I have a copy of the chaos codex.
Does anyone want to know anything specific?
I will not post pictures
OR Links ,
but I will answer questions

Can you pm me the rules for noise marines and their weapons/points costs?

What sort of options do the Chaos Chosen have compared to what they used to be? I heard they lost Infiltrate, but do they still cost 18pts, can take 4-5 special weapons... What seperates them from just a CSM squad that has a few extra weapons and are overpriced?

Who gets access to demonic mounts?

Obliterators - did the point cost or stat line change at all?

Does it have the Special Character overload that other codecies have?

I'm impressed that Marks are actually priced according to usefulness. MoS is just 1pt on Obliterators, for example.

Lord and sorceror can ride mounts.

Chosen - up to four can have a special or CC
one can take a heavy weapon

Otherwise looks like the same options as CSM




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Obliterators are 70 now and can take marks, otherwise looks the same

I don't know what you mean by special character overload, there are some new unique weapons for HQ's though.
Like kharn's flamer from skalathrax, It's a torrent weapon the chews through marines.

That flamer is totally sweet, sure blows the old Kai Gun out of the water.

not to mention a deamon prince can take it

handheld hellhound hell yeah!

 mauzer wrote:



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Obliterators are 70 now and can take marks, otherwise looks the same

I don't know what you mean by special character overload, there are some new unique weapons for HQ's though.
Like kharn's flamer from skalathrax, It's a torrent weapon the chews through marines.

Cool thanks. Price wise, what kind of weapon would be similar to the cost of adding the MoN to them?

Random observations:

Vehicle upgrades are priced pretty low, the Havoc's cost has been halved for example.

There are only 2 Daemon Weapons, not counting the ones on special characters, and one is Khorne only.

oblit pay 6 for nurgle

What do generic Daemon Weapons do? Are there god specific ones still?

EDIT: Blackfang got it already... so no Kai Gun? Can a Prince be Mastery 3?

there is a khrone axe that adds 2 to str and -1ws/bs +deamon weapon rule

Lords cost like a raider with flickerfield

There are no generic just a maul and axe,


The flamer seems to be basically what the kai gun would be and personally, is way better. Marine save ignoring strength of a marine torrent and soul blaze for 30pts is awesome

 BladeWalker wrote:
What do generic Daemon Weapons do? Are there god specific ones still?

There is Khorne one that is +2 STR, AP2, Blinding, gives Rage and -1WS/BS to user. Strikes at initiative, as does Kharn's Gorechild!

The other one is a mace, so AP4, wounds on 2+, anyone who fails his save must pass a T test or be removed, if this happens everyone within 3" of the wearer must also make a T test or take un unsaveable wound.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
There is a chaos artefact that allows the user to generate an extra psy power every turn from a random table (including Divination) but it costs a lot and causes nasty hits to the user.

Can Daemon Princes take Marks in addition to being a "daemon of x"?

What are the options of Fabius Bile's enhanced warriors?

 mauzer wrote:



The flamer seems to be basically what the kai gun would be and personally, is way better. Marine save ignoring strength of a marine torrent and soul blaze for 30pts is awesome

Sweet! And Lords can take this? My Lord with the dragon headed kai gun thing has been pouting for a long time...

Are the Forge/Mauler fiends and the Hell Dragon thing any good?

There is also a non-daemonic weapon that starts out as a power sword but against one chosen character becomes Str x2, AP1, Instant Death.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I'm impressed that Marks are actually priced according to usefulness. MoS is just 1pt on Obliterators, for example.

Wait, MoS giving FnP is one point and MoN giving Fear is 6 points on Oblis? I must me missing something here.

 Starfarer wrote:
Can Daemon Princes take Marks in addition to being a "daemon of x"?

What are the options of Fabius Bile's enhanced warriors?

No.


Just one unit of CSM gets Fearless and +1 Str for free.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 His Master's Voice wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I'm impressed that Marks are actually priced according to usefulness. MoS is just 1pt on Obliterators, for example.

Wait, MoS giving FnP is one point and MoN giving Fear is 6 points on Oblis? I must me missing something here.

MoS gives +1 initiative.

fabius biles enhanced warriors are a free upgrade to +1 strength and fearless but now only one unit per army of normal CSM

on the flamer, lords smiths sorcerors and apostles. it replaces one wep and is one per army

Any form of Psychic defenses? Hood type things or runic armor type stuff?

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 Starfarer wrote:
Can Daemon Princes take Marks in addition to being a "daemon of x"?

What are the options of Fabius Bile's enhanced warriors?

No.


Just one unit of CSM gets Fearless and +1 Str for free.

Cool, thanks. And I assume the enhanced CSM squad can take other options, like marks and icon as normal?

Any truth to the rumor of poisoned flamers for Plague marines?

 Lord Magnus wrote:
Are the Forge/Mauler fiends and the Hell Dragon thing any good?

175 for the dual hades version so hell yes they are.
Your other alternative is havocs who pay 25 for flakk missiles but cost like normal marines

 BladeWalker wrote:
Any form of Psychic defenses? Hood type things or runic armor type stuff?

Didn't see anything, but it's a big codex.

Fallen we know it's been around, I kept trying to post it, but it's against dakka rules.

 mauzer wrote:
Lord sorcerer smith and apostle can ride mounts.

I just noticed that only the Lord and Sorcerer can. The other two have an exception in their entry.

woops ill edit that thanks black fang

What options does the Hellbrute have for weapons? Can it take marks?

Thunder hammer
scourge
missile launcher
additional fist
heavy bolter
reaper
plasma cannon
lascannon
combibolter/heavyflamer

ThatEdGuy wrote:
What options does the Hellbrute have for weapons? Can it take marks?

Comes with PF+MM as standard. No integrated weapon in the fist to start with!

Can replace MM with TLHB, RAC, PC, TLLC, or another fist.

Any fist may be upgraded with a combi-bolter of heavy flamer.

One fist may be replaced with a missile launcher.

Any fist may be replaced with a thunder hammer or power scourge.

No marks or vehicle upgrades.

Quick rundown of Lucius please?

As further evidence that GW hates Tzeentch, the MoT only gives a 6++ base if the model did not already have an invulnerable.

 Biohavok wrote:
Quick rundown of Lucius please?

He's pretty much the same except that his attack value is equal to his opponents WS in a challenge.

edit: Forgot that lash doesn't count as an extra CCW, but gives all his CC attacks shred.

Do Possessed have the Daemon special rule?

Regarding terminators: How much is MoN? How much are combi weapons? What CC options, and how much?


Again, thanks so much for the replies. I've got mine pre-ordered at my FLGS, but I am not a patient man.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
As further evidence that GW hates Tzeentch, the MoT only gives a 6++ base if the model did not already have an invulnerable.

Continued:

Characters have access to Chainaxes and Blight Grenades, but not sonic weaponry or inferno bolts.

 Starfarer wrote:
Do Possessed have the Daemon special rule?

Regarding terminators: How much is MoN? How much are combi weapons? What CC options, and how much?


Again, thanks so much for the replies. I've got mine pre-ordered at my FLGS, but I am not a patient man.

Same here. I've been working on several lists for the past few hours.

Okay Terminators. They're slightly more expensive then last codex, but the LC/DualLC and PF options are way cheaper. Heavy flamers are more expensive and combiweapons/reapers are the same. One less LD but with the Veterans upgrade their basically the same. Marks are about twice what normal CSM pay for.

Actually Termies come with Combis now.

Question Since you have the book.

Looking at the defiler it has 2 PowerFist and you can add 1.

In the profile it lists x attacks if we have 3 powerfists and 1 Powerscurge is it x +3 (Powerfists) + 1 Powersurge?

Termies are slightly more expensive base, but the LC/DualLC/PF options are way cheaper and the come with combiweapons. Heavy flamers are more expensive and reapers are the same. They pay more for marks and can get the same leadership.... with an upgrade.

here's a big one that may go unoticed.

Any tank can take a havoc launcher at for just 12 more

Thats a twinlinked 48inch range small blast at st5 on every tank!

Tyrs13 wrote:
Actually Termies come with Combis now.

Question Since you have the book.

Looking at the defiler it has 2 PowerFist and you can add 1.

In the profile it lists x attacks if we have 3 powerfists and 1 Powerscurge is it x +3 (Powerfists) + 1 Powersurge?

Termies are slightly more expensive base, but the LC/DualLC/PF options are way cheaper and the come with combiweapons. Heavy flamers are more expensive and reapers are the same. They pay more for marks and can get the same leadership.... with an upgrade.

The combibolter is the old twinlinked bolter from the previous codex. They still pay the same amount if they want the combi melta/flamer and plasma.

Any Characters, named or otherwise that Make Chosen count as troops, or scoring(or can take them as like a SM CMD Sqd?). did cultists make it into the book, and if so how can they be armed? Do any characters open up options for alternate allies to represent traitors(IE, IG tank, SM Squads, etc etc)? I know it's a long shot, but any chance Characters get access to heavy weapons(Hvy Flamers, Reapers, etc)? Are Hellbrutes simply there to replace dreadnaughts, or are they a supplement next to them?

Sweet, normal CSM can take 1 flakk missile in a squad of ten - very useful if you only play vs a few flyers.

 Sigvatr wrote:
Sweet, normal CSM can take 1 flakk missile in a squad of ten - very useful if you only play vs a few flyers.

The troops cannot get flakk missiles, Havocs pay a few more points to include them with a standard launcher.

We can do without the requests for links to scans, pdfs etc etc please folks.

We've had to tidy this thread somewhat already, if we have to do so again suspensions and warnings will be handed out.

Be smart please people.

Thank you.

Is this sheet correct for Chaos Cultists? http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-berDJTN8lLA/UEOImxSDNoI/AAAAAAAAKa4/0DJ6GtjivrE/s1600/Cultist+Screenshot+Cropped.jpg

If not what are the point costs for the models?
are Cultists with CCW the same price as cultists with Autoguns?

Thanks!

 Garuss Acine wrote:
Any Characters, named or otherwise that Make Chosen count as troops, or scoring(or can take them as like a SM CMD Sqd?). did cultists make it into the book, and if so how can they be armed? Do any characters open up options for alternate allies to represent traitors(IE, IG tank, SM Squads, etc etc)? I know it's a long shot, but any chance Characters get access to heavy weapons(Hvy Flamers, Reapers, etc)? Are Hellbrutes simply there to replace dreadnaughts, or are they a supplement next to them?

