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Shh, you'll make the fanboys mad.

Seaward wrote:Incidentally...how the hell does he resupply? You're saying he's been wearing the same suit of Terminator armor for centuries without maintenance?

Not only that, he has gone without food, water or (presumably) sleep for said amount of time as well.

Ironsight wrote:Another idea is that he simply grabs ammo when he explodes out of the Warp from other nearby Grey Knights.

... and so I, THE Kaldor Draigo, have once again saved the day! Oh crap, the warp rift! The buzzer means my time is up! Okay guys, hurry, daddy needs some ammo. I'm taking up a collection - everybody empty their storm bolters, stat!

Arrrgh, these endless Draigo threads. Although, actually this is a pretty good one. I'm sorry ,but Draigo is not a tragic figure. In a way his story is a retcon just to show how super awesome he is. Previously, no one could actually go into the warp without horrible things happening to them. Just looking into the warp causes terrible things to happen to Navigators, a people breed just for that purpose. Yet, there goes Draigo actually living in the warp. He sleeps there, somehow eats and drinks there. Probably has afternoon tea too. The whole point is to show that he can beat the gods on their own turf.

I think any and all Draigo threads should be purged from dakka, it only winds up going horribly....horribly wrong....

bombboy1252 wrote:I think any and all Draigo threads should be purged from dakka, it only winds up going horribly....horribly wrong....

Lets pour concrete over all of these and then proceed to bombard it from orbit.

Varrick wrote:

bombboy1252 wrote:I think any and all Draigo threads should be purged from dakka, it only winds up going horribly....horribly wrong....

Lets pour concrete over all of these and then proceed to bombard it from orbit.

I'll call the Imperial navy, get some exterminatus up in the b**ch...

bombboy1252 wrote:

Varrick wrote:

bombboy1252 wrote:I think any and all Draigo threads should be purged from dakka, it only winds up going horribly....horribly wrong....

Lets pour concrete over all of these and then proceed to bombard it from orbit.

I'll call the Imperial navy, get some exterminatus up in the b**ch...

I know a guy that delivers high quality mass quantity concrete anywhere in the segmentum he can be here 5 days before the fleet.

Varrick wrote:

bombboy1252 wrote:

Varrick wrote:

bombboy1252 wrote:I think any and all Draigo threads should be purged from dakka, it only winds up going horribly....horribly wrong....

Lets pour concrete over all of these and then proceed to bombard it from orbit.

I'll call the Imperial navy, get some exterminatus up in the b**ch...

I know a guy that delivers high quality mass quantity concrete anywhere in the segmentum he can be here 5 days before the fleet.

Seal of excellence...

KamikazeCanuck wrote:Arrrgh, these endless Draigo threads. Although, actually this is a pretty good one. I'm sorry ,but Draigo is not a tragic figure. In a way his story is a retcon just to show how super awesome he is. Previously, no one could actually go into the warp without horrible things happening to them. Just looking into the warp causes terrible things to happen to Navigators, a people breed just for that purpose. Yet, there goes Draigo actually living in the warp. He sleeps there, somehow eats and drinks there. Probably has afternoon tea too. The whole point is to show that he can beat the gods on their own turf.

Yeah, I see Chaos Gods as weak Daemons ever since Draigo fluff came out.

Kanluwen wrote:
Like what? The Bloodthirsters--which Sanguinius was able to break over his knee? Which Inquisitor Rex was able to banish (after defeating in martial combat, mind you) the most powerful of himself?

Why do people lie when discussing fluff? Is winning an argument so important that you would make up a bunch of bs? Or is it that you simply heard someone else say this and are just parroting it? Or maybe it's that you just base everything on the summaries on Lexicanum rather than having read any of the material yourself?

Sanguinius was defeated by Ka'Bandha the first time they fought, and the second time around it took all his strength to beat it. Ka'Bandha also fought the Sanguinor (Sanguinius' reincarnation? some "good" daemon? whatever the hell he is) to a standstill, Sanguinor only defeating him in a "desperate gambit" that only worked because Ka'Bandha's wings were destroyed by Sanguinor's initial sneak attack.

