Don't hesitate to ask if Terrify is supposed to protect against Ranged/Close Combat Basic actions only, or against all Ranged/close combat attacks regardless of action type or even reaction attacks.
Voss wrote: Well, pricing _that_ low could cause other problems, especially for a public company.
Even if the shareholders and etc. weren't the case, there is a minimum threshold for pricing, where if you go too low, it gives the impression that you don't value the product or the customers. For a start collecting box, I'd agree with the $60-80 as more reasonable, for a box like this? $60-80 would send the message that they know they're selling junk. Put it in somewhere double that range ($120-160), and it would look about right for a bundle that feels worthwhile.
I suspect $150 would have gotten people quite excited.
As we've seen, doubling again just reasonably makes people go
At 150 I wouldn't have questioned buying this box. Same with 170. At 200 it becomes a hard sell. At nearly 300? No way.
At 150 I wouldn't have questioned buying this box. Same with 170. At 200 it becomes a hard sell. At nearly 300? No way.
Not at all for me. 2 gangs I have no interest in playing, and a little bit of terrain that will be available later- and a poster map, rather than a board?
H.B.M.C. wrote: I've asked Andy if the rulebook in this new box makes the existing hardback one obsolete.
From what they said on the stream, this is supposed to be just for this boxed set as an entry point. There was a brief mention of it having been printed for the box itself, hence the title of "Dark Uprising" on the rulebook itself.
I've got my fingers crossed that this box set is going to be treated as a new starter set ala Underhive. I genuinely think the content is worth the price. I just can't afford it this month. but if it's still available in 4 or 5 months I will absolutely buy it.
Albertorius wrote: I could afford it. I just can't justify that price range even to myself, for what it has.
Also, I don't wanna. Buying this kind of crap deal gives the wrong message, IMHO.
This is a very succinct way of expressing my sentiments. I don't have an issue affording this, but the price just isn't justifiable. I'd rather not give it to GW making an obvious push to see what is the max they can charge for a starter. If I'm going to drop 300 bucks on a single product this season I'd rather buy my nieces a Switch or something.
balmong7 wrote: I've got my fingers crossed that this box set is going to be treated as a new starter set ala Underhive. I genuinely think the content is worth the price. I just can't afford it this month. but if it's still available in 4 or 5 months I will absolutely buy it.
If I understood correctly you are still going to have to buy the hardcover rulebook if you want to play Necromunda full on.
I suspect $150 would have gotten people quite excited.
As we've seen, doubling again just reasonably makes people go
At $150 I would have bought 3 to 4 sets. At $290 I'm buying none. For me it isn't a matter of affordability, it's a matter of principle. The pricing is veering into games console territory as someone earlier mentioned. At that price point the value proposition just isn't there.
Additionally, this puts me off from wanting to buy any GW products going forward. For decades I've become acclimated to the gradual price increases. Put a frog in water and slowly get it to boil and they don't notice. Throw them in a boiling pot... They're gonna feel the burn. GW just threw us in the boiling pot and I'm not liking the burn.
After 25 years of supporting GW, I think I may have reached my limit.
balmong7 wrote: I've got my fingers crossed that this box set is going to be treated as a new starter set ala Underhive. I genuinely think the content is worth the price. I just can't afford it this month. but if it's still available in 4 or 5 months I will absolutely buy it.
If I understood correctly you are still going to have to buy the hardcover rulebook if you want to play Necromunda full on.
Your understanding from what?
As the name implies, it’s a book that contains the rules! This contains absolutely everything you need to play Necromunda. But it has so much more than that – it features details of the rise of the Corpse Grinder Cults and the fall of Hive Arcos, as well as details for creating your own Enforcer Patrol or Corpse Grinder Cult. There’s also a new campaign, which follows the descent of a hive into the grips of a Chaos uprising and six scenarios that capture the deterioration into lawlessness.
balmong7 wrote: I've got my fingers crossed that this box set is going to be treated as a new starter set ala Underhive. I genuinely think the content is worth the price. I just can't afford it this month. but if it's still available in 4 or 5 months I will absolutely buy it.
If I understood correctly you are still going to have to buy the hardcover rulebook if you want to play Necromunda full on.
Your understanding from what?
As the name implies, it’s a book that contains the rules! This contains absolutely everything you need to play Necromunda. But it has so much more than that – it features details of the rise of the Corpse Grinder Cults and the fall of Hive Arcos, as well as details for creating your own Enforcer Patrol or Corpse Grinder Cult. There’s also a new campaign, which follows the descent of a hive into the grips of a Chaos uprising and six scenarios that capture the deterioration into lawlessness.
Well if he want to see the trading post for other weapon profile outside of the one the gang in that box used, play other gang, hire Bounty hunter, and probably hiring hanger-on, brute....etc. he had to buy the books.
Or maybe I'm wrong and the book had everything, Enforcer don't use trading post, and probably so does Corpse Grinder Cult.
balmong7 wrote: I've got my fingers crossed that this box set is going to be treated as a new starter set ala Underhive. I genuinely think the content is worth the price. I just can't afford it this month. but if it's still available in 4 or 5 months I will absolutely buy it.
If I understood correctly you are still going to have to buy the hardcover rulebook if you want to play Necromunda full on.
Your understanding from what?
As the name implies, it’s a book that contains the rules! This contains absolutely everything you need to play Necromunda. But it has so much more than that – it features details of the rise of the Corpse Grinder Cults and the fall of Hive Arcos, as well as details for creating your own Enforcer Patrol or Corpse Grinder Cult. There’s also a new campaign, which follows the descent of a hive into the grips of a Chaos uprising and six scenarios that capture the deterioration into lawlessness.
"Everything you need to play" is the questionable bit. It might just end up being a quick-start booklet with the most basic mechanics and stats for Enforcers/CGC. So yeah, it technically gives you everything you need to play Skirmish games with those two, but it's not really what we'd consider Da Rules anymore than we'd consider the free 40k 8th PDF on the GW website such.
GW were pretty explicit about Blood of The Phoenix being a campaign book and they're pretty explicit about it having everything you need to play Necromunda, not just Dark Uprising. I don't see why there is a dispute about this.
"Everything you need to play" is the questionable bit. It might just end up being a quick-start booklet with the most basic mechanics and stats for Enforcers/CGC. So yeah, it technically gives you everything you need to play Skirmish games with those two, but it's not really what we'd consider Da Rules anymore than we'd consider the free 40k 8th PDF on the GW website such.
The "most basic mechanics" part is covered on the Quick Reference Sheets shown here, right?
Spoiler:
My understanding, which is going off the stream from last week and the product info they've posted so far is that this at least contains the core rules of Necromunda:
Warhammer Community wrote:Just in case the box isn’t full enough, you also get a rulebook, which contains lore, background, all of the core rules of Necromunda and the two gangs in the box, and a new campaign. And you’ll get all of the accessories that you need to play. Phew!
Serious question, as I'm not sure of what all is necessary for Necromunda: Do you need to buy the rulebook if you're working off of The Underhive box for Goliaths or Escher?
Kanluwen wrote: Serious question, as I'm not sure of what all is necessary for Necromunda: Do you need to buy the rulebook if you're working off of The Underhive box for Goliaths or Escher?
It's complicated! Depends if they have the expanded campaign sections, trading post and associated information. If that's cut out then, yes, you can play Necromunda out the box but not as an extended campaign just a series of One Shots or as a limited campaign...
No, you can play a full game of Goliaths vs Eschers with just Underhive. I mean, it has no rules for 3d terrain, any equipment not on the plastic sprues or a xampaign system, but it is by all definitions of GW apologists a full game.
lord_blackfang wrote: No, you can play a full game of Goliaths vs Eschers with just Underhive. I mean, it has no rules for 3d terrain, any equipment not on the plastic sprues or a xampaign system, but it is by all definitions of GW apologists a full game.
lord_blackfang wrote: No, you can play a full game of Goliaths vs Eschers with just Underhive. I mean, it has no rules for 3d terrain, any equipment not on the plastic sprues or a xampaign system, but it is by all definitions of GW apologists a full game.
Well....the equipment lis is wrong, the cost is wrong, the stat is wrong, so does the ganger cost, and the skills, and there're no Juve, and many more,.... with these "knowledge" in mind, you brought them into a normal game with everyone, you'll end up look like an alien.
Gang War 1 has the rules for 3D terrain and the Turf War(?) campaign. Underhive only has rules for the cardboard tiles and one-off skirmish games, so it doesn't have rules for a trading post, for example.
Gang War 1 has the rules for 3D terrain and the Turf War(?) campaign. Underhive only has rules for the cardboard tiles and one-off skirmish games, so it doesn't have rules for a trading post, for example.
Got it.
And Gang War got individual volumes collected into the $60 rulebook they sell now, right?
PS: I really appreciate the answers, folks. It's making me feel a bit more comfortable with the purchase of Dark Uprising as a 'standalone' starting point, and knowing I'd need more books later if I wanted to build out from there.
Got it. And Gang War got individual volumes collected into the $60 rulebook they sell now, right?
PS: I really appreciate the answers, folks. It's making me feel a bit more comfortable with the purchase of Dark Uprising as a 'standalone' starting point, and knowing I'd need more books later if I wanted to build out from there.
After a fashion. They were combined and changed and tweaked all gangs books published to appear in the Gangs of the Underhive book and the Rulebook. Additional books since then you can count as expansions in that they've added new campaign systems, gangs, bounty hunters and rules.
I suspect that to get to the bare minimum with the Dark Uprising box, I'd probably recommend the Gangs book to be able to play Goliath, Orlock, etc and then the rulebook to get the full campaign book. Though, that's on the assumption that the new box rules doesn't include the extended standard Domination campaign.
Got it. And Gang War got individual volumes collected into the $60 rulebook they sell now, right?
PS: I really appreciate the answers, folks. It's making me feel a bit more comfortable with the purchase of Dark Uprising as a 'standalone' starting point, and knowing I'd need more books later if I wanted to build out from there.
In essence, yes. In detail, it's a lot more complicated. The Gang War era (the first year, November 2017 to November 2018) had the following content: ● Rulebook (November 2017) ● Gang War 1(November 2017) ● Gor Half-Horn Bounty Hunter (FW November 2017) ● Gangs of Legends PDF (November 2017) ● Scenario: Claim the Spire (White Dwarf January 2018) ● Scenario: The Gauntlet (White Dwarf February 2018) ● Gang War 2 (February 2018) ● Hired Guns Mad Dog Mono and Grub Targeson (FW February 2018) ● Genestealer Cult (White Dwarf March 2018) ● FAQ nr. 1 (March 2018) ● Escher weapon list pdf (March 2018) ● Chaos Cult (White Dwarf April 2018) ● Goliath weapon list pdf (April 2018) ● Slate and Macula pdf (FW April 2018) ● Bounty Hunter ‘Venator’ gang (White Dwarf May 2018) ● Gang War 3 (May 2018) ● Gang War 4 (August 2018) ● Leader’s Accessories Pack (August 2018) ● Genestealer Cult v2 pdf (August 2018) ● Chaos Cult v2.1 pdf (September 2018)
After this load of stuff, they made N18 rules (2 books), which is a collection of "most" of the previous content. Some as-is, some modified, some ommited by mistake, some ommited on purpose. There are endless big and small changes! After the release of N18 books in December 2018, we had the following new content:
● N18 compilation books: Rules & Gangs (December 2018) ● FAQ nr. 2 (December 2018) ● Badzone Delta-7 v.2 pdf (January 2019) ● Ambull & Borewyrm Infestation (Web, February 2019) ● Monster Hunt v2 (pdf, February 2019) ● Perpetual Campaign (White Dwarf, May 2019) ● The Book of Peril (June 2019) ● Underdog cards (August 2019) ● Dramatis Personae cards (August 2019) ● The Book of Judgement (August 2019) ● Precinct Mini Campaign (White Dwarf, October 2019)
Now (November 2019), we're getting new books. It should be impossible for GW to give out new books that doesn't change or update rules in the process. In short time, we will know.
Chikout wrote: The problem with this box is simply the way zone Mortalis terrain is made. For each section you need four sides and a roof. So to get the same amount of coverage as the Warcry terrain which was mainly single piece wall sections, you need 5 times as much terrain.
I keep looking at all those sprues and thinking that making "thin" walls (pieces glued back to back instead of making "boxes") might generate a lot more terrain. It won't fit the ZM boards, but if you don't have an interest in using the very expensive ZM boards and just want to add them to your table, ZM fit does not matter.
Chikout wrote: The problem with this box is simply the way zone Mortalis terrain is made. For each section you need four sides and a roof. So to get the same amount of coverage as the Warcry terrain which was mainly single piece wall sections, you need 5 times as much terrain.
I keep looking at all those sprues and thinking that making "thin" walls (pieces glued back to back instead of making "boxes") might generate a lot more terrain. It won't fit the ZM boards, but if you don't have an interest in using the very expensive ZM boards and just want to add them to your table, ZM fit does not matter.
