When we released the original Warhammer 40,000: Kill Team Starter Set, it proved to be incredibly popular. After all, not only is the game great, but the box had loads of miniatures (two kill teams, no less!), terrain and a gameboard. That being the case, we thought we’d make another one to help new players to get started, but with two different kill teams and terrain. It’s not only a great way to get into the game, but it’s perfect for splitting with one of your friends!
If you’re already a fan of Warhammer 40,000: Kill Team, fear not – we think the rules are awesome, so haven’t changed a thing! The new box features a kill team of Space Marine Reivers (the Fangs of Ulfrich) pitted against the Fire Warriors of the T’au Empire (Advance Team Starpulse) across the amazing Sector Mechanicus terrain.
Ferocity and formidable combat skill faces off against deadly ranged weaponry and coordinated fire support – it certainly makes for an exciting dynamic!
Nothing new, nothing particularly exciting, but good news because this’ll keep the game alive and will finally make it once again accessible to newcomers. Whether the set is a good deal will remain to be seen, of course..
Also interesting that the rules will remain the same even though some recent and upcoming releases (Chaos and regular Marines) might warrant changes to some datasheets. Still good news that the existing rulebook won’t become outdated already.
So this is:
Tau starter (Advance Team Starpulse)
Space Wolves starter (Fangs of Ulfrich)
Sector Mechanicus killzone
rulebook
tactics cards
...but minus the extra terrain from the two starters? I think that might be the Sector Imperialis board instead of the one that came with the killzone, but I'd have to check.
I'll be honest, if the killzone and two starters were still available, I don't think this would be a really great deal - especially if they jack up the price the to now standard $170.
Edit: The SM killzone also had a bunch of pipes that this one is lacking.
So my prediction is true, KT got a new starter, that'd be good news for Warcry once it's first season starter sold out. Although the terrain here is much thinner than the old starter. (probably because these aren't "made in china" terrain)
My local GW store manager told me, literally just yesterday, that Kill Team was being discontinued and there would not be a new starter set.
Glad to see that's not the case and there will be continued support. With how's it's been selling, it's honestly a surprise it took this long to get another set out since it's all existing products.
Fire Warrior is an example of old GW wasting resources to make unnecessary bits. They got 3-sprues but barely had any interesting options compared to the 2 sprue Pathfinder. Lots of space was wasted to haul all those extra heads, shoulder pads and backpacks.
I think the reason they pit these 2 because they both barely had any options available to them. Picking something like CSM vs these Primaris would make the Primasris side look pale
Also these 2 Killteams are the exact same teams that was sold in the past : Fang of Ulrich and Advance team Starpulse. So none of these content is new
The teams are the same, but it's missing the terrain that came in those boxes. They also included 4 narrative/matched play mission cards each, that were specific to that terrain, and terrain-specific tactics cards. So the Tau had wall of martyrs terrain, along with a martyrs tactic, and its 4 mission cards all took place on wall of martyrs boards. It's anybody's guess whether those will be included (I doubt it though). Fangs of Ulrich were Sector Mechanicus, so who knows? I don't think the original KT starter had mission cards?
I think it is okay if sells for the same price as the original starter. It is obviously not as good of a deal being less terrain and such. But Kill Team is more known quantity a year out and probably isn't going to shift is many starters as a good chunk of potential players are already in or have moved on at this point.
Personally, I would think that re-using the Deathwatch, or even Scions, set would have been a better choice, but Reivers vs. Tau is fine. Though, high melee vs. high ranged don't seem like it is going to offer much in the way of interesting games either. Although, I think I like the factions in this starter more than the ones in the original Kill Team starter.
This is definitely more or a new player starter than a veteran 40k player just wanting the box for cheap miniatures kind of set though.
I'm just hoping that a new starter set means that the killzones will be reprinted too. Those were WAY too difficult to get a hold of. I think Miniature Market only got 5 copies total of the Sector Fronteris zone.
Maybe now that the starter doesn't include the Sector Imperialis, they can break that out into a killzone box for everybody who missed the starter set last time. It's always driven me nuts that the killzone rules were in the manual and it didn't get a card like the all the others.
Sqorgar wrote: I'm just hoping that a new starter set means that the killzones will be reprinted too. Those were WAY too difficult to get a hold of. I think Miniature Market only got 5 copies total of the Sector Fronteris zone.
Maybe now that the starter doesn't include the Sector Imperialis, they can break that out into a killzone box for everybody who missed the starter set last time. It's always driven me nuts that the killzone rules were in the manual and it didn't get a card like the all the others.
I too hope for more sector fronteris terrain. It's nice stuff. It's really strange that a kit hasn't come out with the stuff that was in there yet.
Saturmorn Carvilli wrote: Though, high melee vs. high ranged don't seem like it is going to offer much in the way of interesting games either. Although, I think I like the factions in this starter more than the ones in the original Kill Team starter.
At least Reivers have a chance against Tau Fire Warriors. They are a waste of points usually. Either you need power weapons for MEQ, or the Terror Troops rule is useless as its all Hormagaunts with a single Tyranid Warrior bunkered down out of LOS.
And while the terrain isn't as good a deal as the original starter, that isn't a surprise. Just a limited time thing to drum up enthusiasm at launch.
I bet the first one sold out so fast just because 8/10 bought it just for terrain deal, not the game itself. And now they present us with a two year old terrain which isn’t that useful in game and most already bought plenty.
Quasistellar wrote:I too hope for more sector fronteris terrain. It's nice stuff. It's really strange that a kit hasn't come out with the stuff that was in there yet.
A lot of it is in Moonbase Klassius (or whatever it is called), but it has that unique building with a roof - I mean, that's just a handy piece of terrain, and it was available in extremely limited quantities for an extremely limited time.
Ancestral Hamster wrote:And while the terrain isn't as good a deal as the original starter, that isn't a surprise.
I think they are trying as hard as possible to make this starter set as unappealing as possible for people who already play Kill Team. This is really for new players, and if only new players buy it, maybe it will stick around for a few months so that they can casually pick it up.
Yeah the Fronteris set was great because it's one of the few buildings GW has offered lately that isn't a ruin. You could make some sweet buildings or ship corridors etc with it. I regret only buying one but by the time I realized it was that good it was gone :(
Not having a permanently available starter set was a mistake so I'm glad that's being rectified with this set.
That being said the choice of scenery isn't particularly versatile (when compared with the original box set) and personally I'd have chosen Orks over Tau (my prejudice, make of it what you will).
Perhaps the idea with the scenery choice is to make fewer line of sight checks, simplifying the game for beginners.
It will help them sell their better scenery kits I think. And Orks
Perhaps the idea with the scenery choice is to make fewer line of sight checks, simplifying the game for beginners.
It will help them sell their better scenery kits I think. And Orks
Nah, Those Sector Mechanicus kit is GW "Made in UK" high quality scenery kit, that's why they usually don't give you lots of those compare to their cheaper "made in china" scenery.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Pretty lame starter, especially with the amount of terrain you get.
Looks like the "normal" amount to me - same as was in SWA and in the Kill Zone, just with the diagonal platform sprue replaced by a second big boiler sprue.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Pretty lame starter, especially with the amount of terrain you get.
Looks like the "normal" amount to me - same as was in SWA and in the Kill Zone, just with the diagonal platform sprue replaced by a second big boiler sprue.
Shadow War had at least a diagonal platform sprue and another octagonal platform sprue (could've made much bigger platforms), and the Sector Mechanicus killzone had several additional sprues of plasma pipes that would've made a huge difference in how empty that board feels on the ground level.
Nice to see them bring back a starter set for those interested in Kill Team. It certainly is strange to not have an introductory set available for one of your games.
On the starter itself, the models choices are fine, but the terrain is severally lacking. I think you would need at least 5-6 pieces of scatter terrain to make this board remotely playable on. I could see this amount of terrain on a Warcry board as their isn't much ranged weapon with range of 3 or more, but in 40k? Seems like a massacre waiting to happen.
Chairman Aeon wrote: It’s odd. Smart money thought the new Starter would be new Sisters plus a recycled army and recycled terrain.
Any idea on price? It has to be cheaper or why bother.
In my mind it was Never going to be something like Sisters.
They are going to make a killing on the Battle Sisters set.
It won’t be in bundles, boxes or anything. Just £40 for 10 or whatever they’re at.
This makes complete sense.
Super old kit, that costs nothing.
Newer popular kit, pays itself off very early on, and can be thrown in to make the box look good.
(Also, the pamphlets for each are all already made up etc right?
I'm gonna have to crunch numbers when this drops to see if its worth it. My local store still has the Tau starter box in stock. I never ended up grabbing it because of money, and I didn't care about the wall of martyrs terrain. I collect sector mechanicus scenery, so this might end up being a worthwhile purchase for me.
It looks like 7 frames worth of Mechanicus terrain, so one less than Shadow War Armageddon and original Kill Team starter set. Kill Zone: Sector Mechanicus had 6 frames of Mechanicus terrain and two frames of pipes.
Spruewise this is the same amount of terrain than Warcry starter set but Mechanicus terrain doesn't fill the table as effectively so it looks like a small amount.
Casualty wrote: Hmmm. I was realy hoping for a new Killteam starter to make my way into it, but this really isn't appealing to me at all.
Once this drops there will probably be either a wave of new killzones and kill team boxes, or reprints of the old ones. So I would just keep an eye out for now.
Once this drops there will probably be either a wave of new killzones and kill team boxes, or reprints of the old ones. So I would just keep an eye out for now.
This is a good point. Kill Team's support kind of fizzled after a strong launch, and this new starter could represent a new wave of content coming out. Maybe they can make good on the promise that packs with unique models and terrain like Rogue Trader, Starn's Disciples, or Sector Fronteris seemed to indicate was coming.
No point in missing out on the fun if not necessary. If you already have figures, you could just buy the Core rule book, and tune as needed. (My first game was with my Necrons. Had no Deathmarks so I bought another Immortal/Deathmark box. Will make Flayed Ones from bitz and greenstuff. Google "kitbash flayed ones"; there are are a few articles.)
Or as balmong7 has pointed out there may be reprints or all new Kill Team boxes. Would like a 2nd chance at Killzone: Sector Munitorum, maybe Sector Fronteris.
However, I'm open to 3rd party products. Anyone know of alternate cranes, forklifts etcetera for a warehouse/supply depot? (Already have the shipping containers.)
Casualty wrote: Hmmm. I was realy hoping for a new Killteam starter to make my way into it, but this really isn't appealing to me at all.
Tabletop Combat has a fair amount of warehouse- related stuff along with shipping equipment and dock yards if you don't mind MDF.
I'm hoping we see more unique stuff as well.
Hell I'd settle for just special sculpts of units that already exist. They wouldn't even need to give me new rules. Just give me some flashy new models at least if you aren't going to try and get creative!
Well I am sort of happy. After GW stealth cancelled Sector Mechanicus while I was half way through collecting it I now have an alternate source. The Mechanicus stuff will be on bitz sellers soon enough.
Not the best and not the worst. I have a friend who started a Marines Kill Team and another who started Tau, so might be good for them and we can all use the terrain. I don't need any more Reivers though, so I will be skipping it. If there was more terrain, or another lot like the first starter, I'd be more likely to buy.
highlord tamburlaine wrote: Tabletop Combat has a fair amount of warehouse- related stuff along with shipping equipment and dock yards if you don't mind MDF.
I'm hoping we see more unique stuff as well.
Hell I'd settle for just special sculpts of units that already exist. They wouldn't even need to give me new rules. Just give me some flashy new models at least if you aren't going to try and get creative!
No, the firewarriors are stuffed full of different weapons, drones optional parts etc it's a really good quality kit.
Pretty sure the marines have a load of optional gear too.
Casualty wrote: Hmmm. I was realy hoping for a new Killteam starter to make my way into it, but this really isn't appealing to me at all.
After missing out on the original starter, I feel the same. The original starter had two teams I actually wanted and a better terrain set. This starter gives me nothing I can use but some meh terrain.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Fingers crossed for the Fast Attack and Heavy Support supplements!
