actually buy the darned things for my Tau. That is an amazing looking model, and I absolutely adore the pose!
Voodoo_Chile wrote: That giant suit of armour, Tech-Heretic or Squat Exo-Armour?
You're assuming it's "armour" and not someone who's given themselves over to the Machine God.
Ha that's why I covered myself with Tech-Heretic. Downloaded himself into this perfectly fashionable machine body.
It definitely has shades of a Kastelan Robot about it.
That wouldn't be a Tech-Heretic though...that would be a perfectly acceptable thing!
They weren't shown with the "Imperial loyalists" but alongside the "don't know where their loyalties lie", so tech heretic seems more likely than tech loyalist
Voodoo_Chile wrote: That giant suit of armour, Tech-Heretic or Squat Exo-Armour?
You're assuming it's "armour" and not someone who's given themselves over to the Machine God.
Ha that's why I covered myself with Tech-Heretic. Downloaded himself into this perfectly fashionable machine body.
It definitely has shades of a Kastelan Robot about it.
That wouldn't be a Tech-Heretic though...that would be a perfectly acceptable thing!
They weren't shown with the "Imperial loyalists" but alongside the "don't know where their loyalties lie", so tech heretic seems more likely than tech loyalist
100% a Squat!... probably
Yeah I'm leaning toward Squat too. The guy with the grappling hook and muttonchops looks like a Ratling and I suspect these three are the "abhumans". A pair of Ratlings and a Squat in Exo-Armour as the abhuman Imperials. A Rogue Trader, Psyker and I'm guessing a Crusader as the "regular" human Imperials and the Eldar Ranger and Kroot as the Xenos Merc.
Not if he felt that the squishy brain was too much of a burden! In fairness I'm only thinking that due to the "...motivations remain unclear" line.
Could easily be a fine upstanding member of the cult of Mars.
I'd just like to point out that Stygies has been playing a fairly large role of late in the lore with regards to AdMech. Kill Team has not Martian forces on Vigilus, but Stygies. The Techpriest Dominus set that just got released for the Commander wave has a Stygies background with him being a member of the Xenarite cult.
Hell, the Xenarite Cult has apparently been active trying to acquire tech for the Golden Throne--I think the new AdMech codex makes a mention of them striking a compact with the Haemonculi Covens.
If ever we want to talk about a group with questionable motivations (at least to the outside world), then the Mechanicus is it...and the Xenarite Cult is a step beyond them.
I remember someone having mentioned that they heard a rumour about Ratling snipers and looking at the short guy on the left it would actually make some sense (long barrelled rifle and incredibly small height next to the robot)
Also my vote is that the robot looking thing is one of the last remaining Men of Iron. It doesn't really strike me as a battlesuit of any kind, and it also has the look of old human tech (looks like the castellan).
yeah, look at the last image.....several of the group seem to be pretty damn small
So you basically have..
Rogue Trader
2 Imperialists (tech fellow plus the guy looks like a cross between a scout and assassin)
2 Xenos (ranger and kroot)
3 questionables/abhumans? Robot, Tusken raider dude, grapple guy
bullyboy wrote: yeah, look at the last image.....several of the group seem to be pretty damn small
So you basically have..
Rogue Trader
2 Imperialists (tech fellow plus the guy looks like a cross between a scout and assassin)
2 Xenos (ranger and kroot)
3 questionables/abhumans? Robot, Tusken raider dude, grapple guy
There is a third Imperial- the guy with the staff I think.
I'm pretty sure hammerhead guy is a Navigator. It's clearly Imperium affiliated due to it being shown at that point in the narration, but it doesn't look similar to anything else IoM that we have currently.
Doesnt a lot of the lore refer to them wearing helmets and full body suits to stop people from seeing their mutations? Plus the helmet has a lens for his 3rd eye, and the cane evokes an image of nobility. Plus Navis are sort of psykers which would fill a spell caster role.
bullyboy wrote: yeah, look at the last image.....several of the group seem to be pretty damn small
So you basically have..
Rogue Trader
2 Imperialists (tech fellow plus the guy looks like a cross between a scout and assassin)
2 Xenos (ranger and kroot)
3 questionables/abhumans? Robot, Tusken raider dude, grapple guy
There is a third Imperial- the guy with the staff I think.
I think you are confusing that fellow coming down the ramp. He's the Ranger with the sniper rifle shouldered.
bullyboy wrote: yeah, look at the last image.....several of the group seem to be pretty damn small
So you basically have..
Rogue Trader
2 Imperialists (tech fellow plus the guy looks like a cross between a scout and assassin)
2 Xenos (ranger and kroot)
3 questionables/abhumans? Robot, Tusken raider dude, grapple guy
There is a third Imperial- the guy with the staff I think.
I think you are confusing that fellow coming down the ramp. He's the Ranger with the sniper rifle shouldered.
There is a third person in the "Imperials" shot, with their back to the viewer. I thought it was the same as the person coming down the ramp, but I think you are right- ramp-dude is the ranger.
bullyboy wrote: yeah, look at the last image.....several of the group seem to be pretty damn small
So you basically have..
Rogue Trader
2 Imperialists (tech fellow plus the guy looks like a cross between a scout and assassin)
2 Xenos (ranger and kroot)
3 questionables/abhumans? Robot, Tusken raider dude, grapple guy
There is a third Imperial- the guy with the staff I think.
I think you are confusing that fellow coming down the ramp. He's the Ranger with the sniper rifle shouldered.
There is a third person in the "Imperials" shot, with their back to the viewer. I thought it was the same as the person coming down the ramp, but I think you are right- ramp-dude is the ranger.
He has a strange pointed pope-like hat and what looks to be a mace. Maybe it's a new Imperial missionary?
The other Imperial guy with the halo could be a new crusader.
This group already look better than the Killteam one.
Dunno, they look like mercs of some sort. The fella on the left reminds me of the Forgeworld renegades. Another option for the two mercs and the big robot is something that reminded me that appeared in Imperial Armour 9 in the Tyrants Legion list - Heretek squad with a brute.
bullyboy wrote: yeah, look at the last image.....several of the group seem to be pretty damn small
There is a third person in the "Imperials" shot, with their back to the viewer. I thought it was the same as the person coming down the ramp, but I think you are right- ramp-dude is the ranger.
Guy with the back turned sure looks Mechanicus. Look at his staff head; sort of the gear-axe we are used to.
So it seems there are three sub-factions presented in the video:
"some still hold true to the ideals of the Imperium..."
- Hammerhead guy (navigator/tech priest?)
- Crusader/Electro Priest
- Ecclesiarchy Priest with his back turned (pope hat seems like a giveaway)
"...species who mankind has seen fit to cooperate with in the past..."
- Eldar/ Exodite Ranger
- Kroot Mercenary
"... those of some considerable use but with unclear motivations..."
This one is the hardest. I doubt the big guy is a Kastelan, because they would probably be attributed to the Imperial faction. I expect these to be Hive Scum or possibly deserters, maybe retired veterans from the Imperial army, looking for the big haul. Big guy might be a Squat or Demiurg in Exo Armor
Grappling hook dude appears to have a Scion breastplate. Doesn't appear to be a Squat judging from his proportions. Guy in the left ooks like fairly generic sniper at first glance, but the Eldar Ranger already covers that archetype, so it might be a Heavy Stubber or something similar instead.