- Abby makes choosen troops, generic lords and tzeenth sorc make their cult units troops.

- Nothing dealing really with any form of other book. The book goes over and over again that its bonuses are for its own codex.

- There are no new chars in the book Ahriman is the closest being able to spam powers. as far as heavy weapons.

- Hellbrutes are the new dreads, crazed is very tame now.

guess my eldar better stock up on starcannons thers gunna be an swarm of meq armies at my local flgs...

Krauser1 wrote:
Is this sheet correct for Chaos Cultists? http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-berDJTN8lLA/UEOImxSDNoI/AAAAAAAAKa4/0DJ6GtjivrE/s1600/Cultist+Screenshot+Cropped.jpg

If not what are the point costs for the models?
are Cultists with CCW the same price as cultists with Autoguns?

Thanks!

Complete fabrication.

They're 4 pts, +1 for autogun. May have Marks, but not Icons.

Krauser1 wrote:
Is this sheet correct for Chaos Cultists? http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-berDJTN8lLA/UEOImxSDNoI/AAAAAAAAKa4/0DJ6GtjivrE/s1600/Cultist+Screenshot+Cropped.jpg

If not what are the point costs for the models?
are Cultists with CCW the same price as cultists with Autoguns?

Thanks!

- The sheet is way off, the squad is a point more expensive per model with options being what youd expect for every 10 models.
- Dakka cultists are a point more on top of that.

About Noise Marines: Is it now 110% confirmed that you *must* take 10 men to get a Blastmaster?

- Can the unit carry an Icon/which one/s?

- Are Sonic Blasters still a model-by-model buy, or does the entire squad have to take them?

- Can the unit champion still take both a Sonic Blaster AND a Doom Siren?!

Thank-you kindly!

do cultist get access to plasma guns in the numbers like Vet Squads?

Krauser1 wrote:
Is this sheet correct for Chaos Cultists? http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-berDJTN8lLA/UEOImxSDNoI/AAAAAAAAKa4/0DJ6GtjivrE/s1600/Cultist+Screenshot+Cropped.jpg

If not what are the point costs for the models?
are Cultists with CCW the same price as cultists with Autoguns?

Thanks!

They cost more. Have to pay extra to exchange for autoguns. Only the champion gets to buy a shotgun (also only option), and the only special weapons available to the normal cultists are the heavy stubber and flamer. And they get to take marks for cheaper then normal CSM do.

Did Defilers gain It will not die or the Daemonic special rules?

Text removed
Reds8n

ThatEdGuy wrote:
Did Defilers gain It will not die or the Daemonic special rules?

Yes. Basically every daemon engine (not the Hellbrute) gets daemonic possesion, daemon, daemonforge and it will not die.

What are Havoc costs like relative to say...Long Fangs?

As a side note, Predators, anything up with them?

To equate approximately with the current CSM's, is a 10man squad with a pfist champ and 2 flamers and CCW's, sporting a basic Icon and VotLW and a Rhino still ~240ish points?

I'm sad Reaper Autocannons are the same, they're grossly overcosted and limited in availability :(

Experiment 626 wrote:
About Noise Marines: Is it now 110% confirmed that you *must* take 10 men to get a Blastmaster?

- Can the unit carry an Icon/which one/s?

- Are Sonic Blasters still a model-by-model buy, or does the entire squad have to take them?

- Can the unit champion still take both a Sonic Blaster AND a Doom Siren?!

Thank-you kindly!

Yes. 1 Blastmaster at 10 guys, 2 at 20.

You can take the FNP Icon.

Model per model.

Champion by RAW cannot have a Sonic Blaster, nor a basic CCW for that matter.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Vaktathi wrote:
Predators, anything up with them?

Base cost up a bit, weapon upgrades down a bit. I'll ignore the rest of your questions since they've been known for ages.

What is the base point cost of a Hellbrute and Heldrake?

What is the point cost of Khorne Berzerkers, what are there options, chainaxes per model? or only the leader.. You could takr 1 plasma pistol per 5 i think before... Are there any other weapons a Khorne berzerker squad can take?

I heard rumors before that they might get to take the equivilent of an Eviscerator per 5 models instead of plasma pistols to fit a more CC oriented squad.

 lord_blackfang wrote:


Yes. 1 Blastmaster at 10 guys, 2 at 20.

You can take the FNP Icon.

Model per model.

Champion by RAW cannot have a Sonic Blaster, nor a basic CCW for that matter.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Vaktathi wrote:
Predators, anything up with them?

Base cost up a bit, weapon upgrades down a bit. I'll ignore the rest of your questions since they've been known for ages.

Thank-you kindly!

I hope there's a way around the champion issue... I really, really would hate to have to shelve the one I've converted using bitz from about a dozen different kits!

Is there a new type of Land Raider and if yes which weapons does it have?

Oh! Is there some sort of Drop Pod?

 Vaktathi wrote:
What are Havoc costs like relative to say...Long Fangs?

As a side note, Predators, anything up with them?

To equate approximately with the current CSM's, is a 10man squad with a pfist champ and 2 flamers and CCW's, sporting a basic Icon and VotLW and a Rhino still ~240ish points?

I'm sad Reaper Autocannons are the same, they're grossly overcosted and limited in availability :(

They're definitely costed way better then before. Most of the LF configurations are cheaper but Chaos now have the cheapest Lascannon heavy weapon squad in the game. They're also the same points as a normal CSM with the same options.

Chaos preds base cost is a bit higher then the Loyalist versions, but have cheaper weapon upgrades. They have a more expensive dakkapred but a very cheap full las pred.

 Shadox wrote:
Is there a new type of Land Raider and if yes which weapons does it have?

No, that was just trolling. Same with all the Apostle powers, Helbrute Marks, etc.

 Shadox wrote:
Is there a new type of Land Raider and if yes which weapons does it have?

Nope.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Dandruff wrote:
Oh! Is there some sort of Drop Pod?

Nope too.

Wow, my Slaaneshy Biker squad gained FNP and still went down 45 pts.

FallenAfh wrote:


They cost more. Have to pay extra to exchange for autoguns. Only the champion gets to buy a shotgun (also only option), and the only special weapons available to the normal cultists are the heavy stubber and flamer. And they get to take marks for cheaper then normal CSM do.

Does this mean there are more 'elite/special' cultist squads which get access to more than just those two weapons? if so, is it dependent on mark?

How does the scourge work?

 Anpu42 wrote:
How does the scourge work?

Scourge is a powerfist that deducts d3 from adjoining WS of enemies


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Garuss Acine wrote:

FallenAfh wrote:


They cost more. Have to pay extra to exchange for autoguns. Only the champion gets to buy a shotgun (also only option), and the only special weapons available to the normal cultists are the heavy stubber and flamer. And they get to take marks for cheaper then normal CSM do.

Does this mean there are more 'elite/special' cultist squads which get access to more than just those two weapons? if so, is it dependent on mark?

Only one type of cultist squad, found in troops. Typhus gets super cultists which cannot get more options, but do not cost more.

 Garuss Acine wrote:

FallenAfh wrote:


They cost more. Have to pay extra to exchange for autoguns. Only the champion gets to buy a shotgun (also only option), and the only special weapons available to the normal cultists are the heavy stubber and flamer. And they get to take marks for cheaper then normal CSM do.

Does this mean there are more 'elite/special' cultist squads which get access to more than just those two weapons? if so, is it dependent on mark?

Nope, there's only one cultist entry in the codex. On the other hand Typhus upgrades a vanilla squad to zombies for free.

Can any model (or specifically just units from Codex: Daemons) deep strike off icons?

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I'll ignore the rest of your questions since they've been known for ages.

Sorry I can't keep abreast of every single thing rumored in several thousand posts worth of conversation... I apparently found the one thing that couldn't be re-stated




Man I wish 4chan weren't blocked at work....

How many points are thousand sons, and what are the options for the aspiring sorcerer in terms of how many powers they get and what they can choose from?

Can cultists take marks?

What weapons do the heldrake come with?

ThatEdGuy wrote:
Can any model (or specifically just units from Codex: Daemons) deep strike off icons?

Nobody. There is only one teleport homer type thing in the Codex and it's a Chaos Artefact.


Breaking news: Obliterators Ld8, not Fearless.

Ozomoto wrote:
How many points are thousand sons, and what are the options for the aspiring sorcerer in terms of how many powers they get and what they can choose from?

Can cultists take marks?

What weapons do the heldrake come with?

1ksons are same points though champ is two points cheaper than before. They have few options though can get soulblaze.

Cultists can get marks but no icons

Heldrake can get one hades auto cannon or the balefire thingy.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 lord_blackfang wrote:

ThatEdGuy wrote:
Can any model (or specifically just units from Codex: Daemons) deep strike off icons?

Nobody. There is only one teleport homer type thing in the Codex and it's a Chaos Artefact.


Breaking news: Obliterators Ld8, not Fearless.

edit, thought daemon caused fearless, they just cause fear.

 lazarian wrote:

Oblits are daemons, thus fearless.

Might wanna re-check that

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 lazarian wrote:

Oblits are daemons, thus fearless.

Might wanna re-check that

word yeah saw that, thought fear gave them fearless.

Ozomoto wrote:
How many points are thousand sons, and what are the options for the aspiring sorcerer in terms of how many powers they get and what they can choose from?

Can cultists take marks?

What weapons do the heldrake come with?

Same as before, lost the sorceror commands but gets veterans of the long war standard. Sorcerer only has 1 master level and since is Tzeench marked, must pick his power from the Tzeencth table. On the other hand he's slightly cheaper and doesn't have to pay for his power. May take a gift of mutation/meltabombs.

Cultists can take marks for cheaper then normal CSM.

Helldrake comes with the Hades Autocannon, and can exchange for the bale flamer for free.

Can the heldrake and the helfiend get marks?

Ozomoto wrote:
Can the heldrake and the helfiend get marks?

There are no vehicle specific marks.

Ozomoto wrote:
Can the heldrake and the helfiend get marks?

No they just get to move around weapon options.

Ozomoto wrote:
Can the heldrake and the helfiend get marks?

No, vehicles can't get marks, end of story.

