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The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/05 21:44:29


Post by: Red Harvest


New year, new thread. It's going to be a newsworthy year for Corvus Belli because of the release of N4, and Code One, and Defiance, and some other game, in addition to the usual most excellent minis.

Predictions: we will see fewer releases per month for the first six months of the year since Defiance is taking up production. We will see more boxes, more blisters consolidated into boxes, and fewer blisters.

Adepticon is at the end of March, there may be something big there. GenCon is the end of July. There will be something big there.


A refresher: The February releases named, but no visuals:

-Agents of the Human Sphere. RPG Characters Set
-Mukhtar, Active Response Unit (Boarding Shotgun)
-The Umbra (Repack)
-Intel Spec-Ops (Heavy Pistol, Sniper)

The minis in the Agent's box are all new sculpts. Finally a Mukhtar.

ETA 01/28/20: The battle box, Operation:Kaldstrom, for code one releases at Adepticon. It is Pan-O v. Yu Jing

Here is the schedule for 2020:





The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/05 22:00:11


Post by: .Mikes.


Following on from the conversation in the last thread, I really can't believe CB said they're going to kill off PanO.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/05 22:13:19


Post by: Monkeysloth


Well after Neotexit from 0-12 things were never the same. Varuna stayed with Neotera but Acontecimento demanded a referendum to stay in 0-12 themselves and leave PanO. Lets not talk about the Svalarheima backstop as boy, that's still controversial. It's just a shell of it's former self.





The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/05 23:24:58


Post by: Alpharius


Is it April 1st already?

Damn 2020 is flying by!


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 01:25:19


Post by: Red Harvest


Ha! you could not be more wrong. Look at the new Kusanagi sculpt. There are no combat heels. None. However, there may be some truth to the rumor that the Adepticon LE mini will be a bikini clad Uxia MacNeill. Or the next Aristeia mini will be a bikini clad Uxia MacNeill, or Jeanne d'Arc.

CB isn't killing Pan-O. Just the Neoterrans. You people didn't buy enough Bolts, and this is your punishment, no more nice things for Pan-O...

...Until the next battle box when we get the only other Pan-O sectorial that matters, Svalarheim.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 01:26:37


Post by: Sabotage!


Code One sounds intriguing to me. I loved playing the Icestorm Scenarios and the basic rules of Infinity are great, but as someone who has other hobbies and doesn’t get to play that often full Infinity was too much as there were just so many special rules/equipment to remember. If Code One is more streamlined so that someone who can can only play once a month or so can keep up with it I would enjoy it.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 13:06:59


Post by: SlaveToDorkness


 Red Harvest wrote:
Ha! you could not be more wrong. Look at the new Kusanagi sculpt. There are no combat heels. None. However, there may be some truth to the rumor that the Adepticon LE mini will be a bikini clad Uxia MacNeill. Or the next Aristeia mini will be a bikini clad Uxia MacNeill, or Jeanne d'Arc.

CB isn't killing Pan-O. Just the Neoterrans. You people didn't buy enough Bolts, and this is your punishment, no more nice things for Pan-O...

...Until the next battle box when we get the only other Pan-O sectorial that matters, Svalarheim.


Goddammit! Seriously??? I play Neo. If Bolts were worth a crap (I don’t want a discussion!) I’d play them, I already bought all of them...


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 13:08:54


Post by: Kanluwen


Yeah, Dorkness. The current rumor is that it's Neoterrans being dumped from PanO.


I keep harping on this elsewhere, but man it would be nice if they would just cut Military Orders out and reshuffled them into a NA2 like they did with JSA.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 13:19:33


Post by: Alpharius


 Kanluwen wrote:
Yeah, Dorkness. The current rumor is that it's Neoterrans being dumped from PanO.


I keep harping on this elsewhere, but man it would be nice if they would just cut Military Orders out and reshuffled them into a NA2 like they did with JSA.


That would be a good way to go about it...


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 17:06:54


Post by: Monkeysloth


Agreed. Makes a lot of sense.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 17:56:36


Post by: PsychoticStorm


Not from a background standpoint MO are way to integrated in PanOceania society so is the Church.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 18:04:23


Post by: Kanluwen


And yet they're also supposed to be such a powerful entity that they can field their own forces(mostly by withholding their resurrection tokens except for those 'willing to join the crusade!') without actual PanOceanian military force involvement and they can refuse to join those actual forces...
It's okay to admit that you just don't want to lose your cheap Fusiliers.


Additionally, their range is quite likely responsible for a good chunk of PanO's issues with things being "retired" of late. How many different units of Knights do we really need in the game? Especially with as much potential overlap as most of them have?

There's a big reason why people call them the "wannabe sphess mareenz". CB thinks everyone wants them.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 18:39:38


Post by: PsychoticStorm


I think you know that Fusiliers are out of MO, right? they can field their own forces since they must raise their own forces as they are private military companies "donated" by the church to PanOceania military complex.

I get why you may want MO as NA2 but the NA2 structure as it is does not allow such narrative to exist, it would assume the Church leave PanO and this is not a plausible scenario since they are the most integrated element of PanOceania society.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 19:08:49


Post by: Kanluwen


About time they took them out.

And the NA2 structure was made for this kind of thing. Entities that aren't a "state" in and of themselves, but that have power enough to field their own forces.

There's no requirement for "the church to leave PanO"(and the "most integrated element of PanOceania society" is arguable; that title actually should go to the various corporations) to become a NA2.

But you know that. Druze Society didn't mean that they "left" Haqqislam.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 19:31:27


Post by: Cronch


and the "most integrated element of PanOceania society" is arguable

every game needs a crazy religious fanatics faction, 40k has imperium, Infinity has the PanO


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 19:52:58


Post by: LunarSol


 Kanluwen wrote:

There's a big reason why people call them the "wannabe sphess mareenz". CB thinks everyone wants them.


At least half the time someone asks for a demo for the game, they at some point ask the best way to play the knights.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 20:10:55


Post by: Kanluwen


Yeah, because people talk them up on the 'net as some kind of unique and interesting faction of their own when they're PanO.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 20:12:56


Post by: Red Harvest


Cronch wrote:
and the "most integrated element of PanOceania society" is arguable

every game needs a crazy religious fanatics faction, 40k has imperium, Infinity has the PanO
. Infinity also has the sane religious fanatics faction. And one for the furries <shudder>

Neoterra goes OOP and joins the ASA when Svalarheim releases. Rumored.

The new box of RPG characters for February, what does it mean? A clue to the new game CB hinted at? It seems an odd release at this time.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 20:16:01


Post by: Kanluwen


Probably a way to sneak in updated SpecOps models.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 20:47:21


Post by: PsychoticStorm


 Kanluwen wrote:
About time they took them out.

Thanks, but it has been a while this happened.

 Kanluwen wrote:

But you know that. Druze Society didn't mean that they "left" Haqqislam.


Druze were always a separate faction they are employed by Haqqislam as mercenaries but are not allied to it, in contrast for example to Caplans (or Dahshat) who are owned by Haqqislam corporations.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 LunarSol wrote:

At least half the time someone asks for a demo for the game, they at some point ask the best way to play the knights.


They seem to be quite a popular sectorial.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 20:54:24


Post by: Sqorgar


I think it'd be a mistake for Neoterra to go OOP. The Bolts are sort of my iconic PanO unit. First thing I bought after getting into Infinity with Icestorm was the Neoterran start box. I love them. They could use a little help, but Infinity is a game where you can work with a less than optimal list, if you want to. I'd be super disappointed if NCL was squatted, even if temporarily.