BertBert wrote: Guy in the left ooks like fairly generic sniper at first glance, but the Eldar Ranger already covers that archetype, so it might be a Heavy Stubber or something similar instead.
He's a most likely Scion, the mask and the rolled sleeping mat on his pack give it away. As for role, he could have more mobility/shots/armor penetration than the sniper while having less range/power per shot, it doesn't really look like a heavy stubber to me.
BertBert wrote: Guy in the left ooks like fairly generic sniper at first glance, but the Eldar Ranger already covers that archetype, so it might be a Heavy Stubber or something similar instead.
He's a most likely Scion, the mask and the rolled sleeping mat on his pack give it away. As for role, he could have more mobility/shots/armor penetration than the sniper while having less range/power per shot, it doesn't really look like a heavy stubber to me.
He doesn't actually seem to be wearing a Scion "mask". Those two seem to be the Ratlings that have been mentioned--if you look, he seems to be wearing goggles ala Marine Scouts.
BertBert wrote: Guy in the left ooks like fairly generic sniper at first glance, but the Eldar Ranger already covers that archetype, so it might be a Heavy Stubber or something similar instead.
He's a most likely Scion, the mask and the rolled sleeping mat on his pack give it away. As for role, he could have more mobility/shots/armor penetration than the sniper while having less range/power per shot, it doesn't really look like a heavy stubber to me.
He doesn't actually seem to be wearing a Scion "mask". Those two seem to be the Ratlings that have been mentioned--if you look, he seems to be wearing goggles ala Marine Scouts.
Furthermore if you check the last image (where the group is show from the backs over a cliff) you can notice 2 normal figures at left the robot (wich towers like 2 head above the normal figures) and another 2-3 forms being half the size of the figures so halflings/Squats size for sure.
Moral ambiguity is basically the ratlings’ “hat” too, so it makes sense with the narrative. Besides, any dungeon crawler party needs a thief, and what makes a better thief for a space dungeon than a space halfling?
Also makes sense that the guy with the hammerhead shark head is a psyker of some sort. We need a wizard. We already have two rangers (Eldar and Kroot). Iron halo/space stormcast and the big robot are clearly the fighters of the group.
The priest fellow is also holding a power mace (crozius?) by the looks of it. I think the big robot is some form of Tau personally, with the 'intentions unclear' thing because they're on a mission to understand technology to destroy warp creatures better due to recent events in the timeline directly and indirectly impacting on the Tau considerably.
Hammerhead is shown in the show with the narration saying that “there aresome that hold true with the ideals of the imperial”
No weapons so a psyker and as he has 3 eyes in his mask I think he might be a navigator.
Last group with unknown motives I think are squats (looks smaller than the rest in the cliff image) with the big one being a squat in exoarmour.
The big thing looks utterly.unlike.a Tau battlesuit. Legs aren't digitigrade and the backpack bit it all blocky with no.signs of.Tau powerpack or jumpjets. I remember a discussion here a whole.back centred about the idea that there was a bunch of Kastellans wandering about the galaxy on their own. It's almost like GW is mining Dakka for ideas
Guy with the iron halo in his head - new Crusader
Hammerhead guy - no clue
Guy with the mace and hat behind them - new priest model
I'm thinking the guy with the halo and respirator isn't a Crusader, but rather a Witchfinder. It's a thing that's been mentioned in lore in the past but never saw a model.
Both could also be 'minders' if the hammerhead guy is in fact a Navigator.
Then we have a bounty hunter with a grappling hook
and a bounty hunter with a sniper rifle
Ratlings. They're wearing Auxilia styled armor(it's the same gear the Tempestus and Bullgryns both have--along with the new Rogue Trader stuff) and the one not in shadow has the mutton chops they like to give Ratlings.
and the big robot...
MAN OF IRON
Yeah...the Men of Iron are dead. You really are better off thinking that it's AdMech.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Flinty wrote: The big thing looks utterly.unlike.a Tau battlesuit. Legs aren't digitigrade and the backpack bit it all blocky with no.signs of.Tau powerpack or jumpjets. I remember a discussion here a whole.back centred about the idea that there was a bunch of Kastellans wandering about the galaxy on their own. It's almost like GW is mining Dakka for ideas
That discussion comes from the actual AdMech codex and the fluff on the Kastelans.
This is getting very exciting pretty fast. I have to admit I was expecting a group of an =I=, Rogue Trader, a Primaris Lieutnant and some guard vets or tech priest as the party. Maybe an Exodite. Then they go full "weird alien bar" on us!
I hope that they did their homework and the Kroot is really strong close quarter fighter thanks to its muscle structure despite looking scrawny. He/She could be a all-rounder type. Leveling up wasn't permanent in Silver Tower, right? A nice and easy Zombicide-like progression that has the Kroot able to skill either melee or ranged would be nice. Or a throwback to the old Kroot Merc dex, having him grow wings after snacking on some gargoyles or a muscle-bound freak after tasting (tainted) Astartes geneseed.
Flinty wrote: The big thing looks utterly.unlike.a Tau battlesuit. Legs aren't digitigrade and the backpack bit it all blocky with no.signs of.Tau powerpack or jumpjets. I remember a discussion here a whole.back centred about the idea that there was a bunch of Kastellans wandering about the galaxy on their own. It's almost like GW is mining Dakka for ideas
I'm not saying you are wrong by any means, but if you were a tau engineer and had to make a battlesuit that could lone wolf by itself without the support of tau infrastructure to keep it going, would you make it like a typical tau battlesuit, or something a bit easier to maintain?
Flinty wrote: The big thing looks utterly.unlike.a Tau battlesuit. Legs aren't digitigrade and the backpack bit it all blocky with no.signs of.Tau powerpack or jumpjets. I remember a discussion here a whole.back centred about the idea that there was a bunch of Kastellans wandering about the galaxy on their own. It's almost like GW is mining Dakka for ideas
I'm not saying you are wrong by any means, but if you were a tau engineer and had to make a battlesuit that could lone wolf by itself without the support of tau infrastructure to keep it going, would you make it like a typical tau battlesuit, or something a bit easier to maintain?
I'd still expect anything Tau to resemble their general aestetics, even if it's part of a board game. GW wants factions to be recognizable and having Tau looking like Admech would be rather unintuitive.
Might still be a one-off special character kind of deal, but I doubt it. Why would the Tau be seperate from the Kroot? One would expect them to be connected in some way. My money is still on Squats or Demiurg.
Flinty wrote: The big thing looks utterly.unlike.a Tau battlesuit. Legs aren't digitigrade and the backpack bit it all blocky with no.signs of.Tau powerpack or jumpjets. I remember a discussion here a whole.back centred about the idea that there was a bunch of Kastellans wandering about the galaxy on their own. It's almost like GW is mining Dakka for ideas
I'm not saying you are wrong by any means, but if you were a tau engineer and had to make a battlesuit that could lone wolf by itself without the support of tau infrastructure to keep it going, would you make it like a typical tau battlesuit, or something a bit easier to maintain?
Why would you make anything? You have the Stealth Suit--or Shadowsun's suit.
I'm backing the theory that giant robot dude is a squat in Exo Armour. The tech looks very human, but lacks the skulls and aquilas and gothic touches of Imperial/Admech Tech. It looks like a mix between a Terminator, a Kastellian and a old time diving suit.