They already released that supplement. It's called Warhammer 40K.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Still a paltry level of terrain. The Kill-Zone had more than that...
I did notice that. seems odd. hopefully, it's a reduced price.
I would say it'll be the same cost as the previous one. I don't play Kill Team, but surely there needs to be more LOS blocking terrain?
There at least needs to be cover. The original Sector Mechanicus kit also included a set of promethium relay pipes. Which are just large enough to provide cover without restricting the movement speed of the models. Since cover in kill team is a -1 to hit modifier. It does the job pretty well.
This sad, uninspired, boring set is small consolation for those that missed the excellent first edition Kill Team box set. I'd honestly skip this and just get a rule book and go from there if you want to get into Kill Team now. Although as others have mentioned, I have noticed the game has fizzled quite a bit locally...
callidusx3 wrote: Looks like it will cost US$30 more than the first starter released a year ago.
It's not as good a deal, especially for people who have already bought into Kill Team (like myself), but it is a one stop starting point for Kill Team and is cheaper than buying everything separately. The main problem is that the Sector Mechanicus set looks extremely sparse.
I think GW has sort of been holding back on Kill Team releases until they could get a mass release starter set in stores again. They had maybe the first year's worth of products done, but really half assed everything afterward. I think this is a soft relaunch of the franchise... but I expect price increases all around.
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totalfailure wrote: And looks like a 'let's put everything Kill Team that's not selling into a box' lazy GW effort.
You think the Sector Mechanicus killzone didn't sell? And Fangs of Ulfrich, Advance Team Starpulse, and the tactics card packs have been out of print and impossible to find for a while now.
GW kind of botched the KT release by not being able to keep stock of their starter and then following it up with mostly uninspired releases (Rogue Trader was unique and Arena was a cool product if you like competitive or quick games) like Commanders and Elites (and now needing at least three books to play. No new and interesting factions, no cool extended campaign supplements, etc.
Releasing a new starter could be a way to get people interested in the game again, but releasing a markedly worse starter for more money definitely won't do it. And I can't imagine interest will continue if their next release is "Fast Attack."
If they'd included the pipes it would at least feel a bit more reasonable.
But the scenarios in the original Sector Mechanicus Kill Zone were supposed to be balanced around the amount of terrain in the box, so this feels like a pretty bad playing experience.
Meh starter set, nothing stands out except for the terrain... Standard fire warrior set and half a Primaris Reivers squad...Big pass from me. GW this is not a good showing.
I'd be okay with it if it didn't have Tau Fire Warriors. They came with 7th edition Kill Team and Advance Team Starpulse, so I've already got 20 Kill Team Tau Fire Warriors and I don't want another 10. Wouldn't have minded other Tau units, but I've got Kill Team Fire Warriors coming out the wazoo.
Sqorgar wrote: I'd be okay with it if it didn't have Tau Fire Warriors. They came with 7th edition Kill Team and Advance Team Starpulse, so I've already got 20 Kill Team Tau Fire Warriors and I don't want another 10. Wouldn't have minded other Tau units, but I've got Kill Team Fire Warriors coming out the wazoo.
It does let them pull Starpulse and Ulfrich off the shelves though--possibly opening up room for another couple of Kill Teams down the line, like they did with AdMech/GSC.
I'm not going to get my hopes up, but it might mean we see a 'generic' Space Marines Kill Team of Infiltrators/Incursors, and a Tau one of Pathfinders or Stealth Suits?
Sqorgar wrote: I'd be okay with it if it didn't have Tau Fire Warriors. They came with 7th edition Kill Team and Advance Team Starpulse, so I've already got 20 Kill Team Tau Fire Warriors and I don't want another 10. Wouldn't have minded other Tau units, but I've got Kill Team Fire Warriors coming out the wazoo.
Man I'm the total opposite. I started collecting at the top of 8th edition. So right now I only own two fire warrior squads and 1 breacher squad. So getting another box out of this is perfect for both kill team and my 40k army. (Though I think my local store sitll has advanced team starpulse in stock. I may just grab that and skip the starter set. depends on if my buddy goes halfsies on the box with me.)
It does let them pull Starpulse and Ulfrich off the shelves though--possibly opening up room for another Kill Team set down the line, like they did with AdMech/GSC.
They aren't on the shelves. They sold through their initial production a while ago, and GW doesn't seem in a hurry to reprint any of them. I think it is less about opening up space and more that they want Space Marines in there, but only have 5 models, so they want the other side to have a bunch of models so that it looks like a better value. Fire Warriors have 13 models (when you include the two drones and missile pod).
However, if any faction were to get the Theta-7/Starn business, it'd be Space Wolves (Intercessors + Lt) and Tau (Pathfinders + commander). Death Guard and Thousand Sons are probably up there (they only have elite boxes, lacking core KT units, and are relatively fresh so the design studio hasn't forgotten how to make new ones) while anything Eldar is probably the least likely to see one. Grey Knights, Chaos Space Marines (also new), and Custodes also lack any starter boxes.
Man I'm the total opposite. I started collecting at the top of 8th edition. So right now I only own two fire warrior squads and 1 breacher squad. So getting another box out of this is perfect for both kill team and my 40k army. (Though I think my local store sitll has advanced team starpulse in stock. I may just grab that and skip the starter set. depends on if my buddy goes halfsies on the box with me.)
I don't play 40k, so excuse me if this is a dumb question. But when using Fire Warriors for it, do they have to be more homogeneous load outs? I built my Starpulse Fire Warriors to match the cards, and have weapons and equipment that is kind of all over the place. To use them in 40k, would I need to split them into different units and then fill out the rest of the ranks with similar models, or does that hodge podge of equipment work in a single unit?
It does let them pull Starpulse and Ulfrich off the shelves though--possibly opening up room for another Kill Team set down the line, like they did with AdMech/GSC.
They aren't on the shelves. They sold through their initial production a while ago, and GW doesn't seem in a hurry to reprint any of them. I think it is less about opening up space and more that they want Space Marines in there, but only have 5 models, so they want the other side to have a bunch of models so that it looks like a better value. Fire Warriors have 13 models (when you include the two drones and missile pod).
However, if any faction were to get the Theta-7/Starn business, it'd be Space Wolves (Intercessors + Lt) and Tau (Pathfinders + commander). Death Guard and Thousand Sons are probably up there (they only have elite boxes, lacking core KT units, and are relatively fresh so the design studio hasn't forgotten how to make new ones) while anything Eldar is probably the least likely to see one. Grey Knights, Chaos Space Marines (also new), and Custodes also lack any starter boxes.
Man I'm the total opposite. I started collecting at the top of 8th edition. So right now I only own two fire warrior squads and 1 breacher squad. So getting another box out of this is perfect for both kill team and my 40k army. (Though I think my local store sitll has advanced team starpulse in stock. I may just grab that and skip the starter set. depends on if my buddy goes halfsies on the box with me.)
I don't play 40k, so excuse me if this is a dumb question. But when using Fire Warriors for it, do they have to be more homogeneous load outs? I built my Starpulse Fire Warriors to match the cards, and have weapons and equipment that is kind of all over the place. To use them in 40k, would I need to split them into different units and then fill out the rest of the ranks with similar models, or does that hodge podge of equipment work in a single unit?
They only have to be homogenous for the breachers. 5 model min, 10 max. the regular fire warriors (the carbines and rifles) can be taken as a mixed unit. Again with 5 models min. However, most people run them all with the same gun just for ease.
It does let them pull Starpulse and Ulfrich off the shelves though--possibly opening up room for another Kill Team set down the line, like they did with AdMech/GSC.
They aren't on the shelves. They sold through their initial production a while ago, and GW doesn't seem in a hurry to reprint any of them. I think it is less about opening up space and more that they want Space Marines in there, but only have 5 models, so they want the other side to have a bunch of models so that it looks like a better value. Fire Warriors have 13 models (when you include the two drones and missile pod).
Missile Pods aren't considered a unit but rather wargear. It's like the Homing Beacon for Terminators and Stealth Suits.
Take this with a grain of salt, but I've heard that a big part of why they haven't been in a hurry to reprint anything is that they felt the KT PLUS a Commander as separate purchases didn't seem to work out too well--and that the 'Big Terrain' pieces weren't exactly working out well since that's stuff produced outside of their own manufacturing line, same with the cardboard materials. Purportedly there was some concern that having things like the Wall of Martyr bits turned people off from the later sets, while the Ryza Pattern Ruins and the "Sector Sanctoris Ruins"(two of the frames that came with Urban Conquest) seem to be better received.
However, if any faction were to get the Theta-7/Starn business, it'd be Space Wolves (Intercessors + Lt) and Tau (Pathfinders + commander). Death Guard and Thousand Sons are probably up there (they only have elite boxes, lacking core KT units, and are relatively fresh so the design studio hasn't forgotten how to make new ones) while anything Eldar is probably the least likely to see one. Grey Knights, Chaos Space Marines (also new), and Custodes also lack any starter boxes.
Again, grain of salt time:
Purportedly the Shadowspear sprues were set up with an eye towards being made into Kill Team/Start Collecting sets down the road. I don't own the Elites book so I don't know if Suppressors are in there, but the Marine stuff could easily fill a Kill Team box on its own even if they just gave you 1 of each sprue(not counting the Phobos Librarian and Captains who had their own individual frames), and doing so would give you:
1x Lt in Phobos Armor w/ Grav Chute and Master-Crafted Oculus Bolt Carbine
1x Eliminator Sergeant
1x Eliminator
1x Suppressor Sergeant
1x Suppressor
1x Helix Adept
1x Infiltrator Sergeant
5x Infiltrators, spread across 2 sprues. There's three of them(Pistol raised, 2x different bolters raised poses) on the 'goon' sprue while there's 2(smoke grenade toss and the pseudo-Squad Leader) on what I call the 'command' sprue.
Chaos Marines might not give you the Venomcrawler or Obliterators(are Obliterators in the Elites book?), but the sprue can get you:
2x Greater Possessed
1x Chaos Marine Sergeant with Plasma Pistol and Chainaxe
1x Chaos Marine with Plasma Gun
1x Chaos Marine with Autocannon
4x Chaos Marines with Bolt Pistol and Chainswords
3x Chaos Marines with Boltguns
Take this with a grain of salt, but I've heard that a big part of why they haven't been in a hurry to reprint anything is that they felt the KT PLUS a Commander as separate purchases didn't seem to work out too well--and that the 'Big Terrain' pieces weren't exactly working out well since that's stuff produced outside of their own manufacturing line, same with the cardboard materials. Purportedly there was some concern that having things like the Wall of Martyr bits turned people off from the later sets, while the Ryza Pattern Ruins and the "Sector Sanctoris Ruins"(two of the frames that came with Urban Conquest) seem to be better received.
That's some interesting stuff there. The Commander expansions were an obvious misstep (though largely because they were about $10 too expensive). Also, including terrain in the faction boxes made less and less sense as the terrain became less modular. You can always use some more Sector Mechanicus or Sector Munitorum crates, but the Deathworld forest and Wall of Martyrs didn't really make sense. Not a fan of the Sanctoris scatter rubble either - I don't need 4 sets of it. I would not be terribly disappointed if they dropped the terrain parts of the faction starters (as long as the price dropped too), but if you ask me, just put in straight Sector Mechanicus walkway sprues - those things are always useful, but found in almost none of the kits, and there's no way to get a decent quantity of them.
Purportedly the Shadowspear sprues were set up with an eye towards being made into Kill Team/Start Collecting sets down the road.
I didn't really pay attention to Shadowspear, but aren't most of the Primaris models in it new units that don't have profiles for Kill Team?
Chaos Marines might not give you the Venomcrawler or Obliterators(are Obliterators in the Elites book?), but...
Are the Venomcrawler and Obliterators on the same sprue as the regular chaos marines? They wouldn't create a Kill Team pack with models (or parts of models) that you can't use, but if they are on their own sprues, that would lend some credibility to the rumor.
I'd imagine with most of the newer 3d sculpted models they could just reconfigure a sprue to accommodate the models they want on there.