As for An'ggrath, he was already wounded after a battle with the Grey Knights that were accompanying Rex. Rex was also wielding an ancient force weapon blessed by the Emperor himself. And he hardly bested the daemon in martial combat; he landed a few blows, each of which visibly drained and cut off An'ggrath from the Warp and the source of his powers. And Rex was still beaten and driven to his knees, but in typical bad guy stupidity/good guy plot armor, An'ggrath paused his assault prematurely to roar his triumph and Rex took advantage of the situation to stab him in the heart.

So the most potent Daemon Hunters (Ordo Malleus Inquisitor Lord and a whole bunch of Grey Knights) and one of the top three most martially capable Primarchs all defeated Bloodthirsters, but they did so barely, at great cost, in the material realm where the Bloodthirsters' power is fleeting.

Draigo effortlessly defeats Bloodthirsters bare-handed, while in the friggin' Warp, and then forges new swords out of their weapons with his mind.

Manchu wrote:The point of Draigo is not that he's invincible but that all his efforts (and by proxy, all of the Imperium's efforts) are useless against Chaos. So the questions that Mat Ward is trying to ask you, the hook he's trying to get into your imagination is: if you knew you could never win, would you still fight? What motivates a man to do so?

That may have been the intent, but it came across in a hamfisted and heavy-handed way that reads like a 12-year-old's fantasy fan-spank. Which is nothing new with Ward. The text reads basically as such: "Draigo is the most awesome Grey Knight ever. He did this awesome thing when he was still a noob. Then he did this impossible awesome thing. Then two pages more of super awesome stuff. Oh, by the way, the stuff he destroys doesn't really stay destroyed, but he's all the more awesome for it because he just farms them over and over again for mad XP and phat lewts. Isn't he awesome? fapfapfapfapfap."


Apologists.

Omegus wrote:Draigo effortlessly defeats Bloodthirsters bare-handed, while in the friggin' Warp, and then forges new swords out of their weapons with his mind.

To be honest, this probably isn't even unique to Draigo. I know that they don't do it in the Warp, but don't Purifiers or Paladins have to defeat four of the most powerful Chaos daemons (one of each god) unarmed or something ludicrous? Or have I just made this up?

Either way, Grey Knights seem to have gone up a notch in terms of power. Daemons seemed to have the disadvantage against them now.

The only way I can handle it is that akin to the Warboss Tuska and his Boyz who are constantly reanimated to fight eternally on a Khornate "planet" in the Eye of Terror. The Gods of Chaos enjoy his futilie quest when they actually remember his existance and are happy to prelong it as he means eseentially nothing to them. That may not be the intent but thats how I can deal with it

Of course Draigo is actually less powerful than a mere skink, Oxyotl, Survivor of Phuax, the Returned (p71 Lizardman army book) who was sucked into the Realm of Chaos (AKA the Warp) when his Slann lord drew too deep on the winds of magic and sucked him and his followers in.

Oxyotl managed to get back out for good, something that is beyond Draigo

Yeah its WFB rather than 40K and it maybe the Gods of Chaos let him out.

SomeRandomEvilGuy wrote:

Omegus wrote:Draigo effortlessly defeats Bloodthirsters bare-handed, while in the friggin' Warp, and then forges new swords out of their weapons with his mind.

To be honest, this probably isn't even unique to Draigo. I know that they don't do it in the Warp, but don't Purifiers or Paladins have to defeat four of the most powerful Chaos daemons (one of each god) unarmed or something ludicrous? Or have I just made this up?

Either way, Grey Knights seem to have gone up a notch in terms of power. Daemons seemed to have the disadvantage against them now.

"There is neither training regime nor set process by which a Grey Knight can join these ranks." They just have to be purer than totally pure, and more incorruptible than utterly incorruptible.

And yes, GK have gone from the tragic heroes resolutely fighting a losing battle against an implacable foe, to awesomesause Mary Sues who wtfpwn all opposition and whose only "flaw" is that there is always more opposition to wtfpwn. They went from just having their armor, their nemesis force weapon, and their unshakable faith in the Emperor... to baby-carriage battle robots and daemon swords.