Moreover, it's grouped with the Abhumans and rogues, not the Xenos, which I feel removes the possibility of it being Tau or a new species.
So to me, it's either a Squat (same root technology as humans) or a very wealthy merc.
But I really, really really hope they break the mould with this game. Not literally of course. That would suck. Just figuratively.
Use the first 40k Quest, where there’s not so many ‘background’ characters in plastic, to go back to the old old Quest Character Boxes.
They’ve shown potential with the Commanders for Kill Team. Just needs a subtle rebranding of the boxes, and a swap out of the cardboard gubbins for rules and suitable counters.
Why? Well, my little Thunderbird Puppet, I’ll tell you.
This. This is the chance and indeed GW have needed to show us some new Xenos, without a massive cost sink their end. They don’t even need to find a particular tactical niche necessary to flog a whole range.
Give us the flotsam and jetsam of minor Xenos species. They may only occupy a solar system or two, and therefore have no business appearing in 40k proper. That’s for the big boys.
But the Galaxy is a big place, as they continually tell us. This is a golden opportunity to not only support 40Quest in the future, but give us shiny spangle new.
Leggy wrote: I'm backing the theory that giant robot dude is a squat in Exo Armour. The tech looks very human, but lacks the skulls and aquilas and gothic touches of Imperial/Admech Tech. It looks like a mix between a Terminator, a Kastellian and a old time diving suit.
Moreover, it's grouped with the Abhumans and rogues, not the Xenos, which I feel removes the possibility of it being Tau or a new species.
So to me, it's either a Squat (same root technology as humans) or a very wealthy merc.
Leggy wrote: I'm backing the theory that giant robot dude is a squat in Exo Armour. The tech looks very human, but lacks the skulls and aquilas and gothic touches of Imperial/Admech Tech. It looks like a mix between a Terminator, a Kastellian and a old time diving suit.
Moreover, it's grouped with the Abhumans and rogues, not the Xenos, which I feel removes the possibility of it being Tau or a new species.
So to me, it's either a Squat (same root technology as humans) or a very wealthy merc.
I just want one thing, and it's a pipe dream. I think it's well beyond the purview of GW nowdays - but why not produce a quality game with a lot of depth in one box. I know that's no longer suitable business to most companies - in the land of DLC, expansions, card packs, etc...but is it too much to ask for a genuinely good, deep, engrossing boxed game?
I think, judging by the somewhat minimalistic board-game style WHQ titles we received, we'll get nothing of the sort.
I'd love to be proven wrong. Let me open the box and find a 150-page "Roleplay" book like we had in the original Warhammer Quest. Finally bring back some actual meat on the bones of that original game (which was fantastic).
Flinty wrote: It would be a major reimagining of exo armour if it is. It's huge, when the original stuff was basically a Faberge egg full of angry space dwarf.
True, but it would not be the first time a RT era concept got a massive makeover.
I wanna see what the Ranger looks like, and that weird guy with the three glowing eyes. The game has to have at least one psyker player character, so odds are it's that guy.
It'd be nice to get rules for the RT models as well. Running through a Quest style game as a Void Master or a Death Cult Assassin would be fun.
Kroot looks like Kroot. Could make a fine Shaper. I approve.
Elbows wrote: I just want one thing, and it's a pipe dream. I think it's well beyond the purview of GW nowdays - but why not produce a quality game with a lot of depth in one box. I know that's no longer suitable business to most companies - in the land of DLC, expansions, card packs, etc...but is it too much to ask for a genuinely good, deep, engrossing boxed game?
From GW? Yes.Way too much.
Elbows wrote: I think, judging by the somewhat minimalistic board-game style WHQ titles we received, we'll get nothing of the sort.
I'd love to be proven wrong. Let me open the box and find a 150-page "Roleplay" book like we had in the original Warhammer Quest. Finally bring back some actual meat on the bones of that original game (which was fantastic).
Being a bit technical instead of going into GW policies, does GW even have staff with the time to spare to write such an extensive book? They're releasing army books at breakneck speed, but also very obviously at the expense of quality.
It seems if you wanted something like that, you'd be looking at Forge World/Specialist Games whose job it is to dedicate a lot of time to their stuff. But even there, looking at Necromunda in particular, it's DLC all the way with a very bare bones starter game.
Haighus wrote: Could the big model be an armoured ogryn? Like the FW ogryns in space suits.
I want it to be a Squat, but I like this option as well. If only because the Rogue Trader can't be sure of the Ogryn's intentions because the Ogryn isn't quite sure of them himself.
The other characters look interesting, pretty happy with the kroot as well. Only thing is an apparent lack of female characters which is a bummer for a multiplayer game like this. I was hoping for a sister of battle but it looks like that might not happen. I expect the tiles or board for this game to be gorgeous too.
H.B.M.C. wrote: It'd be nice to get rules for the RT models as well. Running through a Quest style game as a Void Master or a Death Cult Assassin would be fun.
Kill Team and WHQ40K have a lot of potential for piggybacking on each others releases. Even the WHQ floor tiles could be used as a close quarters Killzone. It would be nice if Shadespire had helped GW to get over there aversion to giving board games ongoing support.
Thargrim wrote: The other characters look interesting, pretty happy with the kroot as well. Only thing is an apparent lack of female characters which is a bummer for a multiplayer game like this. I was hoping for a sister of battle but it looks like that might not happen. I expect the tiles or board for this game to be gorgeous too.
Well, there's the Aeldari Ranger as female. Potentially the Navigator-ish character and a Ratling as well.
I think a Sister of Battle was too much to ask for, since they don't tend to wander around by themselves do they?
Thargrim wrote: The other characters look interesting, pretty happy with the kroot as well. Only thing is an apparent lack of female characters which is a bummer for a multiplayer game like this. I was hoping for a sister of battle but it looks like that might not happen. I expect the tiles or board for this game to be gorgeous too.
Well, there's the Aeldari Ranger as female. Potentially the Navigator-ish character and a Ratling as well.
I think a Sister of Battle was too much to ask for, since they don't tend to wander around by themselves do they?
And the Kroot, plus I think we've got a bunch of villains to come too.
Elbows wrote: I just want one thing, and it's a pipe dream. I think it's well beyond the purview of GW nowdays - but why not produce a quality game with a lot of depth in one box. I know that's no longer suitable business to most companies - in the land of DLC, expansions, card packs, etc...but is it too much to ask for a genuinely good, deep, engrossing boxed game?
For GW, it probably is not within their business model (though Blitz Bowl is pretty nice for an all-in-one experience). I would suggest picking up FFG's Forbidden Stars and/or Chaos in the Old World for a complete and deep, single-purchase "GW" experience.
Really happy with the selection of adventures. They have mostly avoided the obvious choices. I hope the enemies show a similar imagination.
Slightly worried that the tiles will just be a bunch of black rooms.
This is all shaping up to be a very exciting game. I guess we will get a look at the enemies next.
Chikout wrote: Really happy with the selection of adventures. They have mostly avoided the obvious choices. I hope the enemies show a similar imagination.
Slightly worried that the tiles will just be a bunch of black rooms.
This is all shaping up to be a very exciting game. I guess we will get a look at the enemies next.
