Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I'm a little bummed by only Level 1 specialists being allowed for Matched play.

 Crimson wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:

Striking scorpions are literally the easiest thing in the world to proxy for kill team if you want them.

Take the point cost from 40k.

Take the statline from 40k.

That's it. You're done.

Yet this was still somehow too difficult for GW to do.

Why exactly do you need GW to do it? Looking at the Kill Team rules, all the point costs are slight modifications on the regular 40k prices, with nearly all models staying about the same and all guns going down in price.

if you want to use any given model in kill team, you are never going to be giving yourself an unfair advantage by directly translating the price of their gear into the game.

I can absolutely see why Scorpions are not in the game and rangers are: Rangers provide a different role than any of the other units, a Scorpion is a Storm Guardian with +1S, +1Ld and +2sv.

One thing I took away from that video review was that there are only 6 faction tactics in the core book - the other 4 are exclusive to the tactic cards.

the_scotsman wrote:

 Crimson wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:

Striking scorpions are literally the easiest thing in the world to proxy for kill team if you want them.

Take the point cost from 40k.

Take the statline from 40k.

That's it. You're done.

Yet this was still somehow too difficult for GW to do.

Why exactly do you need GW to do it? Looking at the Kill Team rules, all the point costs are slight modifications on the regular 40k prices, with nearly all models staying about the same and all guns going down in price.

if you want to use any given model in kill team, you are never going to be giving yourself an unfair advantage by directly translating the price of their gear into the game.

I can absolutely see why Scorpions are not in the game and rangers are: Rangers provide a different role than any of the other units, a Scorpion is a Storm Guardian with +1S, +1Ld and +2sv.

Except for all those people who don;t want you to use your nice house ruled units in a pick up game?

Rangers should be in the basic Eldar Kill Team, its Guardians that shouldn't IMO - they should be the ones that are the uniusal add on.

But then they didn't give Guard Veterans either but you can roll them up in the background table

Or Mandrakes or.......

The unit selections are a complete mess

Now it's time to make those ETB Eldar Ranger, or Lictor. The hope for a multi-part kit is dead.

 Mr Morden wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:

 Crimson wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:

Striking scorpions are literally the easiest thing in the world to proxy for kill team if you want them.

Take the point cost from 40k.

Take the statline from 40k.

That's it. You're done.

Yet this was still somehow too difficult for GW to do.

Why exactly do you need GW to do it? Looking at the Kill Team rules, all the point costs are slight modifications on the regular 40k prices, with nearly all models staying about the same and all guns going down in price.

if you want to use any given model in kill team, you are never going to be giving yourself an unfair advantage by directly translating the price of their gear into the game.

I can absolutely see why Scorpions are not in the game and rangers are: Rangers provide a different role than any of the other units, a Scorpion is a Storm Guardian with +1S, +1Ld and +2sv.

Except for all those people who don;t want you t use your house ruled units in a pcik up game

Rangers should be in the basic Eldar Kill Team, its Guardians that shouldn't IMO - they should be the ones that are the uniusal add on.
But then they didn't give Guard Veterans either but you can roll them up in the background table
Or Mandrakes or.......

Allow me to apologize to you personally for games workshop's decision to put one model rather than the other one you wanted into this game. I am so sorry for this personal attack on you. I hope that over the years, you find a way to heal. or maybe the social skills to ask an opponent whether they'd be OK with you translating a model from one game to the other where the stats, point values and abilities are identical between the two.

All seems like they had much more planned but the GW higher ups personally slashed them out to sell as dlc later on.

Even if this isn't true it certainly seems like it and it makes the older customers feel like GW is slowly going back...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

UltraPrime wrote:
One thing I took away from that video review was that there are only 6 faction tactics in the core book - the other 4 are exclusive to the tactic cards.

Day 1 dlc that richer kids get an advantage with.

Some delightful speculation there..

the_scotsman wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:

 Crimson wrote:

the_scotsman wrote:

Striking scorpions are literally the easiest thing in the world to proxy for kill team if you want them.

Take the point cost from 40k.

Take the statline from 40k.

That's it. You're done.

Yet this was still somehow too difficult for GW to do.

Why exactly do you need GW to do it? Looking at the Kill Team rules, all the point costs are slight modifications on the regular 40k prices, with nearly all models staying about the same and all guns going down in price.

if you want to use any given model in kill team, you are never going to be giving yourself an unfair advantage by directly translating the price of their gear into the game.