Omegus wrote:

SomeRandomEvilGuy wrote:

Omegus wrote:Draigo effortlessly defeats Bloodthirsters bare-handed, while in the friggin' Warp, and then forges new swords out of their weapons with his mind.

To be honest, this probably isn't even unique to Draigo. I know that they don't do it in the Warp, but don't Purifiers or Paladins have to defeat four of the most powerful Chaos daemons (one of each god) unarmed or something ludicrous? Or have I just made this up?

Either way, Grey Knights seem to have gone up a notch in terms of power. Daemons seemed to have the disadvantage against them now.

"There is neither training regime nor set process by which a Grey Knight can join these ranks." They just have to be purer than totally pure, and more incorruptible than utterly incorruptible.

And yes, GK have gone from the tragic heroes resolutely fighting a losing battle against an implacable foe, to awesomesause Mary Sues who wtfpwn all opposition and whose only "flaw" is that there is always more opposition to wtfpwn. They went from just having their armor, their nemesis force weapon, and their unshakable faith in the Emperor... to baby-carriage battle robots and daemon swords.

It's the Paladins that have to defeat one of the most powerful Daemon alone.

iproxtaco wrote:

Omegus wrote:

SomeRandomEvilGuy wrote:

Omegus wrote:Draigo effortlessly defeats Bloodthirsters bare-handed, while in the friggin' Warp, and then forges new swords out of their weapons with his mind.

To be honest, this probably isn't even unique to Draigo. I know that they don't do it in the Warp, but don't Purifiers or Paladins have to defeat four of the most powerful Chaos daemons (one of each god) unarmed or something ludicrous? Or have I just made this up?

Either way, Grey Knights seem to have gone up a notch in terms of power. Daemons seemed to have the disadvantage against them now.

"There is neither training regime nor set process by which a Grey Knight can join these ranks." They just have to be purer than totally pure, and more incorruptible than utterly incorruptible.

And yes, GK have gone from the tragic heroes resolutely fighting a losing battle against an implacable foe, to awesomesause Mary Sues who wtfpwn all opposition and whose only "flaw" is that there is always more opposition to wtfpwn. They went from just having their armor, their nemesis force weapon, and their unshakable faith in the Emperor... to baby-carriage battle robots and daemon swords.

It's the Paladins that have to defeat one of the most powerful Daemon alone.

And Draigo is much more powerful than a "normal" paladin...

Makes sense to me...

bombboy1252 wrote:

iproxtaco wrote:

Omegus wrote:

SomeRandomEvilGuy wrote:

Omegus wrote:Draigo effortlessly defeats Bloodthirsters bare-handed, while in the friggin' Warp, and then forges new swords out of their weapons with his mind.

To be honest, this probably isn't even unique to Draigo. I know that they don't do it in the Warp, but don't Purifiers or Paladins have to defeat four of the most powerful Chaos daemons (one of each god) unarmed or something ludicrous? Or have I just made this up?

Either way, Grey Knights seem to have gone up a notch in terms of power. Daemons seemed to have the disadvantage against them now.

"There is neither training regime nor set process by which a Grey Knight can join these ranks." They just have to be purer than totally pure, and more incorruptible than utterly incorruptible.

And yes, GK have gone from the tragic heroes resolutely fighting a losing battle against an implacable foe, to awesomesause Mary Sues who wtfpwn all opposition and whose only "flaw" is that there is always more opposition to wtfpwn. They went from just having their armor, their nemesis force weapon, and their unshakable faith in the Emperor... to baby-carriage battle robots and daemon swords.

It's the Paladins that have to defeat one of the most powerful Daemon alone.

And Draigo is much more powerful than a "normal" paladin...

Makes sense to me...

Those 'normal' paladins don't go into the Warp to fight daemons.

bombboy1252 wrote:And Draigo is much more powerful than a "normal" paladin...

Makes sense to me...

Draigo is the only (The only) character in all of 40k to have defeated even your bog-standard Greater Daemon within the Warp, let alone a very powerful one like M'kaechan.

Beyond that, the Paladins that go to fight one of those super special awesome Greater Daemons go armed with the Daemon's true name. An incredible advantage against a Daemon. Also one that doesn't apply when fighting them in the Warp.