T
ZM fit matters to all of us Necro players who already got the paper tiles. If they gonna make necromunda walls, they better fit the necromunda tiles!
And Gang War got individual volumes collected into the $60 rulebook they sell now, right?
First, it was collected into TWO books, the Rulebook ($60) and the Gangs of the Underhive book ($50), with a few trivial things left in the Gang Wars books, like the Turf War campaign, which was replaced in the $60 rulebook with the Dominion campaign from Gang War 4(?). Basically, there's no compelling reason to track down the Gang War books at this point.
I am not sure if you need the Gangs of the Underhive book if you don't play one of the six gangs contained within it, but I think it has the trading post and equipment lists. Also, if you played Enforcers, you'd probably need the Rulebook, Gangs, and then the Book of Judgment. If you play the Corpsegrinder Cult, you'll probably need the Book of Ruin in addition to the two core books.
Dark Uprising isn't out yet, so who knows what it is like, but it could potentially contain all the things you need to play Enforcers and CGC by reprinting the selected sections from their respective books, hopefully meaning you will not need the other books unless you want something specific to them (like a particular campaign or to play one of the six original gangs). We'll see, I guess.
I am a little less enthused now I've been reminded about what a spread-out mess the rules are! Still haven't played New Necromunda but... perhaps I never will. Might wait for N3, in about ten years.
Ian Sturrock wrote: I am a little less enthused now I've been reminded about what a spread-out mess the rules are! Still haven't played New Necromunda but... perhaps I never will. Might wait for N3, in about ten years.
I think Baxx has done more to dissuade people from playing Necromunda than a $290 price tag ever will...
Ian Sturrock wrote: I am a little less enthused now I've been reminded about what a spread-out mess the rules are! Still haven't played New Necromunda but... perhaps I never will. Might wait for N3, in about ten years.
I think Baxx has done more to dissuade people from playing Necromunda than a $290 price tag ever will...
Honestly, that would be more GW's policies than Baxx.
Got it.
And Gang War got individual volumes collected into the $60 rulebook they sell now, right?
PS: I really appreciate the answers, folks. It's making me feel a bit more comfortable with the purchase of Dark Uprising as a 'standalone' starting point, and knowing I'd need more books later if I wanted to build out from there.
Spoiler:
In essence, yes. In detail, it's a lot more complicated. The Gang War era (the first year, November 2017 to November 2018) had the following content:
● Rulebook (November 2017)
● Gang War 1(November 2017)
● Gor Half-Horn Bounty Hunter (FW November 2017)
● Gangs of Legends PDF (November 2017)
● Scenario: Claim the Spire (White Dwarf January 2018)
● Scenario: The Gauntlet (White Dwarf February 2018)
● Gang War 2 (February 2018)
● Hired Guns Mad Dog Mono and Grub Targeson (FW February 2018)
● Genestealer Cult (White Dwarf March 2018)
● FAQ nr. 1 (March 2018)
● Escher weapon list pdf (March 2018)
● Chaos Cult (White Dwarf April 2018)
● Goliath weapon list pdf (April 2018)
● Slate and Macula pdf (FW April 2018)
● Bounty Hunter ‘Venator’ gang (White Dwarf May 2018)
● Gang War 3 (May 2018)
● Gang War 4 (August 2018)
● Leader’s Accessories Pack (August 2018)
● Genestealer Cult v2 pdf (August 2018)
● Chaos Cult v2.1 pdf (September 2018)
After this load of stuff, they made N18 rules (2 books), which is a collection of "most" of the previous content. Some as-is, some modified, some ommited by mistake, some ommited on purpose. There are endless big and small changes! After the release of N18 books in December 2018, we had the following new content:
● N18 compilation books: Rules & Gangs (December 2018)
● FAQ nr. 2 (December 2018)
● Badzone Delta-7 v.2 pdf (January 2019)
● Ambull & Borewyrm Infestation (Web, February 2019)
● Monster Hunt v2 (pdf, February 2019)
● Perpetual Campaign (White Dwarf, May 2019)
● The Book of Peril (June 2019)
● Underdog cards (August 2019)
● Dramatis Personae cards (August 2019)
● The Book of Judgement (August 2019)
● Precinct Mini Campaign (White Dwarf, October 2019)
Now (November 2019), we're getting new books. It should be impossible for GW to give out new books that doesn't change or update rules in the process. In short time, we will know.
Let us turn that into a TL/DR:
Today you "need":
1 - The in in-print Rulebook: Rules and Campain system
2 - The Gangs of the Underhive: For all the Gangs and for the Trading-Post.
3 - Optionally: If you're not playing one of the Gangs, then you need the book your crews rules are in. (ie this is Palanite Enforcers, Genesteal Cult, Chaos Cult, Guilds, Mercenaries, etc)
Everything else just adds flavour and isn't required.
Note, all of these are also available digitally from warhammer digital, at a varying savings over the print versions.
I suspect $150 would have gotten people quite excited.
As we've seen, doubling again just reasonably makes people go
At $150 I would have bought 3 to 4 sets. At $290 I'm buying none. For me it isn't a matter of affordability, it's a matter of principle. The pricing is veering into games console territory as someone earlier mentioned. At that price point the value proposition just isn't there.
Additionally, this puts me off from wanting to buy any GW products going forward. For decades I've become acclimated to the gradual price increases. Put a frog in water and slowly get it to boil and they don't notice. Throw them in a boiling pot... They're gonna feel the burn. GW just threw us in the boiling pot and I'm not liking the burn.
After 25 years of supporting GW, I think I may have reached my limit.
Have an exalt! I have supported Newcromunda from the outset because it’s the kind of thing I want to see from Gdubs. But this is just silly. A bridge too far for me.
As someone who has bought every release except dice packs, this is a huge disappointment.
But I don't need the terrain, I have plenty.
The gangs of ruin book is separate and has the full campaign details with extra gangs as opposed to the box set book, and the gangs will be released in next few months.
And Gang War got individual volumes collected into the $60 rulebook they sell now, right?
First, it was collected into TWO books, the Rulebook ($60) and the Gangs of the Underhive book ($50), with a few trivial things left in the Gang Wars books, like the Turf War campaign, which was replaced in the $60 rulebook with the Dominion campaign from Gang War 4(?). Basically, there's no compelling reason to track down the Gang War books at this point.
I am not sure if you need the Gangs of the Underhive book if you don't play one of the six gangs contained within it, but I think it has the trading post and equipment lists. Also, if you played Enforcers, you'd probably need the Rulebook, Gangs, and then the Book of Judgment. If you play the Corpsegrinder Cult, you'll probably need the Book of Ruin in addition to the two core books.
....
Weapons Traits have been helpfully placed only the Gangs book.
So other than tracking that info down somewhere else, you can't play even a one-off without the Gangs book.
We had calculated up that playing Enforcers (before Uprising) would cost over $200 for a player who had no Necromunda stuff.
$47 for Judgement book; $42 for 10 models; $15 dice; $110 for the hard cover books. And you have to track down/make tokens and templates.
I suspect $150 would have gotten people quite excited.
As we've seen, doubling again just reasonably makes people go
At $150 I would have bought 3 to 4 sets. At $290 I'm buying none. For me it isn't a matter of affordability, it's a matter of principle. The pricing is veering into games console territory as someone earlier mentioned. At that price point the value proposition just isn't there.
Additionally, this puts me off from wanting to buy any GW products going forward. For decades I've become acclimated to the gradual price increases. Put a frog in water and slowly get it to boil and they don't notice. Throw them in a boiling pot... They're gonna feel the burn. GW just threw us in the boiling pot and I'm not liking the burn.
After 25 years of supporting GW, I think I may have reached my limit.
Have an exalt! I have supported Newcromunda from the outset because it’s the kind of thing I want to see from Gdubs. But this is just silly. A bridge too far for me.
exalting your exalt... yeah, I am going have to call it a no on this one too.
Xmas is coming and I know what is good for me -
not dropping that much on plastic toys when my wife would like something shinier...
I suspect $150 would have gotten people quite excited.
As we've seen, doubling again just reasonably makes people go
At $150 I would have bought 3 to 4 sets. At $290 I'm buying none. For me it isn't a matter of affordability, it's a matter of principle. The pricing is veering into games console territory as someone earlier mentioned. At that price point the value proposition just isn't there.
Additionally, this puts me off from wanting to buy any GW products going forward. For decades I've become acclimated to the gradual price increases. Put a frog in water and slowly get it to boil and they don't notice. Throw them in a boiling pot... They're gonna feel the burn. GW just threw us in the boiling pot and I'm not liking the burn.
After 25 years of supporting GW, I think I may have reached my limit.
Have an exalt! I have supported Newcromunda from the outset because it’s the kind of thing I want to see from Gdubs. But this is just silly. A bridge too far for me.
exalting your exalt... yeah, I am going have to call it a no on this one too.
Xmas is coming and I know what is good for me -
not dropping that much on plastic toys when my wife would like something shinier...
You sir, are obviously a man of discretion AND discernment.... As the saying goes, “ happy wife, happy life”!
CragHack wrote: 230 euros, for those in EU... pretty damn expensive.
Yikes.
Now I don't feel bad anymore about buying an Enforcer squad recently to convert "instead of waiting until I get the big box".
I won't get this at ~200€ with discount, I won't get SoBs, I won't get any of the rather boring battleboxes man, GW's new prices are really saving me money Maybe the Necro box will be marked down a couple of months down the line in my FLGS, they reduced Escher and Goliath gangs quite nicely in price and I got Kharn and other stuff at 50% off before.
CragHack wrote: 230 euros, for those in EU... pretty damn expensive.
Yikes.
Now I don't feel bad anymore about buying an Enforcer squad recently to convert "instead of waiting until I get the big box".
I won't get this at ~200€ with discount, I won't get SoBs, I won't get any of the rather boring battleboxes man, GW's new prices are really saving me money Maybe the Necro box will be marked down a couple of months down the line in my FLGS, they reduced Escher and Goliath gangs quite nicely in price and I got Kharn and other stuff at 50% off before.
The new box prices have done wonder for my wallet. I can afford living again.
I was thinking about starting this game, but now I don't have a clue where to start, what to get or if I should even bother!
The price of this new box is having me lean towards "no"...
Dude.
You need 2 books, to start. Rulebook and Gangs of Necromunda. That's all.
Book of Peril and Book of Judgement add elements to the game, or give you different options.
That absurd list of books is out of date. Also:
● FAQ nr. 2 (December 2018) - Free ● Badzone Delta-7 v.2 pdf (January 2019) - Free ● Ambull & Borewyrm Infestation (Web, February 2019) - Free ● Monster Hunt v2 (pdf, February 2019) - Free ● Perpetual Campaign (White Dwarf, May 2019) - Optional, never used ● The Book of Peril (June 2019) - Fun but optional ● Underdog cards (August 2019) - LOL Sold out in like 5 minutes, good luck getting these legitimately ● Dramatis Personae cards (August 2019) - LOL, Sold out. You can literally just phtotocopy them from the books/model insert ● The Book of Judgement (August 2019) - Introduces Enforcers and guilders and new campaign type, cool but optional. ● Precinct Mini Campaign (White Dwarf, October 2019) - Optional, if I wouldn't get into trouble I'd give it to you here
I am considering the box at a 20% discount as the enforcers are cool models and the zone mortalis stuff is going to be cheaper in this box than on it's own.
That being said, the amount of books in addition to the core book is unbelievable even if they're optional. I thought 40k was bad for rules bloat.
Baxx list is a history of anything rule related to Necromunda more than "list of books". Duplicate entry like GSC and Chaos Cult gang, were updated and released for free in the later version, making the first one obsolete.
GW release a million of those tactic cards, but those aren't exactly crucial to the game, and you can always look at the card rule around the internet. This is the same for Bloodbowl. But I don't recall someone make a complete list for those in BB (or even using them in a BB match)
that table is a dream.
and is going to stay that way, at least for me.
570euros is a lot, but still less than a divorce.
Love lasts forever, plastic only sticks around 50,000 years or so.
Doesn't look fun to play on, either. The central area to the left looks interesting to fight over, the rest of the board just looks like places to hide in a corner for multiple rounds until your opponent gets bored and tries to rush you. Or at the far end, a place just to be shot.
jeff white wrote: that table is a dream.
and is going to stay that way, at least for me.
570euros is a lot, but still less than a divorce.
Love lasts forever, plastic only sticks around 50,000 years or so.
Are you man or mouse?
But yeah seriously my enthusiasm evaporated at the price.
Does look v nice though.
Hopefully this time around the Helot and GSC gangs will be a bit better put together, rules-wise.
The idea of "corrupting" House gangs is a cool one, and I will probably fall for the ploy by picking up extras for my main House factions(Delaque & Goliath) to make culty conversions.