I've got another box of just Bolts around here somewhere, but I'm basically waiting for Code One/N4 to get back into Infinity (hasn't stopped me buying models though). And Defiance I guess. Seem like Infinity is about six months away from a tsunami of awesome, but I'm just paddling around in the pool until then.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 21:20:22


Post by: Absolutionis


 Red Harvest wrote:
Infinity also has the sane religious fanatics faction. And one for the furries <shudder>
Haqqislam seems to be the 'sane' religious faction, but I'm not sure if you're implying the furries are Bakunin Nomads or Morats. Ever since the Nomads basically started getting too friendly with the Shasvasti, they may as well be part of the CA anyways.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 21:21:24


Post by: SlaveToDorkness


I’m building terrain!


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/06 23:54:11


Post by: Chairman Aeon


But I don't want to have to find the money to buy some Bolts right now...

I don't get MO in Infinity. I mean I understand CB's historicals background, but space knights just seems dumb this side of Star Wars.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/07 06:01:04


Post by: Red_Five


 Chairman Aeon wrote:
But I don't want to have to find the money to buy some Bolts right now...

I don't get MO in Infinity. I mean I understand CB's historicals background, but space knights just seems dumb this side of Star Wars.


They are just soldiers in heavy armor who happen to hold religion in high regard.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/07 08:13:22


Post by: Cronch


No, they're religious stormtroopers that swear fealty to the Magical Nondenomination Pope, not the state of PanO. They're literally a paramilitary organization armed better than the nation-state soldiers.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/07 11:33:59


Post by: Dropbear Victim


Im sticking to vanilla lists so I don't get attached to any sectorials since the ones I like keep getting taken out back and shot.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/07 17:02:47


Post by: Red_Five


Really excited to see the O-12 Sectorials this year!

I am looking forward to N4 quite a bit. I would prefer if they kept the game complex but eliminated nested rules. I would also like them to go into each army and sectorial and rejigger them all to make sure every profile is good/solid.

I wonder what the points scale will look like in N4. Will they just tack a "0" onto all of the current points. Maybe double the current points? Half it? So a Fusilier is 10 points now. If they just stick a 0 on the end, he would be 100 points. If they doubled him, he would be 20. If they halved it, he would be 5. I do not believe halving is the best way to go, since it limits granularity. Not sure if I want to play 3,000 point games. Doubling seems fine.

 Dropbear Victim wrote:
Im sticking to vanilla lists so I don't get attached to any sectorials since the ones I like keep getting taken out back and shot.


The French will return! They just need a different mechanical identity and better looking models.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/07 17:07:20


Post by: Modock


February releases!






The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/07 17:19:33


Post by: Alpharius


Who is who for what Sectorial in all that?


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/07 17:27:07


Post by: Modock


Mukhtar - boarding shotgun (Ramah TaskForce)

Intel spec-ops - heavy pistol (Ariadna)

Agents of human sphere. RPG Characters Set.
PanO
Nomads
Ariadna
Yu Jing


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/07 17:33:57


Post by: Red_Five


Those RPG characters look solid. Great for Proxies.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/07 17:35:53


Post by: Kanluwen


That SpecOps is decidedly "Meh". She got billed as a sniper+heavy pistol by CB themselves, but man did that not pan out apparently.

Agents is, as I figured, a way to squeak out some new SpecOps. PanO's an Order Sergeant, Nomad seems to be a Moderator, the Ariadnan one seems to be a Kazak, and the YJ one looks to be just super generic.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/07 17:42:55


Post by: Soul Samurai


Glad to finally see the Mukhtar. I'm not a particular fan of the pose though; not saying there's anything wrong with it, just not to my tastes.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/07 17:44:20


Post by: Red_Five


 Soul Samurai wrote:
Glad to finally see the Mukhtar. I'm not a particular fan of the pose though; not saying there's anything wrong with it, just not to my tastes.


At least he is not "Captain Morgan-ing" the tactical rock!


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/07 18:53:26


Post by: ImAGeek


I like the Mukhtar a lot.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/07 19:56:03


Post by: Soul Samurai


 Red_Five wrote:
At least he is not "Captain Morgan-ing" the tactical rock!
True, I was glad to see that!


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/07 21:06:01


Post by: Red Harvest


I thought I was seeing another Raoul Spector mini. Not the Mukhtar sculpt I wanted.

The other minis are varying degrees of nice, but nothing for me this month... except shipping for Defiance, IIRC, will be due.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/08 05:50:33


Post by: schoon


That Agents of the Human Sphere box is gold, especially the "official!"


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/10 16:15:21


Post by: Red_Five


The RPG box totally works as a covert Spec-Ops release.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/10 16:42:18


Post by: precinctomega


Is that Red Hood?

Also: yup. Strong start, CB. I want all of these.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/11 07:28:19


Post by: Soul Samurai


 precinctomega wrote:
Is that Red Hood?
Clearly that's the Orange Hood, Red Hood's lesser-known sidekick/spin-off character. DC's real big on that sort of thing.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/16 05:50:08


Post by: teleute


 Kanluwen wrote:
That SpecOps is decidedly "Meh". She got billed as a sniper+heavy pistol by CB themselves, but man did that not pan out apparently.


That option is included in a bevy of alternate arms. I wish there were pictures since I'm probably going to use her as a sniper chasseur.

"This blister includes an Intel Spec-Ops with Sniper Rifle, Molotok, and CC Weapon options for the right arm and Heavy Pistol and Unarmed hand options for the left arm"


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/17 11:43:08


Post by: Absolutionis


Carlos wouldn't go all the way to the BeastsofWar studio just for an Aristeia release. I bet they have something big coming up soon.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/18 20:59:35


Post by: Cannibal


That Moonchild sculpt looks like a really good alternate Chimera.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/18 23:01:56


Post by: Monkeysloth


 Absolutionis wrote:
Carlos wouldn't go all the way to the BeastsofWar studio just for an Aristeia release. I bet they have something big coming up soon.


I think Code One launches soon.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/19 05:54:05


Post by: schoon


 Cannibal wrote:
That Moonchild sculpt looks like a really good alternate Chimera.

Ooooo. Good call.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/23 02:56:07


Post by: Red Harvest


 Absolutionis wrote:
Carlos wouldn't go all the way to the BeastsofWar studio just for an Aristeia release. I bet they have something big coming up soon.


Code One and the new Pan-O v. Yu Jing battle box are to be released at the end of March, in time for Adepticon. This according to Belén Moreno in a podcast ( in Spanish.) Does that qualify as big? Koni promises new videos at the satellite tounaments ( I suspect the LVO is one of them) starting this week-end.

The Madness begins...


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/23 04:05:02


Post by: .Mikes.


And here's me thinking my wallet would be safe until winter :(


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 12:24:30


Post by: Lord Kragan


So any news on N4? I fell out of the game due to my time continually shrinking.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 17:44:21


Post by: Monkeysloth


brief summery of video:

2020 Preview:

Operation Kaldstrom -- new battlepack (pano, yujin). Code one starter. Released at Adepticon. Two new armies for each faction introduced.

Starting at Adepticon is when infinity will split into 2 games. Code one and N4 which will be released at Gencon.

No Sectorials in Code One (not unexpected).

Code One is important not just for getting new players but retail, having a core set of products for them to stock (this has been talked about before).

ITS season will start right after N4's release in August.

Upcoming releases:

Shasvastii Nox Troops Box -- specops ill be in this box (already painted and should be released soon).

Shasvastii is the current best selling army at filming.