Maybe then we could get more walkway sprues. I agree- we're always in need of more of those!
I thought Rogue Trader was a step in the right direction in terms of bringing new things to the 40k table. A shame it didn't come with a set of KT instructions so it was all self- contained like it should have been.
GW want me to pony up those starter set prices, best offer something I don't already have then!
I thought Rogue Trader was a step in the right direction in terms of bringing new things to the 40k table. A shame it didn't come with a set of KT instructions so it was all self- contained like it should have been.
Rogue Trader really felt rushed. The models were amazing, but the campaign was minimal despite being what should've been the selling point for the whole box, and it had Commanders before Commanders was even released. Worse still, they never expanded these factions so the rogue traders, at least, can't play more than 100 pt games - they were already kind of middling, and all the other factions just sort of left them behind. I was expecting the Blackstone Fortress characters to get added to the group. With the new stupidly expensive expansion release, there's enough there for a rogue trader faction... Rogue Trader should've been the future of Kill Team, but instead they went more towards a 40k demo/competitive direction.
My distant hope is that GW was blindsided by the success of Kill Team and has been releasing easy expansions for the time being while they build up more substantial additions to the game. There was a rumored assassins Rogue Trader-like box that never materialized. I'm hoping that they were just saving it until they relaunched Kill Team with a new starter.... Rebellions are built on hope, you know...
I thought Rogue Trader was a step in the right direction in terms of bringing new things to the 40k table. A shame it didn't come with a set of KT instructions so it was all self- contained like it should have been.
Rogue Trader really felt rushed. The models were amazing, but the campaign was minimal despite being what should've been the selling point for the whole box, and it had Commanders before Commanders was even released. Worse still, they never expanded these factions so the rogue traders, at least, can't play more than 100 pt games - they were already kind of middling, and all the other factions just sort of left them behind. I was expecting the Blackstone Fortress characters to get added to the group. With the new stupidly expensive expansion release, there's enough there for a rogue trader faction... Rogue Trader should've been the future of Kill Team, but instead they went more towards a 40k demo/competitive direction.
My distant hope is that GW was blindsided by the success of Kill Team and has been releasing easy expansions for the time being while they build up more substantial additions to the game. There was a rumored assassins Rogue Trader-like box that never materialized. I'm hoping that they were just saving it until they relaunched Kill Team with a new starter.... Rebellions are built on hope, you know...
From what I understand Rogue Trader was rushed. Someone leaked out its existence to the media. Everyone went insane over it, and someone in management was like "Push up the release date to capitalize on hype". That initial reveal trailer went out like a week or two later.
Sqorgar wrote: Are the Venomcrawler and Obliterators on the same sprue as the regular chaos marines? They wouldn't create a Kill Team pack with models (or parts of models) that you can't use, but if they are on their own sprues, that would lend some credibility to the rumor.
The 10 Chaos Marines and the 2 Greater Possessed are on one sprue. The Oblits and the Venom Crawler are on the other sprue.
No, the firewarriors are stuffed full of different weapons, drones optional parts etc it's a really good quality kit.
Pretty sure the marines have a load of optional gear too.
Three potential weapon loadouts for Tau: Breacher with Pulse Blaster, Strike Team with Pulse Rifle or Pulse Carbine. Support Drone can take Smart Missiles or Missile Pod. Drones are Pulse Carbines/Markerlight/Shield Generator.
Rievers have two loadouts: Heavy Bolt Pistol and Combat Knife or Bolt Carbine.
That's some interesting stuff there. The Commander expansions were an obvious misstep (though largely because they were about $10 too expensive). Also, including terrain in the faction boxes made less and less sense as the terrain became less modular. You can always use some more Sector Mechanicus or Sector Munitorum crates, but the Deathworld forest and Wall of Martyrs didn't really make sense. Not a fan of the Sanctoris scatter rubble either - I don't need 4 sets of it. I would not be terribly disappointed if they dropped the terrain parts of the faction starters (as long as the price dropped too), but if you ask me, just put in straight Sector Mechanicus walkway sprues - those things are always useful, but found in almost none of the kits, and there's no way to get a decent quantity of them.
I'm actually a fan of the Sanctoris scatter rubble, but I would point out that there's a second section of the scenery that's in Urban Conquest that hasn't gotten a general release. The fencing, doctorbot, surgical table, and a bunch of crates.
The Wall of Martyrs stuff would have made a lot more sense if they'd made the fluff clear from the outset for everyone. Unlike most of the Kill Teams which had a Vigilus bend, the Necrons and Tau weren't--they were somewhere else entirely, an Imperial world that the Tau were going after. Necrons were waking up there, cause of course it was a Tomb World.
Purportedly the Shadowspear sprues were set up with an eye towards being made into Kill Team/Start Collecting sets down the road.
I didn't really pay attention to Shadowspear, but aren't most of the Primaris models in it new units that don't have profiles for Kill Team?
Apparently the Elites book added the stuff from Shadowspear. Infiltrators, Eliminators, Suppressors, and the Phobos LT, Librarian, and Captain.
I had to look up the Community Article on it.
Chaos Marines might not give you the Venomcrawler or Obliterators(are Obliterators in the Elites book?), but...
Are the Venomcrawler and Obliterators on the same sprue as the regular chaos marines? They wouldn't create a Kill Team pack with models (or parts of models) that you can't use, but if they are on their own sprues, that would lend some credibility to the rumor.
Venomcrawler and Obliterators are their own separate sprue to the normal CSMs and the two Greater Possessed.
The Wall of Martyrs stuff would have made a lot more sense if they'd made the fluff clear from the outset for everyone. Unlike most of the Kill Teams which had a Vigilus bend, the Necrons and Tau weren't--they were somewhere else entirely, an Imperial world that the Tau were going after. Necrons were waking up there, cause of course it was a Tomb World.
Most people I know didn't like wall of martyrs because it removed all the verticality and los blocking stuff from kill team. I personally don't know anyone who got play on sector fronteris. But I liked the look of it because it was a lot of LOS blocking ruins but not quite as verticle as the sector imperialis tuff. Plus you could pretty easily mix it with sector imperialist or sector mechanicus and it fits well.
I thought Rogue Trader was a step in the right direction in terms of bringing new things to the 40k table. A shame it didn't come with a set of KT instructions so it was all self- contained like it should have been.
Rogue Trader really felt rushed. The models were amazing, but the campaign was minimal despite being what should've been the selling point for the whole box, and it had Commanders before Commanders was even released. Worse still, they never expanded these factions so the rogue traders, at least, can't play more than 100 pt games - they were already kind of middling, and all the other factions just sort of left them behind. I was expecting the Blackstone Fortress characters to get added to the group. With the new stupidly expensive expansion release, there's enough there for a rogue trader faction... Rogue Trader should've been the future of Kill Team, but instead they went more towards a 40k demo/competitive direction.
My distant hope is that GW was blindsided by the success of Kill Team and has been releasing easy expansions for the time being while they build up more substantial additions to the game. There was a rumored assassins Rogue Trader-like box that never materialized. I'm hoping that they were just saving it until they relaunched Kill Team with a new starter.... Rebellions are built on hope, you know...
The problem with the Rogue Trader was that it was not really a Rogue Trader faction, it was Elucidian Starstiders faction. These specific guys, with the set gear in this specific combination. I was so disappointed with that. The rules should have been for generic customisable Rogue Trader faction and then the appropriate Blackstone minis should have been added to that. And same for the 40K version of them
I thought Rogue Trader was a step in the right direction in terms of bringing new things to the 40k table. A shame it didn't come with a set of KT instructions so it was all self- contained like it should have been.
Rogue Trader really felt rushed. The models were amazing, but the campaign was minimal despite being what should've been the selling point for the whole box, and it had Commanders before Commanders was even released. Worse still, they never expanded these factions so the rogue traders, at least, can't play more than 100 pt games - they were already kind of middling, and all the other factions just sort of left them behind. I was expecting the Blackstone Fortress characters to get added to the group. With the new stupidly expensive expansion release, there's enough there for a rogue trader faction... Rogue Trader should've been the future of Kill Team, but instead they went more towards a 40k demo/competitive direction.
My distant hope is that GW was blindsided by the success of Kill Team and has been releasing easy expansions for the time being while they build up more substantial additions to the game. There was a rumored assassins Rogue Trader-like box that never materialized. I'm hoping that they were just saving it until they relaunched Kill Team with a new starter.... Rebellions are built on hope, you know...
The problem with the Rogue Trader was that it was not really a Rogue Trader faction, it was Elucidian Starstiders faction. These specific guys, with the set gear in this specific combination. I was so disappointed with that. The rules should have been for generic customisable Rogue Trader faction and then the appropriate Blackstone minis should have been added to that. And same for the 40K version of them
Yeah I was pissed when I learned that they didn't overlap with each other. I spent a bunch of money getting ahold of the models because I thought they would.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I'm not sure where the correct place to post this is in terms of news and rumors. but they just FAQ'd kill team today.
Sqorgar wrote: Looking at the GW preorders on the NZ storefront and... are the models no longer in colored plastic?
They probably have lots of overpriced Reivers and old Tau that stuffing them into this wonderful starter, along with some old news, skimpy amount of Sector Mechanicus is simplicity. And to another poster, just because GW is ‘sold out’ of something sure didn’t mean that I couldn’t walk into my not so friendly or local game store and find the Fangs and Starpulse still gathering dust on the shelf long after the internets declared the ‘unavailable’.
so the GW website says "This section includes Sector Imperialis rules, which are designed for use with the scenery found in the box;"
but the scenery in the box is Sector Mechanicus. Any idea if that's a misprint, or there isn't actually any of the special mechanicus rules in the box. My recollection was that the Core Rules had imperialis terrain rules but the other Sectors were in different terrain boxes.
I guess they'd have had to reprint a different set of core rules to do this, which they did not.
pduggie wrote: so the GW website says "This section includes Sector Imperialis rules, which are designed for use with the scenery found in the box;"
but the scenery in the box is Sector Mechanicus. Any idea if that's a misprint, or there isn't actually any of the special mechanicus rules in the box. My recollection was that the Core Rules had imperialis terrain rules but the other Sectors were in different terrain boxes.
I guess they'd have had to reprint a different set of core rules to do this, which they did not.
The killzone rules basically amount to a large card with six random events on it. The Sector Imperialis table is in the core rulebook, while future killzones had the card separately. In addition to this card, the killzones also include a bunch of tactics cards for the killzone for the various terrain items - Sector Imperialis never got these cards. The killzones also included a booklet on the killzone that was a few pages of lore and a few pages of photographs of the terrain painted.
It does not appear that the new starter set includes the Sector Mechanicus card or the tactics cards. Also, it doesn't include the booklet (despite having the Fangs of Ulfrich and Starpulse booklets) - probably because the booklet shows the plasma pipes that it doesn't include. It does include the SM board though.
So, the new starter set does include the Sector Imperialis rules (which is in the core book), but in no way was it designed for the scenery found in the box. Copy and paste error, I'd guess.
Sqorgar wrote: Looking at the GW preorders on the NZ storefront and... are the models no longer in colored plastic?
They probably have lots of overpriced Reivers and old Tau that stuffing them into this wonderful starter, along with some old news, skimpy amount of Sector Mechanicus is simplicity. And to another poster, just because GW is ‘sold out’ of something sure didn’t mean that I couldn’t walk into my not so friendly or local game store and find the Fangs and Starpulse still gathering dust on the shelf long after the internets declared the ‘unavailable’.
The base primaris kits are really a mystery to me. And the more I mull it over, the more and more I am beginning to think that the team just doesn't know what to do with these models. They seem all over the place with strange weapon options (or lack their of) and even design choices. Suppressors look like knock off toys compared to the intercessor kit, which looks much more streamlined.
I'm interested in starting kill team, I love the Reiver models and like the Tau, so I just popped over to the website to take a gander...
No way am I paying $160 for that box.
I've never gotten into 40k, but GW sure isn't going to win me over anytime soon if that is their offering for a starter.
