zedmeister wrote: Possibly related, but Forgeworld are building a new Diorama. Something they could use for Adeptus Titanicus?
Oh, I might have been seeing the scale wrong - is that really a Warlord skeleton / chassis? I thought it was something smaller, my mind just had to adjust significantly!
RiTides wrote: Oh, I might have been seeing the scale wrong - is that really a Warlord skeleton / chassis? I thought it was something smaller, my mind just had to adjust significantly!
Well, it's not a warhound, and it's not a reaver, so I think you have it there.
Zwan1One wrote: Looks like there's some interesting resin upgrade control centres to the shadow war terrain. To the left of the super heavy tractor.
Interesting observation, though I think we might actually know where that comes from:
RiTides wrote: Oh, I might have been seeing the scale wrong - is that really a Warlord skeleton / chassis? I thought it was something smaller, my mind just had to adjust significantly!
Well, it's not a warhound, and it's not a reaver, so I think you have it there.
Zwan1One wrote: Looks like there's some interesting resin upgrade control centres to the shadow war terrain. To the left of the super heavy tractor.
Interesting observation, though I think we might actually know where that comes from:
If they do it properly, with plastic 8mm LR tank battalions, entire squadrons of Thunderhawks, properly vast Gargants, great scenery and the like, then that would be fine. Other than me having to sell my house to pay for it all.
Anyway, Id be happy if we could take this as 'confirmation' that we'll eventually end up with something closer to Space Marine/Titan Legions/Epic rather than just a re-imagining of Adeptus Titanicus.
The thing is, if what he's saying is true, the old infantry and titans can't both match the new scale. From all we've heard previously, it sounds like the titans are bigger, but should more realistically match everything else from oldschool Epic. That's actually kind of cool, since they're not remaking any of the other stuff yet.
Anyway, Id be happy if we could take this as 'confirmation' that we'll eventually end up with something closer to Space Marine/Titan Legions/Epic rather than just a re-imagining of Adeptus Titanicus.
Indeed. I think, after Blood Bowl and now Shadow War, GW are beginning to realise that they have a large untapped market ripe for exploiting. If those comments are genuine, then they are seriously contemplating Epic, not just Adeptus Titanicus...
Vintersorg wrote: So the new stuff is not going to be in scale as well?
That's not how I interpreted it - he was explaining why they chose 8mm and it appears that they'll all be to scale.
Yep. They're giving a reason for the scale change beyond the interwebular paranoia of 'to do me over, personally'.
No one's naive enough to think it's them PERSONALLY, we think "to do us over, the Epic 40k community as a whole".
Everyone knows Epic 40k has an inconsistent scale, just like actual 40k does, but we still have models in that inconsistent scale And being inconsistent didn't stop them from selectively fixing it in the past, FW's Aeronautica Imperialis released properly scaled 6mm aircraft in spite of there previously being midget scaled Epic 40k aircraft. I can't remember but the FW Warhounds might have been properly scaled as well? I recall measuring them but don't recall the results.
It is also weird to make the choice to go 8mm if the goal is to be consistent, the problem with Epic was the titans were too small, so they fix that by making the scale bigger and thus the titans need to be even bigger again to be in scale with the infantry?
I mean, I personally don't really mind them scaling up, if anything I think they should go 10mm or some such It's just 8mm is an annoying scale where it's still tiny but larger than old Epic enough so as to not be compatible, and since they are going to be releasing only Titans to start off with we can't recreate the old awesome Epic 40k battles until they get around to releasing the rest of it.... if they ever get around to releasing the rest of it.
If they released a few plastic sprues that included basic vehicles and infantry and maybe a few resin aircraft and oddball vehicles early on then I don't mind them changing the scale at all.
Anyway, Id be happy if we could take this as 'confirmation' that we'll eventually end up with something closer to Space Marine/Titan Legions/Epic rather than just a re-imagining of Adeptus Titanicus.
I'm not actually sure what the context of that message is supposed to be for it to be considered confirmation of anything, "Space Slann" isn't something we've heard from GW in the context of miniatures in a long time.
Skink, I think you're missing the gist of the quote from Andy H. He said the infantry were sculpted as small as the medium allowed, but the implication is they're not really 6mm. If you call the infantry actually 8mm size, then making Titans 8mm scale makes sense.
I'm not espousing that, I really have no idea on the scales - but that's how I read the screen capture quote from zedmeister's post.
RiTides wrote: Skink, I think you're missing the gist of the quote from Andy H. He said the infantry were sculpted as small as the medium allowed, but the implication is they're not really 6mm. If you call the infantry actually 8mm size, then making Titans 8mm scale makes sense.
I'm not espousing that, I really have no idea on the scales - but that's how I read the screen capture quote from zedmeister's post.
The old infantry is pretty close to 6mm. I measured a bunch of the old plastic Epic models during our scale discussion earlier and most were about 6mm tall except some oddball things. For some reason the Chaplain was a couple of mm taller than everyone else at 7.5mm, but he stood head and shoulders above basic Marines which were about 6mm and Orks were 5.5mm, Scouts were about 6.5mm. But other than the oddball stuff like the Chaplain, it was all much closer to 6mm than 8mm.
I will admit I had never ever even seen those metal rogue trader era marines
Most the Epic vehicles are probably in the 4mm to 5mm range while the infantry is closer to 6mm. Forge World's more recent foray in to Epic was all pretty well scaled to 6mm. Even if the old metals were 8mm it seems an odd choice to me to use that as the reasoning as they are probably the main overscaled Epic thing compared to damned near everything else they did for Epic over the years.
I have my doubts simply because of the infantry and tank as I thought it's Titans only for now. But that's a Knight, Warhound, Reaver and Warlord there though the knight looks a tad big.
I was suggesting the infantry, land raider and small reaver on the left could be old Epic models, and the three models on the right could be the new models.
Its weapons have been swapped out with the old plastic weapons from the original plastic beetleback Warlords (heavy plasma gun, multimelta and autocannon in original terminology).
Which means that the stand of marines and land raider are the ones from whatever version of Epic replaced 2nd edition (it was after my time!).
By legit people normally mean stuff like official or legal. Whilst these models are awesome they are neither (it's not legal to produce or sell these copies of GW's designs).
I was suggesting the infantry, land raider and small reaver on the left could be old Epic models, and the three models on the right could be the new models.
Again, I'm far from convinced myself.
Remove the "could be" and replace with "are".
If that's legit it's just scale comparison shot. More likely forumware though.
Malika2 wrote: By legit people normally mean stuff like official or legal. Whilst these models are awesome they are neither (it's not legal to produce or sell these copies of GW's designs).
That is questionable and was one of the big questions in the Chapter House lawsuit. It is illegal to recast GW models, but to study their style and make things in that vein is fine. Individual works can be copyrighted but not a style.
Now how close can you come before you're copying/infringing well that's a bit question but the answer (in the US at least) seems to be pretty damn close.
It's the difference between photocopying Lord of the Rings and selling it, and writing a story about a midget trying to get rid of cursed jewelry.
Malika2 wrote: By legit people normally mean stuff like official or legal. Whilst these models are awesome they are neither (it's not legal to produce or sell these copies of GW's designs).
That is questionable and was one of the big questions in the Chapter House lawsuit. It is illegal to recast GW models, but to study their style and make things in that vein is fine. Individual works can be copyrighted but not a style.
Now how close can you come before you're copying/infringing well that's a bit question but the answer (in the US at least) seems to be pretty damn close.
It's the difference between photocopying Lord of the Rings and selling it, and writing a story about a midget trying to get rid of cursed jewelry.
Fair enough, but these models arent "damn close", they are exact (resized) copies.
LOL! it seems these discussions about the forumware copies of GW designs pop up in this thread every couple of pages.
Mymearan wrote: Yep, illegal resized copies of FW models, a pretty deplorable practice IMO.
A deplorable practice? Why exactly? Because someone did a rescale of a model for a system that was discontinued 10 years ago and where these models never existed and that is only played by some enthusiasts? Or did you mean it's deplorable because GW never did these?
Btw: The shown picture from last page are forumware (I know for sure) and are properly scaled titan models for Epic Armageddon (a thing that never existed because scales where all over the place back then) .
Grimzim wrote: A deplorable practice? Why exactly? Because someone did a rescale of a model for a system that was discontinued 10 years ago and where these models never existed and that is only played by some enthusiasts? Or did you mean it's deplorable because GW never did these?
Btw: The shown picture from last page are forumware (I know for sure) and are properly scaled titan models for Epic Armageddon (a thing that never existed because scales where all over the place back then) .
Because they are taking designs from GW (who invested time, effort and money in producing them) and copying them exactly, albeit smaller. Pure copyright infringement and, yes, a deplorable practice. Especially now that they [GW] are considering a relaunch of Adeptus Titanicus.
Grimzim wrote: A deplorable practice? Why exactly? Because someone did a rescale of a model for a system that was discontinued 10 years ago and where these models never existed and that is only played by some enthusiasts? Or did you mean it's deplorable because GW never did these?
Btw: The shown picture from last page are forumware (I know for sure) and are properly scaled titan models for Epic Armageddon (a thing that never existed because scales where all over the place back then) .
Because they are taking designs from GW (who invested time, effort and money in producing them) and copying them exactly, albeit smaller. Pure copyright infringement and, yes, a deplorable practice. Especially now that they [GW] are considering a relaunch of Adeptus Titanicus.
Well, they (the casters) are also investing time, effort, and money into making living models for the game that as mentioned GW stopped supporting 10 years ago. Its simple supply and demand.
GW stopped supplying a game that was one of their most balanced games, that was affordable and is the actual way 40k should be played scale wise. People demanded more, so those who are good with modeling and/or CAD designing took it apon themselves to keep it going. Wouldn't have the issue if they kept it going
str00dles1 wrote: Well, they (the casters) are also investing time, effort, and money into making living models for the game that as mentioned GW stopped supporting 10 years ago. Its simple supply and demand.
GW stopped supplying a game that was one of their most balanced games, that was affordable and is the actual way 40k should be played scale wise. People demanded more, so those who are good with modeling and/or CAD designing took it apon themselves to keep it going. Wouldn't have the issue if they kept it going
won't someone think of the counterfeiters! They have to live as well you know. Of course, it never crossed the mind of these counterfeiters to actually, you know, create their own IP. GW's IP is their own and what they choose to do with it is their own business. It's a pain, I know, as I love Epic but counterfeits and infringement are not a good thing for anybody except, maybe, the counterfeiters.
Grimzim wrote: A deplorable practice? Why exactly? Because someone did a rescale of a model for a system that was discontinued 10 years ago and where these models never existed and that is only played by some enthusiasts? Or did you mean it's deplorable because GW never did these?