I am laughing at this ^

 lord_blackfang wrote:

ThatEdGuy wrote:
Can any model (or specifically just units from Codex: Daemons) deep strike off icons?

Nobody. There is only one teleport homer type thing in the Codex and it's a Chaos Artefact.


Breaking news: Obliterators Ld8, not Fearless.

IMO, even with the point decrease, they got a huge nerf. Which I guess makes perfect sense by GW's MO, everyone who wanted any already has a bunch so might as well nerf them ...

How many points is Ahriman, what ap is his staff, and does he have any specific powers only he can use?

no they didn't get nerfed because now you can take mark of nurgle and pop them up to t5

whoadirty wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:

ThatEdGuy wrote:
Can any model (or specifically just units from Codex: Daemons) deep strike off icons?

Nobody. There is only one teleport homer type thing in the Codex and it's a Chaos Artefact.


Breaking news: Obliterators Ld8, not Fearless.

IMO, even with the point decrease, they got a huge nerf. Which I guess makes perfect sense by GW's MO, everyone who wanted any already has a bunch so might as well nerf them ...

For about the same price as the previous oblits you can get T5. Thats huge.

Ozomoto wrote:
How many points is Ahriman, what ap is his staff, and does he have any specific powers only he can use?

Two meltaguns less than before, AP4, no.

Ozomoto wrote:
How many points is Ahriman, what ap is his staff, and does he have any specific powers only he can use?

Staff is only ap 4, he doesn't appear to have any special powers, I don't think we can post exact points.

So autogun toting cultists cost the same as guard line infantry?

That key thingy can be pretty good potentially...kill a single enemy in melee and your units do not scatter anymore when deepstriking?

Sounds awesome.

Thinking about getting a solid Chaos psyker, a minimum sized unit of cultists (as you are forced to take 1 troops choice) and a squad of havocs to kick some AA ass. 4 flakk rockets per turn? That's like 1 dead flyer. Awesome.

 Sigvatr wrote:
That key thingy can be pretty good potentially...kill a single enemy in melee and your units do not scatter anymore when deepstriking?

Sounds awesome.

Good luck reaching melee in time for a teleport homer to still be relevant

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:
That key thingy can be pretty good potentially...kill a single enemy in melee and your units do not scatter anymore when deepstriking?

Sounds awesome.

Good luck reaching melee in time for a teleport homer to still be relevant

Well, it's better than a normal homer given that it affects everything anywhere...land wherever you want, no scatter. It certainly can be useful. Won a few games by last-turn dropping some deep striking troops in order to capture / contest an objective.

 mauzer wrote:
no they didn't get nerfed because now you can take mark of nurgle and pop them up to t5

I was thinking the loss of Fearless really sucks with Ld 8. T5 doesn't help much if they running off the board. Mind you, single Obliterators are that much better now.

Nerf list, contd: A terminator may only upgrade his melee or ranged weapon, not both. You want lighting claw? No combi-plasma for you!

Why would i take a lightning claw and a comb-plasma? I thought you needed a pair to confer shred, and a Powersword is AP3 just like a Lightning claw is AP3?

whoadirty wrote:

 mauzer wrote:
no they didn't get nerfed because now you can take mark of nurgle and pop them up to t5

I was thinking the loss of Fearless really sucks with Ld 8. T5 doesn't help much if they running off the board. Mind you, single Obliterators are that much better now.

Take one, then he's effectively fearless.

decoste007xt wrote:
Why would i take a lightning claw and a comb-plasma? I thought you needed a pair to confer shred, and a Powersword is AP3 just like a Lightning claw is AP3?

You only need two to get the extra attack, shred is the rule of the weapon.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Nerf list, contd: A terminator may only upgrade his melee or ranged weapon, not both. You want lighting claw? No combi-plasma for you!

So no Combi-Melta and Chainfist together?

 BladeWalker wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Nerf list, contd: A terminator may only upgrade his melee or ranged weapon, not both. You want lighting claw? No combi-plasma for you!

So no Combi-Melta and Chainfist together?

Says you can upgrade one of the options from the following three list so I guess no.

Thanks for the info guys
Been sat here with 3 helbrutes and didnt want to start converting until i knew weapon options

So they are a new dread with a more tame temper issue.
And pretty much same upgrades?
Works for me.

Thanks again guys for all the info

Also as an aside the fluff is still stuck in neutral if that was a question anyone had about that. Were about ready to fight the 13th crusade!

 lazarian wrote:

 BladeWalker wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Nerf list, contd: A terminator may only upgrade his melee or ranged weapon, not both. You want lighting claw? No combi-plasma for you!

So no Combi-Melta and Chainfist together?

Says you can upgrade one of the options from the following three list so I guess no.

Blackfang is right, you have to choose to replace the ranged or the CC weapon.

About fluff: Maybe we should make a new thread for it.

Dark Apostle plus Deathleaper is a bad time for any chaos player.

Im disappointed by lack of hellbrute marks

 lazarian wrote:

 BladeWalker wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Nerf list, contd: A terminator may only upgrade his melee or ranged weapon, not both. You want lighting claw? No combi-plasma for you!

So no Combi-Melta and Chainfist together?

Says you can upgrade one of the options from the following three list so I guess no.

W... T... F...

So out of 20 terminators I have 4 that are legal now... yay.

 BladeWalker wrote:

 lazarian wrote:

 BladeWalker wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Nerf list, contd: A terminator may only upgrade his melee or ranged weapon, not both. You want lighting claw? No combi-plasma for you!

So no Combi-Melta and Chainfist together?

Says you can upgrade one of the options from the following three list so I guess no.

W... T... F...

So out of 20 terminators I have 4 that are legal now... yay.

The heavy is another separate option so you can do chainfist/heavy but yeah this nugget changes the unit composition by a fair margin.

 BladeWalker wrote:

 lazarian wrote:

 BladeWalker wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Nerf list, contd: A terminator may only upgrade his melee or ranged weapon, not both. You want lighting claw? No combi-plasma for you!

So no Combi-Melta and Chainfist together?

Says you can upgrade one of the options from the following three list so I guess no.

W... T... F...

So out of 20 terminators I have 4 that are legal now... yay.

I understand, but what did the termies have on them??

 BladeWalker wrote:

 lazarian wrote:

 BladeWalker wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Nerf list, contd: A terminator may only upgrade his melee or ranged weapon, not both. You want lighting claw? No combi-plasma for you!

So no Combi-Melta and Chainfist together?

Says you can upgrade one of the options from the following three list so I guess no.

W... T... F...

So out of 20 terminators I have 4 that are legal now... yay.

I'll take those pesky illegal ones off your hands, free of charge

Yep, arm swaps are a pretty standard part of any new codex.

Is it true you can combine the Dragon, 2 maulers and an oblit kit to make a Chaos Megazord?

Hetelic wrote:
Is it true you can combine the Dragon, 2 maulers and an oblit kit to make a Chaos Megazord?

.....Really?

Maybe I'm late to the show, but is there any news on:
Cypher (back or not)?
Huron (changes)?


Thanks!

Do two power scourges on a hellbrute reduce attacks on all models by 2? Is this to a minimum of 1? How do Hellbrutes work if they have one hammer/pfist and one scourge?

Arm swaps and something becoming strictly worse are two separate issues. Not only can they not take th/ ss, they can't even keep the one smaaaaaallllll advantage they did have.

ThatEdGuy wrote:
Do two power scourges on a hellbrute reduce attacks on all models by 2? Is this to a minimum of 1? How do Hellbrutes work if they have one hammer/pfist and one scourge?

The Scourge only deducts WS, not attacks. It does not mention what happens when you have two however its worded strongly the effect only happens once (-1d3 not -2d3).

Hetelic wrote:
Is it true you can combine the Dragon, 2 maulers and an oblit kit to make a Chaos Megazord?

Well played. The dragon looks terrible, terrible, terrible. One of the most ugly minis GW has ever released in the current gen.

Hetelic wrote:
Is it true you can combine the Dragon, 2 maulers and an oblit kit to make a Chaos Megazord?

No, no, no! You've got it all wrong!

1 drake forms the body and head
1 mauler splits for the arms
2 maulers for each leg

1 additional drake for upgrading to (IIRC) the Chaos Daemonzord
nothing about obliterators, though the modeling section suggests you use them to test paint schemes, with one squad in each legion.

 spiralingcadaver wrote:
Maybe I'm late to the show, but is there any news on:
Cypher (back or not)?
Huron (changes)?


Thanks!

Huron I am not familiar enough with to tell you differences, No Cypher though.

 Lord Magnus wrote:

 BladeWalker wrote:

 lazarian wrote:

 BladeWalker wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Nerf list, contd: A terminator may only upgrade his melee or ranged weapon, not both. You want lighting claw? No combi-plasma for you!

So no Combi-Melta and Chainfist together?

Says you can upgrade one of the options from the following three list so I guess no.

W... T... F...

So out of 20 terminators I have 4 that are legal now... yay.

I understand, but what did the termies have on them??

Power Fists and CombiWeapons, Chain Fists and CombiWeapons, Lightning Claw and CombiWeapons

So the base Terminator is Power Weapon and Combi-Bolter and swapping arms on old metal kits could prove difficult since the new kits arms are twice the size...

This isn't the thread for you guys to boohoo about the models, kids.

Do thousand sons still hav ap3 bolters? are they relentless or S&P? how expensive Is 1 marine? 1 sorceror? any upgradeable weapons or new rules?

Does the Green (nurgle) Marine get his very own Zord, cause he's special?

No mention of Cypher, 1ksons still have ap3 bolters and S&P

Hetelic wrote:
Does the Green (nurgle) Marine get his very own Zord, cause he's special?

Please leave?

Cant give out points for 1ksons except to say they identical except the sorc squad leader.

Options are the flaming banner, meltabombs and champ mutation.

This may be off topic but what is the purpose of S&P now? i dont have new rulebook, Is sorceror up or down in price? Is sorceror mastery 1?

Hetelic wrote:
Does the Green (nurgle) Marine get his very own Zord, cause he's special?

He's not the only one who's special around here.

 timetowaste85 wrote:
Can you pm me the rules for noise marines and their weapons/points costs?

Me too, please.

 Lord Magnus wrote:

Hetelic wrote:
Is it true you can combine the Dragon, 2 maulers and an oblit kit to make a Chaos Megazord?

.....Really?