Gallahad wrote: I'm interested in starting kill team, I love the Reiver models and like the Tau, so I just popped over to the website to take a gander...
No way am I paying $160 for that box.
I've never gotten into 40k, but GW sure isn't going to win me over anytime soon if that is their offering for a starter.
You're better off not getting the starter and just picking up the book and the kits. FLGS stores typically have terrain, and unless you're looking to build a table for personal use at home, you won't need half of what is in that box.
Gallahad wrote: I'm interested in starting kill team, I love the Reiver models and like the Tau, so I just popped over to the website to take a gander...
No way am I paying $160 for that box.
I've never gotten into 40k, but GW sure isn't going to win me over anytime soon if that is their offering for a starter.
You're better off not getting the starter and just picking up the book and the kits. FLGS stores typically have terrain, and unless you're looking to build a table for personal use at home, you won't need half of what is in that box.
Even then. The book is $40, a box of firewarriors is $50, and reavers are $50. So to buy those separate without the terrain is already $140. So if you REALLY wanted to get both kill teams, and needed the rules. The box is still a good discount. Though it's up to you if you count the extra dice, cards, tokens, and terrain as being worth the extra $20.
I wanted to get it for myself even though I'm already invested in kill team. I probably won't now. But if I was just starting. I totally would buy this box.
Gallahad wrote: I'm interested in starting kill team, I love the Reiver models and like the Tau, so I just popped over to the website to take a gander...
No way am I paying $160 for that box.
I've never gotten into 40k, but GW sure isn't going to win me over anytime soon if that is their offering for a starter.
You're better off not getting the starter and just picking up the book and the kits. FLGS stores typically have terrain, and unless you're looking to build a table for personal use at home, you won't need half of what is in that box.
Even then. The book is $40, a box of firewarriors is $50, and reavers are $50. So to buy those separate without the terrain is already $140. So if you REALLY wanted to get both kill teams, and needed the rules. The box is still a good discount. Though it's up to you if you count the extra dice, cards, tokens, and terrain as being worth the extra $20.
I wanted to get it for myself even though I'm already invested in kill team. I probably won't now. But if I was just starting. I totally would buy this box.
But you wouldn't need both sets of models.
You can go 40 for the book, 40-60 depending on the kit you pick (your faction) and source dice from somewhere much cheaper. Tokens can be made by hand from scratch paper and a pen, and the terrain isn't needed if you have a local shop you go to to play.
Gallahad wrote: I'm interested in starting kill team, I love the Reiver models and like the Tau, so I just popped over to the website to take a gander...
No way am I paying $160 for that box.
I've never gotten into 40k, but GW sure isn't going to win me over anytime soon if that is their offering for a starter.
You're better off not getting the starter and just picking up the book and the kits. FLGS stores typically have terrain, and unless you're looking to build a table for personal use at home, you won't need half of what is in that box.
Even then. The book is $40, a box of firewarriors is $50, and reavers are $50. So to buy those separate without the terrain is already $140. So if you REALLY wanted to get both kill teams, and needed the rules. The box is still a good discount. Though it's up to you if you count the extra dice, cards, tokens, and terrain as being worth the extra $20.
I wanted to get it for myself even though I'm already invested in kill team. I probably won't now. But if I was just starting. I totally would buy this box.
Sort of. Correct on the Core Rules and Fire Warriors. The starter only has half the number that you would get in a Reivers box. You would be much better off picking up First Strike if your aim was playing Kill Team. While I like Reivers, I don't field more than 3 anyways and you will definitely want Intercessors and having the one modeled with an auspex is really nice if you want a total package comms intercessor. Plus, you are well on your way to having a Death Guard kill team if you want a more easy-make competitive faction.
I agree with the idea of picking up the core rules and you faction of choice (usually two boxes of models) most of the time. If you don't play somewhere that already has boards and terrain and don't want to try create your own, try and find one of the old Kill Team terrain sets or maybe even consider one of the Warcry ones. I would only pick up this starter is definitely wanted everything in it or could split it with someone that wants what you don't. Both the Tau and the Space Marines are definitely going to want additional units to round out their rosters, so try and keep that in mind.
This starter is okay, but I get the feeling I not going to see a sudden influx of Tau or Space Marine players nor Sector Mechanicus boards when I play Kill Team. At least GW doesn't have to worry about this one selling out quickly.
Yeah Kill Team: Catacombs with two half warbands and a sprue of doors for probably more than the first starter cost is near to the worst things that could have happened.
Have a Kill Team boxed set you don't want to get them.
GW never fails to impress.
I am pretty sure they said that all the units will be released later. They'll just be in Kill Team first. So a little more patience is required. I think you will find little sympathy from non-Space Marine players on something like this. Everyone has managed to go all of 40k's existence without Heavy Intercessors so far. A few months more shouldn't be that painful.
Is it a little jerky? Maybe. I don't know. I like Kill Team and I can definitely use all the models in this expansion. If someone really wants those Intercessors and simply can't wait until their solo release, I'm not sure if I can muster any sympathy for them if they go out and buy a bunch of these likely, even for GW, expensive expansion boxes.
Have a Kill Team boxed set you don't want to get them.
GW never fails to impress.
I am pretty sure they said that all the units will be released later. They'll just be in Kill Team first. So a little more patience is required. I think you will find little sympathy from non-Space Marine players on something like this. Everyone has managed to go all of 40k's existence without Heavy Intercessors so far. A few months more shouldn't be that painful.
Is it a little jerky? Maybe. I don't know. I like Kill Team and I can definitely use all the models in this expansion. If someone really wants those Intercessors and simply can't wait until their solo release, I'm not sure if I can muster any sympathy for them if they go out and buy a bunch of these likely, even for GW, expensive expansion boxes.
And everyone ignores how Necrons also have two units kicked behind the box because they're not another stupidly overpowered Marines piece of garbage that Marine Players need to get their hands on RIGHT NOW because they might lose a game one day otherwise
Have a Kill Team boxed set you don't want to get them.
GW never fails to impress.
I am pretty sure they said that all the units will be released later. They'll just be in Kill Team first. So a little more patience is required. I think you will find little sympathy from non-Space Marine players on something like this. Everyone has managed to go all of 40k's existence without Heavy Intercessors so far. A few months more shouldn't be that painful.
Is it a little jerky? Maybe. I don't know. I like Kill Team and I can definitely use all the models in this expansion. If someone really wants those Intercessors and simply can't wait until their solo release, I'm not sure if I can muster any sympathy for them if they go out and buy a bunch of these likely, even for GW, expensive expansion boxes.
I know the Rogue Trader Kill Team didn't appear outside of their big box yet but I'd imagine it's highly unlikely these won't .
The helmets on the heavy intercessors look like they're trying to evoke the look of Indomitus armor, and for that I hate them because they are not updated Indomitus Terminator models.
I’ll be buying 2 of this box for sure and hopefully getting 10 more flayed ones second hand. I play both SM and Necrons and want literally all of these models in multiples—except maybe the chronomancer, but he’s the best cryptek so will be easy to sell.
Wha-Mu-077 wrote: And everyone ignores how Necrons also have two units kicked behind the box because they're not another stupidly overpowered Marines piece of garbage that Marine Players need to get their hands on RIGHT NOW because they might lose a game one day otherwise
I didn't ignore that. One, Flayed Ones are technically available now. Sure, their Finecast and good luck actually tracking down somewhere they aren't sold out, but they were already available. Two, I think the demand for the characters is far less than the demand for the units on either side. I was planning on just kitbashing my Plasmancer from the Indomitus box to save money even in the event of a solo release. I suspect a number of people probably were going to do it or have done it with the Dark Imperium Gravis Captain too. Even if that is the case a single purchase is a whole lot easier to stomach for those not patient enough to wait for the solo releases.
I would take it as a kindness if you calm your vitriol on space marines. If you were joking, it didn't come out in text to me. If you were not, it makes you seem just as petulant of those you wish to insult.
Chopstick wrote: Clearly people would buy this for the doors. The best kind of terrain. You also get necron LEGO blocks as a bonus!
I pondered the last set because of the terrain, even though I didn't really want Wolf Reavers or Random tau box. Didn't get it, but I thought about it.
But this terrain is just soooo bad. Most of it barely hides crouching flayed ones and I've no idea what to do with stand alone doors.
If it isn't priced at a real bargain for the four kits, I can't imagine buying this. The doors and lego blocks add negative value to this box, and its frankly sad as it is with 12 whole models.
If it isn't priced at a real bargain for the four kits, I can't imagine buying this. The doors and lego blocks add negative value to this box, and its frankly sad as it is with 12 whole models.
I say 160€ because it will be the only source for the models for a while and it is advertised as full starter set
Chopstick wrote: Clearly people would buy this for the doors. The best kind of terrain. You also get necron LEGO blocks as a bonus!
I pondered the last set because of the terrain, even though I didn't really want Wolf Reavers or Random tau box. Didn't get it, but I thought about it.
But this terrain is just soooo bad. Most of it barely hides crouching flayed ones and I've no idea what to do with stand alone doors.
If it isn't priced at a real bargain for the four kits, I can't imagine buying this.
I quite expect it to be $210. The same as the Warcry Catacombs box. And yes, I recognize it has much less that even Catacombs has. I certainly don't think it will be less than $150. Basically, Kill Team Arena+2 Faction Kill Team Starter Boxes ($90+$65+65+2021 GW prices)
So I don't think it is going to be a worthwhile purchase for those not wanting to play Kill Team beyond maybe a single box as the new squads certainly aren't going to cover the big price tag. I have my doubts about those wanting to play Kill Team too. I like all the contents, but I am not quite sure if I like $210 for it just yet.
Saturmorn Carvilli wrote: I quite expect it to be $210. The same as the Warcry Catacombs box. And yes, I recognize it has much less that even Catacombs has. I certainly don't think it will be less than $150. Basically, Kill Team Arena+2 Faction Kill Team Starter Boxes ($90+$65+65+2021 GW prices)
So I don't think it is going to be a worthwhile purchase for those not wanting to play Kill Team beyond maybe a single box as the new squads certainly aren't going to cover the big price tag. I have my doubts about those wanting to play Kill Team too. I like all the contents, but I am not quite sure if I like $210 for it just yet.
Agreed. When Catacombs came out, I thought GW might give customers a break and so I wrote that my guess was $160 because of less product. Wrong. So while I'm tempted to guess GW will push it higher, I think they will try to make $210 the new "normal" for boxed sets. If profits remain steady or go higher, then they'll push prices higher. If sales tank, then they might put more product in future boxes to make the $210 look more reasonable.
Flayers. While I do need them, I want to see the price on the individually boxed Flayers. If they are higher than the Failcast ones, I'll either kitbash [there are a number of kitbashing articles on the web], or just give up on Necrons in Kill Team. With Deathwatch, AdMech, and the Plague Marines from Space Heroes Series 3 [Not assembled or painted yet], I've plenty of KT options, and I own Rogue Trader as well.
Not sure the value is there for me in GW, not at these prices. And if you look at my signature, I have other miniature gaming options with better value (at least for me).
If it’s $160, I’ll probably buy it even though I’ll print my own terrain. If it’s $200+, nope.
I just bought Indomitus and 2 of the elite boxes to start back into 40K after many editions away. The fact that it comes with the rules to use the models from Indomitus as well just gives me more play possibilities.
Also with terrible weapon and 5" move the melee only 5 flayed one "kill team" (worth 10 pts each) will be absolutely demolished by heavy bolter primaris.
They're so stingy they couldn't afford to give people 10 flayed one, which is 100 pts.
Flayers. While I do need them, I want to see the price on the individually boxed Flayers. If they are higher than the Failcast ones, I'll either kitbash [there are a number of kitbashing articles on the web], or just give up on Necrons in Kill Team. With Deathwatch, AdMech, and the Plague Marines from Space Heroes Series 3 [Not assembled or painted yet], I've plenty of KT options, and I own Rogue Trader as well.
I would put the upper limit to new Necron Flayers at $55. I would kinda expect them to be less, but Lumineth Stone Guard are 5 on 32mm and kinda wanted in numbers. So I wouldn't be entirely surprised at $55.
