solkan wrote: Honestly, I think you might be better off getting three Industrial District 'boxes' for 105 instead of the Industrial Quandrant for 100.
Honestly, I was waiting for the scenery pledge as I like some of the stuff but if that is true that is pretty bad. I mean why would a pledge level ever be worse than just getting add-ons. They better sweeten the deal over time or Mantic has "dun goofed".
I wonder if Mantic isn't running into a problem of keeping the horse in front of the cart with the Deadzone stuff. I mean, I'm sure they like selling terrain for use in other games, but they'd prefer people to use it in theirs.
So they probably want to keep the part where you buy their game the better deal.
How are ruins sprues easier to make yourself? That plastic is tough, it must be taking you an awful long time to cut through the tiles in a regular battlezone
4 x Urban Sprue A
2 x Urban Sprue B
2 x Urban Sprue C
2 x Sci-Fi Accessory Sprue
1 x Connector Sprue
Not counting the connector, that's 10 sprues. So about $3.70 per sprue at RRP
The new Industrial sprue is $35 and has 8 sprues, not counting the connector. That's $4.38 per sprue at KS price.
The new Terrain pledge is $100 and has 24 sprues, not counting the connectors. That's $4.17 per sprue at KS pledge entry price.
Why are Kickstarter prices higher than RRP prices on existing stuff when we're putting our money in nearly a year early?
I must be missing something. Are the new sprues bigger?
If I'm investing money a year early, I don't really expect to be paying more than current RRP.
Either Mantic are trying to make a killing out of us all this time, or next January, we'll see their RRP start to hit GW price levels.
NTRabbit wrote: How are ruins sprues easier to make yourself? That plastic is tough, it must be taking you an awful long time to cut through the tiles in a regular battlezone
Dremels and similar power tools don't care how "tough" your plastic is. And manually carved ruins don't don't suffer quite as much from the "Count the number of identical piles of rocks on this table" problem. But perhaps I should have written "better" than "easier".
Either way, after getting some ruin sprues from the first Deadzone, I'd rather stick to paying for non-ruined sprues and making the ruined parts myself.
4 x Urban Sprue A
2 x Urban Sprue B
2 x Urban Sprue C
2 x Sci-Fi Accessory Sprue
1 x Connector Sprue
Not counting the connector, that's 10 sprues. So about $3.70 per sprue at RRP
The new Industrial sprue is $35 and has 8 sprues, not counting the connector. That's $4.38 per sprue at KS price.
The new Terrain pledge is $100 and has 24 sprues, not counting the connectors. That's $4.17 per sprue at KS pledge entry price.
Why are Kickstarter prices higher than RRP prices on existing stuff when we're putting our money in nearly a year early?
I must be missing something. Are the new sprues bigger?
If I'm investing money a year early, I don't really expect to be paying more than current RRP.
Either Mantic are trying to make a killing out of us all this time, or next January, we'll see their RRP start to hit GW price levels.
Thanks for the recap. It does look like the sprues though have more "wall" pieces as opposed to decorative bits so you can make a usable building out of each sprue.
They're making a bit of a mess of this 2 hours after the update and the total has gone up $3k.
The terrain is no better priced than current retail unless they're planning a price hike it's better to wait for a discounter. Well that saves me the money I put aside for terrain. Mercs might be getting more money from me and I didn't see that happening a week ago
It seems the new sprues have close to twice as much. Or am I looking at this wrong?
That's a good comparison. With the new sprues as pictured below in the spoiler
Spoiler:
you can make a 1x1x2 building with a front door, back wall, one full side wall, one half side wall, and roof making it usable in game (meaning that it is missing one panel on one side's worth of walls to put figures in) on each sprue. You'd need several to do that with the industrial sprues although you'd have a bunch more bits to customize it with on the same sprues.
Yeah, it looks like Mantic's tripping over their "Sprue Conversion" problem again due to the inevitable repackaging.
Unless they manage to get really clever, "Industrial Scenery Sprue" A looks like it's two sprues of stuff, at least; and Industrial Scenery Sprue B looks to be sprue-and-a-half or so.
I somehow missed that they were charging shipping after the fact as well. Perfectly acceptable given that's how everyone does it these days, but I'm leaning towards dropping down to a buck and just adding a Pathfinder and Jetbike. My previous thought was to go down to $35, but the rulebook doesn't excite me enough to think about paying $10-$15 to have it shipped.
I think not adding a mat to the Quarantine pledge was a mistake on Mantics part.
I just saw the shipping too. Its been there the whole time but no one has really been talking about it. I'm really leaning on just waiting to retail. I so wanted to like this, but I'm just not feeling it. Lord knows how much shipping will be. I'll stick it out for a few more days though.
Shipping for almost everyone is going to be via courier, because Royal Mail doesn't take packages anymore, or at least doesn't take packages this large, and they've used different couriers for different regions - ie last time the US and Canada get FedEX, down here in Australia we got UPS
Pledging for a dollar just costs a dollar. At this point I'm likely to wait for retail (and then only maybe buy something) but it won't stop me going in for $1 on the last day - simply so I can avoid 2 weeks of KS spam in my email - easier to follow the campaign here!
It seems the new sprues have close to twice as much. Or am I looking at this wrong?
Industrial sprue A has 4 full-size panels and two 1/4 size panels, plus detail parts (door and fan)
Industrial sprue B has only 2 full-size panels, 2 1/2 size panels, 2 railings and some small bitz.
GrimDork wrote: Isn't that just one of those un-posed just hanging out renders? She doesn't have her weapon either.
Yes, her arms are out in the "da Vinci pose" so It's a fair bet that's a WIP render.
Still not feeling this, though has there been talk of when the PM for this will close? If it'll be sometime in August maybe the $1 is worth it when the spending isn't as crowded.
Hey, I do like the Enforcer scouts, jetbike renders and new terrain. (if not the prices). Truth is it just seemed a perfect opportunity to drop Grumpy Cat in here.
Yes, it's just a T-pose render. I really really love the design, honestly. So fat and awful. And that will be a big old chunk of metal in the finished product, for better or worse.
Which raises the question - what does a Veermyn Faction Starter look like, in Deadzone? Is the brood mother like a Plague Stage 1 that many squads will take, or more like a special character only used in larger battles?
You don't share other peoples dreams of realizing a miniature based, space rat, What's Eating Gilbert Grape scenario?
Looks about as threatening as the rest of the space rats, which is to say, not at all. All the potential there and Mantic still continues to go with "basically Orks" as the design ethos.
Do we have pictures of the Pathfinders next to their other human infantry?
As Tempted as I am with this Kicstarter, I think I'll wait till retail to buy into it. I'm trying to put aside money for the Big Warpath KS I know is coming, even if its a year away.
Just fyi I did a quick check and at this point in its KSKoW second ed was at $172,394. Infestation is over $17k ahead of that and the day still isn't over.
BobtheInquisitor wrote: The mini I am waiting for is the Veermyn psychic with curling horns and an inflated sense of self-worth matched only by his paranoia.
Does it ride around with a giant reprogrammed Asterian drone, one in a series of experiments as they attempt to reverse engineer their designs?
The more I look at the accessory sprues, the less of a rip-off I think the current scenery pricing is. It's still not great. It's not as good of a deal as $25 DZ1.0 battlezones, and it's arguable that currently available 3rd party retail battlezones are a better deal... 8+2 accessory seems more like 9 to me, vs 6+2 seemingly larger accessory sprues which I'd call 7 on a bad day 8 if I'm generous.
Also consider the longass wait for rewards. Could be higher at retail but probably worth chancing that possibility for most. I may get a bit more, but probably not a heavy investment.
What I probably would throw money at them for is individually available accessory sprues. I think the only thing you really need from the industrial BZ to use the accessories fully is some of the quarter tiles and you could just spread the ones from quarantine around to accommodate a much larger pipe network. $10 for both accessory sprues would see me buy several, even if I can make my own pipes cheaper, the generator/motor pieces are sweet, and all of the accessory pipes are designed to fit with the scenery. The little conveyor belt pieces are kind of awesome too.
I guess time will tell, if anything will help keep my pledge at or above my initial guess of $200, it'll be separately available sprues.
Oh, did I hear right that they were thinking about/planning on including an extra connector sprue per scenery bundle? That slightly ups the value too, and at least makes the new terrain more usable out of the box
Finally, having read the fluff bits, I really really hope that they got whoever was writing it to do a *lot* more, both from Exham, and around the sphere.. and then crampack the rulebook with it.
BobtheInquisitor wrote: The mini I am waiting for is the Veermyn psychic with curling horns and an inflated sense of self-worth matched only by his paranoia.
Does it ride around with a giant reprogrammed Asterian drone, one in a series of experiments as they attempt to reverse engineer their designs?
Yes. If only his underlings hadn't sabotaged his gruesome golem with their inept tinkering, he might have become the most prestigious of potentates by now. As any void-addled parasite can see, he is the most deservingly distinguished of despots, a truly regal rodent.
If they wanted to make the Broodmother less terrible, she should have been on an armoured palanquin. The current concept suffers from two pretty blatant flaws: there's clearly no way for her to put either foot under her centre of gravity to allow her to walk, and "pregnant" is not a single size to which you can fit a solid shell. Try to do that, and the armour is going to be either too big or too small most of the time.
solkan wrote: Honestly, I think you might be better off getting three Industrial District 'boxes' for 105 instead of the Industrial Quandrant for 100.
Honestly, I was waiting for the scenery pledge as I like some of the stuff but if that is true that is pretty bad. I mean why would a pledge level ever be worse than just getting add-ons. They better sweeten the deal over time or Mantic has "dun goofed".
I guess I will wait till retail??
I wouldn't take that advice. The ruin sprues look better then what you can produce yourself. I not sure what that guy is talking about. Better to get the more diverse compilation.
Automatically Appended Next Post: It should also be noted there is more to a sprue on the new stuff then the old stuff. With those "one block" squares, I think think they utilized more space. Your getting more terrain then what any of the old "sprues" yielded.
Yeah, I'm more than happy to just pick up the odds and ends at a discount retailer and get free shipping. The pricing AND shipping on this is a collective joke. Frankly though, with the art direction, there's not that much I want.
Does anyone know what happened to the angled battlezone terrain sprue? I've been looking into Mantic terrain recently and found the video below that details the "urban sprue D".
After looking at the various mantic terrain bundles (specifically the adepticon ones but also the sectors and districts), I can't find the sprue being used or included in any of those.
Has anyone gotten this sprue in a normal bundle or kit (as opposed to being handed one at a special event like the youtuber)? I also looked at the new KS sprues and didn't see the pieces there either.