Omegus wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:
Like what? The Bloodthirsters--which Sanguinius was able to break over his knee? Which Inquisitor Rex was able to banish (after defeating in martial combat, mind you) the most powerful of himself?

Why do people lie when discussing fluff? Is winning an argument so important that you would make up a bunch of bs? Or is it that you simply heard someone else say this and are just parroting it? Or maybe it's that you just base everything on the summaries on Lexicanum rather than having read any of the material yourself?

Sanguinius was defeated by Ka'Bandha the first time they fought, and the second time around it took all his strength to beat it. Ka'Bandha also fought the Sanguinor (Sanguinius' reincarnation? some "good" daemon? whatever the hell he is) to a standstill, Sanguinor only defeating him in a "desperate gambit" that only worked because Ka'Bandha's wings were destroyed by Sanguinor's initial sneak attack.

As for An'ggrath, he was already wounded after a battle with the Grey Knights that were accompanying Rex. Rex was also wielding an ancient force weapon blessed by the Emperor himself. And he hardly bested the daemon in martial combat; he landed a few blows, each of which visibly drained and cut off An'ggrath from the Warp and the source of his powers. And Rex was still beaten and driven to his knees, but in typical bad guy stupidity/good guy plot armor, An'ggrath paused his assault prematurely to roar his triumph and Rex took advantage of the situation to stab him in the heart.

So the most potent Daemon Hunters (Ordo Malleus Inquisitor Lord and a whole bunch of Grey Knights) and one of the top three most martially capable Primarchs all defeated Bloodthirsters, but they did so barely, at great cost, in the material realm where the Bloodthirsters' power is fleeting.

Draigo effortlessly defeats Bloodthirsters bare-handed, while in the friggin' Warp, and then forges new swords out of their weapons with his mind.

Manchu wrote:The point of Draigo is not that he's invincible but that all his efforts (and by proxy, all of the Imperium's efforts) are useless against Chaos. So the questions that Mat Ward is trying to ask you, the hook he's trying to get into your imagination is: if you knew you could never win, would you still fight? What motivates a man to do so?

That may have been the intent, but it came across in a hamfisted and heavy-handed way that reads like a 12-year-old's fantasy fan-spank. Which is nothing new with Ward. The text reads basically as such: "Draigo is the most awesome Grey Knight ever. He did this awesome thing when he was still a noob. Then he did this impossible awesome thing. Then two pages more of super awesome stuff. Oh, by the way, the stuff he destroys doesn't really stay destroyed, but he's all the more awesome for it because he just farms them over and over again for mad XP and phat lewts. Isn't he awesome? fapfapfapfapfap."


Apologists.

Exactly, all of those were, y'know, fights? Some struggling, some conflict, some......writing. The Draigo stuff is just so poorly written, maybe if it wasn't it wouldn't be so eye-rollingly over the top. I'm sorry but for all intents and purposes Draigo rapes Mortarion. There's no triumphing over odds. No triumphing over the odds, uphill struggle, dues ex machina or character development. He's alone, Mortarion has a daemon prince retinue and Draigo just goes in there and rapes him.

I find it amusing that he says "is winning so important that you lie?" when his sig is a list of people who he feels he's 'bested', and many of those 'bestings' were when he took something out of context.

For me, Draigo is the stupidly powerful jewel in the crown of ridiculousness that is the Grey Knights codex. Having read threads like this before I actually read the codex, I was hoping the reports of the fluff were exaggerated. Oh, how I wish they were. Knights killing Battle-Sisters to use their blood for rituals? Friggin ghost terminators? Draigo just takes the cake though. Demon primarchs might as well have been chaos gods before he came along. Now, they're just more demons to be chopped up. Draigo single-handedly cheapens every other 40k character's achievements by existing. Who else has done anything that compares?

I like Draigo's Sword.
Thats about it.

He is a okay character. Not terribad like some character.

Dante, Hector Rex, Thawn, every Paladin ever, Guilliman, Sanguinus, Horus, the Emperor, Fulgrim, Ferrus Manus, Marenus Calgar, Angron, Brother Captain Stern, Sergeant Rafen of the Blood Angels, Mephiston. That's off the top of my head, though these are just examples of single characters that have defeated a Greater Daemon or Daemon Prince. Running around in the Warp is something that can't be explained away.

