Little bit of Space Wolf news/rumor

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**Fateweaver**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
Bikers can take wolves instead and give you +1S, T, and A. Something about 50pts for 6 attacks with rending on the charge in there as well.

Out and out the dumbest thing in 40K for a long time - and that's counting the Daemon Codex, the Chaos Codex, RObin Cruddace and Jervis. Men on horses in a Guard army I can handle. Marines on Wolves?

Come on! That's just... uhh...

I would disagree on the Daemon codex. I enjoy it and it's a fun army. Is the reason people spit so much vile at it is that CSM daemons (who really should take a back seat to CSM's) are worse than their CD counterparts?

Anyway, don't shoot the messenger. I just bring updates.

SW's are sort of....feral. I don't see why it's no big deal for something as feral as an ork to ride a giant boar but a feral SM, who from the fluff is not much more civilised than an ork, cannot ride a giant wolf?

Maybe it's a unit that will suck so bad that even if people consider them cool nobody will convert the models, or maybe they'll be that good that people will want to.

**JohnHwangDD**

Fateweaver wrote:Bikers can take wolves instead and give you +1S, T, and A. Something about 50pts for 6 attacks with rending on the charge in there as well.

Are these going to be puny O&G cavalry-sized wolves, Chaos Juggernaut-sized wolves, or Lizardmen Stegadon-sized wolves?

If they are going to be huge, that would be cool. I could use them.

**H.B.M.C.**

Fateweaver wrote:I would disagree on the Daemon codex. I enjoy it and it's a fun army. Is the reason people spit so much vile at it is that CSM daemons (who really should take a back seat to CSM's) are worse than their CD counterparts?

That's not the reason I hate the Daemons Codex.

And the word you're looking for is 'bile'. Look it up. There's a picture of me next to it.

**Cheese Elemental**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
Fateweaver wrote:I would disagree on the Daemon codex. I enjoy it and it's a fun army. Is the reason people spit so much vile at it is that CSM daemons (who really should take a back seat to CSM's) are worse than their CD counterparts?

That's not the reason I hate the Daemons Codex.

And the word you're looking for is 'bile'. Look it up. There's a picture of me next to it.

The reason H' doesn't like the Daemons codex is because Daemonic Incursions don't just happen, they're a rarity and would only appear on a world heavily tainted by Chaos. Heck, Daemons can only appear most of the time if there's cultists or Chaos Marines to summon them. I can agree with him there, but Daemons are fun to play; I have two armies of them, Khorne and Tzeentch.

**H.B.M.C.**

That and the way the army deploys is illogical, nonsensical and childishly 1-dimensional.

**Archonate**

Bikers can take wolves instead and give you +1S, T, and A. Something about 50pts for 6 attacks with rending on the charge in there as well.

What a cliche idea. Not to mention a slowed visual. If Dark Eldar end up riding Warp Beasts, I'm out.

**JohnHwangDD**

Hey, Spaze Woof riders are still better than bikers.

**Archonate**

I personally think they're more cheesy than SM bikers. That's saying a lot.

Fateweaver wrote:SW's are sort of....feral. I don't see why it's no big deal for something as feral as an ork to ride a giant boar but a feral SM, who from the fluff is not much more civilised than an ork, cannot ride a giant wolf?

If SWs are so feral and uncivilized, why are they wearing power armor? Power armor + riding an animal = Fail.

**Fateweaver**

Just because an option exists doesn't mean it has to be used. I'm sure if it's an effective unit lots of people will model them.

As far as normal wolf riders it sounds as if people will have to convert their own unit up. I think it was Phil who said no Wolf Rider models are currently planned. Only Canis will actually have his wolf mount sculpted by GW. Canis' mount is said to be larger than a juggernaught (model wise).

I'm too tired to quote from the Daemon codex but yeah, the fluff if I remember right admits they are rare and don't happen too often but in the grand scheme of things and rarity it's just as rare that Vulkan Hestan will be at every conflict that Salamanders ever get involved in and yet majority of SM lists I see are Vulcan lists (and lets not even start on his clones).

I'm way OT right now but the Daemon codex doesn't make any less sense than 200 Chapters led by Vulkan or every Chaos Space Marine army in the universe being led by dual Lash Princes of Slaanesh. LOL.

**Wannabe Writer**

Archonate wrote:I personally think they're more cheesy than SM bikers. That's saying a lot.

Fateweaver wrote:SW's are sort of....feral. I don't see why it's no big deal for something as feral as an ork to ride a giant boar but a feral SM, who from the fluff is not much more civilised than an ork, cannot ride a giant wolf?

If SWs are so feral and uncivilized, why are they wearing power armor? Power armor + riding an animal = Fail.