Darnok wrote:This box can not possibly cost more than 100€ ($120?).
Oh, it most certainly can. And will. Kill Team Arena came out with far less and was $90. At $120, that won't even cover the costs of the character and unit models. This isn't a starter, old models or even factions not in demand. That book, board and terrain are more than enough to have GW believe they can sell this box for more than all the other models at RRP. The only reason I won't complete write this off as not a jerk move is the fact I do think GW is going to charge a pretty penny for it. I think for anything less that $150 (probably $170) this will sellout in less than half-an-hour. And GW knows it. Which does make it a jerk move IMO on their part if and when it comes out at around $210.
I guess it's pretty obvious that I was not that serious. Of course it can cost more, and it just might. To me it stops being "value" beyond that point though.
Having said that: GW never ceases to amaze me with their pricing choices. We'll see how this one goes...
Chopstick wrote: Clearly people would buy this for the doors. The best kind of terrain. You also get necron LEGO blocks as a bonus!
I pondered the last set because of the terrain, even though I didn't really want Wolf Reavers or Random tau box. Didn't get it, but I thought about it.
But this terrain is just soooo bad. Most of it barely hides crouching flayed ones and I've no idea what to do with stand alone doors.
If it isn't priced at a real bargain for the four kits, I can't imagine buying this.
I quite expect it to be $210. The same as the Warcry Catacombs box. And yes, I recognize it has much less that even Catacombs has. I certainly don't think it will be less than $150. Basically, Kill Team Arena+2 Faction Kill Team Starter Boxes ($90+$65+65+2021 GW prices).
Wow. I thought I was cynical about GW pricing. At $150 all they'd get from me is mocking laughter. $210, I'd seriously suggest they stop sneaking into Bugman's backroom for pints when they're making decisions.
At the end of the day it'd still be cheaper than buying everything separatedly. But most of the cost come from heavily inflated price of the 2 characters, book and cardboard. Which should cost around 160US$ according to GW.
If it's $160 I'll pick it up from an online discounter, if it's $210 I'll probably skip it completely and just get the rulebook. I really like the board and the terrain, and I've still got my Indomitus box set that needs to be assembled and painted, this would be a great excuse to do so. It's been easier to get my old friends to play Kill Team than full 40K for quite a while now, and I love the Necron tomb vibe even if it's just some doors and boxes
If this doesn't MSRP at $210 I will be very, very surprised. They surprised me with BB2020's price but I don't think it will be a pattern.
EDIT: Also, I collected a small necron force of the classic plastics for use in Grim Dark Future. I was worried that these flayed ones would tempt me but am relieved that the new style just doesn't grab me.
Normal troop choice and heroes aren't "kill team exclusive", these are the same kind of "time exclusive" they pack in some of their other "battle box", Except this one got even worse value because they throw in overpriced card board and KT book and the worst kind of terrain one could ask for to justify selling it at the same price or more than their battle boxes.
The 60$ box Kill team with time exclusive heroes was much better than this.
Rogue Trader didn't have any "40k release". And they're actually a Kill team exclusive with character and unique troop being on a same sprue.
They also form a somewhat more coherent and playable "Kill team" than these wacky new "Kill team", Which didn't even have enough to form a 100 pts non-commander force. A 5 man Flayed one KT is a crap team, leader being a Flayed one with 1 W and can't provide any range support, so straight from the box it's a 4 man team + a wizard with leader hiding in corner doing nothing
Missed opportunity to have the box be a Mechanicus vs Necron. Far more thematic than Marines cs Necrons and on top of the they could have tied it in with models from the one video game that came out where you controlled Mechanicus going into a Pyramid.
That's deliberate, I suspect.
The last necron vs ad mech box set hung around on shelves for a long time. The sort of local shops near me still had a few last January, I was thinking about picking them up if they went on sale, but then 2020 happened.
I expect it won't be less then US$160, and I would not be surprised to see US$210. Remember, Brexit is a thing now, and that means the return of the stupid UK Export Tax. There is no way in GW is just going to absorb that cost. They are going to pass that on to the consumer. The annual GW price hike? This year it'll be over 15% for sure. We'll be back in a situation where it will be way cheaper to buy GW products in the UK then anywhere else in the world.
This box set is going to sell out immediately because Space Marine players won't be seeing Heavy Intercessors or the Gravix Captain for months (I bet late Fall/Winter 2021). eBay is about to be flooded with Chronomancers, Flayed Ones, and Kill Team stuff.
Ugh, what a cynical, negative post. Have I become just too jaded by GW???
But from GW's perspective, they want speciality two army boxes to sell out. When the ones wth marines do and the ones without marines don't (wrath and rapture was another that lingered), what conclusions do you think they're going to draw? And so. More boxes with marines in.
Though admittedly, some, like the Phoenix box for Psychic snooze fest, was gak because they filled it with gak and charged an unreasonable price.
privateer4hire wrote: If this doesn't MSRP at $210 I will be very, very surprised. They surprised me with BB2020's price but I don't think it will be a pattern.
EDIT: Also, I collected a small necron force of the classic plastics for use in Grim Dark Future. I was worried that these flayed ones would tempt me but am relieved that the new style just doesn't grab me.
I dunno. Maybe they are going back to the times where you got a good starter for a good price,,
BB was well received at that price.
But I’d have thought they’d put more in for a higher price, than drop down with less stuff.
(I suppose if BB is the start of something, that could be that specialist game sets being well priced. As opposed to the rest..
Which doesn’t necessarily help here, but would be nice for Necromunda or other things that come etc..)
I'm not getting it, but $160 for that teeny tiny playset? As long as they're okay with them still being on eBay in 2024. At $210 I think we might see a new CEO before summer.
Chopstick wrote: Rogue Trader didn't have any "40k release". And they're actually a Kill team exclusive with character and unique troop being on a same sprue.
They also form a somewhat more coherent and playable "Kill team" than these wacky new "Kill team", Which didn't even have enough to form a 100 pts non-commander force. A 5 man Flayed one KT is a crap team, leader being a Flayed one with 1 W and can't provide any range support, so straight from the box it's a 4 man team + a wizard with leader hiding in corner doing nothing
Although you are correct that Rogue Trader was unique to Kill Team, I wasn't referring to them.
Let me put it another way; Kill Team usually uses whatever 40K gets first. For example, plastic Banshees and Incubi. For a short time Kill Team players had to purchase the 40K Blood of the Phoenix set to obtain them. With Pariah Nexus KT players will get the flayers and heavies first, for a short time. Its nice to have it that way around, for a change.
Keep in mind that Pariah Nexus is an expansion for indoor combat. The Flayers won't need to rely as much on ranged weapons in this style of play.
Tamwulf wrote: Remember, Brexit is a thing now, and that means the return of the stupid UK Export Tax. There is no way in GW is just going to absorb that cost. They are going to pass that on to the consumer.
What? I think you might have this a bit wrong. Are you thinking of VAT (value added tax, a flat rate tax on almost everything), or possibly "the stupid US Import Tax"? As far as I'm aware there's no such thing as a "UK Export Tax" and I shudder to think of what that would do to an economy, seems like a terrible idea even just considering the optics (disclaimer, I'm not an accountant).
frankelee wrote: I'm not getting it, but $160 for that teeny tiny playset? As long as they're okay with them still being on eBay in 2024. At $210 I think we might see a new CEO before summer.
It all depends. If the current CEO keeps the stockholders happy, then it does not matter if the consumers are angry. As long as the stockholders get their dividends, it's all good.
Still, I'd think it would be easier to keep dividends high if you grow sales, not shrink them.
I can still find Catacombs set for Warcry on the local store shelves. The original starter disappeared within weeks. So I'd say it didn't really *work* as great as before. Honestly, with the contents it has, it should be priced at just above the Underworlds 2-player starters, so around Start Collecting price.
Current KT starter are still on sale while "door-terrain" KT arena are sold out.
On the other note "Door-terrain" are lazy and low effort kit with little thought put behind it. Since these thing can't connect to anything. Back in the day when they made "door-terrain" like FW zone mortalis they at least made the door open and close.
Cronch wrote: I can still find Catacombs set for Warcry on the local store shelves. The original starter disappeared within weeks. So I'd say it didn't really *work* as great as before. Honestly, with the contents it has, it should be priced at just above the Underworlds 2-player starters, so around Start Collecting price.
you could see Indominus on store shelves before the 2nd print run and shops asking around if people want to buy it
yet it was sold out at GW and hard to get online
if a FLGS cannot sell it, GW don't care as it is the problem of the shop while for them it is "sold" and gone
but lets see, I think GW is starting to overstretch again but this time they don't riks the main product but test it with specialist games which they can cancel easily (if KT and Warcry dies because they are too expensive, it will be hard for those who liked the game, but GW won't lose much)
Albino Squirrel wrote: It's amazing how they manage to make each Kill Team release worse than the last. And it'll probably be more expensive than the last starter set.
According to the preview( and previous article for Kill Team ), Pariah Nexus is not a starter set but an expansion. One will also need the core manual and optionally Commanders for the two characters. It also does not come with dice nor tokens for the two teams.
Cronch wrote: I can still find Catacombs set for Warcry on the local store shelves. The original starter disappeared within weeks. So I'd say it didn't really *work* as great as before. Honestly, with the contents it has, it should be priced at just above the Underworlds 2-player starters, so around Start Collecting price.
The FLGS nearest me still had 4-5 copies of the Main Warcry box set well into the pandemic. They sold off all their GW stock to a competitor to help bridge bills, otherwise they would still have them. I think your seeing how your local shop works and believing it to be like that around the world.
I picked up an Indomitus set recently that was from wave 1, so it just depend on how well the store orders for itself and I found it plans on carrying some of these one off print runs throughout the year expecting the game to grow and expand. When you know GW is not going to make enough to satisfy future orders, sometimes you go big so you can have product later. It’s not ideal for small shops, but you need to have starter sets to grow a base.
I meant more like all the "local" game stores, not one store's shelves. Even GW proper has it in stock. But you are correct that anecdotal evidence isn't proof of anything on it's own.
this time they don't riks the main product but test it with specialist games which they can cancel easily
Idk, there has been steady (and entirely unannounced) price-rising for their main lines too. in AoS the LRL are more expensive than IDK despite both being the same quantity and quality, the big monster kits each one is more expensive than comparable previous kits.
They're firmly in their usual old rut of price-rise every year and making the loss-leaders less and less appealing.
Cronch wrote: I can still find Catacombs set for Warcry on the local store shelves. The original starter disappeared within weeks. So I'd say it didn't really *work* as great as before. Honestly, with the contents it has, it should be priced at just above the Underworlds 2-player starters, so around Start Collecting price.
But we know it definitely won’t be anything near that good value.
Two characters at £22 ish each. And two units for £30 and £40 something like that?
Then the “extra stuff” in there too.
Expansion, with thin booklet that give profile cost for unit in the box, maybe some stratagem and how to play the game too if they're feeling generous.
Best way to get your hand on the hot new flayed dudes or marine with slightly different bolters is to camp ebay. that way you can avoid overpaying for those cardboard and 48 Necron doors + blocks
On a different thought Necron Doors + blocks look like decent terrain piece for Adeptus titanicus and AI.
frankelee wrote: I'm not getting it, but $160 for that teeny tiny playset? As long as they're okay with them still being on eBay in 2024. At $210 I think we might see a new CEO before summer.
It's Marines and a strong unit at that. Anything else and I'd agree but never underestimate the (lack of) willpower in Marine whales.
SamusDrake wrote: By what they've said so far, Pariah Nexus covers just the Indomitus Marines & Necrons. Its an expansion to add confined fighting to the core game.
Kill Team: Arena already added fighting in confined spaces to the Core game. Why should Arena owners pay twice for the same rules? The exclusive models will eventually be released separately. Don't see the draw myself.
Ancestral Hamster wrote: Kill Team: Arena already added fighting in confined spaces to the Core game. Why should Arena owners pay twice for the same rules? The exclusive models will eventually be released separately. Don't see the draw myself.