Yes. Take all 4 kits and stuff them in a blender. Let the Blender run for 5 minutes. Pour out and add 2 lbs of superglue. Mix thoroughly.

 Lokas wrote:

 timetowaste85 wrote:
Can you pm me the rules for noise marines and their weapons/points costs?

Me too, please.

Blastmaster noise marines are as much as plain noise marines in old book, 1 per 10 can take a blastmaster for almost as much as a rhino. The squad can get their banner, ccw for a bit more squad leader can get doom siren, mutation, meltas, plus the melee shooting wargear section.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Justicar Cliesthenes wrote:
This may be off topic but what is the purpose of S&P now? i dont have new rulebook, Is sorceror up or down in price? Is sorceror mastery 1?

Sorc hair cheaper for master 1, S&P is in the new rulebook you kinda need it.

Is it true that tyfus cultists cant take any upgrades and end up as a nurgle unit without actual mark of nurgle ?

Makumba wrote:
Is it true that tyfus cultists cant take any upgrades and end up as a nurgle unit without actual mark of nurgle ?

They are cultists that lose shooting abilities and upgrades, in exchange for FNP, SNP, and Fearless.

do marks count as upgrades?

 Lord Magnus wrote:

Makumba wrote:
Is it true that tyfus cultists cant take any upgrades and end up as a nurgle unit without actual mark of nurgle ?

They are cultists that lose shooting abilities and upgrades, in exchange for FNP, SNP, and Fearless.

Is this an option or just taking typhus automicaly make all of them zombies?

Choice.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
and yes, marks are options.

 Anpu42 wrote:

 Lord Magnus wrote:

Makumba wrote:
Is it true that tyfus cultists cant take any upgrades and end up as a nurgle unit without actual mark of nurgle ?

They are cultists that lose shooting abilities and upgrades, in exchange for FNP, SNP, and Fearless.

Is this an option or just taking typhus automicaly make all of them zombies?

Marks are upgrades so its just the plain cultist for zombies, Typhus can choose though can leave normal ones if he likes.

Is Manreaper x2S or +2S? Was never able to fully read that page.

 whigwam wrote:
Is Manreaper x2S or +2S? Was never able to fully read that page.

+2.

Thanks. And could someone give a quick breakdown on what exactly Dark Apostles do? I remember reading about a bunch of ridiculous abilities/USR's they would confer on Cultists, but I haven't heard anything about those for awhile. Blackfang saying the rumored "Apostle powers" were just "trolling" makes me wonder what they do do.

They everyone within 6" their leadership and let you reroll boons if you are in their unit, iirc.

 whigwam wrote:
Thanks. And could someone give a quick breakdown on what exactly Dark Apostles do? I remember reading about a bunch of ridiculous abilities/USR's they would confer on Cultists, but I haven't heard anything about those for awhile. Blackfang saying the rumored "Apostle powers" were just "trolling" makes me wonder what they do do.

They are chaplain analogs, they do not give unit boosts like rumored. They do allow people in his unit to reroll boons.

They have a leadership bubble, a 4++ and Power maul.

Who's the most competetive god now for mono lists?

Just realized that if you roll multiple boons (result 64 on the table), nothing is stopping you from receiving that same result again and again.

 TheAngrySquig wrote:
Who's the most competetive god now for mono lists?

Probably still Nurgle, but it is a matter of opinion.

 lazarian wrote:

 whigwam wrote:
Thanks. And could someone give a quick breakdown on what exactly Dark Apostles do? I remember reading about a bunch of ridiculous abilities/USR's they would confer on Cultists, but I haven't heard anything about those for awhile. Blackfang saying the rumored "Apostle powers" were just "trolling" makes me wonder what they do do.

They are chaplain analogs, they do not give unit boosts like rumored. They do allow people in his unit to reroll boons.

They have a leadership bubble, a 4++ and Power maul.

I take it a Plasma Pistol is an option

What FOC do they take up? I keep hearing difrent things

 Lord Magnus wrote:

 TheAngrySquig wrote:
Who's the most competetive god now for mono lists?

Probably still Nurgle, but it is a matter of opinion.

Looks pretty balanced to me. I think it will come down to play style for a while. Plague Marines do seem to not have suffered from the codex though. The other cult troops have either been improved or made cheaper.

 Anpu42 wrote:

 lazarian wrote:

 whigwam wrote:
Thanks. And could someone give a quick breakdown on what exactly Dark Apostles do? I remember reading about a bunch of ridiculous abilities/USR's they would confer on Cultists, but I haven't heard anything about those for awhile. Blackfang saying the rumored "Apostle powers" were just "trolling" makes me wonder what they do do.

They are chaplain analogs, they do not give unit boosts like rumored. They do allow people in his unit to reroll boons.

They have a leadership bubble, a 4++ and Power maul.

I take it a Plasma Pistol is an option

What FOC do they take up? I keep hearing difrent things

They are HQ and can take all the melee shooting options normal char can.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Mohoc wrote:

 Lord Magnus wrote:

 TheAngrySquig wrote:
Who's the most competetive god now for mono lists?

Probably still Nurgle, but it is a matter of opinion.

Looks pretty balanced to me. I think it will come down to play style for a while. Plague Marines do seem to not have suffered from the codex though. The other cult troops have either been improved or made cheaper.

I think the best mono army would be undivided. Basic units are so cheap now.

 Lord Magnus wrote:

 TheAngrySquig wrote:
Who's the most competetive god now for mono lists?

Probably still Nurgle, but it is a matter of opinion.

Thanks. If slaanesh gets FNP, what does nurgle get?

nothing . Kelly gave them fear as signature power . lolz.

 TheAngrySquig wrote:

 Lord Magnus wrote:

 TheAngrySquig wrote:
Who's the most competetive god now for mono lists?

Probably still Nurgle, but it is a matter of opinion.

Thanks. If slaanesh gets FNP, what does nurgle get?

Slaanesh gets +1 Initiative, the icon (an upgrade) give FNP
Nurgle gets +1 Toughness, the icon gives Fear

Edit: Correction to Mark of Nurgle, It does not give FNP, It gives +1 Toughness

 TheAngrySquig wrote:

 Lord Magnus wrote:

 TheAngrySquig wrote:
Who's the most competetive god now for mono lists?

Probably still Nurgle, but it is a matter of opinion.

Thanks. If slaanesh gets FNP, what does nurgle get?

Plague marines get FNP, mark of nurgle is just fear.

Oh alright, thanks for clearing that up. Any special weapons for Nurgle only?

 TheAngrySquig wrote:

 Lord Magnus wrote:

 TheAngrySquig wrote:
Who's the most competetive god now for mono lists?

Probably still Nurgle, but it is a matter of opinion.

Thanks. If slaanesh gets FNP, what does nurgle get?

Mark or Icon wise?

Icons = Slaanesh FNP and Nurgle Fear

Marks = Slaanesh +1 intiative and Nurgle +1 Toughness

Does it say anywhere that Plague Zombies count as non-scoring? I heard this numerous times, but Typhus' page makes it seem like they'll still be scoring. Of course, knowing GW, I'm not counting on all relevant rules being on the same page...

 lazarian wrote:

 TheAngrySquig wrote:

 Lord Magnus wrote:

 TheAngrySquig wrote:
Who's the most competetive god now for mono lists?

Probably still Nurgle, but it is a matter of opinion.

Thanks. If slaanesh gets FNP, what does nurgle get?

Plague marines get FNP, mark of nurgle is just fear.

Corrected my post. Plague Marines get FNP, MoN is +1T, Icon is Fear

Are Typhus' zombies still scoring? I want to do a zombie horde army, but it might put a damper on things if I have to take allies to have any scoring unit.

Ninja'd

 whigwam wrote:
Does it say anywhere that Plague Zombies count as non-scoring? I heard this numerous times, but Typhus' page makes it seem like they'll still be scoring. Of course, knowing GW, I'm not counting on all relevant rules being on the same page...

They are still (scoring) troops.

Nothing says that Zombies aren't scoring.

Mohoc wrote:

 whigwam wrote:
Does it say anywhere that Plague Zombies count as non-scoring? I heard this numerous times, but Typhus' page makes it seem like they'll still be scoring. Of course, knowing GW, I'm not counting on all relevant rules being on the same page...

They are still (scoring) troops.

Yep^ No real downside to these guys except lack or ranged weaponry.

If you want to run and army of 260 zombies at 2k, have a blast!

How big of a zombie horde can you take?

 TheAngrySquig wrote:
How big of a zombie horde can you take?

35 per squad

Make that 420 Zombies at 2k

Do regular Obliterators still come with a Power Fist? Or did those go to the Mutilators only?

Also, any new options available to Plaguemarines? Or same as ever?

Thanks everyone for taking the time to answer Q's.

 Lord Magnus wrote:
Make that 420 Zombies at 2k

You pay 50 points for the first 10, then 4 for each additional cultist.

 whigwam wrote:
Do regular Obliterators still come with a Power Fist? Or did those go to the Mutilators only?

Also, any new options available to Plaguemarines? Or same as ever?

Thanks everyone for taking the time to answer Q's.

Oblits have fists like before.

Plaguemarines have roughly the same options as before however have knives now standard.

 whigwam wrote:
Do regular Obliterators still come with a Power Fist? Or did those go to the Mutilators only?

Also, any new options available to Plaguemarines? Or same as ever?

Thanks everyone for taking the time to answer Q's.

No problem

Oblits have a power fist,

Plagues can get 2 special weapons, 2 plasma pistols, an Icon, and mutations, meltabombs, and some other gear for the champ.

 whigwam wrote:
Do regular Obliterators still come with a Power Fist? Or did those go to the Mutilators only?

Also, any new options available to Plaguemarines? Or same as ever?

Thanks everyone for taking the time to answer Q's.

Oblits still have powerfists

Plaguemarines look good. 2 Special Weapons (replace pistol, not the bolt gun), FNP, Fearless, MoN, Blight Grenades (Offensive/Defensive), Krak Grenades, 120pts for the first 4+Champion, 24 pts for up to 15 more

Is there anything special like in SW that you get multiple HQ for each slot?

 Grimwulfe wrote:
Is there anything special like in SW that you get multiple HQ for each slot?

Nope nothing like that, nor is there a unit like wolf guard or royal court.

Are spawn still an entry? Do they take up a FOC slot this codex, and roughly how much do they cost? Are they as crappy as ever, rules wise?