I've never thought of Space Wolves as being uncivilized. They do have an organised hierachy within their chapter, it is just that it does not conform to the Codex written by Guilliman which is considered the standard norm.
I think that riding the wolves of Fenris fits with the character of the Space Wolves. These wolves are meant to be huge (as mentioned by another poster in another thread), they can grow to the size of a rhino APC. What is scarier, a marine on a bike or a marine riding a giant wolf! It fits the character of the army that as a way to prove themselves, Blood Claws (who I believe are the unit that can choose bikes) would try to tame, or rather 'brake', a giant wolf, then ride it into battle to show how hard they are. Besides, I like the warrior idea behind the Space Wolves that, while they wont do anything too tactically stupid, they will eschew standard tactics if it gave the opportunity to do something heroic which would go down in song for centuries. Riding a giant wolf into battle sounds pretty heroic to me

.
Also from a 'practical' point of view a wolf might be considered preferable to a bike. They could cover difficult terrain better than a vehicle, would be far more agile, would be faster then a horse (to compare them to Rough Riders) and of course Fenris wolves are giant wolves!!!! The only thing I would expect to see in the rules would be that they can not turbo boost as I would assume a bike with a hefty engine could go faster than a wolf, giant or not.

**Casper**

Hmm, SW screwing with objectives is just...screwy? Depending on how much of an effect they have it could be game breaking, which could cause the army to fail (or turn into WFB Deamon Hate). Neither of the 2 options would be good.

As to the wolves riding wolves...if there is no model planned whats the

point? In order to do a conversion you would have to buy 3 kits - SM Bikes ($45), New SW conversion kit ($?) and then Goblin Wolf Riders ($35). Add in the cost for more bikes (as you get 10 wolves with the gobbo's) your looking at a unit that costs between $125 (for 6 riders no SW bits) and $200 (gets you 9 riders + SW bits). Definatly not worth it.

I just hope they do the SW right and spice up the SM again. Gives me hope that my DA will at some point get a good Codex and Fluff.

**number9dream**

Sigh, this is off-topic but with every new codex released (SM, IG - especially IG - and now SW), the Ork codex is feeling more and more... bland/generic

It's got some cool individual stuff, but it seems to lack the army-wide abilities of its successors.

A bit more of a nod towards the different clans would have been nice...

Anyway, to get back on topic, somehwat, riding giant wolves seems pretty damned badass!

**Khornholio**

How's this for a SW rumour: I knew a GW store manager in Canada who claimed that the character "Logan Grimmnar" was based on him after he went on a trip to the Nottingham studio circa 1990ish.

**Lowinor**

Casper wrote:Hmm, SW screwing with objectives is just...screwy?

Hrmmm....

Saga: Heroic Sacrifice. You have been told by the seers that you're going down hard today, so you aren't going to count losses on the battlefield. Reroll "Annihilation" if it comes up on the mission table; you may reroll this reroll if it comes up again.

Suddenly, everyone would have a SW army.

**Typeline**

Lowinor wrote:
Casper wrote:Hmm, SW screwing with objectives is just...screwy?

Hrmmm....

Saga: Heroic Sacrifice. You have been told by the seers that you're going down hard today, so you aren't going to count losses on the battlefield. Reroll "Annihilation" if it comes up on the mission table; you may reroll this reroll if it comes up again.

Suddenly, everyone would have a SW army.

But does it make sense is the real question?

I personally feel that doesn't really fit a marines type army. To change the preference of the battle. If CSM had abilities to change things to just KPs I could understand, they don't have a need for anything, just trying to kill SM "BURN! MAIM! KILL!", "Blood for the blood God!" type stuff.

I think SWs more than anyone have things they would want to acquire in battle to gain glory.

And in a meta-game perspective, it's too powerful an ability. As the player you can build your list to a set type of mission and always eliminate the one your army isn't good at.

**dietrich**

H.B.M.C. wrote:And the word you're looking for is 'bile'. Look it up. There's a picture of me next to it.

You first name isn't Fabius is it?

If bikers can ride wolves for an extra 50 points, that means it's going to be a one wound model coming in around 80 points. That is killed by a Starcannon on a 3+ or a Plasmarifle on a 2+.

**Goliath**

I saw the release schedule at my local GW, The Space Wolf second wave (within a wave) is coming out 22nd october.
I would assume that this is similar to the SMs release, where the models released in two bits during the same month.

**JohnHwangDD**

Casper wrote:Hmm, SW screwing with objectives is just...screwy?

IMO, this presages GW moving 40k even further to an Objectives game in 6th. Remember, SW are a minor Codex, and won't be updated again until 7th, so GW needs to plan pretty far ahead with their rules.

____

number9dream wrote:Sigh, this is off-topic but with every new codex released (SM, IG - especially IG - and now SW), the Ork codex is feeling more and more... bland/generic

A bit more of a nod towards the different clans would have been nice...

Perhaps it's just that the novelty has worn off? Orks still have Waagh!

If Marines lose Traits, Eldar lost Craftworlds, CSM lost Legions, and Guard lost Doctrines, you really think GW is going to create special rules for secondary Ork armies? Besides, it's not like you can't take lots of particular stuff to theme an Ork army.

**Quintinus**

number9dream wrote:Sigh, this is off-topic but with every new codex released (SM, IG - especially IG - and now SW), the Ork codex is feeling more and more... bland/generic

It's got some cool individual stuff, but it seems to lack the army-wide abilities of its successors.

A bit more of a nod towards the different clans would have been nice...