Apparently its got "new rules" for confined areas. What those rules will be is anyones guess, although...
Can the Flayed Ones make the most of the darkness to cut down their enemies?
...sounds like a new feature, but I only had the pleasure of the BSF confined rules, not the ones for Arena and Rogue Trader, so I wouldn't like to say.
New rule usually just meant new scenario and some lame interaction with the new "terrain" aka completely worthless.
Also 2d "confined battle" Killteam is pretty much the poor-man and low budget version of the game. it'd be hilarious to charge people a lot for it, lol.
£95 seems about right for GW currently, even though it's basically paying for the new kits with no/very little discount. If I was going to jump into Kill Team I wouldn't be going for a box with scatter terrain. In fact, not sure what's going on with Kill Team to even consider jumping in.
The Killzones might be worth picking up as I'm looking for more skirmish games with the lack of gaming.
Biggest news there is sector fronteris is coming back!
Oh and that price looks. . . terrible for the KT starter. Wow. In fact it's pretty crazy even by GW standards. Heck I was planning on picking it up since I want both HI and flayed ones. Looks like I'll be skipping it if that price is correct. I don't need either that badly.
I suppose they justify it by including an old out of date KT rulebook plus updated rules for new models.
Chopstick wrote: What a deal!!!!111 each troop is 50$, hero is 30$ each, you basically get the rest for FREEEE!!
Still a no buy for me though, lol.
Still on the fence about it. If it has the rules and everything I'll most likely buy it as I haven't gotten into Kill Team yet. The scatter isn't a huge draw for me, but as I am building both Necrons and Primaris the combo of models are all new to me and I can get a discount on this box just like the others. THe scatter can be base decoration or terrain elements If I don't like the system.
The price is basically alright if you actually want to play Kill Team and don't already have the rules, board, dice, tokens, etc. As a pure miniatures box it's too much but they've never touted it as that
Still on the fence about it. If it has the rules and everything I'll most likely buy it as I haven't gotten into Kill Team yet. The scatter isn't a huge draw for me, but as I am building both Necrons and Primaris the combo of models are all new to me and I can get a discount on this box just like the others. THe scatter can be base decoration or terrain elements If I don't like the system.
You're gonna need more necron unit to actually form a team, Flayed one even with the new "buffed" profile are still pretty bad. And you don't want a flayed one to be your leader, Leader and Commander are 2 different units and leader is always required and is more important than Commander.
omfg new kill zones, and one of them is Fronteris, this is great. As someone that's bought several KT starters and multiple Uprising / Mortalis boxes, this makes me exceedingly happy.
Well the GW Whisperers here called it at $160. They know their GeeDubs.
It's neat they're re-releasing the original Killzones, when the first two came out I thought they were going to get me for half a dozen of those boxes, but everyone after that was poor value and filled with terrain I didn't like.
Both Sector Munitorium and Sector Fronteris are returning. Good, as I missed them the first time. Will have to see how much they cost, then figure which one I want more. Leaning towards Sector Fronteris as you can only get the large building in that set, while the cranes in Sector Munitorium can be bought separately.
As for Pariah Nexus, cheaper than I thought (expected $210), but still too much for what's in the box.
@Theophony. You'll need some Immortals and Warriors, and if your group plays with Elites, a sword & board Lychguard for a tanky CC figure. Deathmarks do not seem worth it, even though they have a teleport tactic.
Chopstick wrote: What a deal!!!!111 each troop is 50$, hero is 30$ each, you basically get the rest for FREEEE!!
Still a no buy for me though, lol.
Still on the fence about it. If it has the rules and everything I'll most likely buy it as I haven't gotten into Kill Team yet. The scatter isn't a huge draw for me, but as I am building both Necrons and Primaris the combo of models are all new to me and I can get a discount on this box just like the others. THe scatter can be base decoration or terrain elements If I don't like the system.
Before you drop the money be aware that Pariah Nexus is an expansion and not a starter set. In addition you will need a copy of the Kill Team core manual, and Kill Team: Commanders to use the Captain and Chronomancer.
That aside, if you take the plunge and need more Necrons and Primaris then the 40K Recruit Edition for £32.50 is highly recommended.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Billicus wrote: The price is basically alright if you actually want to play Kill Team and don't already have the rules, board, dice, tokens, etc. As a pure miniatures box it's too much but they've never touted it as that
It has the rules to use Indomitus models and to play indoor missions, not the rules for the game itself. They've already announced the full contents of the box and it does not include dice nor tokens.
The kit also includes all of the rules to use the models from the Indomitus boxed set in your games of Kill Team, including Assault Intercessors and Necron Warriors armed with gauss reapers.
With models, rules, AND terrain, it’s everything you need to start playing Kill Team.
Chopstick wrote: What a deal!!!!111 each troop is 50$, hero is 30$ each, you basically get the rest for FREEEE!!
Still a no buy for me though, lol.
Still on the fence about it. If it has the rules and everything I'll most likely buy it as I haven't gotten into Kill Team yet. The scatter isn't a huge draw for me, but as I am building both Necrons and Primaris the combo of models are all new to me and I can get a discount on this box just like the others. THe scatter can be base decoration or terrain elements If I don't like the system.
Before you drop the money be aware that Pariah Nexus is an expansion and not a starter set. In addition you will need a copy of the Kill Team core manual, and Kill Team: Commanders to use the Captain and Chronomancer.
That aside, if you take the plunge and need more Necrons and Primaris then the 40K Recruit Edition for £32.50 is highly recommended.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Billicus wrote: The price is basically alright if you actually want to play Kill Team and don't already have the rules, board, dice, tokens, etc. As a pure miniatures box it's too much but they've never touted it as that
It has the rules to use Indomitus models and to play indoor missions, not the rules for the game itself. They've already announced the full contents of the box and it does not include dice nor tokens.
The kit also includes all of the rules to use the models from the Indomitus boxed set in your games of Kill Team, including Assault Intercessors and Necron Warriors armed with gauss reapers.
With models, rules, AND terrain, it’s everything you need to start playing Kill Team.
See that’s what I thought, a starting point for new players. I bought Indomitus, two of the Elite edition and a psychomancer, so this set fits nicely into my plan.
The kit also includes all of the rules to use the models from the Indomitus boxed set in your games of Kill Team, including Assault Intercessors and Necron Warriors armed with gauss reapers.
With models, rules, AND terrain, it’s everything you need to start playing Kill Team.
Then this...
With models, rules, AND terrain, it’s everything you need to start playing Kill Team.
...is clearly contradicting...
this expansion introduces new rules for close combat encounters in its claustrophobic depths.
...and...
While you wait, take a look at the full (and we mean FULL) contents of the boxed set.
Without the core manual its not everything one needs to play kill team, which is not shown at all. Neither are the dice and tokens.
Twice in two articles they have said that this is an expansion. They have emphasised in brackets "and we mean FULL" - using caps that we have seen all the contents of the box in the following image.
Either they have made a mistake in the revealing of the contents and its not an expansion, or in their last statement.
An expansion can still contain all the rules necessary to play that expansion as a tand-alone game. They don't say it includes everything in Kill Team, they say it includes "everything you need to start playing kill Team", which is too vague to make assumptions on.
We know it comes with the Pariah Nexus rulebook, and it's safe to presume that book includes the base KT rules and rules for at least the 2 commanders in the box, plus they specifically mention it includes rules for the Indomitus models. Beyond that, we don't know either way if this can completely replace the Core book, replace all the books, or not replace any books and you still need the old Core, Commanders and Elites for a full game, they haven't said.
There is no reason to presume any such thing Kalamedea. No prior KT expansion has included the base KT rules. Not one of the existing expansions, i.e. Rogue Trader, Commanders, Elites or Arena, had any of the base rules. The core rulebook has always been needed.
It is not inconceivable that you could be proven right, but I find it highly unlikely. Hell, I would doubt that this book will contain all of the Space Marine and Necron data sheets. I expect it, like Commanders, Elites and the Annual, to include only the new data sheets.
No reason to presume, other than that's what GW has explicitly stated, you mean. It comes with a book and specifically says "With models, rules, AND terrain, it’s everything you need to start playing Kill Team."
I think the issue here is that they are arguing two different points.
It will contain the rules for playing Kill Team and include iTunes for the indomitus units.
What it most likely won’t contain are the other unit rules from the original rule book for non-indomitus units.
So it will be fully playable as a standalone game or expanded with other Indomitus units but you will need to pick up the main rule book if you want to play as Genestealer cult.
Kalamadea wrote: No reason to presume, other than that's what GW has explicitly stated, you mean. It comes with a book and specifically says "With models, rules, AND terrain, it’s everything you need to start playing Kill Team."
And with all due respect they have specifically shown that it does not come with dice, tokens and data cards. If this was a starter set then it would have those items.
I’m guessing there will be dice and tokens so people can play the boxed game. Probably also profiles from Indomitus units, but that’s it. If you want to play any other faction, or older Marine units you will likely need to buy the core rulebook.
I feel like this was a missed opportunity to update Kill Team’s janky rules.
Chopstick wrote: Expansion, with thin booklet that give profile cost for unit in the box, maybe some stratagem and how to play the game too if they're feeling generous.
Best way to get your hand on the hot new flayed dudes or marine with slightly different bolters is to camp ebay. that way you can avoid overpaying for those cardboard and 48 Necron doors + blocks
On a different thought Necron Doors + blocks look like decent terrain piece for Adeptus titanicus and AI.
You will pay for them though. Reseller will be looking at making profit as well. So he will add up enough price you would be looking to pay same as if you bought whole set and sold marine/necron hjalf you didn't need
Danny76 wrote: Thing is they’ve said everything you need to play (even if they mean “play this limited version with just these models”)
So there must be dice.
Otherwise you wouldn’t play even with just those units in the box.
So there could be dice and tokens easily.
Well, on this one I would be happy to be wrong because drawing in 40K players who haven't already taken the plunge can only be a good thing for the game. Kill Team was largely ignored last year and it would be very annoying if this disappoints new players by failing to live up to one of its key promises.
Moving forward, they mentioned that there would be another KT article this week so hopefully they will put to rest any assumptions about Pariah Nexus.
It would really be ideal if the Pariah Nexus book was the full Kill Team rules just with different scenarios using the terrain it provides. Some errata and cleaning up the wound damage phase would be great and make the game much more playable too.
That said I think it would be asking for too much.
For a 40k player who want to take the plunge. Pariah nexus is the worst choice. Get the previous starter with T'au and Marine, buy troops box serparately , all those options were far better than this.
KT is pretty much in a stable state at this point, other than updated data sheets to 9th ed, no expansion was needed for the game, especially boring expansion for the "2d arena game" like this one.
I don't understand the obssession with getting shiny new big box to get into the game, especially when said box have terrible team composition for the Necron, like seriously, who build a necron team with only Flayed one? and you need 10 to at least fill in the minimum 100 pts team with their 8th ed point cost. GW was so helll bent on saving cost they couldn't even give you 5 more flayed one to form a team.
SamusDrake wrote: They did it for Titanicus so it would certainly be a possibility.
Honestly if they did that and cleaned up the rulebook so that killing a model with ranged fire didn’t take three years and every person I play with didn’t have a different interpretation of how damage and wounds work, I would get back in with this pack. Kill Team is a game I really want to like but the sloppy rule writing really makes it hard for me to have fun with. I love 40k aesthetically and the lore, just wish they could make a decent skirmish game with it.
Chopstick wrote: For a 40k player who want to take the plunge. Pariah nexus is the worst choice. Get the previous starter with T'au and Marine, buy troops box serparately , all those options were far better than this.
KT is pretty much in a stable state at this point, other than updated data sheets to 9th ed, no expansion was needed for the game, especially boring expansion for the "2d arena game" like this one.
That set is pretty good, and it would be a shame to retire it in favour of Pariah Nexus.
Must admit that I was hoping for only a book with the rules for 9th edition units, only to use the new warriors and assault intercessors from the recruit edition. One thing I liked about Kill Team was that a copy of the core manual and First Strike was all one needed to get started.