So, it's kind of vague and doesn't state anything clearly, but:
Creator Mantic Games 25 minutes ago
@ Joey and Narzoth - sorry, the retailer deals are on the existing stuff, we're already working behind the scenes with them, what I meant was that we will be offering some of the existing stuff, but we're also offering it to them as a good deals as well so that they don't miss out, if that makes more sense.
seems to say that add-on deals for existing product are forthcoming, and they just want to also offer similar deals to retailers so as not to step on toes.
So, it's kind of vague and doesn't state anything clearly, but:
Creator Mantic Games 25 minutes ago
@ Joey and Narzoth - sorry, the retailer deals are on the existing stuff, we're already working behind the scenes with them, what I meant was that we will be offering some of the existing stuff, but we're also offering it to them as a good deals as well so that they don't miss out, if that makes more sense.
seems to say that add-on deals for existing product are forthcoming, and they just want to also offer similar deals to retailers so as not to step on toes.
Sounds like coordination which should have been done before this project kicked off.
6-12 worked her way closer to the spaceport, and at a convergence of four tunnels hollowed out into a vast cavern she found reason enough to order an immediate Containment Protocol; more Veer-myn than she had encountered in any operation, a seething mass of thousands. Enough so the tunnel’s floor and lower walls were lost beneath their writhing bodies.
The situation had become clear; Exham with its ultra-high population had bred a Veer-myn colony of prodigious size. A colony which could perhaps have gone unnoticed forever in the swathes of empty cities, until the unforeseen onset of an ice age. It was then a choice of freeze or escape, and the Veer-myn had recognised the potential of Priory Station and acted upon it. Viral outbreaks had long been documented as tools of the Veer-myn, and the bleeding sickness could only have been a first strike on the Mi-Gan troopers already struggling with a dying population in open revolt.
The chance of such a potently virulent disease reaching Prior Station and spreading through the core worlds was alone enough for 6-12 to order an immediate Containment Protocol, but the sheer size of the Veer-myn brood was a danger in itself. If the brood splintered, confirming the elimination of all Veer-myn on Exham may be impossible. To increase the chance of mission success she would have to tag the Brood Mother; the dominant female around which broods were centred. 6-12 knew that would mean she would never leave those tunnels.
Loading her rifle with tracer darts, she tagged the Brood Mother. The effect was instantaneous; the entire colony was roused at their Mother’s keening wail and, drawing on the brood’s group perception, focused on 6-12. In her last act she released a drone cloud to record the discovery and return to the vigilance control system.
She ran out of ammunition before she ran out of targets.
What's next?
As we reach the halfway point, what we’re going to tackle is fleshing out the Veer-myn faction with more choice and variety. With that in mind, we’re going to drop a quick little stretch in between now and the Jetbike.
Enter the Progenitor:
NEW! Stretch Goal $195,000 – Veer-myn Progenitor
Because of the lack of solid data there have been many far-reaching and eccentric theories surrounding the Veer-myn, their habits, abilities and social structure. Some of these theories have been supplanted as slowly more is learned of these creatures. One such theory which survived until only recently was that there was only a single male in the brood which bred with the Brood Mother.*
The reason why the hypothesis remained for so long was due to combat encounters. In almost all cases the Veer-myn were led by a single male, apparently of the Malignus caste but with obvious authority across the brood. It was, and is still, believed that there is no discernible rank below Brood Mother, and the conclusion that this male would hold a unique place among the nest and therefore on the battlefield was accepted as logical.
Even though this theory has been dismissed no other has been proposed as to how these males attain their authority, and the reasoning is marked down as another mystery surrounding the Veer-myn.
*The theory was replaced after evidence of exponential growth in some broods was proved to be impossible with a single breeding male. It is currently thought that an unto-now undiscovered caste of males are instead used as breeders, milked of their reproductive DNA until they die and are replaced by their own male offspring.
Description: The Progenitor looks like a regular Malignus, armed with the most valuable, and usually experimental, weaponry available as befits its station. This weaponry tends to come in two load outs; a Spitter Rifle, or a Chem-Pistol and Hand Drill.
The Spitter Rifle fires a nitrogen based liquid, literally ‘spitting’ out a small glob at tremendous pressure. The result is a highly accurate cryogenic fluid bullet which can eat through armour. Additionally there is potential splash-damage to any other models in the same cube from the impacting slug.
The Veer-myn Progenitor is a sub-leader character for the Veer-myn faction, and comes with an additional head and weapon so that you can build him in a variety of ways.
When we hit this stretch goal, we’ll be able to sculpt and produce him in metal, and make him available to add-on for $8.
Of course, the other thing we’re going to do with this Kickstarter is give you even greater value for your money…
$200,000 is a landmark goal, a milestone, so we’re going to double up on the rewards on offer when we get there.
When we hit this next goal, we won’t just give you one Jetbike in Quarantine, we’ll give you two.
We’ll also double up on the Jetbike Add-on. Two of these awesome bikes for a tenner? You betcha.
And then… Veer-myn Shredders?
Those who dismiss the Veer-myn as barely intelligent pests have obviously never encountered a Shredder. Huge, ravenous humanoids, these things show obvious signs of being made. Even Dr Chanson, the notable Veer-myn denier, was forced to recant when his arch-rival Investigator Gillian Li presented him with a corpse of a Shredder slain on Final Rest, although when he had recovered his wits he dismissed it as a hoax.
As tall as two men and far more bulky, Shredders have ratlike heads and enormous muscles. They are often found to have been bionically altered, the most common variant having two super-drills built into their arms. Shredders are insanely violent and barely sentient, that they exist solely for war is beyond doubt, and are a frightening indication of the Veer-myn’s ingenuity and intentions.
And finally…
Tomorrow marks the the one week point of a Kickstarter which over 1850 people have backed and supported. We have to do something special for that tomorrow, right?
timetowaste85 wrote: Yay, tons of bikes now!! Not getting 5, now I'm getting like 16!!! Wheeeeeeee!!!!!!!!*
*epic squirrel on skateboard emoticon that Dakka doesnt have yet*
Hope you have plenty of enforcer bits to customize. Wait... Who am I kidding? Of course you do.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also, let me know if anyone wants changes in formatting/style/content for the OP.
I also have like 20 Enforcers still on sprue, not sure what to do with yet! I can do a full (I might miss stuff) list of what I have. Bored at work, so it's a good time to list my Enforcer army:
Two 10-man units of Enforcers with rifles and burst lasers/assault blade
Two 10-man units of Enforcers with rifles and missile launcher/energy gauntlet
Three 5-man units of Assault Enforcers with fusion gun
Two 5-man units of Assault Enforcers
Two 5-man units of Suppression Enforcers with assault blade/burst lasers x4
Two 5-man units of Suppression Enforcers with energy gauntlet/missile launchers x4
Two 5-man units of Defenders
One 5-man Suppression unit with Inferno Cannons/energy gauntlet
Two 5-man units of Enforcers with inferno gun/energy gauntlet
One 5-man defender peacekeeper unit
One 5-man peacekeeper with burst laser
One 5-man peacekeeper with inferno cannon
5 Snipers
4 Medics
4 Engineers
2 Peacekeeper sergeants/captains
2 Enforcer sergeants with energy gauntlets
That sounds about right. So...what should I do with the other 20 regulars and 10 peacekeepers? Without giving them away.
I hate to say that I'm kind of sad to see the passing of PVC from Mantic campaigns.
I have a feeling a few of those rats might have made it both cheaper and into the base pledge if they'd been PVC.
Of course I could be totally wrong in that regard. It just seems like they'd include things like commanders and such with the basic strike team. All the original groups had them!
We'll see if Mantic can tempt more money out of me. Not super interested in Enforcer stuff. More rats on the other hand...
Who needs a microphone as long as you're faster than security?
Automatically Appended Next Post: It should be noted that I expect these bikes to be perfect fodder for Battlefleet Mantic purposes. Am I the only one?
highlord tamburlaine wrote: I hate to say that I'm kind of sad to see the passing of PVC from Mantic campaigns.
Indeed. Even as a non-backer/wait-for-retail-guy, I think the DZ1 KS (and presumbaly the starter when retail happens) offered much better value and variety than this one, in no small part due to Restic (which I actually don't mind; it's no worse than plastic in my eyes). Take the Enforcers this time and last time:
DZ2: 10 Pathfinders, presumably with a couple of Special options, and 2 DOG drones, all in HIPS. Now while this may cost less, I don't think Mantic's plastic is any better than Restic on a good day, and there is ultimately less variety here. While you might have just as many options, it's the same 5 legs/bodies/heads duplicated, whereas part of what's great about the Specialists in DZ1 in general had unique sculpts that fitted their style so well. Take the Sniper, for example (arguably the best Enforcer mini to date), something as unique is not doable with unconverted plastic, really.
HIPS is fine for mass battle games, and will be great for Warpath, but in a game like DZ, half a dozen unique sculpts in restic beats duplicates of the same 5 options in HIPS.
The real weakness in this KS is that, aside from the updated rules, it's arguably worse as an intro than the current starter set, which offers better/more varied sculpts, a proper mat, possibllly more terrain, and ultimately, isn't that expensive compared to similar products (say, DV and Infinity Icestorm). I know which I'd pick at any rate.
Skirting the eternal what material do you prefer debate, I still would prefer seeing these commander types included.
Come to think of it, do the Pathfinders have any sort of command unit?
I also want to see what this new entry level box looks like! What kind of rulebook will be included? Why isn't it included in the campaign so far? Heck, we got 2 books in Kings of War... C'mon Mantic!
I think I saw somewhere that there are bits for sergeant types on both the Pathfinder and Veer-Myn sprues. Though that might be me misremembering something.
Are there sergeant parts on the Enforcer and/or Peacekeeper sprues?
I think I saw somewhere that there are bits for sergeant types on both the Pathfinder and Veer-Myn sprues. Though that might be me misremembering something.
Are there sergeant parts on the Enforcer and/or Peacekeeper sprues?
The only thing marking a sergeant on the Enforcer sprue is his energy gauntlet, as far as Deadzone rules go, and there's an energy gauntlet on the enforcer sprue, so yeah...
Yes, they've got the pistol+ energy fist/combat blade option. I suspect both veermyn and pathfinders have Sgts built in, but it does leave us with no high command value leaders included in the pledge, most likely.
Dunno if I just want 4 more bikes... 8 more bikes, or 18 more bikes
CptJake wrote: As a 'starter set', what rule book will the retail version come with? Surely not the hard cover.
Hopefully, they won't clear out their back stock of the original DZ rulebook with the new starter.
Mine has pages on pages of cut and paste (I used post-its with enough adhesive to go directly over parts that had changed) all through it.
It feels like paying to beta test some times.
pretre wrote: I imagine we'll get a Pathfinder Sgt at some point.