The adventurers are good, but the 2 renegades seem a little basic. Sure, one might be a ratling, but then we have 3 snipers? Or a ratling that isn't a sniper and instead has a grapple gun? Seems odd. That's being a little nitpicky, though. This set has me all kinds of excited overall.
I would expect the tiles to mostly be a bunch of black rooms. Judging by the Imperial Shrine board included in the Rogue Trader box they can make a fairly plain floor look really good with minis on it.
I'm curious with the rumors of CSMs in the box means we'll only have Chaos or more variety. I'm torn as I'd love some more Chas cultists done with the current model quality, but solely chaos might be a bit dull after multiple play throughs. Then again tossing in a few random Necrons or Drukhari, or whatever might feel like a weird mishmash as well. Hopefully we'll see some stand alone "renegade" xenos races though.
Elbows wrote: I just want one thing, and it's a pipe dream. I think it's well beyond the purview of GW nowdays - but why not produce a quality game with a lot of depth in one box. I know that's no longer suitable business to most companies - in the land of DLC, expansions, card packs, etc...but is it too much to ask for a genuinely good, deep, engrossing boxed game?
I think, judging by the somewhat minimalistic board-game style WHQ titles we received, we'll get nothing of the sort.
I'd love to be proven wrong. Let me open the box and find a 150-page "Roleplay" book like we had in the original Warhammer Quest. Finally bring back some actual meat on the bones of that original game (which was fantastic).
I am 100% behind you on this. For someone who slowly collects, paints, organizes games and starts playing them in a matter of years not weeks, these new games seem barely worth the trouble. I had just about tooled up for Shadow War when it had disappeared. Haven't really gotten into Necromunda for the same reason.
Chikout wrote: Really happy with the selection of adventures. They have mostly avoided the obvious choices. I hope the enemies show a similar imagination.
Slightly worried that the tiles will just be a bunch of black rooms.
This is all shaping up to be a very exciting game. I guess we will get a look at the enemies next.
The adventurers are good, but the 2 renegades seem a little basic. Sure, one might be a ratling, but then we have 3 snipers? Or a ratling that isn't a sniper and instead has a grapple gun? Seems odd. That's being a little nitpicky, though. This set has me all kinds of excited overall.
I would expect the tiles to mostly be a bunch of black rooms. Judging by the Imperial Shrine board included in the Rogue Trader box they can make a fairly plain floor look really good with minis on it.
I'm curious with the rumors of CSMs in the box means we'll only have Chaos or more variety. I'm torn as I'd love some more Chas cultists done with the current model quality, but solely chaos might be a bit dull after multiple play throughs. Then again tossing in a few random Necrons or Drukhari, or whatever might feel like a weird mishmash as well. Hopefully we'll see some stand alone "renegade" xenos races though.
I'm expecting mostly chaos, though some chaos xenos would be interesting.
As long as they aren't yet more Nurgle gribblies. Between the 8th ed starter and Rogue Trader, there's been way more than enough.
Elbows wrote: I just want one thing, and it's a pipe dream. I think it's well beyond the purview of GW nowdays - but why not produce a quality game with a lot of depth in one box. I know that's no longer suitable business to most companies - in the land of DLC, expansions, card packs, etc...but is it too much to ask for a genuinely good, deep, engrossing boxed game?
I think, judging by the somewhat minimalistic board-game style WHQ titles we received, we'll get nothing of the sort.
I'd love to be proven wrong. Let me open the box and find a 150-page "Roleplay" book like we had in the original Warhammer Quest. Finally bring back some actual meat on the bones of that original game (which was fantastic).
I am 100% behind you on this. For someone who slowly collects, paints, organizes games and starts playing them in a matter of years not weeks, these new games seem barely worth the trouble. I had just about tooled up for Shadow War when it had disappeared. Haven't really gotten into Necromunda for the same reason.
Likewise. the short lived SWA was a bit sour. Haven't invested into Necromunda or Kill Team because they won't last long term. Happy to be wrong though - the continued releases of BB has given me hope that their specialty games will have longevity.
Here's hoping BFG is on the cards for their next major release
Chikout wrote: Really happy with the selection of adventures. They have mostly avoided the obvious choices. I hope the enemies show a similar imagination.
Slightly worried that the tiles will just be a bunch of black rooms.
This is all shaping up to be a very exciting game. I guess we will get a look at the enemies next.
The adventurers are good, but the 2 renegades seem a little basic. Sure, one might be a ratling, but then we have 3 snipers? Or a ratling that isn't a sniper and instead has a grapple gun? Seems odd. That's being a little nitpicky, though. This set has me all kinds of excited overall.
I would expect the tiles to mostly be a bunch of black rooms. Judging by the Imperial Shrine board included in the Rogue Trader box they can make a fairly plain floor look really good with minis on it.
I'm curious with the rumors of CSMs in the box means we'll only have Chaos or more variety. I'm torn as I'd love some more Chas cultists done with the current model quality, but solely chaos might be a bit dull after multiple play throughs. Then again tossing in a few random Necrons or Drukhari, or whatever might feel like a weird mishmash as well. Hopefully we'll see some stand alone "renegade" xenos races though.
I think that the ratlings might be a dual character, in the sense that a player that choose them control both of them
I think that the ratlings might be a dual character, in the sense that a player that choose them control both of them
That's an interesting idea, but then we're looking at one less character functionally in the set. I really hope we can port over the other Rogue Trader characters too. I like the variety shown so far, but I'm still left wanting more.
Silver Tower included cards for four additional heroes in the rulebook (which were subsequently released as a box set), and added thirty-odd via the app and in the card pack Thargrim missed out on. Then you can use any of the ones subsequently added for Shadows of Hammerhal. Hopefully this will be similar.
After the hype generated around Blackstone fortress coming from the potential Abaddon model, multiple sources have chimed in with the contents inside, and
Abaddon isn’t coming… yet
Sadly, it looks like Abaddon may not be in the box despite rumors to the contrary.
However, there’s still some value to it. This is what we can look for on the Chaos side of things:
New Chaos Lord (last one is from 2005)
Chaos Marines
Renegade Guardsmen-type models.
Abaddon might not be coming inside but a new Lord model on top of a new Renegade Guardsmen-esque squad in plastic sounds just about as nice. Will we see Plastic Renegade squads come out shortly after Blackstone? Who knows. That’s also not to say that Abaddon won’t be getting a new model yet either.
After the hype generated around Blackstone fortress coming from the potential Abaddon model, multiple sources have chimed in with the contents inside, and
Abaddon isn’t coming… yet
Sadly, it looks like Abaddon may not be in the box despite rumors to the contrary.
However, there’s still some value to it. This is what we can look for on the Chaos side of things:
New Chaos Lord (last one is from 2005)
Chaos Marines
Renegade Guardsmen-type models.
Abaddon might not be coming inside but a new Lord model on top of a new Renegade Guardsmen-esque squad in plastic sounds just about as nice. Will we see Plastic Renegade squads come out shortly after Blackstone? Who knows. That’s also not to say that Abaddon won’t be getting a new model yet either.
AndrewGPaul wrote: So where are these rumours saying Abaddon was in this game? Were they on Spikey Bits?
Probably there wa some Rumours about a new Abaddon in a new starter set in Vigilus (orks vs Black legion if i recall) but Abby on Blackstone a Stand alone side game.. never had any chance.