The most interesting thing to me is the Survivors of the Apocalypse mode, which might be a way to bring back some of that oldschool lower-tech feel for Underhive-set campaigns without having to go in and manually tweak loads of rarities and costs.
And will the 'new' book in Uprising change the books you 'have to have' list?
Especially if I'm mostly interested in Enforcers?
The book where the Enforcers were introduced was Book of Judgment, and you would typically need that book to play the Enforcers.
I have no idea if the Dark Uprising book allows you to skip it or not, but it is entirely possible that all the Enforcer stats, equipment, skills, and whatnot (all 5 or 6 pages of it) will be reprinted in the Dark Uprising book, allowing you to skip Book of Judgment.
The new hardback book, Book of Ruin, will likely be in the same boat as Book of Judgment, but for the Corpsegrinder Cult.
Based on the stream and the contents, contrary to what they said last week, you need the the uprising box for the uprising campaign, the book of ruin only expands on the material in the box.
Sticker shock is a thing and boy is it bad here. Also GW really needs to consolidate all these different rules into one place. It's almost as if an app where you could buy and store all rule sources into one area in a well laid out and clean format is a good idea.
Has anyone else noticed how hilariously the staging of that overall picture misrepresents the volume of terrain provided by two sets? The front two thirds of the play area are crammed full of terrain while the back third is all but empty. 600 dollars to fill less than 25% of your table
Has anyone else noticed how hilariously the staging of that overall picture misrepresents the volume of terrain provided by two sets? The front two thirds of the play area are crammed full of terrain while the back third is all but empty. 600 dollars to fill less than 25% of your table
Two thirds crammed plus one third empty equals three thirds adequately spaced though does it not?
Yodhrin wrote: The idea of "corrupting" House gangs is a cool one, and I will probably fall for the ploy by picking up extras for my main House factions(Delaque & Goliath) to make culty conversions.
I'll definitely fall for it. Though it was my plan from the beginning to 'desecrate' house gangs for Chaos and Genestealers. I hope there're not too many drawbacks in the rules (there should be some, but...).
N3p3nth3 wrote: Based on the stream and the contents, contrary to what they said last week, you need the the uprising box for the uprising campaign, the book of ruin only expands on the material in the box.
The book of ruin does have the full rules for the corpsegrinder cults though right? I have the 2 hardback books from 2018. Could care less about yet another campaign tbh, but there's no way i'm buying this boxed set at that price. I do like the khorne guys though, might want to start them.
I really feel this box highlights why the card tiles in the initial boxed set were a good idea. They kept the price of the box at a reasonable level. The terrain in this set seriously bloats the cost and the built in discount is too minimal to really notice.
Thargrim wrote: I really feel this box highlights why the card tiles in the initial boxed set were a good idea. They kept the price of the box at a reasonable level. The terrain in this set seriously bloats the cost and the built in discount is too minimal to really notice.
I think the Warcry starter box demonstrates that GW could sell this for $120 cheaper if they wanted to... but they don't want to.
Yodhrin wrote: Hopefully this time around the Helot and GSC gangs will be a bit better put together, rules-wise.
It's impossible to decipher what you mean by "put together," but in terms of functionality the GSC are currently one of the stronger gangs. I'd rank them 3rd after Van Saar and Goliath.
Familiars are the best credits you can spend in the game, getting free gangers from Settlements adds up to a ton of value over the course of a campaign, and a hip shooting web gun adept with a familiar is one of the strongest "single model" builds in the game (well, despite being two models... it still counts! pets are wargear)
The worst thing about them was the 1w champions, but that was more of an issue in the Gang War campaign; once Dominion became the default the problem of squishy champions vs. lost income over the course of a campaign mostly went away.
I hope one of those Dramatis Personae (Abomination of Badzone 12?) is a full-fledged genestealer.
H.B.M.C. wrote: I'd love it if the Genestealer Cult champs weren't glass cannons...
I agree with the "glass" part, but not so much the "cannon."
They don't have much going for them offensively... the basic "skilled Champion" BS 3+, and I guess S4 (which still sucks on a M4" profile).
Infiltrate is a good skill for alpha strikes.
With all the armour and defensive gear that has been introduced you can make them pretty durable. But, of course, you can do the same to every other Champion, and they'll still have 2 wounds.
I still think it's odd that many of these models haven't gotten 40k rules. Many of the people I've talked to would LOVE to have a unit of them attached to another army in a friendly game of 40k.
Tibs Ironblood wrote: Sticker shock is a thing and boy is it bad here. Also GW really needs to consolidate all these different rules into one place. It's almost as if an app where you could buy and store all rule sources into one area in a well laid out and clean format is a good idea.
I made that. Well, pdf, not app. I don't think GW is able/willing to do the same.
It would be a missed opportunity if they didn't make random changes to stats and costs.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
cuda1179 wrote: I still think it's odd that many of these models haven't gotten 40k rules. Many of the people I've talked to would LOVE to have a unit of them attached to another army in a friendly game of 40k.
If they already are fans of the 40k universe and like Necromunda models, it is madness that they don't simply play Necromunda!
All gangs could be used in 40k ca 15 years ago, but they were all reduced to a mediocre imperial guard unit almost without any options.
Altruizine wrote: I agree with the "glass" part, but not so much the "cannon."
Fair enough.
But it's like the GSC rules were written before they started giving multiple wounds to gang champs. They're all W1 and it's annoying.
I think that doofy statline came out of their weird obsession with keeping things uniform across different games. They looked at Acolytes in 40K and saw one wound, so that's what they gave them in Necromunda.
I've never done a detailed comparison myself (and quit 40K, so don't have the new GSC book) but my understanding was that all the Cult units in Necromunda had their 40K statlines transferred over exactly (with additions for the mental stats that don't exist in 40K).
Which would be an insane decision, if that's indeed what they were thinking. The only way to make sense of Necromunda statlines is to consider them relative to the setting, otherwise you get Van Saar meatshields who are equal marksmen to Astartes.
The possibilities are really intriguing. I’d love to see some Genestealer Delaque kitbashes (or Cawdor, with the mutations almost hidden by masks and rags).
I recall reading that the Genestealer upgrade heads fit on the Orlock models, and I'm sure I've seen people use them with Cawdor more than once as well as mix in some of the acolyte/neophyte bits considering you can hide the arm/body connections under the robes.
Looks like Corpse Grinder Cult got a new, unique compact versions of existing weapons. Chain glaive and heavy flamer only takes up a single weapon slot?
I suspect $150 would have gotten people quite excited.
As we've seen, doubling again just reasonably makes people go
At $150 I would have bought 3 to 4 sets. At $290 I'm buying none. For me it isn't a matter of affordability, it's a matter of principle. The pricing is veering into games console territory as someone earlier mentioned. At that price point the value proposition just isn't there.
Additionally, this puts me off from wanting to buy any GW products going forward. For decades I've become acclimated to the gradual price increases. Put a frog in water and slowly get it to boil and they don't notice. Throw them in a boiling pot... They're gonna feel the burn. GW just threw us in the boiling pot and I'm not liking the burn.
After 25 years of supporting GW, I think I may have reached my limit.
I am exactly in the same boat, always was ordering all the box sets, limited edition sets etc. but after seeing the price hikes for Blood of Phoenix (which i wanted but not at 230 as i have almost everything in the box, Feast of Bones... at 195 with same dull ogre poses and a price hike. Then this at $290, the terrain is so limited it isn't funny for a ZM board you would easily need 2-3 sets. In all honesty that terrain would be super easy to 3d print for pennies on the dollar.
GW has priced me out of their product at almost 20 years myself as well. I cannot justify the prices, and honestly feel foolish I have done so for so long looking back. Just as the OP stated i feel like I was getting boiled (great analogy) The pure fact of being in the USA and getting a almost 30 percent price over what europeans are paying when the pound plummitted is hard to look at, and most people still don't understand that GW makes their own conversion rate based off the price of the pound in the 90's. We should be able to be getting stuff at a steal that europeans get it yet can't even take advantage of the economic situation.
As I have been told, people will only treat you the way you let them. As a loyal customer, I am tired of the way GW treats us. My salary is already stretched with having a limited gaming budget and these prices and continual rises is enough for this plastic crack head to seek rehab.
I want to see the backside of those floor tiles. If GW is as smart as they have been with the terrain design, they'll have put holes on the backside of the tiles that the sector mechanicus supports can register into.
The new box has 12 pillars and 24” worth of wall. By comparison, One of each of the 8 old resin tiles would net you 84” of wall and 23 pillars. So a dark uprising box provides about the same number of pillars as 4 resin tiles, but only half the number of walls. Pillars aren’t that much different from 2” walls, so you could also view it as Dark Uprising having 48” of wall, and 8 resin tiles having 130” of wall. So if you had 2 boxes of Dark Uprising, you’d have less than 75% of the coverage of the old tiles.
This is discounting the value of the stairs, platforms, doorways, pipes, obstacles, etc.
Erren wrote: So if you had 2 boxes of Dark Uprising, you’d have less than 75% of the coverage of the old tiles.
Not to defend GW here, because screw them, but Dark Uprising is a Necromunda box set. There are Necromunda things in the box that you are paying for, such as dice, templates, models, rulebooks, tokens, and so on. The actual terrain, as released separately, will likely be cheaper. How much cheaper remains to be seen. To be on the safe side, bring extra lube and go to your happy place.
I suspect $150 would have gotten people quite excited.
As we've seen, doubling again just reasonably makes people go
At $150 I would have bought 3 to 4 sets. At $290 I'm buying none. For me it isn't a matter of affordability, it's a matter of principle. The pricing is veering into games console territory as someone earlier mentioned. At that price point the value proposition just isn't there.
Additionally, this puts me off from wanting to buy any GW products going forward. For decades I've become acclimated to the gradual price increases. Put a frog in water and slowly get it to boil and they don't notice. Throw them in a boiling pot... They're gonna feel the burn. GW just threw us in the boiling pot and I'm not liking the burn.
After 25 years of supporting GW, I think I may have reached my limit.
I am exactly in the same boat, always was ordering all the box sets, limited edition sets etc. but after seeing the price hikes for Blood of Phoenix (which i wanted but not at 230 as i have almost everything in the box, Feast of Bones... at 195 with same dull ogre poses and a price hike. Then this at $290, the terrain is so limited it isn't funny for a ZM board you would easily need 2-3 sets. In all honesty that terrain would be super easy to 3d print for pennies on the dollar.
GW has priced me out of their product at almost 20 years myself as well. I cannot justify the prices, and honestly feel foolish I have done so for so long looking back. Just as the OP stated i feel like I was getting boiled (great analogy) The pure fact of being in the USA and getting a almost 30 percent price over what europeans are paying when the pound plummitted is hard to look at, and most people still don't understand that GW makes their own conversion rate based off the price of the pound in the 90's. We should be able to be getting stuff at a steal that europeans get it yet can't even take advantage of the economic situation.
As I have been told, people will only treat you the way you let them. As a loyal customer, I am tired of the way GW treats us. My salary is already stretched with having a limited gaming budget and these prices and continual rises is enough for this plastic crack head to seek rehab.
Not that I'm 100% done with GW, but I'm certainly done chasing the new releases in the way I have for the past few years.
I've taken a step back, evaluated the piles of untouched plastic I have, started selling a bunch of it online and recouping some of those funds for whatever else I want that's not GW hobby related.
I got rid of all but one 40k army, and I have more kill team factions than I have realistic time to play with, and I sold most of my unbuilt Necromunda gangs. Im also debating whether or not to keep my unopened Warcry set.
But I still have more than enough models and terrain to play all these games without making another purchase if I want.
Part of my issue is that for quite awhile I've had enough disposable income to get whatever I've wanted and not cringe too much at the prices. But this is such a jump it's sort of snapped me out of that. So for me at least I now have a few thousand I've recouped from selling off stuff and still have a reasonable amount of models and terrain left to use. But I'm done with the blind consumption of whatever is new from GW.
Erren wrote: So if you had 2 boxes of Dark Uprising, you’d have less than 75% of the coverage of the old tiles.
Not to defend GW here, because screw them, but Dark Uprising is a Necromunda box set. There are Necromunda things in the box that you are paying for, such as dice, templates, models, rulebooks, tokens, and so on. The actual terrain, as released separately, will likely be cheaper. How much cheaper remains to be seen. To be on the safe side, bring extra lube and go to your happy place.
And from GW's website and the box contents we can make a good estimate of the retail cost of many of the components, and it's $271.99:
Enforcers .......................... $42 (price of every 10 man gang)
Corpse Grinder Cult.......... $60 (estimate because this is a 15 man unit rather than 10)
Gang Cards (2 set) .......... $30
Gang Dice (2 sets) ........... $30
Barricades & Objectives ... $35
Promethium Relay Pipes . $35
Digital Rulebook ............... $39.99 (cheapest way to buy the rules)
So adding $20 to that for 15 sprues of ZM terrain is a pretty good deal.
