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Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/05 21:11:42


Post by: Dynas


I think the Crisis suits are being overrated. Its not like you couldn't get +1 to hit from 5 markerlights before. Nothing has really changed unless you are trying to use them to hit a unit out of LoS of your markerlight sources.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/06 00:45:20


Post by: Mud Turkey 13


 Dynas wrote:
I think the Crisis suits are being overrated. Its not like you couldn't get +1 to hit from 5 markerlights before. Nothing has really changed unless you are trying to use them to hit a unit out of LoS of your markerlight sources.


What makes it interesting is that you can use it on something castled in your opponent's deployment zone that is most likely out of range of your markerlights. Now, you can markerlight something threatening your lines and destroy that with your castle, AND you can drop this strat on something in the opponent's backfield to wipe it out with the Crisis Suits that just landed back there from Manta Hold. So, instead of them protecting their castle by threatening your lines you have eliminated the threat to your lines and you have damaged their castle. They then have to choose to try and attack your lines again or deal with the Crisis Team in their backfield. Like I said before, I don't think it is game breaking, but it gives you some fun things to do with your Crisis Teams finally.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/06 03:34:04


Post by: Yaktan


Yeah, getting 5 marks on stuff is not necessarily a given, especially stuff that is not in your face. And while crisis suits may have their issues, a 4 man cib-bomb with a commander dropping in with them and spending 5 cp will average a dead imperial knight (needs to be Farsight enclaves for full combo). It is something I have thought about building, but I am too wedded to my Shadowsun stealth castle. I am thinking I will add a third squad of stealth suits, who will bring the retired shield drones, to keep up the numbers of drones after we get the new Shadowsun.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/07 20:59:40


Post by: Blndmage


I'm really hoping they give something to Kroot.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/07 21:08:47


Post by: Xenomancers


 carldooley wrote:
The Strat can only be used in your shooting phase.
EWO would still prevent cents from deploying withing your range. They would not survive the initial intercept and then charge damage. A few would but not enough to kill you - if you have any supporting fire they are done.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/08 04:52:10


Post by: davou


Anyone have the release date for greater good? I cant find it anywhere


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/08 13:28:53


Post by: Kanluwen


It's preorders today at 1pm Eastern, releases next Saturday(February 15th).


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/08 21:34:18


Post by: BoomWolf


Well, previews are on youtube.

Crisis suits got SO MUCH LOVE
Doubly so if you are FSE.
Heck, FSE in general got a TON of goodies.


A bonus sept tennet (+1 virtual markerlight against targets within 12")
Good relics (talisman is awesome 5++ without taking a system slot is great. deny is just icing)
Great strats (veteran cadre make all other crisis stratagems pale in comparison)
Even good objectives, for everyone who is playing proper malestorm.
BEST OF ALL-TWO COMMANDERS PER DETACHMENT!

You won't get the sheer insanity of custom septs though-and I kid you not, most of the options are by themselves superior to entire sept.
Hardened Warheads (-1AP with missile pods, HYMP, SMS ans seeker missiles) makes missilesides into sheer insanity.
Other gems include Hybrid Weaponry (+4" assault guns, deep strike in fusion range,), Stabalization Systems (walk and shoot without penalty), Command Net (reroll wounds of 1 against people who are markerlit) possibly up-gunned (-1AP for burst cannon weapons. maybe a spam list can make something out of this?)


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/08 21:52:04


Post by: Sterling191


Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhh my.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/08 23:22:52


Post by: ZergSmasher


FSE should get Crisis Suits as Troops like the old days. Did they in fact get this?

That said, I do look forward to seeing what's in the book (I'll look at a review later).


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 00:24:27


Post by: small_gods


Has anyone got a clear idea how the signature weapon systems work? Are they a relic or do you pay with points or are they 1 cp each with no limits or just one per army??


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 01:43:25


Post by: Matt.Kingsley


 small_gods wrote:
Has anyone got a clear idea how the signature weapon systems work? Are they a relic or do you pay with points or are they 1 cp each with no limits or just one per army??


You can take 1 Prototype System in the place of your free Signiture System at no cost in points/CP.
From what I've read online, it's unclear whether you can replace Signiture System(s) you get from the codex Stratagem as well.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 09:09:15


Post by: small_gods


 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
 small_gods wrote:
Has anyone got a clear idea how the signature weapon systems work? Are they a relic or do you pay with points or are they 1 cp each with no limits or just one per army??


You can take 1 Prototype System in the place of your free Signiture System at no cost in points/CP.
From what I've read online, it's unclear whether you can replace Signiture System(s) you get from the codex Stratagem as well.


Cheers, there's s few thst look really good, would like to at least squeeze the ignore ap 1 and 2 and the ion accelerator one into a list. They seem much better than the codex signature systems.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 10:23:22


Post by: BoomWolf


Well, the biggest selling point is that they apply for an entire unit if applicable.

But the ignore ap1/2 on a stormsurge could be quite neat. Assuming you can justify a stormsurge.
The ion accelerator is cute
The rail rifles are also attractive.

Not sure if they are better than signature systems though.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 11:34:26


Post by: Matt.Kingsley


I thought the ignore AP1/2 Prototype System was limited to Battlesuits? I could be remembering wrong though.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 12:56:39


Post by: BoomWolf


No, it's limited to someone who has an AFP
That happens to be one of the optional secondary weapons for the surge


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 14:51:13


Post by: John Prins


I have a sudden urge to paint red Crisis Suits and Breachers. 2 Commanders per detachment, Veteran Crisis units with BS3+ via Strat, +1 Markerlight within 12", Re-roll wounds within 6". Farsight Enclaves are gonna be nutty.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 15:10:53


Post by: small_gods


 BoomWolf wrote:
No, it's limited to someone who has an AFP
That happens to be one of the optional secondary weapons for the surge


Stormsurge with 6+ fnp and ignore ap 1 and 2 is pretty handy at 340 ish points.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 16:37:35


Post by: tneva82


Ap ignoring seems to be common for gw. Gw's way of countering the ridiculous firepower increase? Rock paper scissor to 2nd degree


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 17:35:55


Post by: BoomWolf


 small_gods wrote:
 BoomWolf wrote:
No, it's limited to someone who has an AFP
That happens to be one of the optional secondary weapons for the surge


Stormsurge with 6+ fnp and ignore ap 1 and 2 is pretty handy at 340 ish points.



Eeer, where is he getting the FnP from?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 17:43:47


Post by: yellowfever


tneva82 wrote:
Ap ignoring seems to be common for gw. Gw's way of countering the ridiculous firepower increase? Rock paper scissor to 2nd degree


Seems like every topic I go to you're in it bitching about GW.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 17:58:09


Post by: Kanluwen


tneva82 wrote:
Ap ignoring seems to be common for gw. Gw's way of countering the ridiculous firepower increase? Rock paper scissor to 2nd degree

Frankly, it's not common enough.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 18:44:44


Post by: carldooley


 BoomWolf wrote:
 small_gods wrote:
 BoomWolf wrote:
No, it's limited to someone who has an AFP
That happens to be one of the optional secondary weapons for the surge


Stormsurge with 6+ fnp and ignore ap 1 and 2 is pretty handy at 340 ish points.



Eeer, where is he getting the FnP from?


Ethereals and Shadowsun's new drone can confer FnP.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 21:40:39


Post by: Yaktan


The drone, yes, however the Ethereals are limited to battlesuit and infantry.

For the wound re-roll tenant, I thought I saw one about vehicles/monsters getting wound re-rolls, is there also one for re-roll wounds vs. markerlit targets, or is it both conditions? Can anyone confirm details?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 22:08:11


Post by: happy_inquisitor


 John Prins wrote:
I have a sudden urge to paint red Crisis Suits and Breachers. 2 Commanders per detachment, Veteran Crisis units with BS3+ via Strat, +1 Markerlight within 12", Re-roll wounds within 6". Farsight Enclaves are gonna be nutty.


Crisis Suits suddenly got good again. They still die really easily but while alive they may just be devastating.

Combo Veterans with either Drop Zone Clear or the new Coordinated Engagement for fully reliable shooting - such a world away from the literally hit-or-miss BS4+ they come with stock. So long as you have either CP or markerlights to support them they will surpass the shooting efficiency of Commanders.

I have some nice red Crisis Suits sitting on my shelf. Time to play boys and girls.

The gangbusters secondary might hold them back in ITC but I think FLG knows that there are problems with the secondaries which need looking at. Outside of ITC I see no reason not to try building some lists around FSE with crisis suits.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 22:32:18


Post by: Blndmage


I haven't been able to find out what Kroot got, anything good?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 22:41:44


Post by: small_gods


 Blndmage wrote:
I haven't been able to find out what Kroot got, anything good?


They get to heroically intervene 6" for 1 cp. Krootox got a decent strat to make their fists-2AP and rerol hit roll (i think).


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 23:35:22


Post by: happy_inquisitor


 Blndmage wrote:
I haven't been able to find out what Kroot got, anything good?


A strat to give them -1 to hit and +1 save in cover

Another strat to heroically intervene from 6" away.

Shaper got a 1CP upgrade to give nearby Kroot an extra dice on advance and charge rolls all game, discard lowest

Krootox got a 1CP strat to double their attacks and give them AP-2 punches. They are credible primaris killers now, although still got that tissue paper armour save.

Not what I expected but that heroic intervention is one of those odd things that sometimes will just win you the game by negating a whole lot of pile-in/consolidate or fight twice trickery your opponent had planned.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/09 23:46:04


Post by: Blndmage


happy_inquisitor wrote:
 Blndmage wrote:
I haven't been able to find out what Kroot got, anything good?


A strat to give them -1 to hit and +1 save in cover

Another strat to heroically intervene from 6" away.

Shaper got a 1CP upgrade to give nearby Kroot an extra dice on advance and charge rolls all game, discard lowest

Krootox got a 1CP strat to double their attacks and give them AP-2 punches. They are credible primaris killers now, although still got that tissue paper armour save.

Not what I expected but that heroic intervention is one of those odd things that sometimes will just win you the game by negating a whole lot of pile-in/consolidate or fight twice trickery your opponent had planned.


Thank you!
Would Dal'yth still be the best bet for an all Kroot force, since it gives the FtGG?
Looks like max Krootox and Hounds is still a go!


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/10 00:12:11


Post by: John Prins


happy_inquisitor wrote:
 Blndmage wrote:
I haven't been able to find out what Kroot got, anything good?


A strat to give them -1 to hit and +1 save in cover

Another strat to heroically intervene from 6" away.

Shaper got a 1CP upgrade to give nearby Kroot an extra dice on advance and charge rolls all game, discard lowest

Krootox got a 1CP strat to double their attacks and give them AP-2 punches. They are credible primaris killers now, although still got that tissue paper armour save.

Not what I expected but that heroic intervention is one of those odd things that sometimes will just win you the game by negating a whole lot of pile-in/consolidate or fight twice trickery your opponent had planned.


Sounds like the best thing the Kroot got was the points drop in Chapter Approved. At least sitting in cover and shooting is Kroot appropriate, they were never a hard hitting combat unit.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/10 08:47:46


Post by: happy_inquisitor


 Blndmage wrote:


Thank you!
Would Dal'yth still be the best bet for an all Kroot force, since it gives the FtGG?
Looks like max Krootox and Hounds is still a go!


I am not sure FtGG is that big a deal on Kroot, although it could be quite good on Krootox. In an all-kroot force I guess that is your best option; allowing for the fact that an all-kroot force is already not your best option.

Krootox are still a mediocre shooting unit but they are now a fairly capable combat unit so long as you can feed them 1CP per turn. 12 attacks S5 AP-2 D2 hitting on 3+ is as good as close combat gets for the Tau codex and they are not a lot of points since CA19.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/10 11:23:56


Post by: smurfORnot


So is heavy suit army viable now?
I might be tempted to go with them, TAU were my 1st army ever(back in 3rd when I played), and I always liked whole mecha theme.

I was kinda sad when reading tactics that crisis were kinda bad and not worth it.
I do love commander suit model, and now it's viable to have multiple of them?



Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/10 15:11:23


Post by: Dynas


I am a bit disappointed that we have to give up our relic for the Prototype signature systems. Why cant we have 1 of each or pay CP for it like marines. Oh wait, not daddys favorite. Cant get the Puretide chip and a Prototype system.

I see FSE coming into the fold with crises sutis for sure, but I don't think its gonna be taking the place of the current tau ITC tourney list.

Getting with 12" is dangerous, you are basically always fighting at rapid fire range for marines, and they can move and and get a 6" charge, with the 17 attacks on 5 guys. Its a dangerous game to be playing.

I do like the breacher strat where then can get there close range profile at 15".



Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/10 16:55:30


Post by: small_gods


 Dynas wrote:
I am a bit disappointed that we have to give up our relic for the Prototype signature systems. Why cant we have 1 of each or pay CP for it like marines. Oh wait, not daddys favorite. Cant get the Puretide chip and a Prototype system.

I see FSE coming into the fold with crises sutis for sure, but I don't think its gonna be taking the place of the current tau ITC tourney list.

Getting with 12" is dangerous, you are basically always fighting at rapid fire range for marines, and they can move and and get a 6" charge, with the 17 attacks on 5 guys. Its a dangerous game to be playing.

I do like the breacher strat where then can get there close range profile at 15".



You can still pay for extra signature systems with the standard codex steat so you can effectively get one for 1cp. It's not clear if you can have 2 prototype systems yet though?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/10 18:10:59


Post by: Dracarys


FSE will be especially good to slot in as a supreme command to get the extra commander and the deny. I'm thinking of slotting it into my triptide list personally.

Has anybody seen what the nova profile of the prototype ion cannon is? It it just Heavy 6 D3+D3 or does it get more shots?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/10 18:23:40


Post by: Unusual Suspect


 BoomWolf wrote:
No, it's limited to someone who has an AFP
That happens to be one of the optional secondary weapons for the surge


Well, yes, but actually no.

It is ALSO limited to someone who has an AFP, but it explicitly calls out "BATTLESUIT model with airbursting fragmentation projector only" in the text.

Notably, only a single model. I don't think any of the other battlesuits except Commanders and Crisis Suits have an AFP.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/10 18:27:44


Post by: small_gods


Dracarys wrote:
FSE will be especially good to slot in as a supreme command to get the extra commander and the deny. I'm thinking of slotting it into my triptide list personally.

Has anybody seen what the nova profile of the prototype ion cannon is? It it just Heavy 6 D3+D3 or does it get more shots?


It's -4 ap and 3 plus d3. Sp its6a pretty solid upgrade.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/10 18:28:10


Post by: Sterling191


Dracarys wrote:
FSE will be especially good to slot in as a supreme command to get the extra commander and the deny. I'm thinking of slotting it into my triptide list personally.

Has anybody seen what the nova profile of the prototype ion cannon is? It it just Heavy 6 D3+D3 or does it get more shots?


Heavy 6, 72", S9 AP-4 3+d3 Damage while overcharging.

Using the Nova reactor on it has no effect.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/10 19:37:35


Post by: small_gods


Sterling191 wrote:
Dracarys wrote:
FSE will be especially good to slot in as a supreme command to get the extra commander and the deny. I'm thinking of slotting it into my triptide list personally.

Has anybody seen what the nova profile of the prototype ion cannon is? It it just Heavy 6 D3+D3 or does it get more shots?


Heavy 6, 72", S9 AP-4 3+d3 Damage while overcharging.

Using the Nova reactor on it has no effect.


I think running one of each will be pretty effective, you can bnc the heavy burst cannon and just use the nova reacator on the ion accelerator to get them both at 3++ and plenty of damage.

What are people's thoughts on the custom septs? I'm liking the look of the stabalisation systems and gifted pilots for some mobility once kayun and drones are gone.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/10 19:41:01


Post by: Dracarys


 small_gods wrote:
Sterling191 wrote:
Dracarys wrote:
FSE will be especially good to slot in as a supreme command to get the extra commander and the deny. I'm thinking of slotting it into my triptide list personally.

Has anybody seen what the nova profile of the prototype ion cannon is? It it just Heavy 6 D3+D3 or does it get more shots?


Heavy 6, 72", S9 AP-4 3+d3 Damage while overcharging.

Using the Nova reactor on it has no effect.


I think running one of each will be pretty effective, you can bnc the heavy burst cannon and just use the nova reacator on the ion accelerator to get them both at 3++ and plenty of damage.

What are people's thoughts on the custom septs? I'm liking the look of the stabalisation systems and gifted pilots for some mobility once kayun and drones are gone.


Stabilization systems is the most obvious one I think. The missile one looks really good as it buffs a lot of things in the army. With that tenet I think there's a place for missile-sides in competitive play, but they're still somewhat expensive points-wise.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/11 04:55:44


Post by: ZergSmasher


Dracarys wrote:
 small_gods wrote:
Sterling191 wrote:
Dracarys wrote:
FSE will be especially good to slot in as a supreme command to get the extra commander and the deny. I'm thinking of slotting it into my triptide list personally.

Has anybody seen what the nova profile of the prototype ion cannon is? It it just Heavy 6 D3+D3 or does it get more shots?


Heavy 6, 72", S9 AP-4 3+d3 Damage while overcharging.

Using the Nova reactor on it has no effect.


I think running one of each will be pretty effective, you can bnc the heavy burst cannon and just use the nova reacator on the ion accelerator to get them both at 3++ and plenty of damage.

What are people's thoughts on the custom septs? I'm liking the look of the stabalisation systems and gifted pilots for some mobility once kayun and drones are gone.


Stabilization systems is the most obvious one I think. The missile one looks really good as it buffs a lot of things in the army. With that tenet I think there's a place for missile-sides in competitive play, but they're still somewhat expensive points-wise.

Points cost is not really what makes me not like Broadsides currently, as their firepower is pretty ridiculous for their cost. What I don't like about them is that they lack the FLY keyword and so can get bad-touched and shut down. They are also slow-moving. In games where I've taken them, they've felt like kind of an anchor on my list, preventing me from moving much. With more mobile lists involving just Riptides and Commanders, I feel like I can actually contest the board a little without leaving important units out in the cold, out of range of my opponent's stuff.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/11 06:17:48


Post by: Jancoran


Take kroot and kroot hounds. Thats what I do.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/11 06:59:44


Post by: BoomWolf


 Unusual Suspect wrote:
 BoomWolf wrote:
No, it's limited to someone who has an AFP
That happens to be one of the optional secondary weapons for the surge


Well, yes, but actually no.

It is ALSO limited to someone who has an AFP, but it explicitly calls out "BATTLESUIT model with airbursting fragmentation projector only" in the text.

Notably, only a single model. I don't think any of the other battlesuits except Commanders and Crisis Suits have an AFP.


Oh, it does?
Sucks. No memesurge for me then.

Still can be useful of your veteran cadre tank.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/11 14:32:21


Post by: Dynas


 small_gods wrote:
 Dynas wrote:
I am a bit disappointed that we have to give up our relic for the Prototype signature systems. Why cant we have 1 of each or pay CP for it like marines. Oh wait, not daddys favorite. Cant get the Puretide chip and a Prototype system.

I see FSE coming into the fold with crises sutis for sure, but I don't think its gonna be taking the place of the current tau ITC tourney list.

Getting with 12" is dangerous, you are basically always fighting at rapid fire range for marines, and they can move and and get a 6" charge, with the 17 attacks on 5 guys. Its a dangerous game to be playing.

I do like the breacher strat where then can get there close range profile at 15".



You can still pay for extra signature systems with the standard codex steat so you can effectively get one for 1cp. It's not clear if you can have 2 prototype systems yet though?


Wait.. so I can take my Puretide Chip AND a prototype relic?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/11 15:22:35


Post by: Sterling191


 Dynas wrote:

Wait.. so I can take my Puretide Chip AND a prototype relic?


Barring an FAQ that precludes the additional relics stratagem, yes. Likewise there's nothing in the wording that I can see that explicitly precludes exchanging multiple purchased relics for multiple prototype systems.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/11 15:28:00


Post by: Mud Turkey 13


Sterling191 wrote:
 Dynas wrote:

Wait.. so I can take my Puretide Chip AND a prototype relic?


Barring an FAQ that precludes the additional relics stratagem, yes. Likewise there's nothing in the wording that I can see that explicitly precludes exchanging multiple purchased relics for multiple prototype systems.


What is the wording for it?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/11 15:33:53


Post by: Sterling191


 Mud Turkey 13 wrote:

What is the wording for it?


"Rather than giving one of your Characters a signature system you may instead select a Prototype System for one Tau Empire unit in your army".

Order of operations with extra relics IMO allows for multiple swap outs. The wording is effectively identical to the way Special Issue Wargear relics are handled by the Marine supplements.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/11 15:39:25


Post by: Mud Turkey 13


Sterling191 wrote:
 Mud Turkey 13 wrote:

What is the wording for it?


"Rather than giving one of your Characters a signature system you may instead select a Prototype System for one Tau Empire unit in your army".

Order of operations with extra relics IMO allows for multiple swap outs. The wording is effectively identical to the way Special Issue Wargear relics are handled by the Marine supplements.


I agree with you. Obviously, they may change it, but as it stands I would say you can still spend the command points to get extra Signature Systems which could be turned into Prototype Systems. If they wanted to totally eliminate the Signature Systems with the use of Prototype Systems it should say, "Rather than giving any of your Characters a signature system you may instead select a Prototype System for one Tau Empire unit in your army."


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/11 15:57:49


Post by: small_gods


 Mud Turkey 13 wrote:
Sterling191 wrote:
 Mud Turkey 13 wrote:

What is the wording for it?


"Rather than giving one of your Characters a signature system you may instead select a Prototype System for one Tau Empire unit in your army".

Order of operations with extra relics IMO allows for multiple swap outs. The wording is effectively identical to the way Special Issue Wargear relics are handled by the Marine supplements.


I agree with you. Obviously, they may change it, but as it stands I would say you can still spend the command points to get extra Signature Systems which could be turned into Prototype Systems. If they wanted to totally eliminate the Signature Systems with the use of Prototype Systems it should say, "Rather than giving any of your Characters a signature system you may instead select a Prototype System for one Tau Empire unit in your army."


I think it's definitely intended to be a non character relic. It's just worded in a slightly unusual way. I'll be taking the ion accelerator and the ghostkeel deepstrike denial relic in a game tonight!


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/11 17:58:24


Post by: Dynas


Typical GW wording.



Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/12 11:10:44


Post by: Babar_babar


I understand that you can have up to 3 prototypes (using 3CP for the 2 extra relic strat)

I yesterday night had a game and used, the new Ion accelerator (which is one of the best antitank in the game I fell), the deepstrike denial on a gostkeel (I was playing against BA so it was very handy), and the new markerlights (on a big pathfinder unit on a sacea detachment to use their strat to be able to move, shoot the markers without penalty, and then move to out of LOS).

The 3 were funny to use, and i think that the new ION would make it into a lot of competitive lists


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/12 12:45:37


Post by: small_gods


Babar_babar wrote:
I understand that you can have up to 3 prototypes (using 3CP for the 2 extra relic strat)

I yesterday night had a game and used, the new Ion accelerator (which is one of the best antitank in the game I fell), the deepstrike denial on a gostkeel (I was playing against BA so it was very handy), and the new markerlights (on a big pathfinder unit on a sacea detachment to use their strat to be able to move, shoot the markers without penalty, and then move to out of LOS).

The 3 were funny to use, and i think that the new ION would make it into a lot of competitive lists


I used it last night also vs Dukari. It is the Ivan Drago of relic weapons, I managed to do 18 wounds to a raider with no marker lights!


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/12 12:56:23


Post by: Sterling191


Taking the Ion Cannon and the Ghostkeel SuperFusion relics into a 1k match tomorrow. We'll see how they do.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/12 15:17:39


Post by: Babar_babar


 small_gods wrote:
Babar_babar wrote:
I understand that you can have up to 3 prototypes (using 3CP for the 2 extra relic strat)

I yesterday night had a game and used, the new Ion accelerator (which is one of the best antitank in the game I fell), the deepstrike denial on a gostkeel (I was playing against BA so it was very handy), and the new markerlights (on a big pathfinder unit on a sacea detachment to use their strat to be able to move, shoot the markers without penalty, and then move to out of LOS).

