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Metal Wraiths aren't that bad.

It's the Tomb Spyders that are a pain.

I think all the new rumors sound great, but I could care less honestly. All I really want is new and awesome models to paint How long do we have to wait till a GW spy with a post count of 3 "leaks" a blurey little gif of new models to make us all drool like ravenous dogs?

I just found them, brittle? when putting them together for a mate years back.

I'd much rather they where plastic, cost wise as well, as I'd love to give my eldest a large unit of them, love the silouette on the battlefield.

However yeah, Tomb Spyder I didn't even raise as that was a given, as is the plastic box hopefully. Almost threw it off the table when putting the metal one together for the same mate.

ph34r wrote:

-Loki- wrote:

ph34r wrote:Welcome to 5e: even the non-mech armies have to mech-up or go home.

Except Tyranids.

True. Kinda hard to add transport vehicles to that army. At least they got the uber-popular Tervigon.

Not hard at all, considering the existence of the Malefactor(it's a Tyranid transport organism from Epic).

I find it amusing how for every rumor there is another rumor that contradicts it directly. And every new batch of rumors adds more contradictions.
Some intelligence service could take lessons in dis-information from the GW.

Wow!

Thanks for the rumors Yak!

H.B.M.C. wrote:...but we also get gonzo-bat-gak-insane fluff that will likely involve a Necron Lord carving his name on the Eye of Terror or maybe Blood Angels Tactical Squads as a 0-1 Elites choice or some other such nonsense.

I admit it, I LOL'd at that one!

Frankly, I'm a fan of most every model being plastic. It usually results in less pinning for support and let's face it, plastic is sweet for modifications.

If that were to make models also cheaper, it would be ideal...but...it is GW..so I suppose that is not likely.

Just Dave wrote:

Sasori wrote:Gentlemen, can we at least get a look at the codex before everyone here jumps off a Cliff? I mean these are still rumors

I agree.
However, this is the internet and jumping to conclusions and off cliffs is what we do...

Sasori wrote:

Nightbringer's Chosen wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:What happened to the idea of Necron transports not really being transports at all, but mobile portals?

I liked that idea better.

Amen.
I loved the idea that my army didn't really have metal boxes to ride around in, but could teleport where it needed to be. More versatile/instant, but less protection.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Sasori wrote:Matt Ward has written solid rules for the armies he has done so far.

Which?

Space Marines, Blood Angels, and Grey Knights.

He's right; Balance-wise, on the whole these armies are good rules-wise. Whilst there's the OTT and overly wacky thing in each of these Codices, ruleswise they're fairly balanced.

TyraelVladinhurst wrote:

akira5665 wrote:As for M. Ward, I agree the new rules/fluff are awful, but there is a silent horde out there, who this very minute are painting up either a Sanguinor, DE Transport, GK Chibihawk or such, who love him.

really? do tell me who? especially after he messed the GK codex up so much, seeing as knights are suppose to be elite methinks squads of 6 should be able to have two psycannons like they USE TO be for ward got to them

All you have to do is look at the Army Lists section for example and it's easy to see how it's dominated by Blood Angels and Grey Knights. Whilst many of us - mostly vets it seems - dislike Mat Wards stuff, there's still a LARGE number of people that buy it and enjoy it and ultimately for GW, the former of which is what matters. Some people see things like Flying Land Raiders, Dreadknights and Storm Ravens and think "awesome!!1!!11!!" and generally these are the kind that enjoy the "fanwank" fluff and ideas Mat Ward seems to come out with; hence no matter how many of us may hate his stuff, it still sells and has a large base of support...
Note: I'm not a fan of Ward, but I try to be reasonable about things.

---------

I think Immortals becoming troops sounds probable; from GW perspective, they always intend to sell new stuff and this stuff is often supported by strong rules; most people own a lot of Warriors, but with almost certainly a new, plastic Immortal kit coming out, making them troops should mean they sell by the tonne...

Well Im just curious what our "I use this ability and your *hardcore* character is now dead. Like DEAD dead, dead" thing will be since he has one of those in a couple of his codices.