Namurr Active Responce for Haqq -- painted and releasing soon

Q&A section:

N4 has new Crit rules that will be affected by trooper profile

Can Zhanshi be one point cheaper? -- Yujin Number one

On faction balance -- Yes newer armies seam better but there are 37 armies and that's hard to balance all the time. Also don't confuse popularity with army efficiency as they've learned people choose armies not just based off of how well they play. They have an ITS chart showing army wins vs losses and all hover around mid to upper 40% win vs loss. With the largest spread 10% between Shock Army (worst) and Rahamada task force (best win rate). There was a lot to this. Probably be best to go and listen to yourself as it's hard to summarize on one viewing (which is all I have time for) and what I wrote might not be the best summery of what Carlos said. About halfway into the video.

3 More Armies in 2020. 2 of those will be in the new Battle Box. The 3rd one is at end of year.

No Plan for an Australian Sectorial army.

Are Merc options missing Tag or heavy hitters going to get one anytime soon? Can't say. Wait till N4.

Will there by a CB fantasy game? Right now we're working on N4 and there's no current project being worked on. Once N4 and Defiance are done maybe but still probably years away.

We know Pan0 is a mistake -- Pan0 is such a mistake that it has 4 armies and getting another one this year so Neoterra is going away. They can't go above 50 skus (I'm not sure in what this is reference too probably per faction).

Will units disappear in N4 -- Yes. The timeline is advancing and some units will go away.

What's the goal for Hacking N4 -- Simpler and more effective. Less devices, programs and so on.

What's the Mini with the N4 preorder -- They haven't decided. Most likely Merc that will work with any army.

New TAGs in 2020. Some will be resculpts like the Cutter. O-12 is getting one too.

Few things I didn't write down but noting really that important.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 17:59:16


Post by: Alpharius


Thanks for the summary!

Looking forward to N4 and hopefully some level of 'streamlining' (if not 'simplification'), especially when it comes to hacking.

Hopefully TAGs become more useful in N4.

And hopefully the Al-Medinat Sectorial finally sees the light of day in 2020 too (?) !


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 18:00:38


Post by: ImAGeek


 Alpharius wrote:
Thanks for the summary!

Looking forward to N4 and hopefully some level of 'streamlining' (if not 'simplification'), especially when it comes to hacking.

Hopefully TAGs become more useful in N4.

And hopefully the Al-Medinat Ramah Task Force Sectorial finally sees the light of day in 2020 too!


Ramah Task Force has been out for a while now.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 18:04:09


Post by: Alpharius


Yes, I was making a perhaps too subtle joke there...

I was excited by the prospect of the Al-Medinat Sectorial, and disappointed by the reality of the Ramah Task Force!


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 18:59:09


Post by: Monkeysloth


Q&A summery:

Carlos is looking forward more for Adepticon and Code One then N4 as it's closer and the start of a new beginning.

Will Links be powerful in N4? Yes, they're important.

No rules/mechanics from Defiance/Ariestia! in N4 despite rumors. Those games aren't Infinity, they aren't going to radically change the game much. N2 -> N3 is a larger change then N3->N4.

N4 Changes scope question -- N4 is a streamlining of N3 and removing redundancy and volume of rules that aren't needed.

Question about releasing all weapon options in boxes and general release cleanup -- Now products will be marked as especial so hopefully they'll be more in stock. As always about the weapon options they don't sell sprues they sell figures. If they moved the plastic they could but it doesn't work for them in Metal.

Question about Bakunin getting HI and some other stuff -- No. As the figure in question is just trying to mirror how other factions play and that's not what Bakunin is about. They don't deserve TO HI units.

N4 Timeline jump -- yes (as in the other video). The last 3 books were working towards the new N4 timeline as they were moving it forward as well.

Question on improvement to ITS site -- They're focusing on N4 release. Maybe at some point.

What is Carlos wishlist for N4 -- To streamline and allow more people to play. And to get rid of superfluous rules that are the same except for one small part. Rules names are changing too. Like now there's Dodge +3 so people know it is. (I believe this was two different questions I combined into one summery)

What is your favorite tag? -- The Salamander.

Question about MI in N4 -- MI will be a different thing in N4 so they don't have to be "patched" to play.

Top selling stuff -- They're filtering the charts to try and give more accurate results as more recent stuff will obviously sell better, same with battle boxes.
1) CSU (shotgun)
2) Dakini Tacbots
3) Ikadron Batroids
4) Tunguska Jurisdictional Commando
5) Dronbot Remotes (REM) (oldest SKU still in production that Carlos can think of)
6) Invincibles Terra-cotta
7) Zulu-Cobra (jammer)
8) Varuna Immediate Reaction Division
9) Rebots
10) Dragon Lady.

Are Tohaa an endangered species now? -- Yes. They're blocked off from home.

N4 will be the whole game. No splitting into Human Sphere N4 and such. This isn't a remake it's a sequel.

N4 isn't going to really reduce the weapon chart. The focus is on skills and rules. (nothing about ammo).


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 19:48:27


Post by: Alpharius


Another excellent summary and so, another 'thank you'!

Getting excited for N4 more and more now...


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 20:31:12


Post by: Ian Sturrock


Lots of stuff about N4 -- does anyone have a quick and dirty summary of what we can expect from Code One? Simplified ruleset, fewer armies, fewer special rules and exceptions, otherwise pretty much as per standard Infinity? 'Cos if so that could very well be my jam.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 20:38:07


Post by: LunarSol


 Ian Sturrock wrote:
Lots of stuff about N4 -- does anyone have a quick and dirty summary of what we can expect from Code One? Simplified ruleset, fewer armies, fewer special rules and exceptions, otherwise pretty much as per standard Infinity? 'Cos if so that could very well be my jam.


It seems to be Infinity: Operation mode. I expect it to be very similar to the experience you get when playing the operation + beyond armies against one another. Firefight focused, limited insertion style encounters without a ton of complicated rules (hacking/extremely impetuous/smoke/etc) but a few of the big event options like aerial deployment and TO camo.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 20:45:46


Post by: NAVARRO


I have been away from infinity for a while bow... like years. But are the miniatures now plastic?


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 20:47:05


Post by: ImAGeek


 NAVARRO wrote:
I have been away from infinity for a while bow... like years. But are the miniatures now plastic?


No still metal. Aristeia (board game) has plastic (PVC) miniatures.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 20:49:50


Post by: .Mikes.




"Will CB make a fantasy game?"

Carlos *rolls eyes* "Every year this question."

Yes, and i will continue to ask it until you give the correct answer!


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 20:58:41


Post by: Kanluwen


It's their own fault, they kept telling people they wanted to do such a game.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 21:12:35


Post by: NAVARRO


 ImAGeek wrote:
 NAVARRO wrote:
I have been away from infinity for a while bow... like years. But are the miniatures now plastic?


No still metal. Aristeia (board game) has plastic (PVC) miniatures.



Thanks! Got scared for a moment there... BTW is Caskuda still dead?


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 21:49:30


Post by: Red Harvest


Hmm, only the Concordat Caskuda is dead. There are other Exrah groups out there with Caskudas. They are not coming to the Human Sphere though. :(

I expect Code One to be somewhere between the rules from the Operation:boxes and the basic rules as we see them in the BRB for N3 (updated of course) with maybe a few advanced bits tossed in. The Operation boxes are very much 'get you by while you learn' rules.