The 3 were funny to use, and i think that the new ION would make it into a lot of competitive lists


I used it last night also vs Dukari. It is the Ivan Drago of relic weapons, I managed to do 18 wounds to a raider with no marker lights!


it is amazing antitank, and also against thing like Obliterators or Centurions, the minimun 4 damage is super reliable


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/12 19:57:36


Post by: Dynas


Who is taking land raiders? Other than the Character Dreadnoughts or Fliers, or the unkillable leviathan dread, i dont see a lot of vehicles.

I dont think the rail gun will be seen as much. I do like the ghostkeel one, at least in current meta with all the DS shenanigans.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/12 20:59:29


Post by: small_gods


 Dynas wrote:
Who is taking land raiders? Other than the Character Dreadnoughts or Fliers, or the unkillable leviathan dread, i dont see a lot of vehicles.

I dont think the rail gun will be seen as much. I do like the ghostkeel one, at least in current meta with all the DS shenanigans.


....knights, repulsors, hemlocks, plague burst crawlers, iron hands fliers. I see loads of tank and much less infantry, at least in the local tournament meta. There's a lot less hoardes of plaguebearers, Genesteeler Cults and mostly vehicles. Although I play itc, so that may skew the ammout of vehicles.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/13 13:41:42


Post by: Babar_babar


I do see a lot of vehicles these days, but that may change a lot depending on the meta of your region. Also I tend to see a lot of T8 on those vehicles (Tank commanders, repulsors, Knights....) for which the S9 of the ION is something to consider


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/13 16:31:02


Post by: Dynas


Babar_babar wrote:
I do see a lot of vehicles these days, but that may change a lot depending on the meta of your region. Also I tend to see a lot of T8 on those vehicles (Tank commanders, repulsors, Knights....) for which the S9 of the ION is something to consider


OK your meta is way different than mine. I see a lot of marine spam with TFC, centurions, knights are done. Very few Tank Commanders due to Imp Fist.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/13 17:04:33


Post by: small_gods


 Dynas wrote:
Babar_babar wrote:
I do see a lot of vehicles these days, but that may change a lot depending on the meta of your region. Also I tend to see a lot of T8 on those vehicles (Tank commanders, repulsors, Knights....) for which the S9 of the ION is something to consider


OK your meta is way different than mine. I see a lot of marine spam with TFC, centurions, knights are done. Very few Tank Commanders due to Imp Fist.


Weird, iron hands fliers are the biggest spammed list in our locals. There are a few raven guard and imperial fists centurions. Marine spam doesn't seem to do well, perhaps people are building to kill marines? There's a few tau triptide players and eldar flyer lists too. Also the last tournament was one by the possessed bomb with 3 plagueburst crawlers, which all in all is a nightmare for tau.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/14 13:29:56


Post by: Babar_babar


Well actually Centurions are a great target for the Super ION as it has great AP and minimun 4 damage


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/14 16:33:04


Post by: Jancoran


Babar_babar wrote:
Well actually Centurions are a great target for the Super ION as it has great AP and minimun 4 damage


IMagine the level of consternation when they gotta lift three or four centurions off the board. oofta.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/15 01:20:05


Post by: captain collius


 Jancoran wrote:
Babar_babar wrote:
Well actually Centurions are a great target for the Super ION as it has great AP and minimun 4 damage


IMagine the level of consternation when they gotta lift three or four centurions off the board. oofta.


I can't wait for the nerf Tau rage to begin


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/17 15:31:45


Post by: Dynas


 captain collius wrote:
 Jancoran wrote:
Babar_babar wrote:
Well actually Centurions are a great target for the Super ION as it has great AP and minimun 4 damage


IMagine the level of consternation when they gotta lift three or four centurions off the board. oofta.


I can't wait for the nerf Tau rage to begin


I saw a list with the 8 plus 2 detachemnts of 2 commanders each. Thats basically like 12 commanders (well 11 if you dont count the Riptide lol).


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/17 16:22:58


Post by: BoomWolf


Hardly efficient though.the eight are fluffy, but have nonsense equipment.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/17 16:29:21


Post by: Jancoran


 BoomWolf wrote:
Hardly efficient though.the eight are fluffy, but have nonsense equipment.


its a conversion nightmare. Lol


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/17 18:38:40


Post by: Yaktan


After getting the Greater Good, I have decided to adjust my close-combat Tau list as follows:

Switch from Tau Sept to Custom Sept Ds'rt, using hybrid weapons and stabilization systems (+ range on assault weapons and battlesuits move/shoot without heavy penalty)

Swap Darkstrider for Hover Drone Ethereal
Drop Target locks on Ghostkeels
Use points from that and chapter approved to get flamer crisis suits and 4 more drones.

This gives me the following list:
Spoiler:

Battalion
Shadowsun, Dispersed Fusion
Ethereal on Drone

2x10 Strikers
Kroot

3x Farsight Marksmen
2x Ghostkeel, CIR, Fusion, Sheild

3x5 pathfinders, 2x3 ion, 1x3 rail rifle

Battalion
Commander, 3x MP, ATS
Fireblade

3x5 Breacher

2x3 Stealth Suits, Fusion, Sheild Drones
2x4 Gun Drones

Battalion
Coldstar, 4x Fusion
Fireblade

3x Breacher

Crisis Team, 2 Flamers, ATS each
Crisis Team, 2 plasma, MP each

I really like the board control my list gives me, and I am trying to avoid getting too many new models. (besides new Shadowsun, just put her together today, and she is quite nice) Unfortunately I do not have much to use the cool new prototypes with, I could go with the ghostkeel anti-deepstrike one, or give my plasma suits the targeting gyros for re-rolls. I do have an ion riptide, but would have to go in a very different direction to fit it in my list, and I like the close combat theme with breachers, stealth suits, and now flamer crisis suits.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/17 19:09:39


Post by: carldooley


 Dynas wrote:
 captain collius wrote:
 Jancoran wrote:
Babar_babar wrote:
Well actually Centurions are a great target for the Super ION as it has great AP and minimun 4 damage


IMagine the level of consternation when they gotta lift three or four centurions off the board. oofta.


I can't wait for the nerf Tau rage to begin


I saw a list with the 8 plus 2 detachemnts of 2 commanders each. Thats basically like 12 commanders (well 11 if you dont count the Riptide lol).


I'm guessing that rule of 3 isn't a problem anymore?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/17 20:33:56


Post by: Jancoran


 carldooley wrote:
 Dynas wrote:
 captain collius wrote:
 Jancoran wrote:
Babar_babar wrote:
Well actually Centurions are a great target for the Super ION as it has great AP and minimun 4 damage


IMagine the level of consternation when they gotta lift three or four centurions off the board. oofta.


I can't wait for the nerf Tau rage to begin


I saw a list with the 8 plus 2 detachemnts of 2 commanders each. Thats basically like 12 commanders (well 11 if you dont count the Riptide lol).


I'm guessing that rule of 3 isn't a problem anymore?


Rule of 3 is a problem. Yes.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/17 20:47:05


Post by: Kanluwen


Am I crazy for liking the Networked Markerlights for Pathfinders?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/18 00:48:24


Post by: Galas


The problem with that is... for making the unit usable ... they put out a weapon that uses a relic slot. Just like the two shoot hammerhead railgun.

Those changes should have been baseline for those units to make them actually competent. Pathfinders should have speciall assault markerights baseline.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/18 09:17:14


Post by: Babar_babar


 Kanluwen wrote:
Am I crazy for liking the Networked Markerlights for Pathfinders?


I have play them in a DAL'YTH detachment for a move shot move shenanigan in a unit of 10. Its funny but maybe not super competitive...


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/18 13:51:33


Post by: Dynas


I think i found a way to kill the Broviathan Unkillable Dreadnought.

Needs a few things.
Marker lights for enough for 5 for +1
Stromsurge with Protoype Weaponry ANnihilation Warhead
A Character preferably like Darkstrider or Fireblade to throw EMP Grenade.

Optional if needed: Suicide Coldstar with 4 Fusion
Optional if Needed: Orbital Ion Beam Stratagem

So make sure you deploy your anchors at start of shooting phase. For +1
Shoot Markerlights to get 5 on the Leviathan for +1, use uplink markerlight strat if needed.
Now our Stormsurge has +2 hit with reroll 1s, so you shouldn't miss with any of the 4 missiles.

Put all 4 missiles into the Leviathan for 12 mortals
Use the EMP Grenade for D3 mortals (possibly having to use CP or Puretude 1/game reroll for damage to finish him off).

If he is still alive, send in the Fusion Coldstar.
You have to kill him all in 1 Turn or his ass is going to heal back up and you wont be able to get him.
Also, have to clear any surrounding Intercessor/Drones screeners with the rest of your army, likely riptides/commanders.

Make sure to take Kingslayer. Thoughts?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/19 03:23:08


Post by: ryzouken


I think Kingslayer is getting 86'd by all accounts and that you're underestimating the durability of the list. I don't think your plan, which has a lot of moving parts and requires your stormsurge to stay in LOS for a turn, is likely to do what it intends in the timeframe allotted.

The fusion coldstar is unlikely to do any damage, given the invuln, damage reduction, FNP, and cogitated martyrdom. I doubt your stormsurge survives the round to fire with anchors deployed. I think the character you're trying to emp grenade with will get picked off by eliminators or by stalker bolt rifles with the sniper strat. But by all means, give it a spin and tell me how it goes.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/19 04:47:14


Post by: ZergSmasher


Stormsurge doesn't benefit from anchors until the turn after he deploys them, so your plan falls apart right there unless you're lucky enough not to roll any 2's to hit. And if you go 2nd against that list, bye bye Stormsurge


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/19 11:49:54


Post by: A Town Called Malus


 BoomWolf wrote:
Hardly efficient though.the eight are fluffy, but have nonsense equipment.


Yeah. So frustrating. Their weaponry is just such a mess of mismatched roles which results in them not being good at anything.

Like, I think Torchstar is a great name for a commander and I like her limited fluff of being a deserter who brought her cadre to the Enclaves (including some of the newer weapon systems which had been developed in the main empire in the years since the split). But putting flamers on a BS2+ model? And those are just base flamers, not even Vior'las signature flamer? Such a waste.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/19 14:01:54


Post by: Dynas


 ZergSmasher wrote:
Stormsurge doesn't benefit from anchors until the turn after he deploys them, so your plan falls apart right there unless you're lucky enough not to roll any 2's to hit. And if you go 2nd against that list, bye bye Stormsurge


Yeah. I guess deploy and hope for T2 and hope he lives. You can get him a 6+ FNP but might be right.

New plan. just wait for April FAQ to nerf it. XD


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/20 09:35:20


Post by: small_gods


 Dynas wrote:
 ZergSmasher wrote:
Stormsurge doesn't benefit from anchors until the turn after he deploys them, so your plan falls apart right there unless you're lucky enough not to roll any 2's to hit. And if you go 2nd against that list, bye bye Stormsurge


Yeah. I guess deploy and hope for T2 and hope he lives. You can get him a 6+ FNP but might be right.

New plan. just wait for April FAQ to nerf it. XD


3 stormsurges would do it easiest. You wouldn't even need the relic. They might down one t1 but t2 you would still be firing 3. I've been using a devilfish full of breaches and darkstrider as a decent distraction from my stirmsure atm. Seems to work well as with new strategies they're almost dangerous!


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/21 05:13:05


Post by: Jancoran


Lets you have 4 riptides. I guess?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/21 14:24:07


Post by: carldooley


 Jancoran wrote:
Lets you have 4 riptides. I guess?


remember, rule of 3.
3 riptides. 3 R'Varna and 3 Y'Vahra makes 9.
If you want another, there are the 8 as well, which is a separate datasheet.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/21 23:43:05


Post by: Jancoran


 carldooley wrote:
 Jancoran wrote:
Lets you have 4 riptides. I guess?


remember, rule of 3.
3 riptides. 3 R'Varna and 3 Y'Vahra makes 9.
If you want another, there are the 8 as well, which is a separate datasheet.


I was referring to the 8 which lets you break the limit, albeit not easily. Lol


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/22 03:48:49


Post by: carldooley


I got my own copy of the PA:GG book tonight, and I was reading through it. A question; it IS only FSE that can take 2 commanders per detachment? There haven't been modifications elsewhere that increase the limit for other Septs?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/22 04:25:39


Post by: ryzouken


 carldooley wrote:
I got my own copy of the PA:GG book tonight, and I was reading through it. A question; it IS only FSE that can take 2 commanders per detachment? There haven't been modifications elsewhere that increase the limit for other Septs?

Correct. The specific amendment to the matched play rule is only found in the Farsight Enclave section of the book, therefore it only applies to detachments of that sept.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/22 09:14:21


Post by: Gunrunner1775


how are Tau countering the psychic shenanigans from Grey Knights

they can literally drop a single character anywere with in 3" of your line, and then target any unit they want within 7" and drop 10+ mortal wounds on a single unit (or character) from psychic stuff, not to mention 20-30 wounds just from smite alone which is 12" range (but is 24" range if unit is within 6" of a captain )


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/22 09:38:32


Post by: small_gods


Gunrunner1775 wrote:
how are Tau countering the psychic shenanigans from Grey Knights

they can literally drop a single character anywere with in 3" of your line, and then target any unit they want within 7" and drop 10+ mortal wounds on a single unit (or character) from psychic stuff, not to mention 20-30 wounds just from smite alone which is 12" range (but is 24" range if unit is within 6" of a captain )


You just need more screening, 3 or 4 units of kroot or even breachers works well against psychic and deepstrike. The ghotkeel prototype system is also a solid choice. They're not able to do all things at once so you're either getting 2 w smite or always in cover/-1 to hit. Also they take a while to all get across the board an they don't have great range with their weapons so you can castle on the backline and unlike all other marines they don't have loads of AP.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/23 00:01:06


Post by: Murrax9


What do people think about using the Eight? I've thought about bringing the Eight along with two battalions full of breachers and fire warriors and then make a big squad of crisis suits, it could work. But there may be better options out there.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/23 01:17:09


Post by: BoomWolf


If you are trying to be any level of competitive, avoid them.
Their loadouts are good for a story, but not in game.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/24 15:25:46


Post by: Malefic666


Quick question. In FSE lists is it best to take 1 quad Fusion Coldstar & then 2 x triple burst cannon or triple missile Coldstars with ATS to hop around objectives pushing infantry off them? 3 quad Fusion Coldstars feels overkill and too much of a suicidal play with them. Like Crisis suits Coldstars are vulnerable and surely need to survive more than a turn or two in order for FSE to win?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/25 02:34:26


Post by: Yaktan


I would say it really depends on the rest of your list and what your meta is like. Since any of the coldstar builds are pretty good at what they do, and are fairly interchangeable in terms of points, you can probably use them to fill in at the end of your list depending on what you need more. If you have plenty of anti-infantry, fusions are good, if you have solid anti-tank and need infantry clearing, burst/mp/ats are good.

I do not do farsight, but my stealth/breacher list probably has similar goals of close in fighting and board control, and I went with a fusion coldstar since my firewarriors, breachers, etc tend to offer good amounts of infantry killing, and for a long time my meta was thick with imperial knights (one tournament all of my games were vs. knights. It was exhausing even though I tended to push them around). One think I do find with him is that 18 inches is long enough range for him to hide behind my ghostkeels or mass breachers much of the time, so he survives pretty well.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/26 12:53:28


Post by: carldooley


Can we use the new Stratagem, 'Promising Pupil' to give named characters a different Warlord Trait. For instance, if I make my Fireblade my warlord, can I give Longstrike 'Through Unity, Devestation' instead because it wasn't my 'initial' warlord selection?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/26 13:03:52


Post by: Sterling191


 carldooley wrote:
Can we use the new Stratagem, 'Promising Pupil' to give named characters a different Warlord Trait. For instance, if I make my Fireblade my warlord, can I give Longstrike 'Through Unity, Devestation' instead because it wasn't my 'initial' warlord selection?


No. You can use it to activate his innate WLT, but cannot give him a different one.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/26 19:07:32


Post by: Malefic666


Yaktan wrote:
I would say it really depends on the rest of your list and what your meta is like. Since any of the coldstar builds are pretty good at what they do, and are fairly interchangeable in terms of points, you can probably use them to fill in at the end of your list depending on what you need more. If you have plenty of anti-infantry, fusions are good, if you have solid anti-tank and need infantry clearing, burst/mp/ats are good.

I do not do farsight, but my stealth/breacher list probably has similar goals of close in fighting and board control, and I went with a fusion coldstar since my firewarriors, breachers, etc tend to offer good amounts of infantry killing, and for a long time my meta was thick with imperial knights (one tournament all of my games were vs. knights. It was exhausing even though I tended to push them around). One think I do find with him is that 18 inches is long enough range for him to hide behind my ghostkeels or mass breachers much of the time, so he survives pretty well.


Okay I see. Thanks very much for the response and your thoughts. I think I’m going to have to play test both variants and see which one I need the most. I’m planning 6 Crisis suits with 2xCIB & ATS, 2 Ghostkeels with burst cannons over fusion, and 6x5 Breachers. The 3x Enforcers will have 3x CIB & ATS too. I think I’ll have enough anti horde shooting with all that so maybe 2x Fusion and one with missiles to hop around on objectives...


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/02/26 19:17:42


Post by: happy_inquisitor


 BoomWolf wrote:
If you are trying to be any level of competitive, avoid them.
Their loadouts are good for a story, but not in game.


What people have been saying for over a year - and its still only conditionally true.

They have poor weapon choices which are reflected in some tasty points discounts. You do not pay full Commander points for those Commanders so you have to re-evaluate their weapons loads with that in mind.

I played them in a couple of RTTs and absolutely smashed all comers with them. If you can get your head around all their rules and keep your screening good they are very good at stopping your opponent from whatever it was they were trying to do. That is really the theme of their special rules - being hard to play against rather than being awesomely hard-hitting. That is of course on top of being Character spam so they are unafraid of shooting so long as you can keep something else closer.

With The Greater Good they now have much improved Sept rules (basically no need for markerlights) and stratagems.

If your competitive level is smaller events and especially RTTs go for it. They will do great for you.

If your competitive level is major and super-major events - especially with the ITC rulespack which still hurts them pretty hard - maybe not.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/01 22:06:42


Post by: killerpenguin


Hi guys! I’m playing my first tau game this Tuesday for a escalation league. I was going to bring a bare bones battalion and a riptide, but I don’t want to be “that guy”, not sure if this list is any better, but we’ll see.

Spoiler:

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (T'au Empire) [28 PL, 500pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

T'au Empire Sept Choice: Farsight Enclaves

+ HQ +

Commander in XV8 Crisis Battlesuit [7 PL, 132pts]: Advanced targeting system, 3x Cyclic ion blaster, Puretide engram neurochip, Warlord

Commander in XV85 Enforcer Battlesuit [7 PL, 136pts]: Advanced targeting system, 3x Cyclic ion blaster

+ Troops +

Strike Team [4 PL, 52pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Markerlight, Pulse rifle
. 6x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle

Strike Team [4 PL, 45pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Markerlight, Pulse rifle
. 5x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle

Strike Team [4 PL, 45pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Markerlight, Pulse rifle
. 5x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle

+ Fast Attack +

Tactical Drones [2 PL, 90pts]
. 9x MV4 Shield Drone

++ Total: [28 PL, 500pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/01 22:34:50


Post by: small_gods


 killerpenguin wrote:
Hi guys! I’m playing my first tau game this Tuesday for a escalation league. I was going to bring a bare bones battalion and a riptide, but I don’t want to be “that guy”, not sure if this list is any better, but we’ll see.

Spoiler:

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (T'au Empire) [28 PL, 500pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

T'au Empire Sept Choice: Farsight Enclaves

+ HQ +

Commander in XV8 Crisis Battlesuit [7 PL, 132pts]: Advanced targeting system, 3x Cyclic ion blaster, Puretide engram neurochip, Warlord

Commander in XV85 Enforcer Battlesuit [7 PL, 136pts]: Advanced targeting system, 3x Cyclic ion blaster

+ Troops +

Strike Team [4 PL, 52pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Markerlight, Pulse rifle
. 6x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle

Strike Team [4 PL, 45pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Markerlight, Pulse rifle
. 5x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle

Strike Team [4 PL, 45pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Markerlight, Pulse rifle
. 5x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle

+ Fast Attack +

Tactical Drones [2 PL, 90pts]
. 9x MV4 Shield Drone

++ Total: [28 PL, 500pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe


Looks solid for a small points game, you need to split your drones up into small units to force overkill and avoid people using tricks like vox scream. Give 2 to each commander and have a unit of 5.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/02 09:15:15


Post by: killerpenguin


 small_gods wrote:
 killerpenguin wrote:
Hi guys! I’m playing my first tau game this Tuesday for a escalation league. I was going to bring a bare bones battalion and a riptide, but I don’t want to be “that guy”, not sure if this list is any better, but we’ll see.

Spoiler:

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (T'au Empire) [28 PL, 500pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

T'au Empire Sept Choice: Farsight Enclaves

+ HQ +

Commander in XV8 Crisis Battlesuit [7 PL, 132pts]: Advanced targeting system, 3x Cyclic ion blaster, Puretide engram neurochip, Warlord

Commander in XV85 Enforcer Battlesuit [7 PL, 136pts]: Advanced targeting system, 3x Cyclic ion blaster

+ Troops +

Strike Team [4 PL, 52pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Markerlight, Pulse rifle
. 6x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle

Strike Team [4 PL, 45pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Markerlight, Pulse rifle
. 5x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle

Strike Team [4 PL, 45pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Markerlight, Pulse rifle
. 5x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle

+ Fast Attack +

Tactical Drones [2 PL, 90pts]
. 9x MV4 Shield Drone

++ Total: [28 PL, 500pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe


Looks solid for a small points game, you need to split your drones up into small units to force overkill and avoid people using tricks like vox scream. Give 2 to each commander and have a unit of 5.


Thank you for your input! I didn’t think of that. I only thought it would be harder to get first blood.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/02 10:04:21


Post by: Ice_can


Would also suggest making the enforcer the warlord.

As that way they need to target but the crisis and enforcer comanders instead of punishing one for slay the warlord and removing the puretide chip.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/02 15:10:30


Post by: Dynas


So is the FSE 6 commander with Crisis Suit Bomb going to be the new meta list or just an alternate of the Triptide/Commander/ Shield Drones.



Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/02 15:50:59


Post by: Sterling191


Missilesides and Iontides are going to get a lot of attention. Expect to see multiple permutations.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/02 16:05:53


Post by: Dynas


Sterling191 wrote:
Missilesides and Iontides are going to get a lot of attention. Expect to see multiple permutations.


Yeah that was the 3rd list. The thing about the broadsides though, is they are slow and cant fly. So as soon as you are tagged in combat, game over.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/02 16:12:32


Post by: Sterling191


 Dynas wrote:

Yeah that was the 3rd list. The thing about the broadsides though, is they are slow and cant fly. So as soon as you are tagged in combat, game over.


A liability, but one that's largely mitigated by the hellacious amount of hurt they can put out. The fact that there are multiple extremely good options now is not remotely a bad thing.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/02 20:21:28


Post by: happy_inquisitor


 Dynas wrote:
So is the FSE 6 commander with Crisis Suit Bomb going to be the new meta list or just an alternate of the Triptide/Commander/ Shield Drones.



I don't personally think the Crisis Bomb part of that will make the grade. Sad but the truth is they tend to die too easily and they are too expensive to be a throwaway. A cheaper Crisis Scalpel might be good but the big bomb units need to *devastate* the opponent on arrival to be worthwhile and I just think too many top tier lists will weather the storm better than that.

The 6 commander part is very solid target denial combined with firepower and probably hyper-mobility assuming several Coldstar Commanders. It is too early to say exactly what will best complement those commanders in each tournament format - I do think it will be a slightly different build across different tournament formats due to the different scoring.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/03 10:48:51


Post by: Nostro


I'm pretty confused about this 6 FSE commander talk... Has this been expanded/clarified/discussed anywhere? (didn't find a YMDC or FAQ)

T'au Empire Codex wrote:If you are playing a matched play game, then in a Battle-forged army, you can include no more than one Commander in each Detachment.