Btw: The shown picture from last page are forumware (I know for sure) and are properly scaled titan models for Epic Armageddon (a thing that never existed because scales where all over the place back then) .
Because they are taking designs from GW (who invested time, effort and money in producing them) and copying them exactly, albeit smaller. Pure copyright infringement and, yes, a deplorable practice. Especially now that they [GW] are considering a relaunch of Adeptus Titanicus.
While legally you are fully correct and I by no means think that reproducing and selling anything that another company sells is a good thing I do not agree. But please consider the circumstances and how these forumware began to exist:
- At the time the forumware was done (years ago) Epic Armageddon was long dead and no models sold by GW / Forgeworld
- The models are not re-casts but some enthusiasts invested hundreds of hours to recreate them at that scale. It's not that GW / Forgeworld provided the 3D data that could be scaled down...
- Only few of those got made and even with the re-launch of Adeptus Titanicus I doubt you will ever see yet be able to get one. And you probably would not want to pay the price you would have to pay
- All in all GW / FW did not lose a single dollar due to this (ok, theoretically a buyer could have used the money to get something else but c'mon ...)
So as said I would not agree: it was merely a work of love for a dead system and - in my eyes - not a deplorable practice. It was the work of some hardcore fans... Yes, legally it is not correct but let's consider the circumstances...
Charax wrote: recasting is not an accurate term for this activity. Where is the original 6mm Mars Pattern Warlord Titan that is being recast?
Exactly! As I said above some guys invested hundreds of hours (and probably even more money) to make these things. This is not some chinese re-casters that the an existing model make a mold and produce it ...
Grimzim wrote: At the time the forumware was done (years ago) Epic Armageddon was long dead and no models sold by GW / Forgeworld
So? It doesn't give them the right to reproduce someone elses designs.
- The models are not re-casts but some enthusiasts invested hundreds of hours to recreate them at that scale. It's not that GW / Forgeworld provided the 3D data that could be scaled down...
See above about on why don't they invent their own IP
- Only few of those got made and even with the re-launch of Adeptus Titanicus I doubt you will ever see yet be able to get one. And you probably would not want to pay the price you would have to pay
A quick google show's otherwise. There's so many of these models out there and I'm betting it's not hard to get a hold of them.
- All in all GW / FW did not lose a single dollar due to this
Oh, you weren't joking. Well, considering that Adeptus Titanicus is due to launch soon, I'm sure GW will be pleased as punch to know they are competing with another party who produces their exact designs. "Why bother re-buying my Titans when I already have my own" the thinking will go. Of course, that has the potential to affect all of us due to the game not selling as much as it could if these counterfeits didn't exist. Also, there's the people who'd be fooled into thinking these are genuine pieces due to the fact that they appear on Ebay regularly. Finally, if they've done these, I'd put money down on them recasting official models as well which probably results in peoples collections being worth less than they could if they decide to sell them on.
It's not a good practice and craps over everyone. Like the designs? Get them in 28mm and create a fan based Epic game for 28mm. Like the game Engine? Then create your own IP, don't rip off someone elses.
Thanks, Grimzim. Let's return top the topic, folks (although unfortunately, that probably means we've got nothing to discuss until FW gives us another hint...)
Those handheld dataslates were at one of the events where they played a titan battle on the floor with reavers, warhounds and warlords. I forget which event, maybe adepticon.
Theophony wrote: Those handheld dataslates were at one of the events where they played a titan battle on the floor with reavers, warhounds and warlords. I forget which event, maybe adepticon.
It was a UK event (at WHW iirc), not Adepticon sadly.
Yikes those dataslates are huge! Will you need one for each model on the board do you think? That is a lot of reference material if you have 5 or 6 titans fighting at once.
Uh, the giant dataslates are for the giant game played with 40k scale models. Pretty sure when we get them they will be a bunch smaller and not magnetic.
Mr_Rose wrote: Uh, the giant dataslates are for the giant game played with 40k scale models. Pretty sure when we get them they will be a bunch smaller and not magnetic.
You're right, but I would kinda love for AT Titans to have nice shiny statsheets like Battletech or Imperial Knights: Renegade. That gets unwieldy for large Epic-scale battles, though.
Mr_Rose wrote: Uh, the giant dataslates are for the giant game played with 40k scale models. Pretty sure when we get them they will be a bunch smaller and not magnetic.
Ah right I see. There is a lot of text and other details on them though, can't see how they could get much smaller if they want to keep the same level of detail.
really? I LOVE the dataslates, I'd totally buy something like that with magnetised damage markers and things for my titans
Yea having one is cool, but having too many makes it hard to keep track of everything. I can see myself putting one down on the chair whilst I do another one and then sitting on it! I dunno what the magnets are like either, they could be easily knocked off or moved for all I know which would make things worse...
Not this year from all we can tell... hopefully we'll hear about a firmer date later in the year, but I'm sure they don't want to distract from the 8th edition release right now.
RiTides wrote: Not this year from all we can tell... hopefully we'll hear about a firmer date later in the year, but I'm sure they don't want to distract from the 8th edition release right now.
8th edition, popularity of blood bowl, switch to plastic. I can see why it's been delayed!
RiTides wrote: Not this year from all we can tell... hopefully we'll hear about a firmer date later in the year, but I'm sure they don't want to distract from the 8th edition release right now.
8th edition, popularity of blood bowl, switch to plastic. I can see why it's been delayed!
Wait, were they not saying "soon" yesterday? Unless we're talking January then I wouldn't consider next year to be "soon" in any sense.
Kroem wrote: Yikes those dataslates are huge! Will you need one for each model on the board do you think? That is a lot of reference material if you have 5 or 6 titans fighting at once.
I know! 8.5"x11" is too big. I do like the black push pins they use. I would imagine there will be a better and easier way to keep track of each titan further down the line.
schoon wrote: Great to hear that work progresses on this!
Can't wait for it to come out - Christmas perhaps?
According to J Martin who talked with Andy Hoare the game is done, and will be released this year:
The book is done, the minis are done. Titanicus is going to print next week and will be out this year
They are going to do a big release with boxed game plus extras. They pushed the schedule back a bit to flesh it out more
They have learned from BB that people are lapping Specialist Games up, so are going to get more budget for it.
So do we have it confirmed that we're talking "boxed game" as in plastic titans and terrain, or as in the original rumoured plan for just a box of terrain and rules and all-resin titans?
The news that they're pushing the investment in SG's up going forward is fantastic.
Had a quick chat with James (Hewitt) yesterday about the statuses of Titans.
All plastic now as mentioned before. He thought the core box would still be rules only (data slates with pegs are in) then Titans in a separate box, but that may not be 100%
He reckons the aim is for FW to support 4 SGs fully at any one time, but they won't be removed from sale when newer games step up to he plate.
Always nice to catch up with him (he did my first day of training when I joined GW, and we bump into each other every so often).
According to J Martin who talked with Andy Hoare the game is done, and will be released this year:
The book is done, the minis are done. Titanicus is going to print next week and will be out this year
They are going to do a big release with boxed game plus extras. They pushed the schedule back a bit to flesh it out more
They have learned from BB that people are lapping Specialist Games up, so are going to get more budget for it.
According to J Martin who talked with Andy Hoare the game is done, and will be released this year:
The book is done, the minis are done. Titanicus is going to print next week and will be out this year
They are going to do a big release with boxed game plus extras. They pushed the schedule back a bit to flesh it out more
They have learned from BB that people are lapping Specialist Games up, so are going to get more budget for it.
Source?
Sounds like source is J Martin who got information from Andy Hoare.
I spoke to James Hewitt yesterday, and while it has been "confirmed" here about the plastics, he did "all but" confirm that it going to happen. Not new news I know but it keeps the hope alive in me.
He mentioned that the titans would be much cheaper and easier to build than originally thought when they were writing the rules. In fact there are mechanics in the rules to allow balancing of uneven match ups purely so they were not forcing people to go out a buy £100's of models just in find a game.
Still no word about anything smaller than a knight making an appearance.
I'm really looking forwards to this. Small games with 1 warlord will be fun. The ability to field an entire Knight house is awesome. You can tell I just read Mechanicus.
Koppo wrote: I spoke to James Hewitt yesterday, and while it has been "confirmed" here about the plastics, he did "all but" confirm that it going to happen. Not new news I know but it keeps the hope alive in me.
He mentioned that the titans would be much cheaper and easier to build than originally thought when they were writing the rules. In fact there are mechanics in the rules to allow balancing of uneven match ups purely so they were not forcing people to go out a buy £100's of models just in find a game.
Still no word about anything smaller than a knight making an appearance.
I think it was already more or less 'confirmed' that, at least at the start, there will NOT be anything smaller than a Knight?
I think the plan is/was, IF this sells really well, eventually other super-heavies, tanks and maybe even Infantry *will* show up, basically giving us The Return of Epic, I hope!
According to J Martin who talked with Andy Hoare the game is done, and will be released this year:
The book is done, the minis are done. Titanicus is going to print next week and will be out this year
They are going to do a big release with boxed game plus extras. They pushed the schedule back a bit to flesh it out more
They have learned from BB that people are lapping Specialist Games up, so are going to get more budget for it.
Only the top link is current sadly, and it specifically says "no set date". The source of the information seems to be James Martin of Little Plastic Soldiers, here:
Little Plastic Soldiers wrote:ADEPTUS TITANICUS UPDATE
27th May 2017
Direct from the Specialist Game Seminar at Warhammer Fest 2017
– Detailed tabletop war game akin to a naval warfare game
– Smaller scale than 40k
– Set during the Horus Heresy
– Wide range of Titans, Knights, Terrain and Modular buildings
– New rules, inspired by the classic 1988 game
– coming soon(ish), no set date.
And an image from the SpikeyBits article nade linked to:
So looks like we're still waiting, hopefully they can nail down a timeline for release after the 8th edition release madness is over! But still doesn't look like 2017 is in the cards...
Has there been anymore news on this? I know I shared what my GW contact saw and knew several weeks ago. This contact clued me into several things that actually came true. Sadly he was fired last week. Hope it wasn't because of the leaked info he was giving.
I can only wonder that going and finding the source before bumping a ~5 week dormant high profile thread with many eyes on it might have been the smart move and resulted in fewer frustrated Dakkites.
Azreal13 wrote: I can only wonder that going and finding the source before bumping a ~5 week dormant high profile thread with many eyes on it might have been the smart move and resulted in fewer frustrated Dakkites.