 Monkeysloth wrote:

Top selling stuff -- They're filtering the charts to try and give more accurate results as more recent stuff will obviously sell better, same with battle boxes.
1) CSU (shotgun)
2) Dakini Tacbots
3) Ikadron Batroids
4) Tunguska Jurisdictional Commando
5) Dronbot Remotes (REM) (oldest SKU still in production that Carlos can think of)
6) Invincibles Terra-cotta
7) Zulu-Cobra (jammer)
8) Varuna Immediate Reaction Division
9) Rebots
10) Dragon Lady.
in terms of factions

1) Merc
2) ALEPH
3) Combined Army
4) Nomads
5) Pan-Oceania
6) Yu Jing
7) Pan-Oceania
8) Pan-Oceania
9) ALEPH
10) Yu Jing (HVT)

No Haqq or Ariadna. Looks like the Varuna sectorial is doing Pan-O many favors.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 21:55:13


Post by: Kanluwen


Yeah, don't believe the "best selling" charts. It's based directly off of their webstore, not what actually is selling in shops.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/27 22:58:39


Post by: Red Harvest


Are you telling me not to believe Bostria? He would never deliberately deceive us.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 03:35:03


Post by: Cannibal


I'm sad about Neoterra going away but as long as Bolts get a new home (and playability) I don't mind.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 04:32:44


Post by: Kanluwen


Bolts are in Foreign Company. Writing's been on the wall for awhile now.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 04:43:59


Post by: Cannibal


 Kanluwen wrote:
Bolts are in Foreign Company. Writing's been on the wall for awhile now.


Oh yeah that's right. All is well by me then. I just really like their aesthetic.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 14:12:34


Post by: LunarSol


You can do a lot worse than the A-Team after all.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 14:20:29


Post by: Cronch


So CB will just keep squatting armies?


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 14:52:46


Post by: Alpharius


Yes, they will.

When they came for the Exrah and the Caskuda, you did nothing.

Now...


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 15:45:22


Post by: PsychoticStorm


It is not a correct use of the word Squatting, that implies both stopping production, stopping support and invalidating the army lists and official participation in the tournaments.
Although at the last video Bostria mentioned that some profiles may stop existing and I think it is something many here asked for, so happy?


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 15:55:34


Post by: solkan


Keep in mind that Corvus Belli is doing to two radically different things:

- The Exrah models and their profiles were killed off, for a combination of design and practical reasons. There are no N3 Exrah profiles at all.
- For the various other sectorials that have been discontinued, all they've officially done is discontinue production of the models.

If all of the "discontinued" sectorials still have rules when N4 comes out, then they haven't been "Squatted".

It's odd. So far there's been the comment that they're going to consolidate hacking and the hacking devices, and reorganize skills, but not the weapons.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 16:06:35


Post by: Alpharius


In fact, didn't they specifically say that they would not be squatting weapon profiles at all?


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 16:16:13


Post by: PsychoticStorm


Well the sectorials will be in rotation, not squatting.

@Alpharius the weapons mechanics themselves, have no real issue to be consolidated like hacking (or are useless if no suitable target is around).


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 16:41:22


Post by: LunarSol


There really aren't that many weapons in the game. A few could be a little different or differentiated with ammo types, but there's not that much to cut outside of maybe some of the quirky side arms.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 17:39:42


Post by: Monkeysloth


If you watched the video the main reason they aren't getting rid of weapons would be that what would you do with the minis with said weapons? Doesn't sound like CB wants to discontinue models just because they decide there are too many weapons. They did say they would if it was "superfluous" and being in would negatively affect the goals of N4 but their main focus is on Skills and rules.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 18:35:55


Post by: Kanluwen


The biggest reason they likely don't want to remove weapon profiles is because they have pushed for mixed boxes with no alternate builds for so long. They'd have to redo huge chunks of tooling to fix any issues they cause.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 19:43:17


Post by: NAVARRO


Assuming that every month CB released new stuff for infinity, by now the amount of minis must be pretty ridiculous to handle?


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 19:53:43


Post by: Kanluwen


 NAVARRO wrote:
Assuming that every month CB released new stuff for infinity, by now the amount of minis must be pretty ridiculous to handle?

Not as much as you'd think. They kept doing resculpts and one-off blisters for profiles.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 21:16:20


Post by: Red Harvest


 LunarSol wrote:
There really aren't that many weapons in the game. A few could be a little different or differentiated with ammo types, but there's not that much to cut outside of maybe some of the quirky side arms.
Beg to differ. I count over 100 entries in the weapons list. Even if you sort and group them, it'll still be a lot of weapons.

The sectorial lists still exist, and the sectorials for ASA and QK, for example, are still playable.IF CB updates units in the vanilla lists for Pan-O and Haqq, those updates to trickle down into the sectorials.

IIRC, CB starts pre-orders about 2 weeks before the Con? and teasers before that. I reckon that we ought to see teasers for the battle box starting 9 or 10 March. Is it going to contain the upgraded terrain, like with Operation: Wildfire ? Like I need more terrain.

Good news that the N4 BRB will be all in one. However, I may skip the book this time. It'll depends on how compelling the updated background will be. Bostria didn't really give to much in the way of hints about how the background/storyline* advances.

(*fluff is something you do to pillows and pr0n stars.)


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 21:19:32


Post by: LunarSol


 Red Harvest wrote:
 LunarSol wrote:
There really aren't that many weapons in the game. A few could be a little different or differentiated with ammo types, but there's not that much to cut outside of maybe some of the quirky side arms.
Beg to differ. I count over 100 entries in the weapons list. Even if you sort and group them, it'll still be a lot of weapons.


How many unique weapons are there in 40k? Most games honestly have a "unique" weapon for every single unit. Infinity is one of the few games where I feel like I can know what every weapon does pretty easily.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 21:30:41


Post by: Red Harvest


No idea about 40k. Haven't played it in over 10 years. Also, not relevant since the games are barely comparable. The weapon names do help in figuring things out, I'll grant you that. A viral rifle will obviously shoot viral ammo, while the breaker combi rifle will shoot breaker ammo. When CB breaks this naming convention, things deteriorate. Red Fury? Blitzen? Flammenspeer? Wild Parrot?

No matter, if there is a mini with the weapon, the weapon will stay... or the mini will go.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 21:47:46


Post by: Red_Five


 Red Harvest wrote:
 LunarSol wrote:
There really aren't that many weapons in the game. A few could be a little different or differentiated with ammo types, but there's not that much to cut outside of maybe some of the quirky side arms.
Beg to differ. I count over 100 entries in the weapons list. Even if you sort and group them, it'll still be a lot of weapons.


There are 167 weapons but that list is deceiving since each weapon is given a unique profile for each type of ammo it uses (e.g. Combirifle, Viral Combirifle, k1 combirifle, etc.) as well as the same weapons different shooting profiles (e.g. HMC (Burst Mode), HMC (Anti-materiel Mode), HMC (Stun Mode), etc.) and some weapons have a light and heavy variant (e.g. Light Shotgun and Heavy Shotgun). Additionally some weapons have different names but are almost identical save for the ammo they use (i.e. Panzerfaust, Flammenspeer, Blitzen and Akrylat-Kanone, etc.).

If you think the herd the list would probably be waaaay shorter.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 22:02:32


Post by: Monkeysloth


The biggest hurdle for infinity's weapons are the range bands. It's a cool system but It think would be better severed with maybe only 10 different ranges that a weapon is assigned instead of trying to make each weapon have a slightly unique range.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 22:30:17


Post by: Red_Five


 Monkeysloth wrote:
The biggest hurdle for infinity's weapons are the range bands. It's a cool system but It think would be better severed with maybe only 10 different ranges that a weapon is assigned instead of trying to make each weapon have a slightly unique range.


Just about all of the range increments are multiples of 8. The issue is that they combine the range bands on some guns when the +/- modifer is the same. That is 100% an issue I think needs to be resolved.

I think the thing that CB should do is to list all of the range bands for each weapon:

0-8
8-16
16-24
24-32
32-48
48-96 (only a handful of weapons shoot past 48", so just lump them all together with this range band).





The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/28 22:43:18


Post by: .Mikes.


 LunarSol wrote:
There really aren't that many weapons in the game.