What I am intrigued with apart from how they are to pull off this elite c'tan business is why and how imortals has troops will work has troops with warriors etc.

KingCracker wrote:

Well Im just curious what our "I use this ability and your *hardcore* character is now dead. Like DEAD dead, dead" thing will be since he has one of those in a couple of his codices.

Our staple weapon desintegrates the victim at the basic parts of its existence.
I'm sure a decent writer could make something of that.

Of course, this being Mat Ward (as he currently spells himself) he will come up with something completely new.

I hope wraiths get a little better (maybe more attacks if they stay without PW's, add PW's otherwise)

I hope the Forgeworld Tombstalker is added to the dex (its a pretty fantastic model)

I hope the new Tomb Spider types aren't garbage

I hope the stupid new transport things (bitter obviously) aren't like Raiders, which is how they sound atm... I really wish they'd stay with the whole "phalanx of robots marching to destroy you" theme

Also, my guess is if this new WBB goes through, Res orbs will probably allow 1 unit within X" to reroll all failed WBB's for that turn. I honestly LIKE this new WBB concept; the fact its not negated by anything other than the unit being wiped. Thats pretty hot honestly. Sure, its not a 50% chance to get back up, but still....

I really wish they weren't tacking vehicles into the Dex... do it like nids, make 3-5 man boxes of the "bigger" stuff (like Immortals), 10 man boxes of the smaller stuff, big blisters, and 'Liths will get more sales now (at $60 a pop none the less). Why make 6 new vehicles? Especially when most likely 3 of them will be semi-useless, 1 will be "cool" but not great, and 2 will be "zomg need to spam!".

Gah... sick of them taking away fluff in favor of new models. At least new nids and DE fit fluff sorta, it seems like anything getting the Ward remake he makes the model rules first, then finds a way to make it "fit". Sure, Stormravens were sorta cool, but seriously; deep striking raiders? Dreadknights? How about Jesus Jr. (Sanguinor)? Or the mighty Draigo, who will single handedly destroy the warp?

Kinda ticks me off... Jes Goodwin should just write everything, the Dark Eldar 'Dex is fantastic!

The Dark Eldar 'dex also took several years of playtesting and development. Every time the codex got pushed pack another 6 months or so, they made use of the time by tweaking and testing it.
That's the crux. The crowd wants updates for everyone, RIGHT NOW, but it also wants them smooth and perfectly balanced.
For the rate Ward is shelling out those books, they are actually quite good. No excuse for the fluff, though.
The book was written by Kelly (yes, THAT Phil Kelly, the Jaws Of the World Wolf-Kelly, which really shows how much good enough playtesting and tweaking can do), by the way. Goodwin and Diaz did the miniatures.

Zid wrote:Kinda ticks me off... Jes Goodwin should just write everything, the Dark Eldar 'Dex is fantastic!

You mean Phil Kelly?

ph34r wrote:Welcome to 5e: even the non-mech armies have to mech-up or go home.

Yeah, this disappoints me as other than Nids, Necrons were the only force that didn't have walkers or transports. [/sigh]

Korraz wrote:The Dark Eldar 'dex also took several years of playtesting and development. Every time the codex got pushed pack another 6 months or so, they made use of the time by tweaking and testing it.
That's the crux. The crowd wants updates for everyone, RIGHT NOW, but it also wants them smooth and perfectly balanced.
For the rate Ward is shelling out those books, they are actually quite good. No excuse for the fluff, though.

True, I'll give you that. Guess speed vs balance we get what we ask for.

But yeah; Ward should write fluff, then build the units. Its been said hes having a hard time writing Necron fluff... no wonder; hes trying to completely redo the dynamic of an army that many people (myself included) LOVE, we just want them updated.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Iamjack42 wrote:

Zid wrote:Kinda ticks me off... Jes Goodwin should just write everything, the Dark Eldar 'Dex is fantastic!

You mean Phil Kelly?