For the low low price of $25.000 we will add a sergeant head to the Pathfinder sprue!
Which they'll try to sell at $3 each as an add to see if folks will bite but after being called out on the ridiculousness of it will change it to 50 cents a pop!
pretre wrote: I imagine we'll get a Pathfinder Sgt at some point.
For the low low price of $25.000 we will add a sergeant head to the Pathfinder sprue!
Which they'll try to sell at $3 each as an add to see if folks will bite but after being called out on the ridiculousness of it will change it to 50 cents a pop!
Well, the scout sprue is still $10 for 5 models...
My only thought is if they're concerned with making this easy and more accessible, metal doesn't seem the best choice of materials for trying to tap into the boardgame/ tabletop curious crowd. But I am not Mantic, so what do I know?
Why not make a sprue with some of these new veermyn leaders all on there? I really hope the slashers will be plastic at least.
Just not a big fan of larger/ heavier metal models. Never have been.
It also doesn't have to come pre-assembled, as per the DBX keepers. I would certainly see a lot of sense in supplying a starter box with a mix of HIPS troopers and boardgame plastic specialists (I see no functional difference between it and PVC, except possibly shallower very fine detail and much less mouldlines). But I assume the funding required would just be much higher.
Tyr13 wrote: Large metals for DZ also have another problem: Tipping terrain. Two walls and a roof wont carry that broodmother, pretty sure of that...
Yep. More chance that the model will tumble, and more chance that the fall will damage the paint job or the model itself.
I'm very much hoping that they'll treat the Veer-myn beast like the Enforcer jetbike and do it in hard plastic. Or, if it's just a tunneler / ground scuttler, maybe falling from towers won't be a concern. Maybe the Brood Mother is so overweight she can't climb buildings either? She certainly doesn't look up to much except pushing a grocery cart.
I've had mixed experiences with Mantic metals, some beautiful, some miscast. I expect with these newer metal models, bought through a Kickstarter campaign, that requesting replacement for miscast parts would be pretty simple, though (rather than bought from a retailer, for example.) I had to ask for a second Sorak Swordspawn head due to a miscast horn and Mantic came through.
A sprue of a few different characters would be really awesome, tho it doesn't seem like mantic is interested in doing that.
I really really don't like metal, especially for a game like this with multiple levels, etc. As someone mentioned a metal model falling from a building could cause some damage.
My preference is probably boardgame plastic from dbx->resin->restic-------->metal. So I probably won't be picking up any characters this campaign unless we see some new materials. I did up my pledge for 2 more jetbikes though, deciding if I should add more, wonder what size the warpath unit will be?
I think I just got numb to it, to be honest. Call is shell shock from Deadzone, Relic Knights and Wrath of Kings... Restic and metal are both complete crap to work with, but Restic is at least much better for transport and play.
I agree, for larger ogre-like models, restic is a solid material choice. For regular infantry sized minis, it's a toss up... but for big chunky models... restic is probably superior, for me. I dread all of othe damage and breaks an Infinity TAG would take... whereas I would probably be comfortable chucking my stage 1 or plague terraton across the room to someone.
I'm with Vermonter, really hope the beast is on a plastic sprue, don't screw the pooch on this one Mantic!
Mantic's Deadzone Restic is absolute crap that is a nightmare to clean up and is quite incapable of holding the necessary details for small and human sized figures - transport and play considerations be damned!
All kidding aside, metal is far preferable to Restic for me.
But that might just be because I started out in the transition from Rogue Trader to 2nd!
Having just taken delivery of £90 worth of yet more Infinity models, I can say I'm quite happy to work with metal models. And yes, I do some conversion work on them.
angryboy2k wrote: Can't believe the number of people here who prefer PVC over metal. This is why we can't have nice things.
Exalted!
People are either having short term memory problems, ridiculous nostalgia good times or a really severe acid flashback there!
PVC is substandard material for miniatures. Actual resin such as FW uses is superior to metal, provided you're casting small objects and you have good quality control in place. HISP is superior to both, excepting the category of "collector's models" in which case you need to go for maximum detail which resin excels in.
The biggest problem with PVC is the irregular shrinkage involved. This is part of why PP's models are generally a huge pain in the ass to assemble.
I'm fine with ranks of 15mm, 10mm or 6mm infantry made in metal, it's even preferable for the smallest scale, but in 28mm scale I just find metal too difficult to clean, a real pain in the ass to assemble (because I hate, hate, hate having to pin anything) too awkward and heavy to use on the table, and for some reason quite difficult to paint properly.
Sure I prefer HIPS, but if the choice is between metal and PVC for a mini large enough to need a 40mm base I'm going to prefer PVC every single time.
It's difficult to argue against folks whose primary concern is that their models aren't too heavy to carry to a game. That to me says that their concerns are completely different to mine.
I don't play miniature games because the models are light, quick to assemble with superglue, and don't smash to bits when dropped (I try not to drop the damn things!); I play miniature games because I appreciate the spectacle of miniature works of art duking it out on a table that's hopefully equally beautiful.
Metal miniatures are certainly a risk on raised terrain. Metal models are definitely more difficult to put together (pinning is necessary on many more models than you'd think). Metal models are undoubtedly more difficult to convert - but unless you're an experienced modeler in the first place you'll probably be butchering the thing anyway; either way (experienced or not) the material doesn't really matter.
However, metal models have two enormous advantages over PVC: 1. They can be cleaned up with files and sandpaper without unnecessary loss of detail. PVC needs cleaning with a knife, where you're basically cutting away sections of model. I can't do it, and I've been painting and playing with toy soldiers for 27 years. 2. They hold detail because the shrinkage of the metal is a known, quantifiable factor that is usually accounted for when creating the model. PVC models can shrink a lot and often have soft detail - PP's Convergence of Cyriss starter had me so frustrated with the detail and the moldlines that I wanted to throw the models across the room.
I will not buy PVC models again (I made an exception for Blood Rage as I'm treating it as pure boardgame). My remaining lifespan is too short to be wasted cleaning them and resculpting detail that should have been on the things in the first place. I feel like the people who think PVC is okay would probably also be satisfied with green army men plastic, and the ability for them to be satisfied with what I consider a completely substandard material, and this material's concomitant acceptance in the industry, is slowly destroying the hobby for me - much as Finecast and the public's apparent acceptance of this awful material was the final nail in my GW coffin.
lord_blackfang wrote: I think I just got numb to it, to be honest. Call is shell shock from Deadzone, Relic Knights and Wrath of Kings... Restic and metal are both complete crap to work with, but Restic is at least much better for transport and play.
Disagree; metal single piece models (Warlord, Foundry, Perry, etc) are the easiest models to work with. 10 seconds of cleaning, glue to base. Fit in precut foam trays.
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Breotan wrote: Actual resin such as FW uses is superior to metal,
FW uses resin? I thought it was some sort of bendy, brittle natural byproduct of some insect larvae.
highlord tamburlaine wrote: We don't know what will be in the box. Is there even a box? I haven't seen one yet?
I haven't been under the impression that this is a boxed release, at least in the way the original one was. I thought infestation was simply the name for the KS and that these figures would be coming in their own boxes come retail. Am I wrong here?
highlord tamburlaine wrote: We don't know what will be in the box. Is there even a box? I haven't seen one yet?
I haven't been under the impression that this is a boxed release, at least in the way the original one was. I thought infestation was simply the name for the KS and that these figures would be coming in their own boxes come retail. Am I wrong here?
It's been suggested, but not confirmed, that Infestation is going to form a follow up 2 player starter with a much cheaper price point by way of omitting some of the more expensive extras like the mouse mat, because people felt Containment Protocols was too expensive to entice new players to make an impulse purchase.
highlord tamburlaine wrote: We don't know what will be in the box. Is there even a box? I haven't seen one yet?
I haven't been under the impression that this is a boxed release, at least in the way the original one was. I thought infestation was simply the name for the KS and that these figures would be coming in their own boxes come retail. Am I wrong here?
It's been suggested, but not confirmed, that Infestation is going to form a follow up 2 player starter with a much cheaper price point by way of omitting some of the more expensive extras like the mouse mat, because people felt Containment Protocols was too expensive to entice new players to make an impulse purchase.
One of my FLGS has been eyeing carrying Deadzone but has also been put off by the starter set price point. They are eyeballing this Kickstarter with the January date as a new thing to carry in the new year.
Overnight we laid waste to the Progenitor stretch goal, adding to the choice available to Veer-myn Commanders. This miniature is now available to add-on for $8.
Over the course of the next few stretch goals we will be funding additional units choices for the Veer-myn, fleshing it out so there is lots on offer.
Today marks one week since the campaign started, so let’s celebrate that with a shiny new stretch goal shall we?
Those who dismiss the Veer-myn as barely intelligent pests have obviously never encountered a Shredder. Huge, ravenous humanoids, these things show obvious signs of being made. Even Dr Chanson, the notable Veer-myn denier, was forced to recant when his arch-rival Investigator Gillian Li presented him with a corpse of a Shredder slain on Final Rest, although when he had recovered his wits he dismissed it as a hoax. As tall as two men and far more bulky, Shredders have ratlike heads and enormous muscles. They are often found to have been bionically altered, the most common variant having two super-drills built into their arms. Shredders are insanely violent and barely sentient, that they exist solely for war is beyond doubt, and are a frightening indication of the Veer-myn’s ingenuity and intentions. Shredders are genetically manipulated Veer-myn and brutish warriors. They are large infantry miniatures, mounted on 40mm bases.
If we hit this stretch goal, we’ll be able to fund and produce the new Veer-myn Shredder in plastic and include one free in Quarantine!
And that’s not all…
Lots of you have asked for more in your pledge levels, and we want to give you more. So, having moved a few things around, when we hit this stretch goal, we will unlock Deadzone: Infestation spec Faction Boosters, and you will be able to pick one FREE in a pledge of Quarantine!
A Faction Booster is a great value bundle of miniatures designed to offer you more specialists, more choice and more variety for your faction, whether you want more figures for your Veer-myn or Enforcers:
Take the new Enforcer Faction Booster for example - this bundle includes five Elite Enforcers in Peacekeeper Armour. This hard plastic kit can be built in a number of different ways, and includes Combat Shields, Incinerator and Burst Laser. There’s also a Strider – a fearsome walker that has the added bonus of being able to be built in Corporation, Rebs or Plague load-outs.
And then, the Veer-myn, where the new Faction Booster will include a Shredder, Veer-myn Progenitor and the Nightmare pack, from our existing range.