They really should have a different version of the set without the terrain to be honest, 48x pieces of necron specific terrain... I know imperial style terrain won't be everyones cup of tea but it's at least a little more generic, or they could have just included really general wall/barricade sections.
Anyway, it's the terrain that is the issue for the price, all opinions and everything but I don't even think the terrain is that good to be honest, it would look awful on a 40k table unless you combine a lot of it to make a bigger terrain piece, which defeats the object of using it for kill team then.
I think a lot of people are use to GW pricing now, but based on the specific plastic in the box, this is a big old swing and a miss price wise. £95 for 60 models is good value really, but like I said above, the specific models in the box (80%) of them are awful and not really of the size of full models anyway. Being generous and saying each one of the terrain pieces is the equivalent of half of a model, it's really £95 for 36 models, and again, 24x (66%) of those models just aren't great.
The command edition of 40k is a much better deal for £10 more, and providing you can get the kill team rules, would serve as a better starter for kill team also. 2 start collecting boxes (old price) and a 20% discount from a 3rd party would be a better start for both also.
Anyway, looks like I'll be waiting for the heavy intercessor and captain kits. With a 20% discount, it would still be £76 and I do very much doubt there will be enough demand for the necrons to get a good reselling price out of them (over the odds) and definitely not the terrain.
I may actually buy the heavy intercessors off eBay myself if they aren't stupid money.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Just to add to this though... If Eradicators are £31.50 for 3x, how much will the heavy intercessor box actually be? It may actually look like a bargain of a box set for £95 once we know the prices of that kit (Assuming the captain will be the standard £22.50 as well).
endlesswaltz123 wrote: They really should have a different version of the set without the terrain to be honest, 48x pieces of necron specific terrain... I know imperial style terrain won't be everyones cup of tea but it's at least a little more generic, or they could have just included really general wall/barricade sections.
Even calling it "terrain" is a stretch. It's a few doors and some Necron crates/barrels. Doors aren't really the terrain one uses outside of specifics things like that map. Its not like they have any application outside of KT, and even then their use is limited.
Further reduces the "value" of this already-obscenely overpriced box.
endlesswaltz123 wrote: They really should have a different version of the set without the terrain to be honest, 48x pieces of necron specific terrain... I know imperial style terrain won't be everyones cup of tea but it's at least a little more generic, or they could have just included really general wall/barricade sections.
Even calling it "terrain" is a stretch. It's a few doors and some Necron crates/barrels. Doors aren't really the terrain one uses outside of specifics things like that map. Its not like they have any application outside of KT, and even then their use is limited.
Further reduces the "value" of this already-obscenely overpriced box.
endlesswaltz123 wrote: They really should have a different version of the set without the terrain to be honest, 48x pieces of necron specific terrain... I know imperial style terrain won't be everyones cup of tea but it's at least a little more generic, or they could have just included really general wall/barricade sections.
Even calling it "terrain" is a stretch. It's a few doors and some Necron crates/barrels. Doors aren't really the terrain one uses outside of specifics things like that map. Its not like they have any application outside of KT, and even then their use is limited.
Further reduces the "value" of this already-obscenely overpriced box.
I also agree, I think they've made a mistake with the contents of this, far too expensive.
lord_blackfang wrote: I agree also but this is their... fourth?... box of plastic doors (Underhive, Rogue Trader, Catacombs) so they must be selling well.
I doubt those things are selling because of the doors, though. That'd be like saying that 40k starters sell well because they come with dice.
Even for me--someone who actually wants every single model in the set (minus necron scatter) and sometimes plays kill team--it's going to be a hard "no" at this price.
Quasistellar wrote: Even for me--someone who actually wants every single model in the set (minus necron scatter) and sometimes plays kill team--it's going to be a hard "no" at this price.
I wanted everything even the Necron scatter terrain (figured I could work it into some some larger foam pieces) and I'm also a hard "no".
Well, assuming I can sell the Flayed ones and the marines.
I’d possibly grab the box and keep all the rules and terrain (maybe the two characters, depending how much I can make back from the two units).
IF the game can still be played without those two units of course.
I don’t mind needing to own the Rulebook for unit profiles, as I already have it. But I want this box to have more use that ‘if you own these two units you can play it’
There’ll be no shortage of people wanting those new kits, so I should be able to move them on.
The price is too steep for me. Assuming the Killzones book comes with the new datasheets, I'll skip the big box and just get the book and Sector Fronteris.
The highlight here for me is the return of Sector Fronteris! I have lusted for that kit for a while now, and din't feel like paying scalper prices for it. So that's going to be a definite purchase for me.
Quasistellar wrote: Even for me--someone who actually wants every single model in the set (minus necron scatter) and sometimes plays kill team--it's going to be a hard "no" at this price.
I have to ask why. Because based on regular GW pricing,
2 character models are 45 quid total
5 heavy intercessors are probably 35 quid
5 flayed ones are probably 17 quid(?), given they should be in a box of 10 that'll cost at least 35 quid.
That's 97 quid bought separately. The Kill Team box would get you the scatter terrain for free and you'd spend 2 quid less than retail.
A real discount on the box would be nice, but if you're willing to buy it all separately AND want the scatter terrain, then it seems an ok buy, at least in GW terms.
If the costs I've quoted are actually better then this box gets worse in comparison, but I don't think it's too far off.
Quasistellar wrote: Even for me--someone who actually wants every single model in the set (minus necron scatter) and sometimes plays kill team--it's going to be a hard "no" at this price.
I have to ask why. Because based on regular GW pricing,
2 character models are 45 quid total
5 heavy intercessors are probably 35 quid
5 flayed ones are probably 17 quid(?), given they should be in a box of 10 that'll cost at least 35 quid.
That's 97 quid bought separately. The Kill Team box would get you the scatter terrain for free and you'd spend 2 quid less than retail.
A real discount on the box would be nice, but if you're willing to buy it all separately AND want the scatter terrain, then it seems an ok buy, at least in GW terms.
If the costs I've quoted are actually better then this box gets worse in comparison, but I don't think it's too far off.
I'll be amazed if the heavy intercessors are only £35 considering eradicators are £31.50 for 3x. I think we may be looking in the £40's (£42 would be my main guess).
This box has a totally expected price and is actually a fine deal if you want everything in it.
Reminds me of the outrage over the price of Dark Uprising, which turned out to be an incredible value.
If you just want some of the models, you should just have a little patience. It's not like this will be the only place to buy some Heavy Intercessors.
With a little industriousness you could break this out for parts and make a profit pretty easily. Plenty of Kill Team players will want just the book or just the board, terrain, and cards too.
This box has a totally expected price and is actually a fine deal if you want everything in it.
Reminds me of the outrage over the price of Dark Uprising, which turned out to be an incredible value.
If you just want some of the models, you should just have a little patience. It's not like this will be the only place to buy some Heavy Intercessors.
With a little industriousness you could break this out for parts and make a profit pretty easily. Plenty of Kill Team players will want just the book or just the board, terrain, and cards too.
Normally boxes like this give you a discount - this box is bordering on those old GW "bundles" that were simply the same price as buying everything individually.
I've actually been a big defender of boxes like Forgebane and Shadowspear but this box really is trash. It's not outrage to point that out. I was planning to buy multiples but I will buy none at this price. Simple.
Normally boxes like this give you a discount - this box is bordering on those old GW "bundles" that were simply the same price as buying everything individually.
How do you figure there is no discount? It looks like a pretty thick book. The boards, cards and terrain aren't free. Sure it's the same price as the what the 40K models will cost separately but you still get all the Kill Team stuff on top of that. Seems like a reasonable amount of value compared to the buying the models on their own.
I think most people will be happy you aren't buying it though. More to go around. In fact, if anything, the price tag is going to assure it's around for the Kill Team players who do want it all.
All GW boxes give you a discount. Including this one.
Box like Forgebane have value of one side just a bit under the price of the box, thus making the other side basically "free" (the value is still no where as good as older box, with the cost of one side surpassed the price of the box). Me being an average GW consumer who just want one side, can just buy the box and forget about the other side, and still feel like I didn't waste money. Plus petty things like cardboard, and cards (sometime even books) were not factoring in value for the old boxes.
Not the same case with today "value box". People who just want a few things from the box and doesn't want to feel like they're "wasting money" has to engage in ebay selling or splitting it with other. You can still get some value from this box, just get what you want and ebay the rest. It is annoying but it is what it is.
Normally boxes like this give you a discount - this box is bordering on those old GW "bundles" that were simply the same price as buying everything individually.
How do you figure there is no discount? It looks like a pretty thick book. The boards, cards and terrain aren't free. Sure it's the same price as the what the 40K models will cost separately but you still get all the Kill Team stuff on top of that. Seems like a reasonable amount of value compared to the buying the models on their own.
I think most people will be happy you aren't buying it though. More to go around. In fact, if anything, the price tag is going to assure it's around for the Kill Team players who do want it all.
The lines between the two are blurring every day, but the kits in this box are the normal kits that will eventually be on sale. The Flayed Ones kit itself could still be an ETB, but that seems unlikely. I think the ETB releases for Necrons/Marines were done in the first wave of stuff.
The ETB models usually have scenic bases (at least the AOS ones and Necron models do). The Dark Imperium ones didn't, but I don't think these guys are ETB. However, I also doubt they really have any options. Like H.B.M.C. said, the lines are blurring together :/
Doubt you'll be waiting that long for the heavy intercessors anyway, and if you are, honestly, can't say it strikes me as a big problem, no. Marines have plenty of viable troops choices to choose from
I highly doubt they are going to be ETB.
As yeah they’ll just be the regular kit when it comes, as opposed to something for starters.
I don’t think it’ll be a multi part kit, there’s no need really.
It’ll just be monopose 5 on a sprue (maybe with one variant head or arm for a “sergeant” type build I guess)
The lines between the two are blurring every day, but the kits in this box are the normal kits that will eventually be on sale. The Flayed Ones kit itself could still be an ETB, but that seems unlikely. I think the ETB releases for Necrons/Marines were done in the first wave of stuff.
yep, it seems GW is more or less removing the part of the hobby that I appreciate the most
lord_blackfang wrote: I agree also but this is their... fourth?... box of plastic doors (Underhive, Rogue Trader, Catacombs) so they must be selling well.
EDIT: Fifth. Kill Team Arena also.
Underhive(the original Necromunda box) and Rogue Trader were very cheap compared to this new box. Catacombs was too expensive, but you did get some interesting terrain besides a varied array of doors, plus it had the full rulebook and two 10 man teams. Kill Team Arena was also far from this expensive and provided tournament mission format.
The pariah nexus is an all time low effort from GW in my mind. As much as I love KT I will be skipping this box.
Chopstick wrote: Flayed one doesn't have a leader, they're all the same.
Then no options.
Just monopose I’d guess.
Automatically Appended Next Post: My real question is,
When are they gonna release the Gellerpox and Starstriders as little sets.
Either as Kill Team ish boxes or for 40k in some form.
The models are too cool to never be seen again surely..
Chairman Aeon wrote: So the 2019 Annual is sold out online. Is it not needed to be played?
It's a compilation of all the WD article, which added a lot of new unit for Marine, added some new factions, and have update points cost and profile of multiple factions. The profile was changed to match the one from current codex. The 9th ed update for KT I reckon won't come out for at least a year. But I think pariah nexus might have an update cost, and new profile for all necron unit to match their 9th ed rule.
Quasistellar wrote: Even for me--someone who actually wants every single model in the set (minus necron scatter) and sometimes plays kill team--it's going to be a hard "no" at this price.
I have to ask why. Because based on regular GW pricing,
2 character models are 45 quid total
5 heavy intercessors are probably 35 quid
5 flayed ones are probably 17 quid(?), given they should be in a box of 10 that'll cost at least 35 quid.
That's 97 quid bought separately. The Kill Team box would get you the scatter terrain for free and you'd spend 2 quid less than retail.
A real discount on the box would be nice, but if you're willing to buy it all separately AND want the scatter terrain, then it seems an ok buy, at least in GW terms.