After the hype generated around Blackstone fortress coming from the potential Abaddon model, multiple sources have chimed in with the contents inside, and
Abaddon isn’t coming… yet
Sadly, it looks like Abaddon may not be in the box despite rumors to the contrary.
However, there’s still some value to it. This is what we can look for on the Chaos side of things:
New Chaos Lord (last one is from 2005)
Chaos Marines
Renegade Guardsmen-type models.
Abaddon might not be coming inside but a new Lord model on top of a new Renegade Guardsmen-esque squad in plastic sounds just about as nice. Will we see Plastic Renegade squads come out shortly after Blackstone? Who knows. That’s also not to say that Abaddon won’t be getting a new model yet either.
Man, I really really hope the Chaos Marine box isn't pure monopose...that'd suck so bad for Chaos players lol. You know GW would say "whaaaat, we gave you your new troop box, you're good for another 25 years right? Just use them alongside the monopose DV chosen, you know, those models you can totally get your hands on still.
The stuff coming in Blackstone Fortress proper is supposed to be Dark Imperium style monopose--possibly with a few swappable bits(there's a couple of Death Guard models that can have Boltguns OR Plasma Guns if I remember right), with an Intercessor/Death Guard style box coming later.
Modern monopose is far better than those pseudo multipose stuff from way up to the 2010ers. Let's be honest the posability was most often due to the arms and heads which fare to often resulted in wonky poses. Commonly seen red multipose are weapon options that are still existent in monopose. What's not on the sprue can be swapped in by minor conversion as it saß with so-called multipose models
Bloodmaster wrote: Modern monopose is far better than those pseudo multipose stuff from way up to the 2010ers.
Nope.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Permission to wee myself laughing if today's reveal shows it's not Chaos forces you're up against in Blackstone?
I'd like there to be Necrons, just because I want more Necrons, but all things considered Chaos is the go to force for a Blackstone Fortress after the Gothic war. Maybe we'll even see a bit of Slaanesh in there* now that it's Slaanesh's time for a revamp.
Really, though, didn't GW actually confirm Chaos Marines in a seminar? I think we can safely rule out any surprises for the main opposing force, but I guess there's always the little additions like Scuttlings and the Skaven assassin in Silver Tower.
Me, I just want a mission with a Keeper of Secrets in the final room and the ability to play Eldrad. For old times' sake.
*Yeah, no worries, it'll be Nurgle because we haven't had Nurgle yet
Stormonu wrote: The “good guys” have my interest, but if they throw in Chaos like the did with Rogue Trader, I will probably pass. Especially if it is Nurgle, again.
Rumor points towards "generic" CSM--themed around Black Legion.
Which, y'know, makes sense since the Black Legion have been actively hunting the Blackstone Fortresses.
Stormonu wrote: The “good guys” have my interest, but if they throw in Chaos like the did with Rogue Trader, I will probably pass. Especially if it is Nurgle, again.
Rumor points towards "generic" CSM--themed around Black Legion.
Which, y'know, makes sense since the Black Legion have been actively hunting the Blackstone Fortresses.
It would be really cool if GW made the game less Blackstone Fortress with Black Legion inside and more graveyard of technology which happens to be located around a Blackstone Fortress to widen the scope of the game. I had a blast with Silver Tower, but the scenario was pretty limited. I'd prefer a more open setting to allow questing with and against different models without feeling too silly. Probably not going to happen, since it's more classic RPG and less board game with specific scenario, but one can at least hope given they moved a little in that direction with Hammerhal.
Also, today's Warhammer Community post seems a little late. I hope they don't skip today. I want to see new stuff!
The Blackstone Fortress is more than just a backdrop to your adventures in Warhammer Quest, but a participant in them – and it will not hesitate to try and stop you. Here’s a look at one of its mechanical minions, a Spindle Drone:
Definitely a Space Crusade style hodge podge then. No exclusive Chaos force. The video goes on about previous parties and other denizens trapped in it. Excellent!
zedmeister wrote: Definitely a Space Crusade style hodge podge then. No exclusive Chaos force. The video goes on about previous parties and other denizens trapped in it. Excellent!
Man, with the comment about previous people seeking the tech and others taken involuntary--pluss the BSF itself, we can possibly face anything. I can see small Kill Teams (3-10 minis) of factions known and unknown who you will have to fight through.
That's a snoozefest right there...but still interested by the game. The video does show that one of the characters is definitely a ratling/squat though. Not that there was much doubt.
You know, in hindsight, hopefully this release will finally silence jokers claiming GW does the garbage, blurry leaks that ruin surprise and necessitate rushed WC articles to control damage. This is how GW wants to do releases - building hype, showing new, surprising bits, making people talk. Terrible picture did by potato camera does nothing but makes the captured stuff look bad, and after WC drops good photo to fix that, future articles on the topic become kinda pointless.
Now I wonder if WC planned to do something similar for speed freaks, animations and all, only for some troll in Chinese warehouse to spoil whole thing and cause such plans to be binned after two emergency articles. IIRC, every single box release since at least Overkill had animation devoted to it, except for the spoiled ones that is...
Galas wrote: Is this the first piece of proper Ancestral technology we see made miniature? This aesthetic is not very much warhammer but it looks phenomenal.
Well, we did have a miniature for the Blackstone Fortress for BFG...
Galas wrote: Is this the first piece of proper Ancestral technology we see made miniature? This aesthetic is not very much warhammer but it looks phenomenal.
Galas wrote: Is this the first piece of proper Ancestral technology we see made miniature? This aesthetic is not very much warhammer but it looks phenomenal.
Irbis wrote: You know, in hindsight, hopefully this release will finally silence jokers claiming GW does the garbage, blurry leaks that ruin surprise and necessitate rushed WC articles to control damage. This is how GW wants to do releases - building hype, showing new, surprising bits, making people talk. Terrible picture did by potato camera does nothing but makes the captured stuff look bad, and after WC drops good photo to fix that, future articles on the topic become kinda pointless.
Now I wonder if WC planned to do something similar for speed freaks, animations and all, only for some troll in Chinese warehouse to spoil whole thing and cause such plans to be binned after two emergency articles. IIRC, every single box release since at least Overkill had animation devoted to it, except for the spoiled ones that is...
IMO, this is probably GW cracking down on leaks hardcore. I'll bet that this box set isn't being manufactured in China, no interns are handling the miniatures and accidentally putting them on display, no mini builders are throwing the sprues away in the trash for some guy to dumpster dive for.
I think that GW is doing their best to get a handle on these sorts of leaks and I think this release has shown that they're finally able to do just that. Else we would have heard about these drones a year ago.
We’ve always kind of assumed they were built by The Old Ones, or by the ancient Eldar.
Now either could still be true, I’m not being immediately revisionist.
But.
We know The Old Ones crested species. What if these were the labours of one such species, long since extinct? That’s a whole new level of fluff for us to dive into.
This is very NOT the "hey, lets release some updated version of stuff from decades ago, nostalgia sells" approach they've been doing alot lately. Damn. BF is getting mighty interesting it seems.
And Renegade Guard? Please be awesome greatcoat! And lots of them!
Not entirely sure we’ll be seeing Renegade Guard here. From the wording, it’s suggestive that the adversaries are part of the Fortress, rather than others trying to take control of it.
But only suggestive. We may see Chaos involved after all. But going on today’s stuff, I rather fear SB is talking bolspit. Again.