The Greater Good wrote:If you are playing a matched play game with a Battle-forged army, you can include no more than two FARSIGHT ENCLAVES COMMANDER units in each Detachment.


I don't see how the rule as written supersedes Ro3 (I assume we're talking in Ro3 context - else I have no issue), it just goes around the 1 commander by detachment rule in the codex.

The same way you "can" take 6 riptides in a Vanguard but actually can't because of Ro3.

The only uses I see are:
- 2 commanders in just one detachment (eg lone Brigade or a det you want to field with alongside the Eight)
- 3 commanders with playing 2 detachments (eg 2xBatallion - and same the Eight thing)
- Shuffle your commanders in FSE if that's where you want them (eg your 3 commanders in 2xFSE Bats and your Fireblades in a Sa'cea det)

I honestly don't think the intent is to allow to circumvent Ro3, though I'd be happy to be proven wrong.




Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/03 11:27:23


Post by: tneva82


3 crisis suit commanders, 3 cold star commanders. Not sure but think that's what 6 commander refers. Before due to tau specific restriction you could have max 1 with keyword commander and with 3 detachments limited you could have max 3 of any combinaton(and there's whole bunch of crisis suit commanders to pick).

With this 2 commander per detachment you can get thus total of 6. There's even lot more you could take without tau restrictions. Like 4 crisis suit commanders(=12) and cold star(=3) for 15 + special characters. But tau specific one restricts it to 3 or 6 with FCE.

Commander is keyword. Not datasheet. Each of the various crisis suit commanders are own datasheets and ergo you could normally take 3 of each. Much like IG there's number of variant leman russes so even with rule of 3 you can have 3 squadrons of leman russ, 3 leman russ conquerors, 3 leman russ commander etc.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/03 12:37:15


Post by: Nostro


Ah, yeah, there we go, thanks for the explanation.

I brainfarted the keyword thing and forgot the different suits had different datasheets.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/03 13:21:45


Post by: killerpenguin


Do you guys think the 6 commanders in Farsight enclaves is gonna get FAQ'd? Its just that i collected 'nids when 8th ed dropped, and i bought, 7 flyrants. Dont want to do the same mistake again..


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/03 13:41:25


Post by: tneva82


The FAQ is about to come very soon so we'll know but that seems too specific to not be intentional and isnt' FCE known for the suits?

But wouldn't buy tons of commanders if you don't have already. With GW that's best option.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/03 13:45:14


Post by: Dynas


I would wait. Its quite possible that it does get nerfed. Always best to wait until the 2 week FAQ comes out after any book.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/03 15:44:29


Post by: John Prins


I can't see them removing the FSE extra commander per detachment rule, given how deliberately it was done.





Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/03 15:59:20


Post by: Azuza001


The 1 commander rule was put in place because no one ran regular suits, just commanders. This was done before the rule of 3. Since then people have started using regular suits / bodyguards in their lists. On top of the bonus that can be given using those new prototype weapons systems I could see them sticking to the 2 commanders per detachment right now just to see how it plays out. I think you will still see a single large squad of burst cannon suits with the prototype swap out as well as an influx of more commanders. Considering its farsight enclave only the more interesting thing will be do we see people switch from tau or borkan to farsight or not. This 1 change has given tau players a new option that's mighty interesting compared to the 2 default options before and should at least lead to different types of lists on the tables now.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/03 21:36:00


Post by: tneva82


Yep. I think by the very least it should be tried. It's particularly nice for the internal balance if it encourages other septs than just t'au. So I hope it doesn't get changed.

However seeing how often gw changes things in the book's faq investing money(or converting existing models...like sister players who converted the starter set canoness to be legal as per codex only to have the codex option replaced with the originally illegal configuration making all those converted models suddenly illegal...) on this(unless you really, really, REALLY want to use it in tournament right away).

Better safe than sorry just in case! I don't expect it to get removed but then again I didn't expect canoness codex wargear option get removed either!


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/04 13:11:36


Post by: killerpenguin


 Dynas wrote:
I would wait. Its quite possible that it does get nerfed. Always best to wait until the 2 week FAQ comes out after any book.


Is there a date for this FAQ?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/04 13:25:19


Post by: tneva82


GW claims 2 weeks after release but it's not hard&fast. Though about that. Think it's about 2 weeks now? So likely next monday(think these generally come on monday though not putting head on stake!)


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/04 16:30:45


Post by: Ice_can


tneva82 wrote:
GW claims 2 weeks after release but it's not hard&fast. Though about that. Think it's about 2 weeks now? So likely next monday(think these generally come on monday though not putting head on stake!)

Believe it should have bee last monday but was usurped by the Marine errata fairly sure that's the second time Tau FAQ has been usurped and ended up being way late.

A suspicious person would suggest it's deliberately set up this way.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/05 07:32:00


Post by: killerpenguin


This has probably come up a thousand times, but now after psychic awakening are breaches better than strike teams? I was going to collect a 6x commanders in a enclaves list, but I’m taking your advice and wait for the faq before I pull the trigger. Should a go for breachers or strike teams in this type of list?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/05 13:31:12


Post by: small_gods


 killerpenguin wrote:
This has probably come up a thousand times, but now after psychic awakening are breaches better than strike teams? I was going to collect a 6x commanders in a enclaves list, but I’m taking your advice and wait for the faq before I pull the trigger. Should a go for breachers or strike teams in this type of list?


I think 1 or 2 units of breachers maxed out is now pretty good in FSE I wouldn't go for all breachers. Depending on your preference you could go for kroot (a cheaper more resilient/point screen) or a strike team for some extra firepower. If you're running 6 commanders and a couple of riptides then I'd go 40 kroot and 20 breachers.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/07 07:40:18


Post by: killerpenguin


Have you guys tried playing with 6 commanders?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/11 14:27:28


Post by: Sterling191


FAQ is up. No more super drones, cant take multiple of the same Prototype System, units cant carry multiple PSs, and they nerfed FSE Kauyon.

Oh and Shadowsun is still pointless if you're not playing Tau sept.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/588e817f.pdf?fbclid=IwAR0zOHtiHtC0nEDHq5vHkN2ouHOcBAWOluaS6adSFWdUaCAPxQjadxF9o1w


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/11 15:20:23


Post by: Dynas


Page 38 – T’au Empire Stratagems,
Modulated Weaponry
Change the first sentence to read:
‘Use this Stratagem in your Shooting phase, when a
Riptide, Ghostkeel or Vehicle model (other than a
Titanic model) from your army is chosen to shoot with.’


They took away the ability on the Y'hvara, back to the shelf.

Looks like we got the Seigler trip tride commander drone spam list or FSE Crisis Bomb as really the only 2 viable comp builds. Maybe broadside/ missile spam with custom regiments.

Seeing that Kauyon FSE was nerfed to codex style instead of the other way around is a bit disappointing as well.

Agreed on Shadowsun, pointless without Tau sept.

Upgunned not carrying over to other burst weapons is a bummer as well. I mean space marines get theres for all BOLT weapons, kind of annoying, but then again , not a favored children.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/11 18:24:44


Post by: Ice_can


Maybe being dumb here but where is the change to the FSE kauyon ability?

The Y'varha and a number of other units just need some straight up points drops or better rules not a strategum work around though.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/11 18:30:16


Post by: Sterling191


Ice_can wrote:
Maybe being dumb here but where is the change to the FSE kauyon ability?.


It was rewritten to be a reroll all hits in PA5 for Enclave Comanders. The FAQ turns it back to the Codex version of reroll failed hits.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/11 19:27:35


Post by: rbstr


Guess the idea that they were moving to "all rolls" vs. "failed" was not true.
Not surprised up gunners won't work on the high-output or long-barreled burst cannon. Just disappointed.
Also, did they really need to FAQ nerf the breachers?
Does Borkan Sept only apply to the long range profile on the pulse blast cannon then?

Personally, I figured they did that on Shadowsun on purpose. Even as stupid as it is.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/11 19:56:01


Post by: Ice_can


Sterling191 wrote:
Ice_can wrote:
Maybe being dumb here but where is the change to the FSE kauyon ability?.


It was rewritten to be a reroll all hits in PA5 for Enclave Comanders. The FAQ turns it back to the Codex version of reroll failed hits.

But that rewrite was only when you field the eight, where it still applies as I understand the FAQ.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/11 23:38:23


Post by: sanguine40k


Yeesh, that FAQ was unnecessarily harsh.

C'mon, GW, throw us a bone!


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/12 01:23:38


Post by: Yaktan


Yeah, the FAQ ruling on breachers is very annoying. I was looking forward to actually being able to use the short range profile.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/13 22:20:37


Post by: Sazzlefrats


Yaktan wrote:
Yeah, the FAQ ruling on breachers is very annoying. I was looking forward to actually being able to use the short range profile.



I missed that, how did breachers get nerfed? Where they good for a second and I blinked?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/14 00:48:00


Post by: ZergSmasher


 Sazzlefrats wrote:
Yaktan wrote:
Yeah, the FAQ ruling on breachers is very annoying. I was looking forward to actually being able to use the short range profile.



I missed that, how did breachers get nerfed? Where they good for a second and I blinked?

The trait that gave them +4" to their range was interpreted by many to mean that all the profiles get an extra 4" range, meaning that their short range would have been 9" instead of 5". GW FAQ'd that to be only the long range gets the benefit, so bye bye 9" murder guns.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/14 02:08:08


Post by: carldooley


 ZergSmasher wrote:
 Sazzlefrats wrote:
Yaktan wrote:
Yeah, the FAQ ruling on breachers is very annoying. I was looking forward to actually being able to use the short range profile.



I missed that, how did breachers get nerfed? Where they good for a second and I blinked?

The trait that gave them +4" to their range was interpreted by many to mean that all the profiles get an extra 4" range, meaning that their short range would have been 9" instead of 5". GW FAQ'd that to be only the long range gets the benefit, so bye bye 9" murder guns.

2 Logical extensions:
1. This means that the Bork'an trait 'Superior Craftsmanship' only buffs the Stormsurge's max range Blastcannon.
2. The 'Pulse Onslaught' Stratagem's max range isn't increased if you do use Hybridised Weaponry.
OTOH, Hybridised Weaponry does essentially give 'Wall of Death' back to flamers.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/27 18:21:11


Post by: killerpenguin


Hi guys! I can’t decide wether I want to build commander spam or a triptide list. Do you guys think there’s a way to combine the two? Something mike this?

FSE battalion

2 coldstar - 4 missile pod  

3 breacher teams with guardian drones

FSE batallion

2 enforcer - 3 CIB, ATS

3 breacher teams with guardian drones

Custom sept vanguard - hardened warheads stabilisation systems

Ethereal - hover drone

3 riptides - burst, missiles, ats and

+28 shield drones total




Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/27 21:51:58


Post by: Dracarys


 killerpenguin wrote:
Hi guys! I can’t decide wether I want to build commander spam or a triptide list. Do you guys think there’s a way to combine the two? Something mike this?

FSE battalion

2 coldstar - 4 missile pod  

3 breacher teams with guardian drones

FSE batallion

2 enforcer - 3 CIB, ATS

3 breacher teams with guardian drones

Custom sept vanguard - hardened warheads stabilisation systems

Ethereal - hover drone

3 riptides - burst, missiles, ats and

+28 shield drones total




Don't forget that saviour protocols is sept locked, so your FSE drones cannot saviour protocol for those riptides. Riptides without shield drones will die pretty quickly without drone support. I've seen some success using one riptide in an FSE army, use it to take the middle and give it drone support so it can hold the middle. However, this works best with good cover to keep your drones from getting murdered.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/29 10:31:02


Post by: Ice_can


 killerpenguin wrote:
Hi guys! I can’t decide wether I want to build commander spam or a triptide list. Do you guys think there’s a way to combine the two? Something mike this?

FSE battalion

2 coldstar - 4 missile pod  

3 breacher teams with guardian drones

FSE batallion

2 enforcer - 3 CIB, ATS

3 breacher teams with guardian drones

Custom sept vanguard - hardened warheads stabilisation systems

Ethereal - hover drone

3 riptides - burst, missiles, ats and

+28 shield drones total



It could work but simply put the list you have presented doesn't benifit much from being FSE you would be aswell making it mono spet or mixing Custom spet and TAU sept and being careful with placement of models.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/29 20:10:21


Post by: Yaktan


Yeah, the main issue is going to be fitting the drones into the same detachment as the riptides. Unless you just have the riptides be Farsight as well, they may not benefit as much, but if someone tries to get in close to deal with them, they will be in for a surprise, eh?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/03/31 16:08:49


Post by: Sazzlefrats


Drones only work for the Sept they are from. So custom sept drones will not protect commanders. Commanders can't be targeted if they aren't the closest model, but... as per Yaktan, if they get around that, your commanders will get murdered.

I think the tripletide is still the alpha list, if you are playing casual I'd go commanders. If you are nuts like me, I own, enough for nearly ever concievable combination. I'm now thinking about a horde of 200 fire warriors. I've done the math, its great against everything except 2+ armor and 3 or worse negatives to hit. So the lord discordant -4 to be hit, possessed bomb is crazy hard to deal with.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/04/02 21:38:24


Post by: killerpenguin


Could the dark strider have a place in breacher heavy competitive FSE lists?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/04/02 22:36:30


Post by: Sterling191


 killerpenguin wrote:
Could the dark strider have a place in breacher heavy competitive FSE lists?


Darkstrider is a Tau sept named character. He has no effect on Enclave units.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/04/05 10:31:27


Post by: Pottsey


Sterling191 wrote:
 killerpenguin wrote:
Could the dark strider have a place in breacher heavy competitive FSE lists?


Darkstrider is a Tau sept named character. He has no effect on Enclave units.

He does have an effect and its negative. Adding Darkstrider into the FSE detachment will mean the FSE units lose Aggressive Footing.The same reason we cannot use Kroot or Vespid in an FSE detachment.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/04/05 19:01:17


Post by: ZergSmasher


I thought Kroot and Vespids did not break Sept tenets, or is FSE an exception to this?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/04/05 20:36:16


Post by: Sterling191


 ZergSmasher wrote:
I thought Kroot and Vespids did not break Sept tenets, or is FSE an exception to this?


Its not clear whether Aggressive Footing is considered a part of the FSE sept tenet (arguments can be made in either direction using the RAW, and both have merit). In classic GW fashion the PA FAQ created a mess in the course of attempting to solve another.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/04/07 18:13:07


Post by: Jancoran


Kroot have been super mandatory in my lists. That Vanguard move solves so many issues, LIKE the posessed bomb.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/04/16 17:33:26


Post by: MasteroftheBloodAngels


Hey everyone, Friday at 6pm EST we will be doing another live streamed game on our twitch channel. This time it’ll be a rematch of the Pro Tabletop finals with Nick's Ultramarines (eerily similar to his old Iron Hands brigade) versus Richard's revamped triple Riptide build! Also, we are continuing our daily paint stream series, join us on twitch every day at 3pm EST for our paint party! Don’t miss the action!

Richard's list: (I decided on an ion tide since people are excited to see it and out of all the matchups it should perform reasonably well into marines).

Custom Sept (Stabilization Systems + Hardened Warheads)

Outrider

Coldstar Commander, 4x missile pods, 2x shield drones 170

Breacher Team, 2x shield drones 55

Tactical drones, 11x shield drones 110

Tactical drones, 11x shield drones 110

Tactical drones, 11x shield drones 110

Supreme Command

Cadre Fireblade, 2x shield drones 62

Cadre Fireblade, 2x shield drones 62

Cadre Fireblade, 2x shield drones 62

Coldstar Commander, 4x missile pods, 2x shield drones 170, warlord, (-1 cp, puretide engram chip), Through Unity Devastation

Ethereal, hover drone, 2x shield drones 70

Vanguard

Coldstar Commander, 4x missile pods, 2x shield drones 170

Riptide, Smart missile systems, Heavy Burst Cannon, Advanced Targeting System, Velocity Tracker, 278

Riptide, Smart missile systems, Heavy Burst Cannon, Advanced Targeting System, Velocity Tracker, 278

Riptide, Smart missile systems, Ion Accelerator, Advanced Targeting System, Velocity Tracker, 293 (prototype weapon system, Amplified Ion Accelerator)

Nick’s list:
Ultramarine Battalion
Librarian 88 (Telepathic assault and scryers gaze), Seal of Oath, additional warlord trait master of strategy
Chaplain- jump pack 90
5 intercessors- bolt rifles 85
5 intercessors- bolt rifles 85
5 scouts- combat weapons 55
5 company vets- storm bolters, storm shields 90
5 company vets- storm bolters, storm shields 90
5 company vets- storm bolters, storm shields 90
Whirlwind Scorpius 215
Relic contemptor dread- twin las, cyclone missile, chain fist 214
Company Ancient 63, Ultramarines relic banner
3 suppressors 90
3 suppressors 90
3 suppressors 90
5 devastators- 4 grav cannons, cherub 150
Drop pod 65

Auxiliary
Bobby G 350, Warlord


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/04/26 07:19:09


Post by: killerpenguin


Spoiler:
MasteroftheBloodAngels wrote:
Hey everyone, Friday at 6pm EST we will be doing another live streamed game on our twitch channel. This time it’ll be a rematch of the Pro Tabletop finals with Nick's Ultramarines (eerily similar to his old Iron Hands brigade) versus Richard's revamped triple Riptide build! Also, we are continuing our daily paint stream series, join us on twitch every day at 3pm EST for our paint party! Don’t miss the action!

Richard's list: (I decided on an ion tide since people are excited to see it and out of all the matchups it should perform reasonably well into marines).

Custom Sept (Stabilization Systems + Hardened Warheads)

Outrider

Coldstar Commander, 4x missile pods, 2x shield drones 170

Breacher Team, 2x shield drones 55

Tactical drones, 11x shield drones 110

Tactical drones, 11x shield drones 110

Tactical drones, 11x shield drones 110

Supreme Command

Cadre Fireblade, 2x shield drones 62

Cadre Fireblade, 2x shield drones 62

Cadre Fireblade, 2x shield drones 62

Coldstar Commander, 4x missile pods, 2x shield drones 170, warlord, (-1 cp, puretide engram chip), Through Unity Devastation

Ethereal, hover drone, 2x shield drones 70

Vanguard

Coldstar Commander, 4x missile pods, 2x shield drones 170

Riptide, Smart missile systems, Heavy Burst Cannon, Advanced Targeting System, Velocity Tracker, 278

Riptide, Smart missile systems, Heavy Burst Cannon, Advanced Targeting System, Velocity Tracker, 278

Riptide, Smart missile systems, Ion Accelerator, Advanced Targeting System, Velocity Tracker, 293 (prototype weapon system, Amplified Ion Accelerator)

Nick’s list:
Ultramarine Battalion
Librarian 88 (Telepathic assault and scryers gaze), Seal of Oath, additional warlord trait master of strategy
Chaplain- jump pack 90
5 intercessors- bolt rifles 85
5 intercessors- bolt rifles 85
5 scouts- combat weapons 55
5 company vets- storm bolters, storm shields 90
5 company vets- storm bolters, storm shields 90
5 company vets- storm bolters, storm shields 90
Whirlwind Scorpius 215
Relic contemptor dread- twin las, cyclone missile, chain fist 214
Company Ancient 63, Ultramarines relic banner
3 suppressors 90
3 suppressors 90
3 suppressors 90
5 devastators- 4 grav cannons, cherub 150
Drop pod 65

Auxiliary
Bobby G 350, Warlord


Hi Richard! Love your streams, they’re very entertaining and informative. Too bad I can’t watch them live, because they start a bit late for me here in Norway. A quick question, I’ve seen you running your commanders with four missile pods, but after my calculations, they’re exactly as effective against 3+ save Vehicles and MEQ’s as 3 missile pods + ATS. A 4 MP commander will statistically do a bit more against a GEQ, but won’t kill more and a 3 MP+ATS commander on a average round of shooting. Or is there a different reason you’re running 4 MP on your commanders?

Edit* sry, I was a bit quick to read there. I thought it was Richard writing. Love all you guys work, keep it up.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/04/26 19:13:10


Post by: A Town Called Malus


My guess would be that they are on average the same but the extra missile pod gives a higher damage potential thanks to extra shots.

Maximum amount of damage you can do with 3 MP is 18. With 4 it is 24. So in the instances you roll above average (or your opponent rolls below average for their saves) you will get more damage out of the QuadPod commander.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/04/27 17:42:25


Post by: killerpenguin


 A Town Called Malus wrote:
My guess would be that they are on average the same but the extra missile pod gives a higher damage potential thanks to extra shots.

Maximum amount of damage you can do with 3 MP is 18. With 4 it is 24. So in the instances you roll above average (or your opponent rolls below average for their saves) you will get more damage out of the QuadPod commander.


Then the question is weather it’s worth the extra points for the extra MP or not.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/04/27 18:18:43


Post by: Ice_can


 killerpenguin wrote:
 A Town Called Malus wrote:
My guess would be that they are on average the same but the extra missile pod gives a higher damage potential thanks to extra shots.

Maximum amount of damage you can do with 3 MP is 18. With 4 it is 24. So in the instances you roll above average (or your opponent rolls below average for their saves) you will get more damage out of the QuadPod commander.


Then the question is weather it’s worth the extra points for the extra MP or not.


Esentially it depends on what you expect to be shooting at.
Against -to hit more shots is always better.

Against hordes or invulnerable saves the shots are better than AP if your already hitting the invulnerable save.

So you need a trade off the otherway to make it more viable.

Not to mention more dice tends to lead to more avarage rolling.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/04/29 13:36:36


Post by: MasteroftheBloodAngels


Appreciate the kind words! In terms of the missile commanders, I don't think you can wrong, the loadout is meta dependent. Since I play in a meta with more good invulnerable save armies and a lot of hordes, I prefer having the extra shots and damage potential, but if I played in a more vehicle heavy army, I would test out the extra ap.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/04/30 18:39:49


Post by: Sazzlefrats


How do you differentiate all those units of drones?

MasteroftheBloodAngels wrote:
Hey everyone, Friday at 6pm EST we will be doing another live streamed game on our twitch channel. This time it’ll be a rematch of the Pro Tabletop finals with Nick's Ultramarines (eerily similar to his old Iron Hands brigade) versus Richard's revamped triple Riptide build! Also, we are continuing our daily paint stream series, join us on twitch every day at 3pm EST for our paint party! Don’t miss the action!

Richard's list: (I decided on an ion tide since people are excited to see it and out of all the matchups it should perform reasonably well into marines).

Custom Sept (Stabilization Systems + Hardened Warheads)

Outrider

Coldstar Commander, 4x missile pods, 2x shield drones 170

Breacher Team, 2x shield drones 55

Tactical drones, 11x shield drones 110

Tactical drones, 11x shield drones 110

Tactical drones, 11x shield drones 110

Supreme Command

Cadre Fireblade, 2x shield drones 62

Cadre Fireblade, 2x shield drones 62

Cadre Fireblade, 2x shield drones 62

Coldstar Commander, 4x missile pods, 2x shield drones 170, warlord, (-1 cp, puretide engram chip), Through Unity Devastation

Ethereal, hover drone, 2x shield drones 70

Vanguard

Coldstar Commander, 4x missile pods, 2x shield drones 170

Riptide, Smart missile systems, Heavy Burst Cannon, Advanced Targeting System, Velocity Tracker, 278

Riptide, Smart missile systems, Heavy Burst Cannon, Advanced Targeting System, Velocity Tracker, 278

Riptide, Smart missile systems, Ion Accelerator, Advanced Targeting System, Velocity Tracker, 293 (prototype weapon system, Amplified Ion Accelerator)

Nick’s list:
Ultramarine Battalion
Librarian 88 (Telepathic assault and scryers gaze), Seal of Oath, additional warlord trait master of strategy
Chaplain- jump pack 90
5 intercessors- bolt rifles 85
5 intercessors- bolt rifles 85
5 scouts- combat weapons 55
5 company vets- storm bolters, storm shields 90
5 company vets- storm bolters, storm shields 90
5 company vets- storm bolters, storm shields 90
Whirlwind Scorpius 215
Relic contemptor dread- twin las, cyclone missile, chain fist 214
Company Ancient 63, Ultramarines relic banner
3 suppressors 90
3 suppressors 90
3 suppressors 90
5 devastators- 4 grav cannons, cherub 150
Drop pod 65

Auxiliary
Bobby G 350, Warlord


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/02 03:34:33


Post by: MasteroftheBloodAngels


 Sazzlefrats wrote:
How do you differentiate all those units of drones?