And from GW's website and the box contents we can make a good estimate of the retail cost of many of the components, and it's $271.99:
Enforcers .......................... $42 (price of every 10 man gang)
Corpse Grinder Cult.......... $60 (estimate because this is a 15 man unit rather than 10)
Gang Cards (2 set) .......... $30
Gang Dice (2 sets) ........... $30
Barricades & Objectives ... $35
Promethium Relay Pipes . $35
Digital Rulebook ............... $39.99 (cheapest way to buy the rules)
So adding $20 to that for 15 sprues of ZM terrain is a pretty good deal.
Let's use Underhive as the basis of out pricing instead:
What does Dark Uprising have that Underhive doesn't have? The plastic terrain and 10 more miniatures. So, that accounts for roughly $165 of this new box's price of $290. Got to be honest. I don't really feel like the value is there. And if this box is considered a discount... how much is the non-discounted version?!
GW has lost their freaking minds recently with regard to pricing, so I would be surprised if, in their diseased minds, the price of this box isn't based on whatever imaginary value increase they've decided to add to everything. So, you may think a box of Corpsegrinder Cult will be $42, but GW is going to charge $65. I mean, they are charging $35 for a sheet of decals and $15 for Zone Mortalis bases (which used to be $7).
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Obispudkenobi wrote: I have ordered four sets, was gonna just order two but I heard on the grapevine it's limited run like warcry was
I have never called another poster a "shill" before in my life, but looking through your (short) post history after seeing this comment... You just praise/defend GW, mock GW's competitors, and complain about GW's detractors. If you aren't a shill, I'm not really sure how your post history would be different if you were.
And from GW's website and the box contents we can make a good estimate of the retail cost of many of the components, and it's $271.99:
Enforcers .......................... $42 (price of every 10 man gang)
Corpse Grinder Cult.......... $60 (estimate because this is a 15 man unit rather than 10)
Gang Cards (2 set) .......... $30
Gang Dice (2 sets) ........... $30
Barricades & Objectives ... $35
Promethium Relay Pipes . $35
Digital Rulebook ............... $39.99 (cheapest way to buy the rules)
So adding $20 to that for 15 sprues of ZM terrain is a pretty good deal.
Let's use Underhive as the basis of out pricing instead:
What does Dark Uprising have that Underhive doesn't have? The plastic terrain and 10 more miniatures. So, that accounts for roughly $165 of this new box's price of $290. Got to be honest. I don't really feel like the value is there. And if this box is considered a discount... how much is the non-discounted version?!
GW has lost their freaking minds recently with regard to pricing, so I would be surprised if, in their diseased minds, the price of this box isn't based on whatever imaginary value increase they've decided to add to everything. So, you may think a box of Corpsegrinder Cult will be $42, but GW is going to charge $65. I mean, they are charging $35 for a sheet of decals and $15 for Zone Mortalis bases (which used to be $7).
And that's only *if* you actually want everything that's in there...
I wonder if this boxed set will end up being limited. It seems straight to have a limited edition starter box, but GW has done it before. Honestly if they just rerelease the original starter with these two gangs and this book and kept everything else the same (with a bit of a mark up for the extra models/ better rulebook....say 150 usd) I think it would be a lot more successful at getting new players to try it out.
And from GW's website and the box contents we can make a good estimate of the retail cost of many of the components, and it's $271.99:
Enforcers .......................... $42 (price of every 10 man gang)
Corpse Grinder Cult.......... $60 (estimate because this is a 15 man unit rather than 10)
Gang Cards (2 set) .......... $30
Gang Dice (2 sets) ........... $30
Barricades & Objectives ... $35
Promethium Relay Pipes . $35
Digital Rulebook ............... $39.99 (cheapest way to buy the rules)
So adding $20 to that for 15 sprues of ZM terrain is a pretty good deal.
Let's use Underhive as the basis of out pricing instead:
The original box is heavily discounted over the individual parts; at around $254 to buy the components individually:
Escher Gang .............. $42
Goliath Gang ............. $42
Gang Cards (2 set) ....... $30
Gang Dice (2 sets) ....... $30
Doors & Bulkheads ........ $35
Barricades & Objectives .. $35
Digital Rulebook ......... $39.99
What does Dark Uprising have that Underhive doesn't have? The plastic terrain and 10 more miniatures. So, that accounts for roughly $165 of this new box's price of $290. Got to be honest. I don't really feel like the value is there. And if this box is considered a discount... how much is the non-discounted version?!
Actually I said $60 for the corpse grinder cult. And I wouldn't be surprised if 1/2 of the terrain is in the $100 range.
But no real point in discussing this; the price is what it is. and really talking about it does absolutely nothing to change that.
Also included is a 128-page softback rulebook containing:
– Background on the rebellions that bubble under the surface of Necromunda and details of the fall of Hive Arcos
– The rules for playing games of Necromunda
– The Uprising Campaign – a complete narrative campaign featuring the desperate decline of a Hive
– Multiple scenarios that capture the feel of a Hive descending into lawlessness
– Rules for creating your own Enforcer Patrol or Corpse Grinder Cult gang
– Rules for all of the weapons and wargear available to gangs and fighters through their House Equipment lists
– Full list of all of the skills available to fighters
I don't know if there's stuff outside of their "House Equipment lists" that these guys would get, but that's what it says.
Erren wrote: So if you had 2 boxes of Dark Uprising, you’d have less than 75% of the coverage of the old tiles.
Not to defend GW here, because screw them, but Dark Uprising is a Necromunda box set. There are Necromunda things in the box that you are paying for, such as dice, templates, models, rulebooks, tokens, and so on. The actual terrain, as released separately, will likely be cheaper. How much cheaper remains to be seen. To be on the safe side, bring extra lube and go to your happy place.
And from GW's website and the box contents we can make a good estimate of the retail cost of many of the components, and it's $271.99:
Enforcers .......................... $42 (price of every 10 man gang)
Corpse Grinder Cult.......... $60 (estimate because this is a 15 man unit rather than 10)
Gang Cards (2 set) .......... $30
Gang Dice (2 sets) ........... $30
Barricades & Objectives ... $35
Promethium Relay Pipes . $35
Digital Rulebook ............... $39.99 (cheapest way to buy the rules)
So adding $20 to that for 15 sprues of ZM terrain is a pretty good deal.
Keep in mind you are getting HALF of a box of barricades, and HALF of a box of Plasma conduits...so drop $35 from that estimate.
Also, the new campaign rules are locked behind this limited release box, the Book of Ruin does not contain the new campaign rules, just a few follow-on/thematically related scenarios...
Also, the new campaign rules are locked behind this limited release box, the Book of Ruin does not contain the new campaign rules, just a few follow-on/thematically related scenarios...
I don't know about this part. Going off this:
Book of Ruin wrote:The book also includes six alternate Uprising Campaigns and a whole suite of arbitrator tools to help with the running of a campaign and ways of enhancing individual scenarios.
Spoiler:
vs
Spoiler:
The missions are in Book of Ruin and Dark Uprising. It looks like the only difference is that they're not 'curated' like they are for Dark Uprising?
There's 25 pages of 'Campaign' stuff in Dark Uprising under "Dark Uprising Campaign" versus 4 pages in Book of Ruin...would that be about the difference for explanatory stuff in a starter set?
As someone that owns a good 3d printer, it would take you at least a week of solid printing to get a low quality approximation of all the terrain in this set and likely 4 or 5 spools of filament, each spool coating about 20-40 dollars depending on the printer. It would take a month of swapping out parts, getting them off the build plates, queuing up new parts, and still would end up costing over a hundred dollars plus the cost of the printer.
And you'll still see lines and steps on the final print, unless you go resin, which will take even longer, require more set up and tear down, and be much more brittle.
I cant wait for GW to release the terrain sets separately and see the sudden rush to buy the box set for the terrain deal alone.
that's a solid game, but why did they have to make a whole new one over it? Great batch of new stuff, but as a holiday, its going to be tight belts and ramyon crafted into Christmas this year...
Still not a fan of the price!
Automatically Appended Next Post: Has there been any word on the additional figures for the three books yet, or the Juve mini's?
Looking at the NZ peorders, I note the Underhive box also remains available for the moment. Also, the Dark Uprising box is indeed nearly three times the price of Underhive - ouch!
Also, the new campaign rules are locked behind this limited release box, the Book of Ruin does not contain the new campaign rules, just a few follow-on/thematically related scenarios...
I don't know about this part. Going off this:
Book of Ruin wrote:The book also includes six alternate Uprising Campaigns and a whole suite of arbitrator tools to help with the running of a campaign and ways of enhancing individual scenarios.
Spoiler:
vs
Spoiler:
The missions are in Book of Ruin and Dark Uprising. It looks like the only difference is that they're not 'curated' like they are for Dark Uprising?
There's 25 pages of 'Campaign' stuff in Dark Uprising under "Dark Uprising Campaign" versus 4 pages in Book of Ruin...would that be about the difference for explanatory stuff in a starter set?
Yeah, looks like the scenarios/missions are duplicated, but the main uprising campaign rules aren't there...and then there's supplemental campaign stuff (alternate ways to run the one in the big box), and some arbitrator stuff in the book of ruin. These books were designed (in my understanding) to work together...book of ruin supplementing the uprising book.
My problem is I don't want to buy the rules for a THIRD time...I get they have to be in there because it's being sold as a starter....It just bothers me that there is a paywall to get the campaign rules....maybe its just the principle of the thing I have a problem with.
Still really torn on this one as want the scenery to add more variation to my existing pile of Necromunda scenery and interested in the Enforcers and cultists so was planning on two sets and have already complete enough extra overtime to offset the cost. However, the price is still off putting but I can see why it costs that much due to the large number of terrain sprues which unfortunately does not create a large amount of terrain due to how boxy it is. It’s not as if I don’t already have five years worth of miniature painting backlog.
Aeneades wrote: ... It’s not as if I don’t already have five years worth of miniature painting backlog.
I feel you, I REALLY want this terrain, and kinda want the two gangs (don't have any enforcers yet), and I want the campaign rules....I just can't drop that kinda money on this this time of year and expect to stay happily married. If it was just me, Id would live on Ramen for a month to make up for it...but then again, I've been in this hobby for about 30 years...and if I stopped buying now, my backlog still wouldn't get finished before I died...might be time to start culling the herd...maybe then I can justify this expense.
The 5 year backlog was on the basis I actually somehow find the time to actually paint but given that I have painted 13 models so far this year my backlog is actually at around 300 years. I think it’s time to start selling off a few bits for space and my sanity...
November is one of the best months for me to actually buy stuff as it’s the only time of year I get overtime. Even if it was only 15% cheaper it would have been a much easier decision.
Yeah, the sticker shock on this really is significant. I see a number of posters noting that if you add up all the components it seems like a ‘good deal’. However the real test for me is the comparison (using UK £ equivalent) in NZ pricing:
Necromunda core set = £90
Dark Uprising = £290
Given both have rules, counters etc, an extra 10 minis and half a board of terrain doesn’t feel like an extra £200 of value to me.
Yeah, looks like the scenarios/missions are duplicated, but the main uprising campaign rules aren't there...and then there's supplemental campaign stuff (alternate ways to run the one in the big box), and some arbitrator stuff in the book of ruin. These books were designed (in my understanding) to work together...book of ruin supplementing the uprising book.
My problem is I don't want to buy the rules for a THIRD time...I get they have to be in there because it's being sold as a starter....It just bothers me that there is a paywall to get the campaign rules....maybe its just the principle of the thing I have a problem with.
It looks like the stuff has a possibility of being present in The Book of Ruins under "Uprising Campaign Events".
I really don't know one way or the other, just looking at page counts for comparison. It really does look like a big chunk of Dark Uprising's stuff might just be an intro to running campaigns.
Yes, I think the big problem here is that the terrain was designed in such a way that it takes a very large number of big sprues to make a relatively small amount of very blocky and fairly uninteresting terrain. The same number of sprues of other terrain sets for that price would probably seem pretty good, but the resulting terrain would look a lot better and more useful.
I dropped by my local GW and had a talk with the manager about the set when no one else was in the store. He basically acknowledged that Blood of The Phoenix and this Necromunda set are hard to justify price wise.
Also said as much as he could to confirm that the ZM stuff will be available separately early next year and that the Necromunda set will be a limited run like the Adeptus Titanicus set. That said, he did not want expect the Necromunda set to move quickly like the AT set did.
The new dice are nice looking (and probably have the best contrast of any of the supplemental dice released since the yellow + black sets in the first starter).
And that's only *if* you actually want everything that's in there...
Duh no kidding stating the obvious. Gw discount boxes have always been discount boxes if you want all. Those who don't gets to buy just terrain for say 90% of this. No surprise there. That was known before anything was revealed about the box
All i did was make a cleaned up version of the logos and graphics from the regimental standard article. I made these for myself but figured it would be fun to put them out there for other people.