I can't say I was expecting robots and drones as enemies. Were the Blackstone Fortresses ancient human constructs from the Golden Age, or did they come from a different alien species?
Barzam wrote: I can't say I was expecting robots and drones as enemies. Were the Blackstone Fortresses ancient human constructs from the Golden Age, or did they come from a different alien species?
Eldar God Vaul made them during the War in Heaven.
The Eldar refer to them as Talismans of Vaul. Clearly in reference to the Crippled God.
But. That’s just part of their mythic cycle. So I’m not massively comfortable saying that’s definitely the truth. Especially after The Fall. Consider how The Imperium misrecalls elements of The Dark Age Of Technology.
So I think it’s safe to say the ancient Eldar at least knew of them. And may well have been able to exploit them as a resource in ages past. Yet none of that suggest they actually built them.
Well my mind is blown and full of questions after seeing this little(?) guy.
Pre fall Eldar or Old one tech? Given there shared history is there really much difference?
Are there more types in the full game? Will these be Blackstones main opponents like Silver towers Tzaangors and Kairic acolytes? Or will they be its Spider grots and Skaven?
Will we see them appear outside of the boxed game and on the "regular" tabletop? If so will they be there own faction or tied to one of the Eldar groups?
This is shaping up to be the most exciting release for me in years. After the new Rogue Trader I was afraid the designs would put me off, but so far everything they showed looks ace.
The spindle drone and the living fortress do have a Necron-y vibe about them - maybe we can expect a new spin on these guys following this release...
I guess I'm the only one who isn't intrigued at all by the drone. The last thing I want or need is yet another race in 40K. If it's just a simple baddy for a board game, that'd be fine...but we don't need another non-Necron droid/bot race. I'd have much preferred other miniatures I can use in a variety of 40K settings to slightly more obscure stuff.
Also don't much care for the look of it, so there's that
The Eldar refer to them as Talismans of Vaul. Clearly in reference to the Crippled God.
But. That’s just part of their mythic cycle. So I’m not massively comfortable saying that’s definitely the truth. Especially after The Fall. Consider how The Imperium misrecalls elements of The Dark Age Of Technology.
So I think it’s safe to say the ancient Eldar at least knew of them. And may well have been able to exploit them as a resource in ages past. Yet none of that suggest they actually built them.
Myths can be based on long forgotten truths. Vaul for example, could have been the name of a physical being who either ascended or as the stories changed with each successive retelling over time became remembered as an Aeldari god.
That's the funny thing for me in that the fortresses themselves have a very Necron look what with all the pyramids, but the fluff has them as being used against the ctan. A bit more exploration, figuratively and indeed with figures, of them will be fun.
The info trickle is in full swing!!! Loving every minute of it, and all that I have seen so far. I wonder if this exploration of the game will continue through next week.... Anyhow, it seems like there is so much more to be revealed and I can’t wait to see the rival team of chaos pawns exploring the fortress revealed.
Based on precedent, I would expect all WQBSF models to get 40k rules. But these don't fit in any current faction.
I'm keep telling people that once we get beyond the GSC and Sisters releases, we're going to see tons of stuff.
World Eaters, Emperor's Children, Primaris, Old Ones, Kroot, Demiurge. I think all of these will enter the game in full force over the next 2-4 years along side new models for all existing factions.
The Eldar refer to them as Talismans of Vaul. Clearly in reference to the Crippled God.
But. That’s just part of their mythic cycle. So I’m not massively comfortable saying that’s definitely the truth. Especially after The Fall. Consider how The Imperium misrecalls elements of The Dark Age Of Technology.
So I think it’s safe to say the ancient Eldar at least knew of them. And may well have been able to exploit them as a resource in ages past. Yet none of that suggest they actually built them.
Myths can be based on long forgotten truths. Vaul for example, could have been the name of a physical being who either ascended or as the stories changed with each successive retelling over time became remembered as an Aeldari god.
That really doesn't fit the origin story of Eldar gods though.
Oh my god, thats a really interesting and potentially fluff-changing mini right there, What the heck is it? Obviously not Necron? Old-one race or helper?
All GW:s big boxes of late has been must-buys for me, but this (and Necromunda) has to take the hype-reward. (Rouge trader looked great but had very little game play)
Loving the exploration of the marigins and odd stuff of 40K instead of just the marines and huge armies!
The Eldar refer to them as Talismans of Vaul. Clearly in reference to the Crippled God.
But. That’s just part of their mythic cycle. So I’m not massively comfortable saying that’s definitely the truth. Especially after The Fall. Consider how The Imperium misrecalls elements of The Dark Age Of Technology.
So I think it’s safe to say the ancient Eldar at least knew of them. And may well have been able to exploit them as a resource in ages past. Yet none of that suggest they actually built them.
Myths can be based on long forgotten truths. Vaul for example, could have been the name of a physical being who either ascended or as the stories changed with each successive retelling over time became remembered as an Aeldari god.
That really doesn't fit the origin story of Eldar gods though.
And hence my statement that the more time that has passed the more the story of 'what actually happened' can change. We may be getting the 'in-universe' origin story of the Eldar gods from the 41st millennium which may be considerably different from an 'in-universe' origin story of the Eldar gods as it happened.
I don't see that it really has to be some mega-fluff changing item though - if we look at the Horus Heresy era, they wiped out hundreds if not thousands of species, races, etc. All of which could have been a 40K army. Space is fething big...as are its inhabitants. A new species shouldn't be fluff-breaking...but just a common occurence. The presence of it aboard a Blackstone Fortress gives its a bit more import, barely.
Elbows wrote: I don't see that it really has to be some mega-fluff changing item though - if we look at the Horus Heresy era, they wiped out hundreds if not thousands of species, races, etc. All of which could have been a 40K army. Space is fething big...as are its inhabitants. A new species shouldn't be fluff-breaking...but just a common occurence. The presence of it aboard a Blackstone Fortress gives its a bit more import, barely.
It wouldn't necessarily be changing any established fluff just expanding it for a different time period which may have contradictory 'in-universe facts' as compared to the 'in-universe facts' of the 41st millennium.
partisan_nick wrote: Oh my god, thats a really interesting and potentially fluff-changing mini right there, What the heck is it? Obviously not Necron? Old-one race or helper?
All GW:s big boxes of late has been must-buys for me, but this (and Necromunda) has to take the hype-reward. (Rouge trader looked great but had very little game play)
Loving the exploration of the marigins and odd stuff of 40K instead of just the marines and huge armies!
I passed on Rouge Trader, all the vigilis stuff just out of personal choice. But I am definitely wanting to see more of this.
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Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Not entirely sure we’ll be seeing Renegade Guard here. From the wording, it’s suggestive that the adversaries are part of the Fortress, rather than others trying to take control of it.
But only suggestive. We may see Chaos involved after all. But going on today’s stuff, I rather fear SB is talking bolspit. Again.
If memory serves from the August WF, we know from the Q&A that the new CSM Marine Sclupts are in this box.
**Madly clicking "Do you wish to know more, Citizen?"**
That drone greatly intrigues me. So far, they've got my interest. Waiting for the curveball, though. Always seems they get *so close* and then shoot themselves, somehow.