Indeed, it's bloody annoying. However, to alleviate the annoyance, it did nudge me into doing a trawl and found something not reposted here from this years Warhammer Fest courtesy of the Titan Owners Club - note the enlarged text:
Warhammer Fest 2017- Adeptus Titanicus Concept Images
Some concept images for Adeptus Titanicus rolls on at Warhammer Fest today with Drake snapping some quick pictures for us.
One thing reported is that:
"Imperial Knights are Cataphractii sized.Marine is about 8mm."
A lot of work has gone into banner looks and shapes.
Posing of legs has also been heavily thought out.
Warhounds will definitely not be a forgotten aspect of the game.
New Legio schemes also seem to be on the way soon.
In terms of the Titan Legions in the images themselves:
Confirmed:
Imperial Hunters (white, red and green scales)
Legio Krytos (Godbreakers) (green and white)
Legio Mortis (Deaths Head) - last image
My guess:
Suspected Legio Osedax (Cockatrices) for the red Titans with skeletal banners
The plan has evidently changed quite a lot since we first heard about the game, but IIRC the most recent info was the game would be in the Knight to Warlord range in terms of units, with somewhere around six engines on each side in a "proper" game, and mechanisms in place to try and prevent someone with more money than sense showing up with six Warlords and just gaking all over normal people with more mixed forces.
People naturally assume that if the game is wildly successful as Blood Bowl apparently has been, it would expand into "Epic: Heresy" and then eventually something like 40K Epic, but that's speculation at the moment.
That said, everything is speculation now, because they've evidently decided to back off their initial pitch and rework things, we hope so the models are plastic not resin, but we don't really have much idea of what the final product will look like now.
zedmeister wrote: Plastics confirmed! Just been talking to Andy Hoare. Also, BFG is being thought about
I'm actually struggling to find enough reaction gifs to deal with all of the news. I mean at this point literally the only way they could make me more excited is if they casually dropped "Oh yeah, also Mordheim." on us.
zedmeister wrote: Plastics confirmed! Just been talking to Andy Hoare. Also, BFG is being thought about
I'm actually struggling to find enough reaction gifs to deal with all of the news. I mean at this point literally the only way they could make me more excited is if they casually dropped "Oh yeah, also Mordheim." on us.
Indeed. It is great to see the specialist studio finally expanding beyond bloodbowl. I hope they get the budget and the staff to continue supporting these games in the way we all want. Adeptus titanicus was the first GW game I ever played so I am very excited to see how it shapes up.
zedmeister wrote: Plastics confirmed! Just been talking to Andy Hoare. Also, BFG is being thought about
I'm actually struggling to find enough reaction gifs to deal with all of the news. I mean at this point literally the only way they could make me more excited is if they casually dropped "Oh yeah, also Mordheim." on us.
Oh god yeah. I'm not massively interested in Titanicus for reasons that I'm not quite sure of, but lately I've been more interested in space warfare type games, and I've always wanted to try Mordheim.
Malika2 wrote: Regarding BFG, on FB it's mentioned that it might return, but in a different scale...
But, why? I mean I can just about see a non-cynical motivation for the AT scale shift even if I have to squint really hard, but the actual size of the models in BFG was completely irrelevant to the gameplay(mechanically you could play with a "fleet" of flight stands with sticky labels on the base to name each one) so changing them doesn't have any impact there, and I don't see any real benefit for the models either - if you bump them up large enough to make a meaningful difference to the level of detail they become totally unwieldy to play with, and exactly because the models don't really matter for the gameplay making them smaller wouldn't actually mean bigger games unless they also radically changed the game mechanics.
I would imagine (non-cynically) that they'd try to do it more accurately? But that would be a logistical nightmare.
Also keep in mind that so far I've only see that tidbit appear in one FB post on the BFG fanpage, all the other info I could find online so far is that Andy Hoare is considering bringing BFG back, no mention of scale.
zedmeister wrote: Plastics confirmed! Just been talking to Andy Hoare. Also, BFG is being thought about
I'm actually struggling to find enough reaction gifs to deal with all of the news. I mean at this point literally the only way they could make me more excited is if they casually dropped "Oh yeah, also Mordheim." on us.
And now for the bad news. While speaking to Tony Cottrell, he mentioned that they only had enough capacity to support 4 specialist games at present...
More power to everyone that is psyched about this. Personally, I'm really fething tired of Giant Stompy Robots in 40K. Please start loving tanks again GW.
zedmeister wrote: Plastics confirmed! Just been talking to Andy Hoare. Also, BFG is being thought about
I'm actually struggling to find enough reaction gifs to deal with all of the news. I mean at this point literally the only way they could make me more excited is if they casually dropped "Oh yeah, also Mordheim." on us.
And now for the bad news. While speaking to Tony Cottrell, he mentioned that they only had enough capacity to support 4 specialist games at present...
If it continues to do well, they could grow though.
BlaxicanX wrote: More power to everyone that is psyched about this. Personally, I'm really fething tired of Giant Stompy Robots in 40K. Please start loving tanks again GW.
This is meant to be the giant stompy robots containment game. You can only really go one step above imperial knight before the system completely collapses in 40k, and even then the model serves much better as a display piece.
zedmeister wrote: Plastics confirmed! Just been talking to Andy Hoare. Also, BFG is being thought about
I'm actually struggling to find enough reaction gifs to deal with all of the news. I mean at this point literally the only way they could make me more excited is if they casually dropped "Oh yeah, also Mordheim." on us.
And now for the bad news. While speaking to Tony Cottrell, he mentioned that they only had enough capacity to support 4 specialist games at present...
So...what are the Fantastic Four here then?
changemod wrote:
BlaxicanX wrote: More power to everyone that is psyched about this. Personally, I'm really fething tired of Giant Stompy Robots in 40K. Please start loving tanks again GW.
This is meant to be the giant stompy robots containment game. You can only really go one step above imperial knight before the system completely collapses in 40k, and even then the model serves much better as a display piece.
Exactly!
And IF (When?) it does well, hopefully they'll expand it into tanks, vehicles, infantry and etc. so we get EPIC back, and then you'll have rules and models to have your tankapalooza!
Well, if this is true, Blood Bowl has already taken a slot, and Necromunda is now announced, and Titanicus has been known about for a while. That would leave only one more 'slot', assuming the limit is 4 games, as is supposedly claimed. .
schoon wrote: From other discussions this weekend, they have confirmed that Imperator Class will be done (eventually).
That would make me sooo happy. Especially as the Imperator I already have will definitely be out of scale in this new game.
Y'know, part of me has this fantasy in my head that when FW does create the Imperator, I will hack their computers, steal the 3D files of it, increase the size to 40K scale, and just go crazy with a 3D printer. And then bury me with them all, like that terra cotta army.
I would love to see an imperator with proper fw detail. It would probably be cerastus knight sized and price, but I would pay it, as long as it comes with the huge damage and power sheet.
Malika2 wrote: I would imagine (non-cynically) that they'd try to do it more accurately? But that would be a logistical nightmare.
Also keep in mind that so far I've only see that tidbit appear in one FB post on the BFG fanpage, all the other info I could find online so far is that Andy Hoare is considering bringing BFG back, no mention of scale.
Aye aye, it's all speculation at this stage obviously, but still - more accurately how? The scale BFG represents is so insanely HUEG that the models were irrelevant and you counted the stem of their flying base as the actual ship for gameplay purposes, and even that was a pretty massive abstraction. They realised when they were doing the original that you can't "accurately" represent whole fleets of 1km+ long voidships on the table, so they ignore the models entirely when designing the rules and then sized the miniatures big enough to look good but small enough you can play with lots on a normal table without it becoming too unwieldy.
As far as I can tell, the original models already found that "sweet spot" - making the smaller is pointless because you can't make them small enough to be "accurate" without making them pretty much invisible, and making them any bigger just limits you to smaller fleets due to space concerns which rather defeats the purpose of a mass fleet warfare game. Changing the scale doesn't provide any actual benefit I can see so a cynical attempt to invalidate existing BFG models and the third-party alternatives that have sprung up over the years GW chose to neglect and ignore the Specialist Games seems like the only logical reason to do it.
Something I've found on that Tactical Command forums:
Slightly OT but BFG was commented on: apparently its years off (Tony C) and will be battlefleet heresy, not gothic.
Andy again has said no scale has been decided on for BFG (of BFH rather!) But I think this is a way of shutting the guy up yelling about how GW are screwing over the loyal fans with scale change (yawn!)
They really need to move away from all these sub games being centered around the heresy. A lot of people would play these other games if they could expand their main armies into these other systems. But with everything being good vs bad, but still identical marines it will get old quick.
It smacks of a money grab and not an honest attempt to actually support the products they release for the long haul.
Well, Epic was originally Adeptus Titanicus and Space Marine. Both games were set during the Horus Heresy and only included Space Marines and Titans. The whole Horus Heresy was made up as an excuse to only have to produce models for a single faction, and look where it has brought us.
whalemusic360 wrote:Well a standard plastic knight is about the size of the shin plate of my warlord. So expect the AT warlord to be ~ knight sized.
In the first post, they've addressed it as the size of the Thanatar, which is similar in height to the Dreadknight for the non-FW familiar.
Even though they've said the scale is 8mm, it appears to be that a marine is 8mm... which should make normal humans about 6mm... kinda makes it actually 6mm scale doesn't it?
Tannhauser42 wrote:
schoon wrote: From other discussions this weekend, they have confirmed that Imperator Class will be done (eventually).
That would make me sooo happy. Especially as the Imperator I already have will definitely be out of scale in this new game.
Y'know, part of me has this fantasy in my head that when FW does create the Imperator, I will hack their computers, steal the 3D files of it, increase the size to 40K scale, and just go crazy with a 3D printer. And then bury me with them all, like that terra cotta army.
I think this would be really interesting to see when they do it. Between all the titan minis in Epic, the Imperator and other biggest titan class minis for other factions... they were all done in a scale separate from the rest. Most aparent when you see the undersized steps and doors at the original Imperators feet. Based on stated sizes of Imperator titans in the scale of this game it should be similar in size to the 40k Porphyron... worth it.
Aye, the Imperator was tiny in scale when compared to the other titans - that said the titans themselves where never in scale with the rest of the Epic range as they would have been a lot bigger if they had been.
Alpharius wrote: I still have a hard time seeing Warlords at 'Knight' size - do we think they'll be that big?
I still don't...
(And yes, I'm wrong at least as much as I'm right!)
I hadn't heard that rumor yet. That is a bit larger than I would prefer, but if they go up in scale the detail will be much nicer and we can see some pretty nice looking armies.
My hope is that they have plastic terrain kits out of the gate, too. I would hate to be stuck with cardboard cutouts for these potentially very expensive armies.
Alpharius wrote: I still have a hard time seeing Warlords at 'Knight' size - do we think they'll be that big?