Spawns are still a Fast Attack, still meh though marking them might be worthwhile, they are a bit cheaper now, plus get a chart bonus

What FOC slot do the Dragons Take?

Daemon princes?

Greater Daemons do they still kill a champion?

Hell Drakes are Fast Attack, Daemon Princes are HQ, Greater Daemons no longer exist, you can get a Greater Daemon via the allies rule

Hi gents, thanks for answering all these questions.

Slightly more meta, who can deepstrike/outflank/play maneuver shenanigans? Are Rhinos now the same cost as loyalist rhinos? And what has leapt out to you lucky people as being particularly cool, exciting and/or awesome list-wise?

Also, there was something in the rumor mill - a scroll or something - that's meant to be pretty exciting, any gen on that or other character upgrades that're new?

And could we get confirmation on the effects of marks/icons for Khorne and Tzeench? Can Bikes/ Raptors/Terminators use all marks and icons? And I'm guessing still no noise marine weapons available for anything outside the basic cult marine unit?

Regards,
Cap'n R

Can mutilators and obliterators be taken in units larger than 3 models?

chosen lost infiltrate
The same units deep strike
Rhinos cost the same and upgrades to them are cheaper

Scroll is pretty useless, only for tzeentch, you get to use one random power each turn but it hits you with st3 ap1 every time

 aka_mythos wrote:
Can mutilators and obliterators be taken in units larger than 3 models?

nadda

 aka_mythos wrote:
Can mutilators and obliterators be taken in units larger than 3 models?

Units of 1-3. Mutators are Elites, Oblits are Heavy

 Starfarer wrote:
Are spawn still an entry? Do they take up a FOC slot this codex, and roughly how much do they cost? Are they as crappy as ever, rules wise?

They don't look took bad. Significant drop in points (~3/4 of what they used to be, I think), they have a 5+ invul now (since they are daemons), are actually quite fast (beasts!) instead of slow, and they can profit a good bit from marks. Tzeentch gives them 4++ while Nurgle makes them T6 (with 3 wounds). They still have random attacks, but Rage means they've got a pretty decent pile of Str 5 attacks on the charge. They get a random buff each round in the fight phase, either 4+ armor, or reroll how many attacks they get, or get poisoned attacks.

With the Mark of Nurgle, a squad of 5 of them makes a decent mobile tarpit to throw at the enemy, honestly.

Edit: Actually, looks like they aren't Daemons, so no save means they still have problems staying alive. Still, T6 means a lot of units will still have a rough time against them, and they've got a 1/3 chance of having an armor save once actually in combat.

Surprised that nobody mentioned that (a) Cultists can be marked, and (b) Olbits lost thier invul. I also noticed that Chosen have CCW and Bolt Pistols as well as Bolters, so that idea of loading two units with Plasma and walking them up the board with Abaddon sounds even better now that they can do some decent combat damage if necessary (4A on the charge).

Daemon Weapons are odd. Khorne one gives Rage even though only Khorne marked models can have it, i.e. they already have Rage. The Murder Sword is nice as it the magic flamer.

 mauzer wrote:
chosen lost infiltrate
The same units deep strike
Rhinos cost the same and upgrades to them are cheaper

Scroll is pretty useless, only for tzeentch, you get to use one random power each turn but it hits you with st3 ap1 every time

Thanks. And yeah, the scroll looks pretty silly.

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:
Surprised that nobody mentioned that (a) Cultists can be marked, and (b) Olbits lost thier invul. I also noticed that Chosen have CCW and Bolt Pistols as well as Bolters, so that idea of loading two units with Plasma and walking them up the board with Abaddon sounds even better now that they can do some decent combat damage if necessary (4A on the charge).

Daemon Weapons are odd. Khorne one gives Rage even though only Khorne marked models can have it, i.e. they already have Rage. The Murder Sword is nice as it the magic flamer.

Abaddon with chosen are good. Oblits are daemons so they do get a 5+ save. cultists can be marked however they are so cheap your possibly better with just getting more of them or taking Typhus.

Thanks for the info. Seeing as I play Death Guard, nurgle marked spawn actually sound pretty sweet! I just need to find some cheap models to build some, as I wanted to have a few anyway for bad rolls on the boon chart. Who knew of all the things in the book, I'd be getting excited about spawn?

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:
Surprised that nobody mentioned that (a) Cultists can be marked, and (b) Olbits lost thier invul. I also noticed that Chosen have CCW and Bolt Pistols as well as Bolters, so that idea of loading two units with Plasma and walking them up the board with Abaddon sounds even better now that they can do some decent combat damage if necessary (4A on the charge).

Daemon Weapons are odd. Khorne one gives Rage even though only Khorne marked models can have it, i.e. they already have Rage. The Murder Sword is nice as it the magic flamer.

Oblits have a 5+ invuln from the Daemon USR

 Lord Magnus wrote:

 spiralingcadaver wrote:
Maybe I'm late to the show, but is there any news on:
Cypher (back or not)?
Huron (changes)?


Thanks!

Huron I am not familiar enough with to tell you differences, No Cypher though.

Sure, his old version was a Chaos Lord, plus:
Hamadrya (provides Warptime)
Tyrant's Claw (Heavy Flamer Power Fist)
Power Axe
personal icon
80 points (more, that is)

The Khorne Axe gives rage because you can take it on a Deamon prince, who would otherwise have no way to get rage.

 mauzer wrote:
Lords cost like a raider with flickerfield

Please don't do this. Just say the points cost. It's not as if we can suddenly play without the Codex if you say that the Lord costs 70 points.

 Captain Roderick wrote:
Hi gents, thanks for answering all these questions.

Slightly more meta, who can deepstrike/outflank/play maneuver shenanigans? Are Rhinos now the same cost as loyalist rhinos? And what has leapt out to you lucky people as being particularly cool, exciting and/or awesome list-wise?

Also, there was something in the rumor mill - a scroll or something - that's meant to be pretty exciting, any gen on that or other character upgrades that're new?

And could we get confirmation on the effects of marks/icons for Khorne and Tzeench? Can Bikes/ Raptors/Terminators use all marks and icons? And I'm guessing still no noise marine weapons available for anything outside the basic cult marine unit?

Regards,
Cap'n R

I haven't looked in detail at the deepstriking/outflanking and things, but I am pretty sure the Hell Drake, all termie armoured units, and all Obliterators and their CC alternatives, Warp Talons (Effectively possessed raptors) and Raptors themselves. I KNOW one of their special Warlord Traits give D3 units infiltrate.

In interesting lists, I believe you could make some cool cult armies, with their perspective characters, as well as a majority deamon/deamon engine army. With cultists and Dark Apostles you could make a religious Word Bearer force, or potentially a cool Alpha Legion army.

The scroll is an item for a psyker which allows you a random new psychic power each turn, at the cost of taking a s3 ap1 hit. (from all of the powers in the rulebook, so there is a lot of potential there, although a lot of randomness)

Termies, Marines, Oblits(and the CC version), Bikes, Raptors, Warp Talons, basically all infantry can take a Mark and Icon, Spawn get marks as well.

Mark of Khorne gives Counter Attack and Rage (+2 attacks on the charge)
Icon gives Furious Charge and re-roll distance

Tzeentch gives +1 to invul, or a 6++ for any unit without one.
Icon gives Soul Blaze to bolt weapons (Bolter, Heavy Bolter, Bolt Pistol and CombiBolters

xxxx -Please don't give specific point costs. -Mannahnin for a Lord.

Didn't notice the Daemon USR on Oblits, so thanks for that.

Regarding Huron, he got pretty nice, getting a nice choice of combat weapons, his usual special rules, and the Master of Treachery WT (D3 units Infiltrate).

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Nerf list, contd: A terminator may only upgrade his melee or ranged weapon, not both. You want lighting claw? No combi-plasma for you!

Wow. Way in invalidate most of my 40+ Terminators GW.

*claps*

 Lord Magnus wrote:

I haven't looked in detail at the deepstriking/outflanking and things, but I am pretty sure the Hell Drake, all termie armoured units, and all Obliterators and their CC alternatives, Warp Talons (Effectively possessed raptors) and Raptors themselves. I KNOW one of their special Warlord Traits give D3 units infiltrate.

In interesting lists, I believe you could make some cool cult armies, with their perspective characters, as well as a majority deamon/deamon engine army. With cultists and Dark Apostles you could make a religious Word Bearer force, or potentially a cool Alpha Legion army.

The scroll is an item for a psyker which allows you a random new psychic power each turn, at the cost of taking a s3 ap1 hit. (from all of the powers in the rulebook, so there is a lot of potential there, although a lot of randomness)

Termies, Marines, Oblits(and the CC version), Bikes, Raptors, Warp Talons, basically all infantry can take a Mark and Icon, Spawn get marks as well.

Mark of Khorne gives Counter Attack and Rage (+2 attacks on the charge)
Icon gives Furious Charge and re-roll distance

Tzeentch gives +1 to invul, or a 6++ for any unit without one.
Icon gives Soul Blaze to bolt weapons (Bolter, Heavy Bolter, Bolt Pistol and CombiBolters

Many thanks for the detail, that's just what I wanted

 spiralingcadaver wrote:

 Lord Magnus wrote:

 spiralingcadaver wrote:
Maybe I'm late to the show, but is there any news on:
Cypher (back or not)?
Huron (changes)?


Thanks!

Huron I am not familiar enough with to tell you differences, No Cypher though.

Sure, his old version was a Chaos Lord, plus:
Hamadrya (provides Warptime)
Tyrant's Claw (Heavy Flamer Power Fist)
Power Axe
personal icon
80 points (more, that is)

Ok, did a bunch of research (Huron is super complicated this dex), Here we go

He retains his power axe (For AP2 stuff) but the Tyrants Claw is an AP3 CCW with a heavy flamer built in, which gives +2 strength, Armourbane, Shred, and it is a specialist weapon.

Hamadrya is a Combat Familiar (+2 attacks at s4 ap -) that gives Huron randomly generated Psychic powers every turn.

He has the Chaos Champion special rule (almost all the characters do) which allows him special mutations when he wins challenges. In addition, he can never refuse a challenge.

He has grenades, Power Armour and a 4+ invul

He is LD 10, Fearless, and D3 units infiltrating.