I had been using colored tape to differentiate the squads, but I plan on buying squad marks so I can properly base the drones to match my army and have the squad marks denote squads.

- Richard


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/03 02:15:45


Post by: Sazzlefrats


MasteroftheBloodAngels wrote:
 Sazzlefrats wrote:
How do you differentiate all those units of drones?


I had been using colored tape to differentiate the squads, but I plan on buying squad marks so I can properly base the drones to match my army and have the squad marks denote squads.

- Richard


Is that like the decal sheets that come with the box sets?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/03 22:41:45


Post by: MasteroftheBloodAngels


No just regular old masking tape, but of different colors. It was a fairly rudimentary method but it was simple and quick. It was also easy to tear off the tape and put a different color on if I wanted to change the squads.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/07 05:48:49


Post by: killerpenguin


Hi guys! I’m making a list of a escalation league. What do you think about the list? Should I go for FSE instead?

+++ New Roster (Warhammer 40,000 8th Edition) [28 PL, 497pts] +++

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (T'au Empire) ++

+ Configuration +

Sept Choice
. Custom Sept: Hybridised Weaponry, Turbo-jets, Up-gunned

+ HQ +

Commander in XV85 Enforcer Battlesuit: Advanced targeting system, 3x Cyclic ion blaster, Velocity tracker
. MV4 Shield Drone

Ethereal: Honour blade, Hover drone

+ Troops +

Breacher Team: MV36 Guardian Drone
. 10x Fire Warrior: 10x Photon grenades, 10x Pulse blaster
. MV4 Shield Drone

Breacher Team: MV36 Guardian Drone
. 10x Fire Warrior: 10x Photon grenades, 10x Pulse blaster
. MV4 Shield Drone

Breacher Team: MV36 Guardian Drone
. 10x Fire Warrior: 10x Photon grenades, 10x Pulse blaster
. MV4 Shield Drone

Breacher Team
. 5x Fire Warrior: 5x Photon grenades, 5x Pulse blaster

Created with BattleScribe


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/07 06:23:59


Post by: Nibbler


i think your list looks good.
But why did you use three of the sept tenets?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/07 07:10:27


Post by: killerpenguin


Nibbler wrote:
i think your list looks good.
But why did you use three of the sept tenets?


I tagged them all to read them in BattleScribe, then forgot to remove the last one. Not having up gunned obviously.

I was thinking FSE might be better though



Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/07 16:10:14


Post by: Ice_can


Depends on how you are intending the list to play, but personally I'm not a fan of the large infantry squads msu for CP anddue to tripointing. Additionally suits tend to be the place you pick up your heavier weapons, if someone brought a russ or such you might find battering through it with breachers a hard slog.

Also hybridised weapons only works on the longest range profile not the shorter 2 because GW FAQ


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/07 20:19:34


Post by: Vineheart01


are hammerheads, ghostkeels, riptides, and skyrays even viable anymore?

I sold my tau when they gutted all the shenanigans i pulled (melee ghostkeels, piranha walls, single suit suicide deepstrike w/ fusions) so i have 0 idea how they work in 8th.

My roommate got into tau recently and has been trying to play Farsight Enclaves, but seems like no matter what he brings his army feels extremely lightweight vs my orks or admech.

Literally everything i was used to doing with tau is not a thing anymore, even markerlight mentality is different. So i am having mega difficulty trying to help him out.

He has a modest amount (40?) of firewarrior/breachers and i think 20 pathfinders, 6-9 crisis suits (i think he has 9 though i know he has 6 assembled), 2 flymanders, farsight, 2 railsides, 1 riptide/ghostkeel, and unsure how many but i know he has several tanks (devilfish/hammerhead/skyray) he just recently got super cheap from ebay...gotta love it when someone sells their army for cheap lol

He's been kinda down because he feels like he bought a useless army. I hear a lot of horror of tau, i just never see it myself so zilcho on validated tips from me


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/07 20:31:53


Post by: Ice_can


A list I am currently in the process of refining right now to give him a starter for 10

Spoiler:


++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (T'au Empire) [62 PL, 3CP, 1,041pts] ++

+ Configuration [8CP] +

Battle-forged CP [3CP]

Detachment CP [5CP]

Sept Choice: Farsight Enclaves

+ Stratagems [-5CP] +

Emergency Dispensation (2 Relics) [-3CP]

Veteran Cadre (4+ models) [-2CP]

+ HQ [16 PL, 275pts] +

Commander in XV86 Coldstar Battlesuit [8 PL, 135pts]: Advanced targeting system [6pts], Burst cannon [8pts], High-output burst cannon [16pts], Missile pod [15pts], Talisman of Arthas Moloch

Commander in XV86 Coldstar Battlesuit [8 PL, 140pts]: 3x Fusion blaster [42pts], Shield generator [8pts]

+ Troops [6 PL, 108pts] +

Breacher Team [2 PL, 35pts]
. 4x Fire Warrior [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse blaster
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [7pts]: Photon grenades, Pulse blaster

Breacher Team [2 PL, 35pts]
. 4x Fire Warrior [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse blaster
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [7pts]: Photon grenades, Pulse blaster

Strike Team [2 PL, 38pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [10pts]: Markerlight [3pts], Photon grenades, Pulse rifle
. 4x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse rifle

+ Elites [38 PL, 618pts] +

XV8 Crisis Battlesuits [38 PL, 618pts]: Cross-linked stabiliser jets, Veteran Cadre
. Crisis Shas'ui [58pts]: 3x Airbursting fragmentation projector [24pts], XV8-02 Crisis Iridium battlesuit [10pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [58pts]: 2x Plasma rifle [16pts], Shield generator [8pts], XV8-02 Crisis Iridium battlesuit [10pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [79pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts], XV8-02 Crisis Iridium battlesuit [10pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [48pts]: 2x Plasma rifle [16pts], Shield generator [8pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [69pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [69pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [69pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [69pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts]
. Crisis Shas'vre [69pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts]
. 3x MV4 Shield Drone [30pts]: 3x Shield generator

+ Fast Attack [2 PL, 40pts] +

Tactical Drones [2 PL, 40pts]
. 4x MV4 Shield Drone [40pts]: 4x Shield generator

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (T'au Empire) [15 PL, 5CP, 242pts] ++

+ Configuration [5CP] +

Detachment CP [5CP]

Sept Choice: Farsight Enclaves

+ HQ [9 PL, 134pts] +

Cadre Fireblade [2 PL, 42pts]: Markerlight [3pts], Photon grenades, Pulse rifle

Commander in XV85 Enforcer Battlesuit [7 PL, 92pts]: 2. Through Unity, Devastation, Airbursting fragmentation projector [8pts], Shield generator [8pts], Warlord

+ Troops [6 PL, 108pts] +

Strike Team [2 PL, 35pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [7pts]: Photon grenades, Pulse rifle
. 4x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse rifle

Strike Team [2 PL, 35pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [7pts]: Photon grenades, Pulse rifle
. 4x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse rifle

Strike Team [2 PL, 38pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [10pts]: Markerlight [3pts], Photon grenades, Pulse rifle
. 4x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse rifle

++ Vanguard Detachment +1CP (T'au Empire) [36 PL, 1CP, 716pts] ++

+ Configuration [1CP] +

Detachment CP [1CP]

Sept Choice
. Custom Sept: Gifted Pilots, Stabilisation Systems

+ HQ [2 PL, 45pts] +

Ethereal [2 PL, 45pts]: Honour blade

+ Elites [30 PL, 591pts] +

Dahyak Grekh [2 PL, 20pts]: Kroot pistol, Kroot rifle

XV104 Riptide Battlesuit [14 PL, 278pts]: 2x Smart missile system [30pts], Advanced targeting system [18pts], Heavy burst cannon [35pts], Velocity tracker [10pts]

XV104 Riptide Battlesuit [14 PL, 293pts]: 2x Smart missile system [30pts], Advanced targeting system [18pts], Amplified ion accelerator, Ion accelerator [50pts], Velocity tracker [10pts]

+ Fast Attack [4 PL, 80pts] +

Tactical Drones [2 PL, 40pts]
. 4x MV4 Shield Drone [40pts]: 4x Shield generator

Tactical Drones [2 PL, 40pts]
. 4x MV4 Shield Drone [40pts]: 4x Shield generator

++ Total: [113 PL, 9CP, 1,999pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)


It's a hybrid between the old tripple riptide and drone spam lists and farsite crisis bomb list

Riptides are still money, comanders are good.

Hammerheads and skyrays need to be spammed with longstrike to be vaguely viable and die quickly.
Stealthsuits are good, goastkeels I personally don't rate.
Broadsides can work but lacking fly can get tarpitted badly.
Missilesides work railsides need magnarailrifles from the greater good book
Pathfinders die too easy with 5+ saves, he needs lots of drones.

Crisis suits only work in 1 unit with CP being fed to them.

He really would benifit from the greater good psychic awakening book.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/07 21:15:46


Post by: Yaktan


Ghostkeels are actually rather good when used properly, in my experience. Bring some stealth suits with shield drones and they last forever, while putting out good amounts of S8 firepower.

Hammerheads and Skyrays can be used, but they are much more glass-cannony due to not getting shield drone support.

Riptides are stars, and commanders are good. Firewarriors do good as well, can bring lots for reasonable price, and you might as well have fireblades to fill out HQ slots after you bring max commanders.

Crisis suits can be reasonable with the right build. I have some flamer suits I need to paint, to run with the new range boost sept.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/07 21:58:38


Post by: Ice_can


Yaktan wrote:
Ghostkeels are actually rather good when used properly, in my experience. Bring some stealth suits with shield drones and they last forever, while putting out good amounts of S8 firepower.

Hammerheads and Skyrays can be used, but they are much more glass-cannony due to not getting shield drone support.

Riptides are stars, and commanders are good. Firewarriors do good as well, can bring lots for reasonable price, and you might as well have fireblades to fill out HQ slots after you bring max commanders.

Crisis suits can be reasonable with the right build. I have some flamer suits I need to paint, to run with the new range boost sept.

I find smart opponents just lift the -1 to hit drones first and then T6 with -1 to hit and 3+Sv goes buy buy fast even worse vrs assualt lists.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/07 23:16:24


Post by: Vineheart01


its even worse against me when im playing orks.
"Oh, minus2? Dont care." lol


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/08 16:42:10


Post by: Sterling191


Ice_can wrote:

I find smart opponents just lift the -1 to hit drones first and then T6 with -1 to hit and 3+Sv goes buy buy fast even worse vrs assualt lists.


The 24 inch Assault armament on the Ghostkeel helps to mitigate that. Park it somewhere at the edge of plink range, keep the stealth drones out of sight, and go to town. If they do draw fire, theyve already done their job by distracting from your riptides, commanders and crisis suits.

Toss in a shield generator and they can take a surprising amount of firepower.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/08 17:32:11


Post by: Ice_can


Sterling191 wrote:
Ice_can wrote:

I find smart opponents just lift the -1 to hit drones first and then T6 with -1 to hit and 3+Sv goes buy buy fast even worse vrs assualt lists.


The 24 inch Assault armament on the Ghostkeel helps to mitigate that. Park it somewhere at the edge of plink range, keep the stealth drones out of sight, and go to town. If they do draw fire, theyve already done their job by distracting from your riptides, commanders and crisis suits.

Toss in a shield generator and they can take a surprising amount of firepower.

I wish I felt it was worth it's point's but trying to make it work has always made me feel it's just too squishy. Though I think this is more an issue of the Toughness values for vehicles and monsters having been artificially restrained a T7 ghostkeel and a T8 riptide would feel more worthwhile, much like T8 would help a lot of vehicals and T9 on landraiders would make them actually playable.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/08 22:04:38


Post by: Yaktan


Yeah, the Shield generator is a big help as well--there are just so many fail states for people shooting at it. Also, I run two together, which means more stealth drones they have to get through, plus the shield drones, and I run Shadowsun as well, so they need to get through her drones. Its a big ball 'o stealthy fun, and really puts out the hurt on things like knights. Oh, you have a 4++? Well, most of my damage is S8 AP -1, so lol!

Also, you would be surprised at how hard it is for people to figure out they need to shoot drones instead of the big dudes. It is obvious for us, playing Tau, but for other people they do not make the connection as easily.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/09 11:30:05


Post by: Vineheart01


A random question about drones...

When they separate from the unit after deployment are they still considered valid targets for objectives n whatnot? I know that was a thing before where unless they were bought as a Drone squad they didnt offer anything (which is one reason why i loved my Piranha wall when i still had Tau in 7th, 10 drones that didnt yield any points on top of a 200pt annoyingly wide wall)
Also, when they separate theyre 1 unit of drones, not each drone is individual right?

One of the reasons i feel like im completely stomping my roommie is all the drones counting as separate units, so i snag crap like "kill 6 units" for big points super easy. The fact that i used to own tau means very little in how i fight them since they are not even remotely playing the same way anymore.
I always target the drones first, especially the special drones since i couldnt find any rule keeping them safe (guardian drones) and pathfinders second. And its not hard to do that, im guessing he just doesnt bring enough drones (i wanna say ~20 in a 2k game)


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/09 11:46:16


Post by: Ice_can


 Vineheart01 wrote:
A random question about drones...

When they separate from the unit after deployment are they still considered valid targets for objectives n whatnot? I know that was a thing before where unless they were bought as a Drone squad they didnt offer anything (which is one reason why i loved my Piranha wall when i still had Tau in 7th, 10 drones that didnt yield any points on top of a 200pt annoyingly wide wall)
Also, when they separate theyre 1 unit of drones, not each drone is individual right?

One of the reasons i feel like im completely stomping my roommie is all the drones counting as separate units, so i snag crap like "kill 6 units" for big points super easy.


Depends how they are taken, taken with crisis suits all the dones taken as wargear for the units form 1 drone squad, but if you have a broasdie with 1 drone and commander with 1 drone and a squad with 1 drone they are 3 units. So yes how you add drones to your list is a skill these days.

Unfortunately they have 2 basic playstyles that are competitive 1 3 riptides and drones with comanders.

The other option is Farsight comander spam and crisis bomb, but that only came out just before everything shutdown, so event results are limited.

Pathfinders I have lost the will to even attempt to make pathfinders work, too squishy and they get picked up and you loose your markerlights, which also only hit on 4+, and it's heavy so that oftten becomes 5+.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/09 11:52:55


Post by: Vineheart01


He's a major gundam fan so of course he wants to run as many suits as he can lol.
Feel bad for him that tau REALLY dont like playing the way he was hoping.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/11 17:58:23


Post by: Sazzlefrats


Ice_can wrote:
A list I am currently in the process of refining right now to give him a starter for 10

Spoiler:


++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (T'au Empire) [62 PL, 3CP, 1,041pts] ++

+ Configuration [8CP] +

Battle-forged CP [3CP]

Detachment CP [5CP]

Sept Choice: Farsight Enclaves

+ Stratagems [-5CP] +

Emergency Dispensation (2 Relics) [-3CP]

Veteran Cadre (4+ models) [-2CP]

+ HQ [16 PL, 275pts] +

Commander in XV86 Coldstar Battlesuit [8 PL, 135pts]: Advanced targeting system [6pts], Burst cannon [8pts], High-output burst cannon [16pts], Missile pod [15pts], Talisman of Arthas Moloch

Commander in XV86 Coldstar Battlesuit [8 PL, 140pts]: 3x Fusion blaster [42pts], Shield generator [8pts]

+ Troops [6 PL, 108pts] +

Breacher Team [2 PL, 35pts]
. 4x Fire Warrior [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse blaster
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [7pts]: Photon grenades, Pulse blaster

Breacher Team [2 PL, 35pts]
. 4x Fire Warrior [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse blaster
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [7pts]: Photon grenades, Pulse blaster

Strike Team [2 PL, 38pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [10pts]: Markerlight [3pts], Photon grenades, Pulse rifle
. 4x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse rifle

+ Elites [38 PL, 618pts] +

XV8 Crisis Battlesuits [38 PL, 618pts]: Cross-linked stabiliser jets, Veteran Cadre
. Crisis Shas'ui [58pts]: 3x Airbursting fragmentation projector [24pts], XV8-02 Crisis Iridium battlesuit [10pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [58pts]: 2x Plasma rifle [16pts], Shield generator [8pts], XV8-02 Crisis Iridium battlesuit [10pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [79pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts], XV8-02 Crisis Iridium battlesuit [10pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [48pts]: 2x Plasma rifle [16pts], Shield generator [8pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [69pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [69pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [69pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [69pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts]
. Crisis Shas'vre [69pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts]
. 3x MV4 Shield Drone [30pts]: 3x Shield generator

+ Fast Attack [2 PL, 40pts] +

Tactical Drones [2 PL, 40pts]
. 4x MV4 Shield Drone [40pts]: 4x Shield generator

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (T'au Empire) [15 PL, 5CP, 242pts] ++

+ Configuration [5CP] +

Detachment CP [5CP]

Sept Choice: Farsight Enclaves

+ HQ [9 PL, 134pts] +

Cadre Fireblade [2 PL, 42pts]: Markerlight [3pts], Photon grenades, Pulse rifle

Commander in XV85 Enforcer Battlesuit [7 PL, 92pts]: 2. Through Unity, Devastation, Airbursting fragmentation projector [8pts], Shield generator [8pts], Warlord

+ Troops [6 PL, 108pts] +

Strike Team [2 PL, 35pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [7pts]: Photon grenades, Pulse rifle
. 4x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse rifle

Strike Team [2 PL, 35pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [7pts]: Photon grenades, Pulse rifle
. 4x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse rifle

Strike Team [2 PL, 38pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [10pts]: Markerlight [3pts], Photon grenades, Pulse rifle
. 4x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse rifle

++ Vanguard Detachment +1CP (T'au Empire) [36 PL, 1CP, 716pts] ++

+ Configuration [1CP] +

Detachment CP [1CP]

Sept Choice
. Custom Sept: Gifted Pilots, Stabilisation Systems

+ HQ [2 PL, 45pts] +

Ethereal [2 PL, 45pts]: Honour blade

+ Elites [30 PL, 591pts] +

Dahyak Grekh [2 PL, 20pts]: Kroot pistol, Kroot rifle

XV104 Riptide Battlesuit [14 PL, 278pts]: 2x Smart missile system [30pts], Advanced targeting system [18pts], Heavy burst cannon [35pts], Velocity tracker [10pts]

XV104 Riptide Battlesuit [14 PL, 293pts]: 2x Smart missile system [30pts], Advanced targeting system [18pts], Amplified ion accelerator, Ion accelerator [50pts], Velocity tracker [10pts]

+ Fast Attack [4 PL, 80pts] +

Tactical Drones [2 PL, 40pts]
. 4x MV4 Shield Drone [40pts]: 4x Shield generator

Tactical Drones [2 PL, 40pts]
. 4x MV4 Shield Drone [40pts]: 4x Shield generator

++ Total: [113 PL, 9CP, 1,999pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)


It's a hybrid between the old tripple riptide and drone spam lists and farsite crisis bomb list

Riptides are still money, comanders are good.

Hammerheads and skyrays need to be spammed with longstrike to be vaguely viable and die quickly.
Stealthsuits are good, goastkeels I personally don't rate.
Broadsides can work but lacking fly can get tarpitted badly.
Missilesides work railsides need magnarailrifles from the greater good book
Pathfinders die too easy with 5+ saves, he needs lots of drones.

Crisis suits only work in 1 unit with CP being fed to them.

He really would benifit from the greater good psychic awakening book.


1. No where near enough drones.
2. No crisis suits of any kind, especially commanders should have burst anything (there is 1 exception and you aren't choosing the relic that goes with it, so no Air Burst Frags, nor burst cannons of any kind). Nor should you be investing in shield generators when you can field more guns.
3. Yes you'll have to cut some suits, but that is OK, quality firepower is better than quantity models, provided you have enough shield drones.



Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/11 22:13:51


Post by: Ice_can


 Sazzlefrats wrote:
Ice_can wrote:
A list I am currently in the process of refining right now to give him a starter for 10

Spoiler:


++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (T'au Empire) [62 PL, 3CP, 1,041pts] ++

+ Configuration [8CP] +

Battle-forged CP [3CP]

Detachment CP [5CP]

Sept Choice: Farsight Enclaves

+ Stratagems [-5CP] +

Emergency Dispensation (2 Relics) [-3CP]

Veteran Cadre (4+ models) [-2CP]

+ HQ [16 PL, 275pts] +

Commander in XV86 Coldstar Battlesuit [8 PL, 135pts]: Advanced targeting system [6pts], Burst cannon [8pts], High-output burst cannon [16pts], Missile pod [15pts], Talisman of Arthas Moloch

Commander in XV86 Coldstar Battlesuit [8 PL, 140pts]: 3x Fusion blaster [42pts], Shield generator [8pts]

+ Troops [6 PL, 108pts] +

Breacher Team [2 PL, 35pts]
. 4x Fire Warrior [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse blaster
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [7pts]: Photon grenades, Pulse blaster

Breacher Team [2 PL, 35pts]
. 4x Fire Warrior [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse blaster
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [7pts]: Photon grenades, Pulse blaster

Strike Team [2 PL, 38pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [10pts]: Markerlight [3pts], Photon grenades, Pulse rifle
. 4x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse rifle

+ Elites [38 PL, 618pts] +

XV8 Crisis Battlesuits [38 PL, 618pts]: Cross-linked stabiliser jets, Veteran Cadre
. Crisis Shas'ui [58pts]: 3x Airbursting fragmentation projector [24pts], XV8-02 Crisis Iridium battlesuit [10pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [58pts]: 2x Plasma rifle [16pts], Shield generator [8pts], XV8-02 Crisis Iridium battlesuit [10pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [79pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts], XV8-02 Crisis Iridium battlesuit [10pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [48pts]: 2x Plasma rifle [16pts], Shield generator [8pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [69pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [69pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [69pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts]
. Crisis Shas'ui [69pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts]
. Crisis Shas'vre [69pts]: 3x Missile pod [45pts]
. 3x MV4 Shield Drone [30pts]: 3x Shield generator

+ Fast Attack [2 PL, 40pts] +

Tactical Drones [2 PL, 40pts]
. 4x MV4 Shield Drone [40pts]: 4x Shield generator

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (T'au Empire) [15 PL, 5CP, 242pts] ++

+ Configuration [5CP] +

Detachment CP [5CP]

Sept Choice: Farsight Enclaves

+ HQ [9 PL, 134pts] +

Cadre Fireblade [2 PL, 42pts]: Markerlight [3pts], Photon grenades, Pulse rifle

Commander in XV85 Enforcer Battlesuit [7 PL, 92pts]: 2. Through Unity, Devastation, Airbursting fragmentation projector [8pts], Shield generator [8pts], Warlord

+ Troops [6 PL, 108pts] +

Strike Team [2 PL, 35pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [7pts]: Photon grenades, Pulse rifle
. 4x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse rifle

Strike Team [2 PL, 35pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [7pts]: Photon grenades, Pulse rifle
. 4x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse rifle

Strike Team [2 PL, 38pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui [10pts]: Markerlight [3pts], Photon grenades, Pulse rifle
. 4x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle [28pts]: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse rifle

++ Vanguard Detachment +1CP (T'au Empire) [36 PL, 1CP, 716pts] ++

+ Configuration [1CP] +

Detachment CP [1CP]

Sept Choice
. Custom Sept: Gifted Pilots, Stabilisation Systems

+ HQ [2 PL, 45pts] +

Ethereal [2 PL, 45pts]: Honour blade

+ Elites [30 PL, 591pts] +

Dahyak Grekh [2 PL, 20pts]: Kroot pistol, Kroot rifle

XV104 Riptide Battlesuit [14 PL, 278pts]: 2x Smart missile system [30pts], Advanced targeting system [18pts], Heavy burst cannon [35pts], Velocity tracker [10pts]

XV104 Riptide Battlesuit [14 PL, 293pts]: 2x Smart missile system [30pts], Advanced targeting system [18pts], Amplified ion accelerator, Ion accelerator [50pts], Velocity tracker [10pts]

+ Fast Attack [4 PL, 80pts] +

Tactical Drones [2 PL, 40pts]
. 4x MV4 Shield Drone [40pts]: 4x Shield generator

Tactical Drones [2 PL, 40pts]
. 4x MV4 Shield Drone [40pts]: 4x Shield generator

++ Total: [113 PL, 9CP, 1,999pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)


It's a hybrid between the old tripple riptide and drone spam lists and farsite crisis bomb list

Riptides are still money, comanders are good.