Nightmares
Specialist tunnel fighting infantry, the creatures designated as 'Nightmares' are amongst the largest and most fearsome Veer-myn creatures encountered. Whether a separate breed of creature or a more mature version of the typical 'Packers' is not clear, but they are phenomenally strong and incredibly skilled fighters. Dressed in scavenged environment and space suits adapted into effective heavy armour, they carry a combat drill in one hand, lethal melee weapons that literally bore into their enemies’ armour, flesh and bones, resulting in a spectacular fountain of blood. An under-slung chem-thrower muzzle is strapped to the other arm, thick pipes leading to canisters on their backs. These chem-throwers can turn any enclosed space into a blazing inferno; any who survive are easily torn apart by the Nightmares’ charge. For these reasons, Nightmares are amongst the most feared heavy infantry in the galaxy. There’s a Nightmare sergeant, Nightmare with Chem-Thrower and standard elite troopers as well, offering some extra choice and variety to the force you can field in Deadzone.
By hitting this stretch goal, you can include either of these Faction Boosters for free in your Quarantine pledge, considerably boosting the value and the miniatures included.
The boosters are also available to add-on to your pledge!
Activate Containment Protocol!
As part of our focus on Deadzone at the moment, we have a range of deals for our retailers and distributors so that they can benefit from the added interest the Kickstarter has given us.
This means we’ve been able to dip into our existing Deadzone range and make some of it available for you to add-on (and likewise, they’re able to get the same deals for their customers no problem!)
Containment Protocol
The Original Deadzone Starter Set plus the expansion, this set will come in the pledge manager with the option of early shipping, so you can get playing and painting whilst you wait for your Infestation pledge to arrive! Deadzone Faction Starters All of the existing miniatures are compatible with the new rulebook, and now you can get your collection started, or expand the troops and specialists you have in your force, with these original Deadzone faction starters.
Each one a deal in it’s own right, you can also get all 6 for $100, saving you $25 off pledging for them separately. And finally... coming soon?!
Hmm, this really is starting to look like a decent deal now. Looks like a case of Mantic learning their lesson with regard to value - this feels like damage control. Regardless, pretty effective damage control as far as this backer is concerned
I don't think the peacekeepers in that bundle have arms compatible with the jetbikes - you'd need the regular enforcers for that. I don't see those coming for free anywhere - am I missing something?
True. Still, as long as they (even just mostly) stick to it wrt new stuff and main pledge levels etc it doesn't seem like a bad idea to give people the choice, at least.
I was gonna change my pledge to the terrain one, but decided to hold off. I might keep the game pledge after all, adding in the extra booster seems like a much better deal. I'll prolly go with the Enforcers, always wanted to get one of those Mechs so now I can
Alpharius wrote: There goes that whole 'resin plastic free zone' thing!
the Nightmares? I've got about 100+ of the old pvc veermyn (because I'm crazy and I love them) and they are part of Mantic's initial foray into pvc... so like those KoW Orc Gore Riders, they are very cleanly cast and nearly free of mold lines.
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Bolognesus wrote: I don't think the peacekeepers in that bundle have arms compatible with the jetbikes - you'd need the regular enforcers for that. I don't see those coming for free anywhere - am I missing something?
" So, having moved a few things around, when we hit this stretch goal, we will unlock Deadzone: Infestation spec Faction Boosters, and you will be able to pick one FREE in a pledge of Quarantine!"
I've always wondered, and I'm not trying to be an ass here... But why are most of Mantic's sculpts sub-par compared to most other manufacturers out there? Honestly, I rarely see another manufacturer with such consistently mediocre sculpts. I like the Enforcers the most, but overall there's so much awkward posing, weird anatomy etc. Is there any particular reason for this? Sure, they're cheap as hell, but does that mean they also hire mediocre sculptors? Do they not give them enough time? Is it the art direction? I can't figure it out. They have some great sculpts, and when I see those I feel like most of their stuff is such a wasted opportunity. Even if they cured the whole Manticverse of Tiny Legs Syndrome, that still wouldn't help. Posing and anatomy. The worst part is that their rules are so good!
Mymearan wrote: I've always wondered, and I'm not trying to be an ass here... But why are most of Mantic's sculpts sub-par compared to most other manufacturers out there? Honestly, I rarely see another manufacturer with such consistently mediocre sculpts. I like the Enforcers the most, but overall there's so much awkward posing, weird anatomy etc. Is there any particular reason for this? Sure, they're cheap as hell, but does that mean they also hire mediocre sculptors? Do they not give them enough time? Is it the art direction? I can't figure it out. They have some great sculpts, and when I see those I feel like most of their stuff is such a wasted opportunity. Even if they cured the whole Manticverse of Tiny Legs Syndrome, that still wouldn't help. Posing and anatomy.
Which sculpts? We've got Mike McVey, Bob Naismith, Remy Tremblay responsible for the lion's share of traditionally sculpted Mantic stuff. Ben Calvert-Lee is an in-house digital sculptor (Master Crafted Miniatures).
Well hell, the bonus faction booster starts to make this look a lot more attractive.
I was just thinking. We had up to 5 factions available for most of us (if you didn't double up on certain factions) the first time around. Plus 2 battlezones worth of terrain, the mouse pad mat... it really was a good deal, wasn't it? Maybe that's why I had such trepidation when this started.
Which sculpts? We've got Mike McVey, Bob Naismith, Remy Tremblay responsible for the lion's share of traditionally sculpted Mantic stuff. Ben Calvert-Lee is an in-house digital sculptor (Master Crafted Miniatures).
It doesn't matter how good the sculptors are if the concept art that they're trying to create from is stuck in a late 1990's cartoony style and you don't like that style. FWIW, the sculptors are doing a good job of making that art style into minis but I find the mantic sculpts pretty muchy equivalent (except for some of the enforcers) to late 1990's models in terms of style, proportions, and quality (at best given the history of restic). They don't look like minis designed in the last few years overall with the not orks, rebs, not skaven, and not squats but more akin to the original warzone minis, vor the maelstrom, urban war, and late 2nd edition 40k stuff.
Which sculpts? We've got Mike McVey, Bob Naismith, Remy Tremblay responsible for the lion's share of traditionally sculpted Mantic stuff. Ben Calvert-Lee is an in-house digital sculptor (Master Crafted Miniatures).
It doesn't matter how good the sculptors are if the concept art that they're trying to create from is stuck in a late 1990's cartoony style and you don't like that style. FWIW, the sculptors are doing a good job of making that art style into minis but I find the mantic sculpts pretty muchy equivalent (except for some of the enforcers) to late 1990's models in terms of style, proportions, and quality (at best given the history of restic). They don't look like minis designed in the last few years overall with the not orks, rebs, not skaven, and not squats but more akin to the original warzone minis, vor the maelstrom, urban war, and late 2nd edition 40k stuff.
Well, courting disgruntled GW vets is often cited as a main part of Mantic's niche (e.g., DB=Not BB; DZ=Not Necromunda; KoW=Not WFB; FFs=Not Squats; etc.).
Many of those vets liked the aesthetic just not GW's approach. That might be a possible explanation?
I'm wondering if the Strider and Nightmares are actually on their "would like to do in HP" list they just didn't want to wait. The Strider in particular seemed like a good candidate in my mind that I thought they might do.
Some might think "restic free" was violated, but they are from the existing range. If they can use them to spice it up and get to the HP kits later, I'm all for it. But like I predicted, there are those who "flipped their shiz" even though we didn't fund any new restic/PVC.
Earth Dragon wrote: As long as it's not chibi or whatever it is. People obsessed with that stuff are just as odd as the style.
Criticize the minis, not the folks who like them.
Difference between like and obsessed.......big difference. I'll critisize a couple of people I've met all I want (considering one was convicted of some disgusting crap)
timetowaste85 wrote: I think the promise was all models being created will be rest if free. Old models brought in are definitely not going against that.
Are the Veermyn Nightmares new? (I have no clue what rat men Mantic made before this KS, this may very well be an existing unit but they were not in the previous KS.)
Mymearan wrote: I've always wondered, and I'm not trying to be an ass here... But why are most of Mantic's sculpts sub-par compared to most other manufacturers out there? Honestly, I rarely see another manufacturer with such consistently mediocre sculpts. I like the Enforcers the most, but overall there's so much awkward posing, weird anatomy etc. Is there any particular reason for this? Sure, they're cheap as hell, but does that mean they also hire mediocre sculptors? Do they not give them enough time? Is it the art direction? I can't figure it out. They have some great sculpts, and when I see those I feel like most of their stuff is such a wasted opportunity. Even if they cured the whole Manticverse of Tiny Legs Syndrome, that still wouldn't help. Posing and anatomy.
Which sculpts? We've got Mike McVey, Bob Naismith, Remy Tremblay responsible for the lion's share of traditionally sculpted Mantic stuff. Ben Calvert-Lee is an in-house digital sculptor (Master Crafted Miniatures).
Really? Those are some amazing sculptors indeed (haven't heard of Calvert-Lee though). It has to be the art direction then, I just can't stand it. The weird thing is, I LOVE oldhammer and old GW stuff. Absolutely love it. So full of character and charm. I can't find any of that in Mantic's stuff though. As for examples, some of my least favorites are all the Plague miniatures with their goofy faces and awkward anatomy, (except the Stage 1), the Marauders with their tiny legs and faces on their stomachs, and the Forge Fathers with 80s biker vests and armored guys that are all posed like they're about to hug someone. I really like the Enforcers, the Rebs have some neat sculpts and the Asterians are ok I guess, although suffer A LOT from being compared to Jes Goodwin's brilliant Eldar aesthethic.
Which sculpts? We've got Mike McVey, Bob Naismith, Remy Tremblay responsible for the lion's share of traditionally sculpted Mantic stuff. Ben Calvert-Lee is an in-house digital sculptor (Master Crafted Miniatures).
It doesn't matter how good the sculptors are if the concept art that they're trying to create from is stuck in a late 1990's cartoony style and you don't like that style. FWIW, the sculptors are doing a good job of making that art style into minis but I find the mantic sculpts pretty muchy equivalent (except for some of the enforcers) to late 1990's models in terms of style, proportions, and quality (at best given the history of restic). They don't look like minis designed in the last few years overall with the not orks, rebs, not skaven, and not squats but more akin to the original warzone minis, vor the maelstrom, urban war, and late 2nd edition 40k stuff.
I guess it's subjective. Mantic KoW Orcs are my #1 favorite Orcs, tied with LOTR Uruk Hai. Also, Urban War Viridians are one of my favorite sci-fi hard-armor models... I have like 50 of them painted up as near-future German infantry (with Leopard 2A6 tanks and Marders as transport)
Forge Fathers are straight up superior to Squats. Squats were one of my main 40k 2nd armies, and they were pretty gak, with horrible aesthetic consistency (flak-armoured infantry, Space Marine Rhinos, leather clad bikers, and norse exo armor all in one army? It was hard to justify thematically)
No one will ever compare to Jes Goodwin's ability to create brilliant designs and 100% follow through with the sculpts.