I can absolutely see why Scorpions are not in the game and rangers are: Rangers provide a different role than any of the other units, a Scorpion is a Storm Guardian with +1S, +1Ld and +2sv.

Except for all those people who don;t want you t use your house ruled units in a pcik up game

Rangers should be in the basic Eldar Kill Team, its Guardians that shouldn't IMO - they should be the ones that are the uniusal add on.
But then they didn't give Guard Veterans either but you can roll them up in the background table
Or Mandrakes or.......

Allow me to apologize to you personally for games workshop's decision to put one model rather than the other one you wanted into this game. I am so sorry for this personal attack on you. I hope that over the years, you find a way to heal. or maybe the social skills to ask an opponent whether they'd be OK with you translating a model from one game to the other where the stats, point values and abilities are identical between the two.

Thanks for the kind words - you must be so proud or your special abilty to transmit sarcasm across the great expanse of the internet - such an achievemnt and I just bet your parents are so proud. Well done Sir Well Done. oh look I can do it too - well maybe its not such a achievement.

Some of us have also mastered the ability to examine information we receive and express an opinion on a game - its this idea called a forum where people exchange views on things - and sometimes they don't agree. Well fancy that.

Some of us can even give reasons why they think things are worng and not just lash out at others....

ENOUGH PLEASE.

I still think the biggest reason behind GW's decision on initial units is the desire to make a competitive game, in a similar vein to shadespire. Except this will be harder to balance because the whole game is a lot less restrictive than SS. The less units that are available the easier it is to balance, by a huge margin. If they added every unit that someone on the internet said made sense for KT's theme there's no way it could be remotely balanced.

As for guardians, I think they fit fine. Guardians are the primary military force of most craftworlds. The aspect warriors do a lot of the heavy lifting but the guardians are the core infantry. They've all had military training, many of them at least a little experience. Hell the vast majority of imperial guardsmen have little or no real combat experience, given the odds of survival in 40k.

Stat wise a guardian is better than a guardsmen. They're more skilled in both ranged and melee combat. They're just as skilled as an IG veteran and are actually more skilled in melee than a vet. If a regular guardsman is suitable for a KT mission then a guardian definitely is, just because an eldar civilian is better than a basically trained human.

Also, to the couple people saying that guardians are one of the worst units in 40k, I have no idea where you got that from. A 20 man guardian bomb deep striking is pretty strong. Not to mention they can get a 2+ or 3++ save with the right buffs. Run them as Ulthwe for more dakka or Iyanden to only lose 1 model to morale and they're really hard to kill.

From their Instagram, some more community Kill Teams:

Since we're derailing the rumour thread, where people look for new info on this release, with our talk of what should/shouldn't be in a KT, I started a new (albeit rambly) thread:

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/760688.page#10071370

Good show!

Unboxing, complete build of the scenery and models, discussion of the rules from Beasts of War

 Cephalobeard wrote:
I'd be fine with FW expansions, but I would much rather see GW control the game and pump out regular expansions.

I bet they will. It's a perfect way for them to have an excuse to add random units to various armies.

 Cephalobeard wrote:
I'm a little bummed by only Level 1 specialists being allowed for Matched play.

Makes sense though. If you want characters/models to get better, thats what the Narrative and Campaign games are for. Otherwise we would all be choosing Level 3 for every game.

loving those Ork Kommandos. I have a similar kitbash in the works myself. Just waiting on 32mm slotted bases.

Maybe, the higher level upgrades cost as much as another model in most cases

This game being popular enough to be a vehicle to update the truly ancient kits would be really great. New Chaos Marines, Aspects etc.

 Eldarain wrote:
This game being popular enough to be a vehicle to update the truly ancient kits would be really great. New Chaos Marines, Aspects etc.

Sisters of Battle...

Agreed - be good to see a whole load of new plastics - the Rogue Trader ones look great

 Nightlord1987 wrote:

 Cephalobeard wrote:
I'm a little bummed by only Level 1 specialists being allowed for Matched play.

Makes sense though. If you want characters/models to get better, thats what the Narrative and Campaign games are for. Otherwise we would all be choosing Level 3 for every game.

That's just the thing, though. Would we? It's a 8-16pt or so upgrade. I doubt many guardsman armies would be taking multiple level 3s, etc. A few level 2s, maybe!

 Mr Morden wrote:

What is kill team supposed to be? If its a group of highly specialised soldiers

No, it isn't. It's about regular guardsmen, Marines, firewarriors, etc.