I'll skip the box, there's way too much stuff in it I don't need. But hopefully there's some boxes next year that are just stacks of bulkheads and walls with nothing superfluous like the pipes sprues in it.
The terrain looks amazing yet a bit… boring the more you look at it. Besides I imagine necromunda terrain quite diferent. I think from all this release the only thing tempting me is the floor tiles since those are a pain to scratchbuilt without too many hours and sweat involved.
So its 4 in a box for 40gbp correct? whats the size?
You know... the more I look at the retail box images, the more they remind me to another game: The old Mantic's Deadzone starter. Only that came with a neoprene mat, of course, and costed about 60 euros...
Albertorius wrote: You know... the more I look at the retail box images, the more they remind me to another game: The old Mantic's Deadzone starter. Only that came with a neoprene mat, of course, and costed about 60 euros...
NAVARRO wrote: The terrain looks amazing yet a bit… boring the more you look at it. Besides I imagine necromunda terrain quite diferent. I think from all this release the only thing tempting me is the floor tiles since those are a pain to scratchbuilt without too many hours and sweat involved.
So its 4 in a box for 40gbp correct? whats the size?
I believe each is 1’ square, so I think you’ll need...erm.....maths is hard hungover.....6 for 6x4 board.
The tiles set is very disappointing, seeing as it's four copies of the same tile. 16 of them for a full 4'x4' table will get stale, fast, not even taking into account the fact that they will cost €220 by their lonesome.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Plus they will clatter like mad when you roll dice on them, things will slide on them. They just sound like an awful buy as a flat gaming surface.
If they're the same thickness as the Sector Mechanicus walkways though... different story.
I have to be honest... they don't look like such a great idea, TBH. There's a reason why neoprene mats are a thing, nowadays. Plus, you buy to boxes of Necromunda: Underhive, you have enough cardboard tiles for a full table, for €10 less, and you also get two 20-man gangs, two sets of dice, two rulebooks...
H.B.M.C. wrote: Plus they will clatter like mad when you roll dice on them, things will slide on them. They just sound like an awful buy as a flat gaming surface.
If they're the same thickness as the Sector Mechanicus walkways though... different story.
From the webstore's lone side image they don't seem particularly thick and may well be usable as upper floors.
Best thing for me is that they seem generic sci-fi industrial in appearance and look like they can easily be used outside of 40k. That definitely adds value in in my book.
Kanluwen wrote: Wow, did he also say plastic Sisters were coming too?
Not sure why you feel the need to be so snarky. Its not like I was passing along inside info, more that even GW staff don't try to pretend the pricing is "a deal".
Also while you may think it would be obvious that the terrain is coming out separately later, we never saw the Sector Fronteris terrain separately and that sold out before most people could buy it.
Just a bit of confirmation people don't need to rush out and buy an overpriced set if they just want the terrain. It will be available separately next year.
The new Uprising campaign is yet another "reskin" of the Dominion campaign, similarly to how Law & Misrule shared many of the same concepts/structures.
Looking through some of the sneak peak previews of the rules, looks like it's going to b 3 phases like the other campaigns: 1. Insurrection phase 2. Downtime 3. Damnation phase
It will use a new set of territories, similar to Territories/Rackets from existing campaigns. This new territory resource can be "Ruined" during the campaign, giving different rewards. Fighters can gain a new Starvation condition which, if applicable, probably reduces the fighter in some way (reduced actions? reduced stats? miss next battle?). This can be fixed by giving fighters Meat portions. There will be some Scavenging mechanics, possibly a number of D6 rolls rewarded by scenarios.
The alternative variants lists additional triumphs, so we will most likely have a new set of triumphs for this campaign too.
All in all, looks like much of the same we've seen before, with some new tweaks and contents added on top.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Plus they will clatter like mad when you roll dice on them, things will slide on them. They just sound like an awful buy as a flat gaming surface.
If they're the same thickness as the Sector Mechanicus walkways though... different story.
From the webstore's lone side image they don't seem particularly thick and may well be usable as upper floors.
Best thing for me is that they seem generic sci-fi industrial in appearance and look like they can easily be used outside of 40k. That definitely adds value in in my book.
Good as a starting point for displays, photoshoots, other systems any scale etc…
And that's only *if* you actually want everything that's in there...
Duh no kidding stating the obvious. Gw discount boxes have always been discount boxes if you want all. Those who don't gets to buy just terrain for say 90% of this. No surprise there. That was known before anything was revealed about the box
Well, yes and no. Over the years, starter sets have often been priced in such a way that if you were interested in one of the factions (plus rules an accessories), they're already good value. Amazing value if you split the set, or want both sides anyway. Just like the Start Collecting boxes are/were comparatively so cheap, that if you were interested in just over half the contents, you might as well buy that box because just over half the contents would cost just as much when bought seperately. The real question for this set is what price to calculate for the terrain. I think it's actually not at all bad as far as table coverage goes, but on closer inspection the design of the walls (nice arches) isn't quite what I'd like for the setting. With some but limited interest in the gangs and no need for part 12(?) in the extensive series of Necromunda books (in this edition that is, and not counting WD articles), this box certainly isn't for me, let alone at that price.
I'm really happy to know that this includes the Enforcers Tactics Cards.
Are they the same ones as the set sold separately? With Underhive, the gang tactics in the box were different than the Escher and Goliath card packs. If I remember correctly, they only had a few Escher/Goliath gang-specific cards in the box (like 2 or 3, with 15 in the card packs), but I think the Enforcer tactics cards only include 4 Enforcer-specific cards in the first place...
Edit: Underhive has 4 Goliath cards (20 neutral), Goliath pack has 8 cards (12 neutral), and Enforcers have 4 Enforcer-specific tactics (16 neutral).
Just had a glance out of curiousity and they're down to 71. So someone's buying them.
Obispudkenobi said he is getting 4. I wonder how many unique customers they have and how many are whales picking up multiples due to FOMO and desire to immediately fill out a ZM table...
I'm really happy to know that this includes the Enforcers Tactics Cards.
Are they the same ones as the set sold separately? With Underhive, the gang tactics in the box were different than the Escher and Goliath card packs. If I remember correctly, they only had a few Escher/Goliath gang-specific cards in the box (like 2 or 3, with 15 in the card packs), but I think the Enforcer tactics cards only include 4 Enforcer-specific cards in the first place...
Edit: Underhive has 4 Goliath cards (20 neutral), Goliath pack has 8 cards (12 neutral), and Enforcers have 4 Enforcer-specific tactics (16 neutral).
In the video from GMG, they definitely said "ENFORCERS TACTICS" at the bottom. There was a set of Slaughter-Cult and Enforcers cards in one bundle that also had Settlements.
Just had a glance out of curiousity and they're down to 71. So someone's buying them.
Obispudkenobi said he is getting 4. I wonder how many unique customers they have and how many are whales picking up multiples due to FOMO and desire to immediately fill out a ZM table...
It's not helped by people calling it "limited edition" now. There's going to be the people buying it to split it out at extortionate prices too.
Damn, Aussies get hit pretty hard, i was thinking it would be around 370-380AUD based on similar priced boxsets in GBP and USD
Silly me and the "GW Tax", should have looked at the AT - Grandmaster edition
In the video from GMG, they definitely said "ENFORCERS TACTICS" at the bottom. There was a set of Slaughter-Cult and Enforcers cards in one bundle that also had Settlements.
The gang-specific cards all say something like that one the bottom (or gang tactics for the neutral cards). I went and found a list of the 4 Enforcer cards from the separate pack and they are different (or at least, have different names) than the cards in Dark Uprising, so it is unique content.
Dark Uprising
- Lockdown
- Appropriate Force
- Stop and Search
- Shock and Awe
- Excellent Reconnaissance
- Extra Vest
- Ankle Holster
- "Don't Trip"
Enforcer Tactics Card Pack
- Hard Stop
- Preemptive Measures
- Swift Justice
- Informant
It's not helped by people calling it "limited edition" now. There's going to be the people buying it to split it out at extortionate prices too.
The FOMO anxiety is very real in this hobby (spurred on deliberately by GW, who only prints 10 copies of everything people want), mixed with an addiction that requires justifying $290 for something you don't need, well, people are going to think and say whatever they can to make it seem like this box isn't cynical exploitation.
I'm really happy to know that this includes the Enforcers Tactics Cards.
Are they the same ones as the set sold separately? With Underhive, the gang tactics in the box were different than the Escher and Goliath card packs. If I remember correctly, they only had a few Escher/Goliath gang-specific cards in the box (like 2 or 3, with 15 in the card packs), but I think the Enforcer tactics cards only include 4 Enforcer-specific cards in the first place...
Edit: Underhive has 4 Goliath cards (20 neutral), Goliath pack has 8 cards (12 neutral), and Enforcers have 4 Enforcer-specific tactics (16 neutral).
Just had a glance out of curiousity and they're down to 71. So someone's buying them.
Obispudkenobi said he is getting 4. I wonder how many unique customers they have and how many are whales picking up multiples due to FOMO and desire to immediately fill out a ZM table...
In the GMG video, there are 7 tactics cards each for Enforcers and Corpse Grinders, so looks like Enforcers now have 3 extra cards that weren't released before?
Edit: nevermind, looks like Sqorgar already answered this in more detail while I was writing this post!
Doesn’t seem to be selling all that well from the GW site. First 3000 orders get a free key ring, and they’re still offering them now if you stick Dark Uprising in your cart. No surprise really, I was in for 2 until I saw the price, now I’ve bought none.
Albertorius wrote: You know... the more I look at the retail box images, the more they remind me to another game: The old Mantic's Deadzone starter. Only that came with a neoprene mat, of course, and costed about 60 euros...
I backed that Kickstarter, got myself a total of 4 mats. Those mats are awesome.
The terrain is good as well, though you never have enough connectors. If you're buying Mantic terrain, get a pack (or 2) of extra connectors.
phillv85 wrote: Doesn’t seem to be selling all that well from the GW site. First 3000 orders get a free key ring, and they’re still offering them now if you stick Dark Uprising in your cart. No surprise really, I was in for 2 until I saw the price, now I’ve bought none.
Yep. I was impressed by the first leaks, but.... I half didn't want to believe the price rumors, but with it right there in the storefront, its just too much absurdity to swallow.
Might buy the bases for a project, though.
jeff white wrote: I might have to see New Zealand someday,
take some models with me, in boxes, new.
Stand outside the GW store in a trench coat.
With a baby carriage.
Well, I decided I wasn't going to pick up the box because of the cost, but did want to start with Necromunda with these gangs.
I found a copy of Underhive on Ebay for 80 USD with free shipping.
Found a couple preorders from the UK for the Enforcers, The Dark Uprising Rulebook and Token Sheet for a combined 80 USD.
Now I'm just waiting for someone to parse up a box on EBAY in the US and put the Corpse Grinders up. It looks like I will end up spending about 200 instead of 290, and while I won't get the terrain (which is fine because I like the tiles and how easy they are to transport), I will have two more gangs ready to play If I decide to pick up the Gangs of the Underhive book.
Albertorius wrote: You know... the more I look at the retail box images, the more they remind me to another game: The old Mantic's Deadzone starter. Only that came with a neoprene mat, of course, and costed about 60 euros...
I backed that Kickstarter, got myself a total of 4 mats. Those mats are awesome.
The terrain is good as well, though you never have enough connectors. If you're buying Mantic terrain, get a pack (or 2) of extra connectors.
Oh, i might have some already
Spoiler:
Might as well get back to it and finish painting the damn thing...
Albertorius wrote: You know... the more I look at the retail box images, the more they remind me to another game: The old Mantic's Deadzone starter. Only that came with a neoprene mat, of course, and costed about 60 euros...
I backed that Kickstarter, got myself a total of 4 mats. Those mats are awesome.
The terrain is good as well, though you never have enough connectors. If you're buying Mantic terrain, get a pack (or 2) of extra connectors.
Oh, i might have some already
Spoiler:
Might as well get back to it and finish painting the damn thing...
I must say, that is a mighty fine table.Doesn't look like you need any more terrain!
I really was thinking about the Box until I saw the price
And if this is a discounted box, the Terrain will be more expensive on its own, so not really an option for me either
Might as well get back to it and finish painting the damn thing...
It already looks good without paint (except for the Pringles), so just using tape/stencils (maybe salt) and 2-3 different coloured sprays would be enough
The Ruined City Set from Mantic (90$ /€ on Amazon) looks like a much better deal at the moment to get enough Terrain on the table
kodos wrote: I really was thinking about the Box until I saw the price
And if this is a discounted box, the Terrain will be more expensive on its own, so not really an option for me either
Might as well get back to it and finish painting the damn thing...
It already looks good without paint (except for the Pringles), so just using tape/stencils (maybe salt) and 2-3 different coloured sprays would be enough
The Ruined City Set from Mantic (90$ /€ on Amazon) looks like a much better deal at the moment to get enough Terrain on the table
Gang Warzone is also available if you don't want ruined buildings. 80 USD direct from Mantic, probably cheaper elsewhere. Ruined City at 90 bucks is amazing.