I still don't...
(And yes, I'm wrong at least as much as I'm right!)
I hadn't heard that rumor yet. That is a bit larger than I would prefer, but if they go up in scale the detail will be much nicer and we can see some pretty nice looking armies.
My hope is that they have plastic terrain kits out of the gate, too. I would hate to be stuck with cardboard cutouts for these potentially very expensive armies.
At 8mm that would be extremely oversized and more around 25mm. an 8mm imperator titan would stand a bit over 5 inches and a warlord around 4.
It's about 22 space marines tall or 18 stories of a building. Titans tend to be very poorly scaled in terms of battlefield terrain. I don't see many people using 8mm buildings that are 15-20 stories tall.
Alpharius wrote: I still have a hard time seeing Warlords at 'Knight' size - do we think they'll be that big?
I still don't...
(And yes, I'm wrong at least as much as I'm right!)
I hadn't heard that rumor yet. That is a bit larger than I would prefer, but if they go up in scale the detail will be much nicer and we can see some pretty nice looking armies.
My hope is that they have plastic terrain kits out of the gate, too. I would hate to be stuck with cardboard cutouts for these potentially very expensive armies.
At 8mm that would be extremely oversized and more around 25mm. an 8mm imperator titan would stand a bit over 5 inches and a warlord around 4.
It's about 22 space marines tall or 18 stories of a building. Titans tend to be very poorly scaled in terms of battlefield terrain. I don't see many people using 8mm buildings that are 15-20 stories tall.
James Hewitt talks a bit about his work on Adeptus Titanicus during an interview about the new Necromunda.
Timestamped to relevant section.
Thanks for finding that. I will listen to the whole interview when I have time, but the real nugget there is that he has done another stand alone boardgame for GW. It will be very interesting to see how that turns out.
That looks an awful lot like a DZC board! Everything covered in plants and over-grown/post-apoc type look fits the background of DZC much more than 40k I think..
Can't wait to see the first pics of new titans! I hope they're not OTT expensive and can scale to an extent with the older epic stuff..
Apologist wrote: The titbit about a Warlord standing roughly 8in (20cm) tall is a good nugget, too.
Feels like a good size IMO, much better than the comically undersized ones from the original epic line. Plenty of room for detail on the kit and the finished model should look nice and imposing on the table. On the down side we are probably looking at a roughly IK price tag to go with the size. But as Titanicus is more of a skirmish game you wont need a lot of Warlords(how many you want is a totally different matter though ).
Apologist wrote: The titbit about a Warlord standing roughly 8in (20cm) tall is a good nugget, too.
Feels like a good size IMO, much better than the comically undersized ones from the original epic line. Plenty of room for detail on the kit and the finished model should look nice and imposing on the table. On the down side we are probably looking at a roughly IK price tag to go with the size. But as Titanicus is more of a skirmish game you wont need a lot of Warlords(how many you want is a totally different matter though ).
Aye. Now we're talking about them being in plastic, that not only means they'll be cheaper right off the bat, it also means they'll be available with an online discount, which is also true of the starter box which will likely end up with a discount on the contents right off the bat anyway. That one change has moved me from "I might get a Warlord to paint, eventually" to trying to guesstimate the costs involved in collecting a full demi-Legio formation and an entire Knight Household for support.
Not making each individual purchase feel too ripoff'y means people end up spending far more overall - who knew?
I must say, I'm really getting back into Epic again now, and am holding off painting the Titans I have to wait and see how these bad boys turn out!
There have been so many different artists impressions over the years, varying descriptions in the background in terms of size and style, not to mention that the sculptors will no doubt want some reference to the original - it will be very interesting to see how they turn out.
Pacific wrote: I must say, I'm really getting back into Epic again now, and am holding off painting the Titans I have to wait and see how these bad boys turn out!
There have been so many different artists impressions over the years, varying descriptions in the background in terms of size and style, not to mention that the sculptors will no doubt want some reference to the original - it will be very interesting to see how they turn out.
They're scaled down versions of the present FW range. They've literally taken the CADs for the FW titans and edited them. Entirely happy with that TBH.
The only question will be whether the price is exorbitant or not. Obviously the detail will be awesome, but if I could literally buy the metal titans with all their great weapon arm options from Vanguard minis AND then ship them all the way to the US for less than buying a new plastic GW alternative at the local game store, I think I'll pass. I mean, while they are more of a lanky old style, the Warlord equivalent from Vanguard is 9-10cm tall, and the same price as the GW Contemptor Dreadnought.
But I expect that'll be the case, with Warhounds starting at the price of 40k dreadnoughts and spiralling up from there. As comparisons to 40k-scale models go, are we still working off Knight sized Warlords, or Dreadnought-sized? Because a 60-65 dollar Warlord is not bad, as a centerpiece, anyway.
AegisGrimm wrote: But I expect that'll be the case, with Warhounds starting at the price of 40k dreadnoughts and spiralling up from there. As comparisons to 40k-scale models go, are we still working off Knight sized Warlords, or Dreadnought-sized? Because a 60-65 dollar Warlord is not bad, as a centerpiece, anyway.
A 40K IK is just over 7in or 18cm with a back mounted weapon. So if that rough size of 8in includes the Warlords carapace weapons then yeah there about the same size. IMO a (really)rough size comparison would be IK for the Warlord, SM box Dread for the Warhound with the Reaver somewhere between and possibly Primaris marine sized Knights.
Id love to buy some Dreadnought sized Warhounds. I always loved their design but not their size. A little weapon swap and perfect count-as Dreadnoughts!
Alpharius wrote: If Warlords are going to be 8" tall...I'm not sure I'm going to be thrilled.
But then, I really do want all of Epic back eventually.
So...whatever it takes to make that happen!
Honestly I doubt they'll be allowed even if they didn't seem pretty ambivalent about the prospect of going beyond Titans when folk have discussed it with them. The main studio are *really* invested in the idea that you can play the whole 40K setting in 40K model scale now, they won't want to give folk an alternative to that. I expect we'll get a ton of variant Titans and Knights for a couple of years, then maybe some Chaosified versions, then maybe some Xenos Titans or equivalent, but after whatever part of that they get to is done I have the feeling they'll "retire"(ie, direct-only the kits and cease active development) the new AT in order to make room for another Specialist Game(alas, probably some horrible AoS-adulterated Mordheim-in-name-only thing).
Alpharius wrote: If Warlords are going to be 8" tall...I'm not sure I'm going to be thrilled.
But then, I really do want all of Epic back eventually.
So...whatever it takes to make that happen!
I'm just getting back into the game now and am shocked by how strong the community still is for the game. And that's without any official GW support for many, many years. I guess it shows how good the rulesets have been and how good the concept is in terms of playing in the 40k universe at that scale.
Even if what Yohdrin says comes to pass (which I think it probably will) all it will help to do is put a load more quality titans onto the market for a few years, help push down some ebay prices, help the bunch of miniature producers that have appeared to produce equivalent miniatures. And it might help players who pick up Adeptus Titanicus look for other things to do with their minis, and discover (or re-discover) playing at that scale and grow the community a bit.
We don't need everything in a GW-stamped and sealed box to enjoy and play at that scale - it's already all there! I'm not sure about the NA community but I'm sure if you have a look about (and in the link in my sig) it will be straightforward to find other players, it's so easy to get hold of miniatures and rules right at this point in time.
I have a feeling that constantly getting asked about proper Epic coming back will in the end lead them to realise there is plenty of money to be made there.
But like Yod says, there's years worth of releases at the titan level before they need to think about it. I'm certainly hoping they release Eldar stuff one day
Alpharius wrote: If Warlords are going to be 8" tall...I'm not sure I'm going to be thrilled.
But then, I really do want all of Epic back eventually.
So...whatever it takes to make that happen!
I'm just getting back into the game now and am shocked by how strong the community still is for the game. And that's without any official GW support for many, many years. I guess it shows how good the rulesets have been and how good the concept is in terms of playing in the 40k universe at that scale.
Even if what Yohdrin says comes to pass (which I think it probably will) all it will help to do is put a load more quality titans onto the market for a few years, help push down some ebay prices, help the bunch of miniature producers that have appeared to produce equivalent miniatures. And it might help players who pick up Adeptus Titanicus look for other things to do with their minis, and discover (or re-discover) playing at that scale and grow the community a bit.
We don't need everything in a GW-stamped and sealed box to enjoy and play at that scale - it's already all there! I'm not sure about the NA community but I'm sure if you have a look about (and in the link in my sig) it will be straightforward to find other players, it's so easy to get hold of miniatures and rules right at this point in time.
Just to be clear, AT is not at the same scale as Epic. Epic was 6mm scale and the Titans in it were in general undersized for practicality purposes. A Warlord in Epic was a bit over 2" tall, so if the new AT has a Warlord weighing in at 8" it's going to be way oversized compared to Epic 40k.
I don't know whether AT will be good or bad for the existing Epic community seeing as the models aren't really going to be compatible.
AllSeeingSkink wrote: Just to be clear, AT is not at the same scale as Epic. Epic was 6mm scale and the Titans in it were in general undersized for practicality purposes. A Warlord in Epic was a bit over 2" tall, so if the new AT has a Warlord weighing in at 8" it's going to be way oversized compared to Epic 40k.
I don't know whether AT will be good or bad for the existing Epic community seeing as the models aren't really going to be compatible.
Well rather than height what's the base size going to be? If it's reasonable enough no reason they can't really be used. Okay so 8mm true scale vs 6mm guys so some scale difference but it's no big deal. If they look good and don't cost arm and teeth why not?
Alpharius wrote: If Warlords are going to be 8" tall...I'm not sure I'm going to be thrilled.
But then, I really do want all of Epic back eventually.
So...whatever it takes to make that happen!
I'm just getting back into the game now and am shocked by how strong the community still is for the game. And that's without any official GW support for many, many years. I guess it shows how good the rulesets have been and how good the concept is in terms of playing in the 40k universe at that scale.
Even if what Yohdrin says comes to pass (which I think it probably will) all it will help to do is put a load more quality titans onto the market for a few years, help push down some ebay prices, help the bunch of miniature producers that have appeared to produce equivalent miniatures. And it might help players who pick up Adeptus Titanicus look for other things to do with their minis, and discover (or re-discover) playing at that scale and grow the community a bit.
We don't need everything in a GW-stamped and sealed box to enjoy and play at that scale - it's already all there! I'm not sure about the NA community but I'm sure if you have a look about (and in the link in my sig) it will be straightforward to find other players, it's so easy to get hold of miniatures and rules right at this point in time.