Hammerheads and skyrays need to be spammed with longstrike to be vaguely viable and die quickly.
Stealthsuits are good, goastkeels I personally don't rate.
Broadsides can work but lacking fly can get tarpitted badly.
Missilesides work railsides need magnarailrifles from the greater good book
Pathfinders die too easy with 5+ saves, he needs lots of drones.

Crisis suits only work in 1 unit with CP being fed to them.

He really would benifit from the greater good psychic awakening book.


1. No where near enough drones.
2. No crisis suits of any kind, especially commanders should have burst anything (there is 1 exception and you aren't choosing the relic that goes with it, so no Air Burst Frags, nor burst cannons of any kind). Nor should you be investing in shield generators when you can field more guns.
3. Yes you'll have to cut some suits, but that is OK, quality firepower is better than quantity models, provided you have enough shield drones.


The lack of Drones is semi intentional, I'm trying to play my list a slightly differentwith threat saturation.
2 The commander your refering to has a distinct purpose of objectives or postman for secondary points.
I disagree on the shields to easy for marine lists and others to make 3+ saves become 5 or 6+ Saves these days. I'll trade that 1 or 2 weapons for not having lost 5 crisis suits in a turn
Airbust frags if you need to chipaway at obsec units behind a wall help, though the weapon spread is because I'm still trying to test out the lists good and bad match ups to find out what weakness it can carry and what match ups need optimised weapons.
3 Unfortunately I've not been able to get the games in to test and refine the concept yet but I agree the 9 man bomb is a bit ott, also think stealth suits are needed and drones will be mixed in and out as playtesting continues.

Thanks for the input and hope to update once lcokdown ends and games etc can be had.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/12 11:14:44


Post by: Wayniac


You know what I wish would come back? Fish of Fury (not the weird turn these to block LOS shenanigans). Absolutely loved the idea of an entire mechanized army backed up with Crisis and Broadside suits.

Biggest issue with Tau now seems to be how good drones are so you see people spamming them rather than real units.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/12 16:25:04


Post by: Sazzlefrats


I wasn't referring to a commander... the airburst + AP reduction prototype combo goes on the large crisis team. If you run the math vs the cross linked jets, AP reduction provides greater durabilty and that unit against itself wins.

Threat saturation is having volume of fire so that you are removing an average number of models off the board. But to do that you need durability so that each turn you are equally effective, until you have achieved control of the game. If you compare a sheild generator to a sheild drone.. the cost is about the same, but if the drone gets wounded... you lose a 10pt drone, if the crisis suit gets wounded... you lose 1 or 2 wounds on a 60pt model... i.e. 20pts to 40pts is lost. Which is a better trade?






Automatically Appended Next Post:
Wayniac wrote:
You know what I wish would come back? Fish of Fury (not the weird turn these to block LOS shenanigans). Absolutely loved the idea of an entire mechanized army backed up with Crisis and Broadside suits.

Biggest issue with Tau now seems to be how good drones are so you see people spamming them rather than real units.


That was fun, even if you just had two devilfish, and 3 units of crisis suits. I did that in 4th edition with farsight enclaves (when that was a real limitation on your army) and took best general in a 64 person tournament. So much fun, and your army looked like a real balanced army.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/13 14:35:25


Post by: Ice_can


 Sazzlefrats wrote:
I wasn't referring to a commander... the airburst + AP reduction prototype combo goes on the large crisis team. If you run the math vs the cross linked jets, AP reduction provides greater durabilty and that unit against itself wins.

Threat saturation is having volume of fire so that you are removing an average number of models off the board. But to do that you need durability so that each turn you are equally effective, until you have achieved control of the game. If you compare a sheild generator to a sheild drone.. the cost is about the same, but if the drone gets wounded... you lose a 10pt drone, if the crisis suit gets wounded... you lose 1 or 2 wounds on a 60pt model... i.e. 20pts to 40pts is lost. Which is a better trade?


Are you sure your playing the CFD correctly as it only works on 1 model against shooting and I have found that a lot of armies can bring CC to bare on the crisis bomb if your puting them to work, Though in all honesty I think you need to be picking the systems on the fly each each systems value is very dependent upon the opponents list, it's worth in some games and not others.

To be honest the drones I'll agree is area but I found the amount of CP required to maximise the crisis bomb limited army construction.
They can happily use 6 CP or 8CP per battle round I expect to spend 4-6 turn 2 and 2-4 turn 3 on them which is brutal but they can put so much hurt onto people it's silly.

I'm just so not into playing the same old same old triptide list, and deviation from the tried and tested is always a risk, it's not supposed to be a finished product it's trying to make crisis suits work but coming back to them having not played for a fee months and rechecking the list, it highlights part of the issue with fixing bad unit design with strategums, which is without CP they quickly get worse.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/13 23:12:11


Post by: Sazzlefrats


CFD... you mean reactive countermeasures? Yes its 1 model, and you load that model up with Sheild Gen and Iridium Armor.... makes him real tough (and the unit) against Ap 0,1, & 2 shooting, until he's dead, l use drones to soak bigger stuff. Yes that unit can use a lot of CP, but... you don't need BS2 every turn. This is a system you pick before you know your opponent. Everything else can be done on the fly.

I change my list all the time, however, dumping 28 of 36 drones (regardless of what you can replace them with) is not going to yield satisfactory results. I run somewhere between 0-2 riptides, 1-6 commanders, 3-9 crisis bomb and up to 3x3 broadsides, the only thing that is absolutely constant in my lists is the number of drones I'm running based on how competitive I judge my opponents will be. At the LFGS, I run 12-24 drones, depending who in my gaming group, I'm good with 12 to 24, but for two players its 30+ or bust. One thing I like is that FSE while the crisis bomb potentially CP intensive, its also really effective with just a single markerlight result. And later turns of the game 3+, well definately 4+ you don't need much CP.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/14 05:29:58


Post by: Ice_can


Yes correct

Maybe it's just bad luck but I found it's one of those easy enough to throw fire into the unit untill the first wound dropped and then go ham on the high AP as any wounds have to go to the wounded model, or CC though that may also be an issue of playing against marines, who just seem to be dripping in AP, and most units being no slouch in CC.

Unfortunately I find myself autoplaying the 5 markerlights on a target strategum often, unless I'm hiting MSU spam when drop zone is the go to, CNC node seems to be on avarage the better option over crosslinked, but it also turns it into needing the foot print to be able to drop 10 suits into which can be an issue.

I think I'll try a 3 man minimum buffed team and see how they perform when I can get back to playing.

May just be me but I still find that the weapons for crisis suits feel like they are pointed from comanders first and then crisis suits are just expected to pay the same.

Broadsides with the maga rifkes look nice but lacking fly just feels like suck a liability for a number of match ups especially with the number of armies starting to bring close combat threats that rely on tripoint


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/14 12:50:17


Post by: Wayniac


So out of curiosity, I've been looking at Tau stuff since I've never actually played them but have been interested in them maybe 5 or so times since they first came out in 2001 (which I fondly remember). With the current meta:

1) I know Drones are good, can you avoid doing a ton of drone spam and be good? I just don't relish the idea of a Tau army of mostly Shield Drones or whatever; a big unit or two small units or something is fine.

2) Are Crisis Suits decent again? They have always been one of the cooler parts of Tau. If so what weapons? Back in my day (heh) I remember you had like Plasma/Missile or Burst/Missile and stuff like that and they had cool names like Death Blossom or Fireknife. I guess now you want to specialize?

3) How about Broadsides and tanks? Hammerheads look really cool, and the new Broadside models look super cool to me (especially compared to the old one that had the railguns over is shoulders). I'm sure Riptides are still OP but they look awesome too.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/14 13:11:51


Post by: Sterling191


Wayniac wrote:
So out of curiosity, I've been looking at Tau stuff since I've never actually played them but have been interested in them maybe 5 or so times since they first came out in 2001 (which I fondly remember). With the current meta:

1) I know Drones are good, can you avoid doing a ton of drone spam and be good? I just don't relish the idea of a Tau army of mostly Shield Drones or whatever; a big unit or two small units or something is fine.

2) Are Crisis Suits decent again? They have always been one of the cooler parts of Tau. If so what weapons? Back in my day (heh) I remember you had like Plasma/Missile or Burst/Missile and stuff like that and they had cool names like Death Blossom or Fireknife. I guess now you want to specialize?

3) How about Broadsides and tanks? Hammerheads look really cool, and the new Broadside models look super cool to me (especially compared to the old one that had the railguns over is shoulders). I'm sure Riptides are still OP but they look awesome too.


First very important question: how competitive are you looking to get? If you're looking at bleeding-edge top-table or bust, there are certain list-building concessions that have to be made. If on the other hand you're looking at friendly semi-competitive play, there are a *LOT* more units that more than earn their keep.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/14 13:48:55


Post by: Wayniac


Sterling191 wrote:
Wayniac wrote:
So out of curiosity, I've been looking at Tau stuff since I've never actually played them but have been interested in them maybe 5 or so times since they first came out in 2001 (which I fondly remember). With the current meta:

1) I know Drones are good, can you avoid doing a ton of drone spam and be good? I just don't relish the idea of a Tau army of mostly Shield Drones or whatever; a big unit or two small units or something is fine.

2) Are Crisis Suits decent again? They have always been one of the cooler parts of Tau. If so what weapons? Back in my day (heh) I remember you had like Plasma/Missile or Burst/Missile and stuff like that and they had cool names like Death Blossom or Fireknife. I guess now you want to specialize?

3) How about Broadsides and tanks? Hammerheads look really cool, and the new Broadside models look super cool to me (especially compared to the old one that had the railguns over is shoulders). I'm sure Riptides are still OP but they look awesome too.


First very important question: how competitive are you looking to get? If you're looking at bleeding-edge top-table or bust, there are certain list-building concessions that have to be made. If on the other hand you're looking at friendly semi-competitive play, there are a *LOT* more units that more than earn their keep.
I'd say somewhere in between. Semi-competitive? Not like final round LVO ITC spam list but not lose every game at the local game store because GW sucks at balance either.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/14 13:57:55


Post by: Sterling191


Wayniac wrote:
I'd say somewhere in between. Semi-competitive? Not like final round LVO ITC spam list but not lose every game at the local game store because GW sucks at balance either.


This actually provides for a ton of unit variety in my experience. So to run down your specific questions with specific answers:

1) You can likely get away with attached drone units instead of going for the big blob o drones. The duos from Fire Warrior teams and Commanders for instance add up quickly, and can still provide a lot of survivability benefits for Riptides, Commanders and Crisis Suits. Plus its far less obnoxious to play against, so thats a plus in friendly environments. I typically run about 12-18 in that manner and do well.

2) Crisis Suits are back in town, but require the FSE "Veteran Cadre" strat to function. Pushing to a base 3+ BS / 4+ WS is huuuuuge when combined with the various support tools available in the Tau codex via strats and other abilities. As to weapons, that's a very individualized question. CiBs and Missiles seem to be the most common uses at present, but there are cases to be made for massed Burst Cannons, or possibly even flamers (the latter being not the most effective, but in a friendlier environment, with the right build thanks to PA they can do work). I personally go for dual CiB + ATS on my six-pack of madlads.

3) Broadsides are very potent. Missilesides with reroll support will delete whatever you point them at, while the new Magna rail rifle gives Railsides a new lease on life. Their lack of fly is an issue, but that's what drones and Fire Warriors are for (also the top floor of ruins). Hammerheads likewise can also do work, though they generally rely on being part of the Longstrike-star configuration.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/14 14:04:18


Post by: Wayniac


Hmm. I'm not too interested in FSE but that's good to know and something to consider.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/14 14:12:05


Post by: Sterling191


Wayniac wrote:
Hmm. I'm not too interested in FSE but that's good to know and something to consider.


Enclaves got a massive boost with PA. Their Sept tenet is basically a baked in SM Captain + LT while close in, and they are the only Sept that can double up on Commanders in a detachment.

A Vanguard of a Veteran Cadre, a pair of Firesights and a duo of Commanders is an exceptional supporting component to just about any Tau army.

Personally, their aggressive nature is a whole lot of fun to play.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/14 17:55:43


Post by: killerpenguin


Sterling191 wrote:
Wayniac wrote:
Hmm. I'm not too interested in FSE but that's good to know and something to consider.


Enclaves got a massive boost with PA. Their Sept tenet is basically a baked in SM Captain + LT while close in, and they are the only Sept that can double up on Commanders in a detachment.

A Vanguard of a Veteran Cadre, a pair of Firesights and a duo of Commanders is an exceptional supporting component to just about any Tau army.

Personally, their aggressive nature is a whole lot of fun to play.


I second this.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/15 00:42:55


Post by: Wayniac


I've read on Goonhammer that you also consider doing the DIY sept and taking the bonus that increases the AP of missile pods and one of the other good ones.

Do you want to take multiples of the same weapon then on Crisis suits? Like all of one type rather than the old plasma/missile type combos?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/15 04:02:29


Post by: Sterling191


Wayniac wrote:
I've read on Goonhammer that you also consider doing the DIY sept and taking the bonus that increases the AP of missile pods and one of the other good ones.


If you're running Missilesides or Missile Commanders that Sept tenet is solid. Most other units dont generate the amount of firepower necessary for it to pay off.

Wayniac wrote:

Do you want to take multiples of the same weapon then on Crisis suits? Like all of one type rather than the old plasma/missile type combos?


Mono-tasking is generally the way to go.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/15 06:22:30


Post by: gmaleron


Hey guys!, looking at jumping back into Tau with the Army focused around tanks. Idea is the field and armored company of sorts and take as many Hammerheads as possible which includes their FW variants. However when it comes to the Fire Support Hammerheads I am somewhat at a loss as to what to equip them with. Has anyone here had experience running them and what advice would you give as to how to equip them? I appreciate your feedback and thank you!


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/15 07:54:03


Post by: Ice_can


 gmaleron wrote:
Hey guys!, looking at jumping back into Tau with the Army focused around tanks. Idea is the field and armored company of sorts and take as many Hammerheads as possible which includes their FW variants. However when it comes to the Fire Support Hammerheads I am somewhat at a loss as to what to equip them with. Has anyone here had experience running them and what advice would you give as to how to equip them? I appreciate your feedback and thank you!

I would be wary of the support tanks as they are Out of Production and have been for I think a long time.
GW is supposed to be producing new imperial armour books, however as they have been moved to main 40k studio, I expect them to be hit with no model =No rules.
Longstrike 3 hammerheads and 3 skyrays should allow you to field your armoured force though.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/15 12:47:09


Post by: carldooley


how does Longstrike buff Skyrays?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/15 15:26:19


Post by: Ice_can


 carldooley wrote:
how does Longstrike buff Skyrays?

He doesn't, however converting up OOP and hencey likely to be removed from match play rules units is not a smart move in my opinion.
The poster wants to play an armour focused list, his options are rather limited for vehicals in Tau, what's your suggestion?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/15 15:47:36


Post by: Yaktan


Yeah, there was a Tau list built around vehicles that was doing well at tournaments a little while back. Longstrike and hammerheads were the core, but it did include a couple of skyrays, and if I remember correctly also a couple of Sunshark Bombers.

All the hammerheads took seeker missiles, and I am pretty sure it went ham on the alpha strike, since the bombers get seeker missiles as well. It was when Knights were super common, if I remember correctly, so if you go first you can alpha down a castelin pretty reliably, and then mop up.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/15 19:52:23


Post by: Sazzlefrats


Yaktan wrote:
Yeah, there was a Tau list built around vehicles that was doing well at tournaments a little while back. Longstrike and hammerheads were the core, but it did include a couple of skyrays, and if I remember correctly also a couple of Sunshark Bombers.

All the hammerheads took seeker missiles, and I am pretty sure it went ham on the alpha strike, since the bombers get seeker missiles as well. It was when Knights were super common, if I remember correctly, so if you go first you can alpha down a castelin pretty reliably, and then mop up.


And uphill fight against battlesuit tau, and almost guaranteed loss if you went second.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/18 16:18:36


Post by: addnid


Hi everyone, sorry for asking this but I can't find the strat I was '"assured existed" by my tau oppnent friday, which gave whole unit of nine crisis suits a feel no pain roll of 5+++ (for 2 PC, so faire stuff I mean it doesn't seem OP or anything, just - very - good) for the turn.
Can you guys please confirm existence of this strat, and where it comes from ? Perhaps it is a FE thing (he was playing full FE, which was really cool BTW)
Thanks again !


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/18 16:28:20


Post by: Sterling191


 addnid wrote:
Hi everyone, sorry for asking this but I can't find the strat I was '"assured existed" by my tau oppnent friday, which gave whole unit of nine crisis suits a feel no pain roll of 5+++ (for 2 PC, so faire stuff I mean it doesn't seem OP or anything, just - very - good) for the turn.
Can you guys please confirm existence of this strat, and where it comes from ? Perhaps it is a FE thing (he was playing full FE, which was really cool BTW)
Thanks again !


Defense in Numbers. May only be used on FSE Crisis Suits or Bodyguards. Its from The Greater Good PA supplement. It can only be played in the Shooting or Fight phases, and only lasts for that phase.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/18 19:14:44


Post by: addnid


Sterling191 wrote:
 addnid wrote:
Hi everyone, sorry for asking this but I can't find the strat I was '"assured existed" by my tau oppnent friday, which gave whole unit of nine crisis suits a feel no pain roll of 5+++ (for 2 PC, so faire stuff I mean it doesn't seem OP or anything, just - very - good) for the turn.
Can you guys please confirm existence of this strat, and where it comes from ? Perhaps it is a FE thing (he was playing full FE, which was really cool BTW)
Thanks again !


Defense in Numbers. May only be used on FSE Crisis Suits or Bodyguards. Its from The Greater Good PA supplement. It can only be played in the Shooting or Fight phases, and only lasts for that phase.


Ah thanks Sterling. Ok just for the phase, noted !


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/19 01:51:24


Post by: Chenko_chenko


Howdy.

I run Farsight Enclaves and have been able to have a nice versatile list that could mix anti vehicle/anti infantry/anti characters... well until my friend brought out this list - I've had five tries (I've gone second ever time) and am generally tabled by turn two.

Any ideas how/if I could beat this with my red boys:
2000 pts (4CP net of Chapter Master)
Outrider Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
Shield Captain
- 3 x Pallas Grav tank

1 Vanguard Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
1 Shield Captain on Jetbike
- 3 x Caladius Grav Tank

1 Vanguard Detachment: (Iron Hands + 1CP)
1 Chapter Master
1 Captain
3 Whirlwind Hyperious
2 Stormtallon Gunships

It's an entire army of 80+ hitting on 2s re rolling failed hits with -2+ AP, made up of 30 S6 shots and 50+ S8 shots.

I completely flummoxed - your thoughts would be appreciated.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/19 02:26:15


Post by: Ice_can


Chenko_chenko wrote:
Howdy.

I run Farsight Enclaves and have been able to have a nice versatile list that could mix anti vehicle/anti infantry/anti characters... well until my friend brought out this list - I've had five tries (I've gone second ever time) and am generally tabled by turn two.

Any ideas how/if I could beat this with my red boys:
2000 pts (4CP net of Chapter Master)
Outrider Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
Shield Captain
- 3 x Pallas Grav tank

1 Vanguard Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
1 Shield Captain on Jetbike
- 3 x Caladius Grav Tank

1 Vanguard Detachment: (Iron Hands + 1CP)
1 Chapter Master
1 Captain
3 Whirlwind Hyperious
2 Stormtallon Gunships

It's an entire army of 80+ hitting on 2s re rolling failed hits with -2+ AP, made up of 30 S6 shots and 50+ S8 shots.

I completely flummoxed - your thoughts would be appreciated.

Something doesn't add up about that
Custodes don't have S8 shooting vehicals.
They have S7 in volume or S9 at like 6 shots, the only S8 is avarage of 12 shots from the whirlwinds.

Shounds like you playing against some wonky interpretation of custodes rules is the primary issue, HBC shoukd pick up Pallus tanks easy enough, the Caladius tanks are a pain to kill

But the Whirlwinds, a fussion mander should do well enough at charging in and mwlting the chaptor master/LT or a Hyperios if needed. Also drones should more than ensure that atleast 1 round of shooting can be tanked okay.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/19 13:28:12


Post by: Sterling191


Ice_can wrote:

Something doesn't add up about that
Custodes don't have S8 shooting vehicals.
They have S7 in volume or S9 at like 6 shots, the only S8 is avarage of 12 shots from the whirlwinds.


If memory serves, they used to. This looks suspiciously like a pre-final FW codex list for the golden lads. I recall that a lot of the shooting characteristics were altered.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/19 14:53:38


Post by: Ice_can


Sterling191 wrote:
Ice_can wrote:

Something doesn't add up about that
Custodes don't have S8 shooting vehicals.
They have S7 in volume or S9 at like 6 shots, the only S8 is avarage of 12 shots from the whirlwinds.


If memory serves, they used to. This looks suspiciously like a pre-final FW codex list for the golden lads. I recall that a lot of the shooting characteristics were altered.

The beta Custodes rules were changed mosy have been close to a year ago now though.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/19 21:33:31


Post by: Chenko_chenko


Ice_can wrote:
Chenko_chenko wrote:
Howdy.

I run Farsight Enclaves and have been able to have a nice versatile list that could mix anti vehicle/anti infantry/anti characters... well until my friend brought out this list - I've had five tries (I've gone second ever time) and am generally tabled by turn two.

Any ideas how/if I could beat this with my red boys:
2000 pts (4CP net of Chapter Master)
Outrider Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
Shield Captain
- 3 x Pallas Grav tank

1 Vanguard Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
1 Shield Captain on Jetbike
- 3 x Caladius Grav Tank

1 Vanguard Detachment: (Iron Hands + 1CP)
1 Chapter Master
1 Captain
3 Whirlwind Hyperious
2 Stormtallon Gunships

It's an entire army of 80+ hitting on 2s re rolling failed hits with -2+ AP, made up of 30 S6 shots and 50+ S8 shots.

I completely flummoxed - your thoughts would be appreciated.

Something doesn't add up about that
Custodes don't have S8 shooting vehicals.
They have S7 in volume or S9 at like 6 shots, the only S8 is avarage of 12 shots from the whirlwinds.

Shounds like you playing against some wonky interpretation of custodes rules is the primary issue, HBC shoukd pick up Pallus tanks easy enough, the Caladius tanks are a pain to kill

But the Whirlwinds, a fussion mander should do well enough at charging in and mwlting the chaptor master/LT or a Hyperios if needed. Also drones should more than ensure that atleast 1 round of shooting can be tanked okay.


My mistake between with the S9 - they're S7. It doesn't half feel like S9 though when pretty much every shot wounds on 3. His Caladiuses always have the range on my markerlights so my 3 man Broadsides' 6 shots with their Magna rifle are comparatively inefficient.