My Eldar was the last of my 40k to go (not counting Space Hulk, I have a full set of RT metal genestealers and terminators); shipped last week actually. It was hard giving them up, but I haven't liked anything about 40k in a decade.
Alpharius wrote: There goes that whole 'resin plastic free zone' thing!
the Nightmares? I've got about 100+ of the old pvc veermyn (because I'm crazy and I love them) and they are part of Mantic's initial foray into pvc... so like those KoW Orc Gore Riders, they are very cleanly cast and nearly free of mold lines.
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Bolognesus wrote: I don't think the peacekeepers in that bundle have arms compatible with the jetbikes - you'd need the regular enforcers for that. I don't see those coming for free anywhere - am I missing something?
" So, having moved a few things around, when we hit this stretch goal, we will unlock Deadzone: Infestation spec Faction Boosters, and you will be able to pick one FREE in a pledge of Quarantine!"
Faction boosters are the peacekeepers+strider and equivalent vermin bundles. Faction starters != faction boosters, from what I can see.
I agree about the LOTR Uruk Hai (great minis!) as well as the Viridians although with the latter I like them due to nostalgia and within the framework of when they were released. As for FF, I'd hope they'd be superior to squats because even if you agreed with my opinion that mantic stuff is late 1990's to early '00 in style/quality overall that still would place them a decade or so after the squats were designed. They're basically a modern day equivalent of Dreamblade/Shockforce... a cheaper more cartoony version of 40k's take on existing scifi tropes.
I'm in my late 30's and have been gaming since high school so I have plenty of things that I like partly because of nostalgia. I just don't have any nostalgia for the majority of Mantic's offerings so the 1990's style doesn't suit me. Obviously YMMV; opinions not facts; etc but I've found myself really wanting to like mantic in theory but the majority of the minis just stop me from doing so in actual practice.
I like the enforcers and the terrain but I'm not interested in doing another heavy armor scifi army/warband after doing so much of it in 40k (especially since there is literally no mantic scene going on in my FLGS and I'd be the one half heartedly pushing the game if I did so). That pretty much leaves me with their terrain as a potential purchase and I do think they did a good job with that.
warboss wrote: I agree about the LOTR Uruk Hai (great minis!) as well as the Viridians although with the latter I like them due to nostalgia and within the framework of when they were released.
I agree about Void Viridians, but UW/M Viridians are still ace.
There's really no other near future sci fi figures on the market that have such subtle excellence in design.
Infinity figures may be sculpted better, but I do not like the anime influence with everyone lithe and jumping around. UW/M Viridians look like generic near future soldiers. The "Future from 1980's" that is my favorite (Terminator, Aliens, Blade Runner, etc)
warboss wrote: As for FF, I'd hope they'd be superior to squats because even if you agreed with my opinion that mantic stuff is late 1990's to early '00 in style/quality overall that still would place them a decade or so after the squats were designed. They're basically a modern day equivalent of Dreamblade/Shockforce... a cheaper more cartoony version of 40k's take on existing scifi tropes.
Whew, I had some Dreamblade/SF stuff, and no way. Early GW Squats are a joke compared to Mantic's Forge Fathers. I'm not say the basic Steel Warrior is a fantastic model (it's merely acceptable), but leagues better than Squats.
warboss wrote: I'm in my late 30's and have been gaming since high school so I have plenty of things that I like partly because of nostalgia. I just don't have any nostalgia for the majority of Mantic's offerings so the 1990's style doesn't suit me.
It's why I love Mantic's KoW Orcs. They don't look like 90's Kev Adams or Bryan Nelson GW Orcs. They look intelligent and brutal.
Whew, I had some Dreamblade/SF stuff, and no way. Early GW Squats are a joke compared to Mantic's Forge Fathers. I'm not say the basic Steel Warrior is a fantastic model (it's merely acceptable), but leagues better than Squats.
You're missing half of what I wrote in terms of meaning. I said they were the modern day equivalent of Dreamblade. Mantic by and large makes worse looking, retro cartoony, but much cheaper 40k "alternatives" just like dreamblade did a decade or more earlier. As for squats, again, you're missing half of what I wrote. I didn't say early squats are the same quality as FF but that FF are a snap shot in time in terms of both quality and style of what squats would have been had they gotten a late 1990's redesign during 2nd ed 40k instead of being canned. Unfortunately, they didn't get that redesign in the late 1990's by GW but instead the early 2010's with mantic. In any case, it's getting a bit off topic so I won't belabor the point further.
Automatically Appended Next Post: The jet bike does look nice though.
Which sculpts? We've got Mike McVey, Bob Naismith, Remy Tremblay responsible for the lion's share of traditionally sculpted Mantic stuff. Ben Calvert-Lee is an in-house digital sculptor (Master Crafted Miniatures).
I don't think McVey did any sculpting did he? He was/is the Art Director though. Also, not everyone agrees that Naismith is as good as you seem to think he is. Remy was hampered by poor art direction and mediocre concepts for most things. The digital guy, Calvert-Lee, is good but is also hampered by the AD and concepts.
warboss wrote:
It doesn't matter how good the sculptors are if the concept art that they're trying to create from is stuck in a late 1990's cartoony style and you don't like that style.
I agree. And it also seems that their concepts all have a pretty distinct anime tinge to them, which I'm personally not a big fan of.
judgedoug wrote: No one will ever compare to Jes Goodwin's ability to create brilliant designs and 100% follow through with the sculpts.
So much truth here. Shame he will likely never work for another miniatures company.
judgedoug wrote:.
It's why I love Mantic's KoW Orcs. They don't look like 90's Kev Adams or Bryan Nelson GW Orcs. They look intelligent and brutal.
I totally disagree here. The Orx are still completely comedy in my opinion, especially the Deadzone ones. The Riffs from Fallen Frontiers look intelligent and brutal.
The Veermyn are all pretty comedy-ish too in my opinion. The Forge Fathers have good ideas, but mostly poor execution.
Alrighty, now I'm finally seeing value being offered for a sweet spot pledge. I can already tell my wallet is going to ache just as bad as it did for DZ, especially since I'm strongly considering getting an Asterian booster so I finally have all the factions.
I have to say, while I am a bit peeved about the jet bikes being tossed out starting at $10 a pop, now they are looking like a very attractive option. Plus, it might just be me, but the way that render looks, the front vanes may be separate pieces, meaning those folks looking for a much smaller profile that would match a GW bike and base better might need nothing more than a smidge of plasticard and/or greenstuff to get SM-compatible jetbikes.
Still holding out for Corp being introduced as a stretch faction and being given a proper HIPS sprue at last, especially since they would offer a beautiful midway point for conversion stock for both Enforcers and Rebs.
I'd rather not have to lug around 40mm based or larger models in metal, tho. Honestly I wouldn't mind MA/DBX board game plastic. It's nice.
I concur.
Metal is fine for human-sized models in one piece, or perhaps two, depending on what they are. Larger metal models (40mm+) need to be one piece, or they end up like those Basilean Characters from the KoW1 KS where the metal wings weigh so much they can never be permanently attached. Or the River Horse Loka Hippo that warped in the mold and ended up in two halves where never the twain shall meet.
lord_blackfang wrote: I think I just got numb to it, to be honest. Call is shell shock from Deadzone, Relic Knights and Wrath of Kings... Restic and metal are both complete crap to work with, but Restic is at least much better for transport and play.
Disagree; metal single piece models (Warlord, Foundry, Perry, etc) are the easiest models to work with. 10 seconds of cleaning, glue to base. Fit in precut foam trays.
Fully agreed! I'll never give up my old Citadel Metals either!
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highlord tamburlaine wrote: I still think of sprue of characters works, if it's stuff that would have been included in the box.
We don't know what will be in the box. Is there even a box? I haven't seen one yet?
There doesn't seem to be a box. It's more of an a la carte thing this time. Hardcover rulebook, sprues of scenery, pack of counters, sprues of figures...
I can understand the hesitation to want to put metal figures up into higher ground in a Deadzone game.
Hopefully we'll see a bit more progress with this campaign today and have less reason to argue over materials at that point.
We all played Necromunda for years without the sky falling. It's really not as big of an issue as people are thinking it is.
There is a simple rule when it comes to Mantic models. The less Heath Foley has been involved, the better they become. It seems that he is not involved that much in this kickstarter, so the concepts look good.
Last two times I woke up, the total had gone up $1k overnight. This morning, finally, I woke up to see some decent progress and a $25 booster thrown in my pledge for free. Probably some correlation there.
So how are those rat Nightmares? I already have Peacekeepers and Striders coming out of my ears, so I'm picking rats for my booster unless some other faction gets unlocked.
Each model is made up of a head, two arms carrying a weapon, a torso, and a pair of legs. These are broadly separated in male and female varieties; three women, two men. These have a few extra options in terms of legs and torso poses, including running and kneeling versions. There are seven heads on the sprue to choose from, each sporting a set of goggles or some pretty darn radical haircuts!
The sprue carries several rifles in ‘firing’ or ‘at ease’ poses. Each of these comes in only two matched parts and so are quick and easy to assemble for your force. There is also a range of additional arms and pouches to really add a sense of character to your models – pointing out a target, firing off a snap-shot with a pistol, or pulling a knife for the up-close kill. There’s even a cloak for those of you who want to add some extra camouflage to your models.
Ah well, the "Beast" (Night Terror now) is metal. $15 for one, probably quite a large hunk of metal, too. On the plus side, as a four-legged scuttler, it'll probably be pretty stable, and make a good paperweight.
And it's only a $5,000 stretch goal. Looks like they're trying to increase the pace.
Oh, its only 5k? I guess I don't feel so bad about it then. Really wanted several in hard plastic but... don't need that for deadzone really.
If you were already gonna get this and the broodmother, almost silly not to pick up the second bundle
The Veer-myn Beast Faction Booster ($25) will include:
- 1 Veer-myn Brood Mother
- 5 Veer-myn Stalkers (that can be built as Night-Crawlers)
- 1 Veer-myn Night Terror with Reaper Harness.
and get 5 more infantry for 2 bucksfree...forgot Brood Mother was $10, was thinking progenitor.
So far, they're keeping it pretty easy for me to pick up the new stuff without dipping too deeply into the wallet, especially since I have enough peacekeepers and striders.
warboss wrote: I said they were the modern day equivalent of Dreamblade. Mantic by and large makes worse looking, retro cartoony, but much cheaper 40k "alternatives" just like dreamblade did a decade or more earlier.