Just to be clear, AT is not at the same scale as Epic. Epic was 6mm scale and the Titans in it were in general undersized for practicality purposes. A Warlord in Epic was a bit over 2" tall, so if the new AT has a Warlord weighing in at 8" it's going to be way oversized compared to Epic 40k.
I don't know whether AT will be good or bad for the existing Epic community seeing as the models aren't really going to be compatible.
Not necessarily. There's been some suggestion that the "8mm scale" thing could have been specifically in reference to the Space Marine test infantry they did, and if the Marines are 8mm then normal humans would be about 6mm still. Also, you have to remember that the Epic titans weren't just small, they were out of scale - actual properly-scaled 6mm titans should have been much bigger than the ones that were released.
AllSeeingSkink wrote: Just to be clear, AT is not at the same scale as Epic. Epic was 6mm scale and the Titans in it were in general undersized for practicality purposes. A Warlord in Epic was a bit over 2" tall, so if the new AT has a Warlord weighing in at 8" it's going to be way oversized compared to Epic 40k.
I don't know whether AT will be good or bad for the existing Epic community seeing as the models aren't really going to be compatible.
Well rather than height what's the base size going to be? If it's reasonable enough no reason they can't really be used. Okay so 8mm true scale vs 6mm guys so some scale difference but it's no big deal. If they look good and don't cost arm and teeth why not?
I'd say the difference between an old Warlord (a bit over 2") and the new Warlord (8") is a pretty massive scale difference.
By my quick back of the hand calcs, an 8" Warlord would be about 1/160 scale, 6mm is typically more like 1/300 scale, so that's a pretty big difference.
/If they look good and don't cost arm and teeth why not?
Sure, do whatever you want, but from what I understand this new range is not intended to be a good fit for replacing old Epic models. If the scale is as different as it seems from the info we have, I'm not sure AT is going to have a huge benefit for the old Epic community nor much of a positive effect on ebay prices of the OOP Epic titans.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Yodhrin wrote: Not necessarily. There's been some suggestion that the "8mm scale" thing could have been specifically in reference to the Space Marine test infantry they did, and if the Marines are 8mm then normal humans would be about 6mm still. Also, you have to remember that the Epic titans weren't just small, they were out of scale - actual properly-scaled 6mm titans should have been much bigger than the ones that were released.
An 8" Warlord would be more like 10 to 11mm scale, so still a lot bigger than old Epic.
I believe FW reps have said previously this wasn't going to be the same scale as old Epic.
Yes we knot it's not same scale but old scale was out of scale with infantrv as well requiring hefty size increase. And in terms of game effect not big difference
I think new Titans with old Epic tanks / infantry will work fine. New Titans with old Titans less so.
I continue to be hugely excited for this, and hope it proves so popular we get the whole 40K range in plastic, over the next couple of decades.
Dear GW, if you are reading - do the above, it will not gut your 40K sales, in a survey of one player (me) I took, I found I am willing to spend little or nothing on 40K in the future, but everything I have on new Epic. Think on.
Darkjim wrote: I think new Titans with old Epic tanks / infantry will work fine. New Titans with old Titans less so.
I continue to be hugely excited for this, and hope it proves so popular we get the whole 40K range in plastic, over the next couple of decades.
Dear GW, if you are reading - do the above, it will not gut your 40K sales, in a survey of one player (me) I took, I found I am willing to spend little or nothing on 40K in the future, but everything I have on new Epic. Think on.
Do we think the old Eldar Titans will work as Wraith Knights in terms of scale?
Probably not. They were quite clear at the open day that this is a game about Imperial Titans during the Heresy. Infantry, tanks, aliens - all a distraction from the core idea, of giant gothic robots blowing each other up.
AndrewGPaul wrote: Probably not. They were quite clear at the open day that this is a game about Imperial Titans during the Heresy. Infantry, tanks, aliens - all a distraction from the core idea, of giant gothic robots blowing each other up.
Darkjim wrote: I think new Titans with old Epic tanks / infantry will work fine. New Titans with old Titans less so.
The new Titans are going to be on the scale of Knights in 40k, so if you're happy with such large models you could just use an Imperial Knight as a Warlord or a Wraithknight as Phantom.
Granted I am both excited for AT and also have a couple of old Epic armies, I just don't see AT as a brilliant option for filling out my Epic armies.
FW did actually make a few Epic scale models which they stopped producing a few years ago, I have a few 6mm scale Warhounds from FW I still need to get around to painting.
Darkjim wrote: I think new Titans with old Epic tanks / infantry will work fine. New Titans with old Titans less so.
The new Titans are going to be on the scale of Knights in 40k, so if you're happy with such large models you could just use an Imperial Knight as a Warlord or a Wraithknight as Phantom.
Granted I am both excited for AT and also have a couple of old Epic armies, I just don't see AT as a brilliant option for filling out my Epic armies.
FW did actually make a few Epic scale models which they stopped producing a few years ago, I have a few 6mm scale Warhounds from FW I still need to get around to painting.
I think DarkJim has the right of it - as long as you haven't got the same class of titan alongside each other then there shouldn't be an issue. Especially if you think of the artistic lisence taken with the size of titans in artwork (with infantry as barely recognisable ants next to the absolutely humongous titans). It's very much down to what you think is the 'right' scale.
Certainly there has been a lot of discussion amongst the Epic community, even with some people doing some CG mock-ups of what the scales will look like alongside each other, and the general consensus is that even for 8mm infantry/tanks it wouldn't look out of place alongside the existing 6mm. Let alone the titans which have varied so massively in terms of their conception and representation in the old artwork.
I'm in it for the sweet Titan on Titan battle and I'm hoping that it eventually leads to more things in this scale, so we can expand our battles and wage war in the 30th - 40th centuries in the scale that we should be waging it in, and get the Apocalypse out of 40K!
Pacific wrote: Certainly there has been a lot of discussion amongst the Epic community, even with some people doing some CG mock-ups of what the scales will look like alongside each other, and the general consensus is that even for 8mm infantry/tanks it wouldn't look out of place alongside the existing 6mm. Let alone the titans which have varied so massively in terms of their conception and representation in the old artwork.
Yeah sure, 6mm vs 8mm isn't a big difference. I think in reality Epic models varied from about 5mm to 8mm scale for the infantry and probably 3mm to 6mm for vehicles (never really checked vehicles that closely, just knew they were in general undersized, but then so are 40k vehicles). If you see the plastic Chaplain in the old Space Marine sprue, he stood head and shoulders above the other infantry for some reason.
Epic was never very consistent.
BUT... an 8" Warhound isn't "8mm" scale, it's more like 10mm to 11mm. That's a pretty massive difference IMO and pushing beyond the limits of being too far different.
Especially when you consider Epic was more often undersized than oversized (Epic flyers look terrible next to FW's Aeronautica Imperialis flyers for example, even though AI was genuinely 6mm scale).
Sure, an old Epic Warlord was a bit undersized, but making it more than 3 times bigger is going a long way the opposite direction
FW historically have been pretty self-consistent with their scaling, if you look at the vehicles, titans and aircraft from Aeronautica Imperialis they are all pretty much 1/300th (or was it 1/285, I forget) of their "real world" sizes.
But all that stuff aside, personally I think a larger scale like AT is going to be is actually better for infantry. If AT isn't going to have infantry then I would have preferred it to be 6mm if not smaller. Not really seeing the advantage of going so big for titans. At the size they are quoting a small AT collection is barely going to fit on 1 shelf of an ikea glass cabinet
AllSeeingSkink wrote: (Epic flyers look terrible next to FW's Aeronautica Imperialis flyers for example, even though AI was genuinely 6mm scale).
Using the "real" sizes presented in the AI rulebook, the Thunderbolt was a different scale to the Barracuda. And it wasn't an insignificant difference, either; something like 1:250 rather than 1:300.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Going bigger means scenery's easier to find. There's masses of card, MDF and resin 10mm urban scenery available now, thanks to Dropzone Commander. More variety than is available in 6mm.
AllSeeingSkink wrote: (Epic flyers look terrible next to FW's Aeronautica Imperialis flyers for example, even though AI was genuinely 6mm scale).
Using the "real" sizes presented in the AI rulebook, the Thunderbolt was a different scale to the Barracuda. And it wasn't an insignificant difference, either; something like 1:250 rather than 1:300.
I just measured my AI Thunderbolt at a smidge over 50mm, in the book they say it's 14.2m, so the Thunderbolt is 1/285 scale. 1/285 is legit for 6mm scale which is usually between 1/285 and 1/300.
I don't have an AI Barracuda model to check, but the book lists the Barracuda as being 11.4m long, so it should be about 40mm long in AI.
The models I've measured from AI all seemed pretty close to the same scale, maybe some of the ones I didn't own were a bit off.
Going bigger means scenery's easier to find. There's masses of card, MDF and resin 10mm urban scenery available now, thanks to Dropzone Commander. More variety than is available in 6mm.
10mm has it's advantages, but if GW is only going to stick to Titans I'd rather they drop it to something a bit smaller. An 8" Warlord is pretty big, that would make an Imperator about the size of 40k scale Warhound Titan.
Going bigger means scenery's easier to find. There's masses of card, MDF and resin 10mm urban scenery available now, thanks to Dropzone Commander. More variety than is available in 6mm.
Which makes it even more weird they went there as GW wants LESS compatibility with 3rd party companies, not more.
Going bigger means scenery's easier to find. There's masses of card, MDF and resin 10mm urban scenery available now, thanks to Dropzone Commander. More variety than is available in 6mm.
Which makes it even more weird they went there as GW wants LESS compatibility with 3rd party companies, not more.
The GW of three/four years ago, perhaps. But, I think they have moved on from that phase, and will release something now if it's a cool idea.
I know of some people that use DZC terrain for Epic (the buildings and city maps especially), and it actually seems to work pretty well, despite the 4mm scale difference.
You never know what GA might do with this game.. They're adding Squats and Eldar at a limited degree to Necromunda . So we might see Eldar titans and Ork Gargants in the near future .
Going bigger means scenery's easier to find. There's masses of card, MDF and resin 10mm urban scenery available now, thanks to Dropzone Commander. More variety than is available in 6mm.
Which makes it even more weird they went there as GW wants LESS compatibility with 3rd party companies, not more.
The GW of three/four years ago, perhaps. But, I think they have moved on from that phase, and will release something now if it's a cool idea.
I know of some people that use DZC terrain for Epic (the buildings and city maps especially), and it actually seems to work pretty well, despite the 4mm scale difference.
You can still see the attitude in their actions. They haven't changed there one bit. Still consider themselves as The Only True Hobby with other companies being leeches that should just die in face of their awesomeness.
odinfellhammer wrote: You never know what GA might do with this game.. They're adding Squats and Eldar at a limited degree to Necromunda . So we might see Eldar titans and Ork Gargants in the near future .