Note this stuff is both modular and can be disassembled if you don't glue it together.
Edit: Gang Warzone is 43 USD on amazon.com
Edit(2): And then I realized I could order 2 Ruined Cities off Amazon, plus shipping and estimated import fees, for less than the new Necromunda box. I'll be building Mantic terrain over Christmas.
kodos wrote: I really was thinking about the Box until I saw the price
And if this is a discounted box, the Terrain will be more expensive on its own, so not really an option for me either
Might as well get back to it and finish painting the damn thing...
It already looks good without paint (except for the Pringles), so just using tape/stencils (maybe salt) and 2-3 different coloured sprays would be enough
The Ruined City Set from Mantic (90$ /€ on Amazon) looks like a much better deal at the moment to get enough Terrain on the table
Gang Warzone is also available if you don't want ruined buildings. 80 USD direct from Mantic, probably cheaper elsewhere. Ruined City at 90 bucks is amazing.
Note this stuff is both modular and can be disassembled if you don't glue it together.
Edit: Gang Warzone is 43 USD on amazon.com
Indeed: I've glued some stuff, but a lot is modular, so that I can change the layout of the table, and it works great (although most I've done it so that I don't need connectors for it).
Edit(2): And then I realized I could order 2 Ruined Cities off Amazon, plus shipping and estimated import fees, for less than the new Necromunda box. I'll be building Mantic terrain over Christmas.
I don't really need it... but I kind of wanna. That's a feth ton of very cool scenery, right there.
I don't really need it... but I kind of wanna. That's a feth ton of very cool scenery, right there.
Each ruined city is going to fill a 2x4' play area pretty easily. If you really want to go vertical it's a lot less, but I didn't go that tall with the stuff I got off the Kickstarter. I prefer discrete buildings over warrens and gantries, so this should basically have me sorted for urban terrain going forward. Now I'm sort of regretting the boxes of Kill Team that I bought, but at least that stuff wasn't as outrageously priced as the Zone Mortalis is.
Yeah.. I think I finished assembling all my Mantic stuff (and i've gone up as much as four floors), but I still have a couple of mechanicus boxes from last christmas specials...
Edit: Gang Warzone is 43 USD on amazon.com
Edit(2): And then I realized I could order 2 Ruined Cities off Amazon, plus shipping and estimated import fees, for less than the new Necromunda box. I'll be building Mantic terrain over Christmas.
I have just ordered another Gang War Zone and a Box Red Bricks/Mars Attacks Scenery from Amazon
Indeed: I've glued some stuff, but a lot is modular, so that I can change the layout of the table, and it works great (although most I've done it so that I don't need connectors for it).
Me too, I have glued some basic elements and use connectors only to combine those on the table
Each ruined city is going to fill a 2x4' play area pretty easily. If you really want to go vertical it's a lot less, but I didn't go that tall with the stuff I got off the Kickstarter.
I have seen a tutorial (not able to find it now) were they used (hard?) foam cubes, pressed some of the more flat walls from the Mantic sets against the side to add the texture and used them as base for the solid lower levels
With the cards being leaked in the youtube review, we currently have a total of 204 Tactics cards. The total for all cards (of any type) is 386. Anybody want more cards in the future?
You know what I'd like even more than that? If they just put all the sodding rules into the rulebooks. All these cards and cards and more cards, and it could have been a single page per-pack if they were laid out in a normal format.
And it's so mental to me that they insist on doing them as unwieldy cards...then don't even bother to keep them in stock. Most of the people I've run into who play the new version now just pirate them, even the ones they did have the opportunity to buy, because why reward GW for such completely back-asswards setups?
It's not like it's hard to come up with reasonable approaches either. One, put all the rules into the books themselves, keep the cards limited, and market them as a "nice to have" play aid; given the quantities they bother to make they'd still sell out. Two, continue to do the cards for everything, but actually keep them in stock. Three, continue to do the cards for everything, then put them out in digital format when the initial print run sells through. The last one doesn't even require any effort on their part, they could have an intern upload the print layout PDF during their lunchbreak.
This isn't some minor bugbear that only online grogs care about either, I've run into a couple of people - prime buy-anything-GW type customers - now who're hesitant to get into Necromunda because they see the even-worse-than-usual proofing/editing and the vanishing accessories-you-actually-kinda-need as indicative that GW are half arsing the game and might drop it. And even though that's probably not a correct perception, it's one that's hard to counter on the actual evidence.
This is GW. They make the cards some absurd size that nobody makes card sleeves for, then take two years to actually release their own card sleeves AFTER all the cards are all out of print.
(Card sleeves are the pocket protectors of the gaming world, but by golly, I insist).
Blood of the Phoenix isn't when GW lost their minds, it's just when it stopped being funny.
the only fighters that can take pistols – the rest of the gang can only take close combat weapons. T
well, rip this gang.
Its the curse of Khorne for most of the last couple decades, barring the weird cannon bike/chariot thing. Don't know where 'Khorne cares not from whence the blood flows' went, but the overwhelming 'Khorne worshippers must be axe murderers only' is ridiculously absurd and makes the armies/forces/gangs so amazingly one dimensional.
Yodhrin wrote: You know what I'd like even more than that? If they just put all the sodding rules into the rulebooks. All these cards and cards and more cards, and it could have been a single page per-pack if they were laid out in a normal format.
And it's so mental to me that they insist on doing them as unwieldy cards...then don't even bother to keep them in stock. Most of the people I've run into who play the new version now just pirate them, even the ones they did have the opportunity to buy, because why reward GW for such completely back-asswards setups?
The card format actually suits the way those abilities work.
They're hidden information, and generated pre-game (often randomly), so they're not really suitable for rulebook tables in the same way something like 40K stratagems are (open information, voluntarily selected in-game).
Yeah, I mean, this Gang literally can't get any ranged weapons. I can only imagine how many pieces of the gang will be left the minute they go against a Van Saar gang.
Crazyterran wrote: Yeah, I mean, this Gang literally can't get any ranged weapons. I can only imagine how many pieces of the gang will be left the minute they go against a Van Saar gang.
A lot of missions don't put you in the greatest position like a game of Warhammer 40k. There's a LOT of missions where a VS gang is going to get erased by the Corpse Grinders.
Bob Lorgar wrote: What exactly do you need the cards for, anyway? Do they have information that's just not found in any of the books?
Reading through the rest of the thread, it sounds like you do. Boy is that stupid.
The cards are mostly gang tactics cards, which you either pick a few or get a few randomly at the start of each scenario. They can do everything from healing a wound during a game, to slamming a door shut at an inopportune moment, to allowing your gang to escape if things suddenly start going bad, to setting fire to an entire mortalis tile and burning everything in it.
They are versatile and 100% not printed anywhere else in any book or supplement GW has printed.
The are a few other cards, like profile cards for Special Characters and territory cards that aren't strictly necessary, but sure are useful. Those do exist in the books.
The latest boxsets are ridiculously priced, especially this one. This bodes not well for the Sisters of Battle release.
Where I am amazed by is the fact that even this new Necromunda box sells. Why don't people for once vote with their wallets, just this single box, to make it clear that these prices are ridiculous. IKt is not like this is a box which has only exclusive otems, and do you really need those new gangs and scenery now?
If this box sells very few copies, GW might actually be rethinking their pricing strategy. But if people keep buying these things, GW will just raise the price some more to see how far they can go.
I used to buy most boxsets because they actually were reasonably priced ,for GW standards, but they lost me with Blood of the Phoenix and seeing this new Necromunda release, I doubt things will improve soon.
If this box sells very few copies, GW might actually be rethinking their pricing strategy.
No, they will think that there is not much interest in Necromunda any more and will increase the prices so that they get the same profit with less sales
If this box sells very few copies, GW might actually be rethinking their pricing strategy.
No, they will think that there is not much interest in Necromunda any more and will increase the prices so that they get the same profit with less sales
Considering it's dropped down to 29 copies from a 140 odd from element games since yesterday, not much chance of that happening.
Looking the unbox vids it looks like its just an overload of terrain sprues… Personally I would prefered 6 factions in the box and then a separate necro terrain box just like the tiles.
Where I am amazed by is the fact that even this new Necromunda box sells. Why don't people for once vote with their wallet
They are voting with their wallet, those who see something they want are voting with their wallet. I've spent way more than that on 40k and AOS armies in the past, if I thought I'd actually get to play necromunda regularly I'd be buying that box.
That is far too expensive. It is a 2 player game, for that price I could buy 4 high quality boardgames that play 2-6 players and require less time and effort to get ready to play.
GW don't have the hobby monopoly they once had, they may be a big fish in their pond, but things like this just come across as a cash grab... no doubt those who have drank the GW kool aid will lap it up, which means that GW will think it is fine to sell at this price.
When I was staff I could buy the 3rd edition Dark Eldar jetbike sprue for 6p... and GW still made a profit on that.
How much do people spend on just 1 side of a 40k and AOS game though, a 2000pt army is often much more than £175 and you only have 1 army with no rules nor terrain nor the 2nd side etc.
I just got back from a local games shop selling masses of board games, there are some in their for well over £100, and then expansions for around £100 as well. Many board games are £80 odd. People will pay a fair amount for a game. Some people will not. They are all voting with their wallets so to speak.
Do I think it this is expensive, yes it is too expensive for me given I don't see that I'd ever play more than 1 or 2 games anyway. The same with the adeptus titanicus game; that looked nice but as I wouldn't expect to find many players where I am then not worth it to me, but it sold like hot cakes.
The point was about the prior posters comment on voting with their wallet; people already are - some with a no and some with a yes. That poster seems confused by the notion of value being personally subjective and others may vote in a way they wouldn't.
puree wrote: How much do people spend on just 1 side of a 40k and AOS game though, a 2000pt army is often much more than £175 and you only have 1 army with no rules nor terrain nor the 2nd side etc.
I think there are different kinds of GW customers. I think there are people who build a complete 2,000 pt army, but I think there are also what I call "event buyers". They like the big box releases. Starter sets, army boxes, battleforces, boardgames (like Warhammer Quest), and so on. I think it is probably rare for them to buy an individual box of miniatures, and instead choose big, individual bulk purchases.
I'm one of those (well, I was - those boxes are the ones hit the hardest by GW's insanity, starting with Warhammer Quest's expansions). I don't have a 2,000pt army of anything. But I have small armies for a dozen different factions in multiple games (including stuff like Adeptus Titanicus, Middle Earth SBG, and so on), all built from those two army boxes, starter sets, and what have you. I can play pretty much any faction in Kill Team or Warcry, but I can not play a single tournament level game of 40k or AoS.
They are all voting with their wallets so to speak.
Necromunda is one of my favorite games (even though I don't really play it). I just love the lore, the models, the rules, the terrain - basically everything. I want to support Necromunda. In fact, I'd rather support Necromunda than almost anything else GW makes. I felt fine about skipping Phoenix and the Ossiarch/Ogor boxes (which I almost certainly would've bought at $150 each). But I'm actually conflicted on this box. Not because I want to spend $300, but because this could be a big chance for Necromunda to get some actual support - the last GW survey, the main thing I asked for was for them to dedicate more resources towards Necromunda (plastics). And here, they have, but at a premium cost.
So, I'm conflicted, frustrated, and angry. I want to protest the price, but I don't also want to protest Necromunda. I honestly haven't even decided whether I'm getting Dark Uprising or not. I know I'll feel terrible allowing myself to be so openly exploited, but I also know that Necromunda and Warcry are the only GW games that I actually like and want more of.
If I'm going to vote with my wallet, I'm just going to stop buying everything GW makes EXCEPT Necromunda (and Warcry)... Actually, that might not be a terrible plan...
Well, great for you. For that kind of money, I'd rather get a full new computer, or like another four Anycubic Photons... but that's just me, of course.
They will always be a core of the "special" customers that GW loves, that still makes this boxset way overpriced.
Saying that I have got to hand it to GW making £145 per boxset profit is impressive and should help prop the financials up for another 6 months against last years figures.
Hey pals, if you can't afford to get into a full wargame like 40k, why not start with a cheaper skirmish game that only needs 10 figures per side... oh wait... #sigh
If people don't buy it, GW will just increase prices so the same amount of profit can be made from less sales. They've been doing that since the LotR bubble burst at the time the country went into recession.
As for these days... GW can charge as much as they want as the whales will purchase them due to FOMO and GW's low production runs.
Albertorius wrote: Well, great for you. For that kind of money, I'd rather get a full new computer, or like another four Anycubic Photons... but that's just me, of course.
Gimgamgoo wrote: Hey pals, if you can't afford to get into a full wargame like 40k, why not start with a cheaper skirmish game that only needs 10 figures per side... oh wait... #sigh
If people don't buy it, GW will just increase prices so the same amount of profit can be made from less sales. They've been doing that since the LotR bubble burst at the time the country went into recession.