See, I still disagree. GW has put out awful, simply awful kits for the past few years. The Enforcer aesthetic, for example, is just leagues better than anything in 40kimho. I'm so tired of the terrible, overly busy, nonsensical gak that GW has been releasing. Each release wave they appear to be in competition with their previous month's release for most laughably bad design and execution.
judgedoug wrote:.
It's why I love Mantic's KoW Orcs. They don't look like 90's Kev Adams or Bryan Nelson GW Orcs. They look intelligent and brutal.
I totally disagree here. The Orx are still completely comedy in my opinion, especially the Deadzone ones. The Riffs from Fallen Frontiers look intelligent and brutal.
I don't care for Orx or Deadzone Orx. I'm talking about KoW Orcs. KoW Orc Ax, Greatax, Morax, Gore Riders are well sculpted, wearing manufactured weapons and armor, have excellent muscled proportions, and don't look like hydrocephalic watermelon heads. They look like a real army, marching to war. Everything I love about fantasy Orcs.
GWWHFB Orcs just look stupid. So bad. So, so sooo bad.
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darkPrince010 wrote: Alrighty, now I'm finally seeing value being offered for a sweet spot pledge.
Not saying that you said anything, but it's interesting to contrast this statement with the chorus of voices that declared the KS garbage value after it was two or three days old.
We all played Necromunda for years without the sky falling. It's really not as big of an issue as people are thinking it is.
On flimsy cardboard terrain, no less!
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Taarnak wrote: I don't think McVey did any sculpting did he? He was/is the Art Director though. Also, not everyone agrees that Naismith is as good as you seem to think he is.
McVey did several sculpts. My favorite is the Orc Krudger on Gore.
I guess there's enough people that think Naismith is good because he is continually hired by companies and is responsible for nearly every 3up traditional sculpt outside of Perry.
GW's sculpting and tooling techniques (for HIPS) are impeccable, but their designs certainly range from amazing to atrocious.
Mantic varies wildly on both fronts and their good designs can be better than GW's bad designs, but they're 15 years behind on the tech side of things.
lord_blackfang wrote: GW's sculpting and tooling techniques (for HIPS) are impeccable, but their designs certainly range from amazing to atrocious.
Mantic varies wildly on both fronts and their good designs can be better than GW's bad designs, but they're 15 years behind on the tech side of things.
The only company on par with GW's technology is Wargames Factory, and I would say WF is superior due to producing actually good kits.
The technical design of a kit may be fantastic, but if the content is awful then there's no reason to buy it.
Otherwise I'd be buying a lot more Bandai and Tamiya models, as they are an order of magnitude better skilled (especially at slide core tooling) than GW. But I don't.
GW produces very very high quality kits of really really terrible designs.
judgedoug wrote: GW has put out awful, simply awful kits for the past few years. The Enforcer aesthetic, for example, is just leagues better than anything in 40kimho. I'm so tired of the terrible, overly busy, nonsensical gak that GW has been releasing. Each release wave they appear to be in competition with their previous month's release for most laughably bad design and execution.
Careful, if you keep making fun of Santa Logan and his friends then he'll put you on his grimdark naughty list permanently!
Someone will get the complete update first so I'll just paraphrase, update 17:
Terror done.
10k more monies gets our shredders upgrades into shredder/ravagers who can be drill+chem thrower, 2x drill, or chem laser cannon. 2 shredagers in quarantine 2 shredagers in the first veermyn booster 2 shredagers for $10!
BOOM, just like the bikes, sexy update.
I'm assuming that you'll get enough bodies to make two, extra heads, and enough arms to make the laser cannon guy and then the other guy can have a 2xdrill or drill+chemthrower, I would be a bit surprised if they had options enough for the 10 dollar kit to make 2x of any build. Just my thoughts, no confirmation.
Makes sense $10k was never enough to tool a HIPs kit they split it into 2 smaller stretch goals to keep things moving and the full kit gets funded for $20k. At least there's 2 in the kit now.
The Night Terror also has a chem thrower in the original artwork that's missing in the stretch goal I wonder if they will come back to it and add the chem thrower for another $5k?
From the way they described the sprue I fear that, like the jetbikes, it will be 1 per sprue, so identical poses all around. But 4 for free in my pledge is pretty cool.
Grots are monopose anyway, so you're certainly not losing out in that department. And the rats will at the very least come with a bunch of head options.
I guess their suitability for Grots will primarily be decided by how much body hair they have.
darkPrince010 wrote: Alrighty, now I'm finally seeing value being offered for a sweet spot pledge.
Not saying that you said anything, but it's interesting to contrast this statement with the chorus of voices that declared the KS garbage value after it was two or three days old.
Well, I was comparing the value for the day-one Infestation vs day-one Deadzone, and there was definitely a stark difference, especially after considering that S&H wasn't included. However, that difference has now been significantly narrowed, so I'm back to being a happy camper, and trying to talk myself out of plunking down anything more than the $115 pledge, plus $25 for Asterians, plus $10 for jetbikes$20 for jetbikes$40 for jetbikes far too much for jetbikes...
I don't care for Orx or Deadzone Orx. I'm talking about KoW Orcs. KoW Orc Ax, Greatax, Morax, Gore Riders are well sculpted, wearing manufactured weapons and armor, have excellent muscled proportions, and don't look like hydrocephalic watermelon heads.
They are quite literally the same thing at their core (Orcs/Orx).
And they are all gak designs and gak executions. They are low-rent copies of GW Orcs (which I don't particularly like either). Right down to the slap dash equipment, and oddly proportioned heads that grow from their chests.
See, I still disagree. GW has put out awful, simply awful kits for the past few years. The Enforcer aesthetic, for example, is just leagues better than anything in 40kimho. I'm so tired of the terrible, overly busy, nonsensical gak that GW has been releasing. Each release wave they appear to be in competition with their previous month's release for most laughably bad design and execution.
We'll just have to agree to disagree. GW has always had their fair share of misses. It's inevitable given the combination of people's personal aesthetics and the sheer number of kits that they produce. I think the new AdMech stuff is fantastic, particularly the infantry. But, you know - there's an endless stream of excellent sculpts that they have put out since forever ago - with gak mixed in - same as it ever was. And I'm not even someone who buys much of it at all anymore, and you know how much I love GW as a company.
judgedoug wrote:.
It's why I love Mantic's KoW Orcs. They don't look like 90's Kev Adams or Bryan Nelson GW Orcs. They look intelligent and brutal.
...
I don't care for Orx or Deadzone Orx. I'm talking about KoW Orcs. KoW Orc Ax, Greatax, Morax, Gore Riders are well sculpted, wearing manufactured weapons and armor, have excellent muscled proportions, and don't look like hydrocephalic watermelon heads. They look like a real army, marching to war. Everything I love about fantasy Orcs.
GWWHFB Orcs just look stupid. So bad. So, so sooo bad.
With something like "Orcs/Orks/Orx" the aesthetic is skewed. I love Kev and Brian's work and that will never change. Yes, I'll admit that some of that is probably very much a legacy of the models I grew up with, and that the proportions aren't especially realistic (especially on Kev's stuff) but I forgive all that. I think GW's stuff with Orcs (and also Goblins) is so far down it's own path that I don't think it works well to compare them to others' take on creatures also called Orcs and Goblins - because aside from the name, there's little relationship left there. Mantic's take on them is simply the same thing, but with slightly more "realistic" proportions. Which is fine if you're starting fresh, but they don't work for me since I have a big pile of the older ones and the Mantic ones are too similar to be considered wholly different for me. Like, I can have a KoW army of Moria Goblins and LotR Orcs on the same table as an army of GW Orcs and Goblins, because they're different enough for me to consider them as entirely different races and armies using the same army list (in my Rift-worlds-esque KoW land, which will soon have Ancient Greeks sharing tables with Gondor, Griffon-based Basileans, GW Elves acting as WoW's Blood Elves and old-school GW Ogres. Because feth it, that's why.
But yeah, too similar for me.
darkPrince010 wrote: Alrighty, now I'm finally seeing value being offered for a sweet spot pledge.
Not saying that you said anything, but it's interesting to contrast this statement with the chorus of voices that declared the KS garbage value after it was two or three days old.
That's because the initial value level was garbage. I don't think many (or indeed any) of us expected it to stay that way. But to pretend that it was $115 worth of value until very recently is silly. That's why we see the fuss about "Fake stretch goals" and the like - when the initial offering is clearly an incomplete product that would/could never sell at retail for the asking price, the "buy-in" is really expected against what the project might at some later stage become, rather than funding what is actually presented on Day 1.
I guess there's enough people that think Naismith is good because he is continually hired by companies and is responsible for nearly every 3up traditional sculpt outside of Perry.
People like to insult Naismith because reasons and because his work can be uneven at times. But mostly because reasons, I think. He's similar to the Perrys in my opinion. A very solid upper-second-tier sculptor.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
warboss wrote: Careful, if you keep making fun of Santa Logan and his friends then he'll put you on his grimdark naughty list permanently!
Spoiler:
Brilliant!
And I can see why people talk about the laughable GW aesthetic. I have to admit, that kits like the above tend not to even register to me anymore, since they're so pants-on-head silly. I actually forget that they exist
These last several stretches have really bolstered the Quarantine package.
It's to the point where doubling seems feasible if you like a broad range of options in individual games and not "subbing". Spread the wealth amongst both factions, or clean sweep the new faction.
Hopefully some of those saying it didn't hold value and were pulling last week take another peak. This is where EBs both help and hurt. It's sometimes tough to swallow your pride and re pledge when you HAD the discount. $5 is $5 to some. I'd prefer if they just made the package $113 and shared the discount with everyone no matter when they discovered the project, but that's just me and some might not bother that first day w/o those $5-10 discounts.
I really want to get into plastic kits for the other factions, Steel Warriors and plague in particular who could use some option depth.
I've been wondering if early birds might help retain more pledgers than they turn away, actually. Getting an Early Bird makes you feel like you're getting a "deal," which might make you less inclined to drop your pledge or just go for $1, as you'd lose it. In previous KS campaigns they had incremental $1 discounts for a range of Early Birds, which also meant that they had a large body of pledgers getting the "extra discount."
I know that means other pledgers are NOT getting the extra discount, and that occasioned some griping, but this really didn't seem to hurt Mantic KS campaigns in the past. It also added to the "game" aspect of the KS, in that people without Early Birds would stay on the hunt for one when others dropped them, which kept them tuning in and engaged.
At $5, Early Birds are pretty inconsequential now either way. If they're only going to do $5, they might as well just drop them entirely, as I doubt that minimal savings means much to people on the fence.