They wrote one line about ambassadors visiting. That does not mean they are adding them to the game
In the near future, I think what we'll see are new titans. They already said that some of the old variants (Deathbringer, Nemesis, Eclipse and Nightgaunt for the Warlord, Hun, Goth and Vandal for the Reaver, Wolf and Mastiff for the Warhound) will now be separate classes by themselves (so finally, more than class of Imperial scout titan!).
The great advantage of the Heresy setting for GW is still the same as it was all those years ago with the first AT game. Both sides used the same equipment. The new game could get by fine with just three model kits and some terrain. But fingers crossed we will eventually see variants of the classic three as well as "new" classes of Titan that have been lost to the mists of time post heresy.
One type I'd really like to see FW/GW attempt is the tri legged titan from one of the Beast arises books. The author(Gav thorp IIRC) mentioned in an interview that it was something put in just for fun. But then that's how the Mastodon started out as well
Yeah, Traitor forces could easily be represented by a spiky bits sprue that adds to the basic Imperial models, or obviously early Heresy titans would just be a matter of paintjob. Adeptus Titanicus (at least Imperial vs. Traitor) is the one game GW could make that would work perfectly fine with a single sculpt of a single line of models, provided they get a nice selection of weapons options. Even the Horus Heresy 28mm boxed game marines are best built with embellishments like Space Wolf accessories, etc, because even each Chapter had differences.
Depending on how they break up the sprue, if they put say the torso and legs assemblies on one sprue, weapons (with plenty of options) on a second, and armor plating nad head options on a third for the warlord, they could easily swap out the last sprue for say a Mars Imperial for Lucius Imperial, Chaos Banelord, or Chaos Plaguelord with a single sprue.
I would simply be happy for a single plastic sculpt of Mars pattern Warhound, Reaver, and Warlord, with a good selection of weapon arms for each. I can easily do Traitor coversions on my own.
We never got into epic, none of us could paint the larger figs and doing the smaller ones seamed even worse . But getting these titans in a larger scale will be great.
Theophony wrote: We never got into epic, none of us could paint the larger figs and doing the smaller ones seamed even worse . But getting these titans in a larger scale will be great.
Really? One of my favourite thing about smaller scales is how they get easier to paint. The smaller they are the easier that they usually are.
Of course when Epic came out I was a snotty nosed little twerp, so I butchered the paint job on all my Epic stuff the same way I butchered the paint job on everything else I painted back then But these days I love anything 15mm scale and smaller, so easy to churn out good looking models.
Less bling to paint, bloody lot easier to paint! Well 12mm(old warmaster) seems to give me headache though. For some reason even harder than 28mm! Well except GW's new 40k models that have upped bling up to 13.
Part of it's the lack of details, part of it is that shading/highlighting is easier. On a 15mm or smaller model simply painting it a dark colour and highlighting it your base colour will give results that look great (whereas the same on a 20+mm model will look somewhat unfinished) and doing the highlights is much easier, a well positioned tap with the brush is all you need to highlight most bits (whereas 20+mm you have to be much more careful to avoid it looking messy).
I reckon on the tabletop my 15mm models look better than my 28mm ones but they took a fraction of the time to paint.
Pacific wrote:Absolutely agree AllSeeingSkink - really good scale to paint, you can do an awful lot with a base coat and wash/drybrush.
I can probably paint a unit or squad of vehicles in the time it would take me to paint a single miniature in 28mm.
tneva82 wrote:Less bling to paint, bloody lot easier to paint! Well 12mm(old warmaster) seems to give me headache though. For some reason even harder than 28mm! Well except GW's new 40k models that have upped bling up to 13.
AllSeeingSkink wrote:Part of it's the lack of details, part of it is that shading/highlighting is easier. On a 15mm or smaller model simply painting it a dark colour and highlighting it your base colour will give results that look great (whereas the same on a 20+mm model will look somewhat unfinished) and doing the highlights is much easier, a well positioned tap with the brush is all you need to highlight most bits (whereas 20+mm you have to be much more careful to avoid it looking messy).
I reckon on the tabletop my 15mm models look better than my 28mm ones but they took a fraction of the time to paint.
Formosa wrote:soooooooooooooooooooooooooo hyped for a return of epic (eventually)
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Theophony wrote: We never got into epic, none of us could paint the larger figs and doing the smaller ones seamed even worse . But getting these titans in a larger scale will be great.
Really? One of my favourite thing about smaller scales is how they get easier to paint. The smaller they are the easier that they usually are.
Of course when Epic came out I was a snotty nosed little twerp, so I butchered the paint job on all my Epic stuff the same way I butchered the paint job on everything else I painted back then But these days I love anything 15mm scale and smaller, so easy to churn out good looking models.
Pacific wrote:Absolutely agree AllSeeingSkink - really good scale to paint, you can do an awful lot with a base coat and wash/drybrush.
I can probably paint a unit or squad of vehicles in the time it would take me to paint a single miniature in 28mm.
Yeah the facepalm was because my younger self didn’t understand less is more on smaller models and would try and paint all the details instead of base, wash and highlight . Now it seems to be a better scale for me, but I’m so vested in larger models.
Also check out the company's main website, they are one of several companies now producing content usable with Epic.
http://vanguardminiatures.co.uk/
Theophany wrote:Yeah the facepalm was because my younger self didn’t understand less is more on smaller models and would try and paint all the details instead of base, wash and highlight . Now it seems to be a better scale for me, but I’m so vested in larger models.
I was in exactly the same place Theophany! Have been fishing out a lot of my old epic (some of which has been boxed up for probably 25 years) and boy is it badly painted - it's made me realise how very lucky we are these days with the acryllics, and not having to wait overnight (and after a thin layer of dust had formed) on top of the old enamel paints!
But you'll find the new paints (plus some extra painting ability and patience) will make an awfully big difference.
I think probably what has happened is that many years now of GW only producing 28mm (and other manufacturers following suit with their main games) has meant it has become the defacto scale for wargaming. But, outside of sci-fi/fantasy there isn't really any standard scale, and instead you choose a scale appropriate to the type of warfare that you want to represent. It's been said many times, but Epic really is ideal for the company to army-level encounters, and having awesome scenes of titans striding between buildings, entire platoons being wiped out by reactor meltdowns and combined assaults of tank squadrons and hundreds of infantry. All of this is easily achievable on the tabletop, and within easy reach of the wallets and time of most mortals, unlike trying to achieve the same at 28mm scale.
The big issue for me is aesthetic. There are a lot of "almost" 6mm ranges out there, but I'm not really interested in "almost". If I get into a game it's because I care about the setting so I want models that fit that setting exactly - note, I don't care who's selling them, just that they're accurate enough to pass as "official" to my eye.
So a GW-produced return to Epic is a big deal for me personally, because none of the readily available 6mm companies have made their not-Space Marines(etc) look enough like actual Space Marines(etc), and the original models are both a bit lacking by modern standards and sodding expensive now they're "collectible".
That aside, it doesn't matter because as I've argued before, I don't think GW will permit a new version of Epic, I think Titans and Knights is all we'll get out of the new AT, because GW don't want you spending 100 quid and getting a whole superheavy tank company, they want you spending 100 quid to get one single superheavy tank in 28mm scale - they know they can put a much higher premium on the same weight of plastic used to produce 28mm kits than they can 6mm because humans are suckers for big, shiny, impressive objects.
Pretty sure GW will go wherever the money takes them?
If AT takes off, they'll want to maintain sales. As Wamahordes has shown us, there's only so many 'big stompy robot with slightly different gun' type models you can release without wearing the concept thin.
For AT? Introduce Xenos race (Orks and Eldar first, kthxpls). From there? Tanks and infantry. Biggedy biggedy bong, Epic has returned.
Vorian wrote: Why would they care about duplicating super heavy tanks but not titans and knights?
I think Yod's point was they don't want you duplicating 40k armies in 6 (or 8 or 10)mm scale, not so much that they care about 1 specific model being duplicated or whatever, they want you to spend $2000 on a 28mm scale 40k army not $200 on a 6mm one.
They potentially have a fear of Epic cannibalising 40k sales since GW pushes 40k as basically Epic in 28mm these days, at least as far as army sizes are concerned. I'm surprised these days how many people have 40k armies that are larger than my Epic armies of the late 90's
Warmachine taught me the opposite - that a game promoted with lots of big stompy robots loses its appeal when you fill it full of things that aren't big stompy robots.
Vorian wrote: Why would they care about duplicating super heavy tanks but not titans and knights?
I think Yod's point was they don't want you duplicating 40k armies in 6 (or 8 or 10)mm scale, not so much that they care about 1 specific model being duplicated or whatever, they want you to spend $2000 on a 28mm scale 40k army not $200 on a 6mm one.
Of course they miss how they won't get 3000£ from me on epic but instead get maybe 500£ on 40k.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: For AT? Introduce Xenos race (Orks and Eldar first, kthxpls). From there? Tanks and infantry. Biggedy biggedy bong, Epic has returned.
As much as I want Epic to return, my prediction is even if AT is massively popular, it'll be years before FW get even part way through releasing Titans/Knights, by which time the game will be on the decline and they'll never get to infantry stuff.
It's already been a year since BB came out and we still only have 5 teams, only 1 of which has been expanded with resin positionals, and BB was from what I understand very popular.
Vorian wrote: Why would they care about duplicating super heavy tanks but not titans and knights?
I think Yod's point was they don't want you duplicating 40k armies in 6 (or 8 or 10)mm scale, not so much that they care about 1 specific model being duplicated or whatever, they want you to spend $2000 on a 28mm scale 40k army not $200 on a 6mm one.
They potentially have a fear of Epic cannibalising 40k sales since GW pushes 40k as basically Epic in 28mm these days, at least as far as army sizes are concerned. I'm surprised these days how many people have 40k armies that are larger than my Epic armies of the late 90's
But the point still stands. Why would they be bothered by super heavy tanks and not knights?
I don't think they think people are buying an 8mm knight or super heavy tank instead of a 28mm one.
Ah, but BB (or so we're told. Always keep salt ready when people talk about the inner workings of GW) was intended to have resin teams - but due to the success has been bumped to plastic.
That causes a delay, no? And we're also told the positive reception has lead to the team responsible expanding.
In summary? BB was a toe in the water. What went before won't necessarily repeat, as it seems GW are reacting to upscale.
Vorian wrote: Why would they care about duplicating super heavy tanks but not titans and knights?
I think Yod's point was they don't want you duplicating 40k armies in 6 (or 8 or 10)mm scale, not so much that they care about 1 specific model being duplicated or whatever, they want you to spend $2000 on a 28mm scale 40k army not $200 on a 6mm one.