I wrote all this out cuz he is complicated, but I felt an explanation was necessary

EDIT: Had to open 4 copies of the dex to look at the pages of these rules, a lot of it will be easy to remember, but until you get a feel for it, be prepared to flip through the book often for wargear/rules.

If the Icon bearer die's do you lose the bonus to the unit that carried it?

 Nicorex wrote:
If the Icon bearer die's do you lose the bonus to the unit that carried it?

Yup. Its very specific that a single model carries it.

After looking at the Mutilators, I'm not entirely convinced that they're a bad unit, especially with the Mark of Nurgle. They'll still have problems with Demolisher Cannons like Paladins, but with the Mark of Nurgle they're only 6 points more and they still have a lot of versatility, plus they avoid getting instantly splatted by Powerfists and Thunderhammers.

Also a Khorne Lord on a Juggernaut is only 110 points for T5 W4 A4 with a 3+ save, plus he's Cavalry. I'm going to be running one with a unit or 2 of Chaos Spawn with the Mark of Nurgle. Since they're beasts, they'll be able to keep up. Sickening! They're like better Ogryns in my eyes.

 Nicorex wrote:
If the Icon bearer die's do you lose the bonus to the unit that carried it?

Yes

 Vladsimpaler wrote:
After looking at the Mutilators, I'm not entirely convinced that they're a bad unit, especially with the Mark of Nurgle. They'll still have problems with Demolisher Cannons like Paladins, but with the Mark of Nurgle they're only 6 points more and they still have a lot of versatility, plus they avoid getting instantly splatted by Powerfists and Thunderhammers.

Also a Khorne Lord on a Juggernaut is only 110 points for T5 W4 A4 with a 3+ save, plus he's Cavalry. I'm going to be running one with a unit or 2 of Chaos Spawn with the Mark of Nurgle. Since they're beasts, they'll be able to keep up. Sickening! They're like better Ogryns in my eyes.

The Khorne Jugger + Spawn sounds like a real winner, maybe not so hot as Thunderwolves but can fulfil a similar (terror-inducing) role. Awesome!

I think my major problem with the Mutilators is the models... but that's for another thread.

Vladsimpaler wrote:Also a Khorne Lord on a Juggernaut is only 110 points for T5 W4 A4 with a 3+ save, plus he's Cavalry. I'm going to be running one with a unit or 2 of Chaos Spawn with the Mark of Nurgle. Since they're beasts, they'll be able to keep up. Sickening! They're like better Ogryns in my eyes.

Can't do that. An IC with a Mark can't join a unit with a different mark.

 Lord Magnus wrote:
Ok, did a bunch of research (Huron is super complicated this dex), Here we go

Thanks a lot! Looking forward to trying him out!

(edit: also, thanks Godless-Mimicry for the shorter version

 Captain Roderick wrote:

 Vladsimpaler wrote:
After looking at the Mutilators, I'm not entirely convinced that they're a bad unit, especially with the Mark of Nurgle. They'll still have problems with Demolisher Cannons like Paladins, but with the Mark of Nurgle they're only 6 points more and they still have a lot of versatility, plus they avoid getting instantly splatted by Powerfists and Thunderhammers.

Also a Khorne Lord on a Juggernaut is only 110 points for T5 W4 A4 with a 3+ save, plus he's Cavalry. I'm going to be running one with a unit or 2 of Chaos Spawn with the Mark of Nurgle. Since they're beasts, they'll be able to keep up. Sickening! They're like better Ogryns in my eyes.

The Khorne Jugger + Spawn sounds like a real winner, maybe not so hot as Thunderwolves but can fulfil a similar (terror-inducing) role. Awesome!

I think my major problem with the Mutilators is the models... but that's for another thread.

Hmm...actually I feel like Chaos Spawn could be pretty sweet versus Thunderwolves, especially Spawn with the Mark of Nurgle.

I typically am not a fan of cross-codex comparisons but most of the time it's easy enough to judge.
Both are fast attack.

Chaos Spawn with the Mark of Nurgle: WS3 BS0 S5 T6 W3 I3 A:1D6 LD10 SV-, and they cost six Ork boys' points for one.
Now I'm not gonna lie, the lack of a save really hurts. However to make up for this, they are now Beasts so they move super fast. Granted they have the possibility of a 4+ save in close combat, but this isn't a huge deal. The biggest thing is that they are T6, meaning that you can't ID these bastards unless you have a weapon that just causes instant death
For rules, they are Fearless, cause Fear, and have Rage.

They're superior to Thunderwolves in the Toughness and Wounds category and they're also cheaper which is great. They're the ultimate tarpit unit! Sure they don't have a save, but unless you are bringing power mauls you will be wounding on 6's in close combat, and they'll be wounding on 3+ most of the time.

I'm going to test them out and let you know how it goes!

@Godless- They'd be screening, I don't care if he can join the same unit as them and I already knew that.

Im thinking Fabius Bile will see some play. His enhanced unit (+1str/model) is free and suffers no penalty. He isnt bad against most moderate characters with an enhanced stat line and hes rather cheap.

So is there anything in the codex that would help a person run an alpha legion army? Any units that have rules to reflect them? Alpha legion characters? Anything at all?

Because that is literally the only thing that is keeping me interested in chaos.

What are the special rules and costs of Mutilators, Warp Talons and that strange random scroll?

 MrMoustaffa wrote:
So is there anything in the codex that would help a person run an alpha legion army? Any units that have rules to reflect them? Alpha legion characters? Anything at all?

Because that is literally the only thing that is keeping me interested in chaos.

Cultists and allies are the only Alpha Legion specific things that stand out. You can also use Huron's rules as a 'count as' in order to guarentee the infiltrate warlord trait. There are no new special characters in the book, you have to do some of the legwork yourself.

 Vladsimpaler wrote:
Chaos Spawn with the Mark of Nurgle: WS3 BS0 S5 T6 W3 I3 A:1D6 LD10 SV-, and they cost six ork boyz points for one.
Now I'm not gonna lie, the lack of a save really hurts. However to make up for this, they are now Beasts so they move super fast. Granted they have the possibility of a 4+ save in close combat, but this isn't a huge deal. The biggest thing is that they are T6, meaning that you can't ID these bastards unless you have a weapon that just causes instant death
For rules, they are Fearless, cause Fear, and have Rage.

So they have fearless and fear but are not Daemons and so do not have the 5++?!

 Shadox wrote:

 Vladsimpaler wrote:
Chaos Spawn with the Mark of Nurgle: WS3 BS0 S5 T6 W3 I3 A:1D6 LD10 SV-, and they cost -- points for one.
Now I'm not gonna lie, the lack of a save really hurts. However to make up for this, they are now Beasts so they move super fast. Granted they have the possibility of a 4+ save in close combat, but this isn't a huge deal. The biggest thing is that they are T6, meaning that you can't ID these bastards unless you have a weapon that just causes instant death
For rules, they are Fearless, cause Fear, and have Rage.

So they have fearless and fear but are not Daemons and so do not have the 5++?!

You are correct, they are not Daemons so no 5++. It's unfortunate, but it does also make sense. I do wish that they would have had FnP but I can also see why they didn't include it.

Lesser and Greater Daemons gone or still in the Dex?

Another interesting note is that Oblits and Mutilators are listed as Bulky... so you can stick Abaddon and 3 Mutilators in a Land Raider...

I always used Oblits as a bodyguard for Abbie since they were fearless in 5th... might have to try that again.

Drive me closer I want to rapid fire plasma in their face! Does that mean they can ride in a Rhino and shoot out the top too?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Farseer Mael Dannan wrote:
Lesser and Greater Daemons gone or still in the Dex?

Gone to the Chaos Daemons codex as allies.

Whats the profile of sonic weapons now?

Bolter S and AP, Salvo 2/3, Ignores Cover

 BladeWalker wrote:
Bolter S and AP, Salvo 2/3, Ignores Cover

Thanks

I've only seen bits and rumours about the Possessed - what are they like?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Nerf list, contd: A terminator may only upgrade his melee or ranged weapon, not both. You want lighting claw? No combi-plasma for you!

Wow. Way in invalidate most of my 40+ Terminators GW.

*claps*

And the Chaos Termie box just got that much crappier to boot!

No lightning claw, no power sword, no combi-plasma...
Just 2 axes, 1 mace/maul, 1 of each heavy, 2 power fists, 1 chainfist, 1 combi-flamer, 1 combi-melta & 2 combi-bolters. Have fun trying to build any kind of viable squad with just that worthless hunk of junk kit...

Talk about a near useless box set! You can have a grand total of 1 dude per $60 box who can actually swing at proper initiative!

Can I get the low down on raptors and warptalons?

For raptors are their costs lower and what kind of wargear can they take?

For warp talons, do they have the deamon special rule and again what kind, if any, wargear can they take?

Thanks.

Guess I may as well ask while I'm thinking about it. Cultists literally can only get heavy flamers and heavy stubbers as special weapons right?

Their "sarge" can get a shotgun, but has no way to acquire a power weapon or a better pistol right? They also have no normal way to acquire stubborn, fearless, or a LD above 8 without relying on IC or other "special" effects (al la zombies)

So in all intents and purposes, they are literally meatshields? I can't think of anything seriously that awesome about them otherwise except that they are far better conscripts.

Although I will admit, this does give me an idea for an allied zombie contigent for my orks.

"Boss, I fink da dok got a bit carried away wif dem oomiez"

"Why's dat?"

"Well, dey'z eaten each other for one fing..."

Experiment 626 wrote:
And the Chaos Termie box just got that much crappier to boot!

Almost all my Combi-Melta guys have Chainfists. I have a lot of Combi-Flamer/Lightning Claw or Combi-Flamer/Power Fist guys. And I have a random assortment of heavies, combi-bolters and other weapons.

I foresee this being one of the first things in the FAQ, something along the lines of:

"Change the sentence in Chaos Terminators to say 'Each model may replace their ranged weapon and/or close combat weapon with one of the following..."

 MrMoustaffa wrote:
Guess I may as well ask while I'm thinking about it. Cultists literally can only get heavy flamers and heavy stubbers as special weapons right?

Their "sarge" can get a shotgun, but has no way to acquire a power weapon or a better pistol right? They also have no normal way to acquire stubborn, fearless, or a LD above 8 without relying on IC or other "special" effects (al la zombies)

So in all intents and purposes, they are literally meatshields? I can't think of anything seriously that awesome about them otherwise except that they are far better conscripts.