________
I'd be surprised if we don't get a Steel Warriors sprue by the end. If this ramps up at all at the finish, there should be enough momentum to fund it, and it was the only other faction represented in the opening video. It looks like they want to get a Veer-myn support weapon / vehicle funded first, but assuming they can do that within this work week, that would seem to finish that faction off. (Unless they're planning another hard plastic sprue for Nightmares. If so, they've been pretty coy about not showing / leaking any renders / concepts in advance. It would also cut against the grain of making the stretch goals for increasingly larger / more powerful units.)
What I'd like to know is if the Veer-myn vehicle will be hard plastic or metal. Right now I'm still in this for Veer-myn, but another large heavy metal piece may make me rethink investing in the faction.
Whatever faction sprues they have already rendered will also be prime candidates for post-campaign pledge manager funding, as we know Mantic wants them done for Warpath. Unlike, say, a one-off Teraton mercenary character, they also are confident that these basic infantry sprues will sell, and that they are essential to the future of their larger franchise.
I think the $5 still helps drive early backers - often enough (or more) to secure the project into fully funded and avoiding the "will it fund? won't it fund?" issues that happen to some other projects.
Right, even the smallest Early Bird serves to motivate people who were going to pledge eventually to pledge as soon as possible, and if carefully structured will push the project into "Fully funded" and possibly extend to the first stretch goal. If you can do this in the first hour, then you've really helped the momentum of the project - people have less reservations about funding, because now they're backing a sure thing that has comfortably funded.
They would be bonkers to do a vehicle in metal, especially in a campaign that's about funding hard plastic - it would probably cost them $15 in raw materials alone! But never say never...
I don't care for Orx or Deadzone Orx. I'm talking about KoW Orcs. KoW Orc Ax, Greatax, Morax, Gore Riders are well sculpted, wearing manufactured weapons and armor, have excellent muscled proportions, and don't look like hydrocephalic watermelon heads.
They are quite literally the same thing at their core (Orcs/Orx).
And they are all gak designs and gak executions. They are low-rent copies of GW Orcs (which I don't particularly like either). Right down to the slap dash equipment, and oddly proportioned heads that grow from their chests.
I know subjectivity and all, but seriously?
Spoiler:
[
Mantic produces a lot (a LOT) of misses, but the KoW Orcs are NOT one of them. They are superior to GW's designs in every aspect.
With something like "Orcs/Orks/Orx" the aesthetic is skewed. I love Kev and Brian's work and that will never change. Yes, I'll admit that some of that is probably very much a legacy of the models I grew up with, and that the proportions aren't especially realistic (especially on Kev's stuff) but I forgive all that. I think GW's stuff with Orcs (and also Goblins) is so far down it's own path that I don't think it works well to compare them to others' take on creatures also called Orcs and Goblins - because aside from the name, there's little relationship left there. Mantic's take on them is simply the same thing, but with slightly more "realistic" proportions. Which is fine if you're starting fresh, but they don't work for me since I have a big pile of the older ones and the Mantic ones are too similar to be considered wholly different for me. Like, I can have a KoW army of Moria Goblins and LotR Orcs on the same table as an army of GW Orcs and Goblins, because they're different enough for me to consider them as entirely different races and armies using the same army list (in my Rift-worlds-esque KoW land, which will soon have Ancient Greeks sharing tables with Gondor, Griffon-based Basileans, GW Elves acting as WoW's Blood Elves and old-school GW Ogres. Because feth it, that's why.
Oh, I was a big Kev Adams fan in the 90's - Orcs were my first WHFB army. I remember experiencing my first style-related disappointment when Brian Nelson took over, I think, with the new Boar Riders. I was like, "hey wait, these guys don't match at all!" At some point in the late 90's I sold that army, though, and never really looked back. Then the LOTR orcs came out and I was like, these are what orcs are supposed to be.
Which is why I love the KoW orc style, and allowed _me_ to start fresh, with a cohesive Orc army with an excellent unified vision. (not counting the later slapdash releases such as the Trolls, bleargh)
It also helps that I love KoW rules so very much that I've just gone crazy with buying armies from various manufacturers. Still got that entire Gamezone Dark Elf army waiting to be painted up as a Thulsa Doom Cult of Set force (with Mierce snakemen)
Way way way off topic, which Greeks are you using? My KoW Greek army is all Vendel/Sgt Major Greeks. They were very fun to paint and have a super distinctive style.
Earth Dragon wrote: Would you buy a printed copy? Or are you just saying just to say?
Unless they go Black Library on the pricing, I would buy a copy. I set aside money for their Dungeon Saga adventure books, but then they decided not to make printed copies. I would buy and read Bloodstone of Cyrillion in paperback if they ever released it. Rulebooks tend to be pricier and have less fluff to make room for rules, so I would not be as likely to buy those.
Oh, I was a big Kev Adams fan in the 90's - Orcs were my first WHFB army. I remember experiencing my first style-related disappointment when Brian Nelson took over, I think, with the new Boar Riders. I was like, "hey wait, these guys don't match at all!" At some point in the late 90's I sold that army, though, and never really looked back. Then the LOTR orcs came out and I was like, these are what orcs are supposed to be.
Which is why I love the KoW orc style, and allowed _me_ to start fresh, with a cohesive Orc army with an excellent unified vision. (not counting the later slapdash releases such as the Trolls, bleargh)
It also helps that I love KoW rules so very much that I've just gone crazy with buying armies from various manufacturers. Still got that entire Gamezone Dark Elf army waiting to be painted up as a Thulsa Doom Cult of Set force (with Mierce snakemen)
Orcs were (one of) my first WHFB armies back in 3rd. I also had Dark Elves and Skaven - both of which got sold off at the time, but the Orcs have remained with me since my teen years. I never had the heart to sell them, despite them being mostly unpainted (still) and even when it looked like I'd never play a fantasy game again. Now with KoW, they ain't goin' nowhere. (and yes, the double negative is deliberate!) Anyway, the Mantic Orcs/Orx just don't work for me on the basis of being too similar, and yet too different, while having so many of the older GW ones, while the LotR ones are enough steps away from anything resembling Orcs as a race elsewhere that they're fine.
Did Gamezone ever get around to releasing their other dark elves that they'd previewed? I should look into them again, but plenty to paint in the meantime.
Way way way off topic, which Greeks are you using? My KoW Greek army is all Vendel/Sgt Major Greeks. They were very fun to paint and have a super distinctive style.
I've got a mix for the historicals - a whole lot of Warlord (Immortal) metals and plastics as well as several boxes of Victrix. Also a smattering of Foundry, with more to come. And then there's the "Mythological/Fantasy Greeks" so I've got some Godslayer, lots more Foundry, the Talos from Maelstrom/Mierce before the shenanigans happened, plus minotaurs from a bunch of places. I'd like to get some of Fitz' ones as well. - though it's my wife's army in theory, I get to do all of the painting (so far). Yay.
It'll be interesting to see where this goes, but Mantic is controlling the pacing so oddly. There are several Enforcer set-ups that would a fine 2nd booster for them that would make all those happy that missed the first KS or just ran out of cash.....I really wonder why they hold off.
I'd think daily add-ons this week is how you battle all these projects closing daily.
There are things Mantic can do to stimulate the total. Could have easily made that goal. Just not as optimistic this is going have the booming last couple days they feel it will. It'll be unfortunate if one of the factions doesn't get the kit they deserve.
I'm guessing the same will happen with this Plague Beast.
Yeah, I'm a pretty big 'gotta catch 'em all' guy for this project, but $25 for one model is just not going to happen for me. Disappointed. I guess I'll have to convert one of my extra marauder tracks.
if that Bubble chucker was restic, at least we'd be getting it for half the current price. Or hard plastic, and then we could be fielding artillery lines of them at a reasonable price.
Looking at my DBX guys on my desk here, that material seems like it would have totally worked for a project like this. Oh well. No use crying over spilled milk.
I fear what that Plague Beast is going to run. He looks large. Plastic plague beasts to compete with plastic jet bikes? That'd be nice...
The Stunt Bot is great in resin, and worth the money for me - it is my favourite Mantic model. I've 2 of them, and the casting isn't perfect but nothing that takes a day to clean and build.
I'm happy with the resin bubble-thrower and plan to take it as my "free" faction starter. I'm very glad people complained about the price, though: getting the progenitor thrown in was very nice.
At least as far as retail goes, the bubble-thrower will be good value. The Stunt-bot went for $20 on the KS and now goes for something like $27 discounted retail.
That Plague Beast is going to be one heavy model if it is cast in metal, though. I expect we'll be seeing a fairly long period of short stretches for metal specialists for all the factions now, before momentum builds for the finale and Mantic get their courage back to put up the Forge Father HP sprue.
Its like a stage 1 stage 2... If its as tough as the s1 and isn't slow... Dag. Plus it'll shave points by not having command (likely?).
If they have progenitor with the space/future warplightning cannon I'll consider it. Would leave me with two of that guy but then he's got options so not the end of the world.
Hopefully several 5k goals like this till momentum builds (hopefully) and we can still see some more HP.
It might be the plague equivalent of the Urban Jotun, Guntrack and Rat Wagon, except instead of firing a long range gun it rus up really fast and throws itself into combat for shredding and screaming
Sounds like its a dumb 1st gen from the last update. Possibly stronger or tougher, but not necessarily . Quadrupedal so maybe not slow. Still seems awful thick to count as fast though.
Also looks like weaponized kalyshi with traditional double glaives and bows but with space future tech.
lord_blackfang wrote:Man, if the ratmen Bubble Chukka is plastic and $5 or even $10 a piece... I will save a lot of money on a huge unit of Ork Mek Gunz.
lord_blackfang wrote:Yeah, that price tag killed all my interest in it.
I'm guessing the same will happen with this Plague Beast.
This sums up the campaign for me - every concept art tease is the start of another material and price lotto. A crazy way to run a campaign.
And the new plague beast is just a stage 1 that's been infected with Mantic Leg Syndrome - it had to happen at some point. It'll end up looking like a VOR Growler.
GrimDork wrote: Sounds like its a dumb 1st gen from the last update. Possibly stronger or tougher, but not necessarily . Quadrupedal so maybe not slow. Still seems awful thick to count as fast though.
Quadrupedal motion is faster than bipedal motion, it's biology
I'm honestly not a fan of the whole Kalyshi story, and that's before getting to the exposed skin. I prefer my Asterians aloof and vanishing into black holes, not charging around pretending to be primitives.
Automatically Appended Next Post: It really is amusing to see people complaining about the price of resin and metal minis, when most of the same people complained so hard about the restic material, that works very well for minis of that size and at half the price, that the material was pulled. It's also not remotely a material lottery - basic troops = HIPS, regular sized elites = metal, large sized minis = resin, special KS exclusives = resin
Shredder says plastic, and they said it was a no-restic campaign, and an all hard plastic campaign within reason - they can't tool hard plastic sprues for the large stuff that gets sold in singles, they just won't sell enough to cover the cost over a mold lifetime.