As for these days... GW can charge as much as they want as the whales will purchase them due to FOMO and GW's low production runs.
Second hand Market, and E bay. Seriously kids. You get stuff after the hype man has left, and also you can get the deals and steals without the fuss of paying GW steep pricing.
Back on topic-
I really love the way this scenery interlinks with the other stuff, and am really having a hard time not justifying putting together a solid specific table of a Industrial zone, with 1X1 tile based scenery along with catwalks, stairs, and chained dangling platforms....
I think we can all agree that the price is steep. So what, this is GW. Lets get past that and get to the conversation on the gangs in the box... I mean, Damn. I knew that they were going to be impressive... I never in my wildest thoughts would have thought that these Cultists would be this top notch. Lets talk more about their weapons options- Has anyone thought to use more of the AOS Khorne figures for this one? adding them in alongside the gang, you can have the additional options of chain weapons and basic blades and variety in there.
The scenery itself alone is a modelers dream. Is there word when the scenery sets themselves are going to be sold individually? I'd really like to get 3 or 4 more.
Yes, the price is steep. I personally don't think it's worth it, but again, I think the terrain is very overpriced for what it is.
What I ended up doing was ordered a copy of Underhive for 80 USD new on Ebay, and then preordered the two new gangs and rules from the boxed set for about 110 USD total. Which gives me a starter that 100 bucks cheaper and two extra gangs to play with when I pick up the Gangs of the Underhive book.
The deciding factor on picking everything up was watching Ash on GMG go over the campaign. It sounds absurdly fun and interesting. It's super dark and really captures that "grim-dark" vibe that a lot of the 40k universe just kind of glances over. As expensive as the boxed set is, the contents are really nice.
I pulled the trigger too, I'd been unsure for a while but eventually decided that I liked the contents enough to justify it.
You are effectively getting 3 gangs worth of figures which retail at approx £60 from discount sites, plus the book (£20), along with the 15 terrain sprues.
As I paid £131 for the box that works out at around £50 for the terrain.
Already have Kill Team for skirmish, but if I were to go into Necromunda then Underhive seems very reasonable and wouldn't loose sleep over this new release as its clearly aimed at a more advanced player and will assume the two teams will be available shortly as separate releases. Personally, I find the Goliath and Esher gangs more interesting than those in the new set...
That said, if you had your heart set on one of one of the new teams then it is frustrating when they present a huge price tag of £175. Bargain or not, its still £175 if you only want only a small part of that set.
I ended up.pulling the trigger as well. Ash's unboxing video and description of the campaign is what sold me. I would never pay this much for a box normally but Ive always been a sucker for Necro.
SamusDrake wrote: Already have Kill Team for skirmish, but if I were to go into Necromunda then Underhive seems very reasonable and wouldn't loose sleep over this new release as its clearly aimed at a more advanced player and will assume the two teams will be available shortly as separate releases. Personally, I find the Goliath and Esher gangs more interesting than those in the new set...
Using Kill Team for Skirmish is like saying "I have a Hot Pocket for authentic Italian dinner."
Danny76 wrote: I know everyone’s a fan of looking at Becca, and yeah I see why, but in this photo - it looks like her cheeks are melting or sagging down. I can’t unsee it now..
I passed. It was an easy decision to make. Love Necromunda, love the big boxes, don’t love sending the message that there’s no ceiling to what I’ll pay for plastic crack. There is, and GW hit it with this release. They are incentivizing the sale of the first 3,000 boxes which is a paltry amount, and they didn’t have the quick wknd sellout, so I suspect there are many who are doing exactly what I am doing, and for similar reasons.
I went in on this too, partly because the UK price is more reasonable (particularly at 20% discount), but mainly because I want everything in the box bar the templates and the rule book (and I have a friend who only has the original starter rule book who will gladly accept it!)
Still on the fence about this. I have a decision to make about whether to go for this box, Infinity Defiance and waiting to see what Black Templars get, it's a triple whammy where I can only get one.
There seems to be quite a bit of availability on this still; maybe it's not going as fast as GW were expecting?
In addition, you have some nades, armour and a little bit of equipment. Depending on wether they have access to Trading Post / Black Market (no clear ruling yet), you may have access to "infinite" amount of weaponry, which you may as well start converting immediately, because GW is never going to release that amount of bits for this game. There are close to 200 unique weapons so far.
In addition, you have some nades, armour and a little bit of equipment. Depending on wether they have access to Trading Post / Black Market (no clear ruling yet), you may have access to "infinite" amount of weaponry, which you may as well start converting immediately, because GW is never going to release that amount of bits for this game. There are close to 200 unique weapons so far.
the following:
Grenade Launcher (Subjugator)
Shock stave
Shield (Subjugator)
Heavy concussion ram (Subjugator)
Assault ram (Subjugator)
are not in the regular box and some of those are (currently) ONLY found in the Box Set. I am running on the assumption that they don't have access to the black market for weapons, which I had thought that GW had already made clear, when put in that PEs may ONLY equip weapons on the list. So even if you bought it on the black Market, you couldn't equip it. Other things are less clear, so on gear currently a question AFAIK.
The 'nade launchers are definitely on my 'want' list.
Not sure if this has been mentioned before, but do the columns/walls match the spaces on the Underhive tiles? I ask because I might be interested in picking some up when bits sellers break up boxes to use for the walls on the tiles.
Sabotage! wrote: Not sure if this has been mentioned before, but do the columns/walls match the spaces on the Underhive tiles? I ask because I might be interested in picking some up when bits sellers break up boxes to use for the walls on the tiles.
Someone asked this in the comments in the GMG let's make video. Answer was "Sadly not really" but who knows they might be close?
Sabotage! wrote: Not sure if this has been mentioned before, but do the columns/walls match the spaces on the Underhive tiles? I ask because I might be interested in picking some up when bits sellers break up boxes to use for the walls on the tiles.
Someone asked this in the comments in the GMG let's make video. Answer was "Sadly not really" but who knows they might be close?
Ah, that's a bummer. Thanks for finding this! At least there are quite a few third parties that who make walls. I really like ZM as keeps things close and brutal, but having some physical walls would be nice.
The best bargain out there is the MDF sets. Now, I know that a lot of people hate MDF terrain, but it actually works well and isn't as "flat" as most MDF terrain for games like Infinity.
The only reason I was considering the walls was to use them with my badzone tiles. Terrible design decision by them if that is the case. Wonder what the logic behind that is, cause it sure ain't gonna help with sales.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Wait, so, GW goes and makes Zone Moratlis walls, and they don't actually fit the cardboard tiles they made?
...wat
Well, there goes all my remaining interest, right there.
Oh the price didn’t do that for you by itself???
I was still interested in the idea of these (as in, as an addition to the already existing tiles). As that idea is actually not realised, well... There's just no point.
I don't know all of them off hand, but this discussion seems to cover a lot of them. I only have experience with the Death Ray Design ones. They look great when painted up, but they are MDF so painting them isn't fun. Also they take pretty much forever to assemble a set.
Thargrim wrote: The only reason I was considering the walls was to use them with my badzone tiles. Terrible design decision by them if that is the case. Wonder what the logic behind that is, cause it sure ain't gonna help with sales.
At the risk of coming across like a fanboy, I wonder if it's because they scaled the new plastics to fit alongside the existing sector mechanicus and sector imperialis and it doesn't quite fit with the layout of the older tiles?
Thargrim wrote: The only reason I was considering the walls was to use them with my badzone tiles. Terrible design decision by them if that is the case. Wonder what the logic behind that is, cause it sure ain't gonna help with sales.
They don't (or soon won't) sell those tiles any more. They want you to buy their high-price 1x1 plastic tiles.
Thargrim wrote: The only reason I was considering the walls was to use them with my badzone tiles. Terrible design decision by them if that is the case. Wonder what the logic behind that is, cause it sure ain't gonna help with sales.
At the risk of coming across like a fanboy, I wonder if it's because they scaled the new plastics to fit alongside the existing sector mechanicus and sector imperialis and it doesn't quite fit with the layout of the older tiles?
Yes, the Zone Mortalis stuff has obviously been sized to fit with the existing range of scenery kits, which makes a lot more sense than scaling them to fit the old cardboard tiles.
Tavis75 wrote: Yes, the Zone Mortalis stuff has obviously been sized to fit with the existing range of scenery kits, which makes a lot more sense than scaling them to fit the old cardboard tiles.
I fail to see why you couldn't do both? The most important thing about Sector Mechanicus is the height. Each level needs to be 5" or 2.5" to fit with everything else. None of that determines the width or length of the pieces though, which could have easily been made to fit the dark spots on the tiles.
Thargrim wrote: The only reason I was considering the walls was to use them with my badzone tiles. Terrible design decision by them if that is the case. Wonder what the logic behind that is, cause it sure ain't gonna help with sales.
At the risk of coming across like a fanboy, I wonder if it's because they scaled the new plastics to fit alongside the existing sector mechanicus and sector imperialis and it doesn't quite fit with the layout of the older tiles?
That would explain height. Noth fitting the existing tiles, not so much.
Albertorius wrote: That would explain height. Noth fitting the existing tiles, not so much.
It'd explain the widths as well. It looks like they have designed the current modern range of scenery kits in way that has them sized to certain lengths and heights so they can all be used together. I'm not near my bits now, but I'd bet that, for example, one of the plasma conduit pipes doesn't exactly scale properly with the walls on the cardboard tiles. But they do line up to exactly the same lengths as a walkway, wall width, building height, etc. Have a look at some of Ray Dranfields older tweets to see how fixed widths and lengths allow the kits to be mixed and matched: https://twitter.com/RayDranfield
I think it's less a problem with the new kits and more a problem with whomever specc'd the cardboard tiles as they did so in a way that doesn't have them match the current range plastic pieces.
Albertorius wrote: That would explain height. Noth fitting the existing tiles, not so much.
It'd explain the widths as well. It looks like they have designed the current modern range of scenery kits in way that has them sized to certain lengths and heights so they can all be used together. I'm not near my bits now, but I'd bet that, for example, one of the plasma conduit pipes doesn't exactly scale properly with the walls on the cardboard tiles. But they do line up to exactly the same lengths as a walkway, wall width, building height, etc. Have a look at some of Ray Dranfields older tweets to see how fixed widths and lengths allow the kits to be mixed and matched: https://twitter.com/RayDranfield
I think it's less a problem with the new kits and more a problem with whomever specc'd the cardboard tiles as they did so in a way that doesn't have them match the current range plastic pieces.
Thing is, they could have gone another way for that. They could have included enlarged connector for the conduicts (instead of the shallow ones they have), for example, while keeping the wall compatible with the already released tiles. They have just chosen not to do that.
Albertorius wrote: That would explain height. Noth fitting the existing tiles, not so much.
It'd explain the widths as well. It looks like they have designed the current modern range of scenery kits in way that has them sized to certain lengths and heights so they can all be used together. I'm not near my bits now, but I'd bet that, for example, one of the plasma conduit pipes doesn't exactly scale properly with the walls on the cardboard tiles. But they do line up to exactly the same lengths as a walkway, wall width, building height, etc. Have a look at some of Ray Dranfields older tweets to see how fixed widths and lengths allow the kits to be mixed and matched: https://twitter.com/RayDranfield
I think it's less a problem with the new kits and more a problem with whomever specc'd the cardboard tiles as they did so in a way that doesn't have them match the current range plastic pieces.
Thing is, they could have gone another way for that. They could have included enlarged connector for the conduicts (instead of the shallow ones they have), for example, while keeping the wall compatible with the already released tiles. They have just chosen not to do that.
Not just for the conduits- also the Sector Mechanicus gantry segments, and the Sector Imperialis floors and walls. It is a much bigger propostion to create adaptors to make it (poorly) compatible with the Sector terrain AND the tiles, than just the Sector terrain (but effectively).
I can see why this is frustrating for those with the tiles, and they could've planned this 2+ years ago maybe when designing those tiles, but it makes much more sense for GW to maintain ideal compatibility between the plastic kits than between the new plastic and the card tiles from one game system. This is doubly true when considering the plastic tiles.
lord_blackfang wrote: Can someone explain how the walls don't fit the cardboard tiles? Both the cardboard and the plastic tiles are a 2" grid.
I guess they're much thicker and take up more space than the blacked out on the tiles.
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Haighus wrote: I can see why this is frustrating for those with the tiles, and they could've planned this 2+ years ago maybe when designing those tiles, but it makes much more sense for GW to maintain ideal compatibility between the plastic kits than between the new plastic and the card tiles from one game system. This is doubly true when considering the plastic tiles.
It is frustrating because every damn time they seem to go out of their way to feth with their clients. The Mechanicus scenery was already released! It's not like they didn't already know. And the time to release plastic stuff is loooong, so it's not like they weren't probably already preparing these when they released the tiles, either.
lord_blackfang wrote: Can someone explain how the walls don't fit the cardboard tiles? Both the cardboard and the plastic tiles are a 2" grid.