Elbows wrote: I guess I'm the only one who isn't intrigued at all by the drone. The last thing I want or need is yet another race in 40K. If it's just a simple baddy for a board game, that'd be fine...but we don't need another non-Necron droid/bot race. I'd have much preferred other miniatures I can use in a variety of 40K settings to slightly more obscure stuff.
Also don't much care for the look of it, so there's that
Nah the last thing we need is more Marine codexes ! but guess what. several Chaos ones alone to come if not a Prmaris one.
I think it it is interesting, enjoying these models as much as the Rogue Trader ones
Honestly I hope they don't go for some big blowout "...but here's what REALLY HAPPENED! WOW!!!!1" thing. For one, because I don't think the studio guys could handle something that big without help from the better BL writers without descending into Wardian farce, but also because it's not really necessary; we know the Old Ones experimented with creating different races, and based on the Orks we know they could be quite inventive/mental - why would they limit themselves to creating only organic life? Maybe we've not seen these things before because the Old Ones' enemies destroyed them on the Blackstones the Imperium had previously found. Maybe their experiments with artificial sentience went horribly awry and were sealed away in a handful of isolated Blackstones, and the rest were built to be controlled by organics.
Regardless, the point is there are plenty of hooks in the existing material to tease out and expand upon, they need to go back to expanding on those(and seeding new ones) rather than this "SURPRISE! [Special Character You've Never Heard Of Before With Upcoming Big Model Kit] has done a thing, NEW FACTION!" thing they tried with Primaris.
Tyranid Horde wrote: Does anyone know the release date for this? I need an excuse for someone to get me this as a Christmas present! Safe to say I'm now very excited.
Tyranid Horde wrote: Does anyone know the release date for this? I need an excuse for someone to get me this as a Christmas present! Safe to say I'm now very excited.
Kanluwen wrote:Didn't the Eldar, pre-fall, have artificial intelligences?
It'd be kind of cool for this to be a look at the empire that was--kinda like how they billed the Visarch.
Pretty sure they did, they had/have weapons to snuff out suns and towards the end, common labour wasn't really a thing they did with the exception of Exodite Eldar. I don't have any source on that other than the 4th Ed codex though.
He looks a little small to be a marine, but that rebreather and bald head setup does hearken back to a specific head on the old marine sprue (without service studs).
The armor and shoulder pads are completely wrong for any sort of marine, however. (A lot closer to chaos marauder armor from Fantasy).
But he's definitely being included as a loyalist to the ideals of the Imperium. Death cultist or minor league assassin? Someone with access to an Iron Halo, however.
Voss wrote: He looks a little small to be a marine, but that rebreather and bald head setup does hearken back to a specific head on the old marine sprue (without service studs).
The armor and shoulder pads are completely wrong for any sort of marine, however. (A lot closer to chaos marauder armor from Fantasy).
But he's definitely being included as a loyalist to the ideals of the Imperium. Death cultist or minor league assassin? Someone with access to an Iron Halo, however.
Maybe the Iron Halo is just literally an iron halo and not the device with the energy shield.
Yodhrin wrote: Regardless, the point is there are plenty of hooks in the existing material to tease out and expand upon, they need to go back to expanding on those(and seeding new ones) rather than this "SURPRISE! [Special Character You've Never Heard Of Before With Upcoming Big Model Kit] has done a thing, NEW FACTION!" thing they tried with Primaris.
I think we should just be happy that the first really new thing in 40K in quite a while doesn't have an absurdly obnoxious name.
It's just called a "Spindle Drone", rather than, "Spindlegrab Mechnodrone" or "Spindlelithe Droneserver" or some other such nonsense.
Yodhrin wrote: Regardless, the point is there are plenty of hooks in the existing material to tease out and expand upon, they need to go back to expanding on those(and seeding new ones) rather than this "SURPRISE! [Special Character You've Never Heard Of Before With Upcoming Big Model Kit] has done a thing, NEW FACTION!" thing they tried with Primaris.
I think we should just be happy that the first really new thing in 40K in quite a while doesn't have an absurdly obnoxious name.
It's just called a "Spindle Drone", rather than, "Spindlegrab Mechnodrone" or "Spindlelithe Droneserver" or some other such nonsense.
That's how you know it's REALLY ancient. From the time before they ran out of names that had real words in them.
Just to add to the rumour mill (won't give source), but was told that reason that nobody has really seen the box or contents yet is because it has one specific miniature that they don't want to reveal right now. My guess is probably the main antagonist to the explorers. Make of that what you will.
partisan_nick wrote: Oh my god, thats a really interesting and potentially fluff-changing mini right there, What the heck is it? Obviously not Necron? Old-one race or helper?
You've seen the article? Well, you're as much of an expert as anyone else. What do you think?
Didn't it say something about a 'malign and sentient intelligence '? I'm wondering if the Blackstone Fortress itself is an A.I. I don't think it has been suggested previously, but maybe the ones so far encountered were 'dead', and this one is how they are supposed to work.
The figure they don't want to reveal is probably a Squat imo. And it may be the big robot, or a different miniature.
IIRC they are dormant and need the right tools (the Eye and Hand) to be reactivated properly. Could be misremembering things, but before it got retconned Eldrad was killed by one when he tried to connect with it through psychic means, only for the fortress to respond with an overwhelming force and turn him into crystal.
Its from the future!
GW is opening up for Ordo Chronos to make time jump alternate timelines.
Now they can have Terra invaded and just go back in time and undo it.
Also, thats how they bring back Sanguinius.
bullyboy wrote: Just to add to the rumour mill (won't give source), but was told that reason that nobody has really seen the box or contents yet is because it has one specific miniature that they don't want to reveal right now. My guess is probably the main antagonist to the explorers. Make of that what you will.
I have a feeling that will be a squat in Exo armour, or I am hoping anyway, I also reckon that iron halo is one of the new CSM .
Fayric wrote: Its from the future!
GW is opening up for Ordo Chronos to make time jump alternate timelines.
Now they can have Terra invaded and just go back in time and undo it.
Also, thats how they bring back Sanguinius.
Erm... I kinda love this idea:-\ I'm not sure I'm supposed to but it would have some crazy stuff
bullyboy wrote: Just to add to the rumour mill (won't give source), but was told that reason that nobody has really seen the box or contents yet is because it has one specific miniature that they don't want to reveal right now. My guess is probably the main antagonist to the explorers. Make of that what you will.
I have a feeling that will be a squat in Exo armour, or I am hoping anyway, I also reckon that iron halo is one of the new CSM .
The image is introduced while the narrator is mentioning the imperial loyalists so I doubt that.
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote: GW community on Facebook implying that the halo figure is a space marine but I'm not buying it :
If that was a cog instead of a halo, I'd say that looks like some kind of tech priest or electro priest. Maybe an Inquisitor? A chaplain without power armor?
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote: GW community on Facebook implying that the halo figure is a space marine but I'm not buying it :
If that was a cog instead of a halo, I'd say that looks like some kind of tech priest or electro priest. Maybe an Inquisitor? A chaplain without power armor?
When I look at that pic I see a Stormcast Eternal with a rebreather.
bullyboy wrote: Just to add to the rumour mill (won't give source), but was told that reason that nobody has really seen the box or contents yet is because it has one specific miniature that they don't want to reveal right now. My guess is probably the main antagonist to the explorers. Make of that what you will.