The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/29 16:33:26


Post by: Red_Five


 .Mikes. wrote:
 LunarSol wrote:
There really aren't that many weapons in the game.




Jokes aside there are not that many weapons. 167 total but way more than half that list are just the same weapons (or nearly identical weapons) with different ammo or different firing modes for individual weapons. If you culled the list down, I am sure it would be like 50 unique weapons.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/29 16:59:37


Post by: LunarSol


 Monkeysloth wrote:
The biggest hurdle for infinity's weapons are the range bands. It's a cool system but It think would be better severed with maybe only 10 different ranges that a weapon is assigned instead of trying to make each weapon have a slightly unique range.


Most of them are more or less the same (rifle/pistol/shotgun/sniper/etc). There's a few quirky ones I'd be fine consolidating, but I'm not sure which ones you're specifically concerned about?

Like most things in Infinity, I personally find the weapons to be something that feels enormously overwhelming in the book and even in Army to a degree, but when you compile your list down to the things that are actually on your models, its honestly way simpler than it appears when you get the info dump. 40k looks about the same when you look at the weapon tables they publish (and those are on a per faction basis). Copying the subset of profiles available to a unit to the profile page makes it feel a lot simpler than it is. Similarly, I find Infinity far far less intimidating when I stop trying to look at all of it and just pay attention to what's on the table.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/29 21:11:31


Post by: Red Harvest


Separating weapons into types, Pistol, Rifle, Combi-rifle, etc and using ammo as a sub-type would make the number of listed weapons less, and may help, at least for the important in game things, like just knowing range bands. You really need to just know those. CB may well do this. We'll see.

The good news is that the rules will be all in one book this time. No mention of the size of the book. Or if it will be separated into a BRB and a background book like for N3.

I don't recall hearing Bostria mention how detailed the rules in the new battle box will be. I hope they are more than the quick start rules that CB currently includes in the battle boxes. An actual preview of Code One. All the material that needs to go to the printer will need to be ready within the next 2 weeks or so, to be done in time.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/29 22:05:41


Post by: Monkeysloth


The new Battle Box should just contain all the code one rules in print. No reason not too.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/29 22:08:41


Post by: Absolutionis


If the rumoured Code One rules are basically going to be a Operation box rules plus, that may very well be the case. They probably won't list every unit in the game, however.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/29 22:46:48


Post by: Monkeysloth


The probably wont, as they've said ARMY will have a code one version. But It would be good code one stats for all the starter boxes they're going to mark as "essential" as that would be a page for faction. Much like they do in the operation boxs now for the factions in them. Just add a few more pages of that to have a real starter rules that you can just pick up a box for each faction and play. That's what Infinity is really missing as all of that are in two player boxes only.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 00:50:43


Post by: .Mikes.


 Red_Five wrote:


Jokes aside there are not that many weapons. 167 total but way more than half that list are just the same weapons (or nearly identical weapons) with different ammo or different firing modes for individual weapons. If you culled the list down, I am sure it would be like 50 unique weapons.


I will never put the jokes asaide - NEVER!

But jokes aside, the number of weapons adn ammo types is something I don't think CB should cullin N4. At least not to a large extent. The variable range bands and having the right tool for the job is part of the granularity that makes Infinity what it is as much as the ARO system.

Hacking though, burn that **** down.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 08:31:57


Post by: Red Harvest


But, but "Muh Nomads! The L33T H4XX0R2!"

I am prepared to stand idly by while hacking dies in a hole. I can live with myself afterwards.

In the current ruleset, magic spellcasting hacking is listed under 'advanced rules' so I'm pretty certain most hacking will be absent from Code One. Bostria did mention hacking as something that will be addressed, so we have that sliver of hope.

Re-watched the LVO video. Code One *arrives* with the Battle Box, but now I doubt that it will contain the complete ruleset. That will probably be a download, so the CB can save on printing. The box will probably have just Quick Starter stuff. No mention of a Code One book.

I added a screenshot of the calendar of releases/events to the OP. and I'll add it here too




The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 16:10:33


Post by: LunarSol


 .Mikes. wrote:

But jokes aside, the number of weapons adn ammo types is something I don't think CB should cullin N4. At least not to a large extent. The variable range bands and having the right tool for the job is part of the granularity that makes Infinity what it is as much as the ARO system.

Hacking though, burn that **** down.


Range bands are what make mobility matter in the game. It keeps things from turning into a static firefight and make positioning really fun and dynamic.

Honestly, hacking isn't that complicated. It's just another weapon in most instances. The most complicated part is just that programs are listed in a single table with a column saying which devices they work on rather than having each device come with a list of its available programs. There's also a few too many options (similar to the different levels of Martial Arts) that could be culled, but the actual interaction of hacking is basically the same as a gun.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 16:25:15


Post by: Red_Five


 .Mikes. wrote:
 Red_Five wrote:


Jokes aside there are not that many weapons. 167 total but way more than half that list are just the same weapons (or nearly identical weapons) with different ammo or different firing modes for individual weapons. If you culled the list down, I am sure it would be like 50 unique weapons.


I will never put the jokes asaide - NEVER!

But jokes aside, the number of weapons adn ammo types is something I don't think CB should cullin N4. At least not to a large extent. The variable range bands and having the right tool for the job is part of the granularity that makes Infinity what it is as much as the ARO system.

Hacking though, burn that **** down.


I do not want to see the weapon list culled much, if at all.

Hacking can be pretty silly. It is my least favorite part of the game. I get why it exists and I use it often but... I would prefer if it were streamlined and simplified quite a bit.



The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 16:32:36


Post by: Cronch


Hacking has been completely window-dressing since 1st edition, and expanding it didn't improve it, it just ensured it's even more unappealing. The problem is, as usual with hacking in an otherwise shooty-shooty game, that you either make the whole mission about hacking, or it's always better to just bring another gun.It's not like magic in fantasy (despite similiarities in having separate section and rules devoted to it) because hacking very rarely interacts with the physical world of the tabletop, whereas spells can do physical damage, or give strong buffs/debuffs to most if not all units on the board instead of very select few.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 16:37:41


Post by: Sqorgar


They should make hacking interact with the terrain more. I should be able to hack a vending machine and have it shoot out canned drinks at enemies. Hack security cameras to give me line of sight around corners. Hack doors to shut on people, crushing them. In Infinity, hacking is the least fun, least cool part of the rules by a country mile. Hacking should be less about buffs and more about surprising your opponent with some out of the box thinking. In my opinion, of course.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 18:08:12


Post by: LunarSol


Cronch wrote:
Hacking has been completely window-dressing since 1st edition, and expanding it didn't improve it, it just ensured it's even more unappealing. The problem is, as usual with hacking in an otherwise shooty-shooty game, that you either make the whole mission about hacking, or it's always better to just bring another gun.It's not like magic in fantasy (despite similiarities in having separate section and rules devoted to it) because hacking very rarely interacts with the physical world of the tabletop, whereas spells can do physical damage, or give strong buffs/debuffs to most if not all units on the board instead of very select few.


There's a few strong buffs available in hacking (shock/ignore cover for remotes being the big one) but I agree there could be more emphasis here.

Hacking as an offensive ability is rather dependent on repeaters. The ability to create areas of the board where a hackable model can't really act without at best risking a reset is really powerful. The game needs control elements or else there's no design space beyond charging more points for PanO Ballistic Skill. They mostly just need to clean up some redundant programs and reorganize the programs a bit to give the different devices more defined roles and likely combine some of the redundant ones. I think a lot could be done by combining them down to 2 or 3 different program lists and differentiating them with either upgrade programs or making some of the effects skills instead of them all being a generic hacker (Killer Hacker, for example, could be a skill that lets you ignore Firewall Mods and add Shock or something.