Yeah I know quadrupedal is faster, I just dunno if its enough to go from slow to fast, maybe just drop slow for normal speed. Even then 2nd gens are not fast.
This project isn't as crazy/awesome as I had hoped, but that just kinda lets me save some money in the end. We've still got add in Wednesday and the last day (maybe) rush so who knows really.
Kalyshi are.. OK... I'll probably just try to make some weapons for my dreadball team though, seem pretty similar.
It's also not remotely a material lottery - basic troops = HIPS, regular sized elites = metal, large sized minis = resin EXCEPT SHREDDERS BECAUSE REASONS, special KS exclusives = resin. And Jetbikes.
I needed a fix so badly the other day I popped a box of Basilean Palandins just for some mold lines to scrape.
I can't remember ever really complaining about the material.
I just hope the metal stuff is better than some of my current Mantic metals, where the halves don't line up, the details aren't sharp, pieces don't connect well... it almost sounds like the restic stuff!
Their quality control on the metals seems to vary considerably.
I'd prefer DBX plastic for anything non-HIPS at this point.
Great stuff, better than restic or Mars Attacks plastic, preassembled and I cleaned up a whole dreadball team in an hour earlier today. Really easy to work with and no warping. By comparison some DZ restic minis took an hour to clean and assemble alone.
NTRabbit wrote: I forgot about the Jetbike, but Shredders are a basic troop unit
They are a 2 for $10 HIPS kit, so I doubt it. (Please don't take this personally btw - as I said, from my point of view every reveal has been a material lotto - if you can see a logic good on ya! )
I like the Asterians as a remote / droid force, and I am not a fan of Kalyshi cheesecake. I don't care if it's just one or two metal specialists, but if it's going to be a Hard Plastic squad that's essential to Asterian forces, I'll probably substitute Eldar models.
pretre wrote: I'm excited and I'm on a phone. The last update said they are thinking about a discounted 'one of everything' completionist pledge.
"Also coming up this week:
Tomorrow is Add-on Wednesday! Add-on Wednesday is that special time of the week where we release a number of cool add-ons to enhance your experience, each entirely optional but gives you more value and more bang for your buck.
And, we’re considering a new completionists pledge level to make getting all of the great new miniatures and scenery that little bit lighter on the wallet. What do you think?"
That'll do well. I have the feeling more are incoming though.
NTRabbit wrote:Now you see the downside to a no-restic project! These are the tings that restic is best at
Ridiculous amounts of flash and warped casts?!
Alpharius wrote:So be it!
Death to Mantic's Restic!
INDEED!
I'm buying everything for the Veer-myn that's not PVC. I'm taking nothing from this KS that is in PVC.
It won't be enough to send a message to Mantic that there is indeed a market for metal, resin and HIPS, but at least I will have stuck to my principles. I'd rather have quality than cheap crap that looks like cheap crap.
The only stuff in Restic is legacy add-ons. Nothing new will be.
Some of us just feel things like the bubble blower of doom would have worked in PVC/restic better. Folks gotta remember that those bigger models are just gonna cost more in resin though. It's been a while since I really been around to price, but that VM artillery is gonna be around $9-10 material cost for the model. It's the other reason they haven't been able to make the base pledge fatter with veer-myn. The entire mass of plastic kits in the base pledge (minus scenery) is probably around that cost at this point.
So for me, I'd really like to get onto that plastic, which I feel brings more backers in as it expands the old factions and let's them put more on offer in the pledge packages.
Let's hope add-on Wednesday really helps us push forward. Gotta get those iron warriors.
.Mikes. wrote: I don't think anything in this KS is in PVC. Have I missed something? From memory the vast majority is in HP, a few metal and one restic.
Just to clarify, PVC is the board game style plastic, like Reaper Bones, is that right?
So-called "restic" is PVC. I won't use the stupid word, any more than I'll buy the crappy stuff that it represents.
Some of us just feel things like the bubble blower of doom would have worked in PVC/restic better.
If by better, you mean "cheaper", you're right. It'll also be covered with carelessly-placed mold lines that have to be cut away with a knife, it'll look like gak because the plastic shrinks back from the mold taking the detail with it, and it'll suck out your soul as you spend six hours cleaning and sculpting to try and make it look right. Then you'll realize that the six hours you wasted cleaning it up could have been spent working part time at the local convenience store, making enough money for a real (i.e. resin) one and having enough change to buy some beer to wash away your sadness.
Wow. Were you uhh... wronged...by Restic(PVC) as a child?
Some strong feelings there.
Honestly I like the material just fine, it's not perfect but it does work well for the larger infantry/monsters/things, and I'd rather have it for stuff that goes on 40mm+ bases than metal, most of the time.
Guess I just have a thicker skin for cleaning mold lines or something?
Or perhaps I'm just an idiot for not being so picky about materials, oh well.
Goal is down to $1500, I'm not *expecting* to see it done in the morning, but surely sometime tomorrow. Curious as to what the materials roulette will end up with on the Aberration. If he's metal I guess I'll get him as the cost will be less. If he's resin, it'll probably be more than I'm willing to spend on it sight unseen.
Haha, it's super WIP, there's a long way to go before it'll be doing what I want it to, but I'm glad I grabbed a forward outpost on sale for the extra long tiles. I really wish they'd sell those on their own.
Some of us just feel things like the bubble blower of doom would have worked in PVC/restic better. Folks gotta remember that those bigger models are just gonna cost more in resin though.
I would rather have it cost more but be worth having. Compare it to my goblin gun tracks in wondrous restic, with mold lines everywhere, soft detail, and frankly just looking like crap and taking a lot of effort to make them half way decent, I'll take cleanly cast resin any time when it comes to items of this size.
The goofy looking super soaker on wheels in resin at least has a chance of showing decent detail and not having mold lines all over what soft detail it would have had as a restic product.
I think the current force add-ons will make it a two wave thing, first wave exclusively already existing items, second wave the new stuff like in KoW2nd and DBX, but that's just an educated guess
GrimDork wrote: Wow. Were you uhh... wronged...by Restic(PVC) as a child?
Some strong feelings there.
Honestly I like the material just fine, it's not perfect but it does work well for the larger infantry/monsters/things, and I'd rather have it for stuff that goes on 40mm+ bases than metal, most of the time.
Guess I just have a thicker skin for cleaning mold lines or something?
Or perhaps I'm just an idiot for not being so picky about materials, oh well.
Or maybe different people have...different opinions?
Although I've got to be honest here, I rarely see anyone extoll the virtues of Mantic's 'restic' when used for 'human sized' miniatures - and for good reason.
Which is why we're all behind the hard plastic for line troops idea, otherwise know as the Warpath Initiative
In other news, the Rat Wagon funded! My favourite part of the Rat Wagon is the Rangefinder Rat, and the extra detail they've gone to to make a special scope that simulates binocular depth perception, because with an eye on each side of the head rats naturally only have monocular deoth perception.
Update #21 from Deadzone: Infestation Sci-fi Skirmish Game
Apr 1 2015
A Beast is Born That’s done it! The Veer-myn Heavy Chem-Thrower is locked in!
We’ve put together a new Veer-myn Booster including the Heavy Chem-Thrower and the Progenitor, which you can include as your choice of free booster in Quarantine.
Alternatively you can add it on for $25.
Up Next!
NEW! Stretch Goal $240,000 Plague First Gen Aberration
For one of the greatest threats facing it, the Galactic Co-Prosperity Sphere knows little about the Plague. There are many first and second hand oral accounts on outbreak incidents stored in the Council’s Exo-Threat Counteraction Unit (those who provide them are often retired afterwards for their own good), but very little solid scientific evidence.
Two of the biggest questions posed by the ETCU is ‘How can the Plague be so comprehensibly virulent?’ and, ‘Why do not all first contact creatures become First Generation Infected?’ Because not all do. Whether it be a flaw in the subject’s genetic code, or some kind of switch within the Plague itself, limiting the number of First Gen Infected, some of those in first contact with a Plague Artefact do not mutate into a Stage One. Their fate is much worse.
Post Containment studies have found that the individuals who change into what have become known as Aberrations, show signs that the mutation followed the same initial stages as those who turn into First Generations; the massive stature and chitinous skin the most telling factors. But at some undefined stage the transformation ceases and begins to fall apart.
Though the victim continues to grow, the mutation forces the host to a hunched, almost quadrupedal stature (it bears noting that Stage One Infected will follow the host’s locomotive nature in all other cases). The end result is an immense, infected creature which does not demonstrate the purposeful nature within the rest of an Infected population. That is to say, it does not seek to spread the Plague, instead it seems to be driven by rabid ferocity and nothing more. One aspect of the Aberration which has sparked some interest in GCPS scientists is the creature seems not to be a vector for the Plague; it cannot infect other creatures. Given that any creature it comes across usually does not survive may or may not be a factor in this.
Addendum: Dr Yoshio Ikeda of the Lu-Fan Conglomerate has been recorded discussing a theory that the quadrupedal nature of the Aberration is a reflection of the true shape of the as-yet unknown race which developed the Plague. A note has been added to Dr. Ikeda’s file and he will be ‘recruited’ to the Council’s Science Division soon.
The First Gen Aberration is a monstrous Plague beast. The miniature is cast in resin and mounted on a 60mm base.
You can include it free in Quarantine if you pick the new Plague Booster. This new $25 booster includes one large resin First Gen Aberration and 5 incredible hard plastic Plague Zombies, which will be available as a Plague unit choice in the updated rules.
Annnndddd…
Speaking of Plague Zombies, one of the most fantastic deals we did on the last Deadzone Kickstarter was our incredible offer on purchasing sets of them.
And it’s now back!
For $15 get 20 terrifying Hard Plastic Zombies – and if you pledge for 3 sets, we’ll give you a fourth set free!
We’ll be back a little later today with Add-on Wednesday. Let us know what you want to see in the comments!
So the hard plastic zombies deal is back, should make some folks happy?
I think I'm gonna let the Aberration slide, the last thing I need is more zombies, and while $25 probably isn't necessarily overpriced for what it is... I'm not otherwise going around buying fancy resin minis, especially not those I have only concept art to go off of. Maybe pledge manager, maybe not. Does seem pretty cool though.
Kind of wonder why he's a 10k stretch as opposed to the seemingly more complicated bubbleblower's 5k, but maybe they're just trying to space things out a bit more as we get closer to time (which is kind of... meh? at best).
Since the old metal rat progenitor was put up for add-on wednesday, I asked if the plague version might be added as well, since it would tie in with the plastic zombies being re-released. It may have been swallowed up in the comments though. The one with a sickle, aka not-Typhus.
70ish GBP for all that lot= yes please 
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