They potentially have a fear of Epic cannibalising 40k sales since GW pushes 40k as basically Epic in 28mm these days, at least as far as army sizes are concerned. I'm surprised these days how many people have 40k armies that are larger than my Epic armies of the late 90's
But the point still stands. Why would they be bothered by super heavy tanks and not knights?
No the point doesn't still stand because tanks vs knights wasn't the point in the first place
I don't think they think people are buying an 8mm knight or super heavy tank instead of a 28mm one.
I think they think people might buy an 8mm ARMY instead of a 28mm one. You can't buy an 8mm Knight instead of a 28mm one to slot in to your 28mm Imperial Guard army.... but you can just buy an 8mm army instead of a 28mm.
Whether that's actually what FW/GW thinks, I dunno, but they have avoided replicating their ranges in their entirety in other scales for quite a long time now.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Ah, but BB (or so we're told. Always keep salt ready when people talk about the inner workings of GW) was intended to have resin teams - but due to the success has been bumped to plastic.
That causes a delay, no? And we're also told the positive reception has lead to the team responsible expanding.
In summary? BB was a toe in the water. What went before won't necessarily repeat, as it seems GW are reacting to upscale.
Maybe, but I just don't see GW releasing massive plastic ranges on short notice. The investment is phenomenal. And if they can't do it on short notice the game will get stale before they get around to releasing smaller tanks and infantry after working their way through the titans.
And the turn around time is still an issue. If AT turns out to be massively popular GW can't just turn around and suddenly release Epic the same way they haven't been able to turn around and release more BB teams. In spite of BB's popularity we're still only averaging less than 1 team per quarter, and a team only consists of 1 sprue worth of design/machining/etc.
A large part of what made Epic possible back in the 90's was metal.
And now they can use resin instead of metal. And plastic.
Ultimately, nobody here has anything like enough knowledge to say what GW can or can't do in terms of production options. All we get are crumbs of info, odd theories, and info from Open Days.
There's little reason GW couldn't produce a full Epic game. IF the money is seen to be there.
Vorian wrote: Why would they care about duplicating super heavy tanks but not titans and knights?
I think Yod's point was they don't want you duplicating 40k armies in 6 (or 8 or 10)mm scale, not so much that they care about 1 specific model being duplicated or whatever, they want you to spend $2000 on a 28mm scale 40k army not $200 on a 6mm one.
They potentially have a fear of Epic cannibalising 40k sales since GW pushes 40k as basically Epic in 28mm these days, at least as far as army sizes are concerned. I'm surprised these days how many people have 40k armies that are larger than my Epic armies of the late 90's
But the point still stands. Why would they be bothered by super heavy tanks and not knights?
No the point doesn't still stand because tanks vs knights wasn't the point in the first place
Sorry, but it does. Why would they care about super heavy tanks but not knights?
They could well want to keep it as big stompy robots, but it doesn't seem to make sense to say expansion into tanks etc wouldn't happen because they are worried about duplicating 40k units - because they are doing that already.
Vorian wrote: Sorry, but it does. Why would they care about super heavy tanks but not knights?
They could well want to keep it as big stompy robots, but it doesn't seem to make sense to say expansion into tanks etc wouldn't happen because they are worried about duplicating 40k units - because they are doing that already.
Line has to be drawn somewhere.
"If titans are okay why not knights?"
"If knights are okay why not super heavy tanks?"
"If super heavy tanks are okay why not tanks?"
"If tanks are okay why not infantry?"
Boom we are where GW doesn't want seeing epic as competition to 40k rather than supplementary which is why last coming of epic failed despite outselling their own expectations by _400%_
If we were going by that metric then neither BB nor Necromunda would be back.
Like I've said before, I'm sure there's a tonne of Titan / knight specific stuff they will be doing for several years, so I'm under no illusion that epic will be back any time soon.
I would imagine Xenos AT stuff would be more likely to come before 8mm tanks and infantry too
Vorian wrote: If we were going by that metric then neither BB nor Necromunda would be back.
Like I've said before, I'm sure there's a tonne of Titan / knight specific stuff they will be doing for several years, so I'm under no illusion that epic will be back any time soon.
I would imagine Xenos AT stuff would be more likely to come before 8mm tanks and infantry too
But BB isn't exactly going to compete with AOS. Epic allows playing big battles of 40k cheaper thus leading GW to conclusion it's competing with itself.
But sure. Show how you can play big huge AOS battles cheaper with BB Necromunda doesn't allow playing big 40k battles either.
Epic meanwhile can easily be seen competing with 40k titans, hundreds of models etc GW wants to push to gaming boards.
Vorian wrote: Why would they care about duplicating super heavy tanks but not titans and knights?
I think Yod's point was they don't want you duplicating 40k armies in 6 (or 8 or 10)mm scale, not so much that they care about 1 specific model being duplicated or whatever, they want you to spend $2000 on a 28mm scale 40k army not $200 on a 6mm one.
They potentially have a fear of Epic cannibalising 40k sales since GW pushes 40k as basically Epic in 28mm these days, at least as far as army sizes are concerned. I'm surprised these days how many people have 40k armies that are larger than my Epic armies of the late 90's
But the point still stands. Why would they be bothered by super heavy tanks and not knights?
No the point doesn't still stand because tanks vs knights wasn't the point in the first place
Sorry, but it does. Why would they care about super heavy tanks but not knights?
Yod was talking about the game expanding to Epic (it's literally part of the same sentence), he just used super heavy tanks as an example of them not wanting to cannibalise sales and used that as an arbitrary line of where he thought GW would stop with it.
They could well want to keep it as big stompy robots, but it doesn't seem to make sense to say expansion into tanks etc wouldn't happen because they are worried about duplicating 40k units - because they are doing that already.
I think there's a small but not large chance of them expanding in to super heavy tanks, but it's the "etc" which is the point. I don't expect them to duplicate the entire range. We can argue about where they might draw the line (Titans but not Knights, Knights but not Super Heavy Tanks, Super Heavy Tanks but not regular tanks, regular tanks but not smaller vehicles, smaller vehicles but not infantry....), but I think the chance of them expanding to the entire range is somewhere between tiny and non-existent.
I meant specifically with regards to how profitable to they have to be - Necromunda and BB got cut despite selling too.
The degree to which Epic would compete with 40k is pure conjecture. I don't think an 8mm game competes much with a 28mm (or whatever the real scale of 40k is now) game. But my opinion is just conjecture too.
The only thing to say about it is they are doing knights so they are showing they are willing to produce some 40k scale units in 8mm. That doesn't mean they will definitely produce others but it does show it isn't 100% out of the question.
Yod was talking about the game expanding to Epic (it's literally part of the same sentence), he just used super heavy tanks as an example of them not wanting to cannibalise sales and used that as an arbitrary line of where he thought GW would stop with it.
Sure, and my point was why would they have an issue about duplication on super heavies but not knights. As in why have you picked that arbitrary line? I was engaging in a discussion :/
Vorian wrote: If we were going by that metric then neither BB nor Necromunda would be back.
Like I've said before, I'm sure there's a tonne of Titan / knight specific stuff they will be doing for several years, so I'm under no illusion that epic will be back any time soon.
I would imagine Xenos AT stuff would be more likely to come before 8mm tanks and infantry too
But BB isn't exactly going to compete with AOS. Epic allows playing big battles of 40k cheaper thus leading GW to conclusion it's competing with itself.
But sure. Show how you can play big huge AOS battles cheaper with BB Necromunda doesn't allow playing big 40k battles either.
Epic meanwhile can easily be seen competing with 40k titans, hundreds of models etc GW wants to push to gaming boards.
Yeah, the whole point people have been making is trying to avoid overlapping ranges.
If GW only does Titans, there's really almost no overlap with 40k. The more they add smaller units the more overlap and the bigger the chance of people using it as an alternative to 40k ("wait a second, why am I buying fifty 28mm Leman Russes for that Apocolypse game when I can just buy a few blisters of 6mm ones!"). The idea of 40k games on the scale of Epic wasn't really a thing back in the 90's when Epic was last released (outside of a few dioramas and whatnot, eg. Big Toof River at the 97 Games Day).
One swallow does not make a summer, and GW releasing some titans that scale with 8/10mm will not suddenly switch the whole format of the game for the current playerbase and all of the other companies that make ranges in 6mm (not least the masses of all of the OOP stock range)
Yodhrin wrote: The big issue for me is aesthetic. There are a lot of "almost" 6mm ranges out there, but I'm not really interested in "almost". If I get into a game it's because I care about the setting so I want models that fit that setting exactly - note, I don't care who's selling them, just that they're accurate enough to pass as "official" to my eye.
So a GW-produced return to Epic is a big deal for me personally, because none of the readily available 6mm companies have made their not-Space Marines(etc) look enough like actual Space Marines(etc), and the original models are both a bit lacking by modern standards and sodding expensive now they're "collectible".
I know it's very much a personal thing (and I believe we may have this conversation before! ), but by my reckoning think the below would probably be classed as 'close enough' to most hobbyists.
Spoiler:
That was an interesting point though someone made about metal miniatures. You have a bit of a Catch-22 here for GW. They won't produce miniatures in metal, which arguably the infantry will need to be initially - resin will be too brittle/fine to use at that scale, and I'm guessing you'd need big sales for the prospect of infantry coming along in plastic. Which you won't get on the back of just Adeptus Titanicus box sales - as much as I love the game and scale, I can't see this being as popular as BB or Necromunda, there are too many wargaming newbies that think games have to be played at 28mm and will scoff at small scale.
Where are those Orks from? These great alternate models always seem to only be available from some super secret garage caster when I try to buy some! EDIT: same question re the marines!
I guess the real decision comes when they exhaust the heresy Titans and knights. Do they produce Xenos titans or do they go into Heresy plastics for 8mm legions? Or stop 8mm entirely
Ahh, I remember the was an indiegogo campaign for the plastics a long time ago and I remember E&Cs posts on taccom a long while ago. Somehow had not realised that site existed. Thanks and sorry for the off topic!
... eh, kinda. Stand some Epic miniatures - even the very first MkI Rhinos and Mk6 Marines, so no worries about scale creep - next to some actual 1:300 scale models and the difference is ... impressive.
While I realize that there isn't much to talk about here - yet - it is probably best to take a lot of this stuff to other, more appropriate and on topic threads.