Anyway, to get back on topic, somehwat, riding giant wolves seems pretty damned badass!

I'm so sorry for your suffering, it's not like you have one of the best codices or anything.

**jmurph**

Man, I was hoping the codex release would be end of September :-(

Oh well.

I just noticed I got grouped with Shuma for SW hate! HEH! I guess I should post some of my wolves to a gallery....

Riding wolves is slowed from a believable military perspective (predators make very poor mounts 1) because of flexible joints that do not bear weight well and 2) because they try to eat you and are generally untameable if you want to keep any fighting instinct). But they are AWESOME from a Rule of Cool perspective. Superhuman Space Viking Knights on Gigantic Space Wolves! I can already hear the guitar solo in the background as the wolf howls at the moon.

**Typeline**

jmurph wrote:
Riding wolves is slowed from a believable military perspective (predators make very poor mounts 1) because of flexible joints that do not bear weight well and 2) because they try to eat you and are generally untameable if you want to keep any fighting instinct). But they are AWESOME from a Rule of Cool perspective. Superhuman Space Viking Knights on Gigantic Space Wolves! I can already hear the guitar solo in the background as the wolf howls at the moon.

I'd like to remind you sir, this is Warhammer 40,000.

**Scottywan82**

From Warseer:

Ragnarok666 wrote:
I've seen the dex. I am a very happy puppy player, i think Phil captured the spirit of the wolves.

Bjorn and Canis are by far my favorite HQ's. Ragnar is a combat monster!!!

Bjorn is armour 13/12/10 with a built in 5+ inv. save he is also a ven dread. he comes with a assault cannon but you can give him a plasma cannon for FREE with a BS 0f 6!!!! he has 4 base attacks at I3 and WS6. he allows all frendly ubits with (iirc) 12" to reroll moral. if he is killed all SW become feerless and becomes a new objective to be captured.

Canis is riding a HUGe wolf ... and the model looks great. he allows Fen. Wolf pack to become Troops. and there is a unit of wolf riders . Canis has 5 base attacks but if he gets surounded he goes crazy and get one attck for evry model in base contact.he has a pair of wolf claws. hes S5 T5 bc he is riding the wolf.

Ragnar gives himself and the unit he joins d3 extra attacks on the charge. he already has 5 built in. with WS6 and S5 thanks to his Sword hes a tornado in combat. Put Ragnar in a unit of Blood Claws and it a distructive combo because the BC get +2 attack on the charge.

Ulrik is back and hes pissed LOL hes gives the unit he joins prefered enemy angainst a unit type he chooses at the start of the game.

Logan is a true comander. he gives special rules to any unit he joins i cant remember them all but one of the is relentless. othe then that he has not changed much.

The trickster is a BC uite upgrade. And he could be a lot of fun.

The Thammer thrower is S10. he throws the hammer 6" at S10 AP1 assault 1. and he gets an extra attack for his shield.

that all i can remember at the moment ill try and get us some more!!!!

Sounds wild. GH are same cost as CSM.

**kirsanth**

"Look at my Space Wolves!"

"Wow, those are big wolves, is that part robot?"

"No no no, the Space Wolves. . . in the armor."

"Oh, I thought it was like a cyber wolf or something, I did not realize it was armor."

"No it is a cyber wolf, the Space Wolf is ON the cyber wolf."

"Oh."

**number9dream**

Vladsimpaler wrote:
number9dream wrote:Sigh, this is off-topic but with every new codex released (SM, IG - especially IG - and now SW), the Ork codex is feeling more and more... bland/generic

It's got some cool individual stuff, but it seems to lack the army-wide abilities of its successors.

A bit more of a nod towards the different clans would have been nice...

Anyway, to get back on topic, somehwat, riding giant wolves seems pretty damned badass!

I'm so sorry for your suffering, it's not like you have one of the best codices or anything.

Don't get me wrong, it's a better than average codex, I just wish there was some more flavour in there. Even something like the different chaos marks but for the different clans would be fine.

It's a bit of "Vanilla Orks" at the moment =]

The same holds true for a bunch of other codexes as well of course, although I'm not really familiar with all of them. The Eldar codex springs to mind tho, it's also a bit "basic". It's not about the strength of the codex really, I hope you see what I'm getting at

I'll give a couple of examples later, gotta run now.

**JohnHwangDD**

**Scottywan82**

Wow, I'm surprised there's been so little talk about the new rules reveal. Ah well, Friday before Labor Day I guess.

**sonofruss**

@JHDD

* happy dance *
* happy dance *
* happy dance *

**Fateweaver**

I think most people are out getting drunk right now so dakka is taking a backseat .....

I might just put scout army on hold and do SW's

**ubermosher**

Scottywan82 wrote:Wow, I'm surprised there's been so little talk about the new rules reveal. Ah well, Friday before Labor Day I guess.

It is the deep breath before the whine.

**Fateweaver**

Yeah, by Monday there will be about 15 pages of "OMG I can't belive x unit or y unit sucks so bad" or "OMG I can't believe the Wolves riding Wolves is true, how childish and lame."

I have the Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaambulance on speed dial for those that need it.