My list was:
Farsight Enclaves Air wing detachment (+1 CP)
1 x Razorshark w/Burst Cannon
2 x Remora Drones (2 units of 1)

Farsight Enclaves Battalion detachment (+5 -4)
2 x Cadre Fireblade w/2 shield drones
1 x Coldstar w/2 fusion blasers + 1 flamer

3 x 5 man Fire Warriors (1 with 2 shield drones)

1 Technical Drone squad
1 Riptide with Amplified Ion Accelerator + 2 Plasma Rifles
3 x Stealth Suits w/2 shield drones
3 veteran Crisis Suits w/ missile pods, velocity trackers and shield generators
1 x Ghostkeel w/ Fusion Obliterator (Died Turn 1)

3 Broadsides w/Magna Rifles/Plasma Rifles & 2 shield drones

Outrider detachment (+1 CP)
1 Cadre Fireblade
1 Coldstar w/ 2 Fusions Blasters, 1 Shield Generator and 1 Flamer

1 5 man Pathfinder with Rail Rifles (Pulse Accelerator Drone & Grav Inhibitor Drone
1 5 man Pathfinder with Ion Rifles (2 Shield Drones)
1 5 man Pathfinder with Ion Rifles
1 5 man Vespid team.



Obviously it's too frail and needs more drones but its just I'm wayyyy off, I can't get to the Hyperioses and any attempt to do so I'm just dissolved by the Custodes' tanks - that's if I have anything left that hasn't been wiped by the Stormtallons and the customary Orbital bombardment.

I'm out manoeuvred, out ranged and outgunned.





Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/19 22:19:31


Post by: Ice_can


Chenko_chenko wrote:
Spoiler:
Ice_can wrote:
Chenko_chenko wrote:
Howdy.

I run Farsight Enclaves and have been able to have a nice versatile list that could mix anti vehicle/anti infantry/anti characters... well until my friend brought out this list - I've had five tries (I've gone second ever time) and am generally tabled by turn two.

Any ideas how/if I could beat this with my red boys:
2000 pts (4CP net of Chapter Master)
Outrider Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
Shield Captain
- 3 x Pallas Grav tank

1 Vanguard Detachment: (Custodes + 1CP)
1 Shield Captain on Jetbike
- 3 x Caladius Grav Tank

1 Vanguard Detachment: (Iron Hands + 1CP)
1 Chapter Master
1 Captain
3 Whirlwind Hyperious
2 Stormtallon Gunships

It's an entire army of 80+ hitting on 2s re rolling failed hits with -2+ AP, made up of 30 S6 shots and 50+ S8 shots.

I completely flummoxed - your thoughts would be appreciated.

Something doesn't add up about that
Custodes don't have S8 shooting vehicals.
They have S7 in volume or S9 at like 6 shots, the only S8 is avarage of 12 shots from the whirlwinds.

Shounds like you playing against some wonky interpretation of custodes rules is the primary issue, HBC shoukd pick up Pallus tanks easy enough, the Caladius tanks are a pain to kill

But the Whirlwinds, a fussion mander should do well enough at charging in and mwlting the chaptor master/LT or a Hyperios if needed. Also drones should more than ensure that atleast 1 round of shooting can be tanked okay.


My mistake between with the S9 - they're S7. It doesn't half feel like S9 though when pretty much every shot wounds on 3. His Caladiuses always have the range on my markerlights so my 3 man Broadsides' 6 shots with their Magna rifle are comparatively inefficient.

My list was:
Farsight Enclaves Air wing detachment (+1 CP)Remove
1 x Razorshark w/Burst CannonRemove
2 x Remora Drones (2 units of 1)Remove

Farsight Enclaves Battalion detachment (+5 -4)
2 x Cadre Fireblade w/2 shield dronesRemove
1 x Coldstar w/2 fusion blasers + 1 flamer

3 x 5 man Fire Warriors (1 with 2 shield drones)

1 Technical Drone squad
1 Riptide with Amplified Ion Accelerator + 2 Plasma Rifles
3 x Stealth Suits w/2 shield drones
3 veteran Crisis Suits w/ missile pods, velocity trackers and shield generators
1 x Ghostkeel w/ Fusion Obliterator (Died Turn 1)

3 Broadsides w/Magna Rifles/Plasma Rifles & 2 shield drones

Outrider detachment (+1 CP)
1 Cadre Fireblade
1 Coldstar w/ 2 Fusions Blasters, 1 Shield Generator and 1 Flamer

1 5 man Pathfinder with Rail Rifles (Pulse Accelerator Drone & Grav Inhibitor DroneRemove
1 5 man Pathfinder with Ion Rifles (2 Shield Drones)Remove1 5 man Pathfinder with Ion RiflesRemove
1 5 man Vespid team.Remove

Obviously it's too frail and needs more drones but its just I'm wayyyy off, I can't get to the Hyperioses and any attempt to do so I'm just dissolved by the Custodes' tanks - that's if I have anything left that hasn't been wiped by the Stormtallons and the customary Orbital bombardment.

I'm out manoeuvred, out ranged and outgunned.



The broadsides should have Velocity Tracker and be in a custom sept detachment to gain the Move and shoot without penalty and hardened warheads buffs, along with the Riptide, I would also advise for another HBC riptide, Velocity Trackers all round, see how his caladious like being hit on 3+, 4+ if he brings the banner of -1.

Also why are your coldstars taking flamers? Go all in on fusion the weapon they excel with.
And why does your vetren crisis suit team have more support systems than weapons just no, take a shield on the guy with iridium armour maybe and then use drones, strategum stacking can have them hitting on 1+ with reroll ones.

More commanders would also help as his tanks can not target charictors.
Is this list just for against you or is this just his take all comers list? As it has some hard counters.

But it also depends on mission set and terrain tules your using ad his list seems built to abuse things and you list is well not exactly likely to loose you friends in a casual meta.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/19 23:00:01


Post by: rbstr


Chenko_chenko wrote:
Obviously it's too frail and needs more drones but its just I'm wayyyy off, I can't get to the Hyperioses and any attempt to do so I'm just dissolved by the Custodes' tanks - that's if I have anything left that hasn't been wiped by the Stormtallons and the customary Orbital bombardment.

I'm out manoeuvred, out ranged and outgunned.


There are several choices here that aren't making much sense:
You're not really playing to the FSE rules which let you take more high-BS units and promote being close.
Commanders with Flamers - you're wasting that BS2+ here. I'm not super against a shield on them with 3 guns, but no flamers.
Broadsides - I love the Heavy Rail Rifle and Magna upgrade, even if they aren't the most efficient. But take the SMS on them not Plasma Rifles, it's just better incidental shooting. Matches range.
Same on the Riptide. I love the prototype ion gun but the SMS will plink at stuff better than the plasma rifles. An ion tide needs to stay away from stuff.
Your vet Crisis should probably be taking 3xmissile pods or whichever guns.
I feel like the Ghostkeel just isn't going to work great against Custodes, even if I like it generally. The custards are just too accurate.
Speaking of prototype weapons. I'm not sure that bringing 3 is a great use of your CP.
I'd drop a fireblade, no need for 3 of them.
Bring more shield drones

Toooooo many pathfinders. FSE, by virtue of their buffs, rely on MLs less than other Tau (and special weapons pathfinders are just very squishy and not points-efficient to protect with Shield Drones either.
There are several markerlight strategems that you can use to get your re-roll ones and the saved points will go to Commander upgrades, shield drones.


Things to think about:
One of FSE's biggest boons is that they can take more commanders. You should.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/20 22:53:47


Post by: Chenko_chenko


rbstr wrote:
Chenko_chenko wrote:
Obviously it's too frail and needs more drones but its just I'm wayyyy off, I can't get to the Hyperioses and any attempt to do so I'm just dissolved by the Custodes' tanks - that's if I have anything left that hasn't been wiped by the Stormtallons and the customary Orbital bombardment.

I'm out manoeuvred, out ranged and outgunned.


There are several choices here that aren't making much sense:
You're not really playing to the FSE rules which let you take more high-BS units and promote being close.
Commanders with Flamers - you're wasting that BS2+ here. I'm not super against a shield on them with 3 guns, but no flamers.
Broadsides - I love the Heavy Rail Rifle and Magna upgrade, even if they aren't the most efficient. But take the SMS on them not Plasma Rifles, it's just better incidental shooting. Matches range.
Same on the Riptide. I love the prototype ion gun but the SMS will plink at stuff better than the plasma rifles. An ion tide needs to stay away from stuff.
Your vet Crisis should probably be taking 3xmissile pods or whichever guns.
I feel like the Ghostkeel just isn't going to work great against Custodes, even if I like it generally. The custards are just too accurate.
Speaking of prototype weapons. I'm not sure that bringing 3 is a great use of your CP.
I'd drop a fireblade, no need for 3 of them.
Bring more shield drones

Toooooo many pathfinders. FSE, by virtue of their buffs, rely on MLs less than other Tau (and special weapons pathfinders are just very squishy and not points-efficient to protect with Shield Drones either.
There are several markerlight strategems that you can use to get your re-roll ones and the saved points will go to Commander upgrades, shield drones.


Things to think about:
One of FSE's biggest boons is that they can take more commanders. You should.



Oof, so I got close today, he modified his list, 3 Stormhawk Interceptors, 2 Calladius, 2 Pallas, 3 Hyperos (Chapter master + Lieutenant) Talemon Heavy Dreadnought & an Allarus Shield Captain.

I brought 3 ghostkeels with with Cyclic Ion Rakers/2 fusions + velocity tracker, 3 6 man stealth teams with 2 fusions (with velocity trackers), 1 Sky Ray, 1 Riptide with Amplified Ion Accelerator (I rolled 7 ones in Turn 1 on his saves) and 3 coldstars with 3 fusions and one with fusion blades.

I killed everything but those damn Hyperios - hitting on 2s/3s, rerolling 1s/2s, wounding on 2s/3s, rerolling 1s, drones/battlesuits and 5+ FNP - they're my damn kryptonite, I don't suppose you've got any ideas how to deal with them?

EDIT: Just realised he wasn't playing under the February Space Marine FAQ so was in Devastator Doctrine for the who game.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/21 18:51:25


Post by: Yaktan


He has custodes, he should not get doctrines at all, period.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/21 20:55:42


Post by: Sterling191


How exactly is he pushing his Hyperios to a 5+++?

There’s funny business going on here.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/21 22:46:15


Post by: Chenko_chenko


Sterling191 wrote:
How exactly is he pushing his Hyperios to a 5+++?

There’s funny business going on here.


I think it was a custom chapter - not sure if an Iron Hands Successor. The Codex Astartes is a bit dense for me. Does that sound fishy?

EDIT: I think he misread 'warded' which gives 5+++ against mortal wounds.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Yaktan wrote:
He has custodes, he should not get doctrines at all, period.


Well I'll be, thanks for letting me know.

I haven't gone up against too many soup lists, beyond GSCs/Tyranids and AM/Knights.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/23 21:38:16


Post by: killerpenguin


Hi guys! Had a game today, and it was a real revelation for me. I made some 5 man movement trays for my breachers and used them for the first time, it was a real game changer. The movement phase got a lot faster, moving a unit in the time I usually use to move one model. In addition to that I used a chess clock for the first time. My opponents and I usually finish round 3, sometimes round 4, in the 3 hours we need to play one game. This is rarely enough for me to make enough to get the points I need for a victory. Using the clock my opponent was playing a lot faster than expected, the intensity and excitement level was higher and it was just a lot more fun. We needed to think and act fast, we made some mistakes, but that just made it more fun.

We played itc mission “what’s yours is mine”, vanguard strike. Alpha legion vs FSE, 2000 pts. It ended i my favour 35 - 32. Had we played one round less, it would be his victory. Very fun game, just wanted to share this experience with you. My list below if anyone’s interested.

Spoiler:


Triple FSE batallion

3 x 3 cib’s and ats enforcers
3 x 3 MP’s and ats Coldstars
7 x 5 breacher squads with 1 guardian drone and shield drone
1 x 9 breachers
1 x 5 strike team with markerlight
3 x 4 shield drones
1 x 7 xv8 bodyguards - 6 with 2 cib’s and ats, and 1 with ABF, reactive countermeasures and iridium with 5 shield drones.






Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/24 17:32:47


Post by: Jestor


Heya all,

Just breaking in to Tau. I was wondering if there is a good resource that gives a breakdown of the units with good positives and negatives and the weapon options.

Thanks!


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/24 17:51:07


Post by: carldooley


Jestor wrote:
Heya all,

Just breaking in to Tau. I was wondering if there is a good resource that gives a breakdown of the units with good positives and negatives and the weapon options.

Thanks!


The Codex?
Oh wait, you wanted a GOOD resource. Sorry, no idea.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/25 09:21:01


Post by: killerpenguin


I run a version of Sieglers FSE list, i think he runs mostly AFP on his bydyguards now, but anyways.. My list has 3x3 cib enforcers, 3x4 MP coldstars, 45 breachers, ~37 drones and 7 xv8 bodyguards. I had My first tournament with the list this weekend and it feel like it playing really slow. The game usually ends after round 3. This is a problem for me since the list really shines after round 3. One of the elements to the problem is the time I use to saviour protocols,moving and take saves on the 14 drone units and 9 breacher units. The other element is the time my opponent uses, which varies greatly. We didn’t use a chess clock, but I’m honestly not sure if I’d benefit from it considering all the time I use on saves and manoeuvring my small units. Any tips?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/25 10:39:27


Post by: AceXT


Jestor wrote:
Heya all,

Just breaking in to Tau. I was wondering if there is a good resource that gives a breakdown of the units with good positives and negatives and the weapon options.

Thanks!


The Start Competing series on Goonhammer is generally pretty good. Their Tau article is here, although it hasn't been updated for Psychic Awakening yet.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/25 17:10:56


Post by: Yaktan


 killerpenguin wrote:
I run a version of Sieglers FSE list, i think he runs mostly AFP on his bydyguards now, but anyways.. My list has 3x3 cib enforcers, 3x4 MP coldstars, 45 breachers, ~37 drones and 7 xv8 bodyguards. I had My first tournament with the list this weekend and it feel like it playing really slow. The game usually ends after round 3. This is a problem for me since the list really shines after round 3. One of the elements to the problem is the time I use to saviour protocols,moving and take saves on the 14 drone units and 9 breacher units. The other element is the time my opponent uses, which varies greatly. We didn’t use a chess clock, but I’m honestly not sure if I’d benefit from it considering all the time I use on saves and manoeuvring my small units. Any tips?


I have similar issues with things taking forever with my army. Only 6 breacher squads, but I also have 20 strikers and my big stealth blob. I find that not worrying about exact placement makes things go much faster, though if you are being competetive and relying on drones, that could backfire. (I played vs. another tau who had that issue--he did not deploy quite right so I was able to kill stuff with drones still around, just out of range).

For me, it seems like rolling all my shooting is what really takes forever. Maybe I just need to learn to roll faster? The breachers are not too bad, 10 shots a squad, but the 30 shots from a striker squad is harder.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/25 20:30:21


Post by: killerpenguin


Yaktan wrote:
 killerpenguin wrote:
I run a version of Sieglers FSE list, i think he runs mostly AFP on his bydyguards now, but anyways.. My list has 3x3 cib enforcers, 3x4 MP coldstars, 45 breachers, ~37 drones and 7 xv8 bodyguards. I had My first tournament with the list this weekend and it feel like it playing really slow. The game usually ends after round 3. This is a problem for me since the list really shines after round 3. One of the elements to the problem is the time I use to saviour protocols,moving and take saves on the 14 drone units and 9 breacher units. The other element is the time my opponent uses, which varies greatly. We didn’t use a chess clock, but I’m honestly not sure if I’d benefit from it considering all the time I use on saves and manoeuvring my small units. Any tips?


I have similar issues with things taking forever with my army. Only 6 breacher squads, but I also have 20 strikers and my big stealth blob. I find that not worrying about exact placement makes things go much faster, though if you are being competetive and relying on drones, that could backfire. (I played vs. another tau who had that issue--he did not deploy quite right so I was able to kill stuff with drones still around, just out of range).

For me, it seems like rolling all my shooting is what really takes forever. Maybe I just need to learn to roll faster? The breachers are not too bad, 10 shots a squad, but the 30 shots from a striker squad is harder.


Another issue is measuring which breacher models are within 5”, 10”, and 15” and Rolling them separately.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/25 23:24:26


Post by: Sterling191


 AceXT wrote:
Jestor wrote:
Heya all,

Just breaking in to Tau. I was wondering if there is a good resource that gives a breakdown of the units with good positives and negatives and the weapon options.

Thanks!


The Start Competing series on Goonhammer is generally pretty good. Their Tau article is here, although it hasn't been updated for Psychic Awakening yet.


It appears to be up to date, insofar as anything can be that released just before COVID shut everything down.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/26 00:39:49


Post by: Chenko_chenko


Chenko_chenko wrote:
Sterling191 wrote:
How exactly is he pushing his Hyperios to a 5+++?

There’s funny business going on here.


I think it was a custom chapter - not sure if an Iron Hands Successor. The Codex Astartes is a bit dense for me. Does that sound fishy?

EDIT: I think he misread 'warded' which gives 5+++ against mortal wounds.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Yaktan wrote:
He has custodes, he should not get doctrines at all, period.


Well I'll be, thanks for letting me know.

I haven't gone up against too many soup lists, beyond GSCs/Tyranids and AM/Knights.


Not that anyone cares but I was finally able to win, albeit with a very unconventional list (Zero Shield Drones)

Battalion Detachment
2 x Cadre Fireblades
3 x Five Man Breacher teams

1 Ghostkeel with Cyclic Raker, Flamer, Target lock, Shield generator
1 Ghostkeel with Cyclic Raker, Fusion Blasters, Target lock, Shield generator
1 Ghostkeel with Fusion Obliterator, Fusion Blasters, Target lock, Shield generator

Vanguard Detachment
1 Coldstar Warlord, 2 fusion Blades, 1 fusion Blaster, Shield Generator, Through Boldness Victory

3 x six man Stealth team, 4 x burst Cannons, 2 x Fusion Blasters, 6 x Shield Generator

1 x nine man veteran Crisis Team, 3 x Iridium armour, 9 x Missile Pods, 9 x Cyclic Ion Blasters, 6 x Fusions Blasters, 3 x Airbursting Fragmentation Projectors (Reactive Countermeasures)



Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/05/26 21:47:05


Post by: killerpenguin


Hi guys! Had a game today, and it was a real revelation for me. I made some 5 man movement trays for my breachers and used them for the first time, it was a real game changer. The movement phase got a lot faster, moving a unit in the time I usually use to move one model. In addition to that I used a chess clock for the first time. My opponents and I usually finish round 3, sometimes round 4, in the 3 hours we need to play one game. This is rarely enough for me to make enough to get the points I need for a victory. Using the clock my opponent was playing a lot faster than expected, the intensity and excitement level was higher and it was just a lot more fun. We needed to think and act fast, we made some mistakes, but that just made it more fun.

We played itc mission “what’s yours is mine”, vanguard strike. Alpha legion vs FSE, 2000 pts. It ended i my favour 35 - 32. Had we played one round less, it would be his victory. Very fun game, just wanted to share this experience with you. My list below if anyone’s interested.

Spoiler:


Triple FSE batallion

3 x 3 cib’s and ats enforcers
3 x 3 MP’s and ats Coldstars
7 x 5 breacher squads with 1 guardian drone and shield drone
1 x 9 breachers
1 x 5 strike team with markerlight
3 x 4 shield drones
1 x 7 xv8 bodyguards - 6 with 2 cib’s and ats, and 1 with ABF, reactive countermeasures and iridium with 5 shield drones.





Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/05 12:28:31


Post by: Ice_can


So what's everyone's thoughts Tau wise on how your going to be structuring your lists?

So far it's certainly looking like putting everything into one battalion is achievable, Howevrr with the commander limit it does seem like FSE will be the way to play IMHO unless it gets Errata'd.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/05 13:49:51


Post by: Sterling191


Its really going to come down to how the Commander limit is handled. The one per-detachment restriction really seems to run counter to the design intent of 9th to reduce detachment numbers.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/05 17:09:46


Post by: killerpenguin


Ice_can wrote:
So what's everyone's thoughts Tau wise on how your going to be structuring your lists?

So far it's certainly looking like putting everything into one battalion is achievable, Howevrr with the commander limit it does seem like FSE will be the way to play IMHO unless it gets Errata'd.


I'd be very surprised if the errata'd the new commander rule so soon after releasing it. It seems it'll penalize us quite a bit CP wise to get all commanders now though. Hopefully if just costs 1 CP for a patrol detachment so we can bring 4 more commanders and 2 troops in two patrol detachments in addition to a battalion, costing us a total of 2 CP. I think that'd be a good trade.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/05 17:13:24


Post by: Ice_can


 killerpenguin wrote:
Ice_can wrote:
So what's everyone's thoughts Tau wise on how your going to be structuring your lists?

So far it's certainly looking like putting everything into one battalion is achievable, Howevrr with the commander limit it does seem like FSE will be the way to play IMHO unless it gets Errata'd.


I'd be very surprised if the errata'd the new commander rule so soon after releasing it. It seems it'll penalize us quite a bit CP wise to get all commanders now though. Hopefully if just costs 1 CP for a patrol detachment so we can bring 4 more commanders and 2 troops in two patrol detachments in addition to a battalion, costing us a total of 2 CP. I think that'd be a good trade.

Given GW referenced the Raiding party rule for Drukari I suspect pateol is probably 2CP as that would leave tripple patrol Drukari CP Neutral with CP costs being balanced with the Raiding part bonus CP.
2CP for 2 commanders starts to feel ouchy


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/05 17:34:56


Post by: Aeri


I will be so happy once commander spam is not viable anymore.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/05 17:38:26


Post by: Sterling191


Aeri wrote:
I will be so happy once commander spam is not viable anymore.


It hasnt been "viable", or even mechanically possible, since the beginning of 8th.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/05 18:48:28


Post by: Sazzlefrats



2CP for 2 commanders starts to feel ouchy


That's not bad... 12 - 4 = 8. And you'll take 1 trait, and 1 relic (pure tide engram). And possibly you might go for 1 extra relic (counter fire thrusters or the AP bullet catcher one)... so you'll start the game with 7cp. +6+up to 6 more... so up to 19, probably 15 overall in an average game. I think that's plenty. I just made my first 9th FSE 6 commander list, its the same list mostly.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/05 19:01:43


Post by: Ice_can


 Sazzlefrats wrote:
Ice_can wrote:

2CP for 2 commanders starts to feel ouchy


That's not bad... 12 - 4 = 8. And you'll take 1 trait, and 1 relic (pure tide engram). And possibly you might go for 1 extra relic (counter fire thrusters or the AP bullet catcher one)... so you'll start the game with 7cp. +6+up to 6 more... so up to 19, probably 15 overall in an average game. I think that's plenty. I just made my first 9th FSE 6 commander list, its the same list mostly.

Yeah I'm already hitting limitations in CP with taking crisis bomb.
Prototype Ion accelerator and CFDS for the bomb is 2 relics down spend 2CP to get 6 (which usually doesn't work for me don't roll enough 6's) or take the Talismans of Moloch in appropriate match ups. Thats 3 to 5CP before going to add another patrol for 2CP at which point I down to starting on 6CP +6 vrs 8ths 9CP still up CP but I'm not sure I'd want to push it to 2 patrols as thats stattingnthe game on 4 CP using the cover strategum if you go second is 2CP and your down to waiting on the drip feed of CP, think I'll stick to fewer commanders with more CP as that Bomb can become quite the wall of a unit with enough CP spend.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/06 07:32:59


Post by: killerpenguin


Ice_can wrote:
 Sazzlefrats wrote:
Ice_can wrote:

2CP for 2 commanders starts to feel ouchy


That's not bad... 12 - 4 = 8. And you'll take 1 trait, and 1 relic (pure tide engram). And possibly you might go for 1 extra relic (counter fire thrusters or the AP bullet catcher one)... so you'll start the game with 7cp. +6+up to 6 more... so up to 19, probably 15 overall in an average game. I think that's plenty. I just made my first 9th FSE 6 commander list, its the same list mostly.

Yeah I'm already hitting limitations in CP with taking crisis bomb.
Prototype Ion accelerator and CFDS for the bomb is 2 relics down spend 2CP to get 6 (which usually doesn't work for me don't roll enough 6's) or take the Talismans of Moloch in appropriate match ups. Thats 3 to 5CP before going to add another patrol for 2CP at which point I down to starting on 6CP +6 vrs 8ths 9CP still up CP but I'm not sure I'd want to push it to 2 patrols as thats stattingnthe game on 4 CP using the cover strategum if you go second is 2CP and your down to waiting on the drip feed of CP, think I'll stick to fewer commanders with more CP as that Bomb can become quite the wall of a unit with enough CP spend.