Nothing really new that we didn't already know. But, it is enlightening to see a peak behind the curtain at the occasional machiavellian management maneuvering mishchief. Still, Generalissimo Kroll hightlighted some expanded parts to bits we've got basic info on. Cross posting as I know a few subscribers for this thread:
Like this: Question... “For Adeptus Titanicus - I heard that you really managed to capture that feel of a titan machine spirit railing against it's Princeps? So if the Princeps is playing it safe and staying back shooting from afar there's a chance the Titan will require some sort of self control check to stop it charging in with it's power fist and going against the player's wishes? If so, you're my favourite person. If not, well you might still place in the top 100 I suppose."
James’ Answer
“Do I get a special prize or something for being your favourite person? Because yeah, that's pretty much what happens. Basically, when you push your titan's reactors to do something cool and unusual (it involves rolling a number of special Reactor Dice, which can lead to your engines overheating, but lets you supercharge weapons, turn on the spot more easily, go faster, etc.) there's a chance that the Machine Spirit will rebel against this mistreatment. You get a Command check, representing your Princeps' Willpower trying to keep the machine in check, but if you fail there's a table you roll on. The plan (which is hopefully still the case) was that in campaign play, titans would each have their own personalities and preferred methods, a bit like Tyranid instinctive behaviour. In short, though, yeah, that can totally happen. I'll accept a certificate in the post.
”
BoL(lock)s can clear off though.
Automatically Appended Next Post: One definite new piece of information that is exciting though:
We all want our Orks! I did some early planning on Gargant rules...
Interestingly, it's set during the Heresy for the same reason the original Adeptus Titanicus was set during the Heresy - because it means you only have to sculpt one set of models, and paint them different colours!
If the game's successful, which I'm hoping it will be, I'm sure there could be expansions that introduce the alien races
Would love to see some more Gargants, if they do ever get around to it. The price on most of them on ebay these days is obscene, and there aren't that many third party producers that have stepped in to fill the void yet.
Pacific wrote: Would love to see some more Gargants, if they do ever get around to it. The price on most of them on ebay these days is obscene, and there aren't that many third party producers that have stepped in to fill the void yet.
And if they do well in small scale, they can scale them up to 28mm.
Pacific wrote: Would love to see some more Gargants, if they do ever get around to it. The price on most of them on ebay these days is obscene, and there aren't that many third party producers that have stepped in to fill the void yet.
I love Gargants in Epic, especially from 2nd edition. You'd unload everything into, you couldn't miss, it'd have fires all over, missing arms, the Kaptain would've been blown off but it still came at you! You just had to hope the fires ran away and it'd explode in typical Orky (loud, messy, destructive) fashion!
Technically, Vanguard bought the Troublemaker Games 6mm "Defeat In Detail" range, and Troublemaker Games itself is still in operation, eg with the soon-to-be-released plastic buildings kits (see my sig link).
Incredibly rude of that horrible rumour monger site to steal my comment and post it for their hits. And deliberately crop my name out of their screenshot to boot.
If GW continue the pattern of releasing specialist games just before Xmas as they did with Bloodbowl & Necromunda, I wouldn't expect much concrete info on AT before the summer.
schoon wrote: While I would really love to see all the Xenos races return to AT, it's going to depend on sales.
I sincerely hope the player base (and demand) is still out there!
The fact that there is still such a strong community for Epic (although it's obviously a bit under the radar, as a lot of people - myself included previously - don't seem to know about it), then you have to think that there will definitely be the player base there.
Not Blood Bowl big, which was still getting tournaments with hundreds of players even without the GW re-boot, but I would say pretty sizeable. I think you'll get a lot of younger players especially saying "oh my God, titans and super-heavies are so much better suited to small scale rather than 28mm. Why on earth did GW not think of this before!"
I'm more and more excited about this, whether or not epic makes a comeback. the sculpts being done in 40k size will really help give them the detail they need.
If epic did comeback it would just be icing on the cake.
Now we just need BFG and the triumvirate will be complete.
I think my excitement has finally worn off . Still very interested to see how the sculpts come out at the smaller scale, especially in plastic... but do we even know if it's coming out this year?
I'd have said yes it'll be out this year before, but TBH I'm not so sure now, especially with that "sculpting in 40K scale first" thing, the extra work to convert everything down to AT scale will add a fair bit of time I expect(you can't just "resize" it in the CAD software and you're done, they'll have to go in and manually re-greeble the surface detailing to account for the size).
Yodhrin wrote: I'd have said yes it'll be out this year before, but TBH I'm not so sure now, especially with that "sculpting in 40K scale first" thing, the extra work to convert everything down to AT scale will add a fair bit of time I expect(you can't just "resize" it in the CAD software and you're done, they'll have to go in and manually re-greeble the surface detailing to account for the size).
At least that means some of the missing options for titans in 28 will finally appear- I know I would pick up a coup more reaver carapace guns, and would love to see the warlord carapace guns not be paired letting you mix them up.
RiTides wrote: I think my excitement has finally worn off . Still very interested to see how the sculpts come out at the smaller scale, especially in plastic... but do we even know if it's coming out this year?
I fully expect Adepticus Titanicus to come out in November this year. Tony Cottrell talked about their game a year strategy on warhammer TV last year. They should also have all six Necromunda houses out by then. They can then put additional releases into the once a quarter rotation with bloodbowl and Necromunda so they will have one big release a month going forward.
If they keep up their schedule Bloodbowl will have 14 teams by the end of 2019 so they can release BFG and put bloodbowl on the back burner a bit.
Titans!
• Andy Hoare heavily hinted towards a Battlefleet Heresy game set in the Sea of Fire.
• Will Hayes working on a new titan model.
• Titanicus: Plastic Knights and scenery in the box with Resin add on packs. It’s release date is still a secret but they’ll be showing us stuff soon™️ expect a busy few months of new releases for it.
• Titans will have personalities and preferred behaviours.
• Ordo Sinister being saved and not in initial release of Titandeath.
• Titanicus: May be all plastic. Some resin add ons much like Necromunda.
• Ursus Claws have been mentioned.
• Some variation in kits to establish allegiance.
• Magnet holes are designed into the kits
• Andy Hoare heavily hinted towards a Battlefleet Heresy game set in the Sea of Fire.
The comment on the AT box confuses though - is it going to be just plastic Knights and terrain, or is that in addition to some, you know, actual Titans for the Adeptus Titanicus boxed set?
Seminar was talking about the events at beta-garmon, which is the main muster point entering/leaving the segmentum solar. This because the only major safe warp route during the heresy.
Several titan legions and billions of infantry were involved with the attempts to take and control the BG system. This conflict is where the main campaign for Adeptus titanicus will be set at.
There was a fair bit of info given for AT but as it's a 'instore’ release, head office is a lot more strict on info.
Basically the game is scheduled and on target. The planned release date hasn't changed for several months, and will have a considerable release amount in the few months after as well.
FW have the main box, the three main titans (warhound, reaver, and warlord) out in plastic, and several kights (all present FW and GW knights are coming). PLUS plastic scenery and gaming tiles are coming near release as well.
Talking of the titan kits, they will be plastic and have several weapon options in the box, with the kit designed to be magnetised without issue. They will also include several different cosmetic options like the knight kits do (heads, banners, armour plates etc)
FW are planning several resin kits to add legio specific icons, additional weapons, and heads. Most of the new stuff is being sculpted at 28mm scale and scaled down for easy of work, so we could see additional and missing titan weapons coming g for 40k should demand be there.
I wonder if the "all present" knights coment is a hint that the Armiger wont be in the game(at first anyway).
Seminar was talking about the events at beta-garmon, which is the main muster point entering/leaving the segmentum solar. This because the only major safe warp route during the heresy.
Several titan legions and billions of infantry were involved with the attempts to take and control the BG system. This conflict is where the main campaign for Adeptus titanicus will be set at.
There was a fair bit of info given for AT but as it's a 'instore’ release, head office is a lot more strict on info.
Basically the game is scheduled and on target. The planned release date hasn't changed for several months, and will have a considerable release amount in the few months after as well.
FW have the main box, the three main titans (warhound, reaver, and warlord) out in plastic, and several kights (all present FW and GW knights are coming). PLUS plastic scenery and gaming tiles are coming near release as well.
Talking of the titan kits, they will be plastic and have several weapon options in the box, with the kit designed to be magnetised without issue. They will also include several different cosmetic options like the knight kits do (heads, banners, armour plates etc)
FW are planning several resin kits to add legio specific icons, additional weapons, and heads. Most of the new stuff is being sculpted at 28mm scale and scaled down for easy of work, so we could see additional and missing titan weapons coming g for 40k should demand be there.
I wonder if the "all present" knights coment is a hint that the Armiger wont be in the game(at first anyway).
I presume this means Chaos eventually won at Beta-Garmon since they made it to Terra.
They've thoroughly denied that in reply to my comments on it. Picked up on their 'it's not the old classic epic', pointing out that doesn't actually prevent it being AT. They continued to deny. In what I felt was a slightly humourless way (may just be the way I read it)
Imagine if the success of the previous specialist games like Bloodbowl and Necromunda led them to go back and re-imagine Adeptus Titanicus as new Epic, what with the new confidence they would have.
Of course almost 0% chance. But I like to imagine.
I'm not sure if, going from the format of previous releases, GW would have capacity to re-create Epic in its entirety.
If you imagine the size of each miniature range for each army, it would amount to dozens of new lines.
And there have already been comments about the new lines for Necro and BB not being released fast enough (and those require relatively far fewer new lines)
So I don't think 0% but probably getting on there!
I'm hoping for a great new Titan 'skirmish' game which does something a bit different to classic Epic, and then some lovely new (correctly scaled) Titans that can be used by the Epic playing community for the existing Armageddon and NetEpic games
MIKEtheMERCILESS wrote: Imagine if the success of the previous specialist games like Bloodbowl and Necromunda led them to go back and re-imagine Adeptus Titanicus as new Epic, what with the new confidence they would have.
Of course almost 0% chance. But I like to imagine.
They already upgraded it once from resin to plastic. I doubt they would do it again. They always have that option down the line if the initial release does well.
This year is the 30th anniversary of Adeptus titanicus and of my involvement in the hobby. They had better release it this year!
I'm hoping for a great new Titan 'skirmish' game which does something a bit different to classic Epic, and then some lovely new (correctly scaled) Titans that can be used by the Epic playing community for the existing Armageddon and NetEpic games
Since titans came first, I'd argue the titans were the 'right' scale - it's everything else that's wrong! :-)
And being inconsistent didn't stop them from selectively fixing it in the past, 
I know, smaller.
won't someone think of the counterfeiters! They have to live as well you know. Of course, it never crossed the mind of these counterfeiters to actually, you know, create their own IP. 
(although unfortunately, that probably means we've got nothing to discuss until 
. But getting these titans in a larger scale will be great.