Yeah, get my people mixed up all the time @_@ <--- failboat self :(

Zid wrote:

Korraz wrote:The Dark Eldar 'dex also took several years of playtesting and development. Every time the codex got pushed pack another 6 months or so, they made use of the time by tweaking and testing it.
That's the crux. The crowd wants updates for everyone, RIGHT NOW, but it also wants them smooth and perfectly balanced.
For the rate Ward is shelling out those books, they are actually quite good. No excuse for the fluff, though.

True, I'll give you that. Guess speed vs balance we get what we ask for.

But yeah; Ward should never ever write fluff, they should get a competent person like Kelly or a BL author to do it, then he can build the units around the fluff. Its been said hes having a hard time writing Necron fluff... no wonder; hes trying to completely redo the dynamic of an army that many people (myself included) LOVE, we just want them updated.

Fixed that for you

Can't wait for Necroliths that fire Necrotesla Cannons that shoot Necrolightning at things.

Or the super uber C'tan Lord that actually killed Vulkan and Leman Russ with a single hand (the other hand was busy fist-bumping a Blood Angel captain... who was so enthralled by the C'tan Lord he was getting his named tattoo'ed on BOTH of his hearts).

Also, he parties in the Eye of Terror and one time he teamed up with the Enslavers to fight the Eldar.. SUPAH FIST BUMP!

****

Sure the rules will be great, but the fluff is going to be hi-freakin-larious.

GW, if this is what my Necrons are going to become they can sit on the shelf until the next, hopefully, less slowed rewrite.

H.B.M.C. wrote:

yakface wrote:Pariahs are gone. Flayed Ones are Elites.

Wha...?

I think there was something someone said about a name change so that they are HQ retinue type guys under a new name... Don't know if that fits with the Cryptek idea. Hope no one had 20+ of these guys.:(

Well, it’s an old 3rd Ed Codex in dire need of an update. Sadly, in order to get that update the Codex will pass through the bad-fanfiction-y mind of Matt Ward. So us Necron players get a new Codex, but we also get gonzo-bat-gak-insane fluff that will likely involve a Necron Lord carving his name on the Eye of Terror or maybe Blood Angels Tactical Squads as a 0-1 Elites choice or some other such nonsense.

Draigo'd on the first page. Nice.

Korraz wrote:The book was written by Kelly (yes, THAT Phil Kelly, the Jaws Of the World Wolf-Kelly, which really shows how much good enough playtesting and tweaking can do), by the way. Goodwin and Diaz did the miniatures.

So one power (which is generally skipped in favor of two others) makes Kelly a worse author for you? Whereas, by comparison, Ward made a template version that didn't give MCs the bonus to Initiative that Jaws does? Could your argument get any worse?

The rumors that started this thread are quite exciting, especially for us modelers. Sounds like a bunch of great new kits to play around with and kit-bash.

The wish lists, codex author opinions, etc. not so exciting, in fact they are less than exciting as in they are the same old dung that every rumor thread descends to once actual rumors or information are finished being posted.

This thread feels like it has become another Matt Ward hate thread, what ever your opinion of the guy doesn't it get boring?

Zid wrote:

Iamjack42 wrote:

Zid wrote:Kinda ticks me off... Jes Goodwin should just write everything, the Dark Eldar 'Dex is fantastic!

You mean Phil Kelly?

Yeah, get my people mixed up all the time @_@ <--- failboat self :(

Actually Jes wrote a lot of the fluff for the Dark Eldar Codex. Guess he influenced the rules as well.

Easy fellas. I heard from a few rumours that a few people worked on the book and Ward is handling the majority. That could easily mean the fluff is not his doing for the most part, and the rules are. So we could blame him for the new FOC but not what kind of fluff that appears. Give it time and see what comes out.