I second this, I’d probably end up at 5 CP after 2 patrols, RCM, 6+ CP regain relic and 2 CP for veterans. With gaining 1 each round and potentially 1 additional each round with the relic, is gonna be low considering all the great stratagems(and probably a few new ones), but I guess I’ll just have to use them sparingly.



Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/09 16:32:56


Post by: killerpenguin


So i guess the velocity tracker is obsolete now with the new rules. Stu said on the 40k stream that only infantry will get -1 to hit from moving and firing heavy weapons in 9th. ed.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/09 16:47:23


Post by: Ice_can


 killerpenguin wrote:
So i guess the velocity tracker is obsolete now with the new rules. Stu said on the 40k stream that only infantry will get -1 to hit from moving and firing heavy weapons in 9th. ed.

You mean Target Lock, Also makes the build your own spet rule that allows you to get a free target lock pointless.

Looks like day 1 errata is going to need to be extensive, still leaves Hammerheads as junk though.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/09 16:55:55


Post by: Sterling191


Ice_can wrote:

Looks like day 1 errata is going to need to be extensive, still leaves Hammerheads as junk though.


Wot? The Longstrike-star benefits exceptionally from this rule change. 2+ BS on the move is toasty.

Biggest issue is what is going to happen with Stabilization Systems, Target Locks, and Markerlights.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/09 18:17:31


Post by: Ice_can


Sterling191 wrote:
Ice_can wrote:

Looks like day 1 errata is going to need to be extensive, still leaves Hammerheads as junk though.


Wot? The Longstrike-star benefits exceptionally from this rule change. 2+ BS on the move is toasty.

Biggest issue is what is going to happen with Stabilization Systems, Target Locks, and Markerlights.

Needing a sept locked nammed charictor to be viable still makes them feel trash to me longstrike is a beast yes but hammerheads without him

Hammerheads issue was more the lack of durability in that list IMHO
Also roumer has it fly will nolonger allow fall back and shooting, big nerf.
Railguns still 1 shot and lacking in damage, Ion cannons will be okay but a hammerhead with smart missile systems is not shooting it's way out of combat reliably enough.

Also it locks you to tau sept and 1 commanders before you pay another 2 or More CP for a second detachment.

Compair that to FSE you get 2 commanders per detachment and auto marketlight and reroll wound rolls of 1.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/10 03:48:03


Post by: rbstr


Yeah, I hope they look at durability and firepower of tanks while they're seemingly putting an emphasis on making vehicles more fun.

Overall though the heavy weapons change is a pretty decent buff for Tau, freeing up nearly-mandatory support systems, or a sept tenant, on basically all of the heavy hitters.
Does make you wonder how/if they're going to errata those things to work differently.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/11 12:38:21


Post by: lare2


Target lock's still useful for assault.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/25 16:55:19


Post by: Sterling191


Welp, Crisis Suits were fun while they lasted.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/25 17:15:18


Post by: Kanluwen


Kneel before Darkstrider and Stealth Suits! KNEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEL!

For those unaware, Stealth Suits have both the "Battlesuit" and "Infantry" keywords. Darkstrider allows for T'au Sept Infantry within 6" to attack with ranged weapons even if they fell back that turn.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/25 19:06:03


Post by: Sterling191


Not gonna lie, a Darkstrider battlesuit based list sounds like fun. If only he wasnt Tau sept locked...

In other news, looks like the Commander limit is here to stay. Going to be some hard choices made about CP.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/27 18:32:24


Post by: rbstr


Been thinking about the Codex Flyers:
The Razorshark doesn't get much besides the new aircraft deepstrike.
The Sunshark can now fire its Ion Rifles' heavy profile at no penalty (pretty big deal I think!) and do a bombing run that takes it off the field to come back later.

Razorshark @ 115pts:
4x S8 Ap-1 Dd3...at BS3+ vs. some targets!
2x S7 Ap-1 Dd3
2x Seekers

Sunshark's got @ 143 points:
Average of 8 shots @ S8 AP-1 D2 with the Ions
4x @ S7 AP-1 Dd3 with Missiles
plus a markerlight, bombs, and 2x seekers
(this seems clearly worth the 28 points over the Razorshark - you're nearly doubling your firepower at the cost of not getting to advance and shoot)

Compare to a Ghostkeel @ 144pts with CIR, burst cannons, shield gen and ATS:
6x S8 AP-2 Dd3
8x S5 Ap-1 D1
4++

Both at at -1 to hit (because of cap), Sunshark has 2 more wounds, much longer range (30" vs 24"-18"), a lower save @4+, no drone protection, can leave and come back, and bombs
Might be worth a look if the points stay proportional.

Forgeworld stuff gets pretty decent upgrades via the heavy weapon change as well.

 Kanluwen wrote:
Kneel before Darkstrider and Stealth Suits! KNEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEL!

For those unaware, Stealth Suits have both the "Battlesuit" and "Infantry" keywords. Darkstrider allows for T'au Sept Infantry within 6" to attack with ranged weapons even if they fell back that turn.


Like it's kinda neat but Steath Suits could already do that and weren't great, I don't see how they'll have changed much in that regard.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/27 18:49:10


Post by: Ice_can


His point except not clearly made is that Darkstrider gives Tau Sept infantry 8th edition fly rules in fallback and shoot.

In 9th no-one can fall back and shoot.

Darkstrider allows 1 unit tl do so, Stealth suits have the correct keywords, and back the most firepower. They are also probably the most resilient platform for actual surviving long enough to make it worthwhile.

What kills it is he is Tau Sept yeah 5+ over watch is nice but 2CP per commander after the first no thanks.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/27 23:50:54


Post by: rbstr


Right I get that they're now a bit unique - my point is that they already had the ability in 8th and it wasn't really that useful. Just because they've become unique doesn't mean that they've become useful. Probably better to just take a Kroot screen, fall back, and use better shooting units.

As far as Commanders: You could take a 2CP Farsight patrol with two Commanders, a set of troops, and some drones. I could see that being pretty popular. Maybe even with a set of Vet Crisis suits.
When it gets down to it something like a Fusionmander works just fine not sharing sept with main detachment.
Doesn't change that the limit sucks and feels punitive from a time before the rule of three existed.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/28 03:49:08


Post by: Ice_can


rbstr wrote:
Right I get that they're now a bit unique - my point is that they already had the ability in 8th and it wasn't really that useful. Just because they've become unique doesn't mean that they've become useful. Probably better to just take a Kroot screen, fall back, and use better shooting units.

As far as Commanders: You could take a 2CP Farsight patrol with two Commanders, a set of troops, and some drones. I could see that being pretty popular. Maybe even with a set of Vet Crisis suits.
When it gets down to it something like a Fusionmander works just fine not sharing sept with main detachment.
Doesn't change that the limit sucks and feels punitive from a time before the rule of three existed.

Yeah I tgibk most people will probably be primary detachment Farsight, as that way 2 Commanders in the initial detachment and 2CP more gets you up to 4 Commanders though with tge reduction in Charictor protection I suspect that commanders may be less go too options especially if they see points increases also Farsight rules looks alot better in 9th and it was bad in 8th.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/28 16:51:10


Post by: Ice_can


Anyone else feeling Stormsurges are double dead now with one costing 3CP and 3 costing 6 CP?
Not even sure why they were even mentioned in the faction focus articals as they seem like one of the worst unitsbin the codex now.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/29 12:28:54


Post by: Aeri


They sounded fun until they didn't...


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/06/29 13:15:56


Post by: Sterling191


Ice_can wrote:
Anyone else feeling Stormsurges are double dead now with one costing 3CP and 3 costing 6 CP?
Not even sure why they were even mentioned in the faction focus articals as they seem like one of the worst unitsbin the codex now.


Sadly, barring considerable additional rules and points changes, there's going to be strong competition for that title.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/01 17:59:34


Post by: rbstr


So, based on leaks, it looks like basically every weapon we have with random shots is a blast weapon. EDIT: I missed something and this following stuff isn't right!
Spoiler:
Unfortunately they didn't break it down by profile. For instance the Ion Cannon is listed without indicating a difference between the standard and overcharge. Also, the Fusion Collider is blast but the Eradicator prototype is not.
There's a lot of implications of that for being able to shoot into melee. Namely it seems like can't use the non-random profile to shoot into melee with those weapons - you're going to be limited to the auxiliary weapons.

Overall this and fly/fallback changes and makes Tau much, much, more vulnerable to "the bad touch". You could have conceived of an Ionhead just sticking in combat and blasting away since it might still be hitting on a 4+ and do a decent bit of damage against some targets with the non-overcharged Cannon+(SMS or Burst Cannon). But that's just not the case - you've basically got to fall back.



Interestingly the Ion Rifle is blast as well. Not really all that scary on Pathfinders since that profile is heavy
But...bringing this back around to my post about the Sunshark - You've now got two ways to shoot the maximum of 12 Ion Rifle shots: The strategem or against units of 6+. This guy is definitely a glass cannon but I think it's worth a look.
I think in a 2k point list I'm gonna try stuffing one into a Farsight Commander patrol. 2 Commanders, a set of breachers and a sunshark. Bomb something and maybe flee off table in the first turn. Come back anywhere in turn 2 and blast something. Hope you survive to t3 to bomb something, use the FSE bomb strategem, and blast something else.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/01 18:13:19


Post by: Aeri


Cluster rockets being blast is actually awesome


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/01 18:15:06


Post by: Sterling191


rbstr wrote:
So, based on leaks, it looks like basically every weapon we have with random shots is a blast weapon. Unfortunately they didn't break it down by profile.


Actually they do (I missed this at first as well). The header of the list states that "if a weapon has more than one profile, all the profiles with a random number of shots gain the blast ability". The implication is that if a profile has a set number of shots, it does *not* become a blast weapon, which jives with relics like the Hammer of Sunderance being on the list, while the Amplified Ion Accelerator or Fusion Obliterator are not.

Not that we're going to be hitting jack on 5+s with no markerlight support in melee, but there are still some options.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/01 18:48:12


Post by: rbstr


Ah! I read the list last night but my work computer won't let me see the images today to check for certain.

But yeah, in general it doesn't seem like you'll want to stick it out to the shooting phase in melee. Basically only if you're basically assured that you can finish something off.
You're not completely markerlight free in that case though. Aerial Targeting will let you put one on and FSE units will get one as well. At least it's a tactical choice to be made?

Other than that Hammerheads could be hitting on 4+ depending on what the damage dealt by the charge was. 3+ if Longstrike is around. Ion Cannons might be useful then, in that way.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/01 19:00:55


Post by: Sterling191


rbstr wrote:
Ah! I read the list last night but my work computer won't let me see the images today to check for certain.

But yeah, in general it doesn't seem like you'll want to stick it out to the shooting phase in melee. Basically only if you're basically assured that you can finish something off.
You're not completely markerlight free in that case though. Aerial Targeting will let you put one on and FSE units will get one as well. At least it's a tactical choice to be made?

Other than that Hammerheads could be hitting on 4+ depending on what the damage dealt by the charge was. 3+ if Longstrike is around. Ion Cannons might be useful then, in that way.


Im actually thinking a little further afield. Gun drones would inherit the 3+ BS, are able to fire into melee since their weapons are considered to be arming the gunship itself, and can be buffed by Fireblades. Thats a dozen pulse shots into a bad-touching unit, which is going to hurt most chaff, and with FSE or custom sept support for at least rerolls of 1s is...not terrible.

Not that it solves the issue of Hammerhead survivability unfortunately.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/02 14:28:59


Post by: footfoe


Really not worried about the commander limit. paying 2 cp for a patrol to bring two FSE commanders is a no brainer.

6 is honestly overkill. because at that point it isn't the CP that's the problem it's the points. Everything is going to be more expensive, you won't have much of a screen left to actually protect your commanders.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/02 17:01:26


Post by: Ice_can


footfoe wrote:
Really not worried about the commander limit. paying 2 cp for a patrol to bring two FSE commanders is a no brainer.

6 is honestly overkill. because at that point it isn't the CP that's the problem it's the points. Everything is going to be more expensive, you won't have much of a screen left to actually protect your commanders.

The way the new rules work Commanders are pretty dead as it is.


What are people's thoughts on secondary missions that are good contenders and Hard passes?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/02 18:03:12


Post by: Sterling191


Ice_can wrote:

The way the new rules work Commanders are pretty dead as it is.


What are people's thoughts on secondary missions that are good contenders and Hard passes?


Commanders wont be dead, largely because there's nothing else that can fill the same niche. But they're definitely down a peg from 8th.

As to secondaries, Bring it Down is going to be good against Vee heavy armies (which are likely to be more common in 9th), While We Stand We Fight will score for keeping the Riptides standing (which is likely going to be a make/break point for the game anyway). Thin Their Ranks looks to be good against large scale MSU or horde lists.

I'd probably avoid Attrition due to the way separating drone units interact with it, as well as any of the Action based ones. The things that can conceivably survive an entire round of focus fire are the models Tau want to be shooting with every possible gun.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/02 18:19:09


Post by: Ice_can


Do we know yet if we can score the same wounds for multiple secondarys yet?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/02 19:39:48


Post by: Sterling191


Ice_can wrote:
Do we know yet if we can score the same wounds for multiple secondarys yet?


I dont see anything in the ruleset that explicitly precludes it, but there's a *lot* of material to cover right now.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/02 20:23:54


Post by: Ice_can


Sterling191 wrote:
Ice_can wrote:
Do we know yet if we can score the same wounds for multiple secondarys yet?


I dont see anything in the ruleset that explicitly precludes it, but there's a *lot* of material to cover right now.

I haven't either yet, but with this amount of info and it not being nice and clear I wanted a second opinion.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/04 17:04:56


Post by: BoomWolf


Well, none of the secondaries even care about dealing wounds, so that's a moot point.

They do care about kills, and if the same kill applies to multiple secondaries, it sure does work.
Wont be common though, except against psyker armies (who are totally hosed by "abhor the witch" secondary being broken AF)


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/04 18:12:05


Post by: Ice_can


 BoomWolf wrote:
Well, none of the secondaries even care about dealing wounds, so that's a moot point.

They do care about kills, and if the same kill applies to multiple secondaries, it sure does work.
Wont be common though, except against psyker armies (who are totally hosed by "abhor the witch" secondary being broken AF)

Also allows stacking bring it down with thin their ranks if they have a bunch of 10+ Wound models as they count as 10 wounds for thin their ranks. So maxing out Bring it down gets you 1/3 of the kill tally needed to max out Thin their ranks.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/06 11:48:15


Post by: footfoe


Ice_can wrote:
footfoe wrote:
Really not worried about the commander limit. paying 2 cp for a patrol to bring two FSE commanders is a no brainer.

6 is honestly overkill. because at that point it isn't the CP that's the problem it's the points. Everything is going to be more expensive, you won't have much of a screen left to actually protect your commanders.

The way the new rules work Commanders are pretty dead as it is.


What are people's thoughts on secondary missions that are good contenders and Hard passes?
huh? commanders are still great. they just need to stick closer to your unkillable suits.

speaking of unkillable. while we stand we fight is a great secondary for tau. If you keep your triptides alive all game you get 15 pts. Not too hard for Tau.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/06 12:23:25


Post by: Ice_can


footfoe wrote:
Ice_can wrote:
footfoe wrote:
Really not worried about the commander limit. paying 2 cp for a patrol to bring two FSE commanders is a no brainer.

6 is honestly overkill. because at that point it isn't the CP that's the problem it's the points. Everything is going to be more expensive, you won't have much of a screen left to actually protect your commanders.

The way the new rules work Commanders are pretty dead as it is.


What are people's thoughts on secondary missions that are good contenders and Hard passes?
huh? commanders are still great. they just need to stick closer to your unkillable suits.

speaking of unkillable. while we stand we fight is a great secondary for tau. If you keep your triptides alive all game you get 15 pts. Not too hard for Tau.

I meant your not going to be goibg all in on 4+ of them as some people theorised in 8th post PA, I'll still be taking 2 unless they get nasty points jumps.

So far I'm actually thinking 9th might be a time to go back to the old school monster mash lists of 7th I thibk it was of tritide and Yvahraa spam as they should hopefully see some big points drops when the new FW books come out in August, as they are still paying index points for the base riptide chassis.

Also really plays well into playing FSE rules wise if not lore wise, but crisis suits outaide of missle pods look like a big risk unit that your might not want to take in sizes above 5.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/06 12:40:11


Post by: Sterling191


Ice_can wrote:

I meant your not going to be goibg all in on 4+ of them as some people theorised in 8th post PA, I'll still be taking 2 unless they get nasty points jumps.

So far I'm actually thinking 9th might be a time to go back to the old school monster mash lists of 7th I thibk it was of tritide and Yvahraa spam as they should hopefully see some big points drops when the new FW books come out in August, as they are still paying index points for the base riptide chassis.

Also really plays well into playing FSE rules wise if not lore wise, but crisis suits outaide of missle pods look like a big risk unit that your might not want to take in sizes above 5.


Keep in mind that Riptides and Ghostkeels (they have the Monster keyword) act as bodyguards for commanders. Fully agree on the Enclave style. My initial Crusade list has a pair of Vet cadres, each with an accompanying Commander. They'll eventually grow up to 5-suits apiece.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/06 13:13:26


Post by: Pottsey


Sterling191 wrote:
Ice_can wrote:

I meant your not going to be goibg all in on 4+ of them as some people theorised in 8th post PA, I'll still be taking 2 unless they get nasty points jumps.

So far I'm actually thinking 9th might be a time to go back to the old school monster mash lists of 7th I thibk it was of tritide and Yvahraa spam as they should hopefully see some big points drops when the new FW books come out in August, as they are still paying index points for the base riptide chassis.

Also really plays well into playing FSE rules wise if not lore wise, but crisis suits outaide of missle pods look like a big risk unit that your might not want to take in sizes above 5.


Keep in mind that Riptides and Ghostkeels (they have the Monster keyword) act as bodyguards for commanders. Fully agree on the Enclave style. My initial Crusade list has a pair of Vet cadres, each with an accompanying Commander. They'll eventually grow up to 5-suits apiece.

Never know we could take 2 veteran squads. Just looked it up and you are right. So for 2CP we can take 2 squads of 3 for the same price as one large squad.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/06 13:48:00


Post by: Sterling191


Pottsey wrote:

Never know we could take 2 veteran squads. Just looked it up and you are right. So for 2CP we can take 2 squads of 3 for the same price as one large squad.


In matched play you cannot (it's a "Once per game" strat). In Crusade, things like Vet Cadre are treated as RP purchases, and are not limited to a single squad. You could conceivably do an entire army of nothing but Veteran XV8 teams in the latter mode.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/06 14:54:17


Post by: Ice_can


Yeah I do think the amount of cross over between crusade and Matched play is going to be way less than GW implied.

Not saying that crusdae doesnt look like it could be great for a nice club grow league, but I think the way both systems are played is going to be very different from each other.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/06 16:03:46


Post by: Sterling191


Ice_can wrote:
Yeah I do think the amount of cross over between crusade and Matched play is going to be way less than GW implied.

Not saying that crusdae doesnt look like it could be great for a nice club grow league, but I think the way both systems are played is going to be very different from each other.


That's not necessarily a bad thing. Bigger tent with more supported ways to play does far more for the long term health of the game than tournament or bust.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/06 21:44:37


Post by: Sazzlefrats


I just saw the rules for detachments....

Commander Spam is 4cp :-)

I think in all cases, 2000pt games will be 3 patrol detachments. Lets you have everything.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/06 22:31:39


Post by: Ice_can


 Sazzlefrats wrote:
I just saw the rules for detachments....

Commander Spam is 4cp :-)

I think in all cases, 2000pt games will be 3 patrol detachments. Lets you have everything.

The issue is the charictor targeting rules are way less useful in protecting commanders in 9th than they were in 8th.
The rest of the balance equation will depend upon the new 9th edition points balance


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/06 22:33:20


Post by: rbstr


Eh, while the ability of a Commander to Manta Stike and have protection is limited, you can still cover them quite readily with drone squads and vehicles ect. Even without being able to zoom all over they're still very good units.

Also: It may be that the "Supreme Commander" keyword is applied to Shadowsun so she'd be available as a freebie in a Supreme Command Detachment - She has a rule named as such already, after all. Maybe even all Commanders get it.
There's certainly a reason the SupCom detachment is HQs and lords of war. Plus it maybe makes that video/batrep/list from Table Top Titans make sense - they weren't wrong, just ahead of what's publicly available.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/06 22:47:36


Post by: Ice_can


Shadowsun and Farsight are the obvious choices for Tau, here's hoping they cover it in the day 1 FAQ, though Farsight really could do with an updated plastic model thats more fittingly sized.

P.S. I hate failcast.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/06 23:10:52


Post by: Sterling191


rbstr wrote:
Eh, while the ability of a Commander to Manta Stike and have protection is limited, you can still cover them quite readily with drone squads and vehicles ect. Even without being able to zoom all over they're still very good units.

Also: It may be that the "Supreme Commander" keyword is applied to Shadowsun so she'd be available as a freebie in a Supreme Command Detachment - She has a rule named as such already, after all. Maybe even all Commanders get it.
There's certainly a reason the SupCom detachment is HQs and lords of war. Plus it maybe makes that video/batrep/list from Table Top Titans make sense - they weren't wrong, just ahead of what's publicly available.


I'll point out that her ability to fit in all Tau detachments regardless of Sept is literally called "Supreme Commander".


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/07 07:10:13


Post by: killerpenguin


Damn, we can’t fall back and shoot with fly units anymore. That’s a mega nerf for us.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/07 07:20:59


Post by: Ice_can


 killerpenguin wrote:
Damn, we can’t fall back and shoot with fly units anymore. That’s a mega nerf for us.

Monsters & vehicals can still shoot in combat we still have overwatch unlike most armies so far. Also it depends what they do with points etc, I'm hoping to finally have a YVhara that isnt paying index riptide points.

I think crisis suits took a bigger hit than Riptide and Ghostkeels.

I'm also interested to see what hassard suits look like post CA2020 as I think they could be important with their -2 to charge ranges with the changes to comand reroll.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/07 14:48:50


Post by: carldooley


Ice_can wrote:
 killerpenguin wrote:
Damn, we can’t fall back and shoot with fly units anymore. That’s a mega nerf for us.

Monsters & vehicals can still shoot in combat we still have overwatch unlike most armies so far. Also it depends what they do with points etc, I'm hoping to finally have a YVhara that isnt paying index riptide points.

I think crisis suits took a bigger hit than Riptide and Ghostkeels.

I'm also interested to see what hassard suits look like post CA2020 as I think they could be important with their -2 to charge ranges with the changes to comand reroll.


Well, here's hoping and everything, but if FLY doesn't work as it did in 8th, maybe JET PACK will do what it did before 8th.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/07 14:50:23


Post by: Sterling191


Ice_can wrote:
 killerpenguin wrote:
Damn, we can’t fall back and shoot with fly units anymore. That’s a mega nerf for us.

Monsters & vehicals can still shoot in combat we still have overwatch unlike most armies so far. Also it depends what they do with points etc, I'm hoping to finally have a YVhara that isnt paying index riptide points.

I think crisis suits took a bigger hit than Riptide and Ghostkeels.

I'm also interested to see what hassard suits look like post CA2020 as I think they could be important with their -2 to charge ranges with the changes to comand reroll.


Broadsides and XV8s got fethed (likewise all Commander variants). Also Battlesuit is, barring an entry in an FAQ, still a terrible keyword. Nobody except stealth suits gets to make use of cover beyond LoS blocking.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/07 16:25:15


Post by: Ice_can


 carldooley wrote:
Spoiler:
Ice_can wrote:
 killerpenguin wrote:
Damn, we can’t fall back and shoot with fly units anymore. That’s a mega nerf for us.

Monsters & vehicals can still shoot in combat we still have overwatch unlike most armies so far. Also it depends what they do with points etc, I'm hoping to finally have a YVhara that isnt paying index riptide points.

I think crisis suits took a bigger hit than Riptide and Ghostkeels.