If the basic marine was sternguard and the basic tau was a crisis suit then you might have a point that eldar should have been all aspect warriors.

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Eldarain wrote:
This game being popular enough to be a vehicle to update the truly ancient kits would be really great. New Chaos Marines, Aspects etc.

Sisters of Battle...

Agreed - be good to see a whole load of new plastics - the Rogue Trader ones look great

I'm sure there will be a Sisters KT. They kept the initial KT's limited to armies that have 8th edition codicies finished. Wolves don't have their own KT and Orks are close enough to a release date that I'm sure all the rules and mechanics are already finished at GW. Sisters are far off enough in the future that their rules probably aren't finalized yet. Next year along with the codex and models I bet there will be a simultaneous KT release.

 Scott-S6 wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:

What is kill team supposed to be? If its a group of highly specialised soldiers

No, it isn't. It's about regular guardsmen, Marines, firewarriors, etc.

If the basic marine was sternguard and the basic tau was a crisis suit then you might have a point that eldar should have been all aspect warriors.

Hmm Gw says different on the Community site:

The game’s focus is on covert operations – players hand-pick their kill teams of die-hard special operatives to get a specific job done, whether that be reconnaissance, sabotage or assassination

Your kill team is a squad of elite warriors,

Now the units chosen don't actually reflect this

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Scott-S6 wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:

What is kill team supposed to be? If its a group of highly specialised soldiers

No, it isn't. It's about regular guardsmen, Marines, firewarriors, etc.

If the basic marine was sternguard and the basic tau was a crisis suit then you might have a point that eldar should have been all aspect warriors.

Hmm Gw says different on the Community site:

The game’s focus is on covert operations – players hand-pick their kill teams of die-hard special operatives to get a specific job done, whether that be reconnaissance, sabotage or assassination

Your kill team is a squad of elite warriors,

Now the units chosen don't actually reflect this

They become elite specialists over the course of a campaign. That's pretty much the point. If they start as specialists then there's no arc.

The game also isn't rules that were written from the ground up.

It's not a whole new rulesset.

It's not a whole new game mode.

The unit selection count is 1-5, not 1-6.

Lots of claims they made aren't true.

Bharring wrote:
The game also isn't rules that were written from the ground up.

It's not a whole new rulesset.

It's not a whole new game mode.

The unit selection count is 1-5, not 1-6.

Lots of claims they made aren't true.

yeah, as is, I must say that have not a lot of interest in KT (which is surprising, since I love skirmish game). Seems like a 40k lite ruleset. Might change when we get the RT expansion, but this is speculation.

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Scott-S6 wrote:

 Mr Morden wrote:

What is kill team supposed to be? If its a group of highly specialised soldiers

No, it isn't. It's about regular guardsmen, Marines, firewarriors, etc.

If the basic marine was sternguard and the basic tau was a crisis suit then you might have a point that eldar should have been all aspect warriors.

Hmm Gw says different on the Community site:

The game’s focus is on covert operations – players hand-pick their kill teams of die-hard special operatives to get a specific job done, whether that be reconnaissance, sabotage or assassination

Your kill team is a squad of elite warriors,

Now the units chosen don't actually reflect this

I think this is easier to rationalise if you consider the scale of the missions. They are not hugely important on a global campaign scale, but more like locally vital targets. Blowing up a supply dump, assassinating a local commander, that kind of thing.

Therefore, I reckon this is like a single unit assembling a Kill team on their assigned section of the front. Say an AM company sends a team of Guardsmen to knock out an opposing Cultist supply dump. A Company likely wouldn't be oozing in veterans to spare, so they choose some dedicated volunteers that are otherwise unremarkable. As/if the volunteers become more experienced and effective in skirmishing, then they can be noticed by higher command, who then assign them to more important missions.

 Boss Salvage wrote:


So yea, looking like there's a way to buy more CP ala AOS.

Got it from the Drive Through review:

+1 CP per full 10 Force (points + other campaign stuff) lower your team is than the highest team in the match

Likely not a ton of extras in matched play, and even then you're shorting yourself a dude in the hope you're at least 10 under the other team(s).

Can't use the same tactic in a phase, generic ones are:



But there are unique ones for specialists (like 3 of them each, 1 per level), plus faction ones, plus those boxed team ones, plus ???

Also you indeed can't increase level in matched play. In campaign play they have costs to start out vets:

Level 1 +0
Level 2 +4
Level 3 +8
Level 4 +12

- Salvage