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote: GW community on Facebook implying that the halo figure is a space marine but I'm not buying it :
If that was a cog instead of a halo, I'd say that looks like some kind of tech priest or electro priest. Maybe an Inquisitor? A chaplain without power armor?
When I look at that pic I see a Stormcast Eternal with a rebreather.
Why? Side by side, every (visible) armor element is quite distinct. Halo is different, shoulder pads are different, giant chest spike on the front of the armor is non-existent on the stormcast, who has a gorget the mystery character lacks.
AndrewGPaul wrote: I'd assumed something like the Crusader Inquisitorial acolyte, or some sort of fanatic of an obscure Imperial cult.
The character might have an aesthetic that is similar to some new units/designs for Sisters perhaps? That is possibly why we can't immediately identify it but latch on to certain iconic similarities.
bullyboy wrote: Just to add to the rumour mill (won't give source), but was told that reason that nobody has really seen the box or contents yet is because it has one specific miniature that they don't want to reveal right now. My guess is probably the main antagonist to the explorers. Make of that what you will.
It's the miniature of a Primarch that they'll find imprisoned in the end chamber.
bullyboy wrote: Just to add to the rumour mill (won't give source), but was told that reason that nobody has really seen the box or contents yet is because it has one specific miniature that they don't want to reveal right now. My guess is probably the main antagonist to the explorers. Make of that what you will.
It's the miniature of a Primarch that they'll find imprisoned in the end chamber.
Haighus wrote: It's gone 4 with no new hint. I feel impatient lol.
Might be, we are "spared" from the fortress as we might see a full reveal tomorrow evening. Keep calm and trust in the wisdom of the eternal corpse God this imps call a God
With the first update to a Guard style model this is going to be the hottest selling box ever.
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bullyboy wrote: Interesting.
So some beastmen, a ghoul of some kind, traitor guard, 3 chaos marines (1 being some kind of Lord), and then something in the vault.
What do you figure the daemon types at the end are?
Great looking game in the scheme of the Rogue Trader box. I'll be picking up one of these, that's for sure. Add in a couple of warbands, and have them fight for the prize as I add in space hulk and Kill team tiles...
I love the concept of adding games like this to a 40K game so there is some meaning to the fight. Already had a great combo with kill team using the temple board from the Rogue Trader set as a DA kill team infiltrated the crypts (randomly emerged from the crypt spaces) taking on a chaos kill team with the leader being a Fallen. On the 40K table, Chaos forces tried to hold back the Ravenwing/Deathwing force reaching the temple to acquire their goal. Was a lot of fun.
Automatically Appended Next Post: OMG, that model is epic, and answered the question above about who they are
Maybe the designers are having some fun, cutting loose and doing things that don't work too well in 40K proper. Then again maybe they are throwing stuff onto the wall and seeing what sticks. Interesting times...
Looks like the explorers will be getting a lot more than they bargained with. Here’s just one of the new enemy models from the set – a mysterious Negavolt Cultist:
Spoiler:
Negavolt Cultists express their heretical devotion by despoiling machinery and corrupting the function of sacred technologies through daemonic invocations and abstruse rituals. Such cults can often be found on planets controlled by the Adeptus Mechanicus.
Hmm. My interest has definitely picked up for this!
Much more intrigued now that we've guaranteed not just facing silly drones. Unfortunately my CSM army is made from non-CSM models, but I'll pick it up for the characterful good guys anyway.
1 Chaos Lord
2+ Chaos Space Marines
2+ Beastmen
Some Negavolt Cultists
Some Renegade Guards
1 Cultist Master (with the staff) ?
1 Ur-Ghul ?
I count at least 8 guardsmen in the last shot (so probably 10). Maybe 5 cultists. The marines are certainly not the style of the previous release, which is interesting.
Okay, so this looks like the forces in this box are :
Chaos: Chaos Lord, 2 Chaos Marines, Weird Drone things, a couple beastmen, a couple negavolt cultists, a handful of renegade cultists, Cultist leader guy, Ur-ghul.
Good Guys: Rogue Trader, Kroot, Eldar Ranger, 5 various henchmen, Giant Robot Dude.
As these two side are supposed to be equal-ish, I have to wonder how powerful the Robot Guy is to balance things. A Rogue Trader is good, but not Chaos Lord good. The rest of the henchmen would be about as good as the cultists and Negavolts. That means the Robot Guy is about equal to two Chaos Marines, an Ur-Ghul, the drones, and needs to pick up the slack from the Rogue Trader/Chaos Lord fight.
Are we sure that that's a Chaos Lord in the video? He looks a little under-dressed by 40kHQ standards, almost more like an aspiring champion.
I know this is mostly the hype talking but if Bullyboy is right and there's a big mind blowing surprise, I wonder if the Chaos force will be led by a Dark Mech Magos.
After all it wouldn't be unreasonable for someone like Abbadon to send Dark Mech in order to try controlling the BST.
I guess we'll find out this weekend judging by the WarCom post.
cuda1179 wrote: Okay, so this looks like the forces in this box are :
Chaos: Chaos Lord, 2 Chaos Marines, Weird Drone things, a couple beastmen, a couple negavolt cultists, a handful of renegade cultists, Cultist leader guy, Ur-ghul.
Good Guys: Rogue Trader, Kroot, Eldar Ranger, 5 various henchmen, Giant Robot Dude.
As these two side are supposed to be equal-ish, I have to wonder how powerful the Robot Guy is to balance things. A Rogue Trader is good, but not Chaos Lord good. The rest of the henchmen would be about as good as the cultists and Negavolts. That means the Robot Guy is about equal to two Chaos Marines, an Ur-Ghul, the drones, and needs to pick up the slack from the Rogue Trader/Chaos Lord fight.
This is a co-op dungeon crawler. There is no reason to assume the forces will be equal size. In fact there should be a ton more adversaries than characters, as it won't always be the same adversaries in each mission.
I hope with all my heart all those Chaos guys announce a Codex : The Lost and the Damned (based on the Eye of terror campaign concepts), in the same way "Silver Tower" announced the Disciples of Tzeentch new units.
There is so much cool stuff from the past of 40k coming back those days (Squat, Necromunda, Rogue Traders, Sisters of Battle, etc. etc.) that it wouldn't surprise me to see them back one way or another.
When I said Chaos Lord I really meant Chaos character (just Lord used as general term). Basically somebody a step up from the other two as he's obviously occupying the throne.
Now, if there is still a reveal (as my source indicated), it could be the Chaos Lord, or it could possibly be the contents of the vault, but maybe not actually in the box. Maybe they find a Primarch in stasis for example (or something else), that is then released as a model following Blackstone (just that the game gives away the model so not shown to people at this time). No idea.
I just can't imagine that they'd release such a major model in a boxed game.
As a secondary note, I'm less excited today than I was yesterday. The drones offered something unique and I was excited to see what came next. However, it just turned out to be more chaos stuff instead.
silent25 wrote: No god specific symbols and the red hues in the Chaos Marine shot make me think and hope for Word Bearers. Please let it be Word Bearers
What appears to be a hammer makes me think Warpsmith...
The game models are looking really cool. I hope that for this or Kill Team we see a Inquisition expansion. An Inquisitor (or multiples) with some Storm troopers/acolytes. And of course multiple kit options for all.
Well my mind is blown and full of questions after seeing this little(?) guy.