I'm also interested to see what hassard suits look like post CA2020 as I think they could be important with their -2 to charge ranges with the changes to comand reroll.


Well, here's hoping and everything, but if FLY doesn't work as it did in 8th, maybe JET PACK will do what it did before 8th.

I like the optimism but given a number of playtesters immediate responce that "that would be the most broken thing to ever add to the game" (I'm sorry WTAF Yannari had this already FFS) I dont see it every coming back to many guardplayers are still salty.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Sterling191 wrote:

Broadsides and XV8s got fethed (likewise all Commander variants). Also Battlesuit is, barring an entry in an FAQ, still a terrible keyword. Nobody except stealth suits gets to make use of cover beyond LoS blocking.

Yeah that is why at the moment I am planning lists for 9th containing no Crisis or Broadside suits.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/07 19:32:35


Post by: rbstr


It is lame that our mid-sized suits don't get in on any of the infantry or vehicle/monster fun. And I hope the new codex comes fairly soon and does something about it.

But as it seems currently Broadsides aren't any different than before with regard getting tagged in combat. They wouldn't be that good at shooting into combat anyway. The heavy weapon change buffed them by really increasing mobility, if anything, and cover rules probably work in their favor with regard to LOS stuff.
Crisis still can pack a huge amount of firepower and pretty wacky survivability between the new 5-marker stratagem, new farsight stuff, ignore Ap-2 prototype and drones. You have to think more about screens with them now, though. Conveniently you can drop a pile of shield drones down in front of them with the Manta Strike if you want.

Honestly, while the fly change isn't great it's not the end of the world. I think the new missions and cover rules over all do more to help our shooting than hurt and I think we can build pretty decent screens in via just plain old drone units, Breachers with guardian drones, maybe even devilfish (actually a decent number of 4+ shots into combat, a strategem to hit on 5+ overwatch when not tau sept), or tons of kroots.

The heavy weapon change does wonders for mobility of the bigger units and means we open a slot for like Counterfire Defense Systems on Riptides. That's some very serious charge denial.
If melee comes back into vogue the CDS and Tau sept are probably well positioned to deal with it.

I'm far more worried about being out-shot than melee troubles.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/07 20:06:23


Post by: Sterling191


rbstr wrote:
They wouldn't be that good at shooting into combat anyway.


Missilesides that can shoot into melee would change the calculus considerably. And mobility wasnt an issue for them after PA.

rbstr wrote:
Conveniently you can drop a pile of shield drones down in front of them with the Manta Strike if you want.


I have very little interest in becoming even more reliant on Shield Drones.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/09 09:43:30


Post by: Aeri


Would the cover removal from marker lights also get rid of the -1 to hit some terrain provides now?
This would actually be a huge buff for tau in comparison to other armies.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/09 10:08:46


Post by: Ice_can


Aeri wrote:
Would the cover removal from marker lights also get rid of the -1 to hit some terrain provides now?
This would actually be a huge buff for tau in comparison to other armies.

Roumer is ignore cover is now ignore light cover (the save bonus) the -1 isnt effected by any of the ignoring cover.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/09 10:44:29


Post by: IanVanCheese


Ice_can wrote:
Aeri wrote:
Would the cover removal from marker lights also get rid of the -1 to hit some terrain provides now?
This would actually be a huge buff for tau in comparison to other armies.

Roumer is ignore cover is now ignore light cover (the save bonus) the -1 isnt effected by any of the ignoring cover.


Apparently this is covered in the weird rule interactions section at the end of the book and yeah, it basically means it ignores light cover now.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/09 13:23:26


Post by: Aeri


Well this is kinda bad then :/
Thought it removed all cover T_T


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/09 13:31:45


Post by: Sterling191


Aeri wrote:
Well this is kinda bad then :/
Thought it removed all cover T_T


The capacity to toggle off all terrain benefits would be exceptionally powerful.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/09 15:16:47


Post by: carldooley


Sterling191 wrote:
Aeri wrote:
Well this is kinda bad then :/
Thought it removed all cover T_T


The capacity to toggle off all terrain benefits would be exceptionally powerful.


Here is hoping then that the Tau day one errata will include a new markerlight table.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/09 15:38:07


Post by: Sterling191


 carldooley wrote:

Here is hoping then that the Tau day one errata will include a new markerlight table.


It absolutely needs to given the changes to Heavy weapon mobility, but I dont expect anything that fundamentally alters the Tau playstyle.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/09 16:41:05


Post by: Ice_can


Sterling191 wrote:
 carldooley wrote:

Here is hoping then that the Tau day one errata will include a new markerlight table.


It absolutely needs to given the changes to Heavy weapon mobility, but I dont expect anything that fundamentally alters the Tau playstyle.

I genuinely expect that the way Gw has done things before, for the Marker lights to have all the same benifits in it untill the new codex as they will come up with some BS how it's still good for pathfinders.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/09 16:59:44


Post by: Sterling191


Ice_can wrote:

I genuinely expect that the way Gw has done things before, for the Marker lights to have all the same benifits in it untill the new codex as they will come up with some BS how it's still good for pathfinders.


That's my expectation for all codices to be honest.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/09 17:54:53


Post by: Ice_can


Sterling191 wrote:
Ice_can wrote:

I genuinely expect that the way Gw has done things before, for the Marker lights to have all the same benifits in it untill the new codex as they will come up with some BS how it's still good for pathfinders.


That's my expectation for all codices to be honest.

Though they did admit that they were redesigning the support systems, but they didn't say if that would be in the FAQ or codex the good old bait and switch.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 01:54:28


Post by: rbstr


I smooshed this list together from what I've got on hand.
Battalion+Patrol
First a Sept-something battalion with:
3xcrisiswith 2xCIB ATS plus one dude with 2x AFP with the Active Countermeasures - This should be fairly hard to shift with the drones there too. Get to slap down the 5-marker strat and really blast something.
CIB enforcer - Stabilizers for those rerolls!
CIBs are just good, I expect transports and primaris and other tough infantry and they're the right gun for that job.
Devilfish w/ 10 breachers+drones - a pretty decent objective holder, they need to chew though a fish, drones, and 10 5++ bodies (though I kinda doubt the guardian drone will be easy to hide)
couple 5-man FW squads - for doing random stuff.
Pair of HRR Broadsides since they're very cool and I just want them.
I think every unit brings its drone allotment.

Could be whatever Sept. HRRs can be sweet in Sa'cea and that would give the CIBs some extra oomph. Could always fall back on Tau if charges are a problem.
Or maybe Hybridized Weaponry, a bit more range on nearly every good gun seems like it could be effective. Not sure on the other one with a custom Sept. I kinda like Soldiers in Arms to let me spread out a bit more and keep FtGG coverage.

Then a Farsight Patrol:
2x Fusion Coldstars - wrecking a couple somethings or others with these guys.
Another Fish w/ 10 Breachers.
Ghostkeel with CIR - he could go in the other detachment too but I kinda think I want to use him a bit closer-up and farsight might work there.

Why not put the Crisis in the Farsight Patrol? I want to keep them back as mobile fire-support and that'll work better in a different sept.
Drones are in there as placeholders, probably gonna put one slightly larger squad in each detachment.
I could make it dual patrol and put both big Breacherfish in the Farsight Detachment. maybe scrap the ghostkeel for a third breacherfish.

Comes in at 1732 so I'm thinking I'll probably have a bit of room in it when points drop. Likely more drones.
An alternative list here is Missile Pod crisis and commander with Hardened Warheads on the main force.
Another adjustment would be a Sunshark in the Farsight detachment traded basically 1:1 with the Ghostkeel - could use that firestorm strat. and do some fun reserves stuff

Spoiler:
Sept Choice
. Custom Sept: Hybridised Weaponry, Soldiers in Arms

+ Stratagems +

Emergency Dispensation (2 Relics)

+ HQ +

Commander in XV85 Enforcer Battlesuit: Advanced targeting system, Cross-linked stabiliser jets, 3x Cyclic ion blaster
. 2x MV4 Shield Drone: 2x Shield generator

Ethereal: 2. Through Unity, Devastation, Honour blade, Hover drone, Puretide engram neurochip, Warlord
. 2x MV4 Shield Drone: 2x Shield generator

+ Troops +

Breacher Team: MV36 Guardian Drone
. 9x Fire Warrior: 9x Photon grenades, 9x Pulse blaster
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Pulse blaster
. MV4 Shield Drone

Breacher Team: MV36 Guardian Drone
. 4x Fire Warrior: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse blaster
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Pulse blaster
. MV4 Shield Drone

Strike Team
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Pulse rifle
. 4x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle: 4x Photon grenades, 4x Pulse rifle

+ Elites +

XV8 Crisis Battlesuits: Reactive countermeasures
. Crisis Shas'ui: 2x Airbursting fragmentation projector, Shield generator, XV8-02 Crisis Iridium battlesuit
. Crisis Shas'ui: Advanced targeting system, 2x Cyclic ion blaster
. Crisis Shas'ui: Advanced targeting system, 2x Cyclic ion blaster
. Crisis Shas'vre: Advanced targeting system, 2x Cyclic ion blaster
. 2x MV4 Shield Drone: 2x Shield generator

+ Fast Attack +

Tactical Drones
. 4x MV1 Gun Drone: 8x Pulse carbine

Tactical Drones
. 4x MV1 Gun Drone: 8x Pulse carbine

+ Heavy Support +

XV88 Broadside Battlesuits
. Broadside Shas'ui: 2x Smart missile system, Heavy rail rifle, Velocity tracker
. 2x MV4 Shield Drone: 2x Shield generator

XV88 Broadside Battlesuits
. Broadside Shas'ui: 2x Smart missile system, Heavy rail rifle, Velocity tracker
. MV4 Shield Drone

+ Dedicated Transport +

TY7 Devilfish: Burst cannon
. 2x MV1 Gun Drone

++ Patrol Detachment (T'au Empire) ++

+ Configuration +

Sept Choice: Farsight Enclaves

+ HQ +

Commander in XV86 Coldstar Battlesuit: 4x Fusion blaster
. 2x MV4 Shield Drone: 2x Shield generator

Commander in XV86 Coldstar Battlesuit: 4x Fusion blaster
. 2x MV4 Shield Drone: 2x Shield generator

+ Troops +

Breacher Team: MV36 Guardian Drone
. 9x Fire Warrior: 9x Photon grenades, 9x Pulse blaster
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Pulse blaster
. MV4 Shield Drone

+ Elites +

XV95 Ghostkeel Battlesuit: 2x Burst cannon, Advanced targeting system, Cyclic ion raker, 2x MV5 Stealth Drone, Shield generator

+ Dedicated Transport +

TY7 Devilfish: Burst cannon
. 2x MV1 Gun Drone


Really wish Tau had a falcon-like half-squad transport that could bring some higher-strength firepower with it. 7 dudes (5+drones), and like your pick of 2xCrisis weapon (Railrifles?!) on top of the gundrones/SMS option. Maybe, like the Devilfish has that weird Recon Drone thing, it could hold a couple DS8's?


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 02:13:32


Post by: Sterling191


Hard disagree on the XV8s. If you're running them with CIBs, they should be Enclaves. Vet Cadre plus additional strats turn them into a unit of multiple Commanders. The only things of value in the Custom Sept list that benefits danger close Crisis are Hybridized Weaponry or Turbo Jets, neither of which come close to the boost that they get from the Enclaves. Also consider running them as Bodyguards. The Sworn Protecters stratagem makes them surprisingly deadly in melee, and its a minor point increase.

Squad up the Broadsides, and if you're running them as Railsides give them the Magna rifle.

If you're dead set on Devilfish, strongly consider a Fireblade or two and consolidate them into a single Sept. Their aura works on the attached Pulse Carbines that the APCs are carrying.



Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 05:02:20


Post by: rbstr


Note: this would be a 9th list, specifically looking at the Eternal War missions, hence the Fish. Holding objectives is going to be the hard part for Tau I think, and they're a strategy to do a bit better.

Anyway, here me out on the Crisis:
Lets say I do hybridized weapons and Soldiers in Arms. You pull a sneaky FtGG on something pretty far away with the 22" CIBs which I think is kinda funny and maybe useful in 9e missions. In my mind these guys are on board turn 1, hanging behind the fishes being very bad targets to shoot at thanks to one tanky boi. The role I've got them in doesn't see them benefiting from Farsight Tenets much at all between range and Coordinated Engagment. So it shakes out in this usage to spending 2CP to get BS2+ or going with BS3+ and get some range benefits (or 5s overwatch, or reroll any one hit roll). In the end I sort of expect Missile Pods and Hardened Warheads to do this better (but then I need to do HYMP broadsides ect.)
But in general, yah, I get it. I've probably upgrade to Bodyguards if the points end up allowing it.

Squading is somewhat placeholdery. Broadsides would be single in Sa'cea, together otherwise. I like the magna, but I only get 3 picks - I think I'd rather have the Puretide Chip, Countermeasures and Stabilizer Jets. If there are points for a third chonker, then Manga is is.

I could drop the Ethereal for a Fireblade. The thing with the Fish and Fireblade is that 10+2 fills'em up and they don't benefit from the aura when he's inside (and he'll be stuck inside for a turn or have issues keeping up, at least) and the breachers don't get a benefit from him at all. 4 Pulse shots per 1, maybe 2 Fish is not a lot when I fully expect them to get popped fairly quickly. I think having the Ethereal to put a 6+FNP on things is more useful.
I do think I'm putting both fish squads in Farsight, though. I've also thought a bit about 2x5 rather than 10x. But I think I gain more via strats on the 10x than I gain from less efficiency on attack allocation from opponents or blast.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 08:39:10


Post by: Ice_can


It's an interest approach and alot is going to depend alot on exactly how much each units points change but I have to say I haven't really felt the same hype that people have about transports as being worthwhile as they aren't ovsec and are a single model, i'll just possition or even charge it and force you to deploy away for the objective and xone you out they also become a big risk if you go second as while they are cheapish high toughness wounds they bring little to the table appart from mobility and the rest of your army will have a hard time covering cround if they get alpha stiked off the table turn 1.

I suspect 9th is going to favour armies with lots of movement and ability to deliver a beastly hit at the end of that movement.

Having your mobility locked into 1-2 units I feel will just seen them alpha'd and you'll loose on primary objectives very quickly.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 14:11:22


Post by: Ice_can


TLDR your never winning vrs new marines that's for sure.
Apparently they have been confirmed at the leaked points

Basically your going to have to trim down hard on units you don't want to and try to figure out how you get firepower and obsec together in 9th to win the missions while everything costs more.
The drone changes hurt and the fly nerfs ontop of the increase to crisis suits just killed them. Stealthsuits aren't lookinh great either unfortunately, hasard suits seem to have ducked the GW radar.

I suspect Tau are going to be a very challenging army to play for the first 6 months or more of 9th.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 14:25:11


Post by: Sterling191


Its going to come down to whats in the FAQ, but in general the above changes do hurt quite a bit. Im actually more worried about Custodes and GK than Marines (seriously, the banana lads are monstrous, and the smitey lads came out almost as well).


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 14:38:56


Post by: Aeri


Im so happy the barracuda got so much cheaper.
Especially with swift strike railgun.
Plus now it can move and shoot without penalty :O


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 16:58:00


Post by: Sterling191


FAQs are out. No significant changes.

Target lock allows advancing and firing with heavy or rapid fire weapons at a -1. No changes to other support systems.

Stabilization systems custom tenet is still entirely pointless.

Ghostkeels got fethed.

Battlesuit keyword is, again, garbage.

There may be something in the tidewalls, but im not convinced.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 17:02:18


Post by: Ice_can


Sterling191 wrote:
FAQs are out. No significant changes.

Target lock allows advancing and firing with heavy or rapid fire weapons at a -1. No changes to other support systems.

Stabilization systems custom tenet is still entirely pointless.

Ghostkeels got fethed.

Battlesuit keyword is, again, garbage.

There may be something in the tidewalls, but im not convinced.

Trying not to be salty but really GW you give marines assulat 2 Multi Meltas on a T5 3w for 40 points and we have to spend 60 points for 18 melta at BS4+, you really don't ever want us to play Crisis suits do you.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 17:14:45


Post by: Sterling191


Ice_can wrote:

Trying not to be salty but really GW you give marines assulat 2 Multi Meltas on a T5 3w for 40 points and we have to spend 60 points for 18 melta at BS4+, you really don't ever want us to play Crisis suits do you.


Another reason Im happy to jettison matched play for the first few balance cycles of 9th. All aboard the Crusade train.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 18:32:05


Post by: rbstr


If you look past the Shield Drones and Riptides the army as a whole gets out fairly well on points increases. Everyone went up, so you have to look at the field.
Like, Goonhammer's example list putting them on the higher end is triptides and shielddrones - both were nerfed and everyone expected it.
If you don't like those lists? Nows the time to do something different.
(of course gundrones didn't go anywhere! so swap those into a triptide list and you're below the field's overall increase)

On the otherhand, Crisis actually got a relative reduction in cost compared to the field because they didn't go up much and the guns didn't go up at all. Commanders are in a similar position. Lots of gun point costs got rolled into the basic cost too.

The balance of Marines is something I'm just ignoring - clearly GW is.


As far as the FAQ...well I didn't expect much and that's what we got. They changed wording so rules function in the new edition and basically nothing else.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 18:38:08


Post by: Sterling191


rbstr wrote:

On the otherhand, Crisis actually got a relative reduction in cost compared to the field because they didn't go up much and the guns didn't go up at all. Commanders are in a similar position. Lots of gun point costs got rolled into the basic cost too.


I firmly disagree with this. The increases in Fire Warriors, Shield Drones, and Commanders (three units that Tau currently do not function without) all compound. Furthermore, this level of increase in a setting of losing the functions that smaller Battlesuit units did is not a "relative buff".

Simply put, the tau roster got worse, and more expensive across the board.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
rbstr wrote:

As far as the FAQ...well I didn't expect much and that's what we got. They changed wording so rules function in the new edition and basically nothing else.


The infuriating part is that they couldnt even do that right.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 18:56:57


Post by: rbstr


If you just focus on, for example, FWs going up two points, and ignore what happened to everyone else.
But look and see that Scions went up the same as FWs and Dire Avengers went up from 8 to 13!...things aren't looking so bad. FWs even got a free pulse pistol in the exchange.
The 4xFusion Coldstar Commander went up 16% total, which is only a bit more than average - that's not so bad.

Functionally, if everyone goes up and you go up less, that's relatively good for you. Tau have several examples of usable units that fit in that category (2xCIB+ATS Crisis went up only %10 - below the whole-game average) while some others were hit harder. It's a mixed bag but it could have been much worse.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 19:04:50


Post by: Ice_can


rbstr wrote:
If you just focus on, for example, FWs going up two points, and ignore what happened to everyone else.
But look and see that Scions went up the same as FWs and Dire Avengers went up from 8 to 13!...things aren't looking so bad. FWs even got a free pulse pistol in the exchange.

Functionally, if everyone goes up and you go up less, that's good for you. Tau have several examples of usable units that fit in that category.

Woo the guys my opponents were wiping off the table now cost more and have some pistols they will never get to use.

You either FTGG/Overwatch stuff to death or they wipe your units has been my experiance with FW in CC.

The issue with crisis suits is they felt over pointed and required sinking lots of points and CP into the unit to make it work, now it costs more CP can't maximise it's size without taking it on the chin from D3 blast weapons and a 3 model unit doesn't work as a bodyguard/screening unit. Justifying Taking Crisis suits is harder in 9th than 8th and they weren't great in 8th.

The issue with shield drones and riptides going up is tau win not buy outshooting people but by outsurviving and makong comeback plays turn 4,5,6 we now need to be on objectives turn 2. The codex as it is writen and pointed feels like it's going to need some janky playing to help it along.

So far I think my next FW order is going to include some XV9's to see if they can help.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 19:09:43


Post by: Sterling191


rbstr wrote:
If you just focus on, for example, FWs going up two points, and ignore what happened to everyone else.
But look and see that Scions went up the same as FWs and Dire Avengers went up from 8 to 13!...things aren't looking so bad. FWs even got a free pulse pistol in the exchange.
The 4xFusion Coldstar Commander went up 16% total, which is only a bit more than average - that's not so bad.

Functionally, if everyone goes up and you go up less, that's relatively good for you. Tau have several examples of usable units that fit in that category (2xCIB+ATS Crisis went up only %10 - below the whole-game average) while some others were hit harder. It's a mixed bag but it could have been much worse.


Fire Warriors dont give a feth about pistols, and points increases on nearly all major factions infantry options are more than outweighed by points reductions in special weapons they carry.

I dont care if it could have been "worse". This was an across the board degradation of function. There is zero to celebrate about that.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 19:11:32


Post by: rbstr


Clearly you guy don't understand what "relative" means.

Crisis Suits, when compared to all the units in the game, got relatively cheaper than they were before. Is that enough to make them good? Doubtful. Playable? Maybe. Firewarriors stayed on par with the comparable stuff or actually came out better.

if you still don't like them, whatever, but the math says that. It's not a judgment on usefulness alone.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 19:14:03


Post by: Sterling191


rbstr wrote:
Clearly you don't understand what "relative" means.

Crisis Suits, when compared to all the units in the game, got relatively cheaper than they were before. Is that enough to make them good? Doubtful. Playable? Maybe


Im a data scientist and clinical researcher. I know precisely what relative means. What you seem to be incapable of grasping is that I do not care.

These points and rules changes do one thing: push people towards the bunker of shield drones and mega suits, which is now objectively worse off. I have zero interest in that playstyle, and in the long term it is self-destructive to the army.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 19:15:15


Post by: Ice_can


rbstr wrote:
Clearly you don't understand what "relative" means.

Crisis Suits, when compared to all the units in the game, got relatively cheaper than they were before. Is that enough to make them good? Doubtful. Playable? Maybe

How did they get relatively cheaper?
New Gravis melta boys 40ppm with 24 assualt metla that gets 2 shots.

Custodes went up 2-3 points.

Crisis suits increased 6 points and lost fly yeah real relative buff their lad.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 19:15:55


Post by: Aeri


This.
Stop looking at tau in a bubble.



Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 19:25:26


Post by: rbstr


Ice_can wrote:
How did they get relatively cheaper?
New Gravis melta boys 40ppm with 24 assualt metla that gets 2 shots.

Custodes went up 2-3 points.

Crisis suits increased 6 points and lost fly yeah real relative buff their lad.


And Fire Dragons went over average, and Retributors w/ Multimelta up some 17%. Overall points went up ~14%( in competitive lists). Cherry picking like that misses the point entirely- everyone knows Eradicators stick out like a sore thumb.


Sterling, If you want to ignore my point to whine about precious riptides and shielddrones fine. That clearly doesn't have much to do with my point. You're welcome to come over and compare PhDs if you want to be Mr. Credentials but I'm through with this here.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 19:29:05


Post by: Sterling191


rbstr wrote:

Sterling, If you want to ignore my point to whine about precious riptides and shielddrones fine. That clearly doesn't have much to do with my point. Yyou're welcome to come over and compare PhDs if you want to be Mr. Credentials.


What part of I HAVE NO INTEREST IN A BUNKER OF SHIELD DRONES AND MEGA SUITS is too complicated for you? I want to be able to play with things other than models that are propped up by saviour protocols. I want Tau to be the aggressive midfield mobile force it was just starting to be at the end of 8th.

Your point, that Crisis suits didnt get completely fethed by points, is irrelevant. Rules, points, and the entire 9th environment, are abundantly clear about what the competitive meta is going to look like.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 19:32:17


Post by: Ice_can


Except you know how firedragons changes in pointa effect eldar lists 0 as they never took them anyway. The units you did taken and will take in eldar lists didnt go up that much.

The Tau problem is GW just took every unit we were taking or moght take and slapped it with points increases.

Tau are not going to be fun to play for the first year of 9th edition is what I'm seeing so far.


Tau 8th Edition Tactics @ 2020/07/13 19:52:13


Post by: Aeri


So either you are willing to play the most efficient units we have in an extremely competitive tournament environment, or you play casual games. No point in whining about having to play big suits.

On the other hand: in casual games crisis totally rock and I love them.

What do you guys think about the barracuda now? I think it's going to be a very strong unit