I guess they're much thicker and take up more space than the blacked out on the tiles.
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Haighus wrote: I can see why this is frustrating for those with the tiles, and they could've planned this 2+ years ago maybe when designing those tiles, but it makes much more sense for GW to maintain ideal compatibility between the plastic kits than between the new plastic and the card tiles from one game system. This is doubly true when considering the plastic tiles.
It is frustrating because every damn time they seem to go out of their way to feth with their clients. The Mechanicus scenery was already released! It's not like they didn't already know. And the time to release plastic stuff is loooong, so it's not like they weren't probably already preparing these when they released the tiles, either.
So yeah, this is planned obsolescence.
Eh, the first cardboard tiles came out over 2 years ago, and would've been designed at the very least 3 months before that probably longer.
That is enough time for the entire plastic Zone Mortalis terrain to be concepted, approved, designed, and put into production- the sprues are dated 2019. This is especially true considering their basic concept is already fully formed in the FW Zone Mortalis tiles. It is a stretch to assume those tiles were made with the knowledge that plastic terrain would eventually be made that deliberately wouldn't fit them.
If anything, I think it is more likely that the success of the terrain compatibility experiment with the Sector kits in the last few years has been a bigger factor in the devlopement of sector-compatible Zone Mortalis terrain than the Zone Mortalis Necromunda tiles.
Crimson wrote: What is this fuss about? Some cardboard? People use cardboard tiles?
People mean the cardboard Zone Mortalis board that was included with the last Necromunda starter. It included plastic doors, but the walls were just drawn on the card base.
I remember there was a difference between the resin and plastic doors and something about the tiles back then. So this is not new I think.
I would like to see comparison pics of the resin ZM pieces, papercard tiles, N17 plastic doors and the new plastic scenery range. Until then why not calm down and dial back the rage about something that may or may not be a problem?
I will continue using the cardboard tiles with or without GW's new ZM pieces. They are good for what they were designed for. Also perfect for easy transportation to other places.
@HBMC The removal of the cardboard tiles and Underhive in general has been confirmed by?
Automatically Appended Next Post: All the fuss because of a milimeter?
Everyone complaining that the terrain should have been spec'ed to fit the cardboard tiles, but really the cardboard tiles should have been created as 1' tiles. Them being 9ish inches is the real issue, as it never synced up with the existing ZM stuff to begin with.
godswildcard wrote: I've seen GW harping about the number of terrain sprues in this box, but is it enough terrain to cover a 3x3 square?
You would need the equivalent of 3-4 boxes to get "satisfying" amount of terrain. The new box is just a (very expensive) appetizer.
At the price of four boxes, you could easily afford to buy a decent 3D printer and enough material to make the terrain yourself.
...at the price of four boxes, you could buy four printers and printing material, at the current costs.
Yep, you could get THREE Ender 3s for the price of two Uprising boxes...or two Anycubic Photons! (U.S. MSRP)
Granted, you'd only be printing the terrain, and the terrain wont be identical (close, though!), nor would you get the minis, cards, or the campaign, etc...It IS hard to justify at this price, and even though I've already got an Ender 3 and a Photon, and have printed a few pieces of the ZM terrain on Thingiverse, I'm still grabbing one box of Dark Uprising...but I am a Necromunda superfan..have been since I got the first one in 1995...I also haven't gotten around to picking up the Enforcers box yet, OR the Plasma pipes...The fact that the full campaign rules are locked in this box and all of these other factors BARELY convinced me to cave and get one.
Fortunately, a single DU uprising box is sufficient for my Kill Team terrain needs (22”x30” board). And it is even affordable (in the USA) when I split it with others who are paying for the gangs and the rules.
Agreed, much about Necromunda these days is planned obsolescence. Old tiles incompatible with new walls is discouraging. I do like the new plastic tiles, but they have a few crucial weaknesses: -More difficult to transport -Very expensive for 4x4 -Monopose (if you can say that about a flat terrain surface) -Terrain features must be converted (industrial fan, sludge, meat grinder, fuel tank ++). Could be difficult to make converted stuff "land" well on the plastic surface because of the small details there? -Difficult/impossible to make pitfalls on plastic tiles?
Sabotage! wrote: Well, I decided I wasn't going to pick up the box because of the cost, but did want to start with Necromunda with these gangs.
I found a copy of Underhive on Ebay for 80 USD with free shipping.
Found a couple preorders from the UK for the Enforcers, The Dark Uprising Rulebook and Token Sheet for a combined 80 USD.
Now I'm just waiting for someone to parse up a box on EBAY in the US and put the Corpse Grinders up. It looks like I will end up spending about 200 instead of 290, and while I won't get the terrain (which is fine because I like the tiles and how easy they are to transport), I will have two more gangs ready to play If I decide to pick up the Gangs of the Underhive book.
Don't count on a legit UK business shipping to the USA. By GW policy they won't and will cancel your preorder and leave you high and dry at the last minute. Been there done that.
Sabotage! wrote: Well, I decided I wasn't going to pick up the box because of the cost, but did want to start with Necromunda with these gangs.
I found a copy of Underhive on Ebay for 80 USD with free shipping.
Found a couple preorders from the UK for the Enforcers, The Dark Uprising Rulebook and Token Sheet for a combined 80 USD.
Now I'm just waiting for someone to parse up a box on EBAY in the US and put the Corpse Grinders up. It looks like I will end up spending about 200 instead of 290, and while I won't get the terrain (which is fine because I like the tiles and how easy they are to transport), I will have two more gangs ready to play If I decide to pick up the Gangs of the Underhive book.
Don't count on a legit UK business shipping to the USA. By GW policy they won't and will cancel your preorder and leave you high and dry at the last minute. Been there done that.
I've never had any issues with it. I've ordered bits and split up kits from the UK dozens of times. I actually don't think it's against GW policy to sell items that don't have an MSRP (or in other words are not a boxed product/book). GW regional pricing doesn't apply to products that don't have any value assigned to them. Were you ordering GW products with an MSRP?
Sabotage! wrote: I've never had any issues with it. I've ordered bits and split up kits from the UK dozens of times. I actually don't think it's against GW policy to sell items that don't have an MSRP (or in other words are not a boxed product/book). GW regional pricing doesn't apply to products that don't have any value assigned to them. Were you ordering GW products with an MSRP?
Bits and split up kits aren't something GW can realistically do anything about.
But it's not like I can just shove a bunch of GW stuff into an order from Wayland or Miniature Market and expect them to actually ship it to me.
H.B.M.C. wrote: But it's not like I can just shove a bunch of GW stuff into an order from Wayland or Miniature Market and expect them to actually ship it to me.
...I'm not sure I'm parsing this correctly. You can't? Why not? I mean, I've done it regularly...
It is a little bit silly that the new hive scum "Abomination of Badzone 12" can't do anything after being Pinned. Its rules are heavily influenced by the spawn, limiting it's actions to Move, Charge, Fight and Coup de Grace actions only. However, they omitted any rule preventing it from being Pinned.
Best way to stand up must be to have an enemy fighter gain Insanity, then run it into B2B with the Abomination...
H.B.M.C. wrote: But it's not like I can just shove a bunch of GW stuff into an order from Wayland or Miniature Market and expect them to actually ship it to me.
...I'm not sure I'm parsing this correctly. You can't? Why not? I mean, I've done it regularly...
You are in EU. H.B.M.C is showing non-european flag so if that's correct he's living, well outside EU. GW forbids EU resalers selling outside EU(no taking advantage of cheap pound). They can't ban them selling within EU at least until brexit happens but outside EU yes they can. So you can order from wayland, I can order from wayland, outside EU however he can't. (well he could use reshipper. Order from wayland to his virtual address in UK which then gets shipped to him. But that adds up expenses above the shipping fees)
That or it's hyperbole how wayland supposedly never delivers orders. Some of those claims around. But I'll give benefit of doubt and assume it's the country specific issue since that is totally valid reason and his flag supports that idea.
Albertorius wrote: ...I'm not sure I'm parsing this correctly. You can't? Why not? I mean, I've done it regularly...
I don't know how it works in Europe, but I'm pretty sure that if they sent the items to me they'd be in breach of their trade terms.
Oh, ok. What's the problem with Miniature Market, then? That's from the US, and the only issue I personally have is that it would cost me a kidney and an eye in shipping costs to buy from them.
Albertorius wrote: ...I'm not sure I'm parsing this correctly. You can't? Why not? I mean, I've done it regularly...
I don't know how it works in Europe, but I'm pretty sure that if they sent the items to me they'd be in breach of their trade terms.
Oh, ok. What's the problem with Miniature Market, then? That's from the US, and the only issue I personally have is that it would cost me a kidney and an eye in shipping costs to buy from them.
Due to distribution restrictions we are only able to ship this product to the United States, Puerto Rico and U.S. Virgin Islands.
This one(found on GW products. It's specifically GW thing)
You would think somebody would have said if it wasn't...It's been like this for years.
It's not legal to restrict like that for EU stores inside EU. That's why you can buy from UK to spain. That's EU rules and as UK is ATMEU member they have to stick with it. Now if UK does leave EU then that law stops applying so in that case in theory GW could apply similar restriction to EU countries. Whether they do is another thing of course.
From someone on Facebook showing off photos as they put together the new Zone Mortalis stuff:
The Pillars match nicely with the old ZM tiles, but with the walls on, they become too wide for the old tiles. There´s a 4mm difference between the old and new tiles.
H.B.M.C. wrote: But it's not like I can just shove a bunch of GW stuff into an order from Wayland or Miniature Market and expect them to actually ship it to me.
...I'm not sure I'm parsing this correctly. You can't? Why not? I mean, I've done it regularly...
You're from Spain, I take? It's against EU law to forbid retailers selling to other member countries if you do, and seeing GW shop most definitely qualifies for it, they had to allow other UK (and EU) retailers doing the same. EU bans a lot of anti-competitive and price manipulation gak producers try to force on retailers, pity so few people know about it. Especially in UK where for the last 40 years about the only information on EU in media was bs on straight bananas and kippers forced by that scumbag Murdoch.
H.B.M.C. wrote: From someone on Facebook showing off photos as they put together the new Zone Mortalis stuff:
The Pillars match nicely with the old ZM tiles, but with the walls on, they become too wide for the old tiles. There´s a 4mm difference between the old and new tiles.
The Underhive tiles are not 1'x1' like the ZM tiles. They are something like 11.5"x11.5". The problem isn't that the ZM terrain doesn't fit the tiles, but that the tiles are ever so slightly shrunk down to fit in a standard GW big box.
Literally every company in the world does regional pricing and any who can get away with it does regional locks. EU members cannot buy Magic cards from the US, where they are significantly cheaper, for example. Heck, even purely digital content that has no distribution costs is priced different for different regions.
Sqorgar wrote: The Underhive tiles are not 1'x1' like the ZM tiles. They are something like 11.5"x11.5". The problem isn't that the ZM terrain doesn't fit the tiles, but that the tiles are ever so slightly shrunk down to fit in a standard GW big box.
Yes, and still equally bad for us customers/gamers. Content suffers because of strict packaging space? Bad idea from GW.
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lord_blackfang wrote: Literally every company in the world does regional pricing and any who can get away with it does regional locks. EU members cannot buy Magic cards from the US, where they are significantly cheaper, for example. Heck, even purely digital content that has no distribution costs is priced different for different regions.
GW's prices are high no matter where you go. A bit pricier outside of the UK, but trust me- if you lived in the UK, you'd still be able to say they're overpriced.
Now comes the part a lot of people are going to struggle with. I bet this might incite some rage.
But it's true.
GW's prices didn't climb that high by accident. It didn't happen because some greedy CEO twirled his mustache and scrawled "TRIPLE THE PRICE!" on a napkin before slapping his secretary, Linda, right on the arse and kicking the nearest puppy.
GW's prices shot up in a very short time, and they did that because people were willing to pay those prices for their toys.
This isn't food, water, booze, or anything else crucial to life. It's a bunch of plastic/resin war toys. It's a luxury item, like a pair of Jordans or a Harley-Davidson or crystal wine glasses. It's very nice, but it's a pricey version of something and there are more affordable options out there of this kind of luxury.
And people still paid absurd prices, because if I'm calculating correctly- the prices doubled in about 4-5 years and unless you're in a third world country ran by some dictator and there's a coup happening... inflation don't work that fast.
You can hate it all you like, and you can gripe about it all day long, all over the internet and even bellow it out at the top of your lungs into the local GW store. But at the end of the day, if you bought it- they won, because dead Presidents (or whatever the rest of your losers put on your money) are louder than you will ever be.
And I'm far from free of guilt, I've paid it. And I admit it. There's a limit for me, I'm certain. And some things are at that limit. So don't think I'm pointing at everyone else, I'll fully admit to being 'part of the problem' to some degree.
Maybe the Necro box will be marked down a couple of months down the line in my 