Although I will admit, this does give me an idea for an allied zombie contigent for my orks.

"Boss, I fink da dok got a bit carried away wif dem oomiez"

"Why's dat?"

"Well, dey'z eaten each other for one fing..."

Honestly you're just better off with allied Imperial Guard most of the time. That being said you can get 30 Cultists with 3 Heavy Stubbers for 145 points so it's not terrible, but considering I can get 30 Guard with tons of weapons and orders and all of that for not that much more, Cultists don't seem that great.

Hmm, glad I didn't preorder the dex atm. So far everything I was looking forward too hasn't been true/ has some large downside. Might wait a bit and look at the 2nd wave release to see if I'll start CSM

I'm just going to have to figure out how to best put together a bunch of naked Daemon Princes. At least at my local shop I can probably get away with making a handful of "upgrade bases" that I can slide the smaller characters into if they Hulk out.

 Magc8Ball wrote:
I'm just going to have to figure out how to best put together a bunch of naked Daemon Princes. At least at my local shop I can probably get away with making a handful of "upgrade bases" that I can slide the smaller characters into if they Hulk out.

You'd be better off running minimally upgraded Chaos Lords. You can get 2 naked Lords for less than the price of a single Daemon Prince.

What happens if someone rolls on the table and becomes a daemon prince? Does he retain any marks, daemon weapons, psychic powers, other gear he already had?

 Vladsimpaler wrote:

 Magc8Ball wrote:
I'm just going to have to figure out how to best put together a bunch of naked Daemon Princes. At least at my local shop I can probably get away with making a handful of "upgrade bases" that I can slide the smaller characters into if they Hulk out.

You'd be better off running minimally upgraded Chaos Lords. You can get 2 naked Lords for less than the price of a single Daemon Prince.

I mean in case of a character mutating into a Daemon Prince. I'm pricing out lists for models I already own, and pretty much every character that might find a useful result is being given the 10 point roll on the Boons table. Between that and the natural results of melee, I figure it won't be that unlikely that I might have multiple DP's pop up in a day of gaming.

Also: wow, I am not pleased that you need 10 Noise Marines to get a Blastmaster. :\

 Vladsimpaler wrote:


You'd be better off running minimally upgraded Chaos Lords. You can get 2 naked Lords for less than the price of a single Daemon Prince.

I think he meant for when a model randomly turns into a Daemon Prince, not in the initial list.

Edit: Ninja'd by six seconds.

I think getting boon with every model that can take it might be worthwhile. 10pts for a random upgrade and a 1/18 chance of becoming a Daemon Prince. Even becoming a Chaos spawn is an upgrade for some models.

 Thatguyoverthere wrote:

 Vladsimpaler wrote:


You'd be better off running minimally upgraded Chaos Lords. You can get 2 naked Lords for less than the price of a single Daemon Prince.

I think he meant for when a model randomly turns into a Daemon Prince, not in the initial list.

Edit: Ninja'd by six seconds.

I think getting boon with every model that can take it might be worthwhile. 10pts for a random upgrade and a 1/18 chance of becoming a Daemon Prince. Even becoming a Chaos spawn is an upgrade for some models.

Gift of mutation specifically says that you reroll the spawn and daemon prince results.

FallenAfh wrote:
Gift of mutation specifically says that you reroll the spawn and daemon prince results.

..oh, yeah. Derp.

Vladsimpaler wrote:Honestly you're just better off with allied Imperial Guard most of the time. That being said you can get 30 Cultists with 3 Heavy Stubbers for 145 points so it's not terrible, but considering I can get 30 Guard with tons of weapons and orders and all of that for not that much more, Cultists don't seem that great.

Comparing Cultists to Guardsmen though is folly as they fulfil completely different roles. Remember that Guardsmen make the backbone of an IG army, and are expected to kill at least some stuff. The same is not true of Cultists who are nothing more than a supporting meatshield, hence them being only 2/3 the cost of a Guardsman.

 Rbb wrote:
What happens if someone rolls on the table and becomes a daemon prince? Does he retain any marks, daemon weapons, psychic powers, other gear he already had?

If a model becomes a DP, he retains his mark in the form of being a 'Daemon of' and has Chaos Armour regardless, but loses everything else.

Does giving a daemon prince daemon of ____ also give it the mark of whatever god as well?

Is their a daemon weapon for each god?

what does the tzeench daemon weapon do?

Can sorcerers take daemon weapons?

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

Vladsimpaler wrote:Honestly you're just better off with allied Imperial Guard most of the time. That being said you can get 30 Cultists with 3 Heavy Stubbers for 145 points so it's not terrible, but considering I can get 30 Guard with tons of weapons and orders and all of that for not that much more, Cultists don't seem that great.

Comparing Cultists to Guardsmen though is folly as they fulfil completely different roles. Remember that Guardsmen make the backbone of an IG army, and are expected to kill at least some stuff. The same is not true of Cultists who are nothing more than a supporting meatshield, hence them being only 2/3 the cost of a Guardsman.

 Rbb wrote:
What happens if someone rolls on the table and becomes a daemon prince? Does he retain any marks, daemon weapons, psychic powers, other gear he already had?

If a model becomes a DP, he retains his mark in the form of being a 'Daemon of' and has Chaos Armour regardless, but loses everything else.

Exactly, that's why I said they're basically much better conscripts. Conscripts are something that fill a very similar role to cultists (meatshields) except cultists have far better leaderships, better ballistic skill, and can even have their leader get various buffs and abilities (although it'd take a bit of luck) Even though the cultists have crappier armor and weapon options, they are far superior at their job of meatshields. If someone was making a traitor guard army, they would be both fluffy and effective as a way to soak up shots from your more important platoon and vet squads.

Only reason why I would take the conscripts though is that while they cost more, they can be endlessly respawned with send in the next wave, which is the ultimate upgrade for a unit who's job is literally to eat shots from incoming fire and respawn at the end of the game so it can hold a home objective.

Ozomoto wrote:
Does giving a daemon prince daemon of ____ also give it the mark of whatever god as well?

Is their a daemon weapon for each god?

what does the tzeench daemon weapon do?

Can sorcerers take daemon weapons?

No.
No.
There is no tzeench daemon weapon. There is a Tzeentch only chaos artifact, and a tzeentch/khorne fluffed flamer but has no restrictions gameplay wise,

Sorcerors can take all of the chaos artifacts. There are only two daemon weapons (as in have the daemon weapon rule) and one is MoK only.

Power fist sorcerers, yay! :p

Rather disappointed that there's only TWO daemon weapons in the entire book for non SC's, and that one is MoK only..

No love for allied daemons teleporting or being summoned? how disappointing. I guess I will have to shell out the points for a daemons icon.

Posted this in the cultist thread..

There is definitely some debate if you can take more than 10 plague zombies in a squad. No doubt it will be hashed out to death on YMDC forum. The argument centres around the fact that under typhus's rules it says plague zombies cannot take options. Clearly under the options section is the choice to add more cultists to a squad. So in a strict RAW sense, since you cannot take options, you cannot add more guys! Hopefully this will be faqed asap...

oh god , that makes them suck even more then the inability to take mark of nurgle ;/

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:
Rather disappointed that there's only TWO daemon weapons in the entire book for non SC's, and that one is MoK only..

Maybe Phil should've read some of the books I've written for inspiration.

Yes I'm not being (totally) serious. A lot of the daemon weapons came from existing Daemon weapons in previous Chaos Codices... even the 'Chaos' Codex.

Whats the run down on Kharn+berserkers, any good? Points cost up or down?

When rolling for the boon table do you declare what dice is the tens and what is the ones before or after rolling?

for a D66 roll you always declare first.

I don't like that random psyker guy AT ALL. Every turn, you roll for what category he can use and then roll for what spells he can use. Lots of unnecessary and prolonging rolling involved here.

Which is what makes the Fabius enhanced unit so fascinating. In an edition that is all about random rolling cinematic gameplay, Fabius is the least random cinematic thing in there.

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

Vladsimpaler wrote:Honestly you're just better off with allied Imperial Guard most of the time. That being said you can get 30 Cultists with 3 Heavy Stubbers for 145 points so it's not terrible, but considering I can get 30 Guard with tons of weapons and orders and all of that for not that much more, Cultists don't seem that great.

Comparing Cultists to Guardsmen though is folly as they fulfil completely different roles. Remember that Guardsmen make the backbone of an IG army, and are expected to kill at least some stuff. The same is not true of Cultists who are nothing more than a supporting meatshield, hence them being only 2/3 the cost of a Guardsman.

 Rbb wrote:
What happens if someone rolls on the table and becomes a daemon prince? Does he retain any marks, daemon weapons, psychic powers, other gear he already had?

If a model becomes a DP, he retains his mark in the form of being a 'Daemon of' and has Chaos Armour regardless, but loses everything else.

So what happens if the Lord didn't have a mark and he becomes a daemon prince?

Crazy, i know, but i'm a fluff nut, so my Iron warriors are likely going to be undivided, even though its seems more effective to dedicate yourself to one of the four.

The table implodes and you burst into flames. Also you lose.

Crazy, i know, but i'm a fluff nut, so my Iron warriors are likely going to be undivided, even though its seems more effective to dedicate yourself to one of the four.

Although it may seem like a bit of a cop-out, you could always do what I do, take a Mark but justify it from an Iron Warriors perspective. For example, I have a unit of Khorne Bezerkers, but they're not really bezerkers, they're a dedicated "breach unit", trained to charge into the breached defenses as soon as an opening appears. To do so, they need to be as good in CQC as possible, and can't be afraid to charge in whilst the ordnance is still flying through the air, hence the Fearless.

 Dr. Delorean wrote:

Crazy, i know, but i'm a fluff nut, so my Iron warriors are likely going to be undivided, even though its seems more effective to dedicate yourself to one of the four.

Although it may seem like a bit of a cop-out, you could always do what I do, take a Mark but justify it from an Iron Warriors perspective. For example, I have a unit of Khorne Bezerkers, but they're not really bezerkers, they're a dedicated "breach unit", trained to charge into the breached defenses as soon as an opening appears. To do so, they need to be as good in CQC as possible, and can't be afraid to charge in whilst the ordnance is still flying through the air, hence the Fearless.