Regardless, I'm sure whatever is changing is set at this point. Curious to see what they come up with.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 18:10:15


Post by: Red_Five


Cronch wrote:
Hacking has been completely window-dressing since 1st edition, and expanding it didn't improve it, it just ensured it's even more unappealing. The problem is, as usual with hacking in an otherwise shooty-shooty game, that you either make the whole mission about hacking, or it's always better to just bring another gun.It's not like magic in fantasy (despite similiarities in having separate section and rules devoted to it) because hacking very rarely interacts with the physical world of the tabletop, whereas spells can do physical damage, or give strong buffs/debuffs to most if not all units on the board instead of very select few.


It is all window dressing until you are running a list full of Unidron Batroids inside a building and a hacker on the outside of the building threatens to attack you when you dare to move any of your Unidrons.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 18:18:39


Post by: Alpharius


I'd be happy if it were near impossible to neuter T.A.G.s via hacking...


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 18:24:56


Post by: LunarSol


 Alpharius wrote:
I'd be happy if it were near impossible to neuter T.A.G.s via hacking...


Really kind of defeats the purpose of hacking, doesn't it?

The extra order really goes a long way towards making TAGs worth taking now. I think with a wide adoption of tactical window to put a general limit on order pools they're actually getting to be in a pretty good place, particularly with a specialist piloting them.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 18:30:16


Post by: Alpharius


Maybe just done down the 'eject' hacking 'power'?

(Unless they already have?)


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 18:55:31


Post by: LunarSol


Eject is such a fun power though. One of the things that often seems to sell people on the idea of the game. It's honestly not even very good in most cases, but definitely something to be cautious of. I can certainly see toning it down though. Kind of depends on other attempts to improve TAGs. Personally, I find Immobilized-2 to be a far far greater concern.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 19:01:19


Post by: Cronch


It it? I find all abilities that take away from other player's agency to be bad design. No one likes stunlocks.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 19:17:22


Post by: LunarSol


Cronch wrote:
It it? I find all abilities that take away from other player's agency to be bad design. No one likes stunlocks.


Everything takes away player agency in any game. Killing your models takes away the agency to use that model, no? In many ways, hacking is a lot kinder than killing, as there is often far more counterplay (like just walking back in your TAG when the opportunity presents itself). It's far from a stunlock.

One of the things I really appreciate about Infinity is that there's never a real lock. If something is in an exposed position; be that a tag in a hacking area or a model in a sniper's lane; it might be stuck but you as a player are not. Sending an order monkey in to clear a repeater or having a drop troop fill a nest with grenades to free up a pinned model is what makes the game feel like the tactical firefight so many other games fail to capture.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 20:29:28


Post by: Alpharius


You do make good points - I'm just a big T.A.G. fan and hacking, to me, seems to have really limited them too much.

I'm OK with that particular pendulum swinging in the other direction a bit, hopefully.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/30 20:54:25


Post by: LunarSol


 Alpharius wrote:
You do make good points - I'm just a big T.A.G. fan and hacking, to me, seems to have really limited them too much.

I'm OK with that particular pendulum swinging in the other direction a bit, hopefully.


TAGs have always been in need of some serious love. I'm all for it. Hacking is a part of that (though personally, I'm vastly more terrified of E/M), but ultimately what has made them bad is more of a fundamental game economy problem that needs to be resolved. No matter how good their stats are; the chunk of orders you lose for taking one is too great. Having them generate an extra order does more to fix them than anything I've seen in the game. Limiting the number of items you can take to 15 is the other big thing they need, IMO. A cap on how many cheap orders you can meaningfully take creates a nice buffer. Given that you can hit that cap for most factions with half your points or less; it means you're essentially working with a 150 point budget of "upgrades". You can spread that out among your 15 or dump half of it in a TAG (which gives you a bonus order) but its not putting you behind the way it currently does. Giving them a tool to complete missions is also pretty critical, and the 3 combined I think fixes most of the problems with TAGs that made trying to fix them with points not a real solution. In many ways, I'd prefer them to be absolutely terrifying to deal with in a firefight but weak to hacking as sort of RPS. Regardless, I'm definitely not opposed to things that make them better; Sally's my girl.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/31 08:12:41


Post by: Cronch


 LunarSol wrote:
Cronch wrote:
It it? I find all abilities that take away from other player's agency to be bad design. No one likes stunlocks.


Everything takes away player agency in any game. Killing your models takes away the agency to use that model, no? In many ways, hacking is a lot kinder than killing, as there is often far more counterplay (like just walking back in your TAG when the opportunity presents itself). It's far from a stunlock.

One of the things I really appreciate about Infinity is that there's never a real lock. If something is in an exposed position; be that a tag in a hacking area or a model in a sniper's lane; it might be stuck but you as a player are not. Sending an order monkey in to clear a repeater or having a drop troop fill a nest with grenades to free up a pinned model is what makes the game feel like the tactical firefight so many other games fail to capture.

Killing the models is expected in a game though. Having them do nothing is much more irritating. Just like with adhesive ammo, which has one way to fix it, and if your army lost it's engineer, too bad.
It's also one of the many ways in which tags are so much worse than basic infantry- not only do they cost around 1/3rd of your points, but they also need at least an engineer to babysit them, and ideally also a hacker, eating into the points even further, while their high ARM is easily ignored by over-abundance of AP ammo and of course the crits just plain ignoring armor. Without those issues resolved, tags will never be worth it.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/31 17:28:56


Post by: Red_Five


Cronch wrote:
 LunarSol wrote:
Cronch wrote:
It it? I find all abilities that take away from other player's agency to be bad design. No one likes stunlocks.


Everything takes away player agency in any game. Killing your models takes away the agency to use that model, no? In many ways, hacking is a lot kinder than killing, as there is often far more counterplay (like just walking back in your TAG when the opportunity presents itself). It's far from a stunlock.

One of the things I really appreciate about Infinity is that there's never a real lock. If something is in an exposed position; be that a tag in a hacking area or a model in a sniper's lane; it might be stuck but you as a player are not. Sending an order monkey in to clear a repeater or having a drop troop fill a nest with grenades to free up a pinned model is what makes the game feel like the tactical firefight so many other games fail to capture.

Killing the models is expected in a game though. Having them do nothing is much more irritating. Just like with adhesive ammo, which has one way to fix it, and if your army lost it's engineer, too bad.
It's also one of the many ways in which tags are so much worse than basic infantry- not only do they cost around 1/3rd of your points, but they also need at least an engineer to babysit them, and ideally also a hacker, eating into the points even further, while their high ARM is easily ignored by over-abundance of AP ammo and of course the crits just plain ignoring armor. Without those issues resolved, tags will never be worth it.


At the same time, it is not like Engineers and Hackers are not useful in other ways for most missions.

Tags are high risk, high reward models.

Before this latest ITS change, I always found running two HI units as being way more effective than one Tag. You get an extra order and an extra body, even if you still want to have the Hacker/Engineer babysitters. Now, I feel like there is way more reason to run a Tag, even if it is still much riskier than two HI units.

I wonder if giving them 2 extra orders would make Tags more equitable?


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/31 18:48:28


Post by: Alpharius


The biggest crime is that one of the coolest models in the history of miniature gaming doesn't see the table enough because of these damn rules!!!

And yes, maybe T.A.G.s generating 2 orders would be a good fix - combined with the aforementioned toning down of hacking, of course!


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/31 18:58:12


Post by: LunarSol


 Alpharius wrote:
The biggest crime is that one of the coolest models in the history of miniature gaming doesn't see the table enough because of these damn rules!!!