Draigo is cool. Get over it. In ten years you will be like, "Remember Draigo? He was sick! All the nerds hated him with a rage cause he was overpowered. Yeah I remember Draigo. Dude was bad. He carved his initials into some Primarchs heart. He travelled into the future too and he was still the Grand Master. He doesn't quit." And people will wonder what you are talking about and you will smile.

Radiation wrote:Draigo is cool. Get over it. In ten years you will be like, "Remember Draigo? He was sick! All the nerds hated him with a rage cause he was overpowered. Yeah I remember Draigo. Dude was bad. He carved his initials into some Primarchs heart. He travelled into the future too and he was still the Grand Master. He doesn't quit." And people will wonder what you are talking about and you will smile.

I like Radiation, He knows things...

YOu know what would be cool?
Creed infiltrating Draigo from the Warp into the middle of Failbadons army

Kanluwen wrote:I find it amusing that he says "is winning so important that you lie?" when his sig is a list of people who he feels he's 'bested', and many of those 'bestings' were when he took something out of context.

Those are a list of people who would argue something until they were blue in the face, then I would provide quotations from the actual written material, and they would take their ball and go home. Ya know, like you did in the Dark Angels thread. It's okay, I know your butt's still sore about it, so I'll forgive you for doing the exact same thing this time.

Cheers.

KamikazeCanuck wrote:Arrrgh, these endless Draigo threads. Although, actually this is a pretty good one. I'm sorry ,but Draigo is not a tragic figure. In a way his story is a retcon just to show how super awesome he is. Previously, no one could actually go into the warp without horrible things happening to them. Just looking into the warp causes terrible things to happen to Navigators, a people breed just for that purpose. Yet, there goes Draigo actually living in the warp. He sleeps there, somehow eats and drinks there. Probably has afternoon tea too. The whole point is to show that he can beat the gods on their own turf.

The United Fanclubs of Darnath Lysander would like a word with you.

AlmightyWalrus wrote:

KamikazeCanuck wrote:Arrrgh, these endless Draigo threads. Although, actually this is a pretty good one. I'm sorry ,but Draigo is not a tragic figure. In a way his story is a retcon just to show how super awesome he is. Previously, no one could actually go into the warp without horrible things happening to them. Just looking into the warp causes terrible things to happen to Navigators, a people breed just for that purpose. Yet, there goes Draigo actually living in the warp. He sleeps there, somehow eats and drinks there. Probably has afternoon tea too. The whole point is to show that he can beat the gods on their own turf.

The United Fanclubs of Darnath Lysander would like a word with you.

When did Lysander go into the Warp?

Radiation wrote:Draigo is cool. Get over it. In ten years you will be like, "Remember Draigo? He was sick! All the nerds hated him with a rage cause he was overpowered. Yeah I remember Draigo. Dude was bad. He carved his initials into some Primarchs heart. He travelled into the future too and he was still the Grand Master. He doesn't quit." And people will wonder what you are talking about and you will smile.

In ten years, I will either be saying "Thank [insert deity] they retconned most of Draigo's fluff so that he actually seems reasonable." or "Why the hell haven't they fixed Draigo's fluff so he's actually reasonable?"

Coolyo294 wrote:

AlmightyWalrus wrote:

KamikazeCanuck wrote:Arrrgh, these endless Draigo threads. Although, actually this is a pretty good one. I'm sorry ,but Draigo is not a tragic figure. In a way his story is a retcon just to show how super awesome he is. Previously, no one could actually go into the warp without horrible things happening to them. Just looking into the warp causes terrible things to happen to Navigators, a people breed just for that purpose. Yet, there goes Draigo actually living in the warp. He sleeps there, somehow eats and drinks there. Probably has afternoon tea too. The whole point is to show that he can beat the gods on their own turf.

The United Fanclubs of Darnath Lysander would like a word with you.

When did Lysander go into the Warp?

Disappeared in a Warp Storm, didn't he?

Anyhow, there's also the Space Wolves' 13th Company.