Half the rumours are indeed confusing Yakface. A loss of Pariahs like others makes me sad - they needed a few changes not a removal.
Flayed Ones should've stayed in Fast Attack but that's personal preference.
Destroyers being Jump Infantry kinda works - they can drift above the battle and land to blast something with guass, but otherwise thats about as understandable as it gets. Skimmers suit them better.
C'tan in Elites as a 0-1... I'm hoping for an Essence of type approach rather than a fullblown God.
Transports... well they better be good ones and well justified. Having an ancient box full of Warriors will not do - a mobile portal or gateway from the Tomb could work. Shouldn't really be open-topped unless it is more portal-based. The fact it can carry jetbikes though... that's interesting.
Monolith I suspect is getting a more diversified arsonel in a sense - those guns given proper profiles and a few other changes.
Still no words on Warscythes though... *hopes they stay the same*.
And huzzah for Immortals as troops. A good move

Mar wrote:This thread feels like it has become another Matt Ward hate thread, what ever your opinion of the guy doesn't it get boring?

Welcome to the internet, where people take everything and drive it into the ground, regardless of whether it was funny or interesting to start with.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Juvieus Kaine wrote:
Flayed Ones should've stayed in Fast Attack but that's personal preference.

Flayed Ones were never Fast Attack, they're Elites.

Mar wrote:This thread feels like it has become another Matt Ward hate thread, what ever your opinion of the guy doesn't it get boring?

yakface wrote:

3) We'll be Back is no longer called that and it is NOT Feel No Pain. Basically it is a 5+ bonus save similar to Feel No Pain, but doesn't get cancelled out by double strength, AP1/2, etc. In addition, this save is made at the END of the phase after morale tests are taken. If the unit is wiped out or is falling back at the end of the phase, then the save cannot be used. So as an opponent, if you manage to wipe the unit out or make them fall back, then you prevent any Necrons from getting back up...unless the unit has something called the 'ever-living' rule, in which case it gets to attempt this save even if the unit is wiped out.

This "'ever-living' rule" has me very interested. We've been told that the Rez Orb has gotten better right, so could one of the affects of the orb be that it confers this rule to units within X inches.

something to think about.

bhsman wrote:

Korraz wrote:The book was written by Kelly (yes, THAT Phil Kelly, the Jaws Of the World Wolf-Kelly, which really shows how much good enough playtesting and tweaking can do), by the way. Goodwin and Diaz did the miniatures.

So one power (which is generally skipped in favor of two others) makes Kelly a worse author for you? Whereas, by comparison, Ward made a template version that didn't give MCs the bonus to Initiative that Jaws does? Could your argument get any worse?

JotWW is Significantly better than the Template one...

(Don't get me wrong, Phil Kelly is IMO the best Codex writer we have right now, but The Template power is nowhere in the same league as JOTWW.)

bhsman wrote:

Korraz wrote:The book was written by Kelly (yes, THAT Phil Kelly, the Jaws Of the World Wolf-Kelly, which really shows how much good enough playtesting and tweaking can do), by the way. Goodwin and Diaz did the miniatures.

So one power (which is generally skipped in favor of two others) makes Kelly a worse author for you? Whereas, by comparison, Ward made a template version that didn't give MCs the bonus to Initiative that Jaws does? Could your argument get any worse?

You are a whole lot implying here, mate. You are jumping at shadows.
First of all, I don't care for JOTWW. Since it has been errata'd, it works well enough in the rules and I always found its power laughable. The other psychic powers of the SW are way more poweful and versatile. I just mentioned it, because every time the SW book is mentioned, half of the posts are concerned with the terrible force called JOTWW.
Second, I never said that Kelly is worse. I just wanted to be remembered that the much-praised writer of CE is the very same guy that brought us the Space Wolves book. And the Wolves are objectively a bad book. That book took the 5th edition power creep to a whole new level that not even the Blood Angels are sure to achieve (in the hands of a skilled player, maybe, but it's not comparison to the Point And Sucker Punch that SW are), let alone Vanilla or Grey Knights. The internal balance is laughable and the fluff...well, it's in line with old Space Wolves fluff. Which was always bad, even for WH40k standards.
Third, i just pointed the weight of proper tweaking and playtesting out.


The thought of BL writers writing the fluff makes me smile. Eight of Ten BL books are utter rubbish, even for rubbiish-sci-fi-literature. The idea of one writer doing the rules and one doing the fluff is a good one, though.