If the costs I've quoted are actually better then this box gets worse in comparison, but I don't think it's too far off.
It's an arbitrary line in the sand is all, and I'm voting with my wallet. I'm not going to judge anyone else who wants to buy it. I just feel like boxed sets or standalone games like this should offer more value. I bought Blackstone Fortress for a similar price and think it's good value due to having unique models and just being a solid game in and of itself. I didn't buy Ascension expenasion because it was, quite frankly, preposterously priced. I won't buy this because the included game (2D Kill Team) is terribly unappealing and actually adds negative value for me, as now I have to dispose of all the extra garbage that comes with the models. The Necron terrain is. . . fine. . . I guess. . . but in this day and age I'm not paying any cost over what I'd pay in the price of filament for my 3D printer for scatter terrain.
Let me be clear here: I like boxed sets if they add value in the form of discounted models or an included game system that's actually good. GW is perfectly capable of providing both while also having record profits. Unlike some that post complaints about this stuff, I do understand that cards, cardboard, and dice actually add significant cost to a box set, but that means you have to make them actually worth something to me (such as blackstone fortress did by making the included game actually good).
A pretty good deal, all that extra for +2 points...if you are SM, at least...
There's a relatively popular YT channel that focuses on gameplay called Auspex Tactics that says they're overcosted compared to Intercessors. I couldn't really confirm as I don't care one way or the other, but he gives some data for people that are interested in analysing this stuff. Also, you'd really have to be a SM player for them to be any sort of good deal, but I take it...from your excessive use of dots...that you just don't like marines (fresh and original sentiment for this community, pls tell us more).
3W unit at under 20 points with better weapon is overcosted? Oh yeah suuuuure. Did you know an ogryn is T5, 3W and they cost 25 pts, and have to sloth through the battlefield to attack people, because their weapon's range is 12".
Also Flayed one is 1W and they have to fight 5 marines at 3W each, oof.
A pretty good deal, all that extra for +2 points...if you are SM, at least...
There's a relatively popular YT channel that focuses on gameplay called Auspex Tactics that says they're overcosted compared to Intercessors. I couldn't really confirm as I don't care one way or the other, but he gives some data for people that are interested in analysing this stuff. Also, you'd really have to be a SM player for them to be any sort of good deal, but I take it...from your excessive use of dots...that you just don't like marines (fresh and original sentiment for this community, pls tell us more).
Kill team points are different to 9th points. That Auspex discussion isn’t relevant in that context. The preview suggests that heavy intercessors will land at 17pts, in a game where flayed ones are 10 pts and tau stealth suits are 20pts.
Yeah.... wrong game friend. While a Heavy Intercessor in 9th and Kill Team is still called a Heavy Intercessor... two different game systems using different rules and point values.
Quasistellar wrote: Even for me--someone who actually wants every single model in the set (minus necron scatter) and sometimes plays kill team--it's going to be a hard "no" at this price.
I have to ask why. Because based on regular GW pricing,
2 character models are 45 quid total
5 heavy intercessors are probably 35 quid
5 flayed ones are probably 17 quid(?), given they should be in a box of 10 that'll cost at least 35 quid.
That's 97 quid bought separately. The Kill Team box would get you the scatter terrain for free and you'd spend 2 quid less than retail.
A real discount on the box would be nice, but if you're willing to buy it all separately AND want the scatter terrain, then it seems an ok buy, at least in GW terms.
If the costs I've quoted are actually better then this box gets worse in comparison, but I don't think it's too far off.
Uh, you are aware that EVERY single box set GW did in last 5 years or so had anywhere between 30 to 50% of plastic in it free? Until recently at least - and this is changing because people are still mindlessly buying whole stock ignoring multiple price raises per year.
Just look at Start Collecting sets (and these weren't even the best), compared to this a glorified one click 2% discount bundle feels like garbage. And that's on first purchase if you want everything, second and subsequent ones are pure trash because half of the ""value"" is in characters you only need 1 of, but you need multiple copies of the infantry kits...
Chopstick wrote: 3W unit at under 20 points with better weapon is overcosted?
In case you spent last 6 months in a cave, yeah. GW did comically stupid, game breaking decision to bump squats to 2W (and just to appease some whiny, conspiracy theory parroting children too...) which made whole primaris range basically obsolete. Only the better guns barely keep them afloat, and even then, one or the other squat unit will be more efficient in whatever role you want, which forces such rock bottom points to keep them any viable. Who could have guessed breaking design space of whole faction while diminishing it by 90% will cause problems?
Irbis wrote: In case you spent last 6 months in a cave, yeah. GW did comically stupid, game breaking decision to bump squats to 2W (and just to appease some whiny, conspiracy theory parroting children too...)
You think GW changes Marines to W2 to appease people?
Uh, you are aware that EVERY single box set GW did in last 5 years or so had anywhere between 30 to 50% of plastic in it free? Until recently at least - and this is changing because people are still mindlessly buying whole stock ignoring multiple price raises per year.
I'm fully aware of that. I'm just pointing out that if you want ALL the minis in the set, I assume you would be buying them at retail anyways, and you get them all in the KT box for basically the cost of retail.
If you're cool with GW retail prices - and to be fair I'm NOT on plenty of stuff - then the box is business as usual.
I collect SM and Necrons, and I considered buying this box, but the grey pile is getting too big and I haven't even cleared out Indomitus yet. Maybe I'll snap up Necron terrain on e-Bay for cheap and buy the models later on a la carte.
Chopstick wrote: 3W unit at under 20 points with better weapon is overcosted?
In case you spent last 6 months in a cave, yeah. GW did comically stupid, game breaking decision to bump squats to 2W (and just to appease some whiny, conspiracy theory parroting children too...) which made whole primaris range basically obsolete.
*looks through the MFM 2021*
Strange, I see no references to Living Ancestors, Hearthguard or the like in there, so I don't know why you're bringing up Squats in this thread.
And attacking other gamers for liking things you don't is such a good look for you, Irbis.
Yeah it would make more sense with 15 flayed ones against 5 marines or so in this box to balance it out, but as a Necron player I don't think it would make for a very fun game just running towards the Marines, and hoping to maybe cause a wound (0.667 on average) if you can even make it to melee.
Why not just release the kits? I don't really see the point of this box.
Oguhmek wrote: Yeah it would make more sense with 15 flayed ones against 5 marines or so in this box to balance it out, but as a Necron player I don't think it would make for a very fun game just running towards the Marines, and hoping to maybe cause a wound (0.667 on average) if you can even make it to melee.
Why not just release the kits? I don't really see the point of this box.
This expansion takes place in a necron tomb, which one can only assume gives the necrons advantages they would not normally have in regular games of Kill Team. This advantage could likely come from narrative missions designed specifically with the included models in mind.
This is Killteam, not warhammer reenactment, even if you made a scenario where marines slipped on banana peels every single turn, they'd still be bad and unplayable in pretty much everywhere else. Even if I was GW and I was being stingy on production, I'd throw in these cheapo 3 man necron warrior kit as fire support for the team.
Oguhmek wrote: ...
Why not just release the kits? I don't really see the point of this box.
They get guaranteed sales of the box from people who aren’t even into kill team. 40k players will buy them just for the unreleased models. Scalpers will buy them because 40k and KT players will want the box. Everyone wins.
It's basically the Eldar/Drukhari plastic Banshees/Incubi kit all over again, except this time it comes packed with a rulebook and necron terrain nobody seems to want instead of old models nobody wants.
Except me, I want it. $160 is hard to justify even at online discount, and I may skip it and buy the book loose from Ebay resellers, but I still want everything in the box. Really would have been a nice set with some adidtional Necron Warriors and Assault Intersessors though, or at the VERY least 10 flayed ones instead of 5. As-is, I really don't see it being worth the money, unfortunately, even as somebody that plays more KT than 40K
It's says Pariah Nexus has the Kill Team Core Rules included so it can be stand alone...so if I already have Kill Team I need to buy this for the Close Confine rules?
Might worth ebaying the book for datasheet for new marine and necron unit. They probably will get the new destroyer unit, which is very fast and killy.
It's says Pariah Nexus has the Kill Team Core Rules included so it can be stand alone...so if I already have Kill Team I need to buy this for the Close Confine rules?
Yes.
However, if you also have Blackstone Fortress( which is still available ) there is a White Dwarf article called "The deadliest Mission" which includes confine rules for playing Kill Team in the Fortress.
Meanwhile, the Chronomancer can be equipped with a choice of aeonstave or entropic lance and has three head options, alongside one of two chronometrons (one open, one closed) in its left hand.
Ancient Otter wrote: No mention of dice either so would GW expect new players to shell out for the KT dice and card set?
It is indeed confusing, but now that we know it has the core rules, I would assume they would be sensible and add those items simply so that it can be played out of the box.
Meanwhile, the Chronomancer can be equipped with a choice of aeonstave or entropic lance and has three head options, alongside one of two chronometrons (one open, one closed) in its left hand.
Killzones sounds a bit disappointing with only imperium based fields and the death world.
How about chaos-corrupted worlds, or those of xenos? Maybe a battle in a hiveship or craftworld, or a Harlequin amphitheater. Given the whole Imdomitus theme, why not a necron world?
Theyre reusing existing one and and non-imperium terrain usually suck because they didn't provide proper block and cover, lack elevation and combability with other kits. Like the Eldar jungle, which was cast in china and shipped in plastic bags (eew!)
Meanwhile, the Chronomancer can be equipped with a choice of aeonstave or entropic lance and has three head options, alongside one of two chronometrons (one open, one closed) in its left hand.
D'OH!
Though seeing both weapon arms. It would have been nice to see the other two heads or the alternate chronometron.
It was never dead, unlike the average GW side game, it is in a complete state with pretty much every factions playable. Games didn't really need expansion, other than occasionally balance update and adding some new 40k units.
Glass has shared leaks from the Pariah Nexus book, including the table of contents. It does NOT include the core rules. Much like it does not include rules for all Indomitus models. The WarCom articles are rife with errors. This is another such instance.
callidusx3 wrote: Glass has shared leaks from the Pariah Nexus book, including the table of contents. It does NOT include the core rules. Much like it does not include rules for all Indomitus models. The WarCom articles are rife with errors. This is another such instance.
I never believed the "rules for all of the miniatures in Indomitus" blurb anyways. Would have been way OP. And the article about HI's stated that they're going to be the toughest marines in Kill Team (Besides Commanders), so that must have meant that Eradicators will not get rules.
callidusx3 wrote: Glass has shared leaks from the Pariah Nexus book, including the table of contents. It does NOT include the core rules. Much like it does not include rules for all Indomitus models. The WarCom articles are rife with errors. This is another such instance.
Look like a whole 9th ed update for marine with deathwatch, and necron, include all of the tactics.
Chopstick wrote: Look like a whole 9th ed update for marine with deathwatch
Oh boy, I can't wait to see this gigantic middle finger to all the DW primaris players called 'suxxx to be you, no rules or wargear for you whatsoever'.
Or are they going to make the 40K insult even worse and actually drop this insane idiocy and give DW rules they had for years back to further piss 40KDW players by reminding them what they are missing now? Place your bets (ahahahaha, not gonna happen, no bit no rule is king now, what, you thought KT is some sort of customizable skirmish wargame with tons of conversions, upgrades and special equipment available for your squad? )...
Voss wrote: Bunch of characters in terminator armor, so several.
You know what I mean...
I thought I did, yeah. You wanted to know if there are non-Primaris characters. Last I checked no Primaris marines wear terminator armor.
If you meant something else, you're going to have to explain.
---
Speaking of Characters though, this is the first time I've really taken a look at the Heavy rifle gravis captain. He's... probably the most dull and disappointing primaris model I've seen. The squad looks better, because they aren't in the 'Oldmarine Squat' pose, or jamming a stiff, flat piece of fiberboard underneath their backpack and calling it a cloak. And either his backpack or the backpack icon is... tilted. Overall it looks like a fairly dull sergeant model, not a captain.
Until recently at least - and this is changing because people are still mindlessly buying whole stock ignoring multiple price raises per year.