And yes, maybe T.A.G.s generating 2 orders would be a good fix - combined with the aforementioned toning down of hacking, of course!


The currently do generate 2 orders. Do you mean 3?


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/31 19:01:57


Post by: Monkeysloth


BoW and Customeeple had a ruleset for infinity where you could play a death match arena (with respawns) with infinity. BoW's version had Tags as the main players while Customeeple's was using stock infantry. Both had upgrades you could pick up like in Unreal Tournament and was quite fun. I managed to snag a set of the tokens before everything was quietly removed from Customeeple's website. Don't think CB was too happy with it but it was a damn fun way to play the game with lots of friends.

Still have the PDF in Spanish for it and you can download the BOW version here (They're fairly similar) https://www.beastsofwar.com/downloads/Infinity-Boot-Camp-TAG-Deathmatch.pdf

It you really want to have fun with your tags this is a good way.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/31 19:18:41


Post by: LunarSol


That's actually how I learned to play the game...


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/31 21:40:17


Post by: Alpharius


 LunarSol wrote:
 Alpharius wrote:
The biggest crime is that one of the coolest models in the history of miniature gaming doesn't see the table enough because of these damn rules!!!

And yes, maybe T.A.G.s generating 2 orders would be a good fix - combined with the aforementioned toning down of hacking, of course!


The currently do generate 2 orders. Do you mean 3?


I did - sorry!

I should have just said "an extra order", I guess...

I am genuinely looking forward to the rules revisions that are coming soon - I do not know why, but I am optimistic that they'll get us a better game.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/01/31 22:41:35


Post by: Red Harvest


N3 was a better game, ruleset-wise, than N2 when it was just the BRB and one excluded all the Human Sphere and Paradiso stuff. The scenarios needed to be updated to N3, and CB really dropped the ball on that. I hope we see updated scenarios to go with the updated ruleset. Given Bostria's statement that Code One and N4 are not just revisions/updates but something more, this may happen. or not.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/04 01:52:29


Post by: Red Harvest


Lol. Double post. Sort of.

New releases, but first, a preview of the O-12 bots




And the releases:





Not bad. Nothing spectacular.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/04 02:27:09


Post by: Kanluwen


In case anyone's curious, the Nox set is:
Sniper Rifle, Hacker, HMG, and...

SpecOps

Rarely these days will I give credit to CB for doing something great, but this is just ace.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/04 02:29:34


Post by: Barzam


Not bad? Those Kaplans look awesome!


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/04 05:41:37


Post by: ImAGeek


The Kaplans look pretty sweet painted up. The renders were okay but the paint helps a lot here. I like the Zhencha too.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/04 06:47:33


Post by: schoon


The Kaplans are outstanding!

The rest is fine.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/04 07:02:52


Post by: Modock


Great set of releases, Kaplans and Nox are really nice and the spec-ops is bad ass.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/04 13:22:24


Post by: precinctomega


KTS are lovely enough that I'll give them a pass on the combat heels.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/04 16:14:42


Post by: PurpleSquig


Really like the look of the copperbots


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/05 13:12:00


Post by: Alpharius


RE: Defiance and the soon to be opening Pledge Manager?


There will be an "all in" pledge level.

However...

The price for this ALL-IN will be 745€.


Yikes.

I mean, I probably could've done the math on it before now, but still, that's a bit of a stinger.

I'll definitely be in the 'pick and choose' category.

And tokens/stand-ins will work well enough for me for...a lot of things, apparently!

EDIT:

To be fair, I only need (want?) some of the 'Reinforcement Packs' anyway!

Maybe one of the upgraded pledges to get the expansions and a few packs will be just fine after all...


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/06 07:28:13


Post by: Red Harvest


What are you trying to talk yourself into, Alpharius? Hmmm? US$820 is a big all in.

I'll stick with my collector level pledge, but if I can also get that Fat Yuan Yuan and/or Kusanagi, I probably will.

I wonder what the hold up really is with the Pledge Manager? What are they trying to do with it that is causing delays?


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/06 07:41:07


Post by: Monkeysloth


were they rolling their own? That's the only thing I can think of outside of the provider they choose may not have the best servers so performance may be meh. It's not like they've got any really complicated selections, they're pretty part the course.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/06 12:09:25


Post by: grouchoben


They're using their own, I guess to max out profits. Might not have been such a good idea, in retrospect


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/06 15:51:36


Post by: Alpharius


 Red Harvest wrote:
What are you trying to talk yourself into, Alpharius? Hmmm? US$820 is a big all in.

I'll stick with my collector level pledge, but if I can also get that Fat Yuan Yuan and/or Kusanagi, I probably will.



More like trying to talk myself out of stuff!

I think I'll end up with all the game content stuff and a reinforcement pack or two - if they math out to being a 'good deal' vs. just buying what I want in blisters/boxes...


 Red Harvest wrote:

I wonder what the hold up really is with the Pledge Manager? What are they trying to do with it that is causing delays?


Yeah, really looks to be 'do it themselves' to save having to pay any of the established ones any fees.

It'll probably work out just fine for them in the long run - delays now up front? Probably the least aggravating of all the usual "Kickstarter Delays".


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/06 22:09:01


Post by: Red Harvest


Agreed

Rolling their own Pledge Manager only makes sense if they plan to have more kickstarters. The time and money spent for a one off is wasted unless it is significantly cheaper. With limited resources, the people working on the PM are people not working on other profit generating activities.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/06 22:55:23


Post by: Alpharius


Given how well this Kickstarter did, and the assorted distribution issues they have - at least in the USA - I do foresee more KS’ from CB moving forward.



The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/06 23:53:41


Post by: Monkeysloth


 Red Harvest wrote:
Agreed

Rolling their own Pledge Manager only makes sense if they plan to have more kickstarters. The time and money spent for a one off is wasted unless it is significantly cheaper. With limited resources, the people working on the PM are people not working on other profit generating activities.


Yep. Doing that kind of infrastructure isn't cheap. Doing it well is even more. I use to dev full stack as well as websites and such. Now I just dev tools to test them. Way less stress and better hours. If they don't do more KSrs they'll have burned a lot of cash on this.

Though if they're smart they'll open it up to other companies and undercut backerkit. Go the ol' Amazon route of selling access to your internal tools/software to competitors as money is money.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/08 16:48:26


Post by: Kalamadea


Well, we know they'll be doing more kickstarters for sure, they just announced a mid-april KS for licensed 8" PVC statues.

https://www.infinitythegame.com/blog/item/782-new-partner-busy-mind-collectibles

There's going to be 3 different statues for the first set, no idea what the other 2 will be, but the 1st is a VERY nice looking Shang-Ji. I love it, hopefully it means new Shan-Ji miniatures in the game soon, because it's always been one of my favorite HI models and this new redesign keeps most of the design details I like intact. I wouldn't be surprised to see this guy in the N4 PanO/YJ starter Operation set, hopefully with a profile update to make them better than in N3 as they're currently not worth the extra 10ish points over a Zhuyong. They can't currently be armed with HMGs, so one new profile at least

No hint of the pricing, hopefully won't be too bad, but similar figures vary GREATLY in price and can be anywhere from $20 to $175+, and this appears to be a new company.



Old Shang-Ji for reference:
Spoiler:



The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/08 17:44:43


Post by: Alpharius


Given how close the Euro and the Dollar are, some of the Defiance "Reinforcement Packs" are looking to be fairly good deals.

Provided, of course, that CB doesn't kill us with shipping charges...