Huh, that's a cool idea. I think i'll adopt it and avoid the aforementioned table combustion.

EDIT: although i'm still curious to know what happens when an undivided lord gets lucky.

Khârn's stats, wargear and special rules? Is he any good?

Any word on if Abaddon can make more then one squad of Chosen Troops?
What kind of options can you give Chosen? Do they suffer from the same issue as Terminators in taking an upgrade CCW and Ranged weapon?
Any dedicated Transport options for Chosen?

 Dr. Delorean wrote:

Crazy, i know, but i'm a fluff nut, so my Iron warriors are likely going to be undivided, even though its seems more effective to dedicate yourself to one of the four.

Although it may seem like a bit of a cop-out, you could always do what I do, take a Mark but justify it from an Iron Warriors perspective. For example, I have a unit of Khorne Bezerkers, but they're not really bezerkers, they're a dedicated "breach unit", trained to charge into the breached defenses as soon as an opening appears. To do so, they need to be as good in CQC as possible, and can't be afraid to charge in whilst the ordnance is still flying through the air, hence the Fearless.

I did the same thing. There are "kind of" Iron Warrior berzerkers in the book Storm of Iron so i dont mind fielding them. I used to give my DP MoN and justify it by the amount of augmentations he has (Dreadnought siege arm, warboss powerclaw and a Valk engine Jump-pack for "wings")

 Lord Harrab wrote:

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

Vladsimpaler wrote:Honestly you're just better off with allied Imperial Guard most of the time. That being said you can get 30 Cultists with 3 Heavy Stubbers for 145 points so it's not terrible, but considering I can get 30 Guard with tons of weapons and orders and all of that for not that much more, Cultists don't seem that great.

Comparing Cultists to Guardsmen though is folly as they fulfil completely different roles. Remember that Guardsmen make the backbone of an IG army, and are expected to kill at least some stuff. The same is not true of Cultists who are nothing more than a supporting meatshield, hence them being only 2/3 the cost of a Guardsman.

 Rbb wrote:
What happens if someone rolls on the table and becomes a daemon prince? Does he retain any marks, daemon weapons, psychic powers, other gear he already had?

If a model becomes a DP, he retains his mark in the form of being a 'Daemon of' and has Chaos Armour regardless, but loses everything else.

So what happens if the Lord didn't have a mark and he becomes a daemon prince?

Crazy, i know, but i'm a fluff nut, so my Iron warriors are likely going to be undivided, even though its seems more effective to dedicate yourself to one of the four.

I don't know what the problem is.

The rule reads.

IF the champion had a mark of chaos, the daemon prince is instead a daemon of the same chaos god.

Note the IF.

Do they clarify if the standard twin linked bolter, now a combi bolter I guess, on a rhino is pintle mounted or not?

I'm a bit miffed at the lack of cohesion between Icons and summoning Daemons, but at least they clarify that the icon is on an individual.

I'm honestly disappointed by these rules. They seem quite rushed, some things don't make sense.

It seems the mechitendrils was optional at one point from wordings, and dark apostle can take long war despite having LD10 and Hatred (Everything)

 Voodoo_Chile wrote:
Any word on if Abaddon can make more then one squad of Chosen Troops?
What kind of options can you give Chosen? Do they suffer from the same issue as Terminators in taking an upgrade CCW and Ranged weapon?
Any dedicated Transport options for Chosen?

Says "units of chosen" are troops - plural, so it's all of 'em

Yes, they have the same restriction - 4 of them may take either a plasma pistol, or a melee weapon or a ranged weapon. However one can also choose from an extended ranged weapon list outside of that selection, so I guess you can have 1 model per squad that has a ranged weapon and a melee weapon.

Rhino only.

 Voodoo_Chile wrote:
Any word on if Abaddon can make more then one squad of Chosen Troops?
What kind of options can you give Chosen? Do they suffer from the same issue as Terminators in taking an upgrade CCW and Ranged weapon?
Any dedicated Transport options for Chosen?

There's a little mention on chosen quite early in this thread. I think they said he makes all chosen troops, and 4 per squad can upgrade to crazy CCW or ranged, I'm not sure if they have the same OR problem as termies. And they'll have rhinos.

Thanks a lot for clarifying guys. Pretty cool Abaddon can make multiple Chosen Squads Troops, could be interesting. Though it is a shame it's melee or ranged for the 4 potential upgrades and no Land Raider.

Lord Harrab wrote:So what happens if the Lord didn't have a mark and he becomes a daemon prince?

He becomes a Daemon Prince with Power Armour, that's it.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
Khârn's stats, wargear and special rules? Is he any good?

Kharn is quite beastly now. He hates everything, meaning his 1's to hit can be re-rolled before they butcher his mates, he stills hits on 2's, strikes at S6 AP2 at initiative, and him and his unit get a 2+ DTW. Oh, and he is immune to being Force Weapon'ed.

Voodoo_Chile wrote:Any word on if Abaddon can make more then one squad of Chosen Troops?
What kind of options can you give Chosen? Do they suffer from the same issue as Terminators in taking an upgrade CCW and Ranged weapon?
Any dedicated Transport options for Chosen?

Yes he can, don't know why anyone would assume otherwise.

Same option as before, but with the option of upgrading their CCW if they don't take special weapons, just like the Terminators, but unlike the Terminators, it isn't a suffering because even though they are good in combat, their primary role will be Marine killing at range.

They can take a Rhino.

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

Voodoo_Chile wrote:Any word on if Abaddon can make more then one squad of Chosen Troops?
What kind of options can you give Chosen? Do they suffer from the same issue as Terminators in taking an upgrade CCW and Ranged weapon?
Any dedicated Transport options for Chosen?

Yes he can, don't know why anyone would assume otherwise.

They can take a Rhino.

Yeah my apologies, I was running under the assumption that it was like an upgrade from Abaddon to one Chosen squad rather than a change to the FOC.

Any word on if a Chaos Lord on a bike will allow you to take Chaos Bikers as troops?

He doesn't. The FOC altering options have been all named and known for awhile now, nothing new on that front.

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:
He doesn't. The FOC altering options have been all named and known for awhile now, nothing new on that front.

Damn ah well, thank you for the info. Hopefully I'll have my codex early next week and see how this yoke plays.

Can dreadnoughts/hellbrutes take havoc launchers again like they could in 2nd edition?

No, just a missile launcher like in 5th.

Wait, if you can't take a ranged and a cow upgrade for chosen, isn't the new $20 aspiring champ unusable ?

 Battle Brother Lucifer wrote:
Wait, if you can't take a ranged and a cow upgrade for chosen, isn't the new $20 aspiring champ unusable ?

No, you could play him as an Aspiring Champion.

 Battle Brother Lucifer wrote:
cow upgrade

There is no cow upgrade.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

Experiment 626 wrote:
And the Chaos Termie box just got that much crappier to boot!

Almost all my Combi-Melta guys have Chainfists. I have a lot of Combi-Flamer/Lightning Claw or Combi-Flamer/Power Fist guys. And I have a random assortment of heavies, combi-bolters and other weapons.

I foresee this being one of the first things in the FAQ, something along the lines of:

"Change the sentence in Chaos Terminators to say 'Each model may replace their ranged weapon and/or close combat weapon with one of the following..."

Here's hoping! Are you teasing me or do you really think it will be fixed? I'm like you I have 20 Terminators and only the Fist/Bolter guys are legal now...

anyone got the skinny on arhimin and the thousand sons? What lv psycher arhiman is, or how many witchfire can he shoot a trurn? what is the inv sv on thousand sons? what is the I on thousand sons? W on son? I read they still have ap3 bolters this is with soulfire to? at the same points cost? is arhimin the same points cost? can defilers take marks?

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
Khârn's stats, wargear and special rules? Is he any good?

He is pretty close to identical to before... I think he lost an attack (though makes up for it in the first round of combat via Rage/Counterattack.) Still has a Plasma Pistol and Gorechild. He is S5 base, S6 with Gorechild, S7 with Furious Charge,and Gorechild still messes up vehicles pretty bad (Armorbane, AP2.) Still hits on 2+, and hits a random friendly within 6" on a 1. No longer immune to psychic, just immune to Force Weapons and denies the witch on 2+. Still 3+/5++, no Eternal Warrior. His biggest buff, though, is that he auto-gets the Hatred Incarnate warlord trait, which gives him and his unit Hatred. Hatred lets you reroll missed attacks in the first round of combat - which means the round he charges, very low chance of him killing his own guys. Instead, he should wreck most everything he's up against, at I5.

So overall... lots of offense, not much defense, still a decent choice for the points (which are almost the same, and might even be a few points cheaper.)

No Marks for vehicles, Ahriman is Mastery 4, he makes 1k sons troops, Sons have inferno bolts and can take an icon to get soul blaze, looking again, his Warlord Trait gives d3 units infiltrate, he can fire 3 witchfire powers and generate powers from Tzeentch, as well as Biomancy, Pyromancy, and Telepathy. IIRC, Ahriman is cheaper than before, 1k Sons are the same cost, same invul, actually pretty much entirely the same, except the rule changes to Slow and Purposeful, as well as fearless, plus the new Psyker stuff, makes them great, rather than so iffy. 1k sons are I4 like all marines, and 1 wound.

rothrich wrote:
anyone got the skinny on arhimin and the thousand sons? What lv psycher arhiman is, or how many witchfire can he shoot a trurn? what is the inv sv on thousand sons? what is the I on thousand sons? W on son? I read they still have ap3 bolters this is with soulfire to? at the same points cost? is arhimin the same points cost? can defilers take marks?

Ahriman = Psyker Level 4, up to 3 Witchfires a turn.

Thousands Sons = 4++, I4, 1W, AP3 Bolters. Icon can gvie them Soulblaze. Around the same points, with the sorcerer I think getting a bit cheaper.

No marks for defilers.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 Battle Brother Lucifer wrote:
Wait, if you can't take a ranged and a cow upgrade for chosen, isn't the new $20 aspiring champ unusable ?

No, you could play him as an Aspiring Champion.

 Battle Brother Lucifer wrote:
cow upgrade

There is no cow upgrade.

my computer autocorrects everything

Unless they make a new chosen/marine box, his look is completely different and will look strange in a normal squad, but he cant go with the DV chosen because of his upgrades.