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/08 19:36:41


Post by: Monkeysloth


If they don't have a US hub the prices will be quite expensive. The Spanish Government set's shipping prices that all couriers have to use so there's no competition price wise which protects the government own mail system. Add that international shipping keeps going up and well last year when I ordered from them for the adepticon bundle and ITS box was $40.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/08 21:11:24


Post by: Dysartes


I've not looked at the Defiance KS, but doesn't it say on there whether they have a US shipping hub/partner or not?


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/08 21:49:08


Post by: Red Harvest


The shipping is "customs friendly", so I suspect that they do have a US partner lined up.

They list estimated shipping charges on the KS page:
Corvus Belli wrote: Bear in mind that we do not yet know exactly how much the different unlockable components will weigh and the size of the packaging. The metal’s weight is not a determining element and will not increase the shipping costs.

The prices take into account one request from a customer purchasing one unit of either the Core or Collector’s Pledge. Extra add-on units, or extra copies of the Core or Collector’s Box will increase the shipping costs:

Spain: 12€-15€
European Union: 20€-25€
Rest of Europe: 20€-25€
USA: 25€-30€
Canada: 25€-30€
Australia: 35€-40€
New Zealand: 35€-40€
Asia: 30€-35€
South Africa: 40€-45€
Rest of the World: 40€-45€

Countries with special pricing: Russia, Brazil, Serbia.


Increasing the size of the packaging will be the factor in determining cost, so those reinforcement boxes may well drastically increase shipping, depending on the size of the boxes themselves. One may end up paying to have a whole lot of air shipped from Spain if there is a lot of empty space in the packaging. There usually isn't much empty space in the current boxes, so I doubt this.

I pledged for the Collector level, so it appears that I'll be paying US$25-US$35 for shipping. Not crazy high, if the collector packaging is the size/volume I think it'll be.

That Shang Ji is nice. The minis have needed re-sculpting for quite a while now. If this sculpt is based on any renders that CB has done, it seems a good indication that there will be a new Shang Ji in the Kaldstrom box. And I keep wanting to type it as Kåldstrøm. Pre-orders begin on 9 March or 16 March I'll bet, so previews begin a week earlier... Maybe we'll start seeing them in about 4 weeks.



The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/09 06:12:47


Post by: schoon


That Shang Ji is very nice.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/10 00:18:42


Post by: .Mikes.


It is a good indication the Shang Ji will make it to N4. At the moment the profile is kind've caught in no man's land and given Carlos' confirmation not all units will make the cut from N3 to N4 I thought the Shang Ji might be one of them.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/10 16:02:01


Post by: Red_Five


 .Mikes. wrote:
It is a good indication the Shang Ji will make it to N4. At the moment the profile is kind've caught in no man's land and given Carlos' confirmation not all units will make the cut from N3 to N4 I thought the Shang Ji might be one of them.


I hope this means that the N4 Shang Ji will have a stronger mechanical identity than basic dude in heavy armor, since Yu Jing has a lot of units that are trying to fill that same role (Shang Ji, Wu Ming, Zuyong, etc.).



The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/10 20:15:46


Post by: .Mikes.


Yep. At the moment it's a not quite so good good Wu Ming. The Zuyong should be the basic HI, the WuMing the all out assault HI, and the Shang Ji.... i dunno, it needs something.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/19 03:50:10


Post by: .Mikes.


OK, so it's been confirmed on the official forums that at release Code One will only supoprt vanilla Yu Jing, PanO, O-12 and Combined.

Let the flaming begin.....


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/19 04:12:29


Post by: Red Harvest


The four factions from the 2 soon to be most recent battle boxes. Support will come for the rest soon enough. Meh.

Koni wisely did NOT tell anyone when to expect the other factions. He also dropped this info the day the Pledge Manager opened too, and the surprises to some of the shipping costs.

Three weeks until we start to see the teasers for Kåldstrøm.

Fortunately for all involved, CB uses Spanish printers, etc, so it is unlikely that Operación:Kåldstrøm will be delayed, unlike some companies releases coming from China.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/19 04:14:00


Post by: Monkeysloth


Ya. That doesn't worry me as long as more factions come in. I'd rather have good support for each (ie box that's playable without additional purchases) for code one then a rush to get everything supported day one.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/19 06:36:22


Post by: Nibbler


 .Mikes. wrote:
OK, so it's been confirmed on the official forums that at release Code One will only supoprt vanilla Yu Jing, PanO, O-12 and Combined.

Let the flaming begin.....


excuse the noob question, but I didn't look at infinity for 2 or 3 years, what's the O12 Faction? Is it Aleph related?


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/19 06:46:58


Post by: Monkeysloth


O-12 is the Space UN of infinity that keeps the peace (to the extent that they can) between the Nations/factions to a certain extent (they've got and FBI like police force that can go anywhere, their own army to enforce judgment from their courts and several other things). Aleph is under O-12 fluff wise but is a separate faction in the mini game.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/19 15:28:16


Post by: LunarSol


Sad my Nomads won't be available at launch, though it really does point to Code One being very focused on Operation armies. Almost like they're trying to make a board game out of them.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/20 06:33:20


Post by: schoon


 .Mikes. wrote:
OK, so it's been confirmed on the official forums that at release Code One will only supoprt vanilla Yu Jing, PanO, O-12 and Combined.

Hey, they've got to start somewhere, and is not like they're saying the other factions aren't being done ever.

Just not "first."


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/20 08:12:13


Post by: PsychoticStorm


The official forums confirmed the 4 starting factions to be supported are going to be PanO, Yu Jing, CA and O-12 more to come as new starters get added to Infinity One line.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/20 09:41:02


Post by: BobbaFett


Essentially, Belen , the marketing director leaked the info in a spanish chat on Telegram.

Impressive communication skills.
This company is full of amateurs.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/20 09:53:22


Post by: solkan


 BobbaFett wrote:

This company is full of amateurs.


*laughs in American*



The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/20 20:13:12


Post by: Monkeysloth


 BobbaFett wrote:
Essentially, Belen , the marketing director leaked the info in a spanish chat on Telegram.

Impressive communication skills.
This company is full of amateurs.


At least they're not freaking out over it like the JSA change from a few years ago where they paid to have all this advertisements in a trade magazine they didn't realize released weeks before their planned announcement and then tried to get mods of different forums and groups to delete posts and threaten to ban people that posted about it.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/20 20:48:49


Post by: precinctomega


Tbf, CB is run by a handful of old friends who made historical 15mm minis for their own amusement and then cast up some scifi 28mm stuff for an RPG they were running.

I think they're allowed to a little bit amateur. I think it's kind of charming.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/20 20:54:29


Post by: Kanluwen


They haven't been that kind of company for a good 10ish years. They're long past any kind of instance where they are "allowed to be a little bit amateur", especially in light of them constantly choosing to keep their company purposely small to avoid paying higher taxes.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/20 21:05:39


Post by: Red Harvest


Code One is something new, whereas the JSA debacle was just a((n) unwelcomed) change to N3.

April release, have they been mentioned?

- Operación:Kåldstrøm
- Dire Foes Mission Pack Alpha: Retaliation
- ITS Season 11 Event Tournament Pack

No idea about this new Dire Foes. Last one was a Pan-O v. Nomads ((DataCash) I'd like to think this one would be in support of Operación:Kåldstrøm and include Pan-O v. Yu Jing.


The 2020 Infinity News and Rumors thread -- N4, C1 and everything else @ 2020/02/20 22:03:48


Post by: .Mikes.


Professional - GW. A well-executed machine designed to milk as much profit from their product as possible and screw all other outcomes.

Amateur - doing something for the love and trying to produce the best product because it's your passion.

Yah, I'll take amateur. Especially considering 'amateur' has resulted in one of the biggest success stories and most fun games in wargaming by the size of